[Flightgear-devel] CH53e data
Hi there, Some data for the CH53e yasim model, taken from Prouty [1], p. 699. Looking at the data in cvs, rotor diameters and chords should/could be changed, just like control input ranges for the main and tail rotor. Weights (lb): - Empty:33009 - MTOW (internal payload): 69750 - MTOW (external payload): 73500 - Fuel capacity (norm): 6682 - Fuel capacity (aux): 8450 Engines: - Type: General Electric T64-GE-416 - Number:3 - Max T.O. rating: 13140 - Max usable power: 11570 Rotor Parameters: Main Tail - Radius (ft): 39.5 10 - Chord (ft):2.44 1.28 - solidity 0.138 0.163 - No. of blades: 7 4 - Tip speed (ft/sec):732 733 - twist (deg): -20 -8 - equiv. linear hinge offset ration (e/R): 0.063 0.043 - Airfoil: SC1095 NACA 0015 - Collective range (deg): -1.4 to 19.6 -10 to 24 - Longitudinal cyclic range (deg): -8.5 to 18.0 - - Lateral cyclic range (deg): -9.8 to 6.1 - - Polar moment of inertia (slug ft^2) 51800181 Greetings, Wim [1] Prouty, R. W., Helicopter Performance, Stability and Control -- Avoid hangovers - stay drunk! - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] What is the basic prgram loop structure of flightgear
GWMobile wrote: It would be helpful if someone familiar with overall detailed structure of flightgear could give the basic program loop structure of flightgear at this point. ( I mean after initialization has been completed and program is in running sim mode) Once in running sim mode, what are the basic real time loops and what are the basic time triggered loops etc. Ampere(and others) put this together a while ago... it might give you an overview. http://denemaxwell.dnsdojo.net/users/downloads/Miscellaneous/FG_design_doc_d4-c.pdf Cheers Dene - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] What is the basic prgram loop structure of
Dene wrote: Ampere(and others) put this together a while ago... it might give you an overview. Oh yeah, that is this famous we know how to do it right (TM), why don't the stupid programmers don't inmplement it this way-document. Indeed, the paper is really nice - but: Has anyone ever seen a single line of working code from one of the proponents of this paper ? Code that at least in some sense implements only a little part of these ideas ? Just a thought, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] 747-200 NAV freq - limitation
Resending as it appears my post was lost? I noticed the new 747-200 has a limitation on Nav1 and Nav2 it does not scroll below 110.xx, same problem as the concorde, the minimum it should scoll down to is 108.xx as many airports ils systems uses a 108.xx 0r 109.xx nav aid this is just to advise the guy working on the 747-200 about the limitation. I made manual changes to my Concorde concorde-nav.xml concorde-ap-nav.xml to fix the limitation! For example changing: binding commandproperty-adjust/command property alias=../../../../params/frq-ctrl/ step-1/step min110/min max130/max wrap130/wrap /binding INTO binding commandproperty-adjust/command property alias=../../../../params/frq-ctrl/ step-1/step min108/min max130/max wrap130/wrap /binding Their are SEVERAL other entries with min108/min max130/max All these need modifying in the above xml files. Michelle Call sign - Aerotro - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] CH53e data
Hi Wim, very interesting data. I have googled to find out, which values are correct, at least for the rotor diameter there is many data on the net. It seems, that in the version in cvs some data are from the ch53d (or are there different ch53e variants?). Very surprising for me are the cyclic/ collective data with approx 20+18=38 degree maximum incidence of the main rotor. Unfortunately I do not have any information about the airfoil (SC1095). One important point: the main rotor and the tail rotor are twisted. Do you know, where the incidence is measured? Do you have such data for other helicopters in your book (bo105 (but here the actual data should be correct), ec135, ec145, ch47d, s76c, little nellie)? Thank you, Maik wim van hoydonck schrieb am 18.12.2006 15:49: Hi there, Some data for the CH53e yasim model, taken from Prouty [1], p. 699. Looking at the data in cvs, rotor diameters and chords should/could be changed, just like control input ranges for the main and tail rotor. Weights (lb): - Empty:33009 - MTOW (internal payload): 69750 - MTOW (external payload): 73500 - Fuel capacity (norm): 6682 - Fuel capacity (aux): 8450 Engines: - Type: General Electric T64-GE-416 - Number:3 - Max T.O. rating: 13140 - Max usable power: 11570 Rotor Parameters: Main Tail - Radius (ft): 39.5 10 - Chord (ft):2.44 1.28 - solidity 0.138 0.163 - No. of blades: 7 4 - Tip speed (ft/sec):732 733 - twist (deg): -20 -8 - equiv. linear hinge offset ration (e/R): 0.063 0.043 - Airfoil: SC1095 NACA 0015 - Collective range (deg): -1.4 to 19.6 -10 to 24 - Longitudinal cyclic range (deg): -8.5 to 18.0 - - Lateral cyclic range (deg): -9.8 to 6.1 - - Polar moment of inertia (slug ft^2) 51800181 Greetings, Wim [1] Prouty, R. W., Helicopter Performance, Stability and Control - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] CH53e data
Hi Maik, Once our library opens again next year (they are moving to a new building), I'll cross check that data with Janes (I work at the faculty of aerospace engineering in Delft). Very surprising for me are the cyclic/ collective data with approx 20+18=38 degree maximum incidence of the main rotor. That's the maximum pitch angle at the root of the blade which is not the same as the angle of attack of a blade (element) along the span of the blade (inflow induced by the rotor itself reduces the angle of attack). You would only need that combination in high speed forward flight, which in normal flight is limited by the stall on the inner side of the retreating blade. Unfortunately I do not have any information about the airfoil (SC1095). This ([1]) NASA report contains some data about wind tunnel test done with that airfoil. One important point: the main rotor and the tail rotor are twisted. Do you know, where the incidence is measured? Pitch angle (theta) is normally measured from the root of the blade, as can be seen in [2], page 322. Flight path angle (phi) is calculated from the tangential and normal velocity components at a blade element and the angle of attack (alpha) is the difference between (or sum of) these two (depending on the choice of positive axes). Do you have such data for other helicopters in your book (bo105 (but here the actual data should be correct), ec135, ec145, ch47d, s76c, little nellie)? I have access to the majority of editions of Janes All The Worlds Aircraft between 1976 and 2006, so yes :) (although I'm not sure about little nellie ...) Greetings, Wim [1] http://halfdome.arc.nasa.gov/publications/files/NASA-TP-2003-212265.pdf [2] http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19960054374_1996092848.pdf On 12/18/06, Maik Justus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Wim, very interesting data. I have googled to find out, which values are correct, at least for the rotor diameter there is many data on the net. It seems, that in the version in cvs some data are from the ch53d (or are there different ch53e variants?). Very surprising for me are the cyclic/ collective data with approx 20+18=38 degree maximum incidence of the main rotor. Unfortunately I do not have any information about the airfoil (SC1095). One important point: the main rotor and the tail rotor are twisted. Do you know, where the incidence is measured? Do you have such data for other helicopters in your book (bo105 (but here the actual data should be correct), ec135, ec145, ch47d, s76c, little nellie)? Thank you, Maik wim van hoydonck schrieb am 18.12.2006 15:49: Hi there, Some data for the CH53e yasim model, taken from Prouty [1], p. 699. Looking at the data in cvs, rotor diameters and chords should/could be changed, just like control input ranges for the main and tail rotor. Weights (lb): - Empty:33009 - MTOW (internal payload): 69750 - MTOW (external payload): 73500 - Fuel capacity (norm): 6682 - Fuel capacity (aux): 8450 Engines: - Type: General Electric T64-GE-416 - Number:3 - Max T.O. rating: 13140 - Max usable power: 11570 Rotor Parameters: Main Tail - Radius (ft): 39.5 10 - Chord (ft):2.44 1.28 - solidity 0.138 0.163 - No. of blades: 7 4 - Tip speed (ft/sec):732 733 - twist (deg): -20 -8 - equiv. linear hinge offset ration (e/R): 0.063 0.043 - Airfoil: SC1095 NACA 0015 - Collective range (deg): -1.4 to 19.6 -10 to 24 - Longitudinal cyclic range (deg): -8.5 to 18.0 - - Lateral cyclic range (deg): -9.8 to 6.1 - - Polar moment of inertia (slug ft^2) 51800181 Greetings, Wim [1] Prouty, R. W., Helicopter Performance, Stability and Control - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- Avoid hangovers - stay drunk!
Re: [Flightgear-devel] CH53e data
Hi Wim wim van hoydonck schrieb am 18.12.2006 23:23: Hi Maik, Once our library opens again next year (they are moving to a new building), I'll cross check that data with Janes (I work at the faculty of aerospace engineering in Delft). very good, thank you! Very surprising for me are the cyclic/ collective data with approx 20+18=38 degree maximum incidence of the main rotor. That's the maximum pitch angle at the root of the blade which is not the same as the angle of attack of a blade (element) along the span of the blade (inflow induced by the rotor itself reduces the angle of attack). yes, but it is still the double value than the bo. But the incidence data I have for the bo is measured at 0.7r and therefore much smaller. Unfortunately I do not have any information about the airfoil (SC1095). This ([1]) NASA report contains some data about wind tunnel test done with that airfoil. Perfect. With this data I can calculate the data for the .xml file. One important point: the main rotor and the tail rotor are twisted. Do you know, where the incidence is measured? Pitch angle (theta) is normally measured from the root of the blade, as can be seen in [2], page 322. I am not sure if that matches the data. With 8° twist and -1.4° pitch at minimum you will get -9.4° at the tip and something about -7° mean (weightened with r^2). In autorotation you will get much overspeed. The data I have for the bo is measured at 0.7r. The effect is, that a pitch of 0 degree gives approx. in the same lift as a blade without twist. Flight path angle (phi) is calculated from the tangential and normal velocity components at a blade element and the angle of attack (alpha) is the difference between (or sum of) these two (depending on the choice of positive axes). Do you have such data for other helicopters in your book (bo105 (but here the actual data should be correct), ec135, ec145, ch47d, s76c, little nellie)? I have access to the majority of editions of Janes All The Worlds Aircraft between 1976 and 2006, so yes :) (although I'm not sure about little nellie ...) One important point for the simulation: most rotors have a delta3 effect (this means: reducing the pitch with increased flapping angle). Do you know this parameter for the ch53e (or for other helicopter?) Greetings, Wim [1] http://halfdome.arc.nasa.gov/publications/files/NASA-TP-2003-212265.pdf [2] http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19960054374_1996092848.pdf Thank you, Maik - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] CH53e data
On Tue, 19 Dec 2006, Maik Justus wrote: One important point for the simulation: most rotors have a delta3 effect (this means: reducing the pitch with increased flapping angle). Do you know this parameter for the ch53e (or for other helicopter?) I can only add that the CH-47D has no delta3 mechanism. (Or at least not the RAF HC Mk2 version which is very similar to the D version Chinook. Found that out just now from reading the RAF Mull-of-Kintyre accident report more thoroughly. But presumably this goes for all Chinook production models.) - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] What is the basic prgram loop structure of
Martin Spott wrote: Dene wrote: Ampere(and others) put this together a while ago... it might give you an overview. Indeed, the paper is really nice - but: Has anyone ever seen a single line of working code from one of the proponents of this paper ? Code that at least in some sense implements only a little part of these ideas ? Hi Martin, I wasn't presenting it as answer to any perceived or real FG issues. Just as an insight to the current structure. I have learnt the hard way that I'm last person qualified to criticize FG, I limit myself to what I can do (and grow in) and help others as I can, but I still indulge in contributing to wish lists even though there's little chance of me contributing anything that might make them happen. The only reason I mentioned it was because; I found the document useful to getting a basic understanding of the program structure and why various things happen as they do. Have a great Christmas Cheers Dene - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] How many players does FlightGear multipla yers feature can support?
My project needs more than 200 aircrafts to fly automatically ,all the aircrafts are drived by external flight data.I want want to utilize the multiplayer engines.Can it support so many players?By the way,my FlightGear runs in a PC. - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
