Re: [Flightgear-devel] git work flow question
Curtis Olson wrote: The other implication here is that it would be extremely handy to have multiple branches checked out simultaneously for other reasons. git makes branching easy, yes, but if you find yourself bouncing between branches with changes for separate projects, and external events may require you to jump to a different branch at a moments notice, It's a major PITA to have to commit every little thing you are in the middle of to switch to another branch. This is like having to completely clean up your desk before you can work on a new task, and then clean it up again completely before you can jump to the next. I think you're looking after having multiple local clones of the same repository where you're checking out a different branch in each of them, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] VATSIM support?
Chris, I think the benefit of having sort of a VATSIM-interface or -bridge for FlightGear is pretty much unquestioned, therefore I'll leave these details out. The point is a completely different one and probably consist of just two simple parts: 1.) Like probably almost every other OpenSource projects, FlightGear attracts its developer crowd (some would call it community) by the features which are specific to OpenSource development in general: Free access to the source code, multiple people working more or less collaboratively on the same part/feature, shared responsibility and certainly a lot more. This is fundamentally different from the development model you'd be forced into after signing an NDA: The NDA would presumably make almost every flavour of collaboration and peer-review impossible and the respective developer would end up as the sole responsible person for interfacing a variety of different FlightGear versions on a colourful bouquet of different platforms. Doesn't sound too attractive Chris O'Neill wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but what VATSIM seems to be saying is that they don't want just anybody trying to connect to their network, hence the only approved clients policy, and in order to enforce that policy they want to be the only source for releasing the source code. As far as I can tell the we need to protect our sim network is void. If they really make this claim, I'd consider it as a specious argument. To put it into different words: I know of at least three distinct implementations of VATSIM network protocols which had been created without VATSIM's help by reverse engineering. Thus, if anyone is seriously interested in compromising their network, there are sufficient opportunities to do so. One of the three people who reverse-engineered VATSIM-protocols was saying in a joke that he suspected the main reason for VATSIM to keep their protocol secret was not to disclose how poorly designed it is :-) Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] VATSIM support?
On Wed, 26 Jan 2011 09:56:41 + (UTC), Martin wrote in message ihor4p$ls0k$1...@osprey.mgras.de: Chris, I think the benefit of having sort of a VATSIM-interface or -bridge for FlightGear is pretty much unquestioned, therefore I'll leave these details out. The point is a completely different one and probably consist of just two simple parts: 1.) Like probably almost every other OpenSource projects, FlightGear attracts its developer crowd (some would call it community) by the features which are specific to OpenSource development in general: Free access to the source code, multiple people working more or less collaboratively on the same part/feature, shared responsibility and certainly a lot more. This is fundamentally different from the development model you'd be forced into after signing an NDA: The NDA would presumably make almost every flavour of collaboration and peer-review impossible and the respective developer would end up as the sole responsible person for interfacing a variety of different FlightGear versions on a colourful bouquet of different platforms. Doesn't sound too attractive ..and then there is the litigation risk, if you don't read nor sign any NDA, you can not violate that agreement. ..if you do sign a NDA, you risk having to hire an expensive contract law lawyer to try convince a pro-business judge that you the progressive pro-community hobbyist hacker did not do what that big business law team _claims_ you did. ..http://groklaw.net/ has _several_ such stories, where even Big Blue has been stuck for over 7 years in US courts. -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] JSBSim merge
On Mon, 2011-01-24 at 15:40 +, James Turner wrote: Okay - I'm going to re-apply my patches locally, and also apply Andreas Gaeb's NaN fixes (and to the release branch too), but of course they all need to be merged to JSBSim proper. After a bit of discussion it was decided that the FlightGear/JSBSim glue code in JSBSim.[ch]xx located in FlightGear/src/FDM/JSBSim now is maintained by FlightGear developers instead of by JSBSim developers and therefore these files will not be overwritten in future updates. Instead they are now copied over to JSBSim instead to act as example code. Erik -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] JSBSim merge
On 26 Jan 2011, at 11:55, Erik Hofman wrote: After a bit of discussion it was decided that the FlightGear/JSBSim glue code in JSBSim.[ch]xx located in FlightGear/src/FDM/JSBSim now is maintained by FlightGear developers instead of by JSBSim developers and therefore these files will not be overwritten in future updates. Instead they are now copied over to JSBSim instead to act as example code. Great, that simplifies things considerably, hopefully for everyone. There's still the issue of my FGPropulsion change, and Andreas' FGPropogate fix to go into JSBSim proper. Regards, James -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] JSBSim merge
On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 12:23 +, James Turner wrote: On 26 Jan 2011, at 11:55, Erik Hofman wrote: After a bit of discussion it was decided that the FlightGear/JSBSim glue code in JSBSim.[ch]xx located in FlightGear/src/FDM/JSBSim now is maintained by FlightGear developers instead of by JSBSim developers and therefore these files will not be overwritten in future updates. Instead they are now copied over to JSBSim instead to act as example code. Great, that simplifies things considerably, hopefully for everyone. There's still the issue of my FGPropulsion change, and Andreas' FGPropogate fix to go into JSBSim proper. I've committed Andreas' FGPropogate fix in JSBSim, your fix needs some more discussion and testing I'm afraid. Erik -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] JSBSim merge
-Original Message- From: Erik Hofman [mailto:e...@ehofman.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 5:55 AM To: FlightGear developers discussions Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] JSBSim merge On Mon, 2011-01-24 at 15:40 +, James Turner wrote: Okay - I'm going to re-apply my patches locally, and also apply Andreas Gaeb's NaN fixes (and to the release branch too), but of course they all need to be merged to JSBSim proper. After a bit of discussion it was decided that the FlightGear/JSBSim glue code in JSBSim.[ch]xx located in FlightGear/src/FDM/JSBSim now is maintained by FlightGear developers instead of by JSBSim developers and therefore these files will not be overwritten in future updates. Instead they are now copied over to JSBSim instead to act as example code. Erik I have received and applied patches from several places recently. Make sure that patches are not accidentally reversed. It is very important that patches - and *very*especially* **any** patches to FGPropagate - go through the proper channels, tested thoroughly using several specified scripts on the JSBSim side. All patches must be posted and/or explained on the JSBSim developer list first prior to being committed. I'm not writing this to be heavy-handed, but to avoid problems going forward, based on past experiences. Sometimes I will see problem reports in various places and be working locally on the best approach for a fix. So, merging *from* the flightgear tree to JSBSim might cause problems when I try to apply my (or another JSBSim developer's) fixes. So, let's please funnel ALL problem reports about JSBSim issues to the JSBSim developer list OR via the bug reporting tool: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?atid=119399group_id=19399func=browse Thanks - and sorry if this comes across as rude or controlling. It's not meant to. :-) Jon -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] JSBSim merge
On 26 Jan 2011, at 12:26, Erik Hofman wrote: Great, that simplifies things considerably, hopefully for everyone. There's still the issue of my FGPropulsion change, and Andreas' FGPropogate fix to go into JSBSim proper. I've committed Andreas' FGPropogate fix in JSBSim, your fix needs some more discussion and testing I'm afraid That's absolutely fine - I freely admit to knowing nothing about JSBSim internals! James -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] JSBSim merge
On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 07:19 -0600, Jon S. Berndt wrote: I have received and applied patches from several places recently. Make sure that patches are not accidentally reversed. They won't since the patches at the FlightGear side will be overwritten by what JSBSim had in CVS. It is very important that patches - and *very*especially* **any** patches to FGPropagate - go through the proper channels, tested thoroughly using several specified scripts on the JSBSim side. All patches must be posted and/or explained on the JSBSim developer list first prior to being committed. I've applied one that can only be harmless, initializing to zero for certain arguments upon reset. The other one needs to be looked at, like described in the JSBSim mailing list. Erik -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] git work flow question
[saw this in time to de-lurk] On 01/25/2011 11:22 AM, Anders Gidenstam wrote: I suspect the option --local to git clone might be useful. I have not tried myself, though. Yeah, this is the best answer for this kind of problem. The .git directory ends up being near-zero size (so long as the deltas between trees are small), and you pay only for the copy of the active tree. So resource consumption is more or less the same as having two checkouts of a remote tree. You do have to manage the extra steps required to push/pull/merge between the trees though. Andy -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] list of aircraft that don't load in fgdata
On Tue, 25 Jan 2011, dave perry wrote: I have tried to load several AC that did not load with filed to load file name errors. So I did a survey of the entire up-to-date fgdata. I used an up-to-date fgrun and went through all the AC. The following do not load even to the viewer in fgrun: 737-100, 737-300, AG-14, Airwave Xtreme 150, CRJ-200, DC-8-63, Fairchild Metroliner, Fooker50-Denim, Jaguar, Late-29, marchetti, MIG-29 Fulcrum, Mirage F1, North American OV-10A USAFE Bronco, Short Empire, x24b, and Zepphelin NT07 multiplayer copilot. Did you try them in FlightGear too? As far as I know both Short Empire and ZLT-NT-copilot (the latter doesn't have any visible model btw) load fine in FlightGear so if the problems with them occur only in fgrun I'd be inclined to consider it a problem in fgrun's model viewer rather than a problem in the aircraft. Cheers, Anders -- --- Anders Gidenstam WWW: http://www.gidenstam.org/FlightGear/ -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] [FWD: Re: VATSIM support?]
I just sent you a message to what is likely an old and replaced address. Just wondering if you are still going to come up to do your thing at LUGOD? jj -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] JSBSim merge
2011/1/26 Erik Hofman e...@ehofman.com: After a bit of discussion it was decided that the FlightGear/JSBSim glue code in JSBSim.[ch]xx located in FlightGear/src/FDM/JSBSim now is maintained by FlightGear developers instead of by JSBSim developers and therefore these files will not be overwritten in future updates. I don't know where this discussion took place so I may have missed the juicier bits. Then I apologize in advance if my questions have already been answered. Instead they are now copied over to JSBSim instead to act as example code. Given the decisions taken above, I don't understand why, in the first place, JSBSim should keep a copy of some code that will now be maintained elsewhere ? What is the plan ? Porting all patches from FlightGear to JSBSim's copy ? What for ? AFAICT JSBSim stand-alone executable is itself an example of how to integrate JSBSim library in an executable. And JSBSim.[ch]xx seems a fairly complicated chunk of code to serve as an example. For instance, JSBSim.cpp (the stand-alone executable) contains 635 lines of code while JSBSim.cxx (the glue code) contains 1413 lines of code. Even though, why the name of the Flight Gear glue code has been changed from JSBSim.[ch]xx to FlightGear.[ch]xx in JSBSim ? Now we have 2 copies of the same source code with 2 different file names. What is the point of this renaming ? Is it not confusing ? 2011/1/26 Erik Hofman e...@ehofman.com: On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 07:19 -0600, Jon S. Berndt wrote: I have received and applied patches from several places recently. Make sure that patches are not accidentally reversed. They won't since the patches at the FlightGear side will be overwritten by what JSBSim had in CVS. Unless I am mistaken, the plan is now to have a 2-way code exchange between FlightGear and JSBSim : FG = JSBSim for JSBSim.[ch]xx/FlightGear.[ch]xx JSBSim = FG for other JSBSim files. Who will make sure that those files are always in a consistent state ? Let's take an example : let's say I develop some code for JSBSim to take into account FG ground material in the landing gears friction forces. For that, I need to modify both JSBSim library *and* FlightGear glue code. So I will submit a patch to JSBSim (for the friction calcs) and another patch to FlightGear (to give JSBSim access to FG material data). The patch for FG glue code cannot be applied readily : first JSBSim needs to be patched and then copied in FlightGear (or otherwise FG compilation will fail). Once JSBSim last revision is copied in FlightGear the second part of the patch must be committed immediately in FlightGear (otherwise FG compilation will fail). And then the patched glue code will be copied back in JSBSim. Notice that the patch can be applied at any moment in JSBSim, even 1 month or 1 year after its submission. On the other hand, some tight synchronization is needed on the FlightGear side if you don't want FG compilation to break. Do you think such a process is sustainable ? I don't. Cheers, Bertrand. -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] git work flow question
On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 1:21 AM, Stefan Seifert n...@detonation.org wrote: Well you don't. Often you just can leave modified files in place while switching branches. If it's not working, you still can simply git stash before switching. git stash creates a temporary branch and commits your local changes to that branch. git stash apply lets you get back those changes, even if you're on a different branch than before (it's just like a git merge stash). Hi Stefan, I created a new branch and then in that branch created some new files and committed them to that subbranch. I'm working on those new files. Any time I make a change to one of those files and then want to quickly switch to the master branch I get a lot of these... $ git checkout master error: You have local changes to 'Aircraft/foo/bar/newfile'; cannot switch branches (because this file doesn't exist in master and the branch switch requires deleting it.) Ok, I could see git stash helping, but wow, if I start getting a few branches going, that could potentially be a lot of extra typing and a lot of things to remember (or go and check) every time I switch branches. When I return to a branch do I have to remember to unstash some changes? If I forget (life gets complicated sometimes) am I going to waste time chasing issues I've already fixed? If I have several branches in play, and someone pushes an important change to fgdata/master (possibly tied to an important change in flightgear/next) that can almost lead to an hour of just getting my branches up to date (even with no direct conflicting files.) I agree that some changes that have not been committed can float back and forth through branch switching (just not the ones I'm making right now.) :-) I found the book Version control with git quite useful. Yes it's somehow strange to need a book for a simple tool like a VCS, but git's features are IMHO worth having to read a little. I've barely had a chance to crack open my applying RCS and SCCS O'Reilly book, and now I have to buy a new book? ... :-) I personally wouldn't call git a simple tool. Git takes a highly complex problem (version control) and splits it up into just about the smallest possible logical chunks. Then it leaves it up to the end user to remember which chunks to stitch together and in which order to achieve the highly complex task. Many common tasks are easy in git. But some things start to become a royal pain. Part of this is because I need to adapt my work flow to be more git compatible. But I think part of this is that git has some limitations and weaknesses too, and isn't completely perfect itself. -- switching gears -- Another thing I do a lot of is work on projects that put me out in the field or traveling. So I like to maintain my projects across multiple machines ... my office desktop pc, my laptop, possibly other machines too depending on the project. If I'm doing FlightGear based work, and I want to create a special branch for my little project, *and* I want to share that branch across multiple PC's and possibly do work at times from any of these PC's ... then I need to create that branch on a server some place. Do I want to pollute the official flightgear repository with a bunch of branches solely for the purpose of my little side adventures? Do I create a separate clone on a separate server and then try to keep those in sync? At some point I'm going to have to sit down and think through the whole process of the best way to share a private branch across multiple PC's ... and keep those all in sync with each other and the official master repository. It should be doable I think, but sounds to me like it will require typing a lot of commands in the right order to make it work right ... I'm sure there are many ways to make this all work cleanly, but the question I have is if there's a way to do it that isn't too kludgey/hackish, isn't too brittle and easily broken by upstream changes, and doesn't require an unreasonable amount of command steps to accomplish. Regards, Curt. -- Curtis Olson: http://www.atiak.com - http://aem.umn.edu/~uav/ http://www.flightgear.org - http://www.flightgear.org/blogs/category/curt/http://www.flightgear.org/blogs/category/personal/curt/ -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] list of aircraft that don't load in fgdata
Hi, On Tue, 25 Jan 2011, dave perry wrote: I have tried to load several AC that did not load with filed to load file name errors. So I did a survey of the entire up-to-date fgdata. I used an up-to-date fgrun and went through all the AC. The following do not load even to the viewer in fgrun: 737-100, 737-300, AG-14, Airwave Xtreme 150, CRJ-200, DC-8-63, Fairchild Metroliner, Fooker50-Denim, Jaguar, Late-29, marchetti, MIG-29 Fulcrum, Mirage F1, North American OV-10A USAFE Bronco, Short Empire, x24b, and Zepphelin NT07 multiplayer copilot. With the latest FGRun on which OS? I have problems with some of them on win 32 xp and FGRun: AG14, 737-100, Airwave Xtreme 150(no valid mdl-file), CRJ-200, DC-8-63, F50-Denim, Jaguar, Late-290, marchetti, MIG-29, Short Empire, x24b HHS -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] JSBSim merge
Hi Bertrand, Here are a couple quick responses: - The reason JSBSim would want to keep a copy of the glue code would be to serve as an example for others who want to integrate JSBSim into their projects. - Changing the name of the glue code (I guess I missed seeing that this was officially decided). But if I'm not mistaken, currently we have JSBSim.cxx and JSBSim.cpp so that is also pretty confusing since they both produce a JSBSim.o. It would make sense to call this FlightGear.cxx within the JSBSim project, probably that's a less informative name within the FlightGear source tree. - 2 way patch patch propagation. Really the only important direction is for us to merge JSBSim changes into FlightGear. Merging the glue code changes back to the JSBSim project would simply be a courtesy to keep the example code up to date and reduce the chance that some bug or poor way to handle something is propagated to others (assuming we discover and fix something in the glue code ourselves.) Best regards, Curt. On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 1:53 PM, Bertrand Coconnier wrote: 2011/1/26 Erik Hofman e...@ehofman.com: After a bit of discussion it was decided that the FlightGear/JSBSim glue code in JSBSim.[ch]xx located in FlightGear/src/FDM/JSBSim now is maintained by FlightGear developers instead of by JSBSim developers and therefore these files will not be overwritten in future updates. I don't know where this discussion took place so I may have missed the juicier bits. Then I apologize in advance if my questions have already been answered. Instead they are now copied over to JSBSim instead to act as example code. Given the decisions taken above, I don't understand why, in the first place, JSBSim should keep a copy of some code that will now be maintained elsewhere ? What is the plan ? Porting all patches from FlightGear to JSBSim's copy ? What for ? AFAICT JSBSim stand-alone executable is itself an example of how to integrate JSBSim library in an executable. And JSBSim.[ch]xx seems a fairly complicated chunk of code to serve as an example. For instance, JSBSim.cpp (the stand-alone executable) contains 635 lines of code while JSBSim.cxx (the glue code) contains 1413 lines of code. Even though, why the name of the Flight Gear glue code has been changed from JSBSim.[ch]xx to FlightGear.[ch]xx in JSBSim ? Now we have 2 copies of the same source code with 2 different file names. What is the point of this renaming ? Is it not confusing ? 2011/1/26 Erik Hofman e...@ehofman.com: On Wed, 2011-01-26 at 07:19 -0600, Jon S. Berndt wrote: I have received and applied patches from several places recently. Make sure that patches are not accidentally reversed. They won't since the patches at the FlightGear side will be overwritten by what JSBSim had in CVS. Unless I am mistaken, the plan is now to have a 2-way code exchange between FlightGear and JSBSim : FG = JSBSim for JSBSim.[ch]xx/FlightGear.[ch]xx JSBSim = FG for other JSBSim files. Who will make sure that those files are always in a consistent state ? Let's take an example : let's say I develop some code for JSBSim to take into account FG ground material in the landing gears friction forces. For that, I need to modify both JSBSim library *and* FlightGear glue code. So I will submit a patch to JSBSim (for the friction calcs) and another patch to FlightGear (to give JSBSim access to FG material data). The patch for FG glue code cannot be applied readily : first JSBSim needs to be patched and then copied in FlightGear (or otherwise FG compilation will fail). Once JSBSim last revision is copied in FlightGear the second part of the patch must be committed immediately in FlightGear (otherwise FG compilation will fail). And then the patched glue code will be copied back in JSBSim. Notice that the patch can be applied at any moment in JSBSim, even 1 month or 1 year after its submission. On the other hand, some tight synchronization is needed on the FlightGear side if you don't want FG compilation to break. Do you think such a process is sustainable ? I don't. Cheers, Bertrand. -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- Curtis Olson: http://www.atiak.com - http://aem.umn.edu/~uav/ http://www.flightgear.org - http://www.flightgear.org/blogs/category/curt/http://www.flightgear.org/blogs/category/personal/curt/
Re: [Flightgear-devel] 777-200ER ground handling..
Hi, This is for Syd really. There is topic on the forum about improving the 777 FDM, and I myself got a bit carried away with modifying the ground steering. Attached is a diff of my changes against git master, as well as a zip file containing (hopefully) all the modified files. What this does is: 1) Limits nose gear steering by rudder to 7 degree as in the real aircraft. 2) Adds tiller steering which overrides any rudder steering, and allows to steer nose gear a full 70 degree left or right like real aircraft. 3) Adds main gear, aft axle steering that comes on when tiller steering is above 13 degrees like real aircraft. Currently main gear steering is up to 8 degrees as that is the number I found, but needs verified... 4) Adds a tiller steering dialog which can be used to steer aircraft with the tiller...available in 777 menu. Can also map a spare joy axis to /controls/gear/tiller-cmd-norm if you have one available. It's a little rough around the edges, and you may want to change property names, locations, and whatever..but I thought I'd post it in case you are interested in it. Feel free to use, ignore, modify, etc however you like. :) cheers! Sounds great- but do you know this already?: http://www.gitorious.org/syd-s-flightgear-content/777-200er You might wanna try a merge request Cheers Heiko -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] 777-200ER ground handling..
On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 6:28 PM, Heiko Schulz aeitsch...@yahoo.de wrote: Sounds great- but do you know this already?: http://www.gitorious.org/syd-s-flightgear-content/777-200er You might wanna try a merge request Cheers Heiko Nope, I didn't know about that one. Thanks. :) cheers --Jacob -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] VATSIM support?
On Tue, 2011-01-25 at 23:41 -0700, jac...@lfstech.com wrote: How about a show of hands? Is there enough interest and volunteers to organize a team to tackle the problem? As I said in my original post, I'm not a programmer so, unfortunately, I couldn't help in that regard. However, I'd be willing to help as an end-user/tester. Regards, Chris -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] list of aircraft that don't load in fgdata
On 01/26/2011 01:31 PM, Anders Gidenstam wrote: On Tue, 25 Jan 2011, dave perry wrote: I have tried to load several AC that did not load with filed to load file name errors. So I did a survey of the entire up-to-date fgdata. I used an up-to-date fgrun and went through all the AC. The following do not load even to the viewer in fgrun: 737-100, 737-300, AG-14, Airwave Xtreme 150, CRJ-200, DC-8-63, Fairchild Metroliner, Fooker50-Denim, Jaguar, Late-29, marchetti, MIG-29 Fulcrum, Mirage F1, North American OV-10A USAFE Bronco, Short Empire, x24b, and Zepphelin NT07 multiplayer copilot. Did you try them in FlightGear too? As far as I know both Short Empire and ZLT-NT-copilot (the latter doesn't have any visible model btw) load fine in FlightGear so if the problems with them occur only in fgrun I'd be inclined to consider it a problem in fgrun's model viewer rather than a problem in the aircraft. Cheers, Anders Hi again, I decided to kill a few hours today chasing down the source of the failure in fgrun for each AC I listed. I can put these failures in 3 classes. These are the first things that fgrun rejects. There are likely others. Class 1: fgfs and fgrun handle recursion of paths differently. Anders, you are correct concerning the failure of fgrun to load both the Short Empire and the ZLT-NT-copilot. These as well as the Jaguar fail to load in fgrun because of differences in the way recursive paths are handled in fgrun and fgfs xml parsers. Class 2: Linux Windows path differences (spaces in dir and file names or case sensitive). 737-300 path is .../Flightdeck/Instruments/STBY/alt.xml but file is ALT.xml AG-14path is .../Instruments/Reloj digital/Reloj digital.xml Fairchild Metroliner path is .../Instruments/Marker/MarkerLights.xml but actual path is .../Instruments/marker/MarkerLights.xml Mirage_F1 path is ../Models/cockpit/Divers/... but actual dir is divers Class 3: File or dir missing 737-100 several redundant models for instruments need to be deleted to match actual directory structure. Example: .../Instruments/aib/ai.xmldir aib doesn't exist CRJ-200 path .../fgdata/Models/Airport/Pushback/warning-light.xml doesn't exist DC-8-63 pathAircraft/dc8-63/Models/cargobox.xml/path doesn't exist Fokker50-Denim path .../Models/fokker50denim.xml doesn't exist Fokker50-KLM path .../Models/fokker50klm.xml doesn't exist Fokker50-VLM path .../Models/fokker50vlm.xml doesn't exist Late-29path .../Effects/wakeG.xml, actual path .../Effects/waves/wakeG.xml Mig-29 path .../Effects/tiptrail.xml, no Effects dir OV-10A USAFE path .../Aircraft/OV10/Effects/smoke.xml, no Effects dir The UIUC models with .mdl files don't load in fgrun viewer and don't seem to work from the command line either. Case 1 needs to be addressed by the maintainers of fgrun. Since this difference in parsing recursive paths only shows up for 3 of 100+ aircraft, it is true that this can be easily avoided by the aircraft maintainers. Case 2 should be addressed by the aircraft maintainers as FlightGear is a cross-platform project. Case 3 should also be addressed by the aircraft maintainers. Some of this is just sloppy xml files with cruft not removed because it is not causing fgfs to crash or abort. Some of this is likely work in progress. Is it possible to add a switch to the fgfs command line so that it aborts when a file or directory request violates the cross-platform goal (names with case not matching the actual dir or file names or names with embedded spaces). Cheers, Dave P. -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] [FlightGear-devel] Rogue accounts on wiki
Hi, Just a heads up. I always wondered why so many accounts with very suspicious names were being created on the Wiki. I think the answer is clear now, someone is trying to place traps for the unwary with links pointing to rogue pages: http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php/Special:RecentChanges Two examples of these traps: http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php/Special:RecentChanges - (diff | histhttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Administration_Jobs_In_Northern_Irelandcurid=6350action=history) . . N Administration Jobs In Northern Irelandhttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php/Administration_Jobs_In_Northern_Ireland; 01:35 . . *(+4,773)* . . Prinraphttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=User:Prinrapaction=editredlink=1 (Talkhttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=User_talk:Prinrapaction=editredlink=1 | contribshttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php/Special:Contributions/Prinrap ) (Created page with . . . . . . . ==center[ http://esecuritys.com/SESS_kd2MjE3fHwxMjk2MDgxOTYzfHwxOTUyfHwoRU5HSU5FKSBNZWRpYVdpa2k%3D_administration%2Bjobs%2Bin%2Bnorthern%2Bireland.htmlbig...) - (diff | histhttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Administration_Jobs_In_Michigan_Charter_Schoolscurid=6349action=history) . . N Administration Jobs In Michigan Charter Schoolshttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php/Administration_Jobs_In_Michigan_Charter_Schools; 01:35 . . *(+4,018)* . . Amfrweshttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=User:Amfrwesaction=editredlink=1 (Talkhttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=User_talk:Amfrwesaction=editredlink=1 | contribshttp://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php/Special:Contributions/Amfrwes ) (Created page with . . . . . . . ==center[ http://esecuritys.com/SESS_wk4MjE3fHwxMjk2MDgxOTYzfHwxOTUyfHwoRU5HSU5FKSBNZWRpYVdpa2k%3D_administration%2Bjobs%2Bin%2Bmichigan%2Bcharter%2Bschools.. .) Tom -- Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
