Re: [foreman-dev] Is it time to remove turbolinks?

[Daniel Lobato Garcia]

On 12/06, Walden Raines wrote:
> I am seeing more and more issues [1][2] around turbolinks and I'm wondering
> if it's time to remove it from foreman.  I have seen it recommended that
> one shouldn't use the back button in foreman; I thought that request was
> reserved for poorly written php sites that resubmit forms when the back
> button is pressed, we're better than that! :)

If someone suggests the back button shouldn't be used within foreman
because that breaks something - it's our fault. I recall some problems
in some pages like Products/Errata etc.. but haven't seen any in a whlie

The request is used by Basecamp, GitHub, and modern Ruby applications,
but honestly that's just an ad-hominem. (notice the blue bar when you click
on a link in GitHub)

>
> Are the benefits of turbolinks worth the cost?  Does anyone have any
> metrics on the difference in page load times with and without
> "turbo"links?

Do the test, it's considerably faster to use it, I'm happy to provide metrics.
In fact for cached pages it can easily be 100ms (/subnets, /settings, etc)

https://www.speedshop.co/2015/05/27/100-ms-to-glass-with-rails-and-turbolinks.html

In fact, there's room to make it faster (data-turbolinks-permanent)

>
> Any additional thoughts on its removal?

Unless there are serious blockers or anything that cannot be done with
Turbolinks that we need to do, I really oppose this. If you have another
alternative that's not pushState that makes Foreman faster and is as easy to
use, I'd be glad to hear it

>
> Cheers,
> Walden
>
> [1] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1522740
> [2] http://projects.theforeman.org/issues/21480
>
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Re: [foreman-dev] Is it time to remove turbolinks?

[Ondrej Prazak]

+1 to the comments above, moving forward with React will allow us to drop
turbolinks at some point without a noticeable decrease in UI performance -
at least that is my hope.

On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 5:46 PM, Ohad Levy  wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 5:10 PM, Walden Raines  wrote:
>
>> I am seeing more and more issues [1][2] around turbolinks and I'm
>> wondering if it's time to remove it from foreman.  I have seen it
>> recommended that one shouldn't use the back button in foreman; I thought
>> that request was reserved for poorly written php sites that resubmit forms
>> when the back button is pressed, we're better than that! :)
>>
>> Are the benefits of turbolinks worth the cost?  Does anyone have any
>> metrics on the difference in page load times with and without
>> "turbo"links?
>>
>> Any additional thoughts on its removal?
>>
>>
> I welcome the proposal to remove turbolinks,  having said that, there are
> a few things that we must take into account.
>
> 1. we should not just remove turbo links and loose all functionaitly -
> this will greatly impact current ui performance.
> 2. we should come up with an alternative plan - which is a roadmap to a
> SPA or semi SPA which will render the usage cases of tubolinks today not
> required.
>
> IMHO - I would suggest we look into converting the vertical nav into a
> react component (some work already done at [1]), than using that as a base
> for a SPA, we should default to fetching content, either via api and using
> react to render it, or (which is the very common case) to let the server
> render html and replace a content div, this will mimic the current way
> turbolinks more or less works and will surely speed up the page load times.
>
> We would need to move things like session / login / permissions etc into
> the browser if we go that path
>
> Ohad
>
>
>
> [1] https://github.com/patternfly/patternfly-react/pull/88
>
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Re: [foreman-dev] Is it time to remove turbolinks?

[Ohad Levy]

On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 5:10 PM, Walden Raines  wrote:

> I am seeing more and more issues [1][2] around turbolinks and I'm
> wondering if it's time to remove it from foreman.  I have seen it
> recommended that one shouldn't use the back button in foreman; I thought
> that request was reserved for poorly written php sites that resubmit forms
> when the back button is pressed, we're better than that! :)
>
> Are the benefits of turbolinks worth the cost?  Does anyone have any
> metrics on the difference in page load times with and without
> "turbo"links?
>
> Any additional thoughts on its removal?
>
>
I welcome the proposal to remove turbolinks,  having said that, there are a
few things that we must take into account.

1. we should not just remove turbo links and loose all functionaitly - this
will greatly impact current ui performance.
2. we should come up with an alternative plan - which is a roadmap to a SPA
or semi SPA which will render the usage cases of tubolinks today not
required.

IMHO - I would suggest we look into converting the vertical nav into a
react component (some work already done at [1]), than using that as a base
for a SPA, we should default to fetching content, either via api and using
react to render it, or (which is the very common case) to let the server
render html and replace a content div, this will mimic the current way
turbolinks more or less works and will surely speed up the page load times.

We would need to move things like session / login / permissions etc into
the browser if we go that path

Ohad



[1] https://github.com/patternfly/patternfly-react/pull/88

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Re: [foreman-dev] Is it time to remove turbolinks?

[Lukas Zapletal]

The idea behind turbolinks is good in general - it works great when
you have a standard Rails application with its view stack (ERB). When
I saw this talked, I liked it very much:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWEts0rlezA

Unfortunately, we are not good fit. This works for a clean app which
ERB and maybe little javascript. Foreman (and Katello) is a heavy JS
app with various JS frameworks and perhaps it does not work well. At
least this is my impression, I am very far from being a frontend
developer :-)

LZ

On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 4:10 PM, Walden Raines  wrote:
> I am seeing more and more issues [1][2] around turbolinks and I'm wondering
> if it's time to remove it from foreman.  I have seen it recommended that one
> shouldn't use the back button in foreman; I thought that request was
> reserved for poorly written php sites that resubmit forms when the back
> button is pressed, we're better than that! :)
>
> Are the benefits of turbolinks worth the cost?  Does anyone have any metrics
> on the difference in page load times with and without "turbo"links?
>
> Any additional thoughts on its removal?
>
> Cheers,
> Walden
>
> [1] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1522740
> [2] http://projects.theforeman.org/issues/21480
>
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-- 
Later,
  Lukas @lzap Zapletal

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