Dr Neuhaus niccy go not recognized

1999-11-07 Thread Charlie ROOT

During make of kernel:

cc -c -O -Wall -Wredundant-decls -Wnested-externs -Wstrict-prototypes
-Wmissing-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -Winline -Wcast-qual
-fformat-extensions -ansi -nostdinc -I- -I. -I../.. -I../../../include
-DKERNEL -include opt_global.h -elf ../../i4b/layer1/i4b_isic_pnp.c
../../i4b/layer1/i4b_isic_pnp.c:53: warning: #warning "Fix i4b pnp!"

Is this a "simple" matter of the right options to config, or does it
involve changes to the code?

Copyright (c) 1992-1999 The FreeBSD Project.
Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993
The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved.
FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #130: Sat Nov  6 18:14:11 CET 1999
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/usr/src/sys/compile/GINA
Timecounter "i8254"  frequency 1193182 Hz
CPU: Pentium II/Xeon/Celeron (337.50-MHz 686-class CPU)
  Origin = "GenuineIntel"  Id = 0x652  Stepping = 2
  
Features=0x183f9ffFPU,VME,DE,PSE,TSC,MSR,PAE,MCE,CX8,SEP,MTRR,PGE,MCA,CMOV,PAT,PSE36,MMX,FXSR
real memory  = 67096576 (65524K bytes)
avail memory = 61603840 (60160K bytes)
Preloaded elf kernel "kernel" at 0xc0357000.
VESA: v2.0, 4096k memory, flags:0x1, mode table:0xc00c0e38 (ce38)
VESA: S3 Incorporated Trio3D.
Pentium Pro MTRR support enabled
npx0: math processor on motherboard
npx0: INT 16 interface
pcib0: Intel 82443BX (440 BX) host to PCI bridge on motherboard
pci0: PCI bus on pcib0
pcib1: Intel 82443BX (440 BX) PCI-PCI (AGP) bridge at device 1.0 on pci0
pci1: PCI bus on pcib1
vga-pci0: S3 model 8904 graphics accelerator at device 0.0 on pci1
isab0: Intel 82371AB PCI to ISA bridge at device 4.0 on pci0
isa0: ISA bus on isab0
ata-pci0: Intel PIIX4 IDE controller at device 4.1 on pci0
ata-pci0: Busmastering DMA supported
ata0 at 0x01f0 irq 14 on ata-pci0
uhci0: Intel 82371AB/EB (PIIX4) USB controller irq 9 at device 4.2 on pci0
usb0: Intel 82371AB/EB (PIIX4) USB controller on uhci0
uhub0: Intel UHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1
uhub0: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered
ugen0: vendor 0x0553 product 0x0002, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 2
intpm0: Intel 82371AB Power management controller at device 4.3 on pci0
intpm0: I/O mapped e800
intpm0: intr IRQ 9 enabled revision 0
smbus0: System Management Bus on intsmb0
smb0: SMBus general purpose I/O on smbus0
intpm0: PM I/O mapped e400 
pcm0: AudioPCI ES1370 irq 5 at device 11.0 on pci0
ed1: NE2000 PCI Ethernet (RealTek 8029) irq 10 at device 12.0 on pci0
ed1: address 00:80:ad:50:40:cf, type NE2000 (16 bit) 
fdc0: NEC 72065B or clone at port 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa0
fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold
fd0: 1440-KB 3.5" drive on fdc0 drive 0
atkbdc0: keyboard controller (i8042) at port 0x60-0x6f on isa0
atkbd0: AT Keyboard irq 1 on atkbdc0
psm0: PS/2 Mouse irq 12 on atkbdc0
psm0: model Generic PS/2 mouse, device ID 0
vga0: Generic ISA VGA at port 0x3b0-0x3df iomem 0xa-0xb on isa0
sc0: System console on isa0
sc0: VGA 16 virtual consoles, flags=0x200
sio0 at port 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 flags 0x10 on isa0
sio0: type 16550A
sio1 at port 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on isa0
sio1: type 16550A
ppc0 at port 0x378-0x37f irq 7 on isa0
ppc0: SMC-like chipset (ECP/EPP/PS2/NIBBLE) in COMPATIBLE mode
ppc0: FIFO with 16/16/9 bytes threshold
lpt0: generic printer on ppbus 0
lpt0: Interrupt-driven port
ppi0: generic parallel i/o on ppbus 0
pca0 at port 0x40 on isa0
pca0: PC speaker audio driver
unknown0: ISDN PnP ISA pass. Adaptor DNT2039 at port 0x200-0x201,0x202-0x203 irq 11 
on isa0
i4b: ISDN call control device attached
i4bisppp: 4 ISDN SyncPPP device(s) attached
i4bctl: ISDN system control port attached
i4bipr: 4 IP over raw HDLC ISDN device(s) attached (VJ header compression)
i4btel: 2 ISDN telephony interface device(s) attached
i4brbch: 4 raw B channel access device(s) attached
i4btrc: 2 ISDN trace device(s) attached
ad0: ST38641A/3.11 ATA-4 disk at ata0 as master
ad0: 8207MB (16809660 sectors), 16676 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S
ad0: 16 secs/int, 0 depth queue, UDMA33
Creating DISK ad0
Creating DISK wd0
ad1: IBM-DTTA-350640/T54OA73A ATA-4 disk at ata0 as slave 
ad1: 6197MB (12692295 sectors), 13431 cyls, 15 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S
ad1: 16 secs/int, 31 depth queue, UDMA33
Creating DISK ad1
Creating DISK wd1
Mounting root from ufs:/dev/wd1s3a




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Re: doscmd broken on current?

1999-11-07 Thread Mike Smith

  Is doscmd working for anyone on current? Here I just get:
  
  -
  
  I have tried it on a single processor and SMP -current and both do the same
  thing. I had it working a while back, so I think my configuration is ok.
  
  Ideas on how to look into this?
  
  Start by invoking it with the various debug/trace options.  I'd guess
  that it may be broken by the signal-related changes that were made
  recently.
 
 hehehe It dies at the very first vm86 instruction, so I guess something
 isn't setup correctly to enter vm86 mode via the sigreturn():

I bet that someone got smart and disallowed PSL_VM in eflags on a 
return to user-mode.
-- 
\\ Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. \\  Mike Smith
\\ Tell him he should learn how to fish himself,  \\  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
\\ and he'll hate you for a lifetime. \\  [EMAIL PROTECTED]




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Re: doscmd broken on current?

1999-11-07 Thread Marcel Moolenaar

John Hay wrote:
 
 Hmmm I see the sigreturn man page hasn't been updated, it still says that
 sigreturn takes a struct sigcontext * argument, while the signal.h file
 says it takes ucontext_t *.

Sigreturn still takes a struct sigcontext*. It also takes a ucontext_t.
I think the header should define sigreturn to take a struct
sigcontext*...

-- 
Marcel Moolenaarmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
SCC Internetworking  Databases   http://www.scc.nl/
The FreeBSD projectmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: show stopper for Gcc 2.95.2 conversion

1999-11-07 Thread Gary Jennejohn

"David O'Brien" writes:
On Sat, Nov 06, 1999 at 10:34:18AM +0100, Gary Jennejohn wrote:
 Here's a patch to bus.h which works for both EGCS and GCC 2.95.2. I have

Here is the patch I've been working on (before I 1st got BDE's reply).
The changes are mostly from OpenBSD + style changes for the way we do
things.  Can you also test this one?

[patch snipped]

This patch also works with both compilers. Seems kind of hairy, though.

Any idea why GCC 2.95.2 produces so much more code ?

# ls -l /kernel*gc*
-rwxr-xr-x  1 root  wheel  1753591 Nov  7 10:50 /kernel.egcs*
-rwxr-xr-x  1 root  wheel  1788387 Nov  7 10:57 /kernel.gcc*

well, it's not all that much more.

---
Gary Jennejohn
Home - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Work - [EMAIL PROTECTED]




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Re: stuck with ~year old current

1999-11-07 Thread Daniel C. Sobral

Taavi Talvik wrote:
 
 Only alternative to get these from outside is to upgrade graduall.. but
 who knows which intermediate source repository dates are good for it?

Mike once said (and, ergo, can be found on the mailing list
archives):

"We do not support upgrading to -current from anything else than the
latest -stable."

There's your answer.

--
Daniel C. Sobral(8-DCS)
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

What y'all wanna do?
Wanna be hackers? Code crackers? Slackers
Wastin' time with all the chatroom yakkers?



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Re: stuck with ~year old current

1999-11-07 Thread Thierry Herbelot

"Daniel C. Sobral" wrote:
 
 Taavi Talvik wrote:
 
  Only alternative to get these from outside is to upgrade graduall.. but
  who knows which intermediate source repository dates are good for it?
 
 Mike once said (and, ergo, can be found on the mailing list
 archives):
 
 "We do not support upgrading to -current from anything else than the
 latest -stable."

Does this still hold after the recent signal changes ?

TfH

(I assume Yes, if one first upgrade the kernel, then the world)

 
 There's your answer.
 
 --
 Daniel C. Sobral(8-DCS)
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 What y'all wanna do?
 Wanna be hackers? Code crackers? Slackers
 Wastin' time with all the chatroom yakkers?
 
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Re: Serious locking problem in CURRENT

1999-11-07 Thread David Malone

On Sat, Nov 06, 1999 at 01:29:16PM -0600, Jonathan Lemon wrote:

 From the manual page for flock:
 
 NOTES
  Locks are on files, not file descriptors.  That is, file descriptors du-
  plicated through dup(2) or fork(2) do not result in multiple instances of
  a lock, but rather multiple references to a single lock.  If a process
  holding a lock on a file forks and the child explicitly unlocks the file,
  the parent will lose its lock.

Doesn't this make it impossible to hold a lock on a file when you
want to fork a child to do some task 'cos the lock will be dropped
when the child closes its copy of the file discriptor on exit?
Either it's a posix goof or the lock shouldn't be let go until
either explicitly released or the last instance of the file discriptor
is closed?

David.


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Re: Serious locking problem in CURRENT

1999-11-07 Thread David Malone

On Sun, Nov 07, 1999 at 02:01:02AM +0100, Ollivier Robert wrote:

 Right but in Postfix case this is not the case. The "master" process run to
 check whether Postfix is running or not is definitely NOT a child of the real
 "master" process.

But if the real master process forks and then it's child closes the fd
which the lock was on, then the master process will have lost it's lock.
Is this likely? Does the real master fork children to do stuff?

David.


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Re: stuck with ~year old current

1999-11-07 Thread Daniel C. Sobral

Lauri Laupmaa wrote:
 
 On Fri, 5 Nov 1999, Michael Reifenberger wrote:
 
  The flag is probably -fformat-extensions so eliminate it from
  /usr/share/mk/bsd.kern.mk.
  Then build linker/kernel/world.
 
 Thank you all who replied! The trick was to take new loader from running
 system, because it was impossible to build one with old gcc...

Impossible is a little bit too harsh. I do it all the time on
freefall, which runs -stable.

--
Daniel C. Sobral(8-DCS)
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Wanna be hackers? Code crackers? Slackers
Wastin' time with all the chatroom yakkers?




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Re: stuck with ~year old current

1999-11-07 Thread Daniel C. Sobral

Thierry Herbelot wrote:
 
  Mike once said (and, ergo, can be found on the mailing list
  archives):
 
  "We do not support upgrading to -current from anything else than the
  latest -stable."
 
 Does this still hold after the recent signal changes ?
 
 TfH
 
 (I assume Yes, if one first upgrade the kernel, then the world)

You assume correctly. -stable loader can load -current kernel. Well,
it could until very recently. I don't know if the new stuff Mike is
doing will introduce any incompatibility.

--
Daniel C. Sobral(8-DCS)
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

What y'all wanna do?
Wanna be hackers? Code crackers? Slackers
Wastin' time with all the chatroom yakkers?




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Re: TCP sockets stuck in the CLOSING state

1999-11-07 Thread Dag-Erling Smorgrav

[bringing this back to -current, with a Bcc to -security]

"Kenneth D. Merry" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 Jonathan Lemon wrote...
  In article local.mail.freebsd-current/[EMAIL PROTECTED] you 
write:
   Before I spend a lot of time hunting this down, I figured it might be worth
   asking -- is there any particular reason why TCP sockets may be getting
   stuck in the CLOSING state more often now?
  Not sure.  But here's a tcpdump trace of a socket that ends up in the
  CLOSING state.  (on the host ``cache'').
  [...]
  1. the other end (folly) never acks the FIN.  The packets at 
 timestamp .492154 and .492160 do not cover the FIN in the
 sequence space.  Yet the host `folly' closes the socket.

This is weird, and probably deserves some investigation (at least if
cache and folly are on the same LAN; otherwise there's a non-zero
possibility of the ACK simply getting lost on the way)

  2. the end that is stuck in CLOSING (cache) never retransmits 
 the FIN.  (The tcpdump extends for about 5 minutes after the
 last packet, with 0 packets lost).

It's not supposed to (according to RFC793).

  Both machines are running -current from early this week.
 
 Those are definitely odd.
 
 After looking through the changes since June, I think (and DES seems to
 agree) that the problems are most likely in your timeout code from August.
 Most every other change in the TCP stack has been cosmetic, or #ifdefed, so
 it wouldn't be enabled by default.
 
 He is going to try to find the problem, although it's most likely a pretty
 subtle bug.

Well, the TCP state machine was never a fun read, amd I haven't had
time to look very closely at the problem yet, but it seems that there
is no way for a connection to leave the TCPS_CLOSING state other than
the receipt of an ACK matching a previously sent FIN. If the ACK gets
lost, the connection is stuck in TCPS_CLOSING forever (I have a
connection that's been stuck in TCPS_CLOSING for at least three days
now). The only instance I can find where a connection in TCPS_CLOSING
state is closed even if no ACK has been received is when the socket
has the SO_KEEPALIVE option set (tcp_timer_keep() in tcp_timer.c).

Note that the state transition diagram in RFC793 does not specify a
timeout for the CLOSING - TIME_WAIT transition, so any faithful
implementation of RFC793 has this bug (but why doesn't this happen on
-STABLE, or on pre-August -CURRENT?)

This hints at a potential DoS vulnerability. Hack a TCP stack to never
acknowledge FIN segments, and blast away at your victim; chances are
he'll run out of mbufs before you run out of source ports (each source
port can only be used once in the attack). Give me a few hours and I
might be able to verify this vulnerability experimentally.

DES
-- 
Dag-Erling Smorgrav - [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: Dr Neuhaus niccy go not recognized

1999-11-07 Thread Hellmuth Michaelis

From the keyboard of Charlie ROOT:

 During make of kernel:
 
 cc -c -O -Wall -Wredundant-decls -Wnested-externs -Wstrict-prototypes
 -Wmissing-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -Winline -Wcast-qual
 -fformat-extensions -ansi -nostdinc -I- -I. -I../.. -I../../../include
 -DKERNEL -include opt_global.h -elf ../../i4b/layer1/i4b_isic_pnp.c
 ../../i4b/layer1/i4b_isic_pnp.c:53: warning: #warning "Fix i4b pnp!"
 
 Is this a "simple" matter of the right options to config, or does it
 involve changes to the code?

PnP support for i4b in -current was disabled during the conversion of
-current to the new-bus/new-pnp architecture; as a result all PnP ISDN
cards i4b supports do no longer work.

hellmuth
-- 
Hellmuth MichaelisTel   +49 40 559747-70
HCS Hanseatischer Computerservice GmbHFax   +49 40 559747-77
Oldesloer Strasse 97-99   Mail  hm [at] hcs.de
22457 Hamburg WWW   http://www.hcs.de


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Re: doscmd broken on current?

1999-11-07 Thread John Hay

   Is doscmd working for anyone on current? Here I just get:
   
   -
   
   I have tried it on a single processor and SMP -current and both do the same
   thing. I had it working a while back, so I think my configuration is ok.
   
   Ideas on how to look into this?
   
   Start by invoking it with the various debug/trace options.  I'd guess
   that it may be broken by the signal-related changes that were made
   recently.
  
  hehehe It dies at the very first vm86 instruction, so I guess something
  isn't setup correctly to enter vm86 mode via the sigreturn():
 
 I bet that someone got smart and disallowed PSL_VM in eflags on a 
 return to user-mode.

Nope it wasn't that bad. I'm not sure if this is the correct fix, but
with this patch I can boot dos again. Can someone with more knowledge
of the signal stuff look and say if this is correct/enough?

The redirector don't work though. I just get a "File not Found" error
when trying to dir any of the redirected directories.

John
-- 
John Hay -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]


Index: doscmd.c
===
RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.bin/doscmd/doscmd.c,v
retrieving revision 1.11
diff -u -r1.11 doscmd.c
--- doscmd.c1999/10/13 23:48:35 1.11
+++ doscmd.c1999/11/07 12:50:06
@@ -258,6 +258,7 @@
 
 sigemptyset(uc.uc_sigmask);
 sigaltstack(NULL, uc.uc_stack);
+uc.uc_mcontext.mc_onstack = uc.uc_stack.ss_flags;
 
 if (tmode)
tracetrap(REGS);


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Re: TCP sockets stuck in the CLOSING state

1999-11-07 Thread Jonathan Lemon

On Nov 11, 1999 at 01:41:48PM +0100, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote:
 [bringing this back to -current, with a Bcc to -security]
 
 "Kenneth D. Merry" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
  Jonathan Lemon wrote...
   In article local.mail.freebsd-current/[EMAIL PROTECTED] you 
write:
Before I spend a lot of time hunting this down, I figured it might be worth
asking -- is there any particular reason why TCP sockets may be getting
stuck in the CLOSING state more often now?
   Not sure.  But here's a tcpdump trace of a socket that ends up in the
   CLOSING state.  (on the host ``cache'').
   [...]
   1. the other end (folly) never acks the FIN.  The packets at 
  timestamp .492154 and .492160 do not cover the FIN in the
  sequence space.  Yet the host `folly' closes the socket.
 
 This is weird, and probably deserves some investigation (at least if
 cache and folly are on the same LAN; otherwise there's a non-zero
 possibility of the ACK simply getting lost on the way)

Good point.  I'll try taking a tcpdump on both sides to see if the
ACK is getting lost, or if it just isn't getting sent at all.


 
 Note that the state transition diagram in RFC793 does not specify a
 timeout for the CLOSING - TIME_WAIT transition, so any faithful
 implementation of RFC793 has this bug (but why doesn't this happen on
 -STABLE, or on pre-August -CURRENT?)

I'm not sure abuot that one.  But I've just committed a fix to tcp_fsm.h,
which will cause it to re-transmit a FIN in CLOSING state.  The FIN was
originally taken out by Garrett in rev 1.5, and restored by dg in rev 1.6.
However, it was re-removed in 1.10 when Garrett made a large commit,
presumably he hadn't taken it out of his local tree.

It fixes the problem here (at least, I can't replicate the problem any
more).  I'm not sure if I'm fixing the symptoms rather than the actual
problem then, though.  NetBSD has the same fix in their tree as well.

I'm pretty sure that I've seen this problem on -current going back as
early as March as well.


 This hints at a potential DoS vulnerability. Hack a TCP stack to never
 acknowledge FIN segments, and blast away at your victim; chances are
 he'll run out of mbufs before you run out of source ports (each source
 port can only be used once in the attack). Give me a few hours and I
 might be able to verify this vulnerability experimentally.

Do let me know if this is the case.  I was considering this last night,
but was too tired to try an figure out how to generate a TCP stream that
would ACK everything but the FIN.
--
Jonathan


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Re: Serious locking problem in CURRENT

1999-11-07 Thread Ben Smithurst

David Malone wrote:

 On Sat, Nov 06, 1999 at 01:29:16PM -0600, Jonathan Lemon wrote:
 
 From the manual page for flock:
 
 NOTES
  Locks are on files, not file descriptors.  That is, file descriptors du-
  plicated through dup(2) or fork(2) do not result in multiple instances of
  a lock, but rather multiple references to a single lock.  If a process
  holding a lock on a file forks and the child explicitly unlocks the file,
  the parent will lose its lock.
 
 Doesn't this make it impossible to hold a lock on a file when you
 want to fork a child to do some task 'cos the lock will be dropped
 when the child closes its copy of the file discriptor on exit?
 Either it's a posix goof or the lock shouldn't be let go until
 either explicitly released or the last instance of the file discriptor
 is closed?

The lock doesn't seem to be released until *explicitly* released, like
the manual page says. I don't think closing the descriptor counts as
an explicit unlock, though I am probably wrong. Run this program,
you'll see the parent still has the lock. Change close(fd) to flock(fd,
LOCK_UN) and you'll see it doesn't. It's possible I've misunderstood
something though.

#include fcntl.h
#include err.h
#include stdio.h
#include unistd.h

int
main(void) {
int fd;

fd = open("lock", O_CREAT|O_RDWR, 0600);
if (fd  0)
err(1, "open");

if (flock(fd, LOCK_EX) != 0)
err(1, "flock");

switch (fork()) {
case -1:
err(1, "fork");
case 0:
close(fd);
_exit(0);
default:
sleep(2);
break;
}

system("lsof | less");
return (0);
}

-- 
Ben Smithurst| PGP: 0x99392F7D
[EMAIL PROTECTED] |   key available from keyservers and
 |   [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: ESS 1868 driver, again

1999-11-07 Thread D. Rock

Peter Wemm wrote:
 As to why the 1869 isn't working for you, that's anybody's guess.  You
 might try posting the 'dmesg' output (not from syslog) and your complete
 config file, as well as any other pertinant information you can think of.
Ok

here is the (hopefully) complete information.

-current cvsupped ~2 hours ago.

If seems there will no interrupts be generated. If I try to play something,
nothing happens, if I run "vmstat -i" then, there are 0 interrupts for irq 5
(pcm0).

Daniel


kernel config file:


machine i386

ident   LAPTOP

maxusers6

options PQ_LARGECACHE

cpu I686_CPU

options COMPAT_43
options SYSVSHM
options SYSVSEM
options SYSVMSG
options MD5
options DDB
options KTRACE
options PERFMON
options UCONSOLE
options INET

pseudo-device   ether
pseudo-device   loop
pseudo-device   bpf
pseudo-device   tun

options ICMP_BANDLIM

options FFS
options NFS
options NFS_NOSERVER

options CD9660
options MSDOSFS
options PROCFS
options FFS_ROOT

options SOFTUPDATES

options QUOTA

options P1003_1B
options _KPOSIX_PRIORITY_SCHEDULING
options _KPOSIX_VERSION=199309L

controller  scbus0
device  da0
device  pass0

pseudo-device   pty

options MSGBUF_SIZE=20480

controller  isa0

controller  pnp0
options PNPBIOS

controller  atkbdc0 at isa? port IO_KBD
device  atkbd0  at atkbdc? irq 1
options ATKBD_DFLT_KEYMAP
makeoptions ATKBD_DFLT_KEYMAP="german.iso"

device  psm0at atkbdc? irq 12
options PSM_HOOKAPM
options PSM_RESETAFTERSUSPEND

device  vga0at isa? port ? conflicts
options VGA_WIDTH90
options VESA
pseudo-device   splash

device  sc0 at isa?
options MAXCONS=6
options SC_DFLT_FONT
makeoptions SC_DFLT_FONT=iso
options SC_PIXEL_MODE

device  npx0at nexus? port IO_NPX flags 0x0 irq 13

controller  ata0
device  atadisk0
device  atapicd0

options ATA_ENABLE_ATAPI_DMA

controller  fdc0at isa? port IO_FD1 irq 6 drq 2
device  fd0 at fdc0 drive 0

device  sio0at isa? port IO_COM1 flags 0x10 irq 4
device  sio1at isa? port IO_COM2 irq 3

device  ed0

device  pcm0

device  apm0at nexus? 
device  joy0at isa? port IO_GAME

controller  pci0

controller  pcic0   at isa? irq 10
controller  pcic1   at isa? irq 10
controller  card0
options PCIC_RESUME_RESET

controller  ppbus0
controller  vpo0at ppbus?
device  lpt0at ppbus?
device  ppi0at ppbus?

device  ppc0at isa? port? irq 7 drq 3

controller  uhci0
controller  usb0
device  ugen0

options HZ=500


dmesg output of verbose boot:

Copyright (c) 1992-1999 The FreeBSD Project.
Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993
The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved.
FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #241: Sun Nov  7 13:48:17 CET 1999
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/usr/src/sys/compile/ROCK
Calibrating clock(s) ... TSC clock: 232125177 Hz, i8254 clock: 1193284 Hz
CLK_USE_I8254_CALIBRATION not specified - using default frequency
Timecounter "i8254"  frequency 1193182 Hz
CLK_USE_TSC_CALIBRATION not specified - using old calibration method
CPU: Pentium II/Xeon/Celeron (232.11-MHz 686-class CPU)
  Origin = "GenuineIntel"  Id = 0x652  Stepping = 2
  
Features=0x183f9ffFPU,VME,DE,PSE,TSC,MSR,PAE,MCE,CX8,SEP,MTRR,PGE,MCA,CMOV,PAT,PSE36,MMX,FXSR
real memory  = 67108864 (65536K bytes)
Physical memory chunk(s):
0x1000 - 0x0009efff, 647168 bytes (158 pages)
0x002ef000 - 0x03ffafff, 64012288 bytes (15628 pages)
avail memory = 62169088 (60712K bytes)
bios32: Found BIOS32 Service Directory header at 0xc00f66a0
bios32: Entry = 0xfd7e0 (c00fd7e0)  Rev = 0  Len = 1
pcibios: PCI BIOS entry at 0x203
pnpbios: Found PnP BIOS data at 0xc00f66d0
pnpbios: Entry = f:a62f  Rev = 1.0
Other BIOS signatures found:
ACPI: 
VESA: information block
56 45 53 41 00 02 6b 00 00 c0 00 00 00 00 f6 8c 
00 c0 10 00 00 00 b4 27 00 c0 b5 27 00 c0 b6 27 
00 c0 b7 27 00 c0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 
VESA: 11 mode(s) found
VESA: v2.0, 1024k memory, flags:0x0, mode table:0xc00c8cf6 (c0008cf6)
VESA: Copyright 1994 TRIDENT MICROSYSTEMS INC.

VESA:   
Pentium Pro MTRR support enabled
pci_open(1):mode 1 addr port (0x0cf8) is 0x80001010
pci_open(1a):   mode1res=0x8000 (0x8000)
pci_cfgcheck:   device 0 [class=06] [hdr=00] is there (id=71928086)
npx0: math processor on motherboard
npx0: INT 16 interface
apm0: APM BIOS on motherboard
apm: found APM BIOS v1.2, connected at v1.2

Re: sio working

1999-11-07 Thread D. Rock

Warner Losh wrote:
 
 In message [EMAIL PROTECTED] "D. Rock" writes:
 : device  sio0at isa? port IO_COM1 flags 0x10 irq 4
 : device  sio1at isa? port IO_COM2 irq 3
 
 These look good.  IIRC, the kernel I tested with also had:
 
 device  sio2at isa? port IO_COM3 irq 5 disabled
 or
 device  sio2
 
 in it, but I may be misremembering.  Just make sure that you use the
 config entry that gives you a port at 0x3e8, since most laptops have
 COM1 and COM2 which really cannot be disabled (well, the BIOS says you
 can disable them, but I've seen a few where the BIOS disabling is
 broken).
Already did that. I used a config entry for 0x3e8 and one for 0x2e8.
Windows 98 configured the card for IRQ 11 I/O 0x3e8 BTW.

Just some more pccard questions:

When will removing cards (and therefor also suspend/resume) work again?
If I remove the netcard or suspend the machine, the system will freeze.

I also get a NMI if I insert my netcard (DLink DE-660). If DDB is compiled
in I can just continue. Interesting the NMI wasn't generated during initial
configuration (via DHCP), but when I tried some ping tests:

pccard: card inserted, slot 0
sio2: irq maps: 0x105 0x105 0x105 0x105
sio2: probe failed test(s): 0 1 4 6 7 9
sio2: irq maps: 0x105 0x105 0x105 0x105
sio2: probe failed test(s): 0 1 4 6 7 9
pccard: card inserted, slot 1
ed0 at port 0x240-0x25f irq 15 slot 1 on pccard0
ed0: address 00:80:c8:8b:66:e9, type NE2000 (16 bit)
bpf: ed0 attached
NMI ... going to debugger
(
[the first two sio2 lines were with config index for port 0x3e8, the other
ones with config index for 0x2e8]

Daniel


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Re: Dr Neuhaus niccy go not recognized

1999-11-07 Thread Hellmuth Michaelis

From the keyboard of Leif Neland:

  PnP support for i4b in -current was disabled during the conversion of
  -current to the new-bus/new-pnp architecture; as a result all PnP ISDN
  cards i4b supports do no longer work.
  
 Anybody working on re-enabling it, and if so, any time-horisonts?

Yes, no.

I still hope documentation for the new-bus, new-pnp architecture will be
made available at sufficient time before 4.0-RELEASE code freeze.

hellmuth
-- 
Hellmuth MichaelisTel   +49 40 559747-70
HCS Hanseatischer Computerservice GmbHFax   +49 40 559747-77
Oldesloer Strasse 97-99   Mail  hm [at] hcs.de
22457 Hamburg WWW   http://www.hcs.de


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Re: Dr Neuhaus niccy go not recognized

1999-11-07 Thread German Tischler

On Sun, Nov 07, 1999 at 03:16:48PM +0100, Leif Neland wrote:
  PnP support for i4b in -current was disabled during the conversion of
  -current to the new-bus/new-pnp architecture; as a result all PnP ISDN
  cards i4b supports do no longer work.
  
 Anybody working on re-enabling it, and if so, any time-horisonts?

Depends on which card you use. I have attempted to do the conversion
for some cards. You are welcome to test it, but don't expect it to
work out of the box, I don't have the hardware to test it. It works
for the hardware I have access to. If the code will be brought into
i4b at all, it will not be before the i4b-PCI card code has
been converted too and the concept and code is sophisticated enough
for Hellmuth to accept it (and from what he wrote before, that won't
be before there is other documentation than RTSL for the newbus
system) . Some other people have shown interest in converting the PCI
code. If it takes time I won't blame them, I don't have any spare 
time until mid january either. 

-- 
German Tischler, [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: Serious locking problem in CURRENT

1999-11-07 Thread Brian Fundakowski Feldman

On Sat, 6 Nov 1999, Dmitrij Tejblum wrote:

 Brian Fundakowski Feldman wrote:
  There were zero comments about what order things happen in; in fact,
  the ordering in this case is Just Plain Lame (TM).  It's much more
  correct to explicitly check for fp-f_count == 1.
 
 Not sure what you mean. The commit clearly states that POSIX and BSD 
 locking intentionally handled in different ways here. Frankly, I see 
 nothing lame in the ordering. The second VOP_ADVLOCK just should be 
 moved to fdrop().

Yes, but you implied that there was some part of the commenting that
I must have missed in rev.1.68, but there was nothing about that. I
think I'll get an okay from bruce and move the unlock to fdrop();  I
have still been pondering which is more correct, actually.

 
   BTW, I have another little concern with that commit: It make possible for 
   last close() of a file descriptor to return 0 instead of the error from 
   VOP_CLOSE(), and the error from VOP_CLOSE() to be ignored.
 
 When a process do closef() on a descriptor "held" by another process 
 (by fhold(), e.g. the process do read() on the descriptor), it will 
 just return 0 without the call to fo_close(). Then, when the other 
 process drop the descriptor, fdrop() call fo_close() but the error is 
 thrown away. No?

Yes, this is what I thought you could have meant.  But would you
rather lose that error in a corner case or do locking on the fd/fdtable
or just let the system crash in that case?  I'm open for a better solution.

 
 Dima
 
 
 

-- 
 Brian Fundakowski Feldman   \  FreeBSD: The Power to Serve!  /
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]`--'



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Re: libvgl - status and perspectives

1999-11-07 Thread Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai

-On [19991106 04:01], Andrzej Bialecki ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
Today I noticed accidentally that either libvgl is broken, or the demo
program does something wrong - the mouse cursor doesn't move.

But this brings more general question regarding console graphics library.
As it is today, libvgl is almost useless due to very limited set of
functions. There were discussions whether to port SVGAlib or GGI. Do you
know if someone is working/planning to work on it?

libggi has more support for FreeBSD than svgalib has and it also seems
to be preferred over svgalib due to security hassles and all that.

So you might want to try that route.

-- 
Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven/Asmodai  asmodai(at)wxs.nl
The BSD Programmer's Documentation Project http://home.wxs.nl/~asmodai
Network/Security SpecialistBSD: Technical excellence at its best
In every stone sleeps a crystal...


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Re: Serious locking problem in CURRENT

1999-11-07 Thread Ollivier Robert

According to David Malone:
 But if the real master process forks and then it's child closes the fd
 which the lock was on, then the master process will have lost it's lock.
 Is this likely? Does the real master fork children to do stuff?

All the time. "master" is an inetd-like daemon which spawn children according
to master.cf. Everything run by Postfix is a child of "master"...

I see your point and that's likely what happen. You're confirming what I
thought about locking brokeness. That's bad.
-- 
Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 4.0-CURRENT #75: Tue Nov  2 21:03:12 CET 1999



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new home directory for daemon

1999-11-07 Thread Julian Stacey

Problem: ~daemon/tmp should not be the same directory as ~root/tmp/
Suggestion: new home directory:
daemon:*:1:1::0:0:Owner of many system processes:/daemon:/sbin/nologin
+ extend BSD.root.dist to create ~daemon/tmp
Given existing current/src/:
  etc/master.passwd:
root::0:0::0:0:Charlie :/root:/bin/csh
daemon:*:1:1::0:0:Owner of many system processes:/root:/sbin/nologin
  etc/group:
wheel:*:0:root
daemon:*:1:daemon
  etc/BSD.root.dist:
..
root
..
(but no root/tmp created)
So assuming a manually created secure  private /root/tmp with
owner root, group wheel, mode 700

This was just posted to the list, rather than made a send-pr, as I guess there
may be better solutions ... Any Comments / Improvements ?

--
Julian Stacey   www.freebsd.org/~jhs/


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Re: stuck with ~year old current

1999-11-07 Thread Mike Smith

   "We do not support upgrading to -current from anything else than the
   latest -stable."
  
  Does this still hold after the recent signal changes ?
  
  TfH
  
  (I assume Yes, if one first upgrade the kernel, then the world)
 
 You assume correctly. -stable loader can load -current kernel. Well,
 it could until very recently. I don't know if the new stuff Mike is
 doing will introduce any incompatibility.

The last incompatibility was around March or so, when the load address 
of the kernel changed.  Anything postdating that is basically 
equi-functional.

-- 
\\ Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. \\  Mike Smith
\\ Tell him he should learn how to fish himself,  \\  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
\\ and he'll hate you for a lifetime. \\  [EMAIL PROTECTED]




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Re: doscmd broken on current? fixed

1999-11-07 Thread John Hay

Ok, with these patches doscmd is working for me again. I can boot dos and
run the topspeed C compiler like I used to a few months ago.

If nobody has any complaints I'll commit it. I'm just not 100% sure about
the patch to doscmd.c and would like if someone with more knowledge about
the signal stuff would just look at it. There is just too many signal
related functions and structures and it isn't always clear (to me at least)
what should be filled in for whom.

John
-- 
John Hay -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]


Index: cwd.c
===
RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.bin/doscmd/cwd.c,v
retrieving revision 1.5
diff -u -r1.5 cwd.c
--- cwd.c   1999/10/12 22:20:18 1.5
+++ cwd.c   1999/11/07 18:59:06
@@ -198,7 +198,7 @@
 u_char *np;
 Path_t *d;
 u_char tmppath[1024];
-u_char snewpath = newpath;
+u_char *snewpath = newpath;
 
 if (where[0] != '\0'  where[1] == ':') {
drive = drlton(*where);
@@ -253,7 +253,7 @@
} else {
if (np[-1] != '\\')
*np++ = '\\';
-   while (*np = *dir++  np - snewpath  1023)
+   while ((*np = *dir++)  np - snewpath  1023)
++np;
}
 }
Index: doscmd.c
===
RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.bin/doscmd/doscmd.c,v
retrieving revision 1.11
diff -u -r1.11 doscmd.c
--- doscmd.c1999/10/13 23:48:35 1.11
+++ doscmd.c1999/11/07 12:50:06
@@ -258,6 +258,7 @@
 
 sigemptyset(uc.uc_sigmask);
 sigaltstack(NULL, uc.uc_stack);
+uc.uc_mcontext.mc_onstack = uc.uc_stack.ss_flags;
 
 if (tmode)
tracetrap(REGS);


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Re: show stopper for Gcc 2.95.2 conversion

1999-11-07 Thread Gary Jennejohn

"Daniel C. Sobral" writes:
Gary Jennejohn wrote:
 
 Any idea why GCC 2.95.2 produces so much more code ?

Mmmm... O'Brien, could you make sure the space-critical code in
sys/boot compiles ok?


I still have GCC 2.95.2 installed. This is what I get in /sys/boot:

=== i386/boot2
(cd /usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2; m4 -DFLAGS=0 boot1.m4 boot1.s) |  as  -o boot1.o
ld -nostdlib -static -N -e start -Ttext 0x7c00 -o boot1.out boot1.o
objcopy -S -O binary boot1.out boot1
dd if=/dev/zero of=boot2.ldr bs=512 count=1 2/dev/null
cc -elf -I/usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2/../btx/lib -I. -fno-builtin  -Os 
-malign-functions=0 -malign-jumps=0 -malign-loops=0 -mrtd  
-Wall -Waggregate-return -Wbad-function-cast -Wcast-align  -Wmissing-declarations 
-Wmissing-prototypes -Wnested-externs  
-Wpointer-arith -Wshadow -Wstrict-prototypes -Wwrite-strings   -c boot2.c
(cd /usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2; m4 -DSIOPRT=0x3f8  -DSIOFMT=0x3  -DSIOSPD=9600 
sio.s) |  as  -o sio.o
ld -nostdlib -static -N -Ttext 0x1000 -o boot2.out  
/usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2/../btx/lib/crt0.o boot2.o sio.o
objcopy -S -O binary boot2.out boot2.bin
btxld -v -E 0x1000 -f bin -b /usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2/../btx/btx/btx -l boot2.ldr  
-o boot2.ld -P 1 boot2.bin
kernel: ver=1.01 size=700 load=9000 entry=9010 map=16M pgctl=1:1
client: fmt=bin size=15c0 text=0 data=0 bss=0 entry=0
output: fmt=bin size=1ec0 text=200 data=1cc0 org=0 entry=0
-192 bytes available


---
Gary Jennejohn
Home - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Work - [EMAIL PROTECTED]




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new sigaction struct

1999-11-07 Thread Steve Price

Marcel,

Just curious as to what the motivation for re-ordering the
sa_flags and sa_mask members in sigaction were?  The manpage
still describes the old order BTW.

My Alpha box has been limping through a package build and I've
noticed a number of ports that seem to be falling over for
signal-related changes.  One in particular would be the rawio
port which expects sa_mask to be before sa_flags in struct
sigaction.

Thanks.

-steve



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Re: Serious locking problem in CURRENT

1999-11-07 Thread Vincent Poy

On Sun, 7 Nov 1999, David Malone wrote:

  The lock doesn't seem to be released until *explicitly* released, like
  the manual page says. I don't think closing the descriptor counts as
  an explicit unlock, though I am probably wrong. Run this program,
  you'll see the parent still has the lock. Change close(fd) to flock(fd,
  LOCK_UN) and you'll see it doesn't. It's possible I've misunderstood
  something though.
 
 On -current it seems to be unlocking regardless - which I think it the
 problem. If you have to explicitly unlock then that seems fine.

There is something broken in -CURRENT with file locking since I've
experienced this with sendmail 8.9.3.  I compared this to a 3.3-RELEASE
machine running sendmail 8.9.3 and it doesn't exhibit the same problem.

You can do a little test of the file locking, might be a bit tricky if
you have a busy system, but it would be interesting to see the result:

Run sendmail with -bd -q1m

Send a message to an "unused" IP address on your local network, e.g.

date | sendmail 'nobody@[123.123.123.123]'

(substitute an appropriate IP address of course). This should have the
(backgrounded) original sendmail process sitting waiting with the queue
file locked for just over one minute, so you need to hurry a bit with
the rest:

Run 'mailq' - does this message have a '*' in the first column (it
should)?

Take the queue ID for the message - shown in the first column of mailq
output (immediately following the '*', if any) - say XAA01234, and do a
verbose queue run for just that ID:

sendmail -v -qIXAA01234

(substituting the queue ID you got of course, i.e. -qIyourID) - this
should just print

Running XAA03875 (sequence 1 of 1)
XAA03875: locked

and then exit - does it?

From the above tests, the file locking does work in general.  However, it
could still be a race condition.  

Here's another test, which will be more of the sendmail situation:

Create a little shell script

#!/bin/sh
sleep 300
cat  /tmp/message.$$

and an alias pointing to it:

testalias: "|/path/to/script"

- then set the daemon to run with -q1m, and send a single mail to
"testalias". If the problem appears in this test, you should have (after
5 minutes) multiple /tmp/message.n (the n being process IDs)
files, each containing the message you sent.

If you check /tmp in 10 minutes, you will notice that some
messages will overlap in -CURRENT of having the same message regenerated
a few times while on 3.3-RELEASE, it will only show one
/tmp/message.n file.

And then just to repeat the test, do the following but this time
send the single message to testalias with the command:

sendmail -odq -oi testalias  messagefile

It might also be worth testing with

sendmail -odi -oi testalias  messagefile

The last form will seem to hang until the message is delivered.

If there is only one '/tmp/message.n' produced in each of these
tests, it will suggest that your system is losing its locks over the
fork made for delivery.  With '-odq', the message is placed in the
queue for later delivery attempts, and the queue run does not
normally fork for delivery.  With '-odi' it is delivered
interactively without a fork.

With neither of those operands, or with '-odb', there is a fork
before delivery.

On all of these tests, 3.3-RELEASE will generate only one
/tmp/message.n while -CURRENT will generate multiple
/tmp/message.n.  

My -CURRENT system is using sources as of 10/30/99 5:30AM PDT.

Cheers,
Vince - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - [EMAIL PROTECTED]      __  
Unix Networking Operations - FreeBSD-Real Unix for Free / / / / |  / |[__  ]
GaiaNet Corporation - M  C Estate / / / /  | /  | __] ]  
Beverly Hills, California USA 90210   / / / / / |/ / | __] ]
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rm error code on FAT

1999-11-07 Thread Maxim Sobolev

Does anybody can explain why two absolutely identical attempts to remove
unexistent files on UFS and FAT32 yields different error codes ("No such
file or directory" and "Invalid argument" respectively)? This breaks "rm
-f" behaviour, because instead of expected "0", "rm -f" on FAT returns
error code instead.

bash-2.03# mount
/dev/ad0s2a on / (ufs, local, noatime, soft-updates, writes: sync 231
async 5542)
procfs on /proc (procfs, local)
/dev/ad0s1 on /mnt (msdos, local)
bash-2.03# rm /tmp/*.no_such_files
rm: /tmp/*.no_such_files: No such file or directory
bash-2.03# rm /mnt/*.no_such_files
rm: /mnt/*.no_such_files: Invalid argument


-Maxim



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Re: help

1999-11-07 Thread David G Andersen

Please note that you've mailed this to a freebsd specific mailing list
which is designed for discussions of issues with freebsd-current.

This is is not subtitled, "A reference for script-kiddie wannabies."

Please insert 50c for your next attempt, and good day.

(Translation:  You've sent your question to an inappropriate mailing list,
and you're not likely to get a good answer here, so go search at rootshell
instead).

Lo and behold, jg once said:
 
 I want to know where I could find Nestea v3.
 Where I can find?
 And where I could find a program that has the same effect that the
 nestea or better.
 It helps me.
 
 THANK YOU!
 
 
 
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Re: rm error code on FAT

1999-11-07 Thread Bruce Evans

On Mon, 8 Nov 1999, Maxim Sobolev wrote:

 Does anybody can explain why two absolutely identical attempts to remove
 unexistent files on UFS and FAT32 yields different error codes ("No such
 file or directory" and "Invalid argument" respectively)? This breaks "rm
 -f" behaviour, because instead of expected "0", "rm -f" on FAT returns
 error code instead.

unlink("/mnt/*.no_such_files") on msdosfs returns EINVAL because the
pathname contains the invalid character '*'.  EINVAL used to be a
documented errno for pathnames containing characters with their high
bit set).  This documentation should have been made filesystem-
dependent instead of removing it.

Bruce



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sh bug

1999-11-07 Thread Jean-Marc Zucconi

Try this in -current

$ cat some_file | head

I have to use ^C to regain control.

Jean-Marc

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Re: sh bug

1999-11-07 Thread Jean-Marc Zucconi

 Jean-Marc Zucconi writes:

  Try this in -current
  $ cat some_file | head

  I have to use ^C to regain control.

... and reverting to rev. 1.22 of eval.c fixes the problem.

Jean-Marc

-- 
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Re: show stopper for Gcc 2.95.2 conversion

1999-11-07 Thread Daniel C. Sobral

Gary Jennejohn wrote:
 
 Mmmm... O'Brien, could you make sure the space-critical code in
 sys/boot compiles ok?
 
 I still have GCC 2.95.2 installed. This is what I get in /sys/boot:
 
 === i386/boot2
 (cd /usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2; m4 -DFLAGS=0 boot1.m4 boot1.s) |  as  -o boot1.o
 ld -nostdlib -static -N -e start -Ttext 0x7c00 -o boot1.out boot1.o
 objcopy -S -O binary boot1.out boot1
 dd if=/dev/zero of=boot2.ldr bs=512 count=1 2/dev/null
 cc -elf -I/usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2/../btx/lib -I. -fno-builtin  -Os 
-malign-functions=0 -malign-jumps=0 -malign-loops=0 -mrtd
 -Wall -Waggregate-return -Wbad-function-cast -Wcast-align  -Wmissing-declarations 
-Wmissing-prototypes -Wnested-externs
 -Wpointer-arith -Wshadow -Wstrict-prototypes -Wwrite-strings   -c boot2.c
 (cd /usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2; m4 -DSIOPRT=0x3f8  -DSIOFMT=0x3  -DSIOSPD=9600 
sio.s) |  as  -o sio.o
 ld -nostdlib -static -N -Ttext 0x1000 -o boot2.out  
/usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2/../btx/lib/crt0.o boot2.o sio.o
 objcopy -S -O binary boot2.out boot2.bin
 btxld -v -E 0x1000 -f bin -b /usr/src/sys/boot/i386/boot2/../btx/btx/btx -l 
boot2.ldr  -o boot2.ld -P 1 boot2.bin
 kernel: ver=1.01 size=700 load=9000 entry=9010 map=16M pgctl=1:1
 client: fmt=bin size=15c0 text=0 data=0 bss=0 entry=0
 output: fmt=bin size=1ec0 text=200 data=1cc0 org=0 entry=0
 -192 bytes available
 

Well, the flags seem correct (in particular -Os). It would be
interesting to see what's the difference in the assembler code
generated by both. Unfortunately, I cannot upgrade my system for the
time being.

--
Daniel C. Sobral(8-DCS)
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

What y'all wanna do?
Wanna be hackers? Code crackers? Slackers
Wastin' time with all the chatroom yakkers?



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