Re: SBLive... anyone, anywhere?

2000-02-17 Thread Egervary Gergely

 There was some mention in the SBLive earlier this year (January), whatever
 became of it?  I checked www.posi.net and I do not see the driver listed
 there at all.  Pointers/suggestions?

it's listed there.
the guy does not reply the mails, however

-- mauzi



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Re: Filesystem size limit?

2000-02-17 Thread Jamie Bowden

On Wed, 16 Feb 2000, Dan Nelson wrote:

:In the last episode (Feb 16), Greg Lehey said:
: On Tuesday, 15 February 2000 at  3:40:58 -0600, Joe Greco wrote:
: 
:  Dunno how many terabyte filesystem folks are out there.
: 
: None, by the looks of it.
:
:Possibly no FreeBSD folks, but on Solaris, VXFS scales very well to
:large volumes.  We've got 2TB worth of storage on a pair of Sparcs, and
:we probably could have created two 1TB filesystems.  We went with 200gb
:and 100gb volumes instead, for ease of backup.

We had a 2TB FS on an Origin2000 at NASA.

Jamie Bowden

-- 

"Of course, that's sort of like asking how other than Marketing, 
Microsoft is different from any other software company..."
Kenneth G. Cavness



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dc / de device probing

2000-02-17 Thread Wilko Bulte

Hi,

I recently got this DEC PC which has an 21142 ethernet chip onboard.

Using -current's dc driver I get:

Feb 17 19:37:39 p6 /kernel: Correcting Natoma config for non-SMP
Feb 17 19:37:39 p6 /kernel: dc0: Intel 21143 10/100BaseTX port
0xec00-0xec7f m
em 0xfdfffc00-0xfdfffc7f irq 11 at device 3.0 on pci0
Feb 17 19:37:39 p6 /kernel: dc0: Ethernet address: 00:00:f8:75:3c:6a
Feb 17 19:37:39 p6 /kernel: miibus0: MII bus on dc0
Feb 17 19:37:39 p6 /kernel: dcphy0: Intel 21143 NWAY media interface on
miibus
0
Feb 17 19:37:39 p6 /kernel: dcphy0:  10baseT, 10baseT-FDX, 100baseTX,
100baseTX-
FDX, auto

Using the de driver one gets:

Feb 17 19:54:17 p6 /kernel: Correcting Natoma config for non-SMP
Feb 17 19:54:17 p6 /kernel: de0: Digital 21142 Fast Ethernet port
0xec00-0xec7
f mem 0xfdfffc00-0xfdfffc7f irq 11 at device 3.0 on pci0
Feb 17 19:54:17 p6 /kernel: de0: DEC 21142 [10-100Mb/s] pass 1.1
Feb 17 19:54:17 p6 /kernel: de0: address 00:00:f8:75:3c:6a
Feb 17 19:54:17 p6 /kernel: de0: driver is using old-style compatability
shims

The interesting thing is that the de driver works, the dc does not: 

Feb 17 19:38:48 p6 login: ROOT LOGIN (root) ON ttyv0
Feb 17 19:39:40 p6 /kernel: dc0: watchdog timeout
Feb 17 19:40:02 p6 /kernel: dc0: watchdog timeout

The machine has it's 21142 connected to a bulkhead panel with a UTP/10base2
connector. It cannot (unless the panel is swapped for a 100mbit one) do
100mbit UTP.

What I wonder: why is the dc driver detecting a 21143 whereas the
de sees a 21142 (which is the correct one BTW)? Are the chips not well
enough distinguishable from the hardware perspective? 

Wilko

-- 
Wilko Bulte Arnhem, The Netherlands   
WWW : http://www.tcja.nlThe FreeBSD Project: http://www.freebsd.org


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64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Steve Ames


Just read this article:

http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2440002,00.html

Which leads to my potentially ignorant question: Where is FreeBSD
w/regards to running on the Itanium (or other 64bit chips)?

-Steve


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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Jordan K. Hubbard

 Which leads to my potentially ignorant question: Where is FreeBSD
 w/regards to running on the Itanium (or other 64bit chips)?

Waiting for somebody at Intel to give us either hardware or simulator
time.  Without either of those things, "working on" Itanium support
is a pretty pointless exercise.

- Jordan


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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Steve Ames

On Thu, Feb 17, 2000 at 02:26:16PM -0800, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote:
  Which leads to my potentially ignorant question: Where is FreeBSD
  w/regards to running on the Itanium (or other 64bit chips)?
 
 Waiting for somebody at Intel to give us either hardware or simulator
 time.  Without either of those things, "working on" Itanium support
 is a pretty pointless exercise.

A pretty tricky exercise also. Thanks for the quick response Jordan.

-steve


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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Patryk Zadarnowski

 
 Just read this article:
 
 http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2440002,00.html
 
 Which leads to my potentially ignorant question: Where is FreeBSD
 w/regards to running on the Itanium (or other 64bit chips)?

Considering the fact that Intel released the IA-64 OS info only on the 15th,
and, to my knowledge, haven't signed any NDA's with anyone from the FreeBSD
team, I'd assume that we're precisely nowhere. ;)

Having said that, I'll be getting Itanium hardware fairly soon after it's
avaliable outside of Intel, and would be ultra-happy to work on an IA-64
FreeBSD when that happens. In the meantime, the only alternative would be to
convince Intel to give someone their IA-64 SimOS, but there's an extermely
slim chance of that happening (from talking to someone on the IA-64 team.)

Pat.


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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Steve Kargl

Patryk Zadarnowski wrote:
 FreeBSD when that happens. In the meantime, the only alternative would be to
 convince Intel to give someone their IA-64 SimOS, but there's an extermely
 slim chance of that happening (from talking to someone on the IA-64 team.)
 

An alternative to IA-64 is the alpha processor.  Last time
I checked, FreeBSD ran just peachy on a 64-bit processor. ;-)
Check out Cmpaq's test drive program.


-- 
Steve


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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Patryk Zadarnowski


 Patryk Zadarnowski wrote:
  FreeBSD when that happens. In the meantime, the only alternative would be to
  convince Intel to give someone their IA-64 SimOS, but there's an extermely
  slim chance of that happening (from talking to someone on the IA-64 team.)
  
 
 An alternative to IA-64 is the alpha processor.  Last time
 I checked, FreeBSD ran just peachy on a 64-bit processor. ;-)
 Check out Cmpaq's test drive program.

I don't know... I'm still to get it to boot on mine (NetBSD runs fine, but for
some bizzare reason, FreeBSD insists on a serial console ;) Anyway, alphas are
boring compared to Itanium. What else can you say about a chip with 3MB of L3
cache on the die, a four clock cycle latency to carry the signal from one end
of the chip to the other, and the main design limitation being the US power
supplies? :) Not to mention the fact that Intel isn't even planning to release
any single-cpu system

Pat.


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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Mike Smith

  An alternative to IA-64 is the alpha processor.  Last time
  I checked, FreeBSD ran just peachy on a 64-bit processor. ;-)
  Check out Cmpaq's test drive program.
 
 I don't know... I'm still to get it to boot on mine (NetBSD runs fine, but for
 some bizzare reason, FreeBSD insists on a serial console ;) Anyway, alphas are
 boring compared to Itanium. What else can you say about a chip with 3MB of L3
 cache on the die, a four clock cycle latency to carry the signal from one end
 of the chip to the other, and the main design limitation being the US power
 supplies? :) Not to mention the fact that Intel isn't even planning to release
 any single-cpu system

What can one say to that, apart from "I have one right here and it works 
just fine" - not something you can say about the IA-64. 8)

-- 
\\ Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. \\  Mike Smith
\\ Tell him he should learn how to fish himself,  \\  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
\\ and he'll hate you for a lifetime. \\  [EMAIL PROTECTED]




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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Marco van de Voort

  Which leads to my potentially ignorant question: Where is FreeBSD
  w/regards to running on the Itanium (or other 64bit chips)?
 
 Waiting for somebody at Intel to give us either hardware or simulator
 time.  Without either of those things, "working on" Itanium support
 is a pretty pointless exercise.

Just a thought:

One could use the released 64-bit Itanium gcc, create a i386-itanium 
crosscompiler, and start preparing some stuff?
Marco van de Voort ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
http://www.stack.nl/~marcov/xtdlib.htm



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stuck NFS procs

2000-02-17 Thread David E. Cross

This is only the second time ever this has happened, but it is still an
interesting problem... I have a large number of "emacs" processes stuck in 
disk-wait.  Here is the ps axl  line for one such process:

33639 88194 1   0 -22  0  5856  340 vmpfw  D qi-   0:01.34 emacs proxy.

Any attempt to access emacs on the client system would result in a type of
hang for that process.  Here is a 'cat /usr/local/bin/emacs /dev/null':

2371 90317 1   3 -18  0   2688 pgtblk D p4-   0:00.02 cat /usr/loc

To "fix" this I went to the NFS server and 'cp emacs emacs.new;rm emacs;mv emacs.new 
emacs'.  In essence forcing a new FH.  The old procs still stick arround.

This leads me to believe the problem is entirely on the local system (ie,
the kernel isn't asking for pages from the NFS server for that FH)

Any ideas what could be corrupting the local cache (I am assuming that is the
problem) like this.  Nothing of note in the dmesg.

--
David Cross   | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Acting Lab Director   | NYSLP: FREEBSD
Systems Administrator/Research Programmer | Web: http://www.cs.rpi.edu/~crossd 
Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, | Ph: 518.276.2860
Department of Computer Science| Fax: 518.276.4033
I speak only for myself.  | WinNT:Linux::Linux:FreeBSD


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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Sam Leffler

- Original Message -
From: "Marco van de Voort" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2000 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: 64bit OS?


   Which leads to my potentially ignorant question: Where is FreeBSD
   w/regards to running on the Itanium (or other 64bit chips)?
 
  Waiting for somebody at Intel to give us either hardware or simulator
  time.  Without either of those things, "working on" Itanium support
  is a pretty pointless exercise.

 Just a thought:

 One could use the released 64-bit Itanium gcc, create a i386-itanium
 crosscompiler, and start preparing some stuff?
 Marco van de Voort ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
 http://www.stack.nl/~marcov/xtdlib.htm


The difficult bits rarely have anything to do with compilers and such
(especially given that most of the code has been through a 64-bit port to
the alpha).  The system-mode pieces of IA-64/Merced were not public until
recently; I noticed the full document set just became available on the intel
web site this week. There's also the Linux port that was posted to the web
in the past week or two; that should show what's needed for a FreeBSD port.

Of course, as was mentioned before, without hardware or a simulator it's
pretty pointless to put much effort into something like this.

Sam



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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread David Scheidt

On Fri, 18 Feb 2000, Patryk Zadarnowski wrote:

 
 I don't know... I'm still to get it to boot on mine (NetBSD runs fine, but for
 some bizzare reason, FreeBSD insists on a serial console ;) Anyway, alphas are
 boring compared to Itanium. What else can you say about a chip with 3MB of L3
 cache on the die, a four clock cycle latency to carry the signal from one end
 of the chip to the other, and the main design limitation being the US power
 supplies? :) Not to mention the fact that Intel isn't even planning to release
 any single-cpu system

"I could have had a PA-8600!"?  Today, and not at some vague point in the
future?


David



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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Patryk Zadarnowski


Which leads to my potentially ignorant question: Where is FreeBSD
w/regards to running on the Itanium (or other 64bit chips)?
  
   Waiting for somebody at Intel to give us either hardware or simulator
   time.  Without either of those things, "working on" Itanium support
   is a pretty pointless exercise.
 
  Just a thought:
 
  One could use the released 64-bit Itanium gcc, create a i386-itanium
  crosscompiler, and start preparing some stuff?
  Marco van de Voort ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
  http://www.stack.nl/~marcov/xtdlib.htm
 
 
 The difficult bits rarely have anything to do with compilers and such
 (especially given that most of the code has been through a 64-bit port to
 the alpha).  The system-mode pieces of IA-64/Merced were not public until
 recently; I noticed the full document set just became available on the intel
 web site this week. There's also the Linux port that was posted to the web
 in the past week or two; that should show what's needed for a FreeBSD port.

The Linux port is extremely minimalistic and uses the minimum amout of IA-64
features to get the OS to do anything useful.

 Of course, as was mentioned before, without hardware or a simulator it's
 pretty pointless to put much effort into something like this.

Also, you'll find that the actual silicon is somewhat different from the
documentation: whole chunks of the architecture are either unimplemented or
covered by errata, and not planned to be fixed in the public Itanium
silicon. The OS teams that signed NDAs with Intel (including the Linux team:
most of their code has been written by IA-64 teams at Intel and HP) have been
cooperating very closely with Intel and were given a lot of information that
(most of us) can only dream about. That is to say: even the simulator wouldn't
help much right now.

On the other hand, IA-64 is a very exotic architecture from the OS's point of
view, and anyone planning to port *BSD to it should probably start planning
ASAP.

Pat.


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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Patryk Zadarnowski


 "I could have had a PA-8600!"?  Today, and not at some vague point in the
 future?

That sort-of misses the point, as I'm taking a research OS perspective, where
IA-64 is trully unique in terms of versitality and a well thought-through
design (especially when it comes to SASOS support!) Besides, that point in the
future is not all that vague at all ;)

Pat.


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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Mike Nowlin


 What can one say to that, apart from "I have one right here and it works 
 just fine" - not something you can say about the IA-64. 8)

I'll just reach down and pat my trusty pair of manufactured-in-1993 Alpha
3000's on their heads...  :)

Oh, forgot...  It's not new until Intel does it...  sorry...

mike




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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Patryk Zadarnowski

 
  What can one say to that, apart from "I have one right here and it works 
  just fine" - not something you can say about the IA-64. 8)
 
 I'll just reach down and pat my trusty pair of manufactured-in-1993 Alpha
 3000's on their heads...  :)
 
 Oh, forgot...  It's not new until Intel does it...  sorry...
 
 mike

You're being just plain silly.  It takes about 5 minutes with the
manuals to realize just how little AXP and IA-64 have in common: one
is a classic superscalar out-of-order design, the other is just about
the opposite: a typical explicit-ILP architecture. What makes IA-64
great is the 8 years of statistical analysis of real-life software the
architecture design team spent fine-tuning the instruction set. What
makes AXP great is the clock rates Digital/Compaq manages to pump into
the beasts ;)

And no, there's nothing fundamentally new in IA-64 apart from the fact
that they're the last kids on the block with a 64 bit chip ;)

Pat.


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Re: stuck NFS procs

2000-02-17 Thread Matthew Dillon

I'd say this is more likely a VM bug rather then an NFS bug.  I don't
think anything is being corrupted, I think it may just be a deadlock.

For this sort of problem you should be able to gdb the kernel live on
the system (without core'ing it) and then look at the stack backtrace
for the processes in question.  You need a debug version of the kernel
binary that is running.

gdb -k kernel.debug /dev/mem
proc  88194
back
proc 90317
back

Also do your ps axl again and make sure there aren't any other processes
stuck in an odd state, looking at the code I don't see a possible deadlock
between those two blocking states.

-Matt
Matthew Dillon 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

:This is only the second time ever this has happened, but it is still an
:interesting problem... I have a large number of "emacs" processes stuck in 
:disk-wait.  Here is the ps axl  line for one such process:
:
:33639 88194 1   0 -22  0  5856  340 vmpfw  D qi-   0:01.34 emacs proxy.
:
:Any attempt to access emacs on the client system would result in a type of
:hang for that process.  Here is a 'cat /usr/local/bin/emacs /dev/null':
:
:2371 90317 1   3 -18  0   2688 pgtblk D p4-   0:00.02 cat /usr/loc
:
:To "fix" this I went to the NFS server and 'cp emacs emacs.new;rm emacs;mv emacs.new 
:emacs'.  In essence forcing a new FH.  The old procs still stick arround.
:
:This leads me to believe the problem is entirely on the local system (ie,
:the kernel isn't asking for pages from the NFS server for that FH)
:
:Any ideas what could be corrupting the local cache (I am assuming that is the
:problem) like this.  Nothing of note in the dmesg.
:
:--
:David Cross   | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 



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Re: 64bit OS?

2000-02-17 Thread Wilko Bulte

On Thu, Feb 17, 2000 at 05:19:21PM -0500, Steve Ames wrote:
 
 Just read this article:
 
 http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2440002,00.html
 
 Which leads to my potentially ignorant question: Where is FreeBSD
 w/regards to running on the Itanium (or other 64bit chips)?

FreeBSD runs very well on the Alpha, which is a 64 bit chip. There is
plenty of 'vapor silicon' (as opposed to vaporware) out there, but until
64 bit chips can be bought readily in the PC world the Alpha port is the 64
bit flagship.

-- 
Wilko Bulte Arnhem, The Netherlands   
http://www.tcja.nl  The FreeBSD Project: http://www.freebsd.org


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Re: stuck NFS procs (LONG)

2000-02-17 Thread David E. Cross

Ok... we'll start with the process table...

monica# ps axl | grep D
  UID   PID  PPID CPU PRI NI   VSZ  RSS WCHAN  STAT  TT   TIME COMMAND
0 0 0   0 -18  0 00 sched  DLs   ??0:00.81  (swapper)
0 2 0   0 -18  0 00 psleep DL??1:10.93  (pagedaemon
0 3 0  91  18  0 00 psleep DL??0:26.62  (vmdaemon)
0 4 0   0  18  0 00 syncer DL??1:51.82  (syncer)
17727 74079 1   0 -22  0  5952  340 vmpfw  D p4-   0:01.53 emacs websrv
17727 74586 1   0 -22  0  5952  340 vmpfw  D p4-   0:01.55 emacs websrv
33639 88342 1   0 -22  0  5856  340 vmpfw  D p4-   0:01.27 emacs proxy.
 2371 90317 1   3 -18  0   2688 pgtblk D p4-   0:00.02 cat /usr/loc
 2646 83637 1   0 -22  0  6256  528 vmpfw  D p9-   0:03.56 emacs
 2646 85055 1   0 -22  0  6344  528 vmpfw  D p9-   0:03.00 emacs
 2937 89546 1   0 -22  0  5576  340 vmpfw  D pa0:00.55 emacs /usr/t
 2575 75559 1   0 -22  0  5652  340 vmpfw  D pf-   0:00.99 emacs simple
 2575 78298 1   0 -22  0  5576  340 vmpfw  D pj-   0:00.97 emacs watchf
32837 85464 1   0 -22  0  6264  528 vmpfw  D pj-   0:02.81 emacs proj2.
32837 87204 1   0 -22  0  6264  528 vmpfw  D pj-   0:03.75 emacs proj2.
17727 90346 1   2 -22  0  5940  344 vmpfw  D pk-   0:01.23 emacs comm.c
 2575 76313 1   0 -22  0  5656  340 vmpfw  D pl-   0:01.54 emacs show_p
33355 84406 1   3 -22  0  7136  528 vmpfw  D pl-   0:04.54 emacs osshel
33355 85094 1   0 -22  0  7184  528 vmpfw  D pl-   0:04.52 emacs
17727 9 1   0 -22  0  5940  340 vmpfw  D pl-   0:01.17 emacs comm.c
0 64921 63848   0  10  0   476  292 ppwait D pt0:00.07 -su (csh)
 2551 75473 1   0 -22  0  7284  524 vmpfw  D q4-   0:05.27 emacs tftp_s
 2023 77402 1   0 -22  0  5672  340 vmpfw  D q8-   0:00.71 emacs index.
37080 7 1   0 -22  0  6208  524 vmpfw  D q8-   0:02.61 emacs bogosj
 2440 86790 1   0 -22  0  7176  524 vmpfw  D q9-   0:05.37 emacs bardet
 2440 88149 1   1 -22  0  7244  524 vmpfw  D q9-   0:04.91 emacs bardet
17727 89837 1   1 -22  0  5940  340 vmpfw  D qd-   0:01.13 emacs comm.c
33639 88194 1   0 -22  0  5856  340 vmpfw  D qi-   0:01.34 emacs proxy.


And we'll move on to some backtraces...

(kgdb) proc 74079
(kgdb) back
#0  mi_switch () at ../../kern/kern_synch.c:825
#1  0xc0131781 in tsleep (ident=0xc054b220, priority=0, 
wmesg=0xc0208bc2 "vmpfw", timo=0) at ../../kern/kern_synch.c:443
#2  0xc01cfa3f in vm_fault (map=0xca8028c0, vaddr=136036352, 
fault_type=3 '\003', fault_flags=8) at ../../vm/vm_fault.c:308
#3  0xc01ea17a in trap_pfault (frame=0xcac7ffbc, usermode=1, eva=136036368)
at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:816
#4  0xc01e9cca in trap (frame={tf_es = 136249383, tf_ds = -1078001625, 
  tf_edi = 400, tf_esi = 10, tf_ebp = -1078114780, tf_isp = -892862492, 
  tf_ebx = -1078110248, tf_edx = 136036332, tf_ecx = 137580544, 
  tf_eax = 1210023680, tf_trapno = 12, tf_err = 6, tf_eip = 134831395, 
  tf_cs = 31, tf_eflags = 66195, tf_esp = -1078114788, tf_ss = 39})
at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:358

(kgdb) proc 74586
(kgdb) back
#0  mi_switch () at ../../kern/kern_synch.c:825
#1  0xc0131781 in tsleep (ident=0xc054b220, priority=0, 
wmesg=0xc0208bc2 "vmpfw", timo=0) at ../../kern/kern_synch.c:443
#2  0xc01cfa3f in vm_fault (map=0xca6262c0, vaddr=136036352, 
fault_type=3 '\003', fault_flags=8) at ../../vm/vm_fault.c:308
#3  0xc01ea17a in trap_pfault (frame=0xcac58fbc, usermode=1, eva=136036368)
at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:816
#4  0xc01e9cca in trap (frame={tf_es = 39, tf_ds = 39, tf_edi = 2320, 
  tf_esi = 58, tf_ebp = -1078114780, tf_isp = -893022236, 
  tf_ebx = -1078108328, tf_edx = 136036332, tf_ecx = 137580544, 
  tf_eax = 1210023680, tf_trapno = 12, tf_err = 6, tf_eip = 134831395, 
  tf_cs = 31, tf_eflags = 66195, tf_esp = -1078114788, tf_ss = 39})
at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:358

(kgdb) proc 88342
(kgdb) back
#0  mi_switch () at ../../kern/kern_synch.c:825
#1  0xc0131781 in tsleep (ident=0xc054b220, priority=0, 
wmesg=0xc0208bc2 "vmpfw", timo=0) at ../../kern/kern_synch.c:443
#2  0xc01cfa3f in vm_fault (map=0xca801240, vaddr=136036352, 
fault_type=3 '\003', fault_flags=8) at ../../vm/vm_fault.c:308
#3  0xc01ea17a in trap_pfault (frame=0xca973fbc, usermode=1, eva=136036368)
at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:816
#4  0xc01e9cca in trap (frame={tf_es = 39, tf_ds = 39, tf_edi = 0, tf_esi = 0, 
  tf_ebp = -1078114664, tf_isp = -896057372, tf_ebx = -1078110532, 
  tf_edx = 136036332, tf_ecx = -1078110532, tf_eax = 1210023680, 
  tf_trapno = 12, tf_err = 6, tf_eip = 134831395, tf_cs = 31, 
  tf_eflags = 66195, tf_esp = -1078114672, tf_ss = 39})
at ../../i386/i386/trap.c:358

(this is the cat(1))
(kgdb) proc 90317
(kgdb) back
#0  mi_switch () at ../../kern/kern_synch.c:825