Re: Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
On Thursday 24 January 2008 06:02:25 am Gerard wrote: On Wed, 23 Jan 2008 20:19:29 +0100 Kris Kennaway [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gerard wrote: I have not been able to find any information in regards to the latest version of Perl, version 5.10.0, released in December. 1) When will this version be available in the ports system? After 7.0 is released. 2) Will FreeBSD-7.0 use this as the default Perl version? Not as it will be shipped, but users can upgrade to it later. I was going to say easily upgrade, but that might turn out to be a lie :) Historically, new versions of perl are a recipe for large amounts of pain because of all the old perl code that stops working. It would be completely irresponsible to attempt that update prior to the release (and moreover, the packages are already finalized for 7.0 anyway, modulo security updates). IMHO, updating to a new OS is like buying a new car. I certainly would not purchase a new vehicle if it contained an old motor. Yes, I could swap out the old motor for a new one once I purchase it; however, wouldn't it have been wiser for the dealer to have done so and spared me the problem. Perhaps this is not the ideal analogy; however, I think you get the idea. I just hope this decision does not cause the fiasco that the updating of Xorg caused and still, from reading the postings on this forum, still continue to cause for some users. Thanks for your response. But you're using BSD because of it's history of stability and habit of Just Working right? What a new version of perl has to fight is a history of years (can I say decades yet?) of perl upgrades that broke tons of stuff due to a lack of backwards compatibility. No one listens to the perl people when they say that new shiny version X isn't different in a way that will affect anything anymore becasuse they've been saying that for years and it's just not been true. Changing the default version of perl to 5.10.0 is going to break tons of ports, and everyone knows it. -- Thanks, Josh Paetzel PGP: 8A48 EF36 5E9F 4EDA 5A8C 11B4 26F9 01F1 27AF AECB signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
On Wednesday 23 January 2008 21:19, Kris Kennaway wrote: Historically, new versions of perl are a recipe for large amounts of pain because of all the old perl code that stops working. I haven't used perl 5.10 yet, but looking at the changes (available at http://search.cpan.org/~rgarcia/perl-5.10.0/pod/perl5100delta.pod), and in particular the section headed ``incompatible changes'', it looks like a small number of odd corners (for example, chdir FOO - unquoted argument now treated as filehandle not directory name) rather than a wholesale change like perl 5.8, which was binary-incompatible with earlier perls and therefore required any modules using the XS interface to C code to be recompiled. Perl 5.10 does introduce a couple of new operators (defined-or, spelt //, and smart-match, spelt ~~), and a number of enhancements which have to be switched on using the ``feature'' pragma - most of these changes have filtered back from the Perl 6 effort. Jonathan ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
Jonathan McKeown wrote: On Wednesday 23 January 2008 21:19, Kris Kennaway wrote: Historically, new versions of perl are a recipe for large amounts of pain because of all the old perl code that stops working. I haven't used perl 5.10 yet, but looking at the changes (available at http://search.cpan.org/~rgarcia/perl-5.10.0/pod/perl5100delta.pod), and in particular the section headed ``incompatible changes'', it looks like a small number of odd corners (for example, chdir FOO - unquoted argument now treated as filehandle not directory name) rather than a wholesale change like perl 5.8, which was binary-incompatible with earlier perls and therefore required any modules using the XS interface to C code to be recompiled. Perl 5.10 does introduce a couple of new operators (defined-or, spelt //, and smart-match, spelt ~~), and a number of enhancements which have to be switched on using the ``feature'' pragma - most of these changes have filtered back from the Perl 6 effort. Time will tell ;-) A single failure deep in the ports tree is enough to ruin the day of thousands of users. Kris ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
On Wed, 23 Jan 2008 20:19:29 +0100 Kris Kennaway [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gerard wrote: I have not been able to find any information in regards to the latest version of Perl, version 5.10.0, released in December. 1) When will this version be available in the ports system? After 7.0 is released. 2) Will FreeBSD-7.0 use this as the default Perl version? Not as it will be shipped, but users can upgrade to it later. I was going to say easily upgrade, but that might turn out to be a lie :) Historically, new versions of perl are a recipe for large amounts of pain because of all the old perl code that stops working. It would be completely irresponsible to attempt that update prior to the release (and moreover, the packages are already finalized for 7.0 anyway, modulo security updates). IMHO, updating to a new OS is like buying a new car. I certainly would not purchase a new vehicle if it contained an old motor. Yes, I could swap out the old motor for a new one once I purchase it; however, wouldn't it have been wiser for the dealer to have done so and spared me the problem. Perhaps this is not the ideal analogy; however, I think you get the idea. I just hope this decision does not cause the fiasco that the updating of Xorg caused and still, from reading the postings on this forum, still continue to cause for some users. Thanks for your response. -- Gerard [EMAIL PROTECTED] Q: What do you get when you stuff a flaming stick down a rabbit-hole? A: Hot cross bunnies! signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
Gerard wrote: On Wed, 23 Jan 2008 20:19:29 +0100 Kris Kennaway [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gerard wrote: I have not been able to find any information in regards to the latest version of Perl, version 5.10.0, released in December. 1) When will this version be available in the ports system? After 7.0 is released. 2) Will FreeBSD-7.0 use this as the default Perl version? Not as it will be shipped, but users can upgrade to it later. I was going to say easily upgrade, but that might turn out to be a lie :) Historically, new versions of perl are a recipe for large amounts of pain because of all the old perl code that stops working. It would be completely irresponsible to attempt that update prior to the release (and moreover, the packages are already finalized for 7.0 anyway, modulo security updates). IMHO, updating to a new OS is like buying a new car. I certainly would not purchase a new vehicle if it contained an old motor. Yes, I could swap out the old motor for a new one once I purchase it; however, wouldn't it have been wiser for the dealer to have done so and spared me the problem. Perhaps this is not the ideal analogy; however, I think you get the idea. I just hope this decision does not cause the fiasco that the updating of Xorg caused and still, from reading the postings on this forum, still continue to cause for some users. Thanks for your response. It's not going to happen. Kris ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
Kris Kennaway wrote: It's not going to happen. I completely agree -- but I'm talking about it being the default perl version. There shouldn't be much of anything stopping lang/perl5.10 from appearing. I'm not saying it needs to be shipped with 7.0-release. -- Philip M. Gollucci ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) o:703.549.2050x206 Senior System Admin - Riderway, Inc. http://riderway.com / http://ridecharge.com 1024D/EC88A0BF 0DE5 C55C 6BF3 B235 2DAB B89E 1324 9B4F EC88 A0BF Work like you don't need the money, love like you'll never get hurt, and dance like nobody's watching. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
Philip M. Gollucci wrote: Kris Kennaway wrote: It's not going to happen. I completely agree -- but I'm talking about it being the default perl version. There shouldn't be much of anything stopping lang/perl5.10 from appearing. I'm not saying it needs to be shipped with 7.0-release. As mentioned, that will happen once the port is ready. Kris ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
I have not been able to find any information in regards to the latest version of Perl, version 5.10.0, released in December. 1) When will this version be available in the ports system? 2) Will FreeBSD-7.0 use this as the default Perl version? It seems rather silly to use the older version as the default in FBSD-7.0 since a newer version is available. -- Gerard [EMAIL PROTECTED] Misfortunes arrive on wings and leave on foot. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
Gerard writes: 2) Will FreeBSD-7.0 use this as the default Perl version? It seems rather silly to use the older version as the default in FBSD-7.0 since a newer version is available. I don't speak for the Release Engineering team, but: almost certainly not. Perl is used by so many things that making the change before a .0 release is work for no necessary gain. It's practically a Kick Me! sign. Robert Huff ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Perl-5.10.0 in FBSD-7.0
Gerard wrote: I have not been able to find any information in regards to the latest version of Perl, version 5.10.0, released in December. 1) When will this version be available in the ports system? After 7.0 is released. 2) Will FreeBSD-7.0 use this as the default Perl version? Not as it will be shipped, but users can upgrade to it later. I was going to say easily upgrade, but that might turn out to be a lie :) Historically, new versions of perl are a recipe for large amounts of pain because of all the old perl code that stops working. It would be completely irresponsible to attempt that update prior to the release (and moreover, the packages are already finalized for 7.0 anyway, modulo security updates). Kris ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
