Re: installing big qmail server ... where to start?
I told the XRAID to slice the 2 x 2.2TB arrays into 4 x 1.1TB arrays. No problems after that. Ben. On 5/6/05, Matthias F. Brandstetter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > -- quoting Benson Wong -- > > There are a couple of issues you will run into here. > > > > 1. Mass storage. FreeBSD doesn't support file systems > 2TB, at least > > not that I found decent documentation and support for. > > How can you address data storage > 2TB then? > Or do I have to split my storage/partition on a RAID with more than 2TB? > > -- > It was the most I ever threw up, and it changed my life forever. > > -- Homer Simpson > Homer Goes To College > -- blog: http://www.mostlygeek.com ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: installing big qmail server ... where to start?
-- quoting Benson Wong -- > There are a couple of issues you will run into here. > > 1. Mass storage. FreeBSD doesn't support file systems > 2TB, at least > not that I found decent documentation and support for. How can you address data storage > 2TB then? Or do I have to split my storage/partition on a RAID with more than 2TB? -- It was the most I ever threw up, and it changed my life forever. -- Homer Simpson Homer Goes To College ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: installing big qmail server ... where to start?
thanks for all your info guys! -- quoting Matthias F. Brandstetter -- > Hi all, > > I have to plan and setup a mail solution for about 50.000 users, here > are some key features requested by our customer: > > - self coded webfrontend w/ webmail and administration (filter, alias > etc) - 100MB quota per user > - autoresponder > - about 50.000 user > - online backup of data > - some more featuers for web frontend > > Since I happily use qmail for some other (but smaller) installations, I > want to try it with qmail here for this project as well. My only problem > is, I have no clue where to start ... beginning from "should I use 2 > redundant and really strong or some more but cheaper servers?" to "which > qmail distributions and patches should I use (ldap, mysql, ...)?" and > "how to store data (mails) and do online backup w/o downtime?". > > I know you can't give me _the_ solution for this issue, but I am > thankful for any hints and internet links on this topic. > > I am sure you guys can help me :) > Greetings and TIA, Matthias -- Marge: Homer, you're his father. You've got to reason with him. Homer: Oh, that never works. He's a goner! Bart the Daredevil ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: installing big qmail server ... where to start?
I'm CC this answer back to FBSD-Questions. On 5/5/05, Odhiambo Washington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > * Benson Wong <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [20050505 02:56]: wrote: > > Hi Ben, > > > > I run a qmail-ldap installation for about 10,000 users. Each has 100MB > > of quota. I use 2 LDAP servers, 2 qmail servers and have all the > > Maildirs stored on a 5.6TB Xserve RAID. > > I would like to ask you if you run your servers on XServe or on FreeBSD. > I'm interested in knowing how you have setup your heterogeneous network > to link FreeBSD to the XServe RAID. On FreeBSD 5.4-STABLE. My FreeBSD (qmail) email servers use NFS. > > > > There are a couple of issues you will run into here. > > > > 1. Mass storage. FreeBSD doesn't support file systems > 2TB, at least > > not that I found decent documentation and support for. > > So how did you go around this limitation? I am buying two Xserves with > XServe RAID and I am positive your experience will help me alot. I've > a great belief that it will.. The 5.6TB XRAID has 2 separate RAID arrays. After RAID-5 overhead it becomes 2.2TB on each array. 2.2TB is 200GB over the max limit, so I had the XRAID slice each array into 2 logical arrays. This gave me 4 x 1.1TB arrays. Each one of those mounted easily in FreeBSD. You may be able use vinum to create them into one large array again, but i didn't bother > > > > 2. Backing up 50,000 Maildirs, where each email is a separate file > > requires something custom. I use Bacula, a network backup tool, and I > > instruct it to do a tar-gzip of each Maildir before backup. This adds > > a bit of overhead, and almost doubles space usage, but it sure beats > > backing up millions of little 4K - 80K files! > > You backup e-mails? That is new to me. How about if the files change as > you run the backup? Oh well. Maildirs don't require file locking. The Maildir may change state but all emails will still be there. Trade off between having OK backups and no backups. FreeBSD's snapshots for large TB volumes isn't stable yet (at least not that I've read) so I don't bother using those. > > > > 3. There is a MAJOR bug with maildirsize, the quota file. These quota > > files go out of sync a lot. From a year of statistics about 0.1% of > > users will likely have out of sync maildirsize files everyday. Who it > > happens to seems to be random. I wrote a custom script that runs every > > 15 minutes to clean up the out of sync maildirsize files. > > This one I am interested in. I experience this alot with Exim. Oh, I use > Exim and not Qmail, but the maildirsize code I believe is from the same > source, no? > I dunno if the code is the same. Good chance if you're seeing maildirsize that are going out of sync for no good reason. > > > Other than those issues my qmail-ldap installation runs super stable. > > On the two mail servers I have serving up IMAP and POP3, their load > > hovers around 0.1 to 0.3 barely anything at all. On my NFS server the > > load is about 0.3... it's barely working too. > > You have separated the servers for IMAP and POP3 or you are > load-balancing? I use DJBDNS and round-robin a domain name with all of my mail servers. It's is very simple to set up and works very well. Load is distributed very evenly. Each mail server provides POP3 and IMAP. Haven't found a need or reason to separate them. Ben. > -- blog: http://www.mostlygeek.com ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: installing big qmail server ... where to start?
Matthias F. Brandstetter wrote: > Hi all, > > I have to plan and setup a mail solution for about 50.000 users, here are > some key features requested by our customer: > > - self coded webfrontend w/ webmail and administration (filter, alias etc) > - 100MB quota per user > - autoresponder > - about 50.000 user > - online backup of data > - some more featuers for web frontend > > Since I happily use qmail for some other (but smaller) installations, I > want to try it with qmail here for this project as well. My only problem > is, I have no clue where to start ... beginning from "should I use 2 > redundant and really strong or some more but cheaper servers?" to "which > qmail distributions and patches should I use (ldap, mysql, ...)?" and "how > to store data (mails) and do online backup w/o downtime?". Some possible tutorials to help you on your way are: QMR (qmail rocks) FreeBSD http://freebsd.qmailrocks.org/ ( Has Mysql, vpopmail, clam-av, spamassin, ) Mail Toaster http://www.tnpi.biz/internet/mail/toaster/index.shtml (has mysql) An honest 50,000 users an mysql implementation might be a little more hardware intensive then an ldap in the long run so you might want to drop a mail to freebsd-isp mailing list and ask around there too for ldap stuff. Dont forget to if you plan on using maildir as a mail storage solution then remember that inodes become very important because you WILL run out of them. A solution can be found in the existing man pages, read "man tuning" before proceeding onto building your server. You might want to stay away from old school imap software like imap-uw because they lack the advanced features like quota support that you will need to enforce quotas for your users. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: installing big qmail server ... where to start?
See http://www.lifewithqmail.org/ldap/ Maybe you could ask on the qmail-ldap mailing list ;) =adriaan= ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: installing big qmail server ... where to start?
I run a qmail-ldap installation for about 10,000 users. Each has 100MB of quota. I use 2 LDAP servers, 2 qmail servers and have all the Maildirs stored on a 5.6TB Xserve RAID. There are a couple of issues you will run into here. 1. Mass storage. FreeBSD doesn't support file systems > 2TB, at least not that I found decent documentation and support for. 2. Backing up 50,000 Maildirs, where each email is a separate file requires something custom. I use Bacula, a network backup tool, and I instruct it to do a tar-gzip of each Maildir before backup. This adds a bit of overhead, and almost doubles space usage, but it sure beats backing up millions of little 4K - 80K files! 3. There is a MAJOR bug with maildirsize, the quota file. These quota files go out of sync a lot. From a year of statistics about 0.1% of users will likely have out of sync maildirsize files everyday. Who it happens to seems to be random. I wrote a custom script that runs every 15 minutes to clean up the out of sync maildirsize files. Other than those issues my qmail-ldap installation runs super stable. On the two mail servers I have serving up IMAP and POP3, their load hovers around 0.1 to 0.3 barely anything at all. On my NFS server the load is about 0.3... it's barely working too. Hope that was helpful. Ben. On 5/4/05, Matthias F. Brandstetter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi all, > > I have to plan and setup a mail solution for about 50.000 users, here are > some key features requested by our customer: > > - self coded webfrontend w/ webmail and administration (filter, alias etc) > - 100MB quota per user > - autoresponder > - about 50.000 user > - online backup of data > - some more featuers for web frontend > > Since I happily use qmail for some other (but smaller) installations, I > want to try it with qmail here for this project as well. My only problem > is, I have no clue where to start ... beginning from "should I use 2 > redundant and really strong or some more but cheaper servers?" to "which > qmail distributions and patches should I use (ldap, mysql, ...)?" and "how > to store data (mails) and do online backup w/o downtime?". > > I know you can't give me _the_ solution for this issue, but I am thankful > for any hints and internet links on this topic. > > I am sure you guys can help me :) > Greetings and TIA, Matthias > > -- > And thank you most of all for nuclear power, which is yet to cause a > single proven fatality, at least in this country. > > -- Homer Simpson > Oh Brother, Where Art Thou? > ___ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > -- blog: http://www.mostlygeek.com ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: installing big qmail server ... where to start?
--On Wednesday, May 04, 2005 12:58:39 PM +0200 "Matthias F. Brandstetter"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi all,
I have to plan and setup a mail solution for about 50.000 users, here are
some key features requested by our customer:
- self coded webfrontend w/ webmail and administration (filter, alias
etc)
I'm not sure what you mean by self coded. Squirrelmail is a webmail front
end that meets the requirements you've mentioned. There are others as well.
- 100MB quota per user
I would recommend that you put the mailboxes on a separate partition -
perhaps even put var on a separate drive - and you should probably use
RAID0 at least.
- autoresponder
- about 50.000 user
- online backup of data
Without knowing if you're local or remote, it's hard to say. I do backups
on a remote server using rsync to a local disk and rsync over ssh to a
remote disk. The local backups make it easy to restore something in a
pinch. The remote backups ensure that I don't lose data if the server
crashes and both disks are toast.
- some more featuers for web frontend
Like what?
Since I happily use qmail for some other (but smaller) installations, I
want to try it with qmail here for this project as well. My only problem
is, I have no clue where to start ... beginning from "should I use 2
redundant and really strong or some more but cheaper servers?" to "which
qmail distributions and patches should I use (ldap, mysql, ...)?" and
"how to store data (mails) and do online backup w/o downtime?".
Mail servers have a lot of I/O so you should use SCSI disks, if possible.
RAID mirroring at least.
I think LDAP would make user admin a lot easier. Mysql would probably help
as well, given the number of users.
I'm not sure I know what you mean by "store data (mails). If you're using
qmail, set up IMAP and the mails are stored in maildir (I think). You can
create a virtual user so you don't have to have /home/{uid} for all 50,000
users.
Surely there's a doc on the web that walks you through all of this? No
sense in reinventing the wheel.
Paul Schmehl ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Adjunct Information Security Officer
The University of Texas at Dallas
AVIEN Founding Member
http://www.utdallas.edu
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
installing big qmail server ... where to start?
Hi all, I have to plan and setup a mail solution for about 50.000 users, here are some key features requested by our customer: - self coded webfrontend w/ webmail and administration (filter, alias etc) - 100MB quota per user - autoresponder - about 50.000 user - online backup of data - some more featuers for web frontend Since I happily use qmail for some other (but smaller) installations, I want to try it with qmail here for this project as well. My only problem is, I have no clue where to start ... beginning from "should I use 2 redundant and really strong or some more but cheaper servers?" to "which qmail distributions and patches should I use (ldap, mysql, ...)?" and "how to store data (mails) and do online backup w/o downtime?". I know you can't give me _the_ solution for this issue, but I am thankful for any hints and internet links on this topic. I am sure you guys can help me :) Greetings and TIA, Matthias -- And thank you most of all for nuclear power, which is yet to cause a single proven fatality, at least in this country. -- Homer Simpson Oh Brother, Where Art Thou? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
