Re: Comment for Apache.org
On 10 Dec 2001, Kevin A. Burton - burtonator wrote: | Give jon a break. With all the hard work he has done he at least deserves the | benefit of the doubt on all these e-mails. What about the times when there is no doubt? When he just behaves totally assholeish? | | When you come close to 1/5th the amount of work he has done for Apache then you | can judge. This is the stuff I just cannot understand. Being a good coder and good committer actually gives you the _right_ to be an a .. not nice to other people on the Jakarta email lists? People that come here for the first time, doing the wrong thing, posting to the wrong list or something, they should only expect to be flogged hard by Jon, right? Because he has earned the right to be rude? I don't get that. You jakarta folks should post this on your website, something like: After serving the Apache and Jakarta community for about 5 years, you earn the right to be an asshole. This not only gives you unlimited possibilities to hurl shit into all Jakarta email lists, but your fellow Jakarta members will even defend your opinions and your new-earned rights to the bitter end. But this time I don't think Jon was that bad, though.. Just a bit rude. Not a complete asshole, as many other times.. -- Mvh, Endre -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Comment for Apache.org
In my opinion, if you haven't contributed anything, then you are just leeching off the hard work of the many individuals behind the Jakarta project What does one's relative standing in the Jakarta project have to do with how you conduct yourself with other project members - or even leeches, for that matter? It's not like anyone here stepped out of the womb with code to contribute. Presumably they were users first, and then became contributors. I have no idea what your past contributions have been, and it isn't relevant. The question is: how much talent have you driven away with your insults? I don't expect anything to change, of course, so I guess the best recourse is to offer a suggestion to your defenders: please, when this happens in the future, contact the original poster immediately and explain things. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Comment for Apache.org
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, December 10, 2001 4:45 PM When you come close to 1/5th the amount of work he has done for Apache then you can judge. So, if I understand Apache's so-called meritocracy system, the more you do for a project, the more unprofessional and ego-driven behavior you are allowed? So, If Jon doubles his workload, will he then be allowed to murder dissenting listmemebers instead of simply insulting them? :) Paul Tiseo, Intermediate Systems Programmer Birdsall 122, Mayo Clinic Jacksonville 4500 San Pablo Rd, FL, 32224 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- (904) 953-8254 / 953-7134 (fax) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Comment for Apache.org
At 10:32 AM -0500 12/11/01, Tiseo, Paul wrote: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, December 10, 2001 4:45 PM When you come close to 1/5th the amount of work he has done for Apache then you can judge. So, if I understand Apache's so-called meritocracy system, the more you do for a project, the more unprofessional and ego-driven behavior you are allowed? So, If Jon doubles his workload, will he then be allowed to murder dissenting listmemebers instead of simply insulting them? :) I think at the double workload level, Jon would only be able to club baby seals. Murder is a bit higher up... I've got those charts around here *somewhere*... -- === Jim Jagielski [|] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [|] http://www.jaguNET.com/ A society that will trade a little liberty for a little order will lose both and deserve neither -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Comment for Apache.org
On Tuesday, December 11, 2001, at 03:19 PM, lloyd wrote: In my opinion, if you haven't contributed anything, then you are just leeching off the hard work of the many individuals behind the Jakarta project What does one's relative standing in the Jakarta project have to do with how you conduct yourself with other project members - or even leeches, for that matter? It's not like anyone here stepped out of the womb with code to contribute. Presumably they were users first, and then became contributors. jon provides training (in his version) of the way. jon's training methods might be considered harsh by many but they are educational. people contribute in many ways, not just by coding. for example, if you'd answered the original question (before jon had to) then this war would never have started and the original poster would have gone away a little bit happier. instead, you decided to post a personal attack on jon. personal attacks are easy. writing good answers is hard and takes time. I have no idea what your past contributions have been, and it isn't relevant. The question is: how much talent have you driven away with your insults? development at apache is very much in the open. having to take responsibility for your contribution - whether it's code or mail posted to the mailing lists - is very much part of the deal. if you can't take the heat, then get out of the kitchen. I don't expect anything to change, of course, so I guess the best recourse is to offer a suggestion to your defenders: please, when this happens in the future, contact the original poster immediately and explain things. if you want things to change, then you need to do something about it (am i sounding like jon? ;) if you were to answer newbie questions - to the best of your ability - then jon wouldn't have to make time to answer them. there's something in it for you too, since you'll learn far more by answering questions than you will by lurking. everybody would be a little happier. - robert -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Comment for Apache.org
On 12/11/01 10:32 AM, Tiseo, Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, December 10, 2001 4:45 PM When you come close to 1/5th the amount of work he has done for Apache then you can judge. So, if I understand Apache's so-called meritocracy system, the more you do for a project, the more unprofessional and ego-driven behavior you are allowed? So, If Jon doubles his workload, will he then be allowed to murder dissenting listmemebers instead of simply insulting them? :) That sort of thing would come in handy from time to time... Hmm -- Geir Magnusson Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] System and Software Consulting Whoever would overthrow the liberty of a nation must begin by subduing the freeness of speech. - Benjamin Franklin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Comment for Apache.org
On Tue, 11 Dec 2001, robert burrell donkin wrote: if you want things to change, then you need to do something about it (am i sounding like jon? ;) if you were to answer newbie questions - to the best of your ability - then jon wouldn't have to make time to answer them. there's something in it for you too, since you'll learn far more by answering questions than you will by lurking. everybody would be a little happier. This version of this same old thread isn't going to accomplish anything. However, as a person who has been around Apache for a long time (including working with Jon directly on Apache JServ), as a person who contributes a lot of code also, and as a person who *does* take the time to do what Robert suggests and answers user questions (striving to do so in a manner that is polite and respectful, and *usually* succeeding at that), I'm going to add one and only one comment. I vastly respect Jon's contributions to Apache -- but I'm disappointed that he doesn't seem to care that his approach to email makes the overall community smaller than it otherwise would be (due to people not being willing to deal with his style). Now, I'm going to go back and start writing some more code (and answering some more user questions). I suggest we all do the same. - robert Craig McClanahan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Comment for Apache.org
I vastly respect Jon's contributions to Apache -- but I'm disappointed that he doesn't seem to care that his approach to email makes the overall community smaller than it otherwise would be (due to people not being willing to deal with his style). Thanks Craig, Sorry Jon, I Agree.. Saludos , Ignacio J. Ortega -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Comment for Apache.org
In my opinion, if you haven't contributed anything, then you are just leeching off the hard work of the many individuals behind the Jakarta project Everybody could disagree with someone but the generally accepted rule is to stay correct with the person. There is many forums on the web to do run such dialogs. Better, I suggest people who want to flam Jon, to do it directly and leave this list a bit more quiet. The list is named [EMAIL PROTECTED] and not [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Comment for Apache.org
On 12/11/01 5:12 PM, GOMEZ Henri [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In my opinion, if you haven't contributed anything, then you are just leeching off the hard work of the many individuals behind the Jakarta project Everybody could disagree with someone but the generally accepted rule is to stay correct with the person. There is many forums on the web to do run such dialogs. Better, I suggest people who want to flam Jon, to do it directly and leave this list a bit more quiet. The list is named [EMAIL PROTECTED] and not [EMAIL PROTECTED] How about we set up that list, and use PayPal to collect donations for some worthy cause (chosen by jon, of course) for people that want to publicly flame jon... He's busy these days, so we can all take turns proxying for him, with the caveat that you have to work hard on Jakarta stuff like he does to be a proxy. Anyone with $$ can flame, of course. geir -- Geir Magnusson Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] System and Software Consulting Whoever would overthrow the liberty of a nation must begin by subduing the freeness of speech. - Benjamin Franklin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Comment for Apache.org
He's busy these days, so we can all take turns proxying for him, with the caveat that you have to work hard on Jakarta stuff like he does to be a proxy. Who are you trying to fool? You would be never able to impersonate him!!! =;o) Paulo P.S.: And I am not talking about working hard. -Original Message- From: Geir Magnusson Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2001 11:27 PM To: Jakarta General List Subject: Re: Comment for Apache.org On 12/11/01 5:12 PM, GOMEZ Henri [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In my opinion, if you haven't contributed anything, then you are just leeching off the hard work of the many individuals behind the Jakarta project Everybody could disagree with someone but the generally accepted rule is to stay correct with the person. There is many forums on the web to do run such dialogs. Better, I suggest people who want to flam Jon, to do it directly and leave this list a bit more quiet. The list is named [EMAIL PROTECTED] and not [EMAIL PROTECTED] How about we set up that list, and use PayPal to collect donations for some worthy cause (chosen by jon, of course) for people that want to publicly flame jon... He's busy these days, so we can all take turns proxying for him, with the caveat that you have to work hard on Jakarta stuff like he does to be a proxy. Anyone with $$ can flame, of course. geir -- Geir Magnusson Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] System and Software Consulting Whoever would overthrow the liberty of a nation must begin by subduing the freeness of speech. - Benjamin Franklin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Comment for Apache.org
- Original Message - From: robert burrell donkin [EMAIL PROTECTED] snip if you want things to change, then you need to do something about it (am i sounding like jon? ;) if you were to answer newbie questions - to the best of your ability - then jon wouldn't have to make time to answer them. snip Who ever said jon HAD to answer anyone? If he can't answer with some resemblance of a mature adult instead of like a snotty nosed 12yo brat he should just shut the hell up and say nothing. But just like a snotty nosed 12yo brat it seems he doesn't have the mental capacity to help himself and therefore needs to be treated like one. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
The Avalon Team is proud to announce Avalon Framework 4.1
Avalon Framework 4.1 Released - The Avalon team is proud to announce the 4.1 final release of the Avalon Framework. About Avalon The Avalon project is Apache's Java Server Framework. It is separated into five sub projects: Framework, Excalibur, LogKit, Cornerstone, and Phoenix. Its purpose is to simplify server side programming for Java based projects. It formalizes serveral best of breed practices and patterns for server side programming. For more information about Avalon, please go to http://jakarta.apache.org/avalon About Avalon Framework 4.1 -- The Avalon Framework formalizes the contracts and patterns used in the other Avalon projects. It is derived from modern software engineering techniques and aims to provide a solid basis on which to build server products. What that means is that we define the central interface Component. We also define the relationship (contract) a component has with peers, ancestors and children. This documentation introduces you to those patterns, interfaces, and relationships. The Avalon Framework raises the abstraction level from Object-Oriented Programming concept one notch to the Component-Oriented Programming model. This enables programmers to concern themselves with assemblies of classes, rather than the classes themselves--thus reducing the number of things the programmer must keep in mind, and speeding up application development. The Avalon Framework is already used in Cocoon2 (http://xml.apache.org/cocoon2), an XML publishing framework. The Avalon Framework is also used in Apache JAMES (http://jakarta.apache.org/james), a Java(tm) Mail Server. Another project that is built on Avalon Framework is Jestkop (http://www.jesktop.org), a cross-platform replacement for your ordinary desktop. If you are evaluating Avalon and want the proof that it's claims are valid check them out. For more information about Avalon Framework 4.1, please go to http://jakarta.apache.org/avalon/framework ChangeLog for Avalon Framework 4.1 *) Improve and update the configuration javadocs to reflect the new namespace support. [JT] *) Deprecate the Loggable and AbstractLoggable classes, and replace them with LogEnabled and AbstractLogEnabled. [BL] *) Add an abstraction layer to the Logging implementation. Thanks to Peter Donald for supplying the interface. [BL] *) Add Namespace support to Configuration files. [BL] *) Add AvalonFormatter that was in LogKit's heirarchy. This way, we avoid circular dependancies. [BL] *) Previously resolve did not throw a ContextException. This made it difficult to indicate errors resolving objects. It now throws an exception thus allowing errors to be propogated and recorded. [PD] *) New ConfigurationSerializer to have your configuration objects persist. [BL] *) Upgrade DefaultConfigurationBuilder to be JAXP compliant, with the option to pass in your own XMLReader. [BL] *) Configuration objects are now Serializable. [PD] *) Add new support to ask a component manager if it has a component. [BL] *) Bug fixes for documentation [PD] *) Update developers docs to support new configuration methods. [BL] *) Improved Hello World documentation. [PH] *) Add UML diagrams supplied by Dieter Wimberger [PD] *) Add new author bios. [BL] *) Update build process to proposed standard. [BL] *) Added a method to Version to parse a Version from a string. Added accessor methods to Version to allow access to major/minor/micro components of version. [PD] *) Updated Version class to refer to micro version rather than revision. This is to match the terminology for JDK versioning. This is just documentation changes. [PD] *) Changed access of Enum and ValuedEnum constructors from public to protected, to prevent Enum users from breaking type-safety by adding new Enum items. This breaks backwards-compatibility in cases where Enum and ValuedEnum were being incorrectly used. [JT] Downloads for Avalon Framework 4.1 available at http://jakarta.apache.org/builds/jakarta-avalon/release/framework/latest -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
