Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-14 Thread Walter Dnes
On Thu, May 11, 2006 at 02:20:56PM +0200, Matthias Bethke wrote
 Hi Walter,
 on Tuesday, 2006-05-09 at 20:34:29, you wrote:
My idea of the right application doesn't install 75% of KDE or GNOME...
 
 Good point! :) What about media-sound/cdplay? Doesn't seem to have any
 dependencies at all.

  I tried that too.  It appears to play the CD, but no sound.  It does
output through the CDROM's headphone jack on my old Dell.  I don't
really want to, but I may have to open up the PC and muck around with
the connection.

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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-14 Thread stupendoussteve


On Sun, 14 May 2006, Walter Dnes wrote:

 On Thu, May 11, 2006 at 02:20:56PM +0200, Matthias Bethke wrote
  Hi Walter,
  on Tuesday, 2006-05-09 at 20:34:29, you wrote:
 My idea of the right application doesn't install 75% of KDE or 
   GNOME...
 
  Good point! :) What about media-sound/cdplay? Doesn't seem to have any
  dependencies at all.

   I tried that too.  It appears to play the CD, but no sound.  It does
 output through the CDROM's headphone jack on my old Dell.  I don't
 really want to, but I may have to open up the PC and muck around with
 the connection.



cdplay is sending output through the analog or digital line on the cdrom
drive, to the soundcard. If there is not a line plugged into the sound
card, then you will not hear sound. Many cd playing applications now will
read the cd itself rather than just sending the play command to the drive.
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-11 Thread Matthias Bethke
Hi Jeremy,
on Monday, 2006-05-08 at 09:38:34, you wrote:
 I don't think you need that silly cable. My understanding was that the
 audio cable connected to you sound card was for when you wanted to
 listen to the cd and your computer was in low-power mode Either way, I
 have stopped installing that cable on new computers that I build and it
 has always worked fine for me.

Strictly speaking you don't need it, it will work just as well via
ATAPI/SCSI. It's just so convenient that a) you have a separate volume
control for the CD input on soundcards and b) playing a CD takes nothing
more than a handful of commands (and probably one a second or so to
update the play timer), the CD-ROM does everything else on its own.

cheers!
Matthias
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-11 Thread Matthias Bethke
Hi Walter,
on Tuesday, 2006-05-09 at 20:34:29, you wrote:
   My idea of the right application doesn't install 75% of KDE or GNOME...

Good point! :) What about media-sound/cdplay? Doesn't seem to have any
dependencies at all.

cheers!
Matthias

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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-09 Thread Harald Arnesen
Daniel da Veiga [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 You don't need the audio-cable to hear music from a cd - just the right
 application ;)

 Oh yeah, you really don`t need the cable, it just makes things easier,
 because it will work with all applications, won`t send data using the
 system bus neither process it using the CPU, the CD drive will do all
 the work and send output directly to the soundcard, the volume manager
 of the soundcard with the CD audio label will work and some other
 benefits.

 But that`s just me. I want my hardware to do the stuff it should.

With a cable, you will (at least with some/most sound cards) have a
digital-analog conversion in the drive, an analog-digital conversion in
the sound card, and another digital-analog conversion on output from the
sound card.

With digital extraction you will just have the last digital-analog
conversion. Guess what sounds best.

A third option: most drives have a digital output connector, and most
sound cards have a digital input connector.
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-09 Thread Daniel da Veiga

On 5/9/06, Harald Arnesen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Daniel da Veiga [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 You don't need the audio-cable to hear music from a cd - just the right
 application ;)

 Oh yeah, you really don`t need the cable, it just makes things easier,
 because it will work with all applications, won`t send data using the
 system bus neither process it using the CPU, the CD drive will do all
 the work and send output directly to the soundcard, the volume manager
 of the soundcard with the CD audio label will work and some other
 benefits.

 But that`s just me. I want my hardware to do the stuff it should.

With a cable, you will (at least with some/most sound cards) have a
digital-analog conversion in the drive, an analog-digital conversion in
the sound card, and another digital-analog conversion on output from the
sound card.

With digital extraction you will just have the last digital-analog
conversion. Guess what sounds best.

A third option: most drives have a digital output connector, and most
sound cards have a digital input connector.
--


Wrong. Sound is by nature analog. The soundcard does nothing, as the
CD drive reads the digital audio and the DAC of the CD drive itself
converts it to analog, passing it directly to the soundcard, that send
it right to the speakers with a little amp or not. As the DAC of the
CD drive has nothing to do anyway, that is hardware doying what it
should.

Check it:
http://img.tfd.com/cde/DIGAUDEX.GIF

If you get the data digitally, you CD drive sends it directly, over
the system bus/digital cable, and your CPU/Soundcard PU must convert
it to analog audio (because your speakers still can't do it (at least
mine), with most modern boards and on-board audio cards, the soundcard
uses the CPU, so, yes, it uses a few cycles. I really don't care how
much, all I can say is that there's one more Interruption Request, and
I like my FPS at top.

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Computer Operator - RS - Brazil
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-09 Thread Walter Dnes
On Mon, May 08, 2006 at 11:24:22PM +0100, Ognjen Bezanov wrote

 Note that in both drivers, you need to state you want to use  DAE
 rather then the old analog method (this is due to the fact that not
 all CD-ROM's have good DAE capabilities). Under CD Audio Player,
 you need to set Play mode to Digital audio extraction, along
 with configuring/checking your drive.
 
 In portage they are called:
 
 media-plugins/xmms-cdaudio  = CD Audio Player
 and
 media-plugins/xmms-cdread = AudioCD Reader
 
 emerge one of them, restart xmms, and you're set ;)

  Neither of them will spin up the CD when I tell xmms to play the
AudioCD.  cdaudio does spin the CD and properly list the tracks and
their lengths when I select Check drive.  Any ideas?

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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-09 Thread Walter Dnes
On Mon, May 08, 2006 at 05:34:57PM +0200, Hemmann, Volker Armin wrote

 You don't need the audio-cable to hear music from a cd - just the right 
 application ;)
 
 like:
 kscd
 amarok

  My idea of the right application doesn't install 75% of KDE or GNOME...



[m3000][root][~] emerge -pv kscd

These are the packages that I would merge, in order:

Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild  N] kde-base/kde-env-3-r4  0 kB
[ebuild  N] dev-libs/libpcre-6.3  -doc 552 kB
[ebuild  N] x11-libs/qt-3.3.4-r8  -cups -debug -doc -examples -firebird 
+gif -immqt -immqt-bc -ipv6 -mysql -nas -odbc +opengl -postgres -sqlite 
-xinerama 14,101 kB
[ebuild  N] app-admin/gamin-0.1.7  -debug -doc 529 kB
[ebuild  N] kde-base/kdelibs-3.4.3-r1  +alsa -arts -cups -debug -doc 
-jpeg2k -kdeenablefinal -kerberos -openexr -spell -ssl +tiff -xinerama 
-zeroconf 16,482 kB
[ebuild  N] kde-base/libkcddb-3.4.3  -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal -xinerama
5,366 kB
[ebuild  N] kde-base/kscd-3.4.3  -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal -xinerama 0 kB

Total size of downloads: 37,032 kB




[m3000][root][~] emerge -pv amarok

These are the packages that I would merge, in order:

Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild  N] dev-libs/libpcre-6.3  -doc 552 kB
[ebuild  N] x11-libs/qt-3.3.4-r8  -cups -debug -doc -examples -firebird 
+gif -immqt -immqt-bc -ipv6 -mysql -nas -odbc +opengl -postgres -sqlite 
-xinerama 14,101 kB
[ebuild  N] kde-base/kde-env-3-r4  0 kB
[ebuild  N] app-admin/gamin-0.1.7  -debug -doc 529 kB
[ebuild  N] kde-base/kdelibs-3.4.3-r1  +alsa -arts -cups -debug -doc 
-jpeg2k -kdeenablefinal -kerberos -openexr -spell -ssl +tiff -xinerama 
-zeroconf 16,482 kB
[ebuild  N] media-libs/taglib-1.4  -debug 715 kB
[ebuild  N] media-sound/amarok-1.3.8  -arts -debug +flac -gstreamer -kde 
+mp3 -musicbrainz -mysql -noamazon +opengl -postgres -visualization +vorbis 
-xine -xinerama -xmms 8,523 kB

Total size of downloads: 40,905 kB


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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-09 Thread Walter Dnes
On Mon, May 08, 2006 at 05:52:07PM +0200, Harald Arnesen wrote
 Stef?n Istv?n [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
  h?tf? 08 m?jus 2006 11.32 d?tummal Walter Dnes ezt ?rta:
I've been so used to playing mp3 files that I'm lost with real live
  audio CDs (not a data CD with mp3 files).  The XMMS docs aren't really
  helpful.  Do I need an additional plug-in?  mplayer is worse.
  mplayer /dev/cdrom tries to play a file by that name.  I emerged
  cdplay and cdplay -c -v gets the CD spinning and the output indicates
  that it is playing, but I get no sound.  I have unmuted the CD player
  and set its volume via alsactl.  One additional complication is that
  there is no headphone jack near the CD tray, so I assume I have to go
  via the soundcard.
 
  Has your CD player been connected with your sound card? If not, I think you 
  won't hear any sound.
 
 You don't need a cable from the CD player to the sound card with xmms:
 
 Options - Preferences - Audio I/O Plugins - Audio CD Reader -
 Configure - Output - Read Digital CD Audio

  My main problem seems to be that (with one exception) xmms doesn't
even get the CD spinning.  Here's what I've checked so far...

  - alsamixer CD unmuted and volume set to 77
  - I am a member of audio and cdrom groups
  - the cdplay program sees the number of tracks and and their
lengths on the cdrom.  cdplay -c -v goes through the motions of
playing the cdrom.  The cdrom spins, and cdplay lists each track as
it's played... but there is no sound.
  - /dev/cdrom is correctly symlinked to /dev/hda
  - I've tried both the xmms-cdaudio and xmms-cdread plugins.
xmms-cdaudio has a Check CD drive option.  When I click it, the
cdrom spins, and I get a list of tracks which matches the output I
get from cdplay --listtracks.

  But when I tell xmms to play AudioCD, it just sists there.  The CD
does not spin at all.

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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-09 Thread Willie Wong
On Tue, May 09, 2006 at 08:35:04PM -0400, Penguin Lover Walter Dnes squawked:
   - alsamixer CD unmuted and volume set to 77
   - I am a member of audio and cdrom groups
   - the cdplay program sees the number of tracks and and their
 lengths on the cdrom.  cdplay -c -v goes through the motions of
 playing the cdrom.  The cdrom spins, and cdplay lists each track as
 it's played... but there is no sound.
   - /dev/cdrom is correctly symlinked to /dev/hda
   - I've tried both the xmms-cdaudio and xmms-cdread plugins.
 xmms-cdaudio has a Check CD drive option.  When I click it, the
 cdrom spins, and I get a list of tracks which matches the output I
 get from cdplay --listtracks.
 

This might be an overkill, but have you tried mplayer? If you already
have it installed, I think mplayer cdda://{tracknumber} would work,
and if I remember correctly, mplayer would read the digital audio,
rather than use the DAC in the CDROM. 

W
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-09 Thread John Jolet


On May 9, 2006, at 8:34 PM, Willie Wong wrote:

On Tue, May 09, 2006 at 08:35:04PM -0400, Penguin Lover Walter Dnes  
squawked:

  - alsamixer CD unmuted and volume set to 77
  - I am a member of audio and cdrom groups
  - the cdplay program sees the number of tracks and and their
lengths on the cdrom.  cdplay -c -v goes through the motions of
playing the cdrom.  The cdrom spins, and cdplay lists each  
track as

it's played... but there is no sound.
  - /dev/cdrom is correctly symlinked to /dev/hda
  - I've tried both the xmms-cdaudio and xmms-cdread plugins.
xmms-cdaudio has a Check CD drive option.  When I click it, the
cdrom spins, and I get a list of tracks which matches the  
output I

get from cdplay --listtracks.



This might be an overkill, but have you tried mplayer? If you already
have it installed, I think mplayer cdda://{tracknumber} would work,
and if I remember correctly, mplayer would read the digital audio,
rather than use the DAC in the CDROM.
maybe i missed part of the thread, but does it have to be graphical?   
There are quite a few curses or command-line cd/mp3 players...


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[gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Walter Dnes
  I've been so used to playing mp3 files that I'm lost with real live
audio CDs (not a data CD with mp3 files).  The XMMS docs aren't really
helpful.  Do I need an additional plug-in?  mplayer is worse.
mplayer /dev/cdrom tries to play a file by that name.  I emerged
cdplay and cdplay -c -v gets the CD spinning and the output indicates
that it is playing, but I get no sound.  I have unmuted the CD player
and set its volume via alsactl.  One additional complication is that
there is no headphone jack near the CD tray, so I assume I have to go
via the soundcard.

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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Stefán István
hétfő 08 május 2006 11.32 dátummal Walter Dnes ezt írta:
   I've been so used to playing mp3 files that I'm lost with real live
 audio CDs (not a data CD with mp3 files).  The XMMS docs aren't really
 helpful.  Do I need an additional plug-in?  mplayer is worse.
 mplayer /dev/cdrom tries to play a file by that name.  I emerged
 cdplay and cdplay -c -v gets the CD spinning and the output indicates
 that it is playing, but I get no sound.  I have unmuted the CD player
 and set its volume via alsactl.  One additional complication is that
 there is no headphone jack near the CD tray, so I assume I have to go
 via the soundcard.

Has your CD player been connected with your sound card? If not, I think you 
won't hear any sound.

Istvan

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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Daniel da Veiga

On 5/8/06, Stefán István [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

hétfő 08 május 2006 11.32 dátummal Walter Dnes ezt írta:
   I've been so used to playing mp3 files that I'm lost with real live
 audio CDs (not a data CD with mp3 files).  The XMMS docs aren't really
 helpful.  Do I need an additional plug-in?  mplayer is worse.
 mplayer /dev/cdrom tries to play a file by that name.  I emerged
 cdplay and cdplay -c -v gets the CD spinning and the output indicates
 that it is playing, but I get no sound.  I have unmuted the CD player
 and set its volume via alsactl.  One additional complication is that
 there is no headphone jack near the CD tray, so I assume I have to go
 via the soundcard.

Has your CD player been connected with your sound card? If not, I think you
won't hear any sound.



Stéfan is right, you need an analog audio cable connecting your CD
drive to your soundcard (or, if your soundcard support it, a digital
one). Else the drive can't send audio to your speakers.

--
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Computer Operator - RS - Brazil
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Jeremy Olexa
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Mattias Merilai wrote:
 Daniel da Veiga wrote:
 
 Stéfan is right, you need an analog audio cable connecting your CD
 drive to your soundcard (or, if your soundcard support it, a digital
 one). Else the drive can't send audio to your speakers.
 
 The other o/s can send audio to the soundcard via the system bus.
 Anybody knows if and when is this going to happen on the good o/s too?

I don't think you need that silly cable. My understanding was that the
audio cable connected to you sound card was for when you wanted to
listen to the cd and your computer was in low-power mode Either way, I
have stopped installing that cable on new computers that I build and it
has always worked fine for me.

To the original poster:
Are you sure you are in the cdrom group? Are you sure you have a
/dev/cdrom node? Any different outcome if you do mplayer /dev/hdc?

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Office: EE/CS 1-201
CS/IT Systems Staff
University of Minnesota

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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Andrew Gaydenko
It's strange question ;-) XMMS does it (just activate cdda plugin).
XMMS clones does it. Amarok does it too (at least SVN version - I
don't use Amarok's official releases).

=== On Monday 08 May 2006 18:17, Mattias Merilai wrote: ===
Daniel da Veiga wrote:

 Stéfan is right, you need an analog audio cable connecting your CD
 drive to your soundcard (or, if your soundcard support it, a digital
 one). Else the drive can't send audio to your speakers.

The other o/s can send audio to the soundcard via the system bus. 
Anybody knows if and when is this going to happen on the good o/s too?
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Re: [SPAM] - Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD? - Bayesian Filter detected spam

2006-05-08 Thread Harald Arnesen
Mattias Merilai [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 Daniel da Veiga wrote:

 Stéfan is right, you need an analog audio cable connecting your CD
 drive to your soundcard (or, if your soundcard support it, a digital
 one). Else the drive can't send audio to your speakers.

 The other o/s can send audio to the soundcard via the system bus.
 Anybody knows if and when is this going to happen on the good o/s too?

About 5 years ago :-)
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Harald Arnesen
Stefán István [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 hétfő 08 május 2006 11.32 dátummal Walter Dnes ezt írta:
   I've been so used to playing mp3 files that I'm lost with real live
 audio CDs (not a data CD with mp3 files).  The XMMS docs aren't really
 helpful.  Do I need an additional plug-in?  mplayer is worse.
 mplayer /dev/cdrom tries to play a file by that name.  I emerged
 cdplay and cdplay -c -v gets the CD spinning and the output indicates
 that it is playing, but I get no sound.  I have unmuted the CD player
 and set its volume via alsactl.  One additional complication is that
 there is no headphone jack near the CD tray, so I assume I have to go
 via the soundcard.

 Has your CD player been connected with your sound card? If not, I think you 
 won't hear any sound.

You don't need a cable from the CD player to the sound card with xmms:

Options - Preferences - Audio I/O Plugins - Audio CD Reader -
Configure - Output - Read Digital CD Audio
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Daniel da Veiga

On 5/8/06, Hemmann, Volker Armin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

On Monday 08 May 2006 16:04, Daniel da Veiga wrote:
 On 5/8/06, Stefán István [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  hétfő 08 május 2006 11.32 dátummal Walter Dnes ezt írta:
 I've been so used to playing mp3 files that I'm lost with real live
   audio CDs (not a data CD with mp3 files).  The XMMS docs aren't really
   helpful.  Do I need an additional plug-in?  mplayer is worse.
   mplayer /dev/cdrom tries to play a file by that name.  I emerged
   cdplay and cdplay -c -v gets the CD spinning and the output indicates
   that it is playing, but I get no sound.  I have unmuted the CD player
   and set its volume via alsactl.  One additional complication is that
   there is no headphone jack near the CD tray, so I assume I have to go
   via the soundcard.
 
  Has your CD player been connected with your sound card? If not, I think
  you won't hear any sound.

 Stéfan is right, you need an analog audio cable connecting your CD
 drive to your soundcard (or, if your soundcard support it, a digital
 one). Else the drive can't send audio to your speakers.


no, he is not.

You don't need the audio-cable to hear music from a cd - just the right
application ;)

like:
kscd
amarok



Oh yeah, you really don`t need the cable, it just makes things easier,
because it will work with all applications, won`t send data using the
system bus neither process it using the CPU, the CD drive will do all
the work and send output directly to the soundcard, the volume manager
of the soundcard with the CD audio label will work and some other
benefits.

But that`s just me. I want my hardware to do the stuff it should.

--
Daniel da Veiga
Computer Operator - RS - Brazil
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Version: 3.1
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Uwe Thiem
On 08 May 2006 16:34, Hemmann, Volker Armin wrote:
 On Monday 08 May 2006 16:04, Daniel da Veiga wrote:

  Stéfan is right, you need an analog audio cable connecting your CD
  drive to your soundcard (or, if your soundcard support it, a digital
  one). Else the drive can't send audio to your speakers.

 no, he is not.

 You don't need the audio-cable to hear music from a cd - just the right
 application ;)

 like:
 kscd
 amarok

Yeah but then your CPU is doing a lot of work. A cable for 10c seems cheaper 
than lots of CPU cycles.

Uwe

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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Andrew Gaydenko
=== On Monday 08 May 2006 20:19, Uwe Thiem wrote: ===
On 08 May 2006 16:34, Hemmann, Volker Armin wrote:

Yeah but then your CPU is doing a lot of work. A cable for 10c seems cheaper 
than lots of CPU cycles.

Uwe
===

I didn't noticed any CPU-eating during CDDA playing back. Porbably, for i286? 
;-)
And, after all, card's DAC is under control and there is a (limited) way to get 
more
clean sound: CD-drives have few-cent-cost poor DACs.
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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Ognjen Bezanov
On Monday 08 May 2006 15:38, Jeremy Olexa wrote:
 Mattias Merilai wrote:
  Daniel da Veiga wrote:
  Stéfan is right, you need an analog audio cable connecting your CD
  drive to your soundcard (or, if your soundcard support it, a digital
  one). Else the drive can't send audio to your speakers.
 
  The other o/s can send audio to the soundcard via the system bus.
  Anybody knows if and when is this going to happen on the good o/s too?

 I don't think you need that silly cable. My understanding was that the
 audio cable connected to you sound card was for when you wanted to
 listen to the cd and your computer was in low-power mode Either way, I
 have stopped installing that cable on new computers that I build and it
 has always worked fine for me.

No you do not. XMMS can use audio out (ie plug the CDROM Audio cable into 
the soundcard) or DAE (Digital audio extraction), where it reads the cdrom 
drive as if its raw data, and does the conversion to sound in software. This 
results in the audio over bus that the original poster pointed out.

To do this. you need to install an xmms-plugin (they did not come with my xmms 
version). There are two of them  in portage to my knowledge:

AudioCD Reader : libcdread.so
CD Audio Player : libcdaudio.so

Out of the two, I use CD Audio Player, because it has more features, such as 
Multiple CD-ROM support. This allows me to plugin in external CD-ROM's (such 
as USB CD-ROMS, and SCSI CD-ROMs/CD changers) and use them to play audio CD's
 
Note that in both drivers, you need to state you want to use  DAE rather then 
the old analog method (this is due to the fact that not all CD-ROM's have 
good DAE capabilities). Under CD Audio Player, you need to set Play mode 
to Digital audio extraction, along with configuring/checking your drive.

In portage they are called:

media-plugins/xmms-cdaudio  = CD Audio Player
and
media-plugins/xmms-cdread = AudioCD Reader

emerge one of them, restart xmms, and you're set ;)


Happy listening!

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http://ziva-vatra.dnsalias.com/~ognen




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Re: [gentoo-user] App/plugin to play CD?

2006-05-08 Thread Richard Fish

On 5/8/06, Uwe Thiem [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Yeah but then your CPU is doing a lot of work. A cable for 10c seems cheaper
than lots of CPU cycles.


I wouldnt' say a _lot_ of CPU cycles.  CDDA is just uncompressed
16-bit 44khz 2-channel audio samples.  All the app has to do is
configure an alsa output, and send the data to the card.  Unless some
kind of rate conversion is required (which would be very surprising),
the CPU should be doing almost nothing.

There will be a small amount of IO bandwidth used, but nothing
significant for a modern computer.  The display updates for something
like a visualizer are much more taxing, IMO.

-Richard

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