Re: [CDR] Re: [geo] High Level Review of a Wide Range of Proposed Marine Geoengineering Techniques

[Thomas Goreau]

They will decompose into CO2 unless they are stored in anoxic dead zones.

Thomas J. F. Goreau, PhD
President, Global Coral Reef Alliance
President, Biorock Technology Inc.
Coordinator, Soil Carbon Alliance
Coordinator, United Nations Commission on Sustainable Development Small Island 
Developing States Partnership in New Sustainable Technologies
37 Pleasant Street, Cambridge, MA 02139
gor...@bestweb.net
www.globalcoral.org
Skype: tomgoreau
Tel: (1) 617-864-4226

Books:

Geotherapy: Innovative Methods of Soil Fertility Restoration, Carbon 
Sequestration, and Reversing CO2 Increase
http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466595392 


Innovative Methods of Marine Ecosystem Restoration
http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466557734 


The Green Disc, New Technologies for a New Future: Innovative Methods for 
Sustainable Development
http://www.greenthindisc.org 

No one can change the past, everyone can change the future

When lies trump truth, the dark ages begin

> On Jun 3, 2019, at 12:34 PM, Amal Bhattarai  wrote:
> 
> As far as the mechanics of sequestration, kelp forests (also land based 
> plants) can be harvested and sunk to ocean floor, quickly, before being 
> consumed and respired. Microbial phytoplankton need more sophisticated 
> methods
> 
> The issue is scale. Can “new growth” be counted in gigatons per year?
> 
> If so, costs would be much less than DAC, which also needs “sinking”. 
> deep ocean or deep underground.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, Jun 3, 2019 at 12:27 AM Franz Dietrich Oeste 
> mailto:oe...@gm-ingenieurbuero.com>> wrote:
> Dear Amal
> 
> Thank you for this key question which can be answered like follows:
> 
> Healthy ocean phytoplankton layer (PL) plants and green microbes cannot 
> assimilate carbon dioxide or carbon dioxide solutions like the continental 
> plants. (PL) plants are forced to use bicarbonate instead of CO2. As a 
> consequence of this fact the PL needs to generate one hydroxyl ion for every 
> bicarbonate carbon assimilated to organic carbon.
> 
> This is no disadvantage for the PL as it seems at first sight. This 
> assimilation effect produces a basicity membrane at the surface of the globes 
> ocean which prevents the bicarbonate carbon from leaving the ocean and which 
> activates the atmospheric CO2 to get absorbed by the basicity of the ocean 
> surface. Because every hydroxyl ion produces a new bicarbonate ion by CO2 
> absorption from the atmosphere the PL cannot not go short in carbon delivery 
> for organic carbon production.
> 
> Additional to organic carbon PL plants need nitrogen, sulphur and halogens 
> for production of organic N, S, and halogen compounds. Also this organics 
> become fertilized by the PL life from dissolved salts like sulphates, 
> nitrates, and halogenides and also generate OH ions during their conversion 
> to organic hetero compounds. Also this metabolic reactions of the PL produce 
> additional alkalinity.
> 
> Healthy PL can compensate excessive basicity generation which would increase 
> the pH values to >9 that is adverse to healthy metabolism. The sequestration 
> of solid carbonate shells and skeletons from bicarbonate is a measure to 
> compensate such uncontrolled pH increase because every carbonate generated 
> produces one molecule carbonic acid which neutralizes the OH ions by 
> bicarbonate generation. Such carbon shell producers in the PL for instance 
> are coccolithophores and foraminifera. Even within extreme productive PL 
> layers like the Humboldt Current upwelling system in front of the South 
> American west coast this kind of carbonate sequestration keeps the pH well 
> within the metabolic optimum.
> 
> Because the assimilation reaction and basicity generation is only active 
> during daytime the pH decreases during the night and even may drop to values 
> of 8 or even below. This phenomenon of the dark is the cause of the CO2 
> escape from upwelling deep water within the polar parts of the ocean during 
> the long lasting winter night because during this season the basicity 
> membrane of the ocean has a hole within these regions.
> 
> So called "Ocean Acidification" said to be a cause of the increased CO2 
> concentration in the atmosphere has not been caused by this effect. Actual 
> cause are damages to the complex PL layer ecosystem which reduces their 
> assimilation activity and OH ion productivity: During the very warm 
> Cretaceous epoch the phytoplankton and ocean life flourished as can be seen 
> from the chalk cliffs of Dover and many fossilized remains found in many 
> other regions of the world. The cliffs had built from the carbonate 
> preciptating healthy and productive PL life. During the epoche of the 
> Cretaceous the CO2 levels within the atmosphere had been up to 5 times of the 
> recent level.
> 
> Franz D. Oeste
> 
> 
> 
> -- 

Re: [CDR] Re: [geo] High Level Review of a Wide Range of Proposed Marine Geoengineering Techniques

[Thomas Goreau]

It’d easy to grow seaweed, we grew it at record rates in Jamaica in the 1980s, 
but very hard to stop it rotting, or being eaten!

In other words, gross C sequestration can be locally very large, but net C 
sequestration may be very small or close to zero.

Thomas J. F. Goreau, PhD
President, Global Coral Reef Alliance
President, Biorock Technology Inc.
Coordinator, Soil Carbon Alliance
Coordinator, United Nations Commission on Sustainable Development Small Island 
Developing States Partnership in New Sustainable Technologies
37 Pleasant Street, Cambridge, MA 02139
gor...@bestweb.net
www.globalcoral.org
Skype: tomgoreau
Tel: (1) 617-864-4226

Books:

Geotherapy: Innovative Methods of Soil Fertility Restoration, Carbon 
Sequestration, and Reversing CO2 Increase
http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466595392 


Innovative Methods of Marine Ecosystem Restoration
http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466557734 


The Green Disc, New Technologies for a New Future: Innovative Methods for 
Sustainable Development
http://www.greenthindisc.org 

No one can change the past, everyone can change the future

When lies trump truth, the dark ages begin

> On Jun 2, 2019, at 10:26 PM, Dan Miller  wrote:
> 
> To the extent that additional seaweed forests grow and, therefore, decrease 
> ocean CO2 content, that will lead to a decrease in atmospheric CO2 because 
> the ocean and atmospheric CO2 levels remain in balance.
> 
> On the other side of the coin, once we start Direct Air Capture, we will need 
> to remove “extra” CO2 to account for the CO2 the oceans will put back into 
> the atmosphere once the atmospheric levels decrease.
> 
> Dan
> 
> On Jun 2, 2019, at 2:20 PM, Amal Bhattarai  > wrote:
> 
> Regarding kelp forests for marine sequestration, how is one to understand 
> that it is atmospheric carbon that is being sequestered, and not the oceanic 
> dissolved carbon, of which there is plenty?
> 
> 
> On Sun, Jun 2, 2019 at 7:09 AM 'Robert Tulip' via Carbon Dioxide Removal 
>  > wrote:
> Dear Mark
> 
> Thank you for sharing your AdjustaDepth Phase 1 Final Report DE-AR916 
>  on the 
> potential for seaweed forests to address global needs for food, fuel and 
> climate.  I encourage readers to review the linked report, as it provides a 
> compelling scientific agenda for reversing global warming and cleaning up the 
> oceans.
> 
> I would like to know if there has been media coverage of this project, as it 
> seems to me one of the biggest and most important efforts now underway for 
> practical climate action.
> 
> Best wishes
> 
> Robert Tulip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, 21 May 2019, 4:44:08 am AEST,  > wrote:
> 
> 
> A non-geoengineering approach could reverse climate change faster than the 
> Marine Geoengineering techniques listed in the GESAMP report.  Estimated 
> initial investments in attached "$100B-Proposal..." presume that the Feed the 
> world and Fuel the world produce profits and quickly snowball to full global 
> capacity.
> 
> The Reverse climate change step might be classified as geoengineering.  It 
> could use any good-for-millennial and ocean restorative carbon storage 
> technique.
> 
> 
> Mark E. Capron, PE
> Ventura, California
> www.PODenergy.org 
> Feed the world. Fuel the world. Reverse climate change.
> 
>  Original Message 
> Subject: [geo] High Level Review of a Wide Range of Proposed Marine
> Geoengineering Techniques
> From: Andrew Lockley  >
> Date: Tue, March 12, 2019 4:41 am
> To: "carbondioxideremo...@googlegroups.com 
> 
>  >"
>  >, geoengineering
> mailto:geoengineering@googlegroups.com>>
> 
> 
> http://www.gesamp.org/publications/high-level-review-of-a-wide-range-of-proposed-marine-geoengineering-techniques
>  
> 
> 
> High Level Review of a Wide Range of Proposed Marine Geoengineering Techniques
> 
> 2019 #98 (143p.)
> Author(s): GESAMP
> Publisher(s): GESAMP
> Journal Series GESAMP Reports and Studies
> This report comprehensively examines a wide range o marine geoengineering 
> techniques to remove carbon dioxide from the atmosphere or boost the 
> reflection of incoming solar radiation to space (albedo modification) or in 
> some cases both. Further, the report recommends a) that a coordinated 
> framework for proposing marine geoengineering activities, submitting 
> supporting evidence and integrating independent expert assessment must 

[geo] Re: [CDR] Off topic: Temperature-dependent hypoxia explains biogeography and severity of end-Permian marine mass extinction | Science

[Thomas Goreau]

Black shales formed in anoxic oceans caused by super greenhouse gas conditions 
are the mechanism by which the planet gets rid of excess CO2, but it takes 
millions of years to do so!

Ironically, most of the world’s oil supply comes from precisely such sources!

That is why the US, Russia, and Saudi Arabia are working hand in glove to 
prevent any political action to reverse global warming, as they did again 
yesterday blocking action on the IPCC report (even though it severely 
underestimates impacts):
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-46496967 


This amounts to killing the planet for willful ignorance and short sighted 
greed.

Thomas J. F. Goreau, PhD
President, Global Coral Reef Alliance
President, Biorock Technology Inc.
Coordinator, Soil Carbon Alliance
Coordinator, United Nations Commission on Sustainable Development Small Island 
Developing States Partnership in New Sustainable Technologies
37 Pleasant Street, Cambridge, MA 02139
gor...@bestweb.net
www.globalcoral.org
Skype: tomgoreau
Tel: (1) 617-864-4226

Books:

Geotherapy: Innovative Methods of Soil Fertility Restoration, Carbon 
Sequestration, and Reversing CO2 Increase
http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466595392 


Innovative Methods of Marine Ecosystem Restoration
http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466557734 


The Green Disc, New Technologies for a New Future: Innovative Methods for 
Sustainable Development
http://www.greenthindisc.org 

No one can change the past, everyone can change the future

When lies trump truth, the dark ages begin

> On Dec 8, 2018, at 9:30 PM, Andrew Lockley  wrote:
> 
> Poster's note: I'm sharing this, as one of the exceptional pieces covering 
> climate change impacts. The apocalyptic end-Permian extinction is around 10 
> degrees Celsius of warming over baseline, business as usual is over 3. That 
> doesn't look like much of a safety margin to me.
> 
> http://science.sciencemag.org/content/362/6419/eaat1327 
> 
> 
> Temperature-dependent hypoxia explains biogeography and severity of 
> end-Permian marine mass extinction
> 
> Justin L. Penn1 
> ,* 
> , Curtis 
> Deutsch 
>  
>  
> 1 
> ,2 
> ,* 
> , Jonathan 
> L. Payne3 , 
> Erik A. Sperling3 
> 
>  See all authors and affiliations
> Science  07 Dec 2018:
> Vol. 362, Issue 6419, eaat1327
> DOI: 10.1126/science.aat1327
> Article
>  
> Figures & Data
>  
> Info & Metrics
>  
> eLetters
>  
>  PDF
>  
> You are currently viewing the abstract.
> 
> View Full Text 
> 
>  
> 
> 
>  
>  
>  
>  
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
>  
> Drivers of the “Great Dying”
> Though our current extinction crisis is substantial, it pales in comparison 
> to the largest extinction in Earth's history, which occurred at the end of 
> the Permian Period. Referred to as the “Great Dying,” this event saw the loss 
> of up to 96% of all marine species and 70% of terrestrial species. Penn et 
> al. explored the extinction dynamics of the time using Earth system models in 
> conjunction with physiological data 

Re: [geo] Aligning conceptions of geoengineering for a healthy climate conversation. Deich

[Thomas Goreau]

This is emergency room resuscitation of a near-dead patient! 

The term for diagnosing and restoring the natural healthy biogeochemical life 
support systems is Geotherapy.

Geotherapy should never be confused with its antithesis, Geo-engineering

Thomas J. Goreau, PhD
President, Global Coral Reef Alliance
President, Biorock Technology Inc.
Coordinator, Soil Carbon Alliance
Coordinator, United Nations Commission on Sustainable Development Small Island 
Developing States Partnership in New Sustainable Technologies
37 Pleasant Street, Cambridge, MA 02139
gor...@bestweb.net
www.globalcoral.org
Skype: tomgoreau
Tel: (1) 617-864-4226

Books:

Geotherapy: Innovative Methods of Soil Fertility Restoration, Carbon 
Sequestration, and Reversing CO2 Increase
http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466595392 
<http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466595392>

Innovative Methods of Marine Ecosystem Restoration
http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466557734 
<http://www.crcpress.com/product/isbn/9781466557734>

The Green Disc, New Technologies for a New Future: Innovative Methods for 
Sustainable Development
http://www.greenthindisc.org <http://www.greenthindisc.org/>

No one can change the past, everyone can change the future

> On Jan 6, 2016, at 4:41 PM, PR CARTER <petercarte...@shaw.ca> wrote:
> 
> 
> Yes climate emergency intervention, is also accurate terminology- perhaps the 
> best.
> 
> The same term is used for life saving emergency medical intervention, which 
> has greatly increased with great success, over recent years. 
> 
> 
> Best regards Peter Carter
> From: "Paul E. Belanger" <pebelangerro...@gmail.com 
> <mailto:pebelangerro...@gmail.com>>
> To: "Ronal Larson" <rongretlar...@comcast.net 
> <mailto:rongretlar...@comcast.net>>
> Cc: "John Nissen" <johnnissen2...@gmail.com 
> <mailto:johnnissen2...@gmail.com>>, "olivier boucher" 
> <olivier.bouc...@lmd.jussieu.fr <mailto:olivier.bouc...@lmd.jussieu.fr>>, 
> "noah deich" <noah.de...@centerforcarbonremoval.org 
> <mailto:noah.de...@centerforcarbonremoval.org>>, "Geoengineering" 
> <geoengineering@googlegroups.com <mailto:geoengineering@googlegroups.com>>, 
> "Peter R Carter" <petercarte...@shaw.ca <mailto:petercarte...@shaw.ca>>, "Bru 
> Pearce" <b...@portgeorge.com <mailto:b...@portgeorge.com>>, "Kevin Lister" 
> <kevin.lis...@btopenworld.com <mailto:kevin.lis...@btopenworld.com>>, "P. 
> Wadhams" <p...@cam.ac.uk <mailto:p...@cam.ac.uk>>, "Tim Lenton" 
> <t.m.len...@exeter.ac.uk <mailto:t.m.len...@exeter.ac.uk>>, "n vaughan" 
> <n.vaug...@uea.ac.uk <mailto:n.vaug...@uea.ac.uk>>, "Thomas Goreau" 
> <gor...@bestweb.net <mailto:gor...@bestweb.net>>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2016 12:40:49 PM
> Subject: Re: [geo] Aligning conceptions of geoengineering for a healthy 
> climate conversation. Deich
> 
> Why not adopt what NAS is trying to do: Climate intervention preferred usage 
> over Geoengineering or other suggestions (i.e. get on the same page?) <>
>  
> I put the NAP/NAS document entitled Climate intervention; Carbon Dioxide 
> removal and reliable Sequestration
> on my web page today – this is part 1 dealing with carbon dioxide removal 
> (CDR)
> http://denverclimatestudygroup.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Climate-Intervention-Carbon-Dioxide-Removal-and-Reliable-Sequestration.pdf
>  
> <http://denverclimatestudygroup.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Climate-Intervention-Carbon-Dioxide-Removal-and-Reliable-Sequestration.pdf>.
>  I need to find 
>  
> part 2  –is/will be on “albedo modification” (fka SRM) – if anyone finds 
> please let me know.
>  
> Climate intervention preferred usage over Geoengineering:
> This part 1 is mainly about the CDR side of Geoengineering – with the NAS 
> preferring it to be called Climate intervention.
> They are comfortable with CDR but prefer “albedo modification”  instead of 
> SRM.
>  
> It is worth repeating the preface below to understand that perspective: BOLDS 
> AND RED MY EMPHASIS/clarification
>  
> Preface:
> The signs of a warming planet are all around us: rising seas, melting ice 
> sheets,
> record-setting temperatures, with impacts cascading to ecosystems, humans,
> and our economy. At the root of the problem, anthropogenic greenhouse gas
> emissions to the atmosphere continue to increase, a substantial fraction of 
> which diffuse
> into the ocean, causing ocean acidification and threatening marine ecosystems.
> Global climate is changing faster than at any time since the rise of human 
>