Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Patrick Matthäi 


Am 19.02.2015 um 10:06 schrieb Humble Devassy Chirammal:

Hi Neils,

>
My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org 


mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?
>

+1 , its better to have a ML on packaging and discuss about the 
changes/concerns/issues in this area.


With my Debian glusterfs maintainer hat on, also: +1



--Humble


On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 2:30 PM, Niels de Vos > wrote:


Hey Pranith!

Thanks for putting this topic on my radar. Uncommunicated packaging
changes have indeed been a pain for non-RPM distributions on several
occasions. We should try to inform other packagers about required
changes in the packaging scripts or upgrade/installation process
better.

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 12:26:33PM +0530, Pranith Kumar Karampuri
wrote:
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1113778
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1191176
>
> How can we make the process of giving good packages for things
other than
> RPMs?

My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic
packag...@gluster.org 
mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?

I've added all packagers that I could track on CC, and am
interested in
their preferences and ideas.

Thanks,
Niels




--
/*
Mit freundlichem Gruß / With kind regards,
 Patrick Matthäi
 GNU/Linux Debian Developer

  Blog: http://www.linux-dev.org/
E-Mail: pmatth...@debian.org
patr...@linux-dev.org
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Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Justin Clift 
On 19 Feb 2015, at 09:00, Niels de Vos  wrote:
> Hey Pranith!
> 
> Thanks for putting this topic on my radar. Uncommunicated packaging
> changes have indeed been a pain for non-RPM distributions on several
> occasions. We should try to inform other packagers about required
> changes in the packaging scripts or upgrade/installation process better.
> 
> On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 12:26:33PM +0530, Pranith Kumar Karampuri wrote:
>> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1113778

A technical solution would be a validation script that can be run as root
and checks for the availability of all the required GlusterFS binaries.

If they're not found in the PATH it barfs with errors message(s) about it.

Shouldn't be hard to implement, if we know all the binary names to check for.


>> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1191176
>> 
>> How can we make the process of giving good packages for things other than
>> RPMs?
> 
> My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
> Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org
> mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?
> 
> I've added all packagers that I could track on CC, and am interested in
> their preferences and ideas.

The core part of this problem seems to be packagers for non-RPM based
platforms not knowing about the special things needing to be done by
GlusterFS packages.

This likely affects NetBSD, FreeBSD, (possibly OSX?), and others too.

The core of the answer is to have the info somewhere packagers can
find it.  A wiki page (well indexed) about "Special Things that
GlusterFS Packagers need to do" would be a suitable thing.

As others have suggested, a mailing list for packagers isn't a bad
idea.  It shouldn't replace the core info being in one place, but
it's a good way to communicate about developments for that info.

This is my pre-coffee thinking anyway. :)

+ Justin

--
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petabytes, and handling thousands of clients.

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Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Lalatendu Mohanty 

On 02/19/2015 05:21 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 04:52:41PM +0530, Lalatendu Mohanty wrote:

On 02/19/2015 04:25 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 03:45:41PM +0530, Lalatendu Mohanty wrote:

On 02/19/2015 02:30 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:

Hey Pranith!

Thanks for putting this topic on my radar. Uncommunicated packaging
changes have indeed been a pain for non-RPM distributions on several
occasions. We should try to inform other packagers about required
changes in the packaging scripts or upgrade/installation process better.

+1

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 12:26:33PM +0530, Pranith Kumar Karampuri wrote:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1113778
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1191176

How can we make the process of giving good packages for things other than
RPMs?

My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org
mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?

+1 for announce packaging changes very clearly.

But I think we should keep using gluster-devel ML for packaging discussions
as IMO it is the right platform to get all developers and packagers
together. However We need to discuss these stuff clearly which we lacked
before.

My idea was to reduce the number of emails that packagers receive. Not
all packagers are active as a Gluster developer, and the -devel list has
quite some traffic. I am afraid that important changes would get lost in
the noise.

Niels


I understand. However my thought was, if we segregate the discussion we
might miss valuable feedback from developers. Also not sure if discussion
around packaging on gluster-devel will increase understanding around
packaging of developers. I agree with you on the email traffic though.

I prefer to not bother most developers with the packaging. If they are
interested, they can subscribe to the packagers list :-)

Developers should clearly state how their components need to get
installed/updated, they should be able to send those details to the
packaging list. When we review changes to the .spec, we should keep in
mind to share those details too.

If we as packagers notice any issues, we would file a bug or request
input on the gluster-devel list. Once the issue is settled, a
description can be shared among the packagers.

Do you think that should be workable?
Niels



Yes, we can definitely try this. Lets do it.

Thanks,
Lala

Thanks,
Lala


Thanks,
Lala

I've added all packagers that I could track on CC, and am interested in
their preferences and ideas.

Thanks,
Niels


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Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Kaleb KEITHLEY 

On 02/19/2015 06:22 AM, Lalatendu Mohanty wrote:

On 02/19/2015 04:25 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 03:45:41PM +0530, Lalatendu Mohanty wrote:

On 02/19/2015 02:30 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:


My idea was to reduce the number of emails that packagers receive. Not
all packagers are active as a Gluster developer, and the -devel list has
quite some traffic. I am afraid that important changes would get lost in
the noise.


I don't know the situation with our Debian, *BSD, and MacOS packagers. 
If they're anything like the typical Fedora/EPEL packager they have 
several or even dozens, perhaps hundreds of packages that they maintain. 
Asking them to slog through gluster-devel to find packaging 
notifications is probably asking a bit much; even with good labelling 
and mail filters.


I agree that a gluster-packaging ML is the right solution.

--

Kaleb

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Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Niels de Vos 
On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 04:52:41PM +0530, Lalatendu Mohanty wrote:
> On 02/19/2015 04:25 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:
> >On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 03:45:41PM +0530, Lalatendu Mohanty wrote:
> >>On 02/19/2015 02:30 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:
> >>>Hey Pranith!
> >>>
> >>>Thanks for putting this topic on my radar. Uncommunicated packaging
> >>>changes have indeed been a pain for non-RPM distributions on several
> >>>occasions. We should try to inform other packagers about required
> >>>changes in the packaging scripts or upgrade/installation process better.
> >>+1
> >>>On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 12:26:33PM +0530, Pranith Kumar Karampuri wrote:
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1113778
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1191176
> 
> How can we make the process of giving good packages for things other than
> RPMs?
> >>>My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
> >>>Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org
> >>>mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?
> >>+1 for announce packaging changes very clearly.
> >>
> >>But I think we should keep using gluster-devel ML for packaging discussions
> >>as IMO it is the right platform to get all developers and packagers
> >>together. However We need to discuss these stuff clearly which we lacked
> >>before.
> >My idea was to reduce the number of emails that packagers receive. Not
> >all packagers are active as a Gluster developer, and the -devel list has
> >quite some traffic. I am afraid that important changes would get lost in
> >the noise.
> >
> >Niels
> >
> I understand. However my thought was, if we segregate the discussion we
> might miss valuable feedback from developers. Also not sure if discussion
> around packaging on gluster-devel will increase understanding around
> packaging of developers. I agree with you on the email traffic though.

I prefer to not bother most developers with the packaging. If they are
interested, they can subscribe to the packagers list :-)

Developers should clearly state how their components need to get
installed/updated, they should be able to send those details to the
packaging list. When we review changes to the .spec, we should keep in
mind to share those details too.

If we as packagers notice any issues, we would file a bug or request
input on the gluster-devel list. Once the issue is settled, a
description can be shared among the packagers.

Do you think that should be workable?
Niels

> 
> Thanks,
> Lala
> 
> >>Thanks,
> >>Lala
> >>>I've added all packagers that I could track on CC, and am interested in
> >>>their preferences and ideas.
> >>>
> >>>Thanks,
> >>>Niels
> 
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Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Lalatendu Mohanty 

On 02/19/2015 04:25 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 03:45:41PM +0530, Lalatendu Mohanty wrote:

On 02/19/2015 02:30 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:

Hey Pranith!

Thanks for putting this topic on my radar. Uncommunicated packaging
changes have indeed been a pain for non-RPM distributions on several
occasions. We should try to inform other packagers about required
changes in the packaging scripts or upgrade/installation process better.

+1

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 12:26:33PM +0530, Pranith Kumar Karampuri wrote:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1113778
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1191176

How can we make the process of giving good packages for things other than
RPMs?

My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org
mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?

+1 for announce packaging changes very clearly.

But I think we should keep using gluster-devel ML for packaging discussions
as IMO it is the right platform to get all developers and packagers
together. However We need to discuss these stuff clearly which we lacked
before.

My idea was to reduce the number of emails that packagers receive. Not
all packagers are active as a Gluster developer, and the -devel list has
quite some traffic. I am afraid that important changes would get lost in
the noise.

Niels

I understand. However my thought was, if we segregate the discussion we 
might miss valuable feedback from developers. Also not sure if 
discussion around packaging on gluster-devel will increase understanding 
around packaging of developers. I agree with you on the email traffic 
though.


Thanks,
Lala


Thanks,
Lala

I've added all packagers that I could track on CC, and am interested in
their preferences and ideas.

Thanks,
Niels


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Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Niels de Vos 
On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 03:45:41PM +0530, Lalatendu Mohanty wrote:
> On 02/19/2015 02:30 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:
> >Hey Pranith!
> >
> >Thanks for putting this topic on my radar. Uncommunicated packaging
> >changes have indeed been a pain for non-RPM distributions on several
> >occasions. We should try to inform other packagers about required
> >changes in the packaging scripts or upgrade/installation process better.
> 
> +1
> >On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 12:26:33PM +0530, Pranith Kumar Karampuri wrote:
> >>https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1113778
> >>https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1191176
> >>
> >>How can we make the process of giving good packages for things other than
> >>RPMs?
> >My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
> >Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org
> >mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?
> 
> +1 for announce packaging changes very clearly.
> 
> But I think we should keep using gluster-devel ML for packaging discussions
> as IMO it is the right platform to get all developers and packagers
> together. However We need to discuss these stuff clearly which we lacked
> before.

My idea was to reduce the number of emails that packagers receive. Not
all packagers are active as a Gluster developer, and the -devel list has
quite some traffic. I am afraid that important changes would get lost in
the noise.

Niels

> 
> Thanks,
> Lala
> >I've added all packagers that I could track on CC, and am interested in
> >their preferences and ideas.
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Niels
> 
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Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Lalatendu Mohanty 

On 02/19/2015 02:30 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:

Hey Pranith!

Thanks for putting this topic on my radar. Uncommunicated packaging
changes have indeed been a pain for non-RPM distributions on several
occasions. We should try to inform other packagers about required
changes in the packaging scripts or upgrade/installation process better.


+1

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 12:26:33PM +0530, Pranith Kumar Karampuri wrote:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1113778
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1191176

How can we make the process of giving good packages for things other than
RPMs?

My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org
mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?


+1 for announce packaging changes very clearly.

But I think we should keep using gluster-devel ML for packaging 
discussions as IMO it is the right platform to get all developers and 
packagers together. However We need to discuss these stuff clearly which 
we lacked before.


Thanks,
Lala

I've added all packagers that I could track on CC, and am interested in
their preferences and ideas.

Thanks,
Niels


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Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Pranith Kumar Karampuri 


On 02/19/2015 02:30 PM, Niels de Vos wrote:

Hey Pranith!

Thanks for putting this topic on my radar. Uncommunicated packaging
changes have indeed been a pain for non-RPM distributions on several
occasions. We should try to inform other packagers about required
changes in the packaging scripts or upgrade/installation process better.

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 12:26:33PM +0530, Pranith Kumar Karampuri wrote:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1113778
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1191176

How can we make the process of giving good packages for things other than
RPMs?

My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org
mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?

I've added all packagers that I could track on CC, and am interested in
their preferences and ideas.

Thanks Niels!
First thing we need to get going is to make other packaging infra to 
handle gluster upgrades. i.e. On upgrade glusterd needs to be restarted, 
first it needs to start with 'upgrade' option 'on' so that it starts 
re-generate the configuration files and dies, then 'glusterd' needs to 
be started again, normally. How do we get this done in other 
distributions if not done already?


Pranith


Thanks,
Niels


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Re: [Gluster-devel] How can we prevent GlusterFS packaging installation/update issues in future?

2015-02-19 Thread Humble Devassy Chirammal 
Hi Neils,

>
My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org
mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?
>

+1 , its better to have a ML on packaging and discuss about the
changes/concerns/issues in this area.

--Humble


On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 2:30 PM, Niels de Vos  wrote:

> Hey Pranith!
>
> Thanks for putting this topic on my radar. Uncommunicated packaging
> changes have indeed been a pain for non-RPM distributions on several
> occasions. We should try to inform other packagers about required
> changes in the packaging scripts or upgrade/installation process better.
>
> On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 12:26:33PM +0530, Pranith Kumar Karampuri wrote:
> > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1113778
> > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1191176
> >
> > How can we make the process of giving good packages for things other than
> > RPMs?
>
> My guess is that we need to announce packaging changes very clearly.
> Maybe it makes sense to have a very low-traffic packag...@gluster.org
> mailinglist where all packagers from all distributions are subscribed?
>
> I've added all packagers that I could track on CC, and am interested in
> their preferences and ideas.
>
> Thanks,
> Niels
>
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