Re: Quantum Snap Server - Opinions?

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
> On Mon, 22 Jul 2002, at 12:40pm, Ken Ambrose wrote:
> > Ken's (security) rule-of-thumb: if you don't have physical security,
> > you don't have security.  Period.  Looked at a different way, I
> -like-
> > being able to reset passwords easily through a button ...
>   Even if said button was not present, I could always apply this
> tried-and-true security exploit: I could rip open the case, and install
> the
> hard drive as a secondary disk in my own system.

  Agreed.  So long as you have something that can use their drives in the RAID 
configuration they have..

  Personally, I have it configured using RAID 5 accross 4 drives..  Just 
something else to add in that wasnt mentioned.  These puppies do raid..

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Re: Quantum Snap Server - Opinions?

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
> >  The *ONLY* concern I've had with it is ease of subverting security. 
> >Primarily, reseting the admin password is as easy as pushing a little
> button 
> >with a pencil top, and pushing it again twice, then holding it down. 
> This 
> >resets the admin password..  No way to disable this 'feature'.  Not to
> bad, 
> >but it's a pet peive I guess..
> You could, if you really wanted to, open up the box and disconnect 
> this button, couldn't you?
> Or, better yet, get a good locking door on the room where this box is 
> located :)

  Aye, true enough.  It's the EASE of which one can do it.  Resetting the 
admin password to nothing is, quite literally, in this case, EASIER then 
setting the time on a digital watch.  And since the box can work with EXTERNAL 
networks, such as NTFS mounts, Windows networks, etc, this could lead to a 
compromise of your entire network, not just the little box.

  Like I said, points is VERY valid.  I'd just ensure people have as little 
access to the physical box as possible.

  As a second note I forgot about, it also has a built in FTP and web server, 
as well as the ability to run Java servlets.  Definatly a nice little box..

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Re: Quantum Snap Server - Opinions?

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Hewitt Tech <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Has anyone used any of the Quantum Snap Server products to add NAS
> storage
> for small office use?

  Yeppers.  I have a 4000.

> I remember them using Linux as the hidden OS.

  Nope..  Currently, BSD.  In April they purchased a company that would lead 
to SnapOS being replaced with a Linux based kernel.

> I
> was
> thinking of recommending one of these for use in a small office. So far
> the
> only deficiency I see in the small one I want to use (the Snap Server
> 2200)
> is that it doesn't respond to the UPS shutdown command in the event of
> commercial power failure.

  Yes, it does, but it will do so via TCP/IP.  So the USB has to be IP aware.

> I'm not sure this would necessarily be a big
> problem since the rest of their office environment would likely already
> be
> down at this point and the Snap Server should be pretty much idle. I
> haven't
> seen too many problems with Linux systems from power failures when the
> system was quiescent.

  I haven't had any issues during failures.  It's a GREAT little box..

> Thoughts?

  The *ONLY* concern I've had with it is ease of subverting security.  
Primarily, reseting the admin password is as easy as pushing a little button 
with a pencil top, and pushing it again twice, then holding it down.  This 
resets the admin password..  No way to disable this 'feature'.  Not to bad, 
but it's a pet peive I guess..

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Re: master-slave DHCP?

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Michael O'Donnell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Does anybody know if it's possible to have a
> DHCP config that positions a local representative
> (server) on each of several isolated LAN
> segments, and where each such representative
> is really just a slave of (and relays traffic
> between its local DHCP clients and) a centralized
> master server that maintains a single database?

  What your talking about is basically DHCP relaying, if I read it right.  
Relaying can be done several ways, including the standard ISC dhrelay deamon, 
the native capabilities of many switches, or dhcpfwd (http://www-user.tu-
chemnitz.de/~ensc/dhcpfwd/).  Relaying basically consists of listening for DHCP 
requests, 'forwarding' them to something, either another network, or a specific 
host, and then responding on behalf of the server to the client..

  Is that what you mean?

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Re: Ethernet device

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Brian Chabot <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> OK, here's a wierd question from one of my clients...
> He's working in a lab environment where he's testing traffic with a
> few
> other people in an isolated environment.
> He needs for general users to run a program that makes socket calls
> usually reserved for root.

  Specifically, what socket calls?  It makes a difference..

> So I had him chmod 4755 the binary.  This works as a temperary
> solution,
> but as it is this binary they are working on, it would require all the
> users to have sudo and that would defeat the purpose.

  Aye..

> So... He suggested that we chmod the *interface* device.  AKA, eth1.
> Might work.  But, in RH7.3, I can't locate the device name in /dev for
> eth1!

  There isnt.  Network interfaces arent devices..

> Any ideas here?

  Again, it matters what the calls are.  If they are trying to put the device 
into premiscious (sic?) mode, or simply trying to do something like bypass the 
TCP layer, and talk directly IP, etc..

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Re: Message Boards

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting "Kenneth E. Lussier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> Does anyone out there have any experience with building/running
> message
> boards? I was asked to find something that was "Like the Message
> Boards
> on AOL". This, of course, is difficult for me, since I don't use AOL.
> However, the basic things that I think I need are 1) Multiple views
> (threaded, topic/tree, etc.) 2) Ability to see new posts only 3) HTML
> support (so poeple can post in different colors (people are wierd))
> and
> 3) registration support. 

  After looking at several a while back, I decided on 
http://www.mawic.de/mwforum/ for several reasons.  One reason being perl vs 
PHP (don't ask.  Personal preference, nothing beyond that), the ability to 
easily create a new external authentication module, many language modules, and 
what I at least got the impression of, a much more open development community.

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Re: RTTVAR?

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting "Thomas M. Albright" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> I'm checking my network with nmap, and i keep getting thie following 
> message:
> [root@blood root]# nmap -sS -O 192.168.0.1 
> Starting nmap V. 2.54BETA7 ( www.insecure.org/nmap/ )
> RTTVAR has grown to over 2.3 seconds, decreasing to 2.0
> what is RTTVAR?

RTTVAR stands for round-trip time variation.  It's something that the TCP stack 
keeps track of and uses to compute the retransmission timer.  Also used is 
SRTT, or smoothed round-trip time.  These two things, and a variety of magical 
equations, are used by the TCP stack to figure out how long it should wait for 
an ACK before resending a packet.  This allows the TCP stack to tune itself for 
a given network 'connection', and not put more burdon on a possibly already 
saturated network.  A rather short, yet fairly detailed description can be read 
at http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2988.txt if you REALLY want to know, but that 
sums it up.  Most of the time, in general, the TCP stack would keep track of 
such alchemy itself, however, setting the RTTVAR to a lower number can 
hypothetically, at least, fool the TCP layer into retransmitting sooner then it 
might do otherwise.  I'm not sure I'd take that approach myself, but..  8-)

  Personally, I'd like to assume that the TCP stack was written by individuals 
smarter then myself, and leave the alchemy up to them..  8-P

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Re: Web application

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting "Kenneth E. Lussier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> However, they all suffer from one problem: They all require
> authentication. This means users would have to log into each
> individual
> application seperately. What I would like to do is have a single login
> page that then passes the users authentication to each application.
> Has
> anyone out there done this sort of thing? If so, is it a fairly easy
> thing to do, or am I in for a world of pain? To keep things as simple
> as
> possible, everything that I end up using  will be in PHP. Any advice
> is
> more than welcome, since I am not a Web developer!!

  Microsoft does..  It's called..  *snickers..  quick donning of flak jacket*  
Passport..

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Fun GNOME Eye candy..

[Thomas Charron]

  I just wanted to pass on that I stumbled accross this quite by accident, and 
its small, yet can sure as heck wow friends and have that definate movie effect 
on things..

http://www.systemtoolbox.com/bard/3ddesktop/

  Its basically a desktop manager for Gnome using OpenGL.  8-)  I actually 
found it quite practical to use, much to my surpise, really..

  *MAKE* sure you have hardware acceleration, though.  Not sure how well it'd 
work without it..

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Re: Humor: NT and security

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Benjamin Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> On Thu, 14 Feb 2002, Michael Costolo wrote:
> > Just out of curiosity, doesn't Tom's Root Boot Disk do the same thing
> for
> > Linux?
>   Sure would.
>   Repeat after me: "If physical security is lost, all security is
> lost."

*snickers*

  'Mr IT guy.  How come all the computers are locked behind plexiglass on our 
desks?'

  'We need physicall secutiry.  Look but don't touch..'

  'But how am I gonna read my email'

  'Send an interoffice memo..'

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Rob Malda..

[Thomas Charron]

  Thought this was at least a bit cute..  8-)  Today Rob Proposed to his to-be 
bride..  With a slashdot story..

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Re: Humor: NT and security

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Michael Costolo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Just out of curiosity, doesn't Tom's Root Boot Disk do the same thing
> for Linux?

  *snickers*  Yep, but it's only funny when done against a Microsoft 
product..  8-)

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Re: Humor: NT and security

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Paul Lussier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> Them: Gasp! This floppy is dangerous! Where did you get it?
> Me: Internet. Been around forever.
> Them: How do we keep students from using this?
> Me: Can't. Migrate. Linux. Mac.
> Them: No, no, no. Just make NT safe.
> Me: Can't. NT inherently unsafe.

  *Toms walks up to the Linux box, does virtually the same danged thing with a 
bootable floppy.  Mounts file system, edits /etc/passwd directly..

  *snickers*

  The only correct answer to addressing EITHER NT or Linux is to encrypt the 
filesystem.  Both Linux and Windows NT/2k/XP have this capability.  The only 
difference is editing /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow instead of c:\winnt\system32
\sam.dat (Think thats the SAM database, can't recall exactly)

  I know, meant to be a joke, but  *snickers*

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Re: (OT) email

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Benjamin Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

http://www.ductape.net is a free, hosted service.  Works VERY well..

> On 12 Feb 2002, R. Sean Hartnett wrote:
> > Can anyone recommend any free email service somewhere that is not one
> of
> > the big spam outfits?
>   Free services work on advert dollars.  Small services cannot attract
> significant advertisers.  Thus, small free services are destined for
> failure.  It would be difficult to recommend such an operation.
>   If you want free, sign up with Yahoo.  :-)

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Re: Job Opening

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting "Derek D. Martin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> I think you need to get a grip.

  As should Ray, I suppose, eh?  8-)

> While I admit I could not resist the
> opportunity to get in a little parenthetical dig at my favorite
> company to hate at the end there (which was certainly not directed at
> the poster, but at Microsoft), the POINT of the message was
> potentially both useful and helpful.  I was pointing out that a
> potentially very large percentage of the intended audience of that
> e-mail might not have been able to read some important information
> that was contained in the attachment.  Since I'm one of the people who
> is unable to read MS-TNEF format, I had *NO IDEA* what was in it, and
> therefore whether or not it was relevant to the matter at hand.

  Umm, Derek, with all do respect, do you have *EVEN THE SLIGHTEST CLUE* as to 
*WHAT* a TNEF attachment *IS*?  It's the RICH TEXT VERSION of the message.  
Shesh, make comments about alot of things, but not a perfectly valid MIME 
alternate presentation of the message..  You missed nothing, which is *WHY* the 
attachment comes along the way it does..

> This is a *LINUX* mailing list.

  Which, ironically enough, has *NOTHING TO DO* with a mail client..

> By its very nature, many people who
> read these messages, and therefore who might be interested in the job
> posting mentioned, CAN NOT READ MS-TNEF.  Myself included, and I'm
> sure many others.

  And the TNEF file had nothing to do with it..  Open Mouth, Insert Foot, CHEW 
TILL THIGH..

> As for your comment about my PGP signature: MS-TNEF is proprietary;
> OpenPGP is an open standard.

  Open has nothing to do with standard.  I'm simply pointing out that your pgp 
file was as worthless to my mail client as his TNEF attachment was to yours.  
And in both cases, everything was all fine and good..

> My PGP signature is also plain text
> inline, whereas MS-TNEF is undocumented binary rubbish.  Anyone who
> cares to find out what PGP is (assuming they don't already know) can
> make use of my PGP signature, pretty much regardless of what platform
> they're using; whereas ONLY people who use MS mailreaders can make use
> of MS-TNEF, as far as I am aware.

  And anyone who uses outlook might have a use for it..  And for the record, 
you can very well read TNEF attachments if it really gets your goat.  
http://www.fentun.com/linux.html

> What I did NOT know, until just now, is that the contents of this kind
> of attachment are not only impossible to read unless you're using a MS
> mailer, but also utterly useless under the same circumstances:

  And you stand incorrect.  The contents are good for other outlook and outlook 
express users.  For crying out loud.  Talk about Linux.  Don't friggen bash 
people becouse of their choice of desktop operating system MAIL CLIENTS.

  *Grabs stapler, beings to use it on toms lips, for fear of where it might 
just bring him next*

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Re: Job Opening

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting "Derek D. Martin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Your mail had an attachment of type MS-TNEF which is a proprietary
> Microsoft format.  Non-MS mail readers have no idea what to do with
> it.  If it contained anything you want to share with the list, you'd
> do well to re-post it, as many of us do not use MS mail readers (and
> with very good reason, I might add).

  As opposed to you sending a PGP file attachement that means rubish under 
anyone NOT happening to use PGP?  For crying out loud, man, he sent out a job 
heads up.  Talk about poking the avon lady in the eye for ringing the door 
bell..  Shesh..

  I got an idea what your email client can do with that there file 
attachment..  8-)

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Re: Remote X problem (Linux to SCO Unix)

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Paul Lussier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> >  Alrighty then.  It's one of two things then.  Either the XDM login is
> >handling autolanching of apps, or Exceeed is setup to automatically log them 
> >in, and start up the remote applications.  Either is valid.  If within 
Exceed,

> To my knowledge neither XDM nor Exceed can do this.  Upon login, 
> either will invoke your .xsession (or is it .xinitrc?) file.  If that 
> is configured to start up apps, then that's where it's happening.

*Thhrrwp*.  To the unknowing, it magically appears that xdm is providing this 
capability.  8-)  Thats what I had meant was happening.

  As far as Exceed doing it, it can indeed open up telnet sessions, etc, in the 
background to handle this sort of thing.  As Derek pointed out, doing this OR 
modifying the default shell scripts WOULD indeed be evil, but I've seen it done.

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Re: Remote X problem (Linux to SCO Unix)

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Vince McHugh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > Thomas Charron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >   I think I'm a little confused.  'Run its app'? 
> > What is the app?
> at this point I would like to get any app (xterm or
> xclock) to run, but ultimately there is apparently a
> script that launches and open several apps (xterm,
> xclock and a proprietary dispatch application). This
> happens when we use either the windows/exceed or the X
> terminals that come with the system.

  Alrighty then.  It's one of two things then.  Either the XDM login is 
handling autolanching of apps, or Exceeed is setup to automatically log them 
in, and start up the remote applications.  Either is valid.  If within Exceed, 
you are recieving an XDM login like window (What many consider a 'Unix X 
Windows Login' dialog), then chances are, their startup scripts are doing the 
job for you..

> I currently get an error: can't open display when I
> try xterm & or xclock &

  Almost sounds like your display on ther Linux box is, as most of the time it 
is, running on screen '0', not one.  As a test, telnet in, and export 
DISPLAY=machine:0 instead of :1.  I'm not sure, but I SEEM to remember Exceed 
using :1..

> >   Chances are, more then likely, that Exceed is
> > setup to remote into the SCO 
> > box, either via telnet, or ssh, and 'run some stuff'
> > that causes an xdm login 
> > window to appear. 
> Just to clarify is the xdm login window the standard
> SCO GUI login??? Because that IS what I am trying to
> do.

  I'm unsure, but it's considered the standard 'X' login screen.  There are 
many varieties of daemons that implement XDM, such as KDM(?) and gdm (Gnome 
version of xdm).

  Try this.  Launch X from a command line using:

/usr/location/of/X -query scomachinename.  If fonts look funny, or you think it 
may be using funny fonts, you *may* have to add: tcp/sco.box:7200 in the 
XFree86config file, under where the fonts are configured.  If this doesnt work, 
try /usr/location/of/X -query scomachinename -ac instead.  If it's a security 
issue, -ac says that anything can connect, essentially turning off access 
control to the server.  (I recall tossing up funny messages to coworkers who 
didnt know a thing about X becouse X was started up this way on some boxes we 
had, so you MAY want to consider securing things a bit more, but up to you..)

Take a gander at this page:
http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/Linux/docs/HOWTO/mini/other-formats/html_single/XDM-
Xterm.html

  The parts we are talking about here are dealing with an 'X' server, along 
with XDM running on what they call in that doc an 'Application Server'.  
Technically, you could really be running on cheap intel boxes that boot off of 
a floppy if you really wanted to in this case, becouse the apps run on the 
server itself, and technically, the only thing running locally is X.  This is 
basically what 'X Terminals' really are, smart displays running X..

  Feel free to ask for help if you need to.  This type of environment makes 
things VERY nice, as if you do things such as setting up XDM broadcast, you can 
simply plugin in and have it work.  In this environment, X would start up and 
literally send out a XDM broadcast request, which the server would answer.  No 
configuration needed, and peoples PC's dont need to be configured for their 
desks.  This makes creating new terminals VERY easy, and simplifies SO many 
things..  But perhaps we're making it a tad to complex then you need cause we 
are familiar with this environment..  8-P

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Re: Samba and PAM

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Ken Ambrose <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> If you find out, please let me know; I'd be very interested in using
> PAM
> authentication (or even LDAP, if you feel so inclined ;-).  As it
> currently stands, I'm able to password synchronization when passwords
> are
> changed, but I'm not able to "automagically" use the MD5 passwords.

  If you compiler your own version of samba, compile it with the --with-pam 
option to the configuration build script.  If you then turn password encryption 
off, Samba will now, by default, *NOT* use the smbpasswd file, but instead 
authenticate via PAM.  Theres a *LITTLE* more to it then this, that I cant 
remember offhand configuration wise, but if you up on the --with-pam option, it 
will become more clear.

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RedHat counter proposal ROCKS..

[Thomas Charron]

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/011120/202744_1.html

You guys need to read this, this is an awesome proposal that will prolly make 
the Microsoft deal look not quite as 'generouse' as they intended..  8-)

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Changelog censoring due to DMCA

[Thomas Charron]

  I thought this was extremely interesting.  I know it ended up on slashdot, 
but if you didnt get a chance, check this out:

http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=linux-kernel&m=100374609914587&w=2

  The changelogs for the kernel will now be hosted in *TWO* versions, with the 
US version actually NOT containing the specific security fixes, merely the 
statement that a fix was made.  Keep clicking on 'Next in Thread' to read the 
conversation as it evolves..

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Red Cross donations..

[Thomas Charron]

  Paypal has setup an easy way to donate:

http://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=p/gen/relief-outside

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Re: Request for assistance

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Benjamin Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> On Sun, 2 Sep 2001, Mark Glassberg wrote:
> > I rewrote /etc/lilo.conf--incorrectly as it turned out--and ran
> lilo.
> > Lilo rewrote the boot sector of the msdos partition, not the mbr of
> the
> > drive.
>   In short: I hope you have backups.  :-(
>   The format of the PBR (Partition Boot Record) is
> application-specific.
> For an MS-DOS filesystem, I believe that would be such details as the
> DOS
> bootstrap code, and the location of the FATs and the root directory.

  There is another alternative.  Reboot on a command line boot disk, and do 
this:

fdisk /MBR

  This will reformat ONLY the MBR of the boot drive.  Then your fudged, becouse 
you cant get to Linux any more, but this can get you into windows so you can 
possibly download a rescue disk that can get you back into your linux box, so 
you can fix lilo, or possibly allow you to use Loadlin to load linux directly 
from Win32.

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RE: Computer industry woes due to Microsoft?

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Jerry Eckert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Dan Jenkins wrote:
> >Of course, the real problem for Compaq, et al is commoditization of
> the
> >PC.
> >More OS choices might help, but they could be commoditized too. With
> >Linux, et al, however, you have more ways to configure the desktop.
> This
> >reduces the commodity aspect, and could return some semblance of
> brand
> >perception.
> Can I say the "V" word here?  Compaq has it now!

  Which HP now has, due to the fact that this morning, HP announced that they 
are BUYING Compaq..

--- 
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Re: Maddog on Tech TV

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Kurth Bemis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> At 08:50 PM 8/29/2001, Scott Mellott wrote:
> channel 191 on Dish Network :-)
> >If you have DirectTV or Dishnetwork, you'll have to check out the
> >ScreenSavers on TechTV (channel 354 on DTV).  Maddog was interviewed
> as

  Channel 244 on AT&T digital cable/Media One.

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Re: Software Dev Conference passes

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Jerry Kubeck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> If any of you might be interested in attending this let me know ASAP 
> and I will get you on the list for passes.

  Not to not appriciate things or anything, but one must bring up the fact that 
they're not giving you anything..  8-P

Exhibits Only Pass Unlimited access to two days (August 29 – August 30, 2001) 
of SD Web Services World Expo. Plus attend keynotes, panels and Expo floor 
party. Free/$50 on site  Free by July 6th  Free by August 3rd.  


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Re: Got Hacked - ATT Suspended Broadband Service (Was "New To List...")

[Thomas Charron]

It's GREAT, with one exception..  If you have a nonstandard setup for
what they consider 'standard', aka, eth0 = outside world, eth1 = inside, you
might have to fudge with some of the startup script, but beyond that, it's a
good application of the LRPs work.

As far as logging, you could always have a remote syslogd and have it go
there..

From: "Taylor, Chris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: Got Hacked - ATT Suspended Broadband Service (Was "New To
List...")
> Do any of you have any experience running CoyoteLinux?
> What would your opinion of this firewall/router be as applied for the
> average home users needs?  Since this is run from a floppy disk and can be
> run an a HDD-less computer, would I still be able to make log files or
would
> they be unnecessary?



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OMG, they're going off the deep end.. Mad Dog?

[Thomas Charron]

  Someone else please read this licence

http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/eula_mit.htm

  This is the usage agreement for the newest Beta of the Mobile internet 
toolkit.  Specifically, look at section 1c.

  Want even better, check out the rest, section 7 is called VII: RELINQUISHING 
OF IMMORTAL SOUL.

  MadDog, you still out there?  What do YOU think of this?  I mean, I suppose 
it's great that Microsoft is actually using the term Linux IN their EULA, but 
for CRYING out loud..

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Re: Open Formats (was ZD on Linux)

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Rich C" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Open Formats (was ZD on Linux)
> Following that logic, such an exploit could be accomplished with a JPG
> viewer or, for that matter, Paint.

Yep.  And there probrably are.  The thing with an image viewer or the
such is the formats are fairly locked down, and hence, buffer overflows
harder to come by.  But there are more then likely some there..

> The PDF document is simply text,
> graphics, and formatting information, similar to a postscript file.

Yeppers.  But the thing with buffer overflows is, what if a file
contained something ELSE.  Thats why they call it a bug..  :-P

> To my
> knowledge, it doesn't contain any script or code; nor can the PDF viewer
> execute any code based on the data in the file.

Yep, and FTP servers don't execute arbitrary commands on the server,
either.  Thats why it's a bug..  8-P  Heres a quick example:

Lets assume we have a function such as this:

void myfunc(char *somedata)
{
char copyofsomedata[100];
memcpy(copyofsomedata, somedata, strlen(somedata));
printf("somedata was %s\n", copyofsomedata);
}

This function takes a string, and copies it into a local variable, and
prints it.  A buffer overflow bug would occur in this case if something was
bigger then 100 characters, as copyofsomedata is only 100.  If somedata is,
lets say 200 characters, the memcopy is going to overflow the buffer.  The
memcpy will *gladly* let you do this.  Heres how it COULD look in memory:

/ copyofsomedata \/ Executable Code \
**|**

Basically, to make it really basic, the system will allow you to
overwrite the 'executable' code.  The way many compilers generate the code,
variables can and are often resting write before executable code.

So it doesn't MATTER if the application doesn't execute something.  In
the case of a buffer overflow, the applications code is actually being
dynamically 'replaced' by the attacker with something else.


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Re: ANIVERSARY: 10 years of LINUX

[Thomas Charron]

From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: ANIVERSARY: 10 years of LINUX
> I propose a celebration of Linux's 10 year anniversary.
> While reading Linus' new book: "Just for Fun", I realized that
> the time is upon us already. (The book is a great read, too).

Wow, been that long already?  I started using it around the .9 range,
like around 93 I think, maybee a little earlier..


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Re: Origin of OS X operating system

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Benjamin Scott" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Origin of OS X operating system
>   Apple has basically scrapped the existing MacOS (formerly just called
> "System").  Apple now has "OS X.  The "X" supposedly stands for release
ten,
> but it is a completely new operating system.  It can be thought of a

As a trivia note, it was decided to call it OSX not only as a marketing
ploy.  Someone owned a tradmark on the phrase 'OS 10'..  :-P


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Re: MS Questions Stallman

[Thomas Charron]

ROTFL.  I liked this one:


Proportionality: If a proprietary program uses a GPL library (as described
in the GNU FAQ #29) or combines with a GPL plug-in or module (as described
in the GNU FAQ #31 and #37), the combined program is subject to the GPL. In
this case, a proprietary program of 1,000,000 lines of code that uses a
small GPL library or links to a GPL plug-in as described above, will then be
subject to the GPL and its terms. This is not a proportional relationship.



 Most libraries are released under the LGPL, and *NOT* the GPL.  Prime
difference is that it specifically allows applications to make external
function calls to the library without the GPL indecting the applications.
And what the HECK is a "proportional relationship"??  Oh, wait, the app
should be licenced in proportion.  Yea, thats it..  8-P



The only thing that really worried me, after rereading it myself, is
this:



#37: "If modules are designed to run linked together in a shared address
space, that almost surely means combining them into one program.



*sigh*.  Thats from the FAQ.  Blech.  Whoever added that was very keen
at expressing their opinion.  Since the tires on my car are designed to run
in the same space as my CAR, I suppose that I must buy Dodge brand name
tires..  8-P

Scary as it is, I think both sides, including Mr. Stallman, are both a
bit stupid.  Ok, lemme rephrase, their idiots, and he's arogant about his
opinions, which are often stated as matter of law, vague as they are..  8-P

From: "Kenneth E. Lussier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: MS Questions Stallman
> This article over at LinuxToday is fairly ammusing. Apparently, M$
> handed out sheets to reporters prior to Stallman's speech at NYU. I
> think that M$ is underestimating Stallman's intelligence, and engaging
> in a head-to-head battle is not in their best interests.


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Re: Linux over OpenBSD

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Mark Komarinski" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux over OpenBSD
> One thing the FSF recommends is that you transfer the copyright
> to the FSF.  In this case, the FSF is the copyright owner (not you)
> and the licence cannot be changed by you later on.

Yea, but the whole idea of giving it to the FSF seems kind of silly to
me, personally.  Thats a 'greater cause' instead of simply wanting to be
able to share the code.

> > Nope.  The only things that have the ability to revoke the rights to
> > use, modify, and redistribute versions previously released by the GPL
are
> > specifically stated within the GPL.  Basically, you break the licence,
and
> > it's revoked.
> Not sure I understand that one.  I thought that previous versions of
software
> under the GPL remained that way until revoked by court order, or
MSAOLTWRIAAMPAA
> finally mangle the copyright law enough.

Well, yes, but an individual can have their rights revoked to the source
by the licence itself.  The licence isn't globally revoked, but the rights
granted to an individual or entity CAN be.  Quote:


  4. You may not copy, modify, sublicense, or distribute the Program
except as expressly provided under this License.  Any attempt
otherwise to copy, modify, sublicense or distribute the Program is
void, and will automatically terminate your rights under this License.
However, parties who have received copies, or rights, from you under
this License will not have their licenses terminated so long as such
parties remain in full compliance.


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Re: Linux over OpenBSD

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Paul Lussier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux over OpenBSD
> >You can "revoke" the GPL and put newer versions under a different
license.
> Well, I suppose, but wouldn't a "new" version have to be a complete
> rewrite and not include any code previously released under the GPL?
> If it did include code previously released under the GPL, wouldn't
> the viral nature of the GPL constitute that as a derivative work?

Nope, becouse nothing in the GPL requires the original authors to give
up their rights to the code.  They are simply granting others with rights to
the existing code.  This is why you can actually release code under 2
different conflicting licences, such as the original author of some peice of
code selling it to a closed source vendor for them to use.

> Additionally, say you are allowed to "revoke" the license for future
> versions of the code, that doesn't mean that the versions previously
> released under the GPL are now "revoked" does it?  Those are still
> out there and free, therefore, anyone can take that code and perpetuate
> it with modifications, right?

Nope.  The only things that have the ability to revoke the rights to
use, modify, and redistribute versions previously released by the GPL are
specifically stated within the GPL.  Basically, you break the licence, and
it's revoked.


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ONLY Linux users would have done this.. 8)

[Thomas Charron]

http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-5949401.html

Mixed emotions regarding this one..


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Re: this *looks* to be real ??

[Thomas Charron]

*ROTFLROTFLROTFL*

From: "Karl J. Runge" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: this *looks* to be real ??
> Hey, your hair would turn grey too if you were a MS program that found
> itself stepping over Bill's edict:
> "500 users for a group ought to be enough for anybody"



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Re: AOL and AIM on Linux

[Thomas Charron]

Yes.  This is primarily becouse they are only using a small subset of
the aim.exe to provide the checksum capabilities, and all current AIM
clients can handle this 'feature'.  In the future, however, they do have the
capabilities to check virtually any file that is distributed with AIM and
request a checksum.  Basically, AIM for Linux has these limited checksums
most likely inside of it.  Or they use a seperate checksum table for the
different clients..

AOL is tricky with things related to AIM.  Remember how they stopped
MSIM?  They purposly used a buffer overflow  in their clients to identify
them..  8)

And for the record, the existing checksums that they have been using
have been discovered, and current libfaim applications can now use them as
well..  :-)

From: "Greg Kettmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2001 12:37 PM
Subject: Re: AOL and AIM on Linux
> "AIM for Linux is not blocked.  We have blocked Gaim and Jabber (against
my
> wishes) but never our own client.  In fact, with in the next few weeks we
are
> planning on releasing another build of AIM for Linux.  As of right now, we
do
> not have a version of AOL that runs on Linux.  Even using WINE, AOL will
not
> run on a Linux platform.  However, using WINE you can run our Windows
client
> on Linux.  It is too bad that people don't actually check out the garbage
> that they end up posting. "


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Re: AOL and AIM on Linux

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Benjamin Scott" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Greater NH Linux Users' Group" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2001 10:42 AM
Subject: Re: AOL and AIM on Linux
> On Thu, 3 May 2001, Paul Lussier wrote:
> > I just got AOL 6.0 in the mail the other day with 1000 free houts.
>   If I remember correctly, those 1000 free hours have to be used in one
month.
>   Hm.  Let me check my calendar for the next month with 42 days in it.

*ROTFLROTFLROTFL*..

I never noticed that before..


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Re: My Firewall Breach. A concern.

[Thomas Charron]

From: Kenneth E. Lussier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: My Firewall Breach. A concern.
>Whoa there, nelly. You can do an SMB mount and mount the C:\
>drive, copy a binary over, then use the remote registry administration
>tools so that every time the machine boots up it executes the binary.
>That is just one example. If SMB is filtered on the router level, then
>there are a few other ways to drop a file onto a Windoze box. If you're
>dealing with NT, then there are even more ways to exploit the box. So,
>yes, they are subject to attack, and they are subject to many of the
>same illegal uses. However, if someone gets a hold of a Windows9x box,
>there is no concept of permissions to stop an attacker.


Yes, but the issue is, the script kiddies don't have as much fun on
Windows boxes..  8)

>> Does this mean that Windows is a fundamentally safer system for use on
>> the Internet?
>Well, I would have to say NO to that.


But then again, we're a bit biased..  8)

>No, what you are seeing is the result of superior marketing and an
>extreamely high level of apathy. Your general Windoz user doesn know if
>they have been exploited or not. But also, Windoz boxen aren as
>attractive to an attacker because it doesn have the same capabilities of
>a Linux box. If you want to run *ANY* system on the internet, you need
>to assume some risk, and most people don't. It doesn't matter if you are
>running Linux or Windoze, if your system is used in an attack, then you
>are liable. Either system needs to be hardened. The difference is that
>you average Linux user has the ability to know where to look to get
>started. Your average Windoze user trusts that Microsoft has secured
>their system.


And the average driver trusts that the company that made their tires
didn't skimp and they won't fall apart whilst they're driving that new SUV
down the highway..  8)  How DARE they not notice that the rubber was
obviously defective..

Re: GnomeICU servers?

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Paul Lussier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: GnomeICU servers?
> I've been futzing around with gnomeicu the last day and a half, and I
> was wondering if anyone knows if it's possible to run a private ICU
> server?
> It seems like having an IM server on a corporate intranet might be a
> handy thing to have, and I wanted to play around with it if it's
> possible.
> From what I've been able to find however, is that gnomeicu just uses
> Mirabilis' protocol, and likely their servers too.  Is that accurate?
> Any ideas, pointers, additional docs?

GnomeICU will work with AOLs publically available ICQ servers, or you
can download a Win32 based server to run an Intranet network.  There are
also several open source servers under development, but the only reliable
one I've ever seen working is http://www.icq.khstu.ru/unix/

If you are looking for an IM system, you may want to take a look at
Jabber http://www.jabber.org and http://www.jabber.com.  Jabber is an open
IM system, meaning that is uses URIs just as email does, and allows any
number of Jabber servers to intercommunicate.  There are also some very nice
perl modules for integrating it into system scripts, to say, send you an IM
when an alert is set, etc..  Becouse of its open architecture, it also
supports several 'gateways' into other IM systems, such as ICQ, MSN, IRC,
and untill recently being blocked by AOL, AIM.  These are server based
solutions, not multiprotocol based clients.  But hey, I'm biased..



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Re: Vitts. (Was Re: ongoing: First Lan)

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Paul Lussier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Vitts. (Was Re: ongoing: First Lan) 
> In a message dated: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 17:08:23 EST
> "Hartnett" said:
> >Dish Network does offer two way satellite Internet.
> Is it true 2-way satellite or is it a telco-return?  Most of these 
> (Direct PC) used to be satellite downstream feed and a telco return.
> Kind of defeating the purpose IMO.

True asynchronous communications.  No phone line involved.


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Re: NSA Secure Linux

[Thomas Charron]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Well, the guys at the NSA most certainly know what they're doing.
  :-)  

If anything, the fact that they DIDN'T release something simular
for either of the below OS's is a strike against them.  :-P

From: "Kurth Bemis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2001 8:32 AM
Subject: NSA Secure Linux
> Anyone seen this?  What a joke!  Well for the Government i suppose
> that  this is the best that they can do with 1.2 billion-trillion
> tax dollars.  I  mean if you want something secure use OpenBSD or
> MacOS!! anyway - check  it out
> http://www.nsa.gov/selinux/download.html
I like their use of wu-FTP as their "secure ftp server. :-)

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oMtSCgrTiNtAyp2hNlkK+RRH
=kKFf
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Re: Ways to protect Data (was Re: Why FTP must die in two words)

[Thomas Charron]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

> Let's digress "Neither SSH nor VPN"? I wasn't aware that there
> was a "VPN" protocol. If there is, please correct me and sent an
> RFC reference and I will be more than happy to look at it as well
> as admit my
> ignorance. If not, and you mean Virtual Private Network in a
> generic sense, then you would need to be more specific

I think his point is, that riding unsecured data streams inside a
secured transport, be it a secured stream or a secured virtual
network, doesn't address the issues that exist with the initial
unsecured stream.  SSH or a VPN of any sort are examples of this.

> IPSec has the ability to
> create an end-to-end encrypted tunnel using session keys, *AND*
> encrypt the individual packets that are sent through that tunnel. I
> will grant you that many people utilize "tunnel-mode" which does
> exactly what you say, tunneling insecure protocols through a secure
> tunnel. However, when you tunnel an insecure protocol inside of a
> constant stream of garbage data that is encrypted using 2048 (or
> 4096)-bit keys, you would have to first penetrate the stream. By
> the time you do that, the session key has changed, and you have to
> start over again. I would say that IPSEC is the most secure (and
> probably the most complex) protocol out there, and there are
> several sub-protocols that make it up (ESP, AH, SHA, etc.). Now, if
> you are talking about PPTP, or an SSH-based VPN, then I would
> agree. 

  Yep, but now your talking at an environment level, and not an
application level.  An application cannot mandate it run under a
secured environment.. :-)

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zGQ9L6ijzROaOJJ/0PhyAVXU
=HqHT
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

Re: djbdns

[Thomas Charron]

From: Benjamin Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: djbdns
> On Thu, 22 Feb 2001, Thomas Charron wrote:
> >>   I do not like software that tells me to go jump in a lake.
> > *AHEM*  Then perhaps you should start scratching your itch, so to
say.
>   Hey, you are the one who said that said I should go check out djbdns.  I
> went and took a look.  I found that it basically said, "Go away."
>   Don't invite people in if you're just going to tell them to get out.
:-)

  Erm, I didn't invite anything.. That was my first reply on that entire
thread..

> On Thu, 22 Feb 2001, Thomas Charron wrote:
> > He hates using software that tells him what features it actually
supports.
>   Clarification: I hate using software that says, "Standards aren't
important;
> do things my way."
>   Sounds way too much like Microsoft.  Sure, at least with djbdns I don't
have
> to *pay* to be treated like dirt, but I'd still rather not be treated like
> dirt.  :-)

Blech.  I think to big of a deal is made about this entire thread.
Someone suggested it, you didn't like it, case closed.  You wheren't treated
like dirt, though.  The developers didn't feel their itch required TCP
support.  Easy enough.  Conversation as its been heard..

"Try this, I think it's better.."

"I looked at it, I am personally insulted that it doesn't support this
feature."

"Err.."

"I hate crap software that tells me to go jump in a lake.  If it doesn't
support exactly what I happen to be looking for, I plan on being personally
insulted.."

"Err.."


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Re: djbdns (was: Heads up for named?)

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Paul Lussier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: djbdns (was: Heads up for named?)
> In a message dated: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:16:39 EST
> "Thomas Charron" said:
> >*AHEM*  Then perhaps you should start scratching your itch, so to
say.
> >:-)
> Well, technically he doesn't have one, since he's using BIND :)

:-)

Well, there *IS* that.. :-)  Just seemed like a funny statement that he
made in his prior email ..  :-)  He hates using software that tells him what
features it actually supports.  So, basically, people who write software to
scratch their itch need to also write support for funcitonality that they
dont care about, becouse they hate software that dictates the features that
they support.. :-)  Seemed kinda counter intuative to me, thats all.. :-)


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Re: djbdns (was: Heads up for named?)

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Benjamin Scott" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Greater NH Linux Users' Group" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 9:28 PM
Subject: djbdns (was: Heads up for named?)
> > It *does* support TCP, if you really think you need it:
>   That very comment exemplifies the single biggest issue I have with
djbdns.
>  It is not the job of the implementor to decide whether or not I
need a
> feature. 
>   I do not like software that tells me to go jump in a lake.

*AHEM*  Then perhaps you should start scratching your itch, so to say.
:-)


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Re: Help! I think space aliens are trying to mess with my fan!

[Thomas Charron]

*bonk*..  Meeza tupid..  :-)  Shoulda been <=, not >=..  :-)

> On Mon, 19 Feb 2001, "Thomas Charron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > main(){
> > int i = 0;
> > while(1)
> > {
> > while(1)
> > {
> > if(i >= 1) i++;
> > else break;
> >  }
> >  i = 0;
> >  sleep(5000);
> > }
> > }


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Re: Help! I think space aliens are trying to mess with my fan!

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Steven W. Orr" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Bill Freeman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2001 3:55 PM
Subject: Re: Help! I think space aliens are trying to mess with my fan!
> Good shot except that the fan gets a *lower* pitch when I turn seti *off*.
> Seti is not the problem of course. I did try a simple C program as well:
> main(){while(1);}
> and the same thing happens.
> I guess I'm still open to an explanation. :-)

Well, here would be a good test.  Use the above example, but try this:

main(){
int i = 0;
while(1)
{
while(1)
{
if(i >= 1) i++;
else break;
 }
 i = 0;
 sleep(5000);
}
}

If other posts hold true, that the fan motor if powering according to
CPU usage, then it will now turn on and off according to which section of
the processor is running.  Its very possible, but most fans I've seen are
powered directly off of the power supply, and not on the same power as the
processor itself..


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Re: StarBand

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Marc Evans" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: StarBand
> > 1) You need a 10 degree veiw of the horizon.  In most cases up here,
> > spec in the boonies, trees get in the way of having it at such a low
> > angle./.
> Mine is set at 32 degrees. I don't believe that there are any birds down
> that low (10 degrees).

  Thats very strange.  My friend actually had an installer come to look, and
he basically said no friggen way.  Of course, hes in the boonies in
Brookline.  I must have been mistaken in the 10 degree statement, but I DO
remember it was very, VERY low, aka, no way in heck to get over the trees
without cutting down half of Brookline..

> > 2) *WIN32* only.  There are two ways of connecting.  One is to use a
USB
> > based 'Satallite' modem.  Another is to have a Satallite interface card.
To
> > my knowledge, there are no drivers for these that will run correctly
under
> > Linux.  I could be incorrect, but when I searched, I came up empty.
> Not true. See my prior post on the topic.

  Now thats something I wasn't aware of at all.  Schweet..

> > 3) Decent bandwidth, but from looking at a live system in Mass
working,
> > it has crap latency.
> Yes, latency is an issue, particularly if you are a game player.

Yep..  Agreed there..  :-(


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Re: StarBand

[Thomas Charron]

Had a friend look at it.  Coupla ick things about it :

1) You need a 10 degree veiw of the horizon.  In most cases up here,
spec in the boonies, trees get in the way of having it at such a low
angle./.

2) *WIN32* only.  There are two ways of connecting.  One is to use a USB
based 'Satallite' modem.  Another is to have a Satallite interface card.  To
my knowledge, there are no drivers for these that will run correctly under
Linux.  I could be incorrect, but when I searched, I came up empty.

3) Decent bandwidth, but from looking at a live system in Mass working,
it has crap latency.

- Original Message -
From: "Mark Rousseau" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2001 12:45 AM
Subject: StarBand
> Has anyone on this list tried the two satellite service from Starband?
> I'm interested in it since I live in the boonies and it seems like it
> will be cold day in hell before DSL is an option.



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Re: Sendmail Training

[Thomas Charron]

From: "Paul Lussier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Ray Bowles" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >How can you possibly justify $2k to any manager (or Wife for that matter)
for
> >training on a system that may as well be called anangrousmail for all
they

ROTFL..  Ray and Niall, I didn't catch it untill reading Pauls
response..  :-)


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Re: Perl CGI (again)

[Thomas Charron]

On Tue, 17 Oct 2000, Paul Lussier wrote:
> In a message dated: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 12:32:05 CDT
> Thomas Charron said:
> >Basically, his browser is configured for 'Ask?' for that MIME type.
> >That's all.  
> I don't think that's it.  It's a CGI which regurgitates plain text.  His 
> browser can display ascii text, therefore,it should be able to display the 
> output from the CGI, no?

  Yep, can display it just fine.  Unless somehow it changed in his browser
settings.  If he set text/plain to 'internal' (Or something like that,
cannot remember ATM the exact setting), the browser will display it just
fine..


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Re: Perl CGI (again)

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Derek Martin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> On Tue, 17 Oct 2000, Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
> > Derek Martin wrote:
> > >   Ok so finally I got my page working, and it works for everyone except
> > > one of our junior administrators, who, rather than seeing the output of
> > > the perl script, gets a file box asking him to save the .pl file.
> > Evidently the content-type is showing up funky.  Does he get any
> > message about the type, such as in the title bar of the save-as
> > box?
> He disappeared so I can't really ask him, and his screen is locked... :(
> [Sometimes there are disadvantages to people doing what they're supposed
> to do...]
> I want to make it clear that I'm sending the appropriate header for
> text/plain and it works fine for EVERYBODY, except this one guy.  So it's
> got to be a browser configuration issue... doesn't it?

  Basically, his browser is configured for 'Ask?' for that MIME type.  That's 
all.  

--- 
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Re: Linux barcoding???

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Derek Martin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > If I had to bet, it would be that you're unlikely to
> > find anything nonproprietary that will help you work
> > with such codes, though I'd be happy to learn that
> > I'm wrong.   Happy hunting...
> In theory, that shouldn't be true.  UPS released the specification of this
> form of encoding (called UPS-code previously) into the public domain, with
> hopes that it would be adopted as a world-wide standard for data encoding.
> However, like Beta-Max, just because it's better doesn't mean it will gain
> widespread acceptance.  I've yet to see it used anywhere else; though
> given the origin of this thread I'd bet someone is using it.  
> As to where to find out more about this form of data encoding, I haven't a
> clue, other than to suggest perhaps you should contact UPS.  I'm sure
> someone there will be able to help you, if you can get past the waves of
> drones who know nothing about technology.

  The actualy Maxicode information is located at www.maxicode.com.  ;-P  The 
biggest problem with it, really, is that the technology required to read the 
Maxicode has a very pricey overhead.  It's more based on imaging technologies 
then scanning technologies.  I highly doubt something like the ':CueCat' device 
could be made to read such codes, simply do to the cost involved.  Even the 
DIADs couldn't read the Maxicode itself, which is the primary reason why they 
sumplimented to MAXI-code with a traditional bar code..  ;-P

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Re: database choice

[Thomas Charron]

> For a variety of reasons I want a relational database for Linux.  As far
as I
> know my choices are
> MySQL  (which has huge and confusing doc)
> Oracle 8i (which has a huge and confusing download)
> DB2 (which has an advertized download that I can't find)
> Postgress (which appears to have no doc whatsoever).
> What are you folks using, if anything ?  What's good what's bad ?
> My needs are so modest that I might just do what I need in C and be done
with
> it, but I'd like to have a real database engine just because.
> Besides, this seems like a nice discussion topic for this group.

Really, it all depends on what you want to do with it.  Each one has +'s
and -'s.  First, obviously, is do you want to pay?  ;-P  Oracle is *GREAT*,
but using it in a production environment is *extremely* expensive.  So the
pay issue decides on Oracle/DB2 vs Postgres/MySQL.  Second question is, how
important is speed versus performance.  These sound like the same, but
they're not.  MySQL can toast Postgress at times, but doesn;t support (yet
in a standard distro) row locking, etc, very well..  MySQL I also found to
be much easier to maintain and administer then Postgress.


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Hacked. Reporting?

[Thomas Charron]

  I have an interesting question for everyone.  As of friday, my machine was 
hacked.  Not a problem, I caught it fairly easily.  I did do something that 
most people probrably do *NOT* do.  I fixed the prob that allowed him to get 
in, but I'm continuing to allow him to run rampent in the account he isn't 
aware that I know exists.  His app that is giving him access is currently 
running it's merry little but off..

  Basically, he's running a distributed attack daemon, being controlled via an 
eggdrop bot, connected to IRC.  In the process of looking at the logs, etc, I 
now have a fairly *VAST* amount of knowledge regarding this little bugger, 
along with other sites he's hacked from, who have the same hole in them.  The 
question is..

  What can I *DO* with all this data?  I've now started to monitor the output 
logs from the stupid eggdrop hack, currently running as 'netserver', which is, 
or course, currently connected to EFNet.  I have tcpsnoop logging all of the 
data coming into that application.  Technically, right now I could hijack this 
twinks network, becouse he's ordering it by using public chat commands.  I've 
seen them come.  He occasionally ftp's into the box to check to ensure the 
account is still valid.  I'm looking at this $%@#^&$%@&@$%*&.

  Now I know, leaving my box open is dangerouse.  But I can wipe this box 
without much of an effort.  I won't lose anything.

  But damned it, I want this little &$*%#^&#%&&#%^*#%^()&(%^.

  Any suggestions?  He currently has hacked at least 24 other machines, running 
simular apps, running on the same server.  He's using a package available at 
http://www.punk.uk.net/botpack1.3.tgz, which looks like a standard IRC bot hack 
setup.  I intend on informing the other machine administrators that he's 
broken, but for now, I'm logging it with all my might.

  Frusteratingly yours..

  One *VERY PO'd* individual..


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Re: Opening a Serial Port from User Space

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Brian Boerner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> I'm trying to open the serial port from the command line.
> I'm looking for a utility similar to tip.
> i.e.
> tip /dev/tty0
> I've searched a couple of sites, but everything I find
> deals with opening it from within a program.
> Anyone know of a utility to do this?

  You mean attacking STDIN/STDOUT to the actual COM port?

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Re: What would this do to our LUGS and the Open Source Community?

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Rich Payne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> There was a court case several years ago now where the USPS succesfully
> sued a company for using either UPS or Fedex to carry all of their mail
> instead of just the "High Priority" type mail/packages. It seems that the
> USPS has a charter (don't know if that's the right term) to carry the mail
> of the people of the US.

  Yea, the USPS has alot of power.  For instance, no carrier can charge less 
then 3x more then the USPS charges for an equiv. service.  Kinda funny.  ;-P

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Re: Linux 20k Socket Challenge

[Thomas Charron]

From: Derek Martin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux 20k Socket Challenge
> > Basically, it revolves around the Linux kernel, and adding the
> > capability for a very large number of simo IP connections.  We need to
> > be able to have a linux box support up to and hopefully over 20k simo
> > TCP connections.
> Just out of curiosity, what on earth for?

  Instant messaging.  This situation lends itself more twards many, little
used sockets, then using UDP.  And the overhead of TCP, while reducing
buffer size, is less then or equal to that of an application transfering
fairly large packets via UDP.

> Well, I have no idea if this will be useful, but...
> There's a socket option for the buffer size... But by reducing it you
> could run into performance issues.  The options are SO_SNDBUF and
> SO_RCVBUF.  See the socket(7) man page for details.
> Be aware that when you call setsockopt(2) with the buffer size, the Linux
> kernel will likely set the size to 2 x the specified size.  Why it does
> this, I have no idea.  To check the buffer sizes, use getsockopt(2) with
> the same socket options.
> Incidentally, the man page also reveals that the default (system-wide)
> value for the buffer is set by the wmem_default sysctl, so you could set
> that.

  Yep, after more investigation, that's what we discovered.  The system wide
setting is the one we wanted.  We're not concerned with the performance
isues, becouse these are little used sockets.  When I say little used, they
are used regularly, but nor for transfering 'much' data.  Coupla K a minute
perhaps..  After further reading, I actually learned quite a deal regarding
buffer wise, and dynamic sizing of buffer windows..  The only thing lacking
is a dynamic shrinking of the buffers..  The other interesting thing we
found is, many Linux distros ship their wmem_default and rmem_default at
32k.  Redhat ships them at 64k..  ;-P


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Re: Linux 20k Socket Challenge

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting "Karl J. Runge" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> How much RAM usage for 20K sockets would be acceptable to you?

  Under 100 Megs by the kernel itself..  ;-P

> Back in 1998 I saw a talk by David S. Miller where he said he was
> optimizing (speed and memory usage) the Linux networking code and was
> doing tests with 40K sockets (likely over loopback but I don't know for
> sure).  He may have been optimizing memory consumption for TIME_WAIT or
> CLOSE_WAIT connections (e.g. http), which won't help you if I
> understand your application (your connections stay up for a long time,
> like,
> well, say, telnet).
> Also, would setsockopt(2) for SO_SNDBUF and SO_RCVBUF (or something
> else) be of use? I wrote some grotty code that calls getsockopt() and
> it suggests for SOL_SOCKET these buffers are 65535 (kernel 2.2.14)...
> I see this number in /usr/include/linux/skbuff.h, but it is likely I
> made some mistake, if you play with getsockopt let me know what you
> find.

  Actually, after some digging and some pointers, it appears that the 
send/receieve buffer size is configurable via /proc/sys/net/core/wmem_default 
and /proc/sys/net/core/rmem_default.  I can also set the max size for these, to 
make then 'smaller' max size.  I've tested it down to 4k, from 64k..  ;-P  Alot 
of this data is contained in /usr/src/linux/Documentation/net/ip-sysctl.txt (or 
something along those lines).  Really interesting stuff.  I'd like to know why, 
if the kernel can dynamically adjust the size needed by a socket, it's default 
and max are set to 64k.

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Linux 20k Socket Challenge

[Thomas Charron]

  Guys, I have a question that some here may be able to assist with.  
Basically, it revolves around the Linux kernel, and adding the capability for a 
very large number of simo IP connections.  We need to be able to have a linux 
box support up to and hopefully over 20k simo TCP connections.  You can see a 
copy of the challange we've issues at http://jabber.org/article/34.html.  The 
biggest issue here is, we'd like to try to decrease the amount of RAM required 
to host this many sockets.  Nearly every other OS we've compiled and tested on 
can do it.  Basically, we have many persistant sockets, all of which are, for 
the most part, idle.  Yes, I know, UDP, etc, instead, we've all had the 
arguments.  For now, the persistant sockets are required.  The question ends up 
being, can we make a Linux kernel support 20k TCP connections, without 
requiring the kernel to consuming anywhere from 400 Megs to over a gig of ram?  
Is it possible to decrease the size of the buffers a given socket uses, and 
hence, decrease the required memory?

  Feel free to give me any input, and I can forward it on to the rest of the 
team, or send it directly to the email address on the above noted web page..

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Re: Two Questions (NT Server) and (Linux Numbers).

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Greg Kettmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Question 1 - I've a friend trying to dual boot Linux (multiple flavors)
> and M$ NT Server.  He can't get this going.  Are others doing this?
> That is, is it possible?  I've done a lot of dual boot with Windows
> 95/98 but wanted to verify that Windows NT Server was doable.  Thanks.

  Very possible.  Basically, install LILO on the partition Linux is residing 
on, and point the NT boot loader to it.  Basically, do this:

  In lilo.conf, point the boot= entry to the place where linux resides.  On my 
box, the lilo.conf entry is boot=/dev/hda3

  From Linux, do this: dd if=/dev/hda3 of=/bootsect.lnx bs=512 count=1.  
Replace hda3 with where Linux is.  Basically, this rips the boot record that 
lilo just installed on /dev/hda3 to a small file.

  Something, be it floppy, or disk copy, get this file (bootsect.lnx) to the NT 
box.  Place it in the root of C.

  Load NT.  Execute this command: attrib -s -r c:\boot.ini.  Now open up 
boot.ini in a text editor, such as notepad or the such.  It'll look something 
like:

[boot loader]
timeout=5
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINNT
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINNT="Windows NT Workstation ...
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINNT="Windows NT Workstation ...

  Add this line to the end:

C:\BOOTSECT.LNX="Linux"

  If you want Linux to be the default bootup OS, changce the default entry to 
say:

default=C:\BOOTSECT.LNX

  Save your new boot.ini file.  attrib +r +s c:\boot.ini

  Reboot.  You're golden.. ;-P

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Re: Next SLUG Meeting

[Thomas Charron]

    It's really tacky to send out a 
Win32 only mail plugin message to a linux users list.  ;-P
 
From: Rick Petree 
To: GNHLUG General 
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 10:43 
PM
Subject: Next SLUG 
Meeting

Re: SLOC counter?

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting David Roberts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Sorry for the interruption, but...
> Any idea if there is a open/share based SLOC (Source Lines Of
> Code) counter function?  I have a relatively new manager who
> came in from a MIL contractor and they eat/live/breath this
> kind of stuff (yup, I've been there already - and I totally
> pissed off one manager when I went and reduced the count on a
> project  ;)

  Kill him, now, before the disease spreads..  ;-P

> Anyway, I did a quick check of Linuxberg and a couple other
> sites, but no luck.  So, before I go out and write one I was
> wondering if anyone in the group knew of a counter already out
> there in Penguin land (script/rpm/compilable source, I really
> don't care at this point)...


 (C and C++ Code Counter) is a simple command line tool which parses files 
in the supported languages and builds a set of reports in HTML of numeric 
measurements (metrics) on those files. Metrics are divided into three groups. 
Procedural metrics include lines of code, lines of comment and McCabe's 
cyclomatic complexity. Metrics of OO design (proposed by Chidamber and Kemerer) 
include depth of inheritance tree, number of children, coupling between 
objects, and weighted methods per class. Structural metrics (based on the work 
of Henry and Kafura), include fan-in, fan-out and information flow.
http://www.fste.ac.cowan.edu.au/~tlittlef/

Resource Standard Metrics
RSM performs metrics and quality checks on C, C++ and Java source code and 
creates reports in HTML format. File names are hyper-linked for simple code 
browsing when an error is found. It performs metrics differentials between code 
base lines and identifies which files have changed (code line percent), been 
removed or added, and remained the same. It also enforces style, checks for 
errors that compilers miss, and determines metrics such as Lines of Code, 
effective lines of code, complexity, comment content, key word content, and C 
to C++ compatibility.
http://msquaredtechnologies.com/

  Those where two I had bookmarked offhand, but I have never used them 
myself..  Hope it helps..  Be forwarned, metrics *CAN* be usefull, but not as a 
rule, merely as one metric of many.  Good KLOC's can be a very misleading thing.

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Re: dhcpd

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Rich Payne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Does anyone know how to make dhcpd not listen/answer on a given
> interface? I
> was playing around with it last night and though I had everything setup ok
> but then read the logs and saw it watching and answering on the cable
> interface (telling the user there was no addresses left! not good).

  When you start dhcpd, specify the interface names you want it to listen on as 
a command line paramater.  If none are specified, it listens on all of them.

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Re: The GNHLUG meeting Tonight

[Thomas Charron]

Perhaps if we had a list of 'backup' speakers, who could basically 'pull
something out or their rear ends' based on what they are currently working
on.  I unfortionatly, didn't get the email untill later in the afternoon,
but I could have at least done a presentation on this months Linux Journal
cover story, Jabber..  Perhaps a listing of 'emergency speakers' which could
give their phone numbers?

From: Benjamin Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The GNHLUG meeting Tonight 
>   And I am sorry to say that some of us work for a living, don't have the
> opportunity to check our email for cancelations all day long, and wasted a
> considerable amount of time waiting for a meeting that didn't happen.  And
no,
> I wasn't the only one.  And yes, I'm in a bad mood.
>   Since I don't want to be *entirely* unproductive in this message... how
> about a volentary register of people's phone number(s), maintained on an
> opt-in basis, so that organizers can provide active notification in the
event
> that a similar screw^H^H^H^H^H occurance happens again?  I would be happy
to
> maintain such a list and play phone tag for everyone, if for no other
reason
> then it would at least ensure I get notified in the future.



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Re: hrm...ports!

[Thomas Charron]

> And while this shows the couple of machines that I've ssh'd TO (remote
> port 22), it doesn't list my sshd which is bound to my local port 22.
> Why is that?

netstat will list the local service name if it is listed in the servives
file.  instead, grep for ssh.  Here's mine:

[twolf@rune twolf]$ netstat -l | grep ssh
tcp0  0 *:ssh   *:* LISTEN
[twolf@rune twolf]$

:ssh is the plain text for the port 'name'.  Using -n along with it
elimintaes the usage of port 'names':

[twolf@rune twolf]$ netstat -ln | grep 22
tcp0  0 0.0.0.0:22  0.0.0.0:*   LISTEN
[twolf@rune twolf]$

-n unfortionatly, also makes the display not show host names, but
instead, actual IP's.


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Re: hrm...ports!

[Thomas Charron]

I'm betting that vbox isn't actually listening to it.  I'm betting that
it was installed in inetd.conf, whitch is launching it.  Some RPM's
automatically add entires there when you install them, and vbox tends to be
one of those that gets installed 'behind yer back', ever if you don't
support ISDN..

> Have you tried "lsof|grep 20012"? It doesn't always work but alot of the
> time it will tell you exactly what program is listening on that port.
> = Adam =



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Re: GNHLUG List[s] [Slackware Users?]

[Thomas Charron]

>   It varies *a lot*.  Sometimes, several days go by with only a message or
> two.  At the other end of the spectrum, we have seen over 100 messages/day
> before

Yea, but you guys made me and Paul promise not to get into realtime
conversations over the list from work several years ago..  ;-P


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Re: hrm...ports!

[Thomas Charron]

Strait from /etc/services:

vboxd   20012/tcp   # voice box system
vboxd   20012/udp   # voice box system

Now as to if that's what's actually USING that port, who knows..

- Original Message -
From: Kurth Bemis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 8:00 AM
Subject: hrm...ports!


> i was fooling around with nmap on my debian 2.1 box and did a large port
> scan...i scanned from port 1 to 65535...all the normal ports were/are open
> pop/smtp/http etc..  then i saw something interestingport 20012 was
> open.  i telnet'ed to it and got this
>
> Trying 127.0.0.1...
> Connected to localhost.
> Escape character is '^]'.
> 589 Can't read access list (No such file or directory). Goodbye!
> 281 .
> Connection closed by foreign host.
>
> as far as i know there shouldn't be anything on that port.  I checked out
> all the normal places...inetd, rcx.d every for something that might
> indicate a deamon or something on that port.nothing.does anyone
> have any ideas?
>
> ~kurth
> Kurth Bemis - Network/Systems Administrator, USAExpress.net/Ozone Computer
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.usaexpress.net/kurth
> ICQ - 6624050
> Call Sign - N1TYW
> PGP key available - http://www.usaexpress.net/kurth/pgp
>
> Fight Weak Encryption!  Donate your wasted CPU cycles to Distributed.net
> (http://www.distributed.net)
>
>
>
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Re: modprobe Vs. insmod

[Thomas Charron]

Some modules require things that are provided by other modules.
modprobe loads all required modules, and insmod doesn't.  Simple enough..
;-P  If you do a modprobe, you'll notice that most likely there is at least
one other module that has the module you loaded in the 'used by'.  If you
then instead insmod the needed modules, and THEN the module you where
attempting to load, they load fine..  And example is many of the card
specific modules, in my case emu10k1.  Nearly all of the sound drivers also
require a module named soundcore.  soundcore provides symbols required by
the sound driver.  If it is not loaded first, then the insmod fails.  In the
case of modprobe, it sees that the sound driver requires symbols provided
for by soundcore, and loads soundcore first.

- Original Message -
From: Kenneth E. Lussier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, August 11, 2000 10:46 PM
Subject: modprobe Vs. insmod


> All,
>
> I have never seen this before, but I'm betting someone else
> has I built a kernel, and none of the modules load at boot
> time. Not unusual, since they aren't really needed. However, if I
> use insmod to try to load them, then I get a list of unresolved
> symbols. But, if I use modprobe, they load with no complaints.
> Does anyone know why this is?



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Re: Gnome enlightenment

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Niall Kavanagh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> On Wed, 9 Aug 2000, Jeffry Smith wrote:
> > about KDE).  Also, Gnome doesn't have the licensing conflicts that KDE
> > does (even the new Open Source QT).
> At the risk of starting a licensing flame war, can you detail where the
> open source QT license is lacking? Not a leading question I assure you! ;)

  It's not that it's lacking at all.  It's just that the QPL isn't compatible 
with GPL.  It's a sticky situtation, that probrably will not be solved anytime 
soon.  QT is indeed 'Free Software'.  Nothing wrong with the licence at all.

--- 
Thomas Charron
<< Wanted: One decent sig >>
<< Preferably litle used  >>
<< and stored in garage.  ?>>

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Re: floppy spanning

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Tom Rauschenbach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> This has gotta be a FAQ, but I can't find it.  What utilities are out there
> that can write a single tgz file that is bigger than a floppy to multiple
> floppies ?  I need to move a 1.5 meg binary from one machine to another and
> sneaker net is my only option.

  man split

  On the other side, once both parts are copied, (taking into consideration 
file names are a1 and a2):

  cat a2 >> a1

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Re: ABC News article on Linux and Bugs..

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Cole Tuininga <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> First of all, congratulations to Mission Critical.  According to the
> article, you folks are not only shipping a linux dist of your own, it's
> doing as well as Red Hat!  Congrats!  
> (*walks off grumbling about journalists who don't research before
> writing*)
> (*comes back after a minute*)
> Is there a source at ABC that can be written to so as to offer some
> corrected information?  I didn't see anything in the article...

  I wasn't able to find one after preliminary searches of other articles, 
etc..  I personally wanted to point out the same thing that Niall had said 
earlier, in that many of the bugs in Microsoft based 'equivilent' products, 
such as IIS, etc, total many, MANY more then those of Linux.

--- 
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Re: ABC News article on Linux and Bugs..

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Niall Kavanagh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> On Wed, 2 Aug 2000, Thomas Charron wrote:
> One point I never see mentioned:
> Microsoft vulnerabilirties are just that -- Microsoft's.
> Any app that runs on on Linux or distributed with Redhat/Turbo etc. is
> counted as a "Linux vulnerabilty".
> If one were to lump in all the other Win32 apps with vulnerabilities I'm
> sure you'd come up with a greater number than 99 (number of reported
> Bugtraq MS vul) or even 122 (number for all linux apps).
> Bottom line, neither OS is inherently insecure, it's the apps and cruft on
> top of them, like Sendmail, IIS, ActiveX etc.

  I actually just noticed that MS actually has a seperate bugtraq catagory for 
IIS, while Linux is one general entry, including Apache bugs on Linux.   ;-P

--- 
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ABC News article on Linux and Bugs..

[Thomas Charron]

  I found this article interesting.  Misleading as hell, but interesting, 
nontheless..

  I would like to see a site that publishes the Bugtraq lists to refute them, 
anyone have a URL?  I think the biggest thing that is 'missing' here is that 
RedHat's bugs most probrably include all apps published *WITH* the operating 
system, versus NT's, which strickly list OS vulnerabilities..

http://www.abcnews.go.com/sections/tech/FredMoody/moody.html
--- 
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Re: Linux Firewalls

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
> Is the firewall topic going to be on next month's agenda?  I hope so, cause
> I'm very interested in this issue.  I've read some material about a  Linux
> based firewall app "Fireplug".  Has anyone heard of this, and if so, would
> you recommend it.  You can get an evaluation copy at www.edge.fireplug.net.
> The blurb on the software from the site is:  "This software will allow you
> to turn a very minimally configured consumer PC (you know that old 486,
> currently being used as a doorstop) into a basic stand alone Internet
> firewall, complete with address translation, proxying, and IP packet
> forwarding."  I'm thinking of using a Dell PII 266 with 2.1 gig as a PC
> dedicated to a firewall; is this sufficient?  I was considering using an
> IBM Pentium 133 with 1.1 gig, but thought the processor was too slow and
> would create a bottleneck to get info to/from the internet on a SMALL
> network - are my concerns valid or is this P133 sufficient? and you can get
> a one month evaluaation copy).

  This is basically a repackage of a stock Linux kernel, with a whole lot of 
network card drivers, and ipchains.  I wouldn't pay a dime for it, becouse 
*ANY* distro out there can handle this just fine.

  As far as the hardware requirments, I have a 486/33 with 8 megs RAM serving 
up my home network, doing exactly what your talking about, booting from a 
floppy created by http://www.coyotelinux.com/coyote.html

  They have two versions, basically, a 'Free version', and a for charge 
version.  The charge version is actually a Win32 app that asks you a series of 
configuration questions, and makes your boot disk directly from a Win32 box.  
The Free version is the same thing, but it's only 'automation' is basically a 
shell script that does the same exact thing..

--- 
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Perl whois interface..

[Thomas Charron]

I deleted the mail for someone who was requesting a Web interface to
whois.  There are two ways.  The easiest would be http://bw.org/whois/ which
provides a built in CGI abity in perl.  The second would be to extend a CGI
script using Net::Whois.

>From the whois perl at bw.org documentation:

Automatic CGI Support

BW whois works as a CGI program without modification. You can
create your own look by using an external HTML file named
whois.html, but that is completely optional. It works fine as-
is.

The external HTML file will need a few simple "placeholders" in
it. The placeholders are replaced at runtime with the various
values which make this work. These placeholders are represented
by text enclosed in '$' signs like this: $PLACEHOLDER$

The placeholders are described here:

$SELF$
The URI path of the program on your web server, taken from
the value of the SCRIPT_NAME environment variable.

$DOMAIN$
The domain that was last looked up, if any.

$RESULT$
The result of the whois query from BW whois.

To supress the disclaimer text in the output (like --
stripheader) add a hidden field named stripheadere like this:

`'

You can get an example file from the program with:

`whois --makehtml > whois.html'


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Re: Printing to NT

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Tom Laurie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

  Look at smbprint.  It's a script that you can use to print to a Windows 
shared printer, and is used via lpr..

> I am trying to print to a printer which is shared on a windows 2000 server,
> but am having no luck.
> I set up a queue using Red Hat printtool, trying first with SMB and second
> with Remote.  Never could make a connection using either one.  Anybody got
> any ideas?

--- 
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Re: Cable Modem DHCP Question

[Thomas Charron]

> A friend here has it set up.
> He says that when he set it up, by default Mandrake tried to use dhcpcd
> and that it didn't work at all for him.  He used pump instead.

Wow, that's interested.  I've heard more people having issues with pump,
and replacing it with dhcpcd then the other way around..


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Re: Telnet and SSH (was: Worrisome messages)

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Kurth Bemis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Keene State College's sites were owned that waythough the telnet 
> daemonfunny thing is...they still have it openlook at additron.org 
> for a mirror of the hacked page.  I think that its still there...

  In their case, they had several things coming, having a non shadowed password 
file and all..  ;-P


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Re: AOL Instant Messenger for Linux?

[Thomas Charron]

> >  > I read recently about someone who had put together an
> >  > AIM compatible *server*. Since this would be perfect for
> >  > customer service, I am trying to find the reference.
> >  > Anybody have this one? I thought I saw it in a recent Linux
> >  > mag, but haven't run across it yet. It supposedly works with
> >  > AIM, ICQ, & some others.
> >  Are you thinking of Jabber? Jabber is supposed to be a more general
> >  instant messenger server, with hooks into ICQ, aim, yahoo, and IRC,
among
> >  others.
> Yes, jabber appears to be the system I read about.
> I am now looking at it for some nonprofits, who want their
> own server, and also to suggest to some commercial companies
> for customer support. This looks like something that Mission
> Critical Linux, Linuxcare, or VA Linux could use also.
> Users register into the system. Each company has their own
> support messaging server, which they control, and can have
> high speed connections to, on their own network.

Actually, many entities are using it for just that.  But don't get it to
confused.  Jabber isn't an AIM compatible *server* really, we merely have a
system where everything is a resource, including gateways to other networks.

  On a side note, if you're more interested in Jabber, or *anyone* is for
that matter, feel free to fire emails my way.  I promise I won't respond
with 6 duplicates again..  ;-P  I'm one of the developers on the project.
You'll notice me at
http://docs.jabber.org/draft-miller-impp-jabber-00.html#anchor27 third name
down..  ;-P

  (Ok, so that was just an ego plug, but hey, this is open source, gotta get
the kicks somehow..)

>
> In the rescheduled firewall meeting in August, this is one of the
> questions we will ask. How well does a firewall pass things
> like ICQ, AIM, IRC, jabber, etc.
>
> Bob Sparks
> Linux guru wannabe
>
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Re: Jabber

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting "Kenneth E. Lussier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Thomas Charron wrote:
> > At this point, I'd like to point out that there is an Open Source
> > instant messaging system at http://www.jabber.org/
> At this point, I would like to point out that Tom is getting repetitive
> in his old age ;-)

  Bah..  Apperently Outlook decided it really needed to make a point.  ;-P

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Jabber

[Thomas Charron]

At this point, I'd like to point out that there is an Open Source
instant messaging system at http://www.jabber.org/

To quote our opening page:

Welcome to Jabber.org! Join us at the O'Reilly Open Source Convention! See
the announcement for details.

Jabber is an instant messaging System, similar to ICQ or AIM, yet far
different. It is open source, absolutely free, simple, fast, extensible,
modularized, cross platform, and created with the future in mind. Jabber has
been designed from the ground up to serve the needs of the end user, satisfy
business demands, and maintain compatibility with other messaging systems.

To explain a bit on the 'compatible' part, Jabber is mostly geared on an
open namespace by using an addressing system simular to email.  JID's
(Jabber ID's) are user@server based.  It also addresses the idea of a
resource, aka, you may be you at home, or you at work, or heck, you on your
cell phone.  I won't go further, becouse this could go on for hours, but we
end up merging the two together, which means [EMAIL PROTECTED]/AIM can map
to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  aim.jabber.org is a 'AIM gateway', which
basically will connect to AIM for you, and serve as a gateway between your
presence within jabber, and your presence within AIM.

We currently have these gateway transports implemented:
yahoo-transport
aim-transport
icq-transport
msn-transport
irc-transport

In addition to these, there are also several utitlity transports that
have been implemented, such as rss-agent (serves up syndicated news to your
client), Stock ticker agents, etc, all in variouse stages of development.

We have API's implemented for Perl, Python, C, C++, and at least one
implementation based on COM for Win32 systems.

If you have any questions, go check out http://docs.jabber.org which
contains many of the user and developer overviews, along with links to the
general XML DTD used within the communication protocol.  Our submition to
the IETF is at http://docs.jabber.org/draft-miller-impp-jabber-00.html which
is the proposed protocol for the Internet Messaging and Presence Protocol.

- Original Message -
From: Bruce McCulley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Greg Kettmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: AOL Instant Messenger for Linux?


> In addition to the other pointers, check out everybuddy.com
>
> I've just started a new job where IM is the communications facility of
> choice, using M$  and Yahoo IM clients, and one of the other software
> engineers recommended everybuddy as a client for Linux.  I don't have
> enough experience to comment on it yet.
>
> --Bruce McCulley
>
> Greg Kettmann wrote:
>
> > It seems to me that I read about an AIM compatible client for Linux.
> > Could someone provide the proper pointers or suggestions?  Thanks.  GGK
> >
> > **
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Jabber

[Thomas Charron]

At this point, I'd like to point out that there is an Open Source
instant messaging system at http://www.jabber.org/

To quote our opening page:

Welcome to Jabber.org! Join us at the O'Reilly Open Source Convention! See
the announcement for details.

Jabber is an instant messaging System, similar to ICQ or AIM, yet far
different. It is open source, absolutely free, simple, fast, extensible,
modularized, cross platform, and created with the future in mind. Jabber has
been designed from the ground up to serve the needs of the end user, satisfy
business demands, and maintain compatibility with other messaging systems.

To explain a bit on the 'compatible' part, Jabber is mostly geared on an
open namespace by using an addressing system simular to email.  JID's
(Jabber ID's) are user@server based.  It also addresses the idea of a
resource, aka, you may be you at home, or you at work, or heck, you on your
cell phone.  I won't go further, becouse this could go on for hours, but we
end up merging the two together, which means [EMAIL PROTECTED]/AIM can map
to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  aim.jabber.org is a 'AIM gateway', which
basically will connect to AIM for you, and serve as a gateway between your
presence within jabber, and your presence within AIM.

We currently have these gateway transports implemented:
yahoo-transport
aim-transport
icq-transport
msn-transport
irc-transport

In addition to these, there are also several utitlity transports that
have been implemented, such as rss-agent (serves up syndicated news to your
client), Stock ticker agents, etc, all in variouse stages of development.

We have API's implemented for Perl, Python, C, C++, and at least one
implementation based on COM for Win32 systems.

If you have any questions, go check out http://docs.jabber.org which
contains many of the user and developer overviews, along with links to the
general XML DTD used within the communication protocol.  Our submition to
the IETF is at http://docs.jabber.org/draft-miller-impp-jabber-00.html which
is the proposed protocol for the Internet Messaging and Presence Protocol.

- Original Message -
From: Bruce McCulley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Greg Kettmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: AOL Instant Messenger for Linux?


> In addition to the other pointers, check out everybuddy.com
>
> I've just started a new job where IM is the communications facility of
> choice, using M$  and Yahoo IM clients, and one of the other software
> engineers recommended everybuddy as a client for Linux.  I don't have
> enough experience to comment on it yet.
>
> --Bruce McCulley
>
> Greg Kettmann wrote:
>
> > It seems to me that I read about an AIM compatible client for Linux.
> > Could someone provide the proper pointers or suggestions?  Thanks.  GGK
> >
> > **
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>
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Jabber

[Thomas Charron]

At this point, I'd like to point out that there is an Open Source
instant messaging system at http://www.jabber.org/

To quote our opening page:

Welcome to Jabber.org! Join us at the O'Reilly Open Source Convention! See
the announcement for details.

Jabber is an instant messaging System, similar to ICQ or AIM, yet far
different. It is open source, absolutely free, simple, fast, extensible,
modularized, cross platform, and created with the future in mind. Jabber has
been designed from the ground up to serve the needs of the end user, satisfy
business demands, and maintain compatibility with other messaging systems.

To explain a bit on the 'compatible' part, Jabber is mostly geared on an
open namespace by using an addressing system simular to email.  JID's
(Jabber ID's) are user@server based.  It also addresses the idea of a
resource, aka, you may be you at home, or you at work, or heck, you on your
cell phone.  I won't go further, becouse this could go on for hours, but we
end up merging the two together, which means [EMAIL PROTECTED]/AIM can map
to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  aim.jabber.org is a 'AIM gateway', which
basically will connect to AIM for you, and serve as a gateway between your
presence within jabber, and your presence within AIM.

We currently have these gateway transports implemented:
yahoo-transport
aim-transport
icq-transport
msn-transport
irc-transport

In addition to these, there are also several utitlity transports that
have been implemented, such as rss-agent (serves up syndicated news to your
client), Stock ticker agents, etc, all in variouse stages of development.

We have API's implemented for Perl, Python, C, C++, and at least one
implementation based on COM for Win32 systems.

If you have any questions, go check out http://docs.jabber.org which
contains many of the user and developer overviews, along with links to the
general XML DTD used within the communication protocol.  Our submition to
the IETF is at http://docs.jabber.org/draft-miller-impp-jabber-00.html which
is the proposed protocol for the Internet Messaging and Presence Protocol.

- Original Message -
From: Bruce McCulley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Greg Kettmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: AOL Instant Messenger for Linux?


> In addition to the other pointers, check out everybuddy.com
>
> I've just started a new job where IM is the communications facility of
> choice, using M$  and Yahoo IM clients, and one of the other software
> engineers recommended everybuddy as a client for Linux.  I don't have
> enough experience to comment on it yet.
>
> --Bruce McCulley
>
> Greg Kettmann wrote:
>
> > It seems to me that I read about an AIM compatible client for Linux.
> > Could someone provide the proper pointers or suggestions?  Thanks.  GGK
> >
> > **
> > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the following text in the
> > *body* (*not* the subject line) of the letter:
> > unsubscribe gnhlug
> > **
>
>
> **
> To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
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>


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Jabber

[Thomas Charron]

At this point, I'd like to point out that there is an Open Source
instant messaging system at http://www.jabber.org/

To quote our opening page:

Welcome to Jabber.org! Join us at the O'Reilly Open Source Convention! See
the announcement for details.

Jabber is an instant messaging System, similar to ICQ or AIM, yet far
different. It is open source, absolutely free, simple, fast, extensible,
modularized, cross platform, and created with the future in mind. Jabber has
been designed from the ground up to serve the needs of the end user, satisfy
business demands, and maintain compatibility with other messaging systems.

To explain a bit on the 'compatible' part, Jabber is mostly geared on an
open namespace by using an addressing system simular to email.  JID's
(Jabber ID's) are user@server based.  It also addresses the idea of a
resource, aka, you may be you at home, or you at work, or heck, you on your
cell phone.  I won't go further, becouse this could go on for hours, but we
end up merging the two together, which means [EMAIL PROTECTED]/AIM can map
to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  aim.jabber.org is a 'AIM gateway', which
basically will connect to AIM for you, and serve as a gateway between your
presence within jabber, and your presence within AIM.

We currently have these gateway transports implemented:
yahoo-transport
aim-transport
icq-transport
msn-transport
irc-transport

In addition to these, there are also several utitlity transports that
have been implemented, such as rss-agent (serves up syndicated news to your
client), Stock ticker agents, etc, all in variouse stages of development.

We have API's implemented for Perl, Python, C, C++, and at least one
implementation based on COM for Win32 systems.

If you have any questions, go check out http://docs.jabber.org which
contains many of the user and developer overviews, along with links to the
general XML DTD used within the communication protocol.  Our submition to
the IETF is at http://docs.jabber.org/draft-miller-impp-jabber-00.html which
is the proposed protocol for the Internet Messaging and Presence Protocol.

- Original Message -
From: Bruce McCulley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Greg Kettmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: AOL Instant Messenger for Linux?


> In addition to the other pointers, check out everybuddy.com
>
> I've just started a new job where IM is the communications facility of
> choice, using M$  and Yahoo IM clients, and one of the other software
> engineers recommended everybuddy as a client for Linux.  I don't have
> enough experience to comment on it yet.
>
> --Bruce McCulley
>
> Greg Kettmann wrote:
>
> > It seems to me that I read about an AIM compatible client for Linux.
> > Could someone provide the proper pointers or suggestions?  Thanks.  GGK
> >
> > **
> > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the following text in the
> > *body* (*not* the subject line) of the letter:
> > unsubscribe gnhlug
> > **
>
>
> **
> To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the following text in the
> *body* (*not* the subject line) of the letter:
> unsubscribe gnhlug
> **
>


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Jabber

[Thomas Charron]

At this point, I'd like to point out that there is an Open Source
instant messaging system at http://www.jabber.org/

To quote our opening page:

Welcome to Jabber.org! Join us at the O'Reilly Open Source Convention! See
the announcement for details.

Jabber is an instant messaging System, similar to ICQ or AIM, yet far
different. It is open source, absolutely free, simple, fast, extensible,
modularized, cross platform, and created with the future in mind. Jabber has
been designed from the ground up to serve the needs of the end user, satisfy
business demands, and maintain compatibility with other messaging systems.

To explain a bit on the 'compatible' part, Jabber is mostly geared on an
open namespace by using an addressing system simular to email.  JID's
(Jabber ID's) are user@server based.  It also addresses the idea of a
resource, aka, you may be you at home, or you at work, or heck, you on your
cell phone.  I won't go further, becouse this could go on for hours, but we
end up merging the two together, which means [EMAIL PROTECTED]/AIM can map
to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  aim.jabber.org is a 'AIM gateway', which
basically will connect to AIM for you, and serve as a gateway between your
presence within jabber, and your presence within AIM.

We currently have these gateway transports implemented:
yahoo-transport
aim-transport
icq-transport
msn-transport
irc-transport

In addition to these, there are also several utitlity transports that
have been implemented, such as rss-agent (serves up syndicated news to your
client), Stock ticker agents, etc, all in variouse stages of development.

We have API's implemented for Perl, Python, C, C++, and at least one
implementation based on COM for Win32 systems.

If you have any questions, go check out http://docs.jabber.org which
contains many of the user and developer overviews, along with links to the
general XML DTD used within the communication protocol.  Our submition to
the IETF is at http://docs.jabber.org/draft-miller-impp-jabber-00.html which
is the proposed protocol for the Internet Messaging and Presence Protocol.

- Original Message -
From: Bruce McCulley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Greg Kettmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: AOL Instant Messenger for Linux?


> In addition to the other pointers, check out everybuddy.com
>
> I've just started a new job where IM is the communications facility of
> choice, using M$  and Yahoo IM clients, and one of the other software
> engineers recommended everybuddy as a client for Linux.  I don't have
> enough experience to comment on it yet.
>
> --Bruce McCulley
>
> Greg Kettmann wrote:
>
> > It seems to me that I read about an AIM compatible client for Linux.
> > Could someone provide the proper pointers or suggestions?  Thanks.  GGK
> >
> > **
> > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the following text in the
> > *body* (*not* the subject line) of the letter:
> > unsubscribe gnhlug
> > **
>
>
> **
> To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the following text in the
> *body* (*not* the subject line) of the letter:
> unsubscribe gnhlug
> **
>


**
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Jabber

[Thomas Charron]

At this point, I'd like to point out that there is an Open Source
instant messaging system at http://www.jabber.org/

To quote our opening page:

Welcome to Jabber.org! Join us at the O'Reilly Open Source Convention! See
the announcement for details.

Jabber is an instant messaging System, similar to ICQ or AIM, yet far
different. It is open source, absolutely free, simple, fast, extensible,
modularized, cross platform, and created with the future in mind. Jabber has
been designed from the ground up to serve the needs of the end user, satisfy
business demands, and maintain compatibility with other messaging systems.

To explain a bit on the 'compatible' part, Jabber is mostly geared on an
open namespace by using an addressing system simular to email.  JID's
(Jabber ID's) are user@server based.  It also addresses the idea of a
resource, aka, you may be you at home, or you at work, or heck, you on your
cell phone.  I won't go further, becouse this could go on for hours, but we
end up merging the two together, which means [EMAIL PROTECTED]/AIM can map
to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  aim.jabber.org is a 'AIM gateway', which
basically will connect to AIM for you, and serve as a gateway between your
presence within jabber, and your presence within AIM.

We currently have these gateway transports implemented:
yahoo-transport
aim-transport
icq-transport
msn-transport
irc-transport

In addition to these, there are also several utitlity transports that
have been implemented, such as rss-agent (serves up syndicated news to your
client), Stock ticker agents, etc, all in variouse stages of development.

We have API's implemented for Perl, Python, C, C++, and at least one
implementation based on COM for Win32 systems.

If you have any questions, go check out http://docs.jabber.org which
contains many of the user and developer overviews, along with links to the
general XML DTD used within the communication protocol.  Our submition to
the IETF is at http://docs.jabber.org/draft-miller-impp-jabber-00.html which
is the proposed protocol for the Internet Messaging and Presence Protocol.

- Original Message -
From: Bruce McCulley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Greg Kettmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: AOL Instant Messenger for Linux?


> In addition to the other pointers, check out everybuddy.com
>
> I've just started a new job where IM is the communications facility of
> choice, using M$  and Yahoo IM clients, and one of the other software
> engineers recommended everybuddy as a client for Linux.  I don't have
> enough experience to comment on it yet.
>
> --Bruce McCulley
>
> Greg Kettmann wrote:
>
> > It seems to me that I read about an AIM compatible client for Linux.
> > Could someone provide the proper pointers or suggestions?  Thanks.  GGK
> >
> > **
> > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the following text in the
> > *body* (*not* the subject line) of the letter:
> > unsubscribe gnhlug
> > **
>
>
> **
> To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the following text in the
> *body* (*not* the subject line) of the letter:
> unsubscribe gnhlug
> **
>


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MD5 enabled crypt()

[Thomas Charron]

  For the reasonably bored, I just figured out how the MD5 enabled crypt 
function in unix works, and holy ugly.

  Basically, it takes a password and a salt.  It then starts a 1000 iteration 
loop.  It then hashes the result of the hash iterativly, using the sale every 
3rd time, the original password every 7th time, and all other times, use the 
results of the last hash.  Upon further reading, they did this becouse MD5 
hashing isn't slow.  They figured if the implementation required you to do it 
1000 times, it would slow down crack attacks of the resulting hash.

  Useless knowledge I suppose, but I found it interesting.  Ok, hideouse AND 
interesting, but still..  ;-P

--- 
Thomas Charron
<< Wanted: One decent sig >>
<< Preferably litle used  >>
<< and stored in garage.  ?>>

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Re: Fwd: MD5 hash question

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Paul Lussier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Actually, I am using the Crypt-PasswdMD5-1.0 module which is dependant upon
> the Digest::MD5 module.  I'm just not sure how I'd go about creating a 
> password.  Would this suffice:
>   #!/usr/bin/perl 
> 
>   my ($password) = shift;
>   my (@salt) = ('a..z','A..Z','0..9','.','/');# Legal salt characters
> 
>   # need a 12 character salt (according to Niall :)
>   
>   $salt = int(rand(@salt)) . int(rand(@salt)) . int(rand(@salt)) . 
>   int(rand(@salt)) . int(rand(@salt)) . int(rand(@salt)) . 
>   int(rand(@salt)) . int(rand(@salt)) . int(rand(@salt)) . 
>   int(rand(@salt)) . int(rand(@salt)) . int(rand(@salt)) ;
>   $cryptedpassword = unix_md5_crypt($password, $salt); 

  After additional reading, yes, this will work, however, only pass it an 8 
character salt.  The module does a $salt = substr($salt, 0, 8); so providing 
more is useless.  In the case of this module, it's an 8 char salt.


> Creating the salt is what seems to be eluding me.  Somewhere for a normal
> DES/unix password I came up with this algorithm:
>   my (@salt) = ('a..z','A..Z','0..9','.','/');# Legal salt characters
>   $salt = rand(@salt) . rand(@salt);
> Which doesn't seem to make sense, since you want the salt to be a 2
> character 
> string, and rand seems to be returning a float.  Which, if appended
> together, 
> results in a mess.

  I believe that rand(@thing) equates to doing a $thing(rand($#thing)).  In any 
case, yes, this is correct..


> Ironically, it seems to work.  Also, according to the code in the 
> Crypt::PasswdMD5 module, the salt can only be 8 characters.

  Yep, and looking at the source of the module, it only uses 8.  Passing more 
then 8 gets chopped..

> So, I guess at this point, I need to ask, How do I do this :)

  I can now see the confusion.  The crypt that uses MD5 doesn't just use an MD5 
digest.  It uses the digest of the digest recusivly 1000 times.  See this 
snippet from what the module actually does:

for ($i = 0; $i < 1000; $i++) {
$ctx1 = new MD5;
if ($i & 1) { $ctx1->add($pw); }
else { $ctx1->add(substr($final, 0, 16)); }
if ($i % 3) { $ctx1->add($salt); }
if ($i % 7) { $ctx1->add($pw); }
if ($i & 1) { $ctx1->add(substr($final, 0, 16)); }
else { $ctx1->add($pw); }
$final = $ctx1->digest;
}

  Essentually, it's digests it 1000 times, combinging digests of the salt, the 
password, and recursivly itself.  Jesus is it ugly and wicked overkill..  ;-P

  To answer your question, this snippet would work fine:

#!/usr/bin/perl 

my ($password) = shift;
my (@salt) = ('a..z','A..Z','0..9','.','/');# Legal salt characters
my $FullSalt;

for(my $i = 0; $i < 8;$i++)
{   
  $FullSalt .= rand(@salt);
}

$cryptedpassword = unix_md5_crypt($password, $salt); 

  NOT tested, but it's basically the idea that you had earlier..

--- 
Thomas Charron
<< Wanted: One decent sig >>
<< Preferably litle used  >>
<< and stored in garage.  ?>>

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Re: 3d Modeling

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Jeffry Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> This is a followup to Cole's presentation of a 3D modeling sw at the
> May SLUG meeting.  I just found Geomview, which has restarted
> development, apparently (thanks to the power of GPL when the original
> developers abandoned it):
> http://www.geomview.org/
> I'm still working on getting it to actually work, since it appears to
> currently use Motif, and it doesn't use autoconf, so you have to do
> lots of editing of makefiles to match your system.  Looks promising,
> from the screenshots.

  I missed that meeting, but as a note, http://www.linux3d.org/ has many 
reviews/links to 3D modeling packages available for Linux, many under the GPL.  
One of the more promising ones is mindseye.sourceforge.net.  Blender is also a 
*VERY* nice package, if you have time to master the obfuscated UI that it 
uses.  Blender is the inhouse modeler used/written by/for NeoGeo, which they 
opened up several years ago.  For a while, it was free, but limited in 
features, aka, you had to 'buy' additional features, but since June 21st, it's 
all 100% open, as well as some parts being open sourced.  A short list 
of 'features' is located at http://www.blender.nl/complete/index.html  This is 
a perfect case of a situation where a commercial entity opened up an in house 
application, and reaped the rewards from doing so, in the way of plugins, etc.

  They also sell a full color printed manual for it.

--- 
Thomas Charron
<< Wanted: One decent sig >>
<< Preferably litle used  >>
<< and stored in garage.  ?>>

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Re: Linux and Cell phones

[Thomas Charron]

I should also note you're more likely to find it within the US as the
SH888

- Original Message -
From: Thomas Charron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Karl J. Runge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, July 04, 2000 10:51 AM
Subject: Re: Linux and Cell phones


> The best example of a phone with a built in modem would be the
Ericsson
> I888.
>
http://mobile.ericsson.com/spg.asp?template=Product_Page&grid=grid2&Menuleft
>
=menu_left_B&Subheadtext=sh_B1.Xa&Menumid=menu_mid_B&Menusub=menu_mid_sub&Co
> mbo=inc_MobPhoneCombo&ProdId=8881
>   Not only a built in modem, but a built in IR interface, so it talks to a
> laptop/palm by just putting it on the table next to it.  Unfortionatly,
> harder to find in the US, and much more popular overseas.



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Re: Linux and Cell phones

[Thomas Charron]

The best example of a phone with a built in modem would be the Ericsson
I888.


http://mobile.ericsson.com/spg.asp?template=Product_Page&grid=grid2&Menuleft
=menu_left_B&Subheadtext=sh_B1.Xa&Menumid=menu_mid_B&Menusub=menu_mid_sub&Co
mbo=inc_MobPhoneCombo&ProdId=8881

  Not only a built in modem, but a built in IR interface, so it talks to a
laptop/palm by just putting it on the table next to it.  Unfortionatly,
harder to find in the US, and much more popular overseas.

- Original Message -
From: Bruce Dawson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Karl J. Runge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, July 04, 2000 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: Linux and Cell phones


> The only cell phone I'm aware of (with a built-in modem) is the QualComm
> "Thin phone". I have one, but haven't tried the modem yet. The QualComm
> PDQ (which comes with a PalmPilot attached) will have a built-in serial
> port, but its awfully big for a cell phone.
>
> I've been fairly pleased with Bell Atlantic Mobile - they have pretty
> good coverage (both digital and analog), and seem to be constantly
> expanding.
>
> "Karl J. Runge" wrote:
> >...
> > Anyway, does anyone out there have suggestions for a cell phone service
> > provider (we live near Manchester) and brand of cell phone that would
> > allow me to do this?  (One complication is the laptop doesn't have a
> > serial port, just a PCMCIA modem, do any cell phones allow direct RJ11
> > connections a modem?)
>
> **
> To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the following text in the
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>


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Re:

[Thomas Charron]

Sorry, for the follow up, but it was installed as either one large:

manual.html
manual.texi
manual.txt

  It also states that a ps version is available, but it points to
http://www.mysql.com/Manual, which just seems to contain the HTML version of
it..

- Original Message -
From: Thomas Charron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Tom Rauschenbach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2000 10:14 PM
Subject: Re:


> Err, the mysql documents got installed by an RPM on my system.  I
could
> zip it up and send it if you wish.  It installed them under
> /usr/doc/MySQL-3.22.32.  The RPM that installed them is reported as
> MySQL-server, which I believe is the base MySQL rpm.
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Tom Rauschenbach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2000 9:13 PM
> > The documentation for MySql seems to be only available as HMTL.  Does
> anyone
> > have a tool for grabbing an HMTL tree for printing ?
> > I'd really like to read the MySql Documentation offline, but there
does'nt
> seem
> > to be an easy way to do this.
>
>
>
> **
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>


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Re:

[Thomas Charron]

Err, the mysql documents got installed by an RPM on my system.  I could
zip it up and send it if you wish.  It installed them under
/usr/doc/MySQL-3.22.32.  The RPM that installed them is reported as
MySQL-server, which I believe is the base MySQL rpm.

- Original Message -
From: Tom Rauschenbach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2000 9:13 PM
> The documentation for MySql seems to be only available as HMTL.  Does
anyone
> have a tool for grabbing an HMTL tree for printing ?
> I'd really like to read the MySql Documentation offline, but there does'nt
seem
> to be an easy way to do this.



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Re: He shall dance at noon...

[Thomas Charron]

*pictures**pictures**pictures**pictures**pictures**pictures**pictures**pictu
res**pictures*

Dude, that's such a Niall thing to do..  ;-P

From: Paul Lussier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 30, 2000 9:37 AM
Subject: He shall dance at noon...
> Though most of you are probably familiar with my .sig which states:
> "I always explain our company via interpretive dance.
>  I meet lots of interesting people that way."
>   Niall Kavanagh, 10 April, 2000
> Well, thanks to Brigitte, our VP of Marketing, who recently saw my .sig
and
> evidently has much better access to rose petals than either Derek or I,
> for bringing in more than an adequate supply this morning. :)
> Therefore, Niall, we are all expecting a performance around lunchtime
today!
> For those of you who can't make it, we'll keep you updated :)
> And thanks Brigitte, we owe you one :)



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Re: MySQL GPL'd

[Thomas Charron]

Quoting Jeffry Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Way to go, VA Linux.  The fasted db now truly open-source.  Now if you
> can get someone to open-source a matter transporter ;-)

  Now if only it gets full fledged transaction support natively, etc.  And 
remains fast while doing so..  ;-P

--- 
Thomas Charron
<< Wanted: One decent sig >>
<< Preferably litle used  >>
<< and stored in garage.  ?>>

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Re: Free software in business (was maddog speaks)

[Thomas Charron]

From: jim t.p. ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 28, 2000 9:19 AM
Subject: Re: Free software in business (was maddog speaks)
Derek,
I'm still confused.  How was sendmail and Apache originally created?  What
do those people do for a living?  How do they make their money?  I'm not
being a wise guy here, I really want to understand how software would work
in a completly open source world.  I mean if I'm a programmer by trade and I
want to feed my family how do I do it in this model?  Maybe I'm being overly
simplistic but I like the concept, I just don't fully get it.

  It scratched an itch.  Why would a community get together, clear a patch
of forest, and put up a baseball diamond?  Without *GASP!* getting paid for
it..  I happen to put a good deal of work into an open source instant
messaging project, to the point where my names in the rfc (How's that for
geek status, yet another reason).

  The thing to remember is, when open source projects start, RARELY do they
understand the scope that the project may come to.  Look at Linux.  Linus
had *NO CLUE* how big it would become.  He didn't start writing it with the
intentions of creating the OS.  He did it becouse he wanted to.  He shared
what he managed to hack out.  Others hacked onto it.  That got exciting, it
now did even more.  He did some more with it.  Then it started to grow.  An
example of this functioning in real life is found at
http://www.apache.org/ABOUT_APACHE.html which gives a brief historical
rundown of 'how it started'.

  Now person, I do it becouse it excites me.  To work on something that
grows.  No one to tell you 'this is how it should go', or 'this is how it
should be done'.  You go off on your merry way and create.  When several
developers working on the same thing with a common vision, and the same
excitment about the project, you get good, quality code.  You also end up
with less marketting features, and more really needed features.  I think
much of IIS, as an example, was actually designed by a marketing group, to
push their other products even further, and certainly NOT to design and
build a world class, fast, nevergoesdown HTTP server.

  It all goes back to the ballfield, but you don;t have to get as dirty..
;-P


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Re: billing system (the final damm word)

[Thomas Charron]

If you're willing to use a database server, then Freeside is a *GREAT*
product.  I hadn't mentioned it originally, becouse you had stated you
didn't want a DB server involved.

http://freshmeat.net/appindex/1999/04/12/923892627.html

It *does* require gobs of Perl modules, but can handle nearly
everything, all the way up to billing Credit Cards..

- Original Message -
From: Kurth Bemis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 26, 2000 3:13 AM
Subject: billing system (the final damm word)


> THAT'S IT!  i'm sick of this VisualBasic wanna be SQL closed source
> crap!  I am going to code a billing program for X if it kills
me...probably
> using mysql or some other open source DB.  i'd like to get help with this
> task, however i realize that many of you are very busy..so.any help
> will be much appreciated. :-)..the project will be located at
> http://www.usaexpress.net/kurth/billing...there i'll post stuff..about
> it.specs..any and all code...etc.nothing is there now..but soon it
> will be...like Tuesday or so.  if any of you are interested let me
> know..i'm gonna need all the help i can get :-)
>
> ~kurth
> Kurth Bemis - Senior Linux Network/Systems Administrator, USAExpress.net
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.usaexpress.net/kurth
> ICQ - 6624050
> Call Sign - N1TYW
> PGP key available - http://www.usaexpress.net/kurth/pgp
>
> Fight Weak Encryption!  Donate your wasted CPU cycles to Distributed.net
> (http://www.distributed.net)
>
>
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