[Goanet] Confused over language usage
* G * O * A * N * E * T C * L * A * S * S * I * F * I * E * D * S * ANKA SERVICES For all your Goa-based media needs - Newspapers and Electronic Media Newspaper Adverts, Press Releases, Press Conferences www.ankaservices.com kam...@ankaservices.com Hope you've got clarification to the confusion over the lanaguage usage from the explanation provided by Prof. S M Borges. 'Borges and the script issue' is a totally different issue altogether and therefore cannot be linked with the usage of Konkani language. Fausto Eugene wrote: Perhaps someone knowledgeable on the grammatical aspects, or nuances, of the language could explain why in a same sentence why Goenkaranchi and G?ykar are written in the way they are. If a leading Konkani in Roman-script magazine is confused on the usage of the word, then it is not a good sign.
[Goanet] Confused over language usage.
* G * O * A * N * E * T C * L * A * S * S * I * F * I * E * D * S * ANKA SERVICES For all your Goa-based media needs - Newspapers and Electronic Media Newspaper Adverts, Press Releases, Press Conferences www.ankaservices.com kam...@ankaservices.com Respected Editor, Its very funny as to why so much time is wasted in discussing usage of language.United States is a union of fifty states and has only one language-English.Bharat has twetyfour official languages and yet no common language for the nation.(HINDI is not yet official National Language).It was wonderful to read at The Swami Vivekananda Retreat at Ridgley(NY) that one should learn Sanskrit English along with one's mothertongue.Bharat as such has good chance to follow Swamiji's advice and unite languagewise. With best regards, Deo Borem Korum. Shyam V.Bale,Mumbai.
[Goanet] Confused over language usage
* G * O * A * N * E * T C * L * A * S * S * I * F * I * E * D * S * ANKA SERVICES For all your Goa-based media needs - Newspapers and Electronic Media Newspaper Adverts, Press Releases, Press Conferences www.ankaservices.com kam...@ankaservices.com Hi Eugene, Appending Prof. S M Borges' reply to your query. Hope this explanation will suffice. Fausto It is gratifying to note that at least one reader of GULAB (even if he is someone WRITING in English) is concerned about how Konkani words are written in the Roman script. GULAB is constrained to say this because when we ran a series of 20 articles on this topic with a view to standardize the contributions received from our own authors, we found that hardly anyone paid attention to our suggestions, and we continued to receive articles written in the same old individual styles; nobody bothered to tell us whether and where we were going wrong either, in spite of our invitation to do so. Consequently, our work of proof correction did not diminish; the resulting tedium leads to some errors remaining uncorrected however much we wish to avoid this. The present query involves (a) the use of Y, (b) the method used for nasalization and (c) the necessity of doubling some consonants. We had devoted a full article (no. 20) to explain our understanding of the use of Y. This letter is found in Konkani written up to the first decade of the twentieth century. (It is also found in Pai Tiatrist's play, Bhattkara staged in 1910 but published in about 1940.) It is not found in later Konkani works obviously because the letter was banished from the Portuguese language in 1911; Goan children who went to Portuguese school after 1911 did learn the name of this letter as Igrôz but did not know the sound it represents as they did not come across a single word containing this letter. (Some, in fact, wrongly assumed that Y has the same sound as Z.) In recent decades, the medium of instruction having shifted to English, our children know that Y represents sounds: a vowel sound I (ee as in 'only'), a diphthong sound AI (eye as in 'try'), a consonant sound YO (as in 'young', 'buyer'). Earlier, the consonant sound was represented in Konkani by IO or EO depending on the position. Considering the number of vowel sounds in Konkani, the Roman script vowels were really overworked, even without handling this consonant sound. Therefore, it was thought appropriate to utilize the hitherto idle Y for the consonant sound alone. But there was strong opposition to this move. This included some veteran writers who have produced meritorious literary and research works. Moreover, a majority of GULAB readers, we felt, did not have the good fortune of going to an English school. Hence we decided to introduce this change gradually. This is one of the reasons why some words are spelt differently in one and the same article or sentence. Uniform nasalization could have been accomplished by using the 'tilde' in every case. But two factors militate against this. (a) the additional moves required to be made on the keyboard every time a 'tilde-bearing' vowel is to be typed and (b) the ubiquity of nasal sounds in Konkani. Moreover, even the languages which have been using the Roman script for centuries make do with the nasal consonants M and N for the purpose of nasalization. Therefore, it was decided to use the 'tilde' (as well as other accents) only where absolutely necessary. Generally, M is used when the nasal vowel precedes a labial consonant (i.e. B, M, P) and N in all other cases. But M and N also function as consonants. Hence a provision had to be made in the event of a consonant M preceding a labial consonant, or a consonant N preceding one of the other consonants. This is accomplished by placing an apostrophe after the M/N as the case may be. Examples: gulam'ponn (slavery), kan'sul (temple), mon'xak (to man). When a final M follows a vowel it always nasalizes the vowel; thus all neutral plural nouns end with a nasal M: fulam, kellim. However, if such M is to be pronounced as a consonant, an apostrophe must follow it: molom' (unguent), salam' (salute), chondrim' (moon). Now, let us take the specific cases of Gõy / Goem, Gõykar / Goemkar. When we use the Konkani words for Goa and Goan we find a dichotomy. Some use a monosyllabic Gõy, others a disyllabic Go-em. Similarly for Goan we use a disyllabic Gõy-kar or a tri-syllabic Go-em-kar. The latter versions arise, we feel, as a result of literally reading Goem and Goenkar in Roman script (in Devanagari the words are uniformly Gõy and Gõykar.) We therefore
[Goanet] Confused over language usage
* * * * * * * * * ANNUAL GOANETTERS MEET * * * * * * * * * Goanetters in Goa and visiting meet Jan 6, 2009 at 3.30 pm at Hotel Mandovi (prior to the Goa Sudharop event, which you're also welcome to). Join in for a Dutch dinner -- if we can agree on a venue after the meet. RSVP (confirmations only) 9822122436 or 2409490 or f...@goa-india.org Reading Editor-at-Start (hearing such a term for the first time, though I would prefer founding editor) Miquel Braganza's editorial in he newly-launched GoaMag he has used y in uloy, boroy and vaddoy in GoaMag-a vorxim GÕy-cho mog vaddov-ia. Konkani uloy, Konkani boroy, Konkani-cho mog vaddoy. Is it proper to use y instead of i? However, I know the trend to used GÕy with a tilde on o was started by Vavraddeancho Ixtt and now commonly used by Gulab. If I remember correctly Gulab used Goem when it first started. I don't know since when the change began. But Gulab is not consistent. On the cover page of its November issue, it says, Goem Bond Korun Konnem Kitem Zoddlem? and also GÕy Bond Also Goykar (with the accent) is used as for the earlier Goemkar. On page 7, the title for Soter Barreto's article is written, Kuwaitchea Goenkarank Mhozo Salam' (don't know if the apostrophe at the end of salam is phonetically needed). Also on page 31, Fr. Teo Fernandes, OCD, in his Aitarachem Provochon, writes Hich got atam sodeak zalea amchea Goenkaranchi, GÕyche zom'nicho, pikavollicho, serkari toxech karkhaneacho lab GÕykarank pavche adincho lob dusroch on-GÕykar chaun voita ani ami GÕykar fokot, tea kombeam bhoxem, amchech modem zhogddun ekamekachim rogtam kaddunkuch urle Perhaps someone knowledgeable on the grammatical aspects, or nuances, of the language could explain why in a same sentence why Goenkaranchi and GÕykar are written in the way they are. If a leading Konkani in Roman-script magazine is confused on the usage of the word, then it is not a good sign. I have also noticed that our native language is spelled Konknni ifrom the earlier Konkani. Probably both spellings are acceptable, but I would like to know which one of the two is widely used. Eugene Correia
[Goanet] Confused over language usage
* * * * * * * * * ANNUAL GOANETTERS MEET * * * * * * * * * Goanetters in Goa and visiting meet Jan 6, 2009 at 3.30 pm at Hotel Mandovi (prior to the Goa Sudharop event, which you're also welcome to). Join in for a Dutch dinner -- if we can agree on a venue after the meet. RSVP (confirmations only) 9822122436 or 2409490 or f...@goa-india.org Noted. Prof. S M Borges will be the right person to answer your query. Fausto Eugene wrote: However, I know the trend to used G?y with a tilde on o was started by Vavraddeancho Ixtt and now commonly used by Gulab. If I remember correctly Gulab used Goem when it first started. I don't know since when the change began. But Gulab is not consistent. On the cover page of its November issue, it says, Goem Bond Korun Konnem Kitem Zoddlem? and also G?y Bond Perhaps someone knowledgeable on the grammatical aspects, or nuances, of the language could explain why in a same sentence why Goenkaranchi and G?ykar are written in the way they are. If a leading Konkani in Roman-script magazine is confused on the usage of the word, then it is not a good sign. I have also noticed that our native language is spelled Konknni ifrom the earlier Konkani. Probably both spellings are acceptable, but I would like to know which one of the two is widely used. Eugene Correia
Re: [Goanet] Confused over language usage
* * * * * * * * * ANNUAL GOANETTERS MEET * * * * * * * * * Goanetters in Goa and visiting meet Jan 6, 2009 at 3.30 pm at Hotel Mandovi (prior to the Goa Sudharop event, which you're also welcome to). Join in for a Dutch dinner -- if we can agree on a venue after the meet. RSVP (confirmations only) 9822122436 or 2409490 or f...@goa-india.org Me think 'Goemkar' is the truthful representative of Romi Konkani. 'Y' such as in 'Goycho' is disputable. Eugene could be very much on the dot. floriano goasuraj - Original Message - From: Eugene Correia gene_corr...@yahoo.com To: goa...@goanet.org Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 12:34 PM Subject: [Goanet] Confused over language usage Reading Editor-at-Start (hearing such a term for the first time, though I would prefer founding editor) Miquel Braganza's editorial in he newly-launched GoaMag he has used y in uloy, boroy and vaddoy in GoaMag-a vorxim GÕy-cho mog vaddov-ia. Konkani uloy, Konkani boroy, Konkani-cho mog vaddoy. Is it proper to use y instead of i? However, I know the trend to used GÕy with a tilde on o was started by Vavraddeancho Ixtt and now commonly used by Gulab. If I remember correctly Gulab used Goem when it first started. I don't know since when the change began. But Gulab is not consistent. On the cover page of its November issue, it says, Goem Bond Korun Konnem Kitem Zoddlem? and also GÕy Bond Also Goykar (with the accent) is used as for the earlier Goemkar. On page 7, the title for Soter Barreto's article is written, Kuwaitchea Goenkarank Mhozo Salam' (don't know if the apostrophe at the end of salam is phonetically needed). Also on page 31, Fr. Teo Fernandes, OCD, in his Aitarachem Provochon, writes Hich got atam sodeak zalea amchea Goenkaranchi, GÕyche zom'nicho, pikavollicho, serkari toxech karkhaneacho lab GÕykarank pavche adincho lob dusroch on-GÕykar chaun voita ani ami GÕykar fokot, tea kombeam bhoxem, amchech modem zhogddun ekamekachim rogtam kaddunkuch urle Perhaps someone knowledgeable on the grammatical aspects, or nuances, of the language could explain why in a same sentence why Goenkaranchi and GÕykar are written in the way they are. If a leading Konkani in Roman-script magazine is confused on the usage of the word, then it is not a good sign. I have also noticed that our native language is spelled Konknni ifrom the earlier Konkani. Probably both spellings are acceptable, but I would like to know which one of the two is widely used. Eugene Correia
