Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Robert A. Rosenberg]

At 1:38 PM -0600 on 1/21/08, Paul Gilmartin wrote about Re: How does 
ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?:


When the mother needs the daughter's assistance, it WAITs on the 
second ECB, clears it, and POSTS the first.


ONLY IF the mother task has nothing else it can do while it is 
waiting for the daughter to be ready to do something for it. 
Otherwise the mother task just periodically tests ECB2 and does its 
POST once ECB1 has been WAIT'ed on by the daughter.


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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Craddock, Chris]

Warning: kind of a long-ish reply coming up;

> What exactly is wrong with the ECB/WAIT/POST mechanism? I think it has
> always worked great. It's got some pretty difficult limitations in
cross
> memory mode (but it still works!), but otherwise I'm not sure where
you
> get "awful".

Yeah, it works FSVO "works" but it is a 1960's design where the only
real concern was a wait and a post without much real asynchronous
behavior going on. Check the SVC numbers (1 and 2) Pretty early on in
that design cycle wouldn't you say? Back then nobody thought of or even
cared about all of the failure cases and there are loads of them. Here
are only a few of them.

Where do I start... how about the fact that an "ECB" is just 4 bytes (on
a word boundary) of storage? There is no indication anywhere that those
particular 4 bytes are really part of a serialization interface and not
(say) 4 bytes in someone else's control block or working storage. 

When you issue a WAIT macro Mr Wait only checks that each ECB is in the
right key for you to wait on it and that it does not appear to have
already been "posted". The big scientific check is whether the 40 bit is
on. If so, he's going to just return immediately. That's why the famous
"quick post" algorithm works. 

Otherwise WAIT is going to put the caller's RB into a wait state and
blast X'80abcdefg' into the ECB where "abcdefg" is (or would be) the
address of the waiting RB. Of course if that address wasn't really an
ECB you have an overlay. In most (but not all) cases that would be
considered a programming error so let's not quibble over it.

Now if the ECB happens to be in storage that the caller didn't own (say
it's owned by a parallel task) and the storage owner terminates. Oops
again. Now your task is waiting on an ECB that doesn't even exist
anymore and no deity could wake it up. It is literally and permanently
toast and the only way to wake up the task is to detach it which tends
to be kind of draconian for the work that was supposed to be running on
that task. This is a fairly common error in multitasking apps where
parallel tasks serialize between each other via wait/post. 

Now let's turn our attention to POST. Folks who routinely look at dumps
(guilty yer 'onor) tend to recognize things that "look like" an ECB in
wait status because of the X'80abcdefg' pattern. But if an ECB isn't
currently in a wait, then it's just 4 bytes of storage and the contents
could be anything at all. Arguably an ECB is only really an ECB when it
is being waited on.

Now Mr POST isn't fussy. He's kind of a lounge lizard kind of guy. He
does a quick look and if the 80 bit is on, he heads off and does RB
validation and assuming it really is waiting and the current post would
satisfy the wait count, POST alters the RB status to indicate the RB is
now ready. But if the 80 bit is off... he assumes the "ECB" just is not
being waited on, so he blasts X'40xxyyzz' (where xxyyzz is the post code
you supplied) into the "ECB" - again, see the quick-post code to grasp
the deep intelligence that's used.

So if you point your POST macro at -any- 4 bytes (in your own key,
assuming you're not authorized, but otherwise just any old 4 bytes you
want to nuke) and good ol' Mr POST will cheerfully blast a X'40xxyyzz'
into it for you. No muss no fuss and absolutely no way to say "oops".
But wait, there's more.

Since there's literally no indication ANYWHERE that those 4 bytes are,
or ever were an ECB, they could legitimately be asynchronously posted by
some other unit of work long after the thrill is gone. So let's say that
"function X" has called some asynchronous service and passed the address
of 4 bytes of private storage as an ECB. But assume for grins and
giggles that the async service can end with or without posting that ECB
and/or that our "function X" can simply decide to bail out and not wait
on the ECB at all. 

What happens next and why should you care? Presumably that ECB is going
to get nailed sooner or later. So now there's a reasonable certainty
that 4 innocent bytes (probably belonging to some other "function Y" by
now) are going to get vaporized if/when that async service call
completes. Ooops. That's another very common cause of those mysterious
overlay problems.

And then there's our friend Mr Cross-Memory Post. He's been the cause of
many a lost system. Now you're not just pointing at 4 random bytes in
your own address space, you have a whole system full of potential victim
address spaces. That's what the old TSO version of the battleships game
did BTW. You could nuke 4 bytes at a time in the other guy's address
space until either of you got forced off, or the system went belly up.
Sysprogs had fun back in the day huh?

The last point is that that there's no accountability. You could issue
POST against an "ECB" a hundred times and the owner of the ECB might
perceive any number from zero to a hundred posts. You would need to
build some sort of queuing mechanism in conjunction with wait/post to
ensu

Re: New Mainframes coming in February

[Timothy Sipples]

>I have found that my company (before downsizing me) was totally
>confused with the EC/BC determinations.
>I wish IBM would try to simplify their offerings.
>I've dealt with their marketting cr*p for 27 years, and I find
>their distintions only make sense to IBM sales.

Ted, what are the confusing parts about EC and BC?  It should be very
simple: there are two pieces of hardware.  The BC starts at 26 MIPS of CP
capacity and goes up to almost 1,800 per frame.  The EC starts at about 200
and goes up to nearly 18,000.  (There's plenty of overlap between the two
so you have room to grow.)  If the BC provides enough capacity, that's what
you buy, otherwise the EC is available.  You can upgrade a BC to an EC.

Both run the same software portfolio.  Both deliver mainframe qualities of
service -- both are 100% genuine mainframes.  (The EC always has at least
two spare processors, while the BC lets you choose whether to have spares
or not.  The EC does have an optional feature available to let you replace
a whole processor "book" while the machine continues to operate, but this
is perhaps academic if you have Parallel Sysplex.)  You can stuff more
memory inside an EC, but the BC still offers lots.  No surprise that the EC
is physically about twice the size of the BC.

I have heard about some confusion out there about certain things, but EC v.
BC is a new one, so I'm curious to hear more about that.  I think ever
since the z800 came out 5 or 6 years ago this two machine strategy has been
in place, and it hasn't changed fundamentally.  The EC and BC are round #3
of that strategy, after round #2 (z990/z890).  In all three rounds the
bigger one debuted first and the smaller one second.

- - - - -
Timothy Sipples
IBM Consulting Enterprise Software Architect
Specializing in Software Architectures Related to System z
Based in Tokyo, Serving IBM Japan and IBM Asia-Pacific
E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: I want to add virtual printer to my MFNetDisk, Any value?

[shai hess]

HI,

 Yes, I understand that virtual printers is not needed in the MF
environment.


 Thanks,
 Shai


On 1/21/08, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 01/18/2008
>   at 01:03 PM, Shai Hess <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>
> > I want to add a small feature which I call it virtual MF printer.
>
> Why?
>
> > This will enable MVS user to print to MVS virtual printer any MVS file.
>
> What's wrong with the support already in JES2 and JES3?
>
> > My question is if this feature in MFNetDisk is required or not?
>
> I see no need for it. Just write SYSOUT data sets.
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
> ISO position; see 
> We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
> (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
>
> --
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Re: Re-hosting IMB-MAIN (was RE: z890 2086-160 w/ 2 IFLs on eBay)

[Darren Evans-Young]

On Mon, 21 Jan 2008, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) wrote:

>Are we losing our hosting? If not, why discuss options for a new host?
>I've heard nothing about UA dropping us. Yes, Darren has retired, but he's
>still willing to put in time for the list. If there is a need to move,
>it's his opinions that matter most, and I haven't read anything from him
>suggesting that it's necessary, or even that he's been consulted.

It's amazing how a post degenerates into
a wild rumour. (not your post Shmuel)

IBM-MAIN isn't going anywhere.
UA is not dropping us.  The only
place I've heard this, is this list!

I have retired from my Unix Sys Admin position.
I still receive a check from UA for my teaching
the Computer-Based Honors Program. So, I'm not
going anywhere either!

Geez!

Darren

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Re: SMP/E and why not.

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 01/13/2008
   at 06:38 PM, Edward Jaffe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>Perhaps worthy of a poll question. But, I suspect most service orders 
>don't include superseded maintenance. Certainly, that's my preference.

And if a PE shows up for the superseding PTF? I'd prefer to get all
service not in  ACCEPT status, download the latest HOLDDATA and let SMP/E
sort things out at APPLY time.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: Re-hosting IMB-MAIN (was RE: z890 2086-160 w/ 2 IFLs on eBay)

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 01/18/2008
   at 02:15 PM, Thomas Kern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>Okay, Then I will gladly be your z/VM sysprog. My experience on the 'dark
>side' goes back to June 23, 1976 when I first logged onto a virtual
>machine.

I'm a TSO bigot from way bac,, and I would *NEVER* refer to VM as the dark
side. In fact, there are VM0 facilities, e.g., XEDIT, that I would love to
see in MVS.

I agree that z/VM makes more sense than z/OS if all that you're doing is
hosting LISTSERV, but unless someone is paying for the processor,
environmentals and peripherals Linux on an AMD would seem to make more
sense than either.

Are we losing our hosting? If not, why discuss options for a new host?
I've heard nothing about UA dropping us. Yes, Darren has retired, but he's
still willing to put in time for the list. If there is a need to move,
it's his opinions that matter most, and I haven't read anything from him
suggesting that it's necessary, or even that he's been consulted. 
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[David Logan]

What exactly is wrong with the ECB/WAIT/POST mechanism? I think it has
always worked great. It's got some pretty difficult limitations in cross
memory mode (but it still works!), but otherwise I'm not sure where you get
"awful".

David Logan

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Henry Willard
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 4:14 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

"Craddock, Chris" wrote:

>
> As in horshoes? Yes. The ECB is one of the most widely used "tools" in
> the system. As a serialization primitive it is just awful, but there's
> no getting away from it now.
>

The ECB might not be perfect, but compared to what you have to put up with
on Unix where there are about a half dozen mechanisms which can't be used
together, it is downright brilliant.

>
> CC

Henry

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Re: New Mainframes coming in February

[Mark Post]

>>> On Mon, Jan 21, 2008 at  5:12 PM, in message
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Paul Gilmartin
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 
-snip-
> Whose trademark is Firewire?  (And how can one do a trademark search?)

http://www.uspto.gov/


Mark Post

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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Henry Willard]

"Craddock, Chris" wrote:

>
> As in horshoes? Yes. The ECB is one of the most widely used "tools" in
> the system. As a serialization primitive it is just awful, but there's
> no getting away from it now.
>

The ECB might not be perfect, but compared to what you have to put up with
on Unix where there are about a half dozen mechanisms which can't be used
together, it is downright brilliant.

>
> CC

Henry

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Re: I want to add virtual printer to my MFNetDisk, Any value?

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on
01/18/2008
   at 10:04 PM, shai hess <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>2. I think the printers are not like disks. They can not have complicate
>CCWs,

Mah pitom! They most cedrtainly can.

>3. I am sure that UCS and FCB are open to everyone, because user need to
>know how he can control his printing.

The user does not directly control his own printing. IBM supplies
defaults, for much more than FCB and UCS, and the local systems
programmers are responsible for anything beyond that.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: I want to add virtual printer to my MFNetDisk, Any value?

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 01/18/2008
   at 01:03 PM, Shai Hess <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

> I want to add a small feature which I call it virtual MF printer.

Why?

> This will enable MVS user to print to MVS virtual printer any MVS file.

What's wrong with the support already in JES2 and JES3?

> My question is if this feature in MFNetDisk is required or not?

I see no need for it. Just write SYSOUT data sets.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Linux boot problem on z/VM

[Murray M. Robinson]

I did a major boob!

I was creating some LVM under Linux SLES 9 on a z/VM machine.

I ran the mkinitrd  and zipl commands after updating the /etc/zipl.conf. 

I incorrectly updated the dasd=  entry in the zipl.conf file parameters 
string.

It should have been dasd=100-106 but I set it to 101-106.

This seems to have moved the offset for the devices such that at boot time 
it gets an incorrect blocksize on the root=/dev/dasdb1 

Is there anyway I can overlay this parameter at Linux boot time.

Thanks.

This e-mail message and any attachments may contain confidential, 
proprietary or non-public information.  This information is intended 
solely for the designated recipient(s).  If an addressing or transmission 
error has misdirected this e-mail, please notify the sender immediately 
and destroy this e-mail.  Any review, dissemination, use or reliance upon 
this information by unintended recipients is prohibited.  Any opinions 
expressed in this e-mail are those of the author personally.

Murray Robinson

ACI Worldwide, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(402)-778-1930

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Re: New Mainframes coming in February

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 17:01:54 EST, Ed Finnell wrote:
>
>>>
>Lots of possibilities. Based on same matrix as G6 guess  it would logical to
>make it a Zipper chip*? Wonder if  we can firewire sysplexes together like the
>XBoxeslots of  possibilities
>
>*That would be interlocking slide fastener for the  military
>
What advantage would Firewire have over Ethernet?

Some systems can do IP over Firewire.

Whose trademark is Firewire?  (And how can one do a trademark search?)

-- gil

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Re: Copying Unix tar file to tape

[Aaron Walker]

On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 15:41:53 -0500, Jon Brock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:

>I am trying to write out a Unix System Services file -- a tar archive --
>to tape.  For simplicity's sake, I was planning on using IEBGENER, but
>I'm a bit confused as to what file characteristics to use for this.
>Anybody out there have any sample JCL?
>
>Thanks,
>Jon
>

I always very happily used omvstape from the z/OS Unix Tools and 
Toys page:

http://www.ibm.com/servers/eserver/zseries/zos/unix/bpxa1ty2.html

I did go in and modify some of the blocking, etc, to make it more 
efficient space-wise (I was storing a *lot* of information, and that 
made a big difference), but you need the C compiler to do that.

Aaron

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Re: Copying Unix tar file to tape

[Kirk Wolf]

If you use pax instead of tar, it can already use MVS datasets.

On Jan 21, 2008 4:05 PM, Paul Gilmartin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 14:48:23 -0600, McKown, John wrote:
>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jon Brock
> >> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 2:42 PM
> >>
> >> I am trying to write out a Unix System Services file -- a tar
> >> archive --
> >> to tape.  For simplicity's sake, I was planning on using IEBGENER, but
> >> I'm a bit confused as to what file characteristics to use for this.
> >> Anybody out there have any sample JCL?
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Jon
> >
> >I'd just use RECFM=FB,LRECL=1,BLKSIZE=0,DSORG=PS. No, I've never done
> >this.
> >
> o I wouldn't be surprised if QSAM performance with these attributes
>  were horrendous.  No direct evidence; I shied away from trying it.
>
> >//STEP1 EXEC PGM=IEBGENER
> >//SYSPRINT DD SYSOUT=*
> >//SYSIN DD DUMMY
> >//SYSUT1 DD PATH='/path/to/file.tar',FILEDATA=BINARY,
> >// DCB=(RECFM=FB,LRECL=1,BLKSIZE=8000)
> >//SYSUT2 DD DSN=TAPE.OUTPUT.TAR,DISP=(NEW,CATLG),
> >// UNIT=TAPE,DCB=(RECFM=FB,LRECL=1,BLKSIZE=0,DSORG=PS)
> >//
> >
> >Note that the BLKSIZE=8000 on the SYSUT1 doesn't really matter too much.
> >Any valid value will do.
> >
> But I'm not sure that SDB would supply a valid value if you code
> BLKSIZE=0 and OPEN for input.
>
> (The following from memory; I'm not retesting): In order to generate
> a tape compatible with non-IBM systems, I used RECFM=U, BLKSIZE=5120,
> the latter being the default given by "man tar" on a non-IBM system.
> Then I never found a non-IBM system with compatible drives, but I
> was able to read it back and uncompress and untar it on the creating
> z/OS system.
>
> In a Rexx exec, I piped tar | compress | [descriptor piped to SYSUT1
> of ATTCHMVS IEBGENER].  Tar now can write its archives to Classic
> data sets, but I doubt it can deal with uncatalogued data sets.  I'm
> now using CD-ROMs instead of tapes.
>
> -- gil
>
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Re: Copying Unix tar file to tape

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 14:48:23 -0600, McKown, John wrote:

>> -Original Message-
>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jon Brock
>> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 2:42 PM
>>
>> I am trying to write out a Unix System Services file -- a tar
>> archive --
>> to tape.  For simplicity's sake, I was planning on using IEBGENER, but
>> I'm a bit confused as to what file characteristics to use for this.
>> Anybody out there have any sample JCL?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Jon
>
>I'd just use RECFM=FB,LRECL=1,BLKSIZE=0,DSORG=PS. No, I've never done
>this.
>
o I wouldn't be surprised if QSAM performance with these attributes
  were horrendous.  No direct evidence; I shied away from trying it.

>//STEP1 EXEC PGM=IEBGENER
>//SYSPRINT DD SYSOUT=*
>//SYSIN DD DUMMY
>//SYSUT1 DD PATH='/path/to/file.tar',FILEDATA=BINARY,
>// DCB=(RECFM=FB,LRECL=1,BLKSIZE=8000)
>//SYSUT2 DD DSN=TAPE.OUTPUT.TAR,DISP=(NEW,CATLG),
>// UNIT=TAPE,DCB=(RECFM=FB,LRECL=1,BLKSIZE=0,DSORG=PS)
>//
>
>Note that the BLKSIZE=8000 on the SYSUT1 doesn't really matter too much.
>Any valid value will do.
>
But I'm not sure that SDB would supply a valid value if you code
BLKSIZE=0 and OPEN for input.

(The following from memory; I'm not retesting): In order to generate
a tape compatible with non-IBM systems, I used RECFM=U, BLKSIZE=5120,
the latter being the default given by "man tar" on a non-IBM system.
Then I never found a non-IBM system with compatible drives, but I
was able to read it back and uncompress and untar it on the creating
z/OS system.

In a Rexx exec, I piped tar | compress | [descriptor piped to SYSUT1
of ATTCHMVS IEBGENER].  Tar now can write its archives to Classic
data sets, but I doubt it can deal with uncatalogued data sets.  I'm
now using CD-ROMs instead of tapes.

-- gil

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Re: New Mainframes coming in February

[Ed Finnell]

 
In a message dated 1/21/2008 3:39:23 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

I wish IBM would try to simplify their offerings.

I've dealt  with their marketting cr*p for 27 years, and I find their 
distintions only  make sense to IBM 
 
>>
Lots of possibilities. Based on same matrix as G6 guess  it would logical to 
make it a Zipper chip*? Wonder if  we can firewire sysplexes together like the 
XBoxeslots of  possibilities
 
*That would be interlocking slide fastener for the  military





**Start the year off right.  Easy ways to stay in shape. 
http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp0030002489

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Re: New Mainframes coming in February

[Ted MacNEIL]

>But perhaps part of the grand plan is to only have one very scalable model 
>moving forward. Guess those of us not under NDA will find out soon...

I have found that my company (before downsizing me) was totally confused with 
the EC/BC determinations.

I wish IBM would try to simplify their offerings.

I've dealt with their marketting cr*p for 27 years, and I find their 
distintions only make sense to IBM sales.

-
Too busy driving to stop for gas!

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Re: New Mainframes coming in February

[Mark Zelden]

On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 08:05:37 -0600, McKown, John
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>I'm more interested in the new instructions, and any enhancements to the
>architecture itself (if any). The only way that we will get one is if it
>is cheaper (in hard dollars) than our current z9BC.
>

Assuming things stay the same as they have in "z"-past, the "big z" model
will be this year and the "baby z" model will be next year.   But perhaps part
of the grand plan is to only have one very scalable model moving forward.
Guess those of us not under NDA will find out soon...

Mark 
--
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mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: Copying Unix tar file to tape

[McKown, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jon Brock
> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 2:42 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Copying Unix tar file to tape
> 
> 
> I am trying to write out a Unix System Services file -- a tar 
> archive --
> to tape.  For simplicity's sake, I was planning on using IEBGENER, but
> I'm a bit confused as to what file characteristics to use for this.
> Anybody out there have any sample JCL?
> 
> Thanks,
> Jon

I'd just use RECFM=FB,LRECL=1,BLKSIZE=0,DSORG=PS. No, I've never done
this.

//STEP1 EXEC PGM=IEBGENER
//SYSPRINT DD SYSOUT=*
//SYSIN DD DUMMY
//SYSUT1 DD PATH='/path/to/file.tar',FILEDATA=BINARY,
// DCB=(RECFM=FB,LRECL=1,BLKSIZE=8000)
//SYSUT2 DD DSN=TAPE.OUTPUT.TAR,DISP=(NEW,CATLG),
// UNIT=TAPE,DCB=(RECFM=FB,LRECL=1,BLKSIZE=0,DSORG=PS)
//

Note that the BLKSIZE=8000 on the SYSUT1 doesn't really matter too much.
Any valid value will do.

--
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Senior Systems Programmer
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Keeping the Promise of Affordable Coverage
Administrative Services Group
Information Technology

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Copying Unix tar file to tape

[Jon Brock]

I am trying to write out a Unix System Services file -- a tar archive --
to tape.  For simplicity's sake, I was planning on using IEBGENER, but
I'm a bit confused as to what file characteristics to use for this.
Anybody out there have any sample JCL?

Thanks,
Jon

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Re: SMTP resend queued messages

[Greg Zimmerman]

Thanks Richard, that worked and cleared out and delivered the emails.  I 
needed to put in the IP address of the old server at the end of the command, 
and after doing that, it took off.

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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Anne & Lynn Wheeler]

The following message is a courtesy copy of an article
that has been posted to bit.listserv.ibm-main,alt.folklore.computers as well.


[EMAIL PROTECTED] (McKown, John) writes:
> "Atomic" is used quite a bit in computer science. Like the original
> Greek, it means "indivisible". That is, when an atomic operation occurs,
> any other process will either see the data in the original form, or in
> the updated form. But it will never seen an intermediate form. It is
> especially used in relational databases. This is usually done so that,
> for instance, if you transfer money from checking to savings, you never
> see the amount in both places. You either see the amount in checking or
> in savings. This despite the fact that a lot of stuff is going on to do
> the move.
>
> "compare and swap" simply means that. It compares field1 against field2.
> If field1 equals field2, then the contents of field3 is placed in
> field2. What is "atomic" is that there is a "lock" that occurs so that
> at the instant before field1 is compared against field2, no other
> process is allowed to modify or even look at field2 until after the
> instruction finishes. This ensures that once the operation starts that
> no other process can make any updates or decisions based on the contents
> of field2.

there are ACID properties with regard to transactions ... frequently
things like financial.

A .. atomicity
C .. consistency
I .. isolation
D .. durability

a wiki ref
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACID

simpler example is two concurrent transactions, one a debit and one a
credit ... attempting to update the *same* value.

say you have $5000 in savings account. there is a transaction that
fetches the current value ... in order to subtract a $200 ATM debit.  At
the same time there is another transaction that is attempting to perform
(add) an EFT $1000 deposit.

W/o the transaction serialization semantics, the EFT $1000 deposit
concurrently fetches the current ($5000) value, adds $1000 and starts a
store operation of the $6000 value ... concurrently while the ATM debit
is performing the store of the $4800 value.

correct transaction atomic serialization, should result in correct $5800
when everything is done. w/o transaction atomic serialization, the $6000
"store" might be done followed by the $4800 "store" ... or the "4800"
store might be done followed by the $6000 "store" (resulting in either
$4800 or $6000, neither correct)

for the compare&swap scenario. The $4800 "store" only completes if the
value being replaced is $5000 ... otherwise things start all over
... similarly, the $6000 "store" only completes if the value being
replaced is $5000 ... otherwise things starts all over again.

in transaction systems, this is sometimes referred to as "optimistic"
... as opposed to purely serialized locking systems ... which only allow
one single transaction at a time to fetch a value ... and no other
transaction is allowed to fetch a value (or otherwise proceed) until the
active transaction has completed ... this is somewhat analogous to the
kernel spin-lock mentioned in previous description:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2008b.html#58 How does ATTACH pass address of ECB 
to child?

the transaction properties for consistently updating two different
values ... is somewhat more complicated ... than simple compare&swap.
Doing a transfer from one account to another requires that two values
(not just one) be correctly updated as a single, syncronized, serialized
operation (w/o allowing other simultaneous transactions to corrupt the
values).

in a few, carefully controlled situation it can be done by
compare-double & swap. a savings account value and the debit account
value are stored in contiguous storage locations. For a "transfer"
operation, both values are fetched, and the appropriate changes (a
subtraction from one and an addition to the other) are made to both
values.  then compare-double and swap is executed ... only succeeding
with the replace of both values IFF (if & only if) neither value has
changed since the original fetch operation. If either or both values
have changed since the initial fetch (because other operations are
concurrently attempting to change the same fields) ... then the store
operations fail ... and the process starts all over again.

the other alternative ... for concurrent updates of multiple different
values is to resort to something like the spin-lock scenario ... only
allowing one processing to performing operations at a single time.  As
pointed out ... to avoid getting into trouble ... the active running
transaction can't be interrupted while it is performing the "locked"
operation.

compare&swap semantics tends to provide much higher level of concurrent
operations with much lower overhead for providing correct serialized
operation.

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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 13:56:37 -0500, Craddock, Chris wrote:

>> But, and this is what was so hard for me to get.  Mother can pass
>> Daughter an ECB for the Daughter task to use.  Daughter does some
>stuff
>> and then WAITs.  Mother goes about her business until she needs
>Daughter
>> do so something.   Mother clears the ECB and
>POSTs
>> it freeing Daughter from her slumber. "Get to work, you."  Daughter
>does
>> her thing and then WAITs for further instruction.
>
>NO Mother does not clear the ECB. Mother just issues POST against
>the ECB and the system does the rest. Clearing the ECB would cause the
>POST to fail.
>
One little glitch remains.  The mother needs to know when the daugnter
is ready to accept more work.  Either of the following works:

o The daughter can simply clear the ECB to zeroes and the mother
  can use this as an indication that the daughter is ready to be
  POSTed.  But in some cases, the mother might end up spinning
  until the daughter clears the second ECB.  So, better:

o Introduce a second ECB.  When the daughter has accepted the
  work item or is ready for more work, it clears the first ECB,
  POSTs the second, and WAITs on the first.  When the mother
  needs the daughter's assistance, it WAITs on the second ECB,
  clears it, and POSTS the first.  If there's a communication
  area, neither task should POST until it has completed reading
  or updating that communication area; effectively POSTing
  transfers ownership of the communication area (and the POSTed
  ECB) to the other task.  The mother must clear both ECBs before
  ATTACH.  The daughter must POST the second ECB as part of
  initialization after it has been ATTACHed.

  This is the reason that "a pair of ECBs" has been mentioned
  earlier in this thread.  (I believe I'm "close as in horseshoes"
  here.)

>> ECB's are used all over the place it seems, and are not just a control
>> block used with ATTACH.  I missed that, hence my confusion.
>> Am I even close?  This kept me up till 4:30 this morning.
>
>As in horshoes? Yes. The ECB is one of the most widely used "tools" in
>the system. As a serialization primitive it is just awful, but there's
>no getting away from it now.
>
>CC
>
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Who is reading your Old Drives? Freebie Web Seminar 1/29/2008

[Ed Gould]

Developing a sound data protection strategy is one of the more  
complex tasks faced by today's IT organizations. Historically  
speaking, many companies have been concerned about data protection  
only from access (i.e., authentication and authorization), backup and  
recovery or business continuity perspectives. Today, an increasing  
number of regulatory requirements that govern the protection of  
personal information (e.g., health records, financial statements,  
credit/debit card information, social security numbers etc.) are  
driving increased company efforts to protect information and guard  
against the various ways it may fall out of their control.


http://searchstorage.bitpipe.com/detail/RES/1199459074_778.html? 
src=wc_sstr_fgru_01_21_08&li=86737&asrc=EM_FGMC_2924825&uid=6570353


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Re: SMTP resend queued messages

[Richard Peurifoy]

Greg Zimmerman wrote:

Hello,

Is there a way to resend queued emails?  This past Friday afternoon, our 
primary email server was switched and I wasn't told about it until this 
morning.  Since the IP address of the email server changed (IPMAILERADDRESS 
parm), I've updated it and bounced SMTP to get it going.  In the meantime, 
those emails which were tried to be sent out since Friday afternoon are sitting 
around on the system, paired up with their HLQ.A0.ADDRBLOK and 
HLQ.A0.NOTE datasets.  One other thing when I do a SMSG SMTP QU 
command, the output is:


Msg from SMTP:  * - Mail Queues -
Msg from SMTP:  * Spool Queue: 0
Msg from SMTP:  * R: 172.999.999.999 : 2816 old.email_server.com
Msg from SMTP:  * Undeliverable Queue: 0
Msg from SMTP:  * --- Resolver Queues ---   
Msg from SMTP:  * Process Queue:   0
Msg from SMTP:  * Send Queue:  0
Msg from SMTP:  * Wait Queue:  0
Msg from SMTP:  * Retry Queue: 0
Msg from SMTP:  * Completed Queue: 0
Msg from SMTP:  * Error Queue: 0
*** 
I've edited the IP address and server name line with the R:
When I restart SMTP, it's aware of the datasets and allocates them with a 
disp of KEEP.  (See below)


IEF237I 091E ALLOCATED TO SYS5 
IEF285I   SMTP.A0007094.ADDRBLOK   KEPT

IEF285I   VOL SER NOS= PRD005.

Any relevent help or suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Greg 


You need to issue an "SMSG SMTP EXPIRE" command from TSO.
This will cause SMTP expire the DNS lookup's for the queued
mail and redo them.

See the section on SMTP in the IP USER'S GUIDE and COMMANDS.

To use the SMSG command, you must have the following at the
start of your SMTP PROC:

//SETSMSG EXEC PGM=SETSMSG,
// PARM=ON
//SYSPRINT  DD SYSOUT=A
//OUTPUTDD SYSOUT=A
//SYSIN DD DUMMY

See the section on SMTP in the IP Configuration Reference.

--
Richard

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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[McKown, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lindy Mayfield
> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 12:34 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[snip]

> 
> Lindy
> 
> Things like "atomic" and "compare and swap" are still beyond me right
> now.  I'll get it sooner or later.

"Atomic" is used quite a bit in computer science. Like the original
Greek, it means "indivisible". That is, when an atomic operation occurs,
any other process will either see the data in the original form, or in
the updated form. But it will never seen an intermediate form. It is
especially used in relational databases. This is usually done so that,
for instance, if you transfer money from checking to savings, you never
see the amount in both places. You either see the amount in checking or
in savings. This despite the fact that a lot of stuff is going on to do
the move.

"compare and swap" simply means that. It compares field1 against field2.
If field1 equals field2, then the contents of field3 is placed in
field2. What is "atomic" is that there is a "lock" that occurs so that
at the instant before field1 is compared against field2, no other
process is allowed to modify or even look at field2 until after the
instruction finishes. This ensures that once the operation starts that
no other process can make any updates or decisions based on the contents
of field2.

--
John McKown
Senior Systems Programmer
HealthMarkets
Keeping the Promise of Affordable Coverage
Administrative Services Group
Information Technology

The information contained in this e-mail message may be privileged
and/or confidential.  It is for intended addressee(s) only.  If you are
not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure,
reproduction, distribution or other use of this communication is
strictly prohibited and could, in certain circumstances, be a criminal
offense.  If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the
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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Craddock, Chris]

> But, and this is what was so hard for me to get.  Mother can pass
> Daughter an ECB for the Daughter task to use.  Daughter does some
stuff
> and then WAITs.  Mother goes about her business until she needs
Daughter
> do so something.   Mother clears the ECB and
POSTs
> it freeing Daughter from her slumber. "Get to work, you."  Daughter
does
> her thing and then WAITs for further instruction.

NO Mother does not clear the ECB. Mother just issues POST against
the ECB and the system does the rest. Clearing the ECB would cause the
POST to fail.

> ECB's are used all over the place it seems, and are not just a control
> block used with ATTACH.  I missed that, hence my confusion.
> Am I even close?  This kept me up till 4:30 this morning.

As in horshoes? Yes. The ECB is one of the most widely used "tools" in
the system. As a serialization primitive it is just awful, but there's
no getting away from it now.

CC

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Re: WLM and DB2

[Diehl, Gary (MVSSupport)]

Tom,

I'm looking at a presentation from the Webpage you specified.  Under
"Presentations", "Workload Manager", the A03.pdf "Workload Manager for
the DB2 Professional" PDF on page 10 has me a little bit confused.  It
says:

Workload Manager calculates a Performance Index for every ask in the
system that is ready
to execute. If it calculates out to exactly 1, then the task is
achieving its "Goal" as defined
to Workload manager. If it is more than 1, then the task is doing better
than its defined
"Goal" to Workload Manager. If it is below 1, then the task is not doing
as good as its
"Goal" as defined to Workload Manager.
...

A PI larger than 1 was "not meeting goal", I thought, not the other way
around?  Am I just misreading this somehow?

I'm also looking at the sample WLM spreadsheet from that same webpage (I
love to see others' policies, it really expands one's thinking), and I
see that columns O, P, Q, and R are flags of some sort, but I can't seem
to figure out what they mean in context.  Would you please explain them?

Thanks,

Gary Diehl
MVS Support
"The glass is neither half full or half empty; the engineer who designed
the glass simply allowed for a 100% increase in fluid storage."
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf
Of Tom Moulder
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 4:31 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: WLM and DB2

I did a presentation on WLM and DB2 at IDUG 2006.  Follow this link to
get a
copy of the presentation and a sample policy spreadsheet.  Call or write
if
you have questions about the presentation.

http://www.trexassociates.com/links.htm

Tom Moulder

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SMTP resend queued messages

[Greg Zimmerman]

Hello,

Is there a way to resend queued emails?  This past Friday afternoon, our 
primary email server was switched and I wasn't told about it until this 
morning.  Since the IP address of the email server changed (IPMAILERADDRESS 
parm), I've updated it and bounced SMTP to get it going.  In the meantime, 
those emails which were tried to be sent out since Friday afternoon are sitting 
around on the system, paired up with their HLQ.A0.ADDRBLOK and 
HLQ.A0.NOTE datasets.  One other thing when I do a SMSG SMTP QU 
command, the output is:

Msg from SMTP:  * - Mail Queues -
Msg from SMTP:  * Spool Queue: 0
Msg from SMTP:  * R: 172.999.999.999 : 2816 old.email_server.com
Msg from SMTP:  * Undeliverable Queue: 0
Msg from SMTP:  * --- Resolver Queues ---   
Msg from SMTP:  * Process Queue:   0
Msg from SMTP:  * Send Queue:  0
Msg from SMTP:  * Wait Queue:  0
Msg from SMTP:  * Retry Queue: 0
Msg from SMTP:  * Completed Queue: 0
Msg from SMTP:  * Error Queue: 0
*** 
I've edited the IP address and server name line with the R:
When I restart SMTP, it's aware of the datasets and allocates them with a 
disp of KEEP.  (See below)

IEF237I 091E ALLOCATED TO SYS5 
IEF285I   SMTP.A0007094.ADDRBLOK   KEPT
IEF285I   VOL SER NOS= PRD005.

Any relevent help or suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Greg 

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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Craddock, Chris]

> I understand that during a WAIT, bits 1-31 of the ECB hold the
> address of a control block.  If that control block resides above
> the Line, might not its address spoof the POST bit?  I suppose
> this is not a concern because no two tasks are allowed to WAIT
> concurrently on the same ECB.

The "control block" is the waiting RB - used by the system to locate the
waiting task and validate that the putative ECB really is being waited
on by that task and RB. RBs are guaranteed to be in 24 bit storage, so
no issue with spoofing.

CC

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Re: IGD17279I

[Mark Pace]

Found it -  z/OS DFSMSdfp Diagnosis


-- 
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Mainline Information Systems

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Re: IPCS in batch

[Robert Wright]

Frank Chu wrote:

We have a batch job that's worked reliably for the last 7 or 8 years 
that's stopped working when we moved to zOS 1.9 from zOS 1.8.  For some 
reason that I can't figure out, "BLSCPRNT CURRENT" is not processing any 
more.  Other parameter for BLSCPRNT works, just CURRENT is failing.


Nothing in the IPCS docs stand out and I didn't come across anything in 
the APAR database.  Anybody else come across this?


Our level 2 team has recently been working with a 1.7 customer who has 
been seeing a looping condition when running BLSCPRNT CURRENT.  I 
located some logic that clearly needed to be updated when dumps include 
data above the bar, a problem that doesn't appear to be the customer's 
specific problem with the CLIST.  We're currently poring over some 
output supplied where LIST and CONLIST options were turned on.


I'd recommend that you open a PMR and describe what is going wrong for 
you.  I hope it turns out to be the same thing and can be addressed with 
a single set of PTFs.


Bob Wright - MVS Service Aids

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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Tom Harper]

Lindy,

Close. Mother should not clear the ECB, as while the daughter task is
waiting, the ECB contains the address of the daughter's RB.

Correct protocol is for the WAITer (in this case, the daughter) to clear
the ECB immediately after being POSTed by mother.

Tom Harper

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lindy Mayfield
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 12:34 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

The light bulb finally went off, ever so dimly.  Now I think I got it.  

ATTACH can use an ECB that the Mother can wait on until Daughter ends.
The POSTing of the ECB is done by the system upon completion of
Daughter.

But, and this is what was so hard for me to get.  Mother can pass
Daughter an ECB for the Daughter task to use.  Daughter does some stuff
and then WAITs.  Mother goes about her business until she needs Daughter
do so something.   Mother clears the ECB and POSTs
it freeing Daughter from her slumber. "Get to work, you."  Daughter does
her thing and then WAITs for further instruction.

Mother could also POST with a return code indicating that Daughter
should just call it a night and end, whereas Mother could WAIT on the
original ECB used with the0 ATTACH until Daughter comes back home. 

ECB's are used all over the place it seems, and are not just a control
block used with ATTACH.  I missed that, hence my confusion.

Am I even close?  This kept me up till 4:30 this morning.  

Lindy

Things like "atomic" and "compare and swap" are still beyond me right
now.  I'll get it sooner or later.

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IGD17279I

[Mark Pace]

I used to believe that I was good at reading IBM doc.

z/OS 1.9
IGD17279I 1 VOLUMES WERE REJECTED BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT INITIALIZED (*
04160054*)
See the ANTRQST section in z/OS DFSMSdfp Advanced Services for information
on the QFRVOLS volume reason texts and volume reason code.
diagdata
   is the DADSM diagnostic code or OTHERS after 10 diagnostic codes have
been displayed for a failure reason.

*z/OS DFSMSdfp Advanced Services* says
Deleted
   Information Information on the ANTRQST macro has been removed and is now
contained in z/OS DFSMS Advanced Copy Services, SC35-0428.

*z/OS DFSMS Advanced Copy Services*
has information on the format of ANTRQST and the RETINFO field, but no
explanation of the return codes, or where to find them.

I'm now at a total loss as to figure out what *04160054* is trying to tell
me.

The DASD volume is initialized and online, there are other datasets on it
that are in use.

Anyone know where I can find additional information?






-- 
Mark Pace
Mainline Information Systems

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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Lindy Mayfield]

The light bulb finally went off, ever so dimly.  Now I think I got it.  

ATTACH can use an ECB that the Mother can wait on until Daughter ends.
The POSTing of the ECB is done by the system upon completion of
Daughter.

But, and this is what was so hard for me to get.  Mother can pass
Daughter an ECB for the Daughter task to use.  Daughter does some stuff
and then WAITs.  Mother goes about her business until she needs Daughter
do so something.   Mother clears the ECB and POSTs
it freeing Daughter from her slumber. "Get to work, you."  Daughter does
her thing and then WAITs for further instruction.

Mother could also POST with a return code indicating that Daughter
should just call it a night and end, whereas Mother could WAIT on the
original ECB used with the0 ATTACH until Daughter comes back home. 

ECB's are used all over the place it seems, and are not just a control
block used with ATTACH.  I missed that, hence my confusion.

Am I even close?  This kept me up till 4:30 this morning.  

Lindy

Things like "atomic" and "compare and swap" are still beyond me right
now.  I'll get it sooner or later.


-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of David Logan
Sent: 20. tammikuuta 2008 18:55
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

The bottom line is that one task needs to be suspended until some event
occurs.
WAIT causes MVS to suspend the task until the ECB is posted
POST causes MVS to resume the task that has been waiting.

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IPCS in batch

[Frank Chu]

Hi All,

We have a batch job that's worked reliably for the last 7 or 8 years that's 
stopped working when we moved to zOS 1.9 from zOS 1.8.  For some reason 
that I can't figure out, "BLSCPRNT CURRENT" is not processing any 
more.  Other parameter for BLSCPRNT works, just CURRENT is failing.


Nothing in the IPCS docs stand out and I didn't come across anything in the 
APAR database.  Anybody else come across this?


Thanks
Frank

 Development Programmer
 Cole Software LLC
 www.colesoft.com
 Phone : 540.456.6164  Fax : 540.456.6658
 Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] 


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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Anne & Lynn Wheeler]

The following message is a courtesy copy of an article
that has been posted to bit.listserv.ibm-main,alt.folklore.computers as well.

[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Paul Gilmartin) writes:
> I have believed, and other updates to this thread appear to concur,
> that WAIT/POST are older than CS.  At some time, then, WAIT/POST
> code must have used some other locking mechanism.  So, after CS
> first became available there may have been some interval before it
> was reliable to use CS to bypass POST.  When did that interim
> conclude, making it safe to bypass POST in that fashion?  And might
> there be open-source archival MVS (3.8 or earlier) that could
> execute on emulated hardware supporting CS, but for which POST
> requires the actual SVC?

re:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2008b.html#31 How does ATTACH pass address of ECB 
to child?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2008b.html#47 How does ATTACH pass address of ECB 
to child?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2008b.html#48 How does ATTACH pass address of ECB 
to child?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2008b.html#50 How does ATTACH pass address of ECB 
to child?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2008b.html#51 How does ATTACH pass address of ECB 
to child?

wait/post was svc into the kernel running disabled for interrupts
... and therefor would be "serialized" from the standpoint of other
events.

the state of the multiprocessing art when charlie was working on
fine-grain multiprocessor locking for cp67 (and invented compare&swap
instruction) ... was single supervisor/kernel "spin-lock" ... i.e. a
single kernel variable that all first level interrupts handlers would
perform a "test&set" on initial entry.

if the test&set was succesful, execution would continue thru the first
level interrupt handler and into the rest of the kernel. if test&set was
unsuccesful, the code would continue to branch back to the test&set
instruction until succesful. on leaving the kernel (for
application/problem execution), the global kernel spin-lock would be
cleared to zeros (allowing other processors to execute in the kernel).

implicit was that all wait/post operations were correctly serialized
... along with effectively all other kernel functions ... by combination
of the kernel running disabled for interrupts ... and, on real
multiprocessor, test&set serialization on the global kernel spin-lock.

as noted, with other organizations believing that test&set was adequate
for all multiprocessor functions ... the challenge given the science
center
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#545tech

was to come up with compare&swap uses that weren't multiprocessor
specific. the result was the stuff that appears in the appendex
of the principles of opertion ... previous reference
http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/dz9zr003/A.6?DT=20040504121320

where it was possible to implement correct, concurrent shared operations
w/o requiring the overhead of kernel/supervisor calls (which achieved
correctly serialized operation, in part by running disabled for
asynchronous interrupts).

other past posts mentioning various multiprocessor and/or compare&swap
interrupt
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#smp

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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[McKown, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of McKown, John
> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 11:28 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?
> 
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin
> > Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 11:11 AM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?
> > 
> > 
> > On Sun, 20 Jan 2008 11:09:57 -0800, Edward Jaffe wrote:
> > 
> 
> [snip]
> 
> > 
> > And might IBM designers choose to convert to YA seriaization
> > technique in WAIT/POST (PLO?), rendering the customer and ISV use
> > of CS invalid?  I recognize this would be very difficult to do
> > in the existing marketplace, but it would transgress no commitment
> > in the absence of documentation stating that such use of CS is a
> > supported interface.  Remember the "provided".
> > 
> 
> [snip]
> 
> > 
> > -- gil
> 
> Gil,
> 
> Interesting question. I understand the PLO argument, but I 
> think that CS
> and its family will still work, regardless of how IBM implements the
> WAIT/POST logic. Unless I am totally understanding the following, from

Uh, make that "misunderstanding" instead of "understanding". Damn
arthritis!

> the POPS:
> 
> 
> When an equal comparison occurs,  the  third  operand  is  stored  at
> the
> second-operand  location.  The fetch of the second operand 
> for purposes
> of
> comparison and the store into the second-operand location 
> appear to  be
> a
> block-concurrent interlocked-update reference as observed by 
> other CPUs.
> ...
> A  serialization  function  is performed before the operand is fetched
> and
> again after the operation is completed.
> 
> 
> 
> Indicates, to me, that a PLO or any other instruction being 
> executed on
> another CPU will still see the atomic results of the CS instruction.
> 
> --

--
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Senior Systems Programmer
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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[McKown, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin
> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 11:11 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?
> 
> 
> On Sun, 20 Jan 2008 11:09:57 -0800, Edward Jaffe wrote:
> 

[snip]

> 
> And might IBM designers choose to convert to YA seriaization
> technique in WAIT/POST (PLO?), rendering the customer and ISV use
> of CS invalid?  I recognize this would be very difficult to do
> in the existing marketplace, but it would transgress no commitment
> in the absence of documentation stating that such use of CS is a
> supported interface.  Remember the "provided".
> 

[snip]

> 
> -- gil

Gil,

Interesting question. I understand the PLO argument, but I think that CS
and its family will still work, regardless of how IBM implements the
WAIT/POST logic. Unless I am totally understanding the following, from
the POPS:


When an equal comparison occurs,  the  third  operand  is  stored  at
the
second-operand  location.  The fetch of the second operand for purposes
of
comparison and the store into the second-operand location appear to  be
a
block-concurrent interlocked-update reference as observed by other CPUs.
...
A  serialization  function  is performed before the operand is fetched
and
again after the operation is completed.



Indicates, to me, that a PLO or any other instruction being executed on
another CPU will still see the atomic results of the CS instruction.

--
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Senior Systems Programmer
HealthMarkets
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Administrative Services Group
Information Technology

The information contained in this e-mail message may be privileged
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Re: BPXOINIT shutdown failure

[Chase, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Mark Yuhas
> 
> The following contains excerpts the SYSLOG from a shutdown 
> from Saturday night, 1/19:
> 
> F BPXOINIT,SHUTDOWN=FORKS
> [ snip ]
> 
> After a few minutes, the following PID was still active.
> 
> D OMVS,ASID=ALL
> BPXO040I 18.41.50 DISPLAY OMVS 454
> OMVS 000E FORK SHUTDOWN   OMVS=(00,FS)
> USER JOBNAME  ASIDPID   PPID STATE   START CT_SECS
> OMVSKERN BPXOINIT 002A  1  0 MRI--- 18.15.4059.041
>   LATCHWAITPID= 0 CMD=BPXPINPR
>   SERVER=Init Process AF=0 MF=0 TYPE=FILE
> 
> 
> What do I do now to end BPXOINIT?

F OMVS,SHUTDOWN (without the initial F BPXOINIT,...) makes everything go
away gracefully here (z/OS 1.7).

-jc-

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Re: CFW with Syncsort

[(IBM Mainframe Discussion List)]

 
 
In a message dated 1/21/2008 10:39:36 A.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>It looks like the GDPS group also misunderstood CFW.
...
>Excerpt from GDPS
>You should eliminate any known exploitation of Cache Fast Write  (CFW).
Disk write operations using CFW (Cache Fast Write) are written into  cache
but not to
the disk. Having CFW operations in progress at the time a  HyperSwap occurs
can yield
unpredictable results since there is no  corresponding mirrored cache content
in the
secondary disk subsystem. Any  known exploiters of CFW (such as DFSORT)
should
be customized to not use  CFW.
 
It looks to me rather that the GDPS group did not misunderstand CFW, since  
they are saying not to use CFW with GDPS, then they explain why not, and in  
their explanation they offer what looks like a correct understanding of  CFW.
 
GDPS uses PPRC to keep a secondary volume in synch with a primary  volume.  
When data is written to a primary PPRC volume, the primary  controller writes 
the data into its (primary) cache, sends the data down the  communications link 
to the secondary volume's controller which then writes that  data into its 
(the secondary's) cache, sends a signal back to the primary  controller that 
the 
data is now safely in the secondary's cache, and then and  only then will the 
primary controller signal that the I/O request on the primary  LPAR is 
complete.  (The order of the first two operations I described above  could be 
reversed without affecting the final outcome, namely that the primary  I/O is 
not 
deemed complete until the secondary is known to have a valid copy of  the data. 
 
But it may well be that the controller does both of these  operations 
simultaneously for performance reasons.  I don't know that  detail.  And in 
fact the 
controller should, in my opinion, start writing  the data to the comm link 
before writing it into its cache, since the comm link  operation could take a 
much longer time to complete than the cache operation if  the secondary's 
distance is great enough.)  The designers of the PPRC  microcode could have 
chosen to 
support CFW operations on a primary PPRC I/O  request, but evidently decided 
not to.  They documented this somewhere, and  the GDPS group were able to find 
it and write a warning not to use CFW on a PPRC  primary.  The purpose of CFW 
data is for easily recreatable, intermediate  data that almost never really 
needs to be made permanent.  Sort work files  are an excellent example of CFW 
data.  I don't see why anything bad could  happen if you allow CFW data onto a 
PPRC primary, since presumably the CFW is  easily recreatable.  And you 
probably would not want to send such data down  a communications link anyway.  
I am 
here speaking of normal  operations.  When Hyperswap gets involved, there is 
an abnormal operation  underway.  I suspect the warning against CFW on a PPRC 
primary is  self-defensive overkill on the part of the GDPS lawyers.
 
Bill  Fairchild
Franklin, TN





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Re: How does ATTACH pass address of ECB to child?

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Sun, 20 Jan 2008 11:09:57 -0800, Edward Jaffe wrote:

>Binyamin Dissen wrote:
>> In the past (370 pre PLO), CS was the only way to do this function.
>>
>> While it certainly is possible for IBM to rewrite WAIT/POST to use the PLO
>> instruction, I certainly doubt that such a code change will occur.
>
>Especially since PLO and CS do not serialize each other's updates!!
>
>> The code in the POPs is used - all over the place - to avoid an unnecessary
>> SVC/PC call. It is completely safe to use.
>
>Indeed. Used heavily by z/OS and nearly every z/OS-based ISV product
>I've ever seen.
>
I have believed, and other updates to this thread appear to concur,
that WAIT/POST are older than CS.  At some time, then, WAIT/POST
code must have used some other locking mechanism.  So, after CS
first became available there may have been some interval before it
was reliable to use CS to bypass POST.  When did that interim
conclude, making it safe to bypass POST in that fashion?  And might
there be open-source archival MVS (3.8 or earlier) that could
execute on emulated hardware supporting CS, but for which POST
requires the actual SVC?

And might IBM designers choose to convert to YA seriaization
technique in WAIT/POST (PLO?), rendering the customer and ISV use
of CS invalid?  I recognize this would be very difficult to do
in the existing marketplace, but it would transgress no commitment
in the absence of documentation stating that such use of CS is a
supported interface.  Remember the "provided".

I understand that during a WAIT, bits 1-31 of the ECB hold the
address of a control block.  If that control block resides above
the Line, might not its address spoof the POST bit?  I suppose
this is not a concern because no two tasks are allowed to WAIT
concurrently on the same ECB.

-- gil

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Re: CFW with Syncsort

[John Ticic]

> > John,
> > 
> > I have been told that CFW must be turned off for Hyperswap, but I never
> > understood why. You say that CFW must be written to disk for Hyperswap,
> > but
> > why can all the other writes still be deferred in cache/NVS?
> > 
> > Ron
> > 
> > > 
> > > Hyperswap would be one of those circumstances were you would also want
> > > the
> > > I/O to be written to the disk. In that case you must ensure that CFW
> > is
> > > not
> > > being used.
> > > 
> > > John
> > > 
> 
> G'day Ron,
> 
> sorry, I hadn't seen your update.
> 
> 'written to the disk' wasn't exactly what I meant to say! 
> 
> 'All writes have to be in the secondary disk subsystem before the I/O is
> completed' is more accurate. This is not the case for CFW.
> 
> John

G'day Ron,

I should know better than to argue with you!

You're right. It looks like the GDPS group also misunderstood CFW.

Excerpt from DS8000 introduction and planning.

cache fast write
A form of the fast-write operation in which the storage server 
writes the data directly to cache, where it is available for later
destaging.

Excerpt from GDPS 

You should eliminate any known exploitation of Cache Fast Write (CFW).
Disk write operations using CFW (Cache Fast Write) are written into cache
but not to
the disk. Having CFW operations in progress at the time a HyperSwap occurs
can yield
unpredictable results since there is no corresponding mirrored cache content
in the
secondary disk subsystem. Any known exploiters of CFW (such as DFSORT)
should
be customized to not use CFW.

And just to complete the thread. To turn CFW on or off at the LCU level use
IDCAMS SETCACHE.

---
John

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Re: CFW with Syncsort

[Reda, John]

SyncSort should use CFW for SORTWK I/O unless the device is not enabled
for it.  SORTOUT I/O will use DFW. 

John Reda
Syncsort, Inc.

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> On
Behalf Of John Baker
Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 4:30 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: CFW with Syncsort
 
>Can anyone confirm whether or not Syncsort uses CFW?  

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Re: BPXOINIT shutdown failure

[Mark Yuhas]

Thanks to the respondents.

At one time, I had RTFMd that stated the way to bring down OMVS/USS was
to issue the 'F BPXOINIT,SHUTDOWN=FILEOWNER' & 'F
BPXOINIT,SHUTDOWN=FORKS' commands.

These two commands have worked until Saturday.  I will use the new
command and monitor its success.

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Re: z890 2086-160 w/ 2 IFLs on eBay

[Eric Chevalier]

On 19 Jan 2008 03:36:04 -0800,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (R.S.) wrote:

>I wonder why people get excited about z890 on eBay.
>Second hand equipment is widely available, although not on aBay.
>The prices for z/8xx are reasonably low, I heard about $10k for z/800 
>with CPs.

But excited they do become. Looks like that z890 sold for $40k to
"packman3".

Eric

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Re: DFHSM QUESTION : ATTEMPTING TO FIND MIGRAT2 VOLSER

[Lizette Koehler]

There have been rare instances of a bad recall.  Mostly due to I/O errors on 
the tape. I do not remember any recent issues for DFSMShsm for recall.


I maybe incorrect, but I think you can go to the HSM logs to see how the data 
set was recalled.  I believe it will include the volser of the tape when the 
recall occurred.  Or identify the time of the recall (hh.mm.ss) and then go 
into the SYSLOG/OPERLOG and find out what migrat tapes were mounted at that 
time.  

Lizette

>   
>  I am investigating a complaint made by one of our users.  The user 
> stipulates that when the dsn was recalled from ML2 to disk, it (recall) 
> corrupted the data.  I would like to know if there is a way of finding the 
> VOLSER of the ML2 after the dataset had been put back on disk.  This would 
> help me determine if the tape has some type of physical problem.  I checked 
> the DFHSM STORAGE ADMIN guide but I couldn't find the command.  
>   
>  Thanks in advance for your help.
>

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Re: IDC3009I return code *5*??

[Thompson, Steve]

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of David Andrews
Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 3:28 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: IDC3009I return code *5*??

I did a LISTC VOL against one of my catalogs today and was rewarded in
part with these entries:


Dave, look at APAR OA22002 and see if it applies to your situation.

Regards,
Steve Thompson

-- All opinions expressed by me are my own and may not necessarily
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Re: Monitoring DASD Capacity/Usage

[Rob Scott]

Mike,

I feel your pain, as I went through this with the MXI 4.3 SGRP command (which 
relies on the information returned by SMS to report on space usage). Quite a 
few users reported the inconsistancy - so in MXI G2, the SGRP command now uses 
the latest cached LSPACE data gathered by the MXI server for all volumes in the 
storage group.

You could use DCOLLECT and then combine the SMS report reports and those that 
report on DASD volumes to produce accurate reports. This is easier if you have 
SAS - but can be done with REXX with a little bit of effort.

Unfortunately the SSI calls to SMS to get the SGRPs and volumes in a SGRP are 
not a GUPI - so it is not simple to roll-yer-own assembler program to do this 
all for you.




Rob Scott
Rocket Software, Inc
275 Grove Street
Newton, MA 02466
617-614-2305
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of 
Michael B Smith
Sent: 21 January 2008 14:09
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Monitoring DASD Capacity/Usage

According to IBM, (see APARS OA05936 and OA21002 and marketing request
MR0508025651)
there are several ways that ISMF can report conflicting and/or incorrect 
storate usage numbers at the Storage Group level as compared to the volume 
level.
We have on OA21002 but still see conflicting numbers.
If ISMF is not totally reliable as to reporting space usage, what is the 
current best way to report on DASD usage/capacity, say in a single DB8300 from 
a DFSMS perspective? IE Total space allocated to the SG, used by the SG, free 
space in the SG, etc.


Regards,
Mike Smith
706-275-3435
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: DFHSM QUESTION : ATTEMPTING TO FIND MIGRAT2 VOLSER

[Bob Shannon]

>The user stipulates that when the dsn was recalled from ML2 to disk, it 
>>(recall) corrupted the data.

It's more likely that the data was corrupted before the dataset was migrated.

Bob Shannon
Rocket Software

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Re: Monitoring DASD Capacity/Usage

[Vernooy, C.P. - SPLXM]

"Michael B Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]
com>...
> According to IBM, (see APARS OA05936 and OA21002 and marketing request

> MR0508025651)
> there are several ways that ISMF can report conflicting and/or
incorrect 
> storate usage numbers at
> the Storage Group level as compared to the volume level.
> We have on OA21002 but still see conflicting numbers. 
> If ISMF is not totally reliable as to reporting space usage, what is
the 
> current best way to report on
> DASD usage/capacity, say in a single DB8300 from a DFSMS perspective?
IE 
> Total space allocated 
> to the SG, used by the SG, free space in the SG, etc.
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Mike Smith 


I understand you need to do it with standard, free available tools? You
can use IDCAMS Dcollect to gather information about your dasd, including
SMS constructs. 
If you have MXG, it is a piece of cake (half a day work) to condense
this into useable figures, store them in a SAS database and produce
beautiful plots for short and longterm planning. 
If you don't have MXG, but you have SAS, it is a little more work.
If you don't have SAS, you must interprete the records yourself and
produce your reports.

Kees.
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Monitoring DASD Capacity/Usage

[Michael B Smith]

According to IBM, (see APARS OA05936 and OA21002 and marketing request 
MR0508025651)
there are several ways that ISMF can report conflicting and/or incorrect 
storate usage numbers at
the Storage Group level as compared to the volume level.
We have on OA21002 but still see conflicting numbers. 
If ISMF is not totally reliable as to reporting space usage, what is the 
current best way to report on
DASD usage/capacity, say in a single DB8300 from a DFSMS perspective? IE 
Total space allocated 
to the SG, used by the SG, free space in the SG, etc.


Regards,
Mike Smith 
706-275-3435
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: New Mainframes coming in February

[McKown, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Phil Payne
> Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 2:58 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: New Mainframes coming in February
> 
> 
> The announcement in February is scarcely news.  I predicted 
> 'late 2007 or early 2008' back in
> June 2005 ( 
> http://www.isham-research.co.uk/mainframe_2008.html ) and the 
> dates have only
> firmed up since then.
> 
> Shipment in 1Q is a mild surprise - I was expecting April.
> 
> Whilst I happily accept the overall performance claims, I'll 
> be interested to see variations
> between workloads.  The LSPR guys have likely been having a fun time.
> 
> And it's the small ones that will really be interesting.  
> Let's see what the physical
> granularity is like.
> 
> -- 
>   Phil Payne

I'm more interested in the new instructions, and any enhancements to the
architecture itself (if any). The only way that we will get one is if it
is cheaper (in hard dollars) than our current z9BC.

--
John McKown
Senior Systems Programmer
HealthMarkets
Keeping the Promise of Affordable Coverage
Administrative Services Group
Information Technology

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Re: CFW with Syncsort

[John Ticic]

> John,
> 
> I have been told that CFW must be turned off for Hyperswap, but I never
> understood why. You say that CFW must be written to disk for Hyperswap,
> but
> why can all the other writes still be deferred in cache/NVS?
> 
> Ron
> 
> > 
> > Hyperswap would be one of those circumstances were you would also want
> > the
> > I/O to be written to the disk. In that case you must ensure that CFW
> is
> > not
> > being used.
> > 
> > John
> > 

G'day Ron,

sorry, I hadn't seen your update.

'written to the disk' wasn't exactly what I meant to say! 

'All writes have to be in the secondary disk subsystem before the I/O is
completed' is more accurate. This is not the case for CFW.

John

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Re: LPAR Rename

[Vernooy, C.P. - SPLXM]

"Vernooy, C.P. - SPLXM" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]
t>...
> "Mark Jacobs" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
> > Does anyone know the procedure to rename an LPAR on a z9 without a
> POR?
> > 
> > -- 
> > Mark Jacobs
> 
> We happened to try this last week and found out it was not possible.
> 
> Kees.

Some more details:
1. You cannot give an existing Lpar another name through dynamic IOCDS.
2. You can rename a reserved (name=*) lpar to a real name.
3. You can rename an existing lpar to reserved (name=*).

So yes, you can rename an Lpar in 2 IOCDS updates, rename it first to
"*" and then rename it to its new name.

Kees.
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