Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
If one installs z/VM solely for use as a Linux hypervisor, would there be a need for RSCS? Maybe. There is certainly a need to perform maintenance to the z/VM system as well as administrative functions such as creating virtual machines. Hmmm RSCS seems to have come a long way since I last touched a VM system (VM/ESA 2.1, about a dozen years ago). Back then, RSCS was used mostly like the NJE component of JES. Similarly, would there be a need to talk about licensing terms for RACF/VM to run on an IFL, if z/VM were used solely as a Linux hypervisor? Sure. To control who performs the needed maintenance and administration, for example. But the intent of my question was whether one could just purchase the standard RACF/VM license and then run it on z/VM on an IFL, or does one have to obtain special dispensation from IBM to run RACF/VM on an IFL, as was stated for RSCS? Indeed if z/VM is only run as a Hypervisor running a whole mess of Linux Penguins, then RSCS is not going to be needed to establish a NJE connection between JES2-RSCS. RACF/VM will depend on your auditors and what they want to see as to the activity of the SYSPROGs. Here we run RACF/VM for the 3-4 SYSPROGs only to track where they go. For the MAINT userid or any share USERID we force the SYSPROG to use the LOGONBY feature of signon. Although you might consider DIRMAINT as an addon to manage your z/VM Directory Minidisks although it can be done manually in the z/VM Directory. Just keep in mind you may still see a requirement for ISPF/VM 3.2 which was the latest and greatest thing out back in 1988. It has not changed since and it is for using ISPF as the interface for RACF/VM and DIRMAINT. They both work fine using the command line interface and it saved here the outrageous offering of first $50K to license it and then it dropped down to $25K plus SS for a product which had not been updated in 16 years when I implemented RACF/VM and DIRMAINT. They are both very reasonable in cost and keep the auditors very happy. jim -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
But the intent of my question was whether one could just purchase the standard RACF/VM license and then run it on z/VM on an IFL, or does one have to obtain special dispensation from IBM to run RACF/VM on an IFL, as was stated for RSCS? It's not clear to me if everyone understands that the following infrastructure support programs are priced features of z/VM V5 and therefore are perfectly capable of being licensed without special dispensation on IFLs: z/VM V5 Base (including CP, CMS, GCS, TCP/IP, REXX, PIPEs, much more...) z/VM V5 RACF z/VM V5 DirMaint z/VM V5 Performance Toolkit z/VM V5 RSCS The old separate RACF/VM program product is no longer marketed nor supported on modern VM versions. Same goes for the old versions of DirMaint, RSCS, and the predecessors of the Performance Toolkit. If you want any of these on z/VM V5 you license them as features of z/VM V5. They are 'allowed' to run anywhere you have z/VM itself licensed. David -- David J. Chase, WW zSeries Software Sales-- --IBM 18th Fl, 11 Madison Ave, NYC, NY 10010 -- -- 917-472-3346 - dchase at us.ibm.com -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
But the intent of my question was whether one could just purchase the standard RACF/VM license and then run it on z/VM on an IFL, or does one have to obtain special dispensation from IBM to run RACF/VM on an IFL, as was stated for RSCS? No. RACF for z/VM is considered part of the infrastructure necessary for running new workloads as well as old workloads. Along with the need for the usual types of security such as authentication, data access and so on, you have to keep in mind that RACF for z/VM is different from RACF for z/OS in that various things related to being a hypervisor need to be secured: - CP Privilege Classes - VSWITCH access - VLAN access - DCSS (DisContiguous Shared Segments) - Default and maximum virtual storage sizes - Virtual NIC definitions and more. From the very optimistic point of view the above statement would be recommended by Auditors and in general it is true. But in reality with z/VM running only as a Hypervisor for Linux Penguins, a shop will have 2-3 SYSPROGs (may even be z/OS'ers) who take care of z/VM. No one else, no matter how much they tell you them will only z/VM for some CMS application will have a USERID. Because the SYSPROGs have to back each other up, all of them are going to have all the rights to all of the above; Gotta trust someone in general. One can grow into all the right and proper things once the Penguins become popular where you live. Keep in mind, RACF/VM DIRMAINT are indeed optional products and not required for z/VM or to run zLinux. Everything runs just fine technically without them. This is true for an IFl implementation or even if you run it on a CP bringing up z/OS as what VM'ers called the Intruder Operating System. When the implementations get going and one has maturing Penguin colonies, then indeed, one may catch the eyes of auditors and they will be interested in tracking who has access into the Hyervisor, colonies of penguins, and what you are doing to the virtual critters. jim -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
There is a variety of confusion. Sorry I've been away for so long. Real Life. Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer and am not dispensing legal advice. Rather, I am giving my observation of, at the practical level, How The System Works. Hardware: While you may own the machine outright, you do not own the LIC (the microcode), but have a License to Use from IBM. IBM's obvious (to a layman) intent for the use of the Integrated Facility for Linux is, uh, for Linux. The announcement removes any [IBM] impediment to OpenSolaris on an IFL. Software: z/VM *and all of it's features* (RACF, RSCS, DIRMAINT, PERFORMANCE TOOLKIT) are licensed to run on IFLs in support of that Linux workload. They are licensed under the International Program License Agreement (IPLA) and incur a one-time charge (OTC) with an option to pay an annual fee for service and support. For system software and most IBM application middleware, the OTC is based on the number of CPUs. Sometimes the number installed, sometimes the number you use. (It depends on whether a license manager is involved.) z/VM Co. use the number of installed CPUs. A product that is licensed under the IBM Customer Agreement (ICA) with a monthly license charge (MLC) is NOT licensed to run on an IFL. Why? Because MLC is based on MSUs. There are zero MSUs on an IFL ergo no capacity to run software that consumes MSUs (paraphrasing). You can ask IBM for a Special Bid to give you an explicit license to run ICA software on an IFL. You will usually pay a calculated one-time charge that is indexed to the MLC. The license-to-use may be limited to specific use cases. None of the other IBM operating systems (z/OS, z/TPF, z/VSE) are licensed to run on IFLs and we do not grant Special Bids for them. They are traditional workload. They may serve as clients or servers to Linux, but they do not support the operation and management of Linux or z/VM. We also don't grant Special Bids for things like compilers and databases - things that, again, are NOT in direct support of managing the Linux (and, now, OpenSolaris) workloads on an IFL. We have granted Special Bids for PVM, VTAM, NetView, ISPF and other software that is in support of the system itself. The above are general observations and you may find an exception along the way. The answer yesterday may not be the answer tomorrow. If you have any concerns or questions about a specific piece of software, I recommend you contact your IBM rep or business partner - don't assume anything. Hope this helps. Alan Altmark z/VM Development IBM -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On 11/19/2008 at 7:26 PM, Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -snip- As I read that, then, prior to yesterday the license terms for z/VM prohibited running it in an IFL other than to run a Linux guest. Now the prohibition has been weakened to allow OpenSolaris guests also. That is correct. (BTW, the SineNomine web page states that OpenSolaris requires z/VM; it will not run native in any LPAR.) As is that. Their design goal from the beginning was to make use of z/VM to reduce the (already staggering) amount of work that would need to be done for the port. Mark Post -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tony Harminc In the case of z/VM products such as RSCS, IBM has said repeatedly that they are happy to talk about licensing terms for running on IFLs. If one installs z/VM solely for use as a Linux hypervisor, would there be a need for RSCS? Similarly, would there be a need to talk about licensing terms for RACF/VM to run on an IFL, if z/VM were used solely as a Linux hypervisor? -jc- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:41:05 -0600, Chase, John wrote: If one installs z/VM solely for use as a Linux hypervisor, would there be a need for RSCS? Maybe. There is certainly a need to perform maintenance to the z/VM system as well as administrative functions such as creating virtual machines. Similarly, would there be a need to talk about licensing terms for RACF/VM to run on an IFL, if z/VM were used solely as a Linux hypervisor? Sure. To control who performs the needed maintenance and administration, for example. -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tom Marchant On Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:41:05 -0600, Chase, John wrote: If one installs z/VM solely for use as a Linux hypervisor, would there be a need for RSCS? Maybe. There is certainly a need to perform maintenance to the z/VM system as well as administrative functions such as creating virtual machines. Hmmm RSCS seems to have come a long way since I last touched a VM system (VM/ESA 2.1, about a dozen years ago). Back then, RSCS was used mostly like the NJE component of JES. Similarly, would there be a need to talk about licensing terms for RACF/VM to run on an IFL, if z/VM were used solely as a Linux hypervisor? Sure. To control who performs the needed maintenance and administration, for example. But the intent of my question was whether one could just purchase the standard RACF/VM license and then run it on z/VM on an IFL, or does one have to obtain special dispensation from IBM to run RACF/VM on an IFL, as was stated for RSCS? -jc- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On 11/20/2008 at 8:41 AM, Chase, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -snip- If one installs z/VM solely for use as a Linux hypervisor, would there be a need for RSCS? Sure. Those Linux guests don't live in isolation. A good number of shops did go through the special bid process to get RSCS licensed. Similarly, would there be a need to talk about licensing terms for RACF/VM to run on an IFL, if z/VM were used solely as a Linux hypervisor? Absolutely, particularly if you want access to your Linux systems controlled by policy. Also things like which guests can connect to which virtual switches, or specific VLANs. Mark Post -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On 11/20/2008 at 2:01 PM, Chase, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -snip- But the intent of my question was whether one could just purchase the standard RACF/VM license and then run it on z/VM on an IFL, or does one have to obtain special dispensation from IBM to run RACF/VM on an IFL, as was stated for RSCS? No. RACF for z/VM is considered part of the infrastructure necessary for running new workloads as well as old workloads. Along with the need for the usual types of security such as authentication, data access and so on, you have to keep in mind that RACF for z/VM is different from RACF for z/OS in that various things related to being a hypervisor need to be secured: - CP Privilege Classes - VSWITCH access - VLAN access - DCSS (DisContiguous Shared Segments) - Default and maximum virtual storage sizes - Virtual NIC definitions and more. Mark Post -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:45:10 +0100, Vernooy, C.P. - SPLXM wrote: As I read it, z/VM on an IFL is now allowed to run a Solaris guest, until now z/VM was only allowed to run z/Linux guests. How would it know what operating system is being IPLed? -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
Tom Marchant wrote: On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:45:10 +0100, Vernooy, C.P. - SPLXM wrote: As I read it, z/VM on an IFL is now allowed to run a Solaris guest, until now z/VM was only allowed to run z/Linux guests. How would it know what operating system is being IPLed? AFAIK it wasn't a technical restriction but a licensing concern. -- Mark Jacobs Time Customer Service Tampa, FL We're in the stickiest situation since Sticky the stick insect got stuck on a sticky bun. Rowan Atkinson as Captain Edmund Blackadder in Blackadder Goes Forth -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:29:36 -0500, Mark Jacobs wrote: Tom Marchant wrote: On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:45:10 +0100, Vernooy, C.P. - SPLXM wrote: As I read it, z/VM on an IFL is now allowed to run a Solaris guest, until now z/VM was only allowed to run z/Linux guests. How would it know what operating system is being IPLed? AFAIK it wasn't a technical restriction but a licensing concern. Is there a licensing restriction on an IFL that specifies what operating systems can run on it? Or is the licensing restriction on MVS to prevent it from being legally run on an IFL? -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
Tom Marchant wrote: On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:29:36 -0500, Mark Jacobs wrote: Tom Marchant wrote: On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:45:10 +0100, Vernooy, C.P. - SPLXM wrote: As I read it, z/VM on an IFL is now allowed to run a Solaris guest, until now z/VM was only allowed to run z/Linux guests. How would it know what operating system is being IPLed? AFAIK it wasn't a technical restriction but a licensing concern. Is there a licensing restriction on an IFL that specifies what operating systems can run on it? Or is the licensing restriction on MVS to prevent it from being legally run on an IFL? Yes on the first question, Before this week's announcement only zVM and zLinux were licensed to run on an IFL. Now OpenSolaris can be run under zVM. Yes+ on the second. The microcode that gets loaded on an IFL is missing two(?) instructions that zOS requires to execute so even if you wanted to break the license, zOS couldn't be IPLed. -- Mark Jacobs Time Customer Service Tampa, FL We're in the stickiest situation since Sticky the stick insect got stuck on a sticky bun. Rowan Atkinson as Captain Edmund Blackadder in Blackadder Goes Forth -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
Kees, I would have to agree with Rich. The announcement mentions that this applies to both current IFL's and newly order IFL's without referring to a feature code or MCL change that must be installed on current IFL's, so I see it as simply an announcement that OpenSolaris can LEGALLY be run on an IFL LPAR (pre z/VM 5.4 z10) or a mixed LPAR and dispatched on IFL's on the latest hardware and software. As to Paul's question about z/VM without CMS, recall that a lot of z/VM service machines run under CMS (I believe that both RACF for z/VM and Dirmaint are in this list), so running z/VM without CMS would be difficult. Wayne Driscoll Product Developer NOTE: All opinions are strictly my own. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Vernooy, C.P. - SPLXM Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2008 1:45 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris As I read it, z/VM on an IFL is now allowed to run a Solaris guest, until now z/VM was only allowed to run z/Linux guests. Kees. Rich Smrcina [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... Before the announcement OpenSolaris would certainly run on an IFL. The announcement didn't chance anything on the IFLs around the world. It just makes it official. It's more of a statement to make the PHB's happy. Paul Gilmartin wrote: On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 16:05:36 -0700, Kopischke, David G. wrote: From IBM Announcements today... Integrated Facility for Linux (IFL) authorization is expanded to include the OpenSolaris operating system http://www.ibm.com/vrm/newsletter_10577_3590_95481_email_DYN_1IN/ngn1227 27252 Interesting. I had wondered. But I remain curious. If, prior to today, a customer had attempted to IPL OpenSolaris under an IFL, what would have happened? o PR/SM would have prohibited the operation? o The operation would have succeeded, but PR/SM would have called home and lawyers would have come knocking. It appears that Linux and OpenSolaris are the only two OSes authorized to run in IFLs. What's an operating system? Various vendors and IBM have standalone backup, restore, dump, and diagnostic utilities (or used to). These can be considered OSes, however specialized. Are these, therefore, prohibited in IFLs? There was some mention here lately of the possibility (or impossibility) of using z/VM without CMS. Some customers likely want z/VM solely for the purpose of running Linux (or OpenSolaris) in IFLs. Can they do without CMS, or is CMS required for z/VM administration? -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- Rich Smrcina VM Assist, Inc. Phone: 414-491-6001 Ans Service: 360-715-2467 http://www.linkedin.com/in/richsmrcina Catch the WAVV! http://www.wavv.org WAVV 2009 - Orlando, FL - May 15-19, 2009 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html ** For information, services and offers, please visit our web site: http://www.klm.com. This e-mail and any attachment may contain confidential and privileged material intended for the addressee only. If you are not the addressee, you are notified that no part of the e-mail or any attachment may be disclosed, copied or distributed, and that any other action related to this e-mail or attachment is strictly prohibited, and may be unlawful. If you have received this e-mail by error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, and delete this message. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij NV (KLM), its subsidiaries and/or its employees shall not be liable for the incorrect or incomplete transmission of this e-mail or any attachments, nor responsible for any delay in receipt. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij N.V. (also known as KLM Royal Dutch Airlines) is registered in Amstelveen, The Netherlands, with registered number 33014286 ** -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:57:09 -0500, Mark Jacobs wrote: Tom Marchant wrote: Is there a licensing restriction on an IFL that specifies what operating systems can run on it? Or is the licensing restriction on MVS to prevent it from being legally run on an IFL? Yes on the first question, Before this week's announcement only zVM and zLinux were licensed to run on an IFL. Now OpenSolaris can be run under zVM. I see that z/VM was licensed to run on an IFL only to run Linux and now it is licensed to run on an IFL with OpenSolaris guests as well. But is there a restriction on the IFL too? I haven't been able to find one. For example, if someone was still running MTS, would they be legally able to run it on the IFL? -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
Tom Marchant wrote: [...] I see that z/VM was licensed to run on an IFL only to run Linux and now it is licensed to run on an IFL with OpenSolaris guests as well. Not exactly. You can run VM under VM on IFL. In simple words you can run under VM anything you can run without VM. VM is transparent for licenses and technical blockades. Note that (latest VM) can emulate zIIP/zAAP for z/OS guest, but the emulation is done on CP. -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland -- BRE Bank SA ul. Senatorska 18 00-950 Warszawa www.brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237 NIP: 526-021-50-88 Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2008 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA wynosi 118.642.672 zote i zosta w caoci wpacony. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:50:51 +0100, R.S. wrote: Tom Marchant wrote: [...] I see that z/VM was licensed to run on an IFL only to run Linux and now it is licensed to run on an IFL with OpenSolaris guests as well. Not exactly. You can run VM under VM on IFL. In simple words you can run under VM anything you can run without VM. VM is transparent for licenses and technical blockades. Note that (latest VM) can emulate zIIP/zAAP for z/OS guest, but the emulation is done on CP. From the announcement: Prior to this announcement, z/VM was authorized to run on IFL processors only if, on the IFL processors, z/VM was being used exclusively to run Linux workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those Linux workloads. As of November 18, 2008, end users are now also authorized to run z/VM on IFL processors if z/VM is used to run OpenSolaris workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those OpenSolaris workloads. I know that there are restrictions to prevent IBM operating systems from running on an IFL. I'm still looking for documentation making any other restrictions on what can be run on an IFL. -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
Tom Marchant wrote: On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:50:51 +0100, R.S. wrote: Tom Marchant wrote: [...] I see that z/VM was licensed to run on an IFL only to run Linux and now it is licensed to run on an IFL with OpenSolaris guests as well. Not exactly. You can run VM under VM on IFL. In simple words you can run under VM anything you can run without VM. VM is transparent for licenses and technical blockades. Note that (latest VM) can emulate zIIP/zAAP for z/OS guest, but the emulation is done on CP. From the announcement: Prior to this announcement, z/VM was authorized to run on IFL processors only if, on the IFL processors, z/VM was being used exclusively to run Linux workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those Linux workloads. As of November 18, 2008, end users are now also authorized to run z/VM on IFL processors if z/VM is used to run OpenSolaris workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those OpenSolaris workloads. From practise: I'am aware of installations which use IFLs and on the IFL LPAR run VM and some of the VM's guests are again VMs. I'm pretty sure IBM is fully aware of the configuration. So, I believe, it is (and was) legal to run VM under VM on IFL as long as at the end is Linux. First, it makes sense, second it is technically available. BTW: I like OpenSolaris on IFL. Good news for the platform. I would be happy if at least some of Windows functionality were available on mainframe. Isn't intentionally to make wait state message on HMC as BLUE SCREEN ? vbg -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland -- BRE Bank SA ul. Senatorska 18 00-950 Warszawa www.brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237 NIP: 526-021-50-88 Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2008 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA wynosi 118.642.672 zote i zosta w caoci wpacony. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tom Marchant Is there a licensing restriction on an IFL that specifies what operating systems can run on it? Or is the licensing restriction on MVS to prevent it from being legally run on an IFL? There is (allegedly) a machine instruction in MVS that is disabled on IFLs, thus rendering it impossible to run MVS on an IFL. -jc- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tom Marchant From the announcement: Prior to this announcement, z/VM was authorized to run on IFL processors only if, on the IFL processors, z/VM was being used exclusively to run Linux workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those Linux workloads. As of November 18, 2008, end users are now also authorized to run z/VM on IFL processors if z/VM is used to run OpenSolaris workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those OpenSolaris workloads. Hmmm Nothing explicit regarding a second-level z/VM on the IFL. And it seems that, with regard to software licensing, that which is not permitted, is prohibited. So, can one legally run a second-level z/VM on an IFL? -jc- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On 11/19/2008 at 9:45 AM, Tom Marchant [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -snip- I see that z/VM was licensed to run on an IFL only to run Linux and now it is licensed to run on an IFL with OpenSolaris guests as well. But is there a restriction on the IFL too? No, since you (or whomever you're leasing it from, own the hardware. You can do with that hardware whatever you want, or the lessor allows. Software licenses/terms and conditions restrict what you do with the software. I haven't been able to find one. For example, if someone was still running MTS, would they be legally able to run it on the IFL? Yes, as long as any license MTS might have would allow that (along with your unspoken assumption that someone had actually ported MTS to the platform, or written an emulator for it, etc.) Mark Post -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On 11/19/2008 at 10:50 AM, R.S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tom Marchant wrote: [...] I see that z/VM was licensed to run on an IFL only to run Linux and now it is licensed to run on an IFL with OpenSolaris guests as well. Not exactly. You can run VM under VM on IFL. In simple words you can run under VM anything you can run without VM. VM is transparent for licenses and technical blockades. But in the case, the particular restriction being talked about it on z/VM itself. If you wanted to install z/VM on an IFL for the sole purpose of running a traditional CMS workload, that would not be permitted by the standard licensing. Note that (latest VM) can emulate zIIP/zAAP for z/OS guest, but the emulation is done on CP. If by latest you mean 5.3, that is correct. If you mean 5.4, it is not. z/VM 5.4, when running on a z10 and in a z/VM mode LPAR, can and will dispatch z/OS workload to real zIIPs and zAAPs if they are available to the LPAR. (And Linux workload to real IFLs as well in the same LPAR.) Mark Post -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On 11/19/2008 at 12:20 PM, Chase, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tom Marchant From the announcement: Prior to this announcement, z/VM was authorized to run on IFL processors only if, on the IFL processors, z/VM was being used exclusively to run Linux workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those Linux workloads. As of November 18, 2008, end users are now also authorized to run z/VM on IFL processors if z/VM is used to run OpenSolaris workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those OpenSolaris workloads. Hmmm Nothing explicit regarding a second-level z/VM on the IFL. And it seems that, with regard to software licensing, that which is not permitted, is prohibited. So, can one legally run a second-level z/VM on an IFL? Yes. The if required, z/VM applications in support of those Linux workloads would cover that if necessary. However, running a second-level z/VM is a _very_ long-established (and IBM recommended) method of installing and testing maintenance. IBM isn't about to make that unavailable to the z/VM systems programmers. Mark Post -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
2008/11/19 Tom Marchant [EMAIL PROTECTED]: From the announcement: Prior to this announcement, z/VM was authorized to run on IFL processors only if, on the IFL processors, z/VM was being used exclusively to run Linux workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those Linux workloads. As of November 18, 2008, end users are now also authorized to run z/VM on IFL processors if z/VM is used to run OpenSolaris workloads and, if required, z/VM applications in support of those OpenSolaris workloads. I know that there are restrictions to prevent IBM operating systems from running on an IFL. I'm still looking for documentation making any other restrictions on what can be run on an IFL. The way I read this recent announcement is that it is merely a change to the licence conditions for z/VM. I am not aware of any conditions attached to the IFL that restrict what you can run on it; rather, there may be conditions on licensed software such as z/VM and z/OS that restrict what hardware they may run on. In the case of z/OS, there is also a runtime test for the wrong kind of engine, but it's the licence that counts. In the case of z/VM products such as RSCS, IBM has said repeatedly that they are happy to talk about licensing terms for running on IFLs. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 10:48:07 -0700, Mark Post wrote: Tom Marchant wrote: ... if someone was still running MTS, would they be legally able to run it on the IFL? Yes, as long as any license MTS might have would allow that (along with your unspoken assumption that someone had actually ported MTS to the platform, or written an emulator for it, etc.) No port or emulator necessary. MTS (The Michigan Terminal System) was originally written to run on a 360-67 and has been run on ESA machines. -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 10:48:07 -0700, Mark Post wrote: On 11/19/2008 at 9:45 AM, Tom Marchant wrote: -snip- I see that z/VM was licensed to run on an IFL only to run Linux and now it is licensed to run on an IFL with OpenSolaris guests as well. But is there a restriction on the IFL too? No, since you (or whomever you're leasing it from, own the hardware. You can do with that hardware whatever you want, or the lessor allows. Software licenses/terms and conditions restrict what you do with the software. As I read that, then, prior to yesterday the license terms for z/VM prohibited running it in an IFL other than to run a Linux guest. Now the prohibition has been weakened to allow OpenSolaris guests also. (BTW, the SineNomine web page states that OpenSolaris requires z/VM; it will not run native in any LPAR.) -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
From IBM Announcements today... Integrated Facility for Linux (IFL) authorization is expanded to include the OpenSolaris operating system http://www.ibm.com/vrm/newsletter_10577_3590_95481_email_DYN_1IN/ngn1227 27252 -- This e-mail transmission may contain information that is proprietary, privileged and/or confidential and is intended exclusively for the person(s) to whom it is addressed. Any use, copying, retention or disclosure by any person other than the intended recipient or the intended recipient's designees is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient or their designee, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete all copies. OppenheimerFunds may, at its sole discretion, monitor, review, retain and/or disclose the content of all email communications. == -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 16:05:36 -0700, Kopischke, David G. wrote: From IBM Announcements today... Integrated Facility for Linux (IFL) authorization is expanded to include the OpenSolaris operating system http://www.ibm.com/vrm/newsletter_10577_3590_95481_email_DYN_1IN/ngn122727252 Interesting. I had wondered. But I remain curious. If, prior to today, a customer had attempted to IPL OpenSolaris under an IFL, what would have happened? o PR/SM would have prohibited the operation? o The operation would have succeeded, but PR/SM would have called home and lawyers would have come knocking. It appears that Linux and OpenSolaris are the only two OSes authorized to run in IFLs. What's an operating system? Various vendors and IBM have standalone backup, restore, dump, and diagnostic utilities (or used to). These can be considered OSes, however specialized. Are these, therefore, prohibited in IFLs? There was some mention here lately of the possibility (or impossibility) of using z/VM without CMS. Some customers likely want z/VM solely for the purpose of running Linux (or OpenSolaris) in IFLs. Can they do without CMS, or is CMS required for z/VM administration? -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
Before the announcement OpenSolaris would certainly run on an IFL. The announcement didn't chance anything on the IFLs around the world. It just makes it official. It's more of a statement to make the PHB's happy. Paul Gilmartin wrote: On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 16:05:36 -0700, Kopischke, David G. wrote: From IBM Announcements today... Integrated Facility for Linux (IFL) authorization is expanded to include the OpenSolaris operating system http://www.ibm.com/vrm/newsletter_10577_3590_95481_email_DYN_1IN/ngn122727252 Interesting. I had wondered. But I remain curious. If, prior to today, a customer had attempted to IPL OpenSolaris under an IFL, what would have happened? o PR/SM would have prohibited the operation? o The operation would have succeeded, but PR/SM would have called home and lawyers would have come knocking. It appears that Linux and OpenSolaris are the only two OSes authorized to run in IFLs. What's an operating system? Various vendors and IBM have standalone backup, restore, dump, and diagnostic utilities (or used to). These can be considered OSes, however specialized. Are these, therefore, prohibited in IFLs? There was some mention here lately of the possibility (or impossibility) of using z/VM without CMS. Some customers likely want z/VM solely for the purpose of running Linux (or OpenSolaris) in IFLs. Can they do without CMS, or is CMS required for z/VM administration? -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- Rich Smrcina VM Assist, Inc. Phone: 414-491-6001 Ans Service: 360-715-2467 http://www.linkedin.com/in/richsmrcina Catch the WAVV! http://www.wavv.org WAVV 2009 - Orlando, FL - May 15-19, 2009 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
On 11/18/2008 at 7:38 PM, Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -snip- There was some mention here lately of the possibility (or impossibility) of using z/VM without CMS. Some customers likely want z/VM solely for the purpose of running Linux (or OpenSolaris) in IFLs. Can they do without CMS, or is CMS required for z/VM administration? It would be nearly impossible to administer z/VM without CMS. CMS also makes a very useful environment to do initial setup/customization for the various guest operating systems that run on z/VM. Mark Post -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: IFL Extended to OpenSolaris
As I read it, z/VM on an IFL is now allowed to run a Solaris guest, until now z/VM was only allowed to run z/Linux guests. Kees. Rich Smrcina [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... Before the announcement OpenSolaris would certainly run on an IFL. The announcement didn't chance anything on the IFLs around the world. It just makes it official. It's more of a statement to make the PHB's happy. Paul Gilmartin wrote: On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 16:05:36 -0700, Kopischke, David G. wrote: From IBM Announcements today... Integrated Facility for Linux (IFL) authorization is expanded to include the OpenSolaris operating system http://www.ibm.com/vrm/newsletter_10577_3590_95481_email_DYN_1IN/ngn1227 27252 Interesting. I had wondered. But I remain curious. If, prior to today, a customer had attempted to IPL OpenSolaris under an IFL, what would have happened? o PR/SM would have prohibited the operation? o The operation would have succeeded, but PR/SM would have called home and lawyers would have come knocking. It appears that Linux and OpenSolaris are the only two OSes authorized to run in IFLs. What's an operating system? Various vendors and IBM have standalone backup, restore, dump, and diagnostic utilities (or used to). These can be considered OSes, however specialized. Are these, therefore, prohibited in IFLs? There was some mention here lately of the possibility (or impossibility) of using z/VM without CMS. Some customers likely want z/VM solely for the purpose of running Linux (or OpenSolaris) in IFLs. Can they do without CMS, or is CMS required for z/VM administration? -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- Rich Smrcina VM Assist, Inc. Phone: 414-491-6001 Ans Service: 360-715-2467 http://www.linkedin.com/in/richsmrcina Catch the WAVV! http://www.wavv.org WAVV 2009 - Orlando, FL - May 15-19, 2009 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html ** For information, services and offers, please visit our web site: http://www.klm.com. This e-mail and any attachment may contain confidential and privileged material intended for the addressee only. If you are not the addressee, you are notified that no part of the e-mail or any attachment may be disclosed, copied or distributed, and that any other action related to this e-mail or attachment is strictly prohibited, and may be unlawful. If you have received this e-mail by error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, and delete this message. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij NV (KLM), its subsidiaries and/or its employees shall not be liable for the incorrect or incomplete transmission of this e-mail or any attachments, nor responsible for any delay in receipt. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij N.V. (also known as KLM Royal Dutch Airlines) is registered in Amstelveen, The Netherlands, with registered number 33014286 ** -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
