Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rankin, Bob Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 12:57 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9 Our production environment is running OS390 V2R4 (9708 PUT). My management wants to purchase a Z9 to replace our aging Multiprise 2003-125 and move our existing OS to run on the Z9. While we know that OS390 V2R4 has not been certified to run on the Z9, my management thinks it possible that it might work anyway. Personally I don't think this is feasible but IBM has done stranger things in the past. Can anyone out there provide more specific information regarding this topic. While I know that there are significant instruction set differences, perhaps V2R4 may not encounter them, I don't know. Has anyone done this? Does anyone know what will happen if we attempt to do this? SNIP Based on my experience with OS/390 V2R9, you will get a PI-LOOP. That is, it will go to a check stop state during the IPL itself. I'm trying to remember the release that I once tried to IPL on a z890 (It wasn't a z800 because that's where we were going to migrate from). During the SAPR meeting, you should have seen the look on a few people's faces when IBM's people said that only 2.10 and up would run. Well, I was told to give it a try and the Production system (OS/390 2.9) died before I could get my finger off the enter key from doing the load. Regards, Steve Thompson -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
I think that I might have mentioned this before but I have successfully (several times) migrated 2.8 and 2.9 system to a Z9. Admittedly, we didn't leave the client there for very long, (less than a week) while we moved them to z/OS, but it ran okay. Brian Westerman -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
Our production environment is running OS390 V2R4 (9708 PUT). My management wants to purchase a Z9 to replace our aging Multiprise 2003-125 and move our existing OS to run on the Z9. While we know that OS390 V2R4 has not been certified to run on the Z9, my management thinks it possible that it might work anyway. Personally I don't think this is feasible but IBM has done stranger things in the past. Can anyone out there provide more specific information regarding this topic. While I know that there are significant instruction set differences, perhaps V2R4 may not encounter them, I don't know. Has anyone done this? Does anyone know what will happen if we attempt to do this? Bob Rankin City of Portland, Oregon -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
On what factual basis does your management think that this will work? IBM had compatibility FMID's back in the early zOS releases that would enable them to run on a zxxx processor. There never was an equalvilent for OS/390 releases of the operating system. I would bet against it, but I don't have any hard facts to back it up. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rankin, Bob Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 1:57 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9 Our production environment is running OS390 V2R4 (9708 PUT). My management wants to purchase a Z9 to replace our aging Multiprise 2003-125 and move our existing OS to run on the Z9. While we know that OS390 V2R4 has not been certified to run on the Z9, my management thinks it possible that it might work anyway. Personally I don't think this is feasible but IBM has done stranger things in the past. Can anyone out there provide more specific information regarding this topic. While I know that there are significant instruction set differences, perhaps V2R4 may not encounter them, I don't know. Has anyone done this? Does anyone know what will happen if we attempt to do this? Bob Rankin City of Portland, Oregon -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
Mark Jacobs wrote: On what factual basis does your management think that this will work? IBM had compatibility FMID's back in the early zOS releases that would enable them to run on a zxxx processor. There never was an equalvilent for OS/390 releases of the operating system. The fact is OS/390 2.10 *was* supported on z/990. Compatibility fmids were for multiple channel subsystem machines (z/990, z/890), not z at all. Earlier OS/390 releases worked on z/900, without compatibility fmid, although with some recommended service (PTFs). AFAIK even OS/390 2.10 with compatibility fmids won't work on z9. Won't work, no not supported. -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland -- BRE Bank SA ul. Senatorska 18 00-950 Warszawa www.brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237 NIP: 526-021-50-88 Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2007 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA (w caoci opacony) wynosi 118.064.140 z. W zwizku z realizacj warunkowego podwyszenia kapitau zakadowego, na podstawie uchwa XVI WZ z dnia 21.05.2003 r., kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA moe ulec podwyszeniu do kwoty 118.760.528 z. Akcje w podwyszonym kapitale zakadowym bd w caoci opacone. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
We are currently running a production OS390 V2R10 on a z9 BC. BUT, we have to do any HCD changes from a z/OS 1.4 lpar with the z990 compatibility ptfs installed. I do not know about V2R4. Silvio On Mon, 1 Oct 2007 10:56:34 -0700, Rankin, Bob [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Our production environment is running OS390 V2R4 (9708 PUT). My management wants to purchase a Z9 to replace our aging Multiprise 2003- 125 and move our existing OS to run on the Z9. While we know that OS390 V2R4 has not been certified to run on the Z9, my management thinks it possible that it might work anyway. Personally I don't think this is feasible but IBM has done stranger things in the past. Can anyone out there provide more specific information regarding this topic. While I know that there are significant instruction set differences, perhaps V2R4 may not encounter them, I don't know. Has anyone done this? Does anyone know what will happen if we attempt to do this? Bob Rankin City of Portland, Oregon -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
We attempted to run a soon to be eliminated OS/390 2.6 system on a z/890 a while back. The system did IPL, but once more than a few users got on, performance was terrible. We moved them back to the Amdahl that came off lease until we could upgrade it to OS/390 2.10 (then supported). -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
You are running a production environment on an operating system which has not been supported for a number of years? Is your application environment (CICS, DB2, what have you) similarly in an unsupported state? I hope, for your sake, that some application doesn't come along which breaks this fragile setup, or you will be installing a LOT of software in a very short time (or paying through the nose to have it done). Tim Hare Senior Systems Programmer Florida Department of Transportation Tel: +1 (850) 414-4209 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU wrote on 10/01/2007 01:56:34 PM: Our production environment is running OS390 V2R4 (9708 PUT). My management wants to purchase a Z9 to replace our aging Multiprise 2003-125 and move our existing OS to run on the Z9. While we know that OS390 V2R4 has not been certified to run on the Z9, my management thinks it possible that it might work anyway. Personally I don't think this is feasible but IBM has done stranger things in the past. Can anyone out there provide more specific information regarding this topic. While I know that there are significant instruction set differences, perhaps V2R4 may not encounter them, I don't know. Has anyone done this? Does anyone know what will happen if we attempt to do this? In the archives: http://bama.ua.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0702L=ibm-mainP=R25482I=1X=- Jim Mulder z/OS System Test IBM Corp. Poughkeepsie, NY -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
On Mon, 1 Oct 2007 10:56:34 -0700, Rankin, Bob wrote: Our production environment is running OS390 V2R4 (9708 PUT). My management wants to purchase a Z9 to replace our aging Multiprise 2003-125 and move our existing OS to run on the Z9. While we know that OS390 V2R4 has not been certified to run on the Z9, my management thinks it possible that it might work anyway. Personally I don't think this is feasible but IBM has done stranger things in the past. Can anyone out there provide more specific information regarding this topic. While I know that there are significant instruction set differences, perhaps V2R4 may not encounter them, I don't know. Has anyone done this? Does anyone know what will happen if we attempt to do this? Search the archives for [(Mulder) and (purge)] and you should find this: z890, z990, and z9 machines have a 2-level TLB. Nothing lower than OS/390 2.10 will run reliably on a machine with a 2-level TLB because lower releases than 2.10 do not do some of the necessary TLB purges. I have heard some speculation that you might be able to get around this by running an older MVS under VM, with the following VM trace: #CP TRACE IPTE RUN NOTERM Of course, this would cause some performance degradation, since VM would intercepting and simulating every IPTE for this virtual machine. I don't know of anyone who has tried this. It was just some hall talk with a VM developer. There may be other issues that would prevent an older MVS from running on a modern machine, such as missing support for a larger storage increment size. The storage increment size might also be avoided under VM if the virtual machine does not have too much real storage defined - I think VM simulates the increment size but I wouldn't swear to that. ...which leads me to believe that you can expect 'difficulties' (at minimum) unless you are running your OS/390 2.4 system under z/VM - and maybe even IF you are running under z/VM. (It was just hallway talk, after all.) Jim's post was addressing a jump from a newer-than-your machine to a z/9-BC and he posted it back in (or around) February. (Thanks, as always, Jim!) -- Tom Schmidt Madison, WI -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OS/390 V2R4 on Z9
I can only speak for OS/390 2.9 and 2.10 on the Z9 as being able to run, I have never tried an older version, mostly because we have not had a client with an older version move to a Z9 (at least not with my help). I think that there are better ways to accomplish what you need though, I could easily set up a supported system (z/OS) on the Z9 in a weekend and depending on your configuration, it might be possible to share most of your hardware and cut over incrementally in a very short period of time. I have had a lot of experience getting older versions of the subsystems to run under the newer z/OS versions which would allow you to move your subsystems intact changing (mostly) just the operating system. Obviously I'm simplifying this, but depending on what your current installed subsystem configuration is, it might be quite simple and quick to get you up on the Z9 with only a minor amount of fuss. It might be worth a try to see if we could get 2.4 to run as well, but I wouldn't want to bet the farm on it. If your interested, give me a off list email and we can discuss it. Brian Westerman -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
