Re: Question on Out Sourcing
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 02/12/2008 at 04:16 PM, Pat Mihalec [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: I have a question on Out Sourcing. When you sign a contract does that mean you no longer have to pay for your software product maintenance licenses? There's no way to answer that without seeing both the license agreements and the outsourcing contracts. You should include your accounting and legal staffs in the negotiations. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 02/13/2008 at 09:44 AM, Pat Mihalec [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: I know this but I needed it from someone else to show the current director. He has not mainframe experience, his background is Windows. The situation is the same with windoze; you need to read the licensing agreement to know what you can transfer. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
I definitely agree with Steve on It depends. You need to have your company's lawyers check out the contract thoroughly looking at all the fine legalese. Then have 1 or 2 people that the company employs to keep an eye on the outsourcer. The company I work for now was outsourced and then brought everything back in-house because they were being burned by the outsourcer. I've heard of other similar experiences. You need to have a well written contract and you need to monitor the outsourcer so as to get the capacity you need at a reasonable price. Tom Kelman Commerce Bank of Kansas City - Posted by Paul Mihalec - I have a question on Out Sourcing. When you sign a contract does that mean you no longer have to pay for your software product maintenance licenses? - Posted by Steve Thompson - It depends. If your contract says that your equipment, operations, etc. are managed at the new data center by the outsourcer's people, then you probably pay the software license fees. If your contract says that your system will be migrated into their environment... Now the licensing of software is based on the outsourcer's equipment... So your charges will include your pro-rata share. I have seen both situations used by the same outsourcing company. Regards, Steve Thompson * If you wish to communicate securely with Commerce Bank and its affiliates, you must log into your account under Online Services at http://www.commercebank.com or use the Commerce Bank Secure Email Message Center at https://securemail.commercebank.com NOTICE: This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential. The information is exclusively for the use of the individual or entity intended as the recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, printing, reviewing, retention, disclosure, distribution or forwarding of the message or any attached file is not authorized and is strictly prohibited. If you have received this electronic mail message in error, please advise the sender by reply electronic mail immediately and permanently delete the original transmission, any attachments and any copies of this message from your computer system. * -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Pat Mihalec I have a question on Out Sourcing. When you sign a contract does that mean you no longer have to pay for your software product maintenance licenses? Not at all. You'll continue to pay either directly (like annual automobile registration fees) or indirectly (like fuel taxes built-in to the selling price), but you WILL have to pay, or stop using the software. -jc- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
Oh---Only knows Windows Ummman---would really love to comment on this one...lol...but may cause a stir ... -- Email Disclaimer This E-mail contains confidential information belonging to the sender, which may be legally privileged information. This information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity addressed above. If you are not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of the E-mail or attached files is strictly prohibited. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
Do you have a link for that report? No, but their main site is www.linuxformat.co.uk, I still like to have the paper in my hand and I can always go back to an old article as long as my attic still has space... Search for IBM and Sun snuggle up or Solaris hits big blue's mainframes shocker! -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Staller, Allan Sent: 13 Februarie 2008 04:17 nm To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing Herbie, Do you have a link for that report? snip I just read page 10 of the February edition of Linux Format where the claim is made that OpenSolaris was successfully ported to a System z IBM mainframe that is co-owned by Sun and Sine Nomine in Virginia USA. /snip -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Elavon Financial Services Limited Registered in Ireland: Number 418442 Registered Office: Block E, 1st Floor, Cherrywood Business Park, Loughlinstown, Co. Dublin, Ireland Directors: Robert Abele (USA), John Collins, Terrance Dolan (USA), Pamela Joseph (USA), Declan Lynch, John McNally, Malcolm Towlson Elavon Financial Services Limited, trading as Elavon, is regulated by the Financial Regulator -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
With us that stuff is all spelled out in the contract. No surprises later. How can an IT director have only Windows experience? Does that mean my mother could be an IT director? : ) Dave Thorn * Senior Technology Analyst * SunGard Computer Services * 600 Laurel Oak Road, Voorhees, NJ, 08043 Tel 856 566-5412 * Mobile 609 781-0353 * Fax 856 566-3656 CONFIDENTIALITY: This e-mail (including any attachments) may contain confidential, proprietary and privileged information, and unauthorized disclosure or use is prohibited. If you received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender and delete this e-mail from your system. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Patrick Falcone Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 11:13 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Question on Out Sourcing Better to check the agreement very thoroughly. I would want to know, before signing, what is covered *after* the contract has been signed. You might be surprised at what you'll be paying for a few weeks down the road after the contract has been signed and you need *x* to be investigated, solved, implemented, upgraded, etc... for you by the outsourcer. I'm willing to bet that a lot of companies get hit with hidden fee's down the line where it becomes evident that outsourcing is ending up costing more that was originally thought. Pat Mihalec [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know this but I needed it from someone else to show the current director. He has not mainframe experience, his background is Windows. He thinks that if you move to the outsourcer system you no longer pay the fees. It comes as a shock to him. I suggested he ask the outsourcer directly about this. Pat Mihalec Rush University Medical Center Senior System Programmer (312) 942-8386 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
Better to check the agreement very thoroughly. I would want to know, before signing, what is covered *after* the contract has been signed. You might be surprised at what you'll be paying for a few weeks down the road after the contract has been signed and you need *x* to be investigated, solved, implemented, upgraded, etc... for you by the outsourcer. I'm willing to bet that a lot of companies get hit with hidden fee's down the line where it becomes evident that outsourcing is ending up costing more that was originally thought. Pat Mihalec [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know this but I needed it from someone else to show the current director. He has not mainframe experience, his background is Windows. He thinks that if you move to the outsourcer system you no longer pay the fees. It comes as a shock to him. I suggested he ask the outsourcer directly about this. Pat Mihalec Rush University Medical Center Senior System Programmer (312) 942-8386 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
I know this but I needed it from someone else to show the current director. He has not mainframe experience, his background is Windows. He thinks that if you move to the outsourcer system you no longer pay the fees. It comes as a shock to him. I suggested he ask the outsourcer directly about this. Pat Mihalec Rush University Medical Center Senior System Programmer (312) 942-8386 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ted MacNEIL [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU 02/12/2008 04:43 PM Please respond to IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU To IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU cc Subject Re: Question on Out Sourcing I have a question on Out Sourcing. When you sign a contract does that mean you no longer have to pay for your software product maintenance licenses? Of course the licence still has to be paid for. You can either transfer it to the service provider, or continue paying it yourself. If you've transfered, it will be buried in your service fees. It's not free. A certain large ISV wanted to charge us 10 times the annual rate to transfer the licence to our out-sourcer. They did this because the out-sourcer had a fully funded (and approved) initiative to replace all the products they supplied with any other equivalent. The ISV was/is not popular. They decided they'd rather gouge us one more time because they were going to lose us, if they transfered the licence. (You can probably figure out which ISV) But, the bottom line is maintenance is not going to go away, regardless of who pays for it (directly, or indirectly). - Too busy driving to stop for gas! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
Ron, Why would the z/9 or z/6 not make a perfect Windows terminal server... It is stable and all the rest... I just read page 10 of the February edition of Linux Format where the claim is made that OpenSolaris was successfully ported to a System z IBM mainframe that is co-owned by Sun and Sine Nomine in Virginia USA. Who would have thought the day would come that that would be possible... 10 years ago, certainly not me. Regards Herbie -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ron Wells Sent: 13 Februarie 2008 04:01 nm To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Question on Out Sourcing Oh---Only knows Windows Ummman---would really love to comment on this one...lol...but may cause a stir ... -- Email Disclaimer This E-mail contains confidential information belonging to the sender, which may be legally privileged information. This information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity addressed above. If you are not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of the E-mail or attached files is strictly prohibited. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Elavon Financial Services Limited Registered in Ireland: Number 418442 Registered Office: Block E, 1st Floor, Cherrywood Business Park, Loughlinstown, Co. Dublin, Ireland Directors: Robert Abele (USA), John Collins, Terrance Dolan (USA), Pamela Joseph (USA), Declan Lynch, John McNally, Malcolm Towlson Elavon Financial Services Limited, trading as Elavon, is regulated by the Financial Regulator -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
Herbie, Do you have a link for that report? snip I just read page 10 of the February edition of Linux Format where the claim is made that OpenSolaris was successfully ported to a System z IBM mainframe that is co-owned by Sun and Sine Nomine in Virginia USA. /snip -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pat Mihalec Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 9:44 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Question on Out Sourcing I know this but I needed it from someone else to show the current director. He has not mainframe experience, his background is Windows. He thinks that if you move to the outsourcer system you no longer pay the fees. It comes as a shock to him. I suggested he ask the outsourcer directly about this. SNIP To quote a friend of mine and former co-worker, a nickle's worth of free advice: Since your director has no experience with large data centers [that is what the statement He has not mainframe experience, his background is Windows. means, isn't it?], make sure that your contract requires the outsourcing company to cover the costs of your moving back to the facility where you came from should they breach the contract, or not be able to fulfill the contract satisfactorily. This suggestion was followed by a certain ISV some years ago when a certain outsourcer promised them all kinds of things (such as APF libraries they would need for continued development, a test environment to validate their changes, etc.). The outsourcer failed to deliver, and had to cover their costs to move back to the environment where they had been. While this may seem a bit trivial, to move back to where you came from, if you are into this outsourcing agreement by 90 days, and you have gotten rid of equipment... Or your current environment is also an outsourcer and there is a penalty to be paid to get back into your old contract... Make sure you read the fine print and make sure you know what constitutes a breach, what can be done to fix or heal the breach, and what your costs can be for such things. The devil is in the details and while the sales people can make it sound all kinds of great, that phrase this is our standard contract or this is a standard phrase/clause is generally a RED FLAG if you were prompted to ask a question about it. Again, a nickle's worth of free advice. Regards, Steve Thompson -- All opinions expressed by me are my own and may not necessarily reflect those of my employer. -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
I understand from sources close to the port that it is indeed underway and should be sometime this year. Staller, Allan wrote: -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Van Dalsen, Herbie Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 10:22 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing Do you have a link for that report? -- Rich Smrcina VM Assist, Inc. Phone: 414-491-6001 Ans Service: 360-715-2467 rich.smrcina at vmassist.com http://www.linkedin.com/in/richsmrcina Catch the WAVV! http://www.wavv.org WAVV 2008 - Chattanooga - April 18-22, 2008 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
Rich, I should probably not put this in because the Feb edition is not online to read yet(probably still selling in Eason's / W.H. Smith)... But the exact words of this article is this... IBM signaled another change in its relationship with Sun Microsystems by announcing the success of a project to port OpenSolaris to its mainframe for the first time. Later on in the article it says the following: James Stallings, general manager, IBM System z, said Solaris integration made perfect sense... The future of the data center lies in virtualization's ability to reduce skyrocketing energy and maintenance costs and more... Regards Herbie -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rich Smrcina Sent: 13 Februarie 2008 04:51 nm To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing I understand from sources close to the port that it is indeed underway and should be sometime this year. Staller, Allan wrote: -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Van Dalsen, Herbie Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 10:22 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing Do you have a link for that report? -- Rich Smrcina VM Assist, Inc. Phone: 414-491-6001 Ans Service: 360-715-2467 rich.smrcina at vmassist.com http://www.linkedin.com/in/richsmrcina Catch the WAVV! http://www.wavv.org WAVV 2008 - Chattanooga - April 18-22, 2008 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Elavon Financial Services Limited Registered in Ireland: Number 418442 Registered Office: Block E, 1st Floor, Cherrywood Business Park, Loughlinstown, Co. Dublin, Ireland Directors: Robert Abele (USA), John Collins, Terrance Dolan (USA), Pamela Joseph (USA), Declan Lynch, John McNally, Malcolm Towlson Elavon Financial Services Limited, trading as Elavon, is regulated by the Financial Regulator -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Van Dalsen, Herbie Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 10:22 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing Do you have a link for that report? No, but their main site is www.linuxformat.co.uk, I still like to have the paper in my hand and I can always go back to an old article as long as my attic still has space... Search for IBM and Sun snuggle up or Solaris hits big blue's mainframes shocker! -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Staller, Allan Sent: 13 Februarie 2008 04:17 nm To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing Herbie, Do you have a link for that report? snip I just read page 10 of the February edition of Linux Format where the claim is made that OpenSolaris was successfully ported to a System z IBM mainframe that is co-owned by Sun and Sine Nomine in Virginia USA. /snip -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Elavon Financial Services Limited Registered in Ireland: Number 418442 Registered Office: Block E, 1st Floor, Cherrywood Business Park, Loughlinstown, Co. Dublin, Ireland Directors: Robert Abele (USA), John Collins, Terrance Dolan (USA), Pamela Joseph (USA), Declan Lynch, John McNally, Malcolm Towlson Elavon Financial Services Limited, trading as Elavon, is regulated by the Financial Regulator -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
Several years ago I was the data center for a very large Texas-based regional hospital (over 1K in beds) running on a 9672 (at the time). Our holding company owned another dozen or so small (50-75 bed) hospitals running on a client-server solution. The software running in the smaller hospitals was not Y2K compliant and time was running out so they contracted with Perot Systems to get it finished. An overly aggressive sales team got their foot in the door and promised a $100M in cost savings over the 10-year contract. Of course the executives jumped on the agreement and we all ended up being outsourced. The first year (and only year - I left afterward) after outsourcing the operational cost of the data center (not including software) doubled! In fact there has been ZERO cost savings as a result of the outsourcing if anything costs have been ~ 50% higher. I am sure that in certain circumstances economies of scale will prevail and cost saving can be realized. But, as was our case, when you have a streamlined operation with a limited, hardworking staff that's not always the case. Gary -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Patrick Falcone Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 10:13 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Question on Out Sourcing Better to check the agreement very thoroughly. I would want to know, before signing, what is covered *after* the contract has been signed. You might be surprised at what you'll be paying for a few weeks down the road after the contract has been signed and you need *x* to be investigated, solved, implemented, upgraded, etc... for you by the outsourcer. I'm willing to bet that a lot of companies get hit with hidden fee's down the line where it becomes evident that outsourcing is ending up costing more that was originally thought. Pat Mihalec [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know this but I needed it from someone else to show the current director. He has not mainframe experience, his background is Windows. He thinks that if you move to the outsourcer system you no longer pay the fees. It comes as a shock to him. I suggested he ask the outsourcer directly about this. Pat Mihalec Rush University Medical Center Senior System Programmer (312) 942-8386 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
Certain times you can be added to the outsource company's MIPS/site license. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ted MacNEIL Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 4:44 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Question on Out Sourcing I have a question on Out Sourcing. When you sign a contract does that mean you no longer have to pay for your software product maintenance licenses? Of course the licence still has to be paid for. You can either transfer it to the service provider, or continue paying it yourself. If you've transfered, it will be buried in your service fees. It's not free. A certain large ISV wanted to charge us 10 times the annual rate to transfer the licence to our out-sourcer. They did this because the out-sourcer had a fully funded (and approved) initiative to replace all the products they supplied with any other equivalent. The ISV was/is not popular. They decided they'd rather gouge us one more time because they were going to lose us, if they transfered the licence. (You can probably figure out which ISV) But, the bottom line is maintenance is not going to go away, regardless of who pays for it (directly, or indirectly). - Too busy driving to stop for gas! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
In a word, YES. Dave Thorn [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2/13/2008 11:17 AM With us that stuff is all spelled out in the contract. No surprises later. How can an IT director have only Windows experience? Does that mean my mother could be an IT director? : ) CONFIDENTIALITY/EMAIL NOTICE: The material in this transmission contains confidential and privileged information intended only for the addressee. If you are not the intended recipient, please be advised that you have received this material in error and that any forwarding, copying, printing, distribution, use or disclosure of the material is strictly prohibited. If you have received this material in error, please (i) do not read it, (ii) reply to the sender that you received the message in error, and (iii) erase or destroy the material. Emails are not secure and can be intercepted, amended, lost or destroyed, or contain viruses. You are deemed to have accepted these risks if you communicate with us by email. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
Oops: David Boyes (I misspelled Mr Boyes name). Brian On Wed, 13 Feb 2008 12:15:41 -0600, Brian Peterson wrote: On Wed, 13 Feb 2008 16:13:28 -, Van Dalsen, Herbie wrote: (snip) I just read page 10 of the February edition of Linux Format where the claim is made that OpenSolaris was successfully ported to a System z IBM mainframe that is co-owned by Sun and Sine Nomine in Virginia USA. Who would have thought the day would come that that would be possible... 10 years ago, certainly not me. (snip) From November 2007here's a video of a show floor interview of David Boies demonstrating OpenSolaris running under z/VM. The video is in five parts - the below is a link to part 1, and then you can navigate to parts 2-5. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH71qP-yDDIfeature=related Brian -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
On Wed, 13 Feb 2008 16:13:28 -, Van Dalsen, Herbie wrote: (snip) I just read page 10 of the February edition of Linux Format where the claim is made that OpenSolaris was successfully ported to a System z IBM mainframe that is co-owned by Sun and Sine Nomine in Virginia USA. Who would have thought the day would come that that would be possible... 10 years ago, certainly not me. (snip) From November 2007here's a video of a show floor interview of David Boies demonstrating OpenSolaris running under z/VM. The video is in five parts - the below is a link to part 1, and then you can navigate to parts 2-5. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH71qP-yDDIfeature=related Brian -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
Very clever of IBM to have I running inside VM... That's another $NNN further before you will have Solaris up and running! -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Peterson Sent: 13 Februarie 2008 06:19 nm To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing Oops: David Boyes (I misspelled Mr Boyes name). Brian On Wed, 13 Feb 2008 12:15:41 -0600, Brian Peterson wrote: On Wed, 13 Feb 2008 16:13:28 -, Van Dalsen, Herbie wrote: (snip) I just read page 10 of the February edition of Linux Format where the claim is made that OpenSolaris was successfully ported to a System z IBM mainframe that is co-owned by Sun and Sine Nomine in Virginia USA. Who would have thought the day would come that that would be possible... 10 years ago, certainly not me. (snip) From November 2007here's a video of a show floor interview of David Boies demonstrating OpenSolaris running under z/VM. The video is in five parts - the below is a link to part 1, and then you can navigate to parts 2-5. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH71qP-yDDIfeature=related Brian -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Elavon Financial Services Limited Registered in Ireland: Number 418442 Registered Office: Block E, 1st Floor, Cherrywood Business Park, Loughlinstown, Co. Dublin, Ireland Directors: Robert Abele (USA), John Collins, Terrance Dolan (USA), Pamela Joseph (USA), Declan Lynch, John McNally, Malcolm Towlson Elavon Financial Services Limited, trading as Elavon, is regulated by the Financial Regulator -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Van Dalsen, Herbie Very clever of IBM to have I running inside VM... That's another $NNN further before you will have Solaris up and running! ... Unless you already have z/VM and some spare capacity. -jc- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: OpenSolaris successfully ported to an IBM Mainframe.. Was Question on Out Sourcing
On Wed, Feb 13, 2008 at 3:10 PM, in message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Van Dalsen, Herbie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Very clever of IBM to have I running inside VM... That's another $NNN further before you will have Solaris up and running! IBM had nothing to do with that decision. Rather it was the decision of the people doing the port. Mark Post -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
I have a question on Out Sourcing. When you sign a contract does that mean you no longer have to pay for your software product maintenance licenses? Of course the licence still has to be paid for. You can either transfer it to the service provider, or continue paying it yourself. If you've transfered, it will be buried in your service fees. It's not free. A certain large ISV wanted to charge us 10 times the annual rate to transfer the licence to our out-sourcer. They did this because the out-sourcer had a fully funded (and approved) initiative to replace all the products they supplied with any other equivalent. The ISV was/is not popular. They decided they'd rather gouge us one more time because they were going to lose us, if they transfered the licence. (You can probably figure out which ISV) But, the bottom line is maintenance is not going to go away, regardless of who pays for it (directly, or indirectly). - Too busy driving to stop for gas! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
Pat Mihalec wrote: I have a question on Out Sourcing. When you sign a contract does that mean you no longer have to pay for your software product maintenance licenses? Pat Mihalec Rush University Medical Center Senior System Programmer (312) 942-8386 [EMAIL PROTECTED] You are still paying for it no matter what. Either directly to the software vendor, or as part of your contract with the out sourcer. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Question on Out Sourcing
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pat Mihalec Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 4:16 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Question on Out Sourcing I have a question on Out Sourcing. When you sign a contract does that mean you no longer have to pay for your software product maintenance licenses? SNIP It depends. If your contract says that your equipment, operations, etc. are managed at the new data center by the outsourcer's people, then you probably pay the software license fees. If your contract says that your system will be migrated into their environment... Now the licensing of software is based on the outsourcer's equipment... So your charges will include your pro-rata share. I have seen both situations used by the same outsourcing company. Regards, Steve Thompson -- All opinions expressed by me are my own and may not necessarily reflect those of my employer. -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Question on Out Sourcing
I have a question on Out Sourcing. When you sign a contract does that mean you no longer have to pay for your software product maintenance licenses? Pat Mihalec Rush University Medical Center Senior System Programmer (312) 942-8386 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
