Re: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE
I never try to convince a bigot of anything. Cf: Matthew 7:6. Oracle has stablized their z/OS offering at the 10.2 level. I know nothing of Sybase on z/OS. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * (817)-961-6183 cell john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE
Can't speak to SYBASE. ORACLE v. DB2 ... Take your pick. Both will do the job well, and both have flavors that run on many platforms (a not necessarily congruent list). HTH, snip Well, to put a bit of perspective on it. DB2 is a crap database that is pushed by IBM. Compared to Sybase and Oracle it's the equivalent of an old Skoda held together with bits of filler and newspaper and, to add emphasis..(after I accused him of being brainwashed or blinkered). just been in the real world working with all platforms. I've worked with DB2 and as an Oracle DBA (and I started off on Sybase) I know shinola and I know shit /snip -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE
On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 12:07 PM, Rob Lister rob.lis...@aciworldwide.comwrote: Hi Folks, Certainly don't want to start a mine-is-bigger-than-yours debate, but Could any DB2 DBA help me (I hope) riddicule the following comment? Rob, you may be much better off asking the question on th DB2-L list. Jim McAlpine -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE
I don't see this as a DB2 issue. I hear the same kind of thing about other products: Mine is better than yours because I know so. About the only thing I can suggest is to smile and say Yes, grasshopper*. :-) Seriously, it's probably better that he somehow learn on his own that the technical merits of a given product aren't the only criteria. That is, yes, this may be true but there are larger truths. With any luck, you'll drive him to try to back his opinions with facts and the opinions of others. As he digs, he'll grow. *For my non-US friends - this comes from a US TV show where the very wise master patiently mentored a child toward enlightenment. The master gave the child the nickname 'grasshopper'. Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Rob Lister Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 6:08 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE Hi Folks, Certainly don't want to start a mine-is-bigger-than-yours debate, but Could any DB2 DBA help me (I hope) riddicule the following comment? Well, to put a bit of perspective on it. DB2 is a crap database that is pushed by IBM. Compared to Sybase and Oracle it's the equivalent of an old Skoda held together with bits of filler and newspaper and, to add emphasis..(after I accused him of being brainwashed or blinkered). just been in the real world working with all platforms. I've worked with DB2 and as an Oracle DBA (and I started off on Sybase) I know shinola and I know shit ..snip Many thanks for any/all observations. Cheers, Rob NOTICE: This electronic mail message and any files transmitted with it are intended exclusively for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. The message, together with any attachment, may contain confidential and/or privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, printing, saving, copying, disclosure or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete all copies. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE
Rob, While I can't speak to the Oracle vs DB2 issue you are asking about, other than to echo what others have said, that being they are both very good DBMSs, I have a different request. While the language you used in your quote from your coworker doesn't offend me, it really bothered out inappropriate content filter. I don't know how many other installations have such a beast front-ending their incoming e-mails, but I'm pretty sure at least some of the installations have such an animal, with some probably configured to simply throw away any e-mail it finds. You may find that you don't get as many replies simply because fewer of your compatriots see the e-mail. Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Rob Lister Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 6:08 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE Hi Folks, Certainly don't want to start a mine-is-bigger-than-yours debate, but Could any DB2 DBA help me (I hope) riddicule the following comment? Well, to put a bit of perspective on it. DB2 is a crap database that is pushed by IBM. Compared to Sybase and Oracle it's the equivalent of an old Skoda held together with bits of filler and newspaper and, to add emphasis..(after I accused him of being brainwashed or blinkered). just been in the real world working with all platforms. I've worked with DB2 and as an Oracle DBA (and I started off on Sybase) I know shinola and I know s*** This is from a collegue I work with. His skills are (I Think) mainly Unix and I know he has never worked on a Z platform (maybe P?). The reference to Skoda may give him away. Skoda's are now pretty good cars, unlike 20 years ago. Think his comment comes from some repressed 20 year old experience? I'm a zOS SysProg currently trying to install our product into a USS area back ended by DB2 with MQ providing the comms. I'm struggling with the Unix side at the moment so have to ask for help on a few occasions. Unfortunately, my DB2 skills are not sufficient to rebutt the above statements. I'd love to hear from a DB2 DBA who could. From my point of view, I heartilly dislike the 'vi' command in unix (I always use OEDIT if poss) but don't say it is rubbish as I don't have the knowledge of using 'vi' for 30 years. I simply prefer ISPF which I HAVE used for 30 years. Is this the same sort of thing - Is this guy so anti Mainframe, he actually believes what he says? Many thanks for any/all observations. Cheers, Rob -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE
The comments of your coworker are simply irrational rant for which no rational answer would suffice. Tell him to calm down tell what exactly his problem is with regard to DB2. That might be something that can be rationally discussed. IBM's Roger Miller once mentioned a quote from some book by Larry Ellison where he calls DB2 an example of a first class software product. In Roger's opinion the book was worth reading just for that. I never bothered to read this (or Palmisano's) book so I can't quote chapter and verse but a search in DB2-L archives might bring it up. May be a word from Ellison himself would hammer some sense into your coworker. Mohammad On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 06:07:31 -0500, Rob Lister rob.lis...@aciworldwide.com wrote: Hi Folks, Certainly don't want to start a mine-is-bigger-than-yours debate, but Could any DB2 DBA help me (I hope) riddicule the following comment? Well, to put a bit of perspective on it. DB2 is a crap database that is pushed by IBM. Compared to Sybase and Oracle it's the equivalent of an old Skoda held together with bits of filler and newspaper and, to add emphasis..(after I accused him of being brainwashed or blinkered). just been in the real world working with all platforms. I've worked with DB2 and as an Oracle DBA (and I started off on Sybase) I know shinola and I know shit This is from a collegue I work with. His skills are (I Think) mainly Unix and I know he has never worked on a Z platform (maybe P?). The reference to Skoda may give him away. Skoda's are now pretty good cars, unlike 20 years ago. Think his comment comes from some repressed 20 year old experience? I'm a zOS SysProg currently trying to install our product into a USS area back ended by DB2 with MQ providing the comms. I'm struggling with the Unix side at the moment so have to ask for help on a few occasions. Unfortunately, my DB2 skills are not sufficient to rebutt the above statements. I'd love to hear from a DB2 DBA who could. From my point of view, I heartilly dislike the 'vi' command in unix (I always use OEDIT if poss) but don't say it is rubbish as I don't have the knowledge of using 'vi' for 30 years. I simply prefer ISPF which I HAVE used for 30 years. Is this the same sort of thing - Is this guy so anti Mainframe, he actually believes what he says? Many thanks for any/all observations. Cheers, Rob -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE
Larry Elison : I make fun of a lot of other databasesall other databases, in fact, except the mainframe version of DB2. Its a first-rate piece of technology http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Database/In-Larrys-Own-Words/2/ Bruno Sugliani zxnetconsult(at)free(dot)fr http://zxnetconsult.free.fr On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 14:35:59 -0500, Mohammad Khan mkkha...@hotmail.com wrote: The comments of your coworker are simply irrational rant for which no rational answer would suffice. Tell him to calm down tell what exactly his problem is with regard to DB2. That might be something that can be rationally discussed. IBM's Roger Miller once mentioned a quote from some book by Larry Ellison where he calls DB2 an example of a first class software product. In Roger's opinion the book was worth reading just for that. I never bothered to read this (or Palmisano's) book so I can't quote chapter and verse but a search in DB2-L archives might bring it up. May be a word from Ellison himself would hammer some sense into your coworker. Mohammad Larry Elison : I make fun of a lot of other databasesall other databases, in fact, except the mainframe version of DB2. Its a first-rate piece of technology http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Database/In-Larrys-Own-Words/2/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE
The following message is a courtesy copy of an article that has been posted to bit.listserv.ibm-main,alt.folklore.computers as well. oldti...@wanadoo.fr (Bruno Sugliani) writes: Larry Elison : I make fun of a lot of other databases—all other databases, in fact, except the mainframe version of DB2. Its a first-rate piece of technology http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Database/In-Larrys-Own-Words/2/ posts from today mentioning early RDBMS and other DBMS work: http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2009i.html#7 My Vintaage Dream PC http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2009i.html#10 64 Cores -- IBM is showing a prototype already and recent related post in comp.database.theory regarding working with Ingres, Sybase, Informix (long before it was acquired) and Oracle on some of the cluster scaleup activity http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2009h.html#26 Natural keys vs Aritficial Keys related post regarding Jan92 meeting in Larry's conference room http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/95.html#13 There was some discussion in the period about these other vendors possibly porting to same platform as (mainframe) DB2 (differentiated from totally different non-mainframe DB2) ... and one of the barriers was feeling that they would have to perform 300 mainframe disk drive configuration regression tests as part of a competitive port (and the incremental business didn't appear to justify such an activity). At the time, they were more than willing to leave that market segment to mainframe DB2. -- 40+yrs virtualization experience (since Jan68), online at home since Mar1970 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: DB2 vs SYBASE or ORACLE
Bruno has the right quote. Your friend simply disagrees with Larry Ellison. Larry presumably had DB2 for z/OS Version 7 (or earlier) in mind -- all the more impressive for DB2. DB2 has come a long way since Version 7, as we all know. - - - - - Timothy Sipples IBM Consulting Enterprise Software Architect Based in Tokyo, Serving IBM Japan / Asia-Pacific E-Mail: timothy.sipp...@us.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
