Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 11:23:29 -0600, Kirk Wolf wrote:
>See this five year old RFE (where requirements go to die):
>https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/rfe/execute?use_case=viewRfe_ID=59716
>
A couple further thoughts (it's probably discourteous to amend an RFE ex post 
facto):
POSIX says:  
https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/functions/tzset.html#tag_16_629_03
DESCRIPTION  ... If TZ is absent from the environment, 
implementation-defined
default timezone information shall be used..

It might be less disruptive to blind-dubbed processes not to set TZ but to
use "implementation-defined default timezone information".  A couple OSes
I know do this as follows:

528 $ uname -a; ls -l /etc/localtime
Darwin PaulGilm.wifi.belezacoffeebar.com 18.7.0 Darwin Kernel Version 
18.7.0: Tue Aug 20 16:57:14 PDT 2019; root:xnu-4903.271.2~2/RELEASE_X86_64 
x86_64
lrwxr-xr-x  1 root  wheel  40 Nov 23 11:46 /etc/localtime -> 
/var/db/timezone/zoneinfo/America/Denver

1064 $ uname -a; ls -l /etc/localtime
Linux Bunsen5-PG 4.9.0-11-686-pae #1 SMP Debian 4.9.189-3+deb9u2 
(2019-11-11) i686 GNU/Linux
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 34 Sep 18 18:35 /etc/localtime -> 
/usr/share/zoneinfo/America/Denver

z/OS might just use the value in BPXPRMxx but not set TZ.

And:  https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8536#section-3.3
3.3.  TZif Footer
   The TZif footer is structured as follows (the lengths of multi-octet
   fields are shown in parentheses):

  +---++---+
  | NL|  TZ string (0...)  |NL |
  +---++---+
TZif Footer
   The elements of the footer are defined as follows:
   TZ string:  ... e as defined in Section 8.3 of the "Base
  Definitions" volume of [POSIX] with ASCII encoding

Elsewhere I found suggestions that an implementation might rely only
on the  TZif Footer (with reduced function) to avoid greater code
changes or performance impacts, or install only the footers to save
storage.

-- gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Gadi Ben-Avi]

This is the result:
# cat TZlog.txt
Script command is started on Wed Jan  1 05:50:11 2020. 
# date 
Wed Jan  1 05:50:29  2020  
# export -p | grep TZ  
export TZ="IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0" 
# echo "$0 $SHELL" 
/bin/sh /bin/sh
# exit 
Script command is complete on Wed Jan  1 05:51:14 2020.
#  

I am using z/OS v2.3

Gadi

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Paul Gilmartin
Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2019 6:02 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

On 2019-12-30, at 22:51:40, Gadi Ben-Avi wrote:
> 
> I changed TZ to the value you suggested, and when I issue the time command I 
> get UTC.
>  
"time"?  Try "date" instead.

Troubleshooting:

o Run the commands in the attached TAtry.txt file (This is not a shell script.)


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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Tue, 31 Dec 2019 05:51:40 +, Gadi Ben-Avi wrote:

>I changed TZ to the value you suggested, and when I issue the time command I 
>get UTC.
>
So the TZ mailing list gently scolded me for rehashing old news and mentioned:
http://austingroupbugs.net/view.php?id=1252
This proposal would address Austin Group issue 661 "grammar of TZ variable 
is insufficient for describing Israel Daylight-saving time", as 
TZ='IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0' represents current rules for Israel, with the 
'/26' exercising the proposed extension. It would also let POSIX TZ strings 
represent the current daylight-saving scheme for Godthab, via 
TZ='<-03>3<-02>,M3.5.0/-2,M10.5.0/-1' where the '/-2' and '/-1' exercise the 
proposed extension. 
...
The two minor extensions are specified in Internet RFC 8536 section 3.3.1 "TZ 
String Extensions" , [^] and the 
proposed action is to add these to POSIX.

And in RFC 8536:
...
  Example: <-03>3<-02>,M3.5.0/-2,M10.5.0/-1
 This represents a time zone that observes daylight saving time
 from 22:00 on the day before March's last Sunday until 23:00 on
 the day before October's last Sunday.  Standard time is 3 hours
 west of UT and is abbreviated "-03"; daylight saving time is 2
 hours west of UT and is abbreviated "-02".

So Israel needs only wait until POSIX assimilates RFC 8536 then z/OS
conforms to the updated POSIX.

RFE, anyone?


>-Original Message-
>From: Paul Gilmartin
>Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 9:28 AM
>...
>A better approach, extracting information from Linux, which does it right:
>
>503 $ tail -1  /usr/share/zoneinfo/Asia/Tel_Aviv
>IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0

-- gil

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Hour 26? (was: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks)

[Paul Gilmartin]

(cross-posting to tz and IBM-MAIN)
Hi, TZData,

On a Linux system, I see:
1043 $ uname -a
Linux Bunsen5-PG 4.9.0-11-686-pae #1 SMP Debian 4.9.189-3+deb9u2 (2019-11-11) 
i686 GNU/Linux
1044 $ cat /usr/share/zoneinfo/Asia/Tel_Aviv   | tail -1
IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0
1045 $ 

... This would seem to be Month 3, Week 4, Day 4, hour 26.
26?  Is that supposed to be 02:00 the next day?

But POSIX says:
https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/basedefs/V1_chap08.html#tag_08
... The hour shall be between zero and 24, and the minutes (and seconds)
-if present-between zero and 59. The result of using values outside 
of this range is unspecified.

z/OS (which supports only POSIX format) seems to ignore that TZ
(as allowed by "unspecified") and use UTC0:
https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/en/SSLTBW_2.1.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r1.bpxa500/bpxa50065.htm
(It doesn't specify.)

Ouch!
-- gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Paul Gilmartin]

On 2019-12-30, at 22:51:40, Gadi Ben-Avi wrote:
> 
> I changed TZ to the value you suggested, and when I issue the time command I 
> get UTC.
>  
"time"?  Try "date" instead.

Troubleshooting:

o Run the commands in the attached TAtry.txt file (This is not a shell script.)


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TZ=IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0 script
date
export -p | grep TZ
echo "$0 $SHELL"
exit
mv typescript TZlog.txt

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o Reply here attaching the generated TZlog.txt

o After review by enough critical eyes, go to SR.

> -Original Message-
>> 
> A better approach, extracting information from Linux, which does it right:
> 
>503 $ tail -1  /usr/share/zoneinfo/Asia/Tel_Aviv
>IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0
> 
> So:
>TZ=IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0 export TZ
> 
> See: https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/007908799/xbd/envvar.html

-- gil



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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Gadi Ben-Avi]

I changed TZ to the value you suggested, and when I issue the time command I 
get UTC.

Gadi


-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Paul Gilmartin
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 9:28 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 07:09:19 +, Gadi Ben-Avi wrote:

>I know, bit that requires editing a file.
>I want something that can be done using automation.
>
A better approach, extracting information from Linux, which does it right:

503 $ tail -1  /usr/share/zoneinfo/Asia/Tel_Aviv
IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0

So:
TZ=IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0 export TZ

See: https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/007908799/xbd/envvar.html

Unfortunately, this must be set in several places.

-- gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Steve Smith]

It is impossible to please everyone all the time :-D.  The only solution is
to use UTC everywhere for everything; except of course, that would please
almost no one who doesn't live in Iceland.

sas


On Mon, Dec 30, 2019 at 3:19 PM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> From *which* time zone? You may have different processes running with
> different values for TZ.
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Seymour J Metz]

>From *which* time zone? You may have different processes running with 
>different values for TZ.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3



From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
Paul Gilmartin <000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 2:27 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 13:08:12 -0600, Kirk Wolf wrote:
>
>... maybe there should be a special setting for TZ (or another envar)
>that will cause TZ to automatically follow the MVS time.
>Maybe open another RFE?  :-)
>
Wrong approach because of insufficient information.  It must go
the opposite way, setting MVS time from TZ.  Consider that today
Colorado and Arizona have the same CVTLDTO, but:

711 $ tail -1 /usr/share/zoneinfo/America/Denver  | tail -1
MST7MDT,M3.2.0,M11.1.0

712 $ tail -1 /usr/share/zoneinfo/America/Phoenix | tail -1
MST7

And those TZ values provide sufficient information to schedule
the (however misconceived) semiannual SET TIMEZONE.

-- gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 13:08:12 -0600, Kirk Wolf wrote:
>
>... maybe there should be a special setting for TZ (or another envar)
>that will cause TZ to automatically follow the MVS time.
>Maybe open another RFE?  :-)
> 
Wrong approach because of insufficient information.  It must go
the opposite way, setting MVS time from TZ.  Consider that today
Colorado and Arizona have the same CVTLDTO, but:

711 $ tail -1 /usr/share/zoneinfo/America/Denver  | tail -1
MST7MDT,M3.2.0,M11.1.0

712 $ tail -1 /usr/share/zoneinfo/America/Phoenix | tail -1
MST7

And those TZ values provide sufficient information to schedule
the (however misconceived) semiannual SET TIMEZONE.

-- gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Kirk Wolf]

Gil,

I agree - maybe there should be a special setting for TZ (or another envar)
that will cause TZ to automatically follow the MVS time.
Maybe open another RFE?  :-)

On Mon, Dec 30, 2019 at 12:53 PM Paul Gilmartin <
000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 11:23:29 -0600, Kirk Wolf wrote:
> >...
> >The correct place to set TZ (as documented in the UNIX Planning book) is
> >/etc/init.options.
> >... z/OS UNIX is brain dead in this
> >regard, and the "init" process environment is not inherited by
> blind-dubbed
> >processes.
> >
> >See this five year old RFE (where requirements go to die):
> >
> https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/rfe/execute?use_case=viewRfe_ID=59716
> >
> I read; I voted long ago.  It doesn't matter.  And it leaves a 100%
> surfeit.
> There should be *one* point of control that governs both z/OS UNIX and
> Classic MVS.  Or at least a provision to omit specifying one to default to
> the
> value of the other.
>
> -- gil
>
> --
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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 11:23:29 -0600, Kirk Wolf wrote:
>...
>The correct place to set TZ (as documented in the UNIX Planning book) is
>/etc/init.options.
>... z/OS UNIX is brain dead in this
>regard, and the "init" process environment is not inherited by blind-dubbed
>processes.
>
>See this five year old RFE (where requirements go to die):
>https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/rfe/execute?use_case=viewRfe_ID=59716
> 
I read; I voted long ago.  It doesn't matter.  And it leaves a 100% surfeit.
There should be *one* point of control that governs both z/OS UNIX and
Classic MVS.  Or at least a provision to omit specifying one to default to the
value of the other.

-- gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 09:42:05 -0600, Giliad Wilf wrote:
>...
>Yes, it flips automatically, Gadi.
>
>Note the M3 and M10 in the expression, for March and October.
>
Imagining something that changes or "flips" semiannually is a
conceptual error.  In fact the TZ environment variable is a parameter
to a function that takes as an argument a TOD (sort of) value from
any time in the past, present, or near future and returns the matching
local civil time as a result.  If six months from now with the same TZ
in the environment, I use TOD argument I save today, it will return
the same local time it did today.

Nothing "changes."

>What does not flip automatically is the CLOCKxx's TIMEZONE parameter value. 
>A JES2 automatic command can be manually set, up to seven days in advance,
>before the date, to do the flip "unattended", as it has to occur at 2am...

-- gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Kirk Wolf]

>
>
> Unfortunately, this must be set in several places.
>
> -- gil
>
>
> Depends on what you mean by "several".  Might be dozens, hundreds, etc.

The correct place to set TZ (as documented in the UNIX Planning book) is
/etc/init.options.
This will be picked up by any shells or programs (cron, etc) that are
started by the "init" process.
Unfortunately, this doesn't help much since z/OS UNIX is brain dead in this
regard, and the "init" process environment is not inherited by blind-dubbed
processes.

See this five year old RFE (where requirements go to die):
https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/rfe/execute?use_case=viewRfe_ID=59716

Vote for it if you actually think that it will matter :-(

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Grant Taylor]

On 12/30/19 12:09 AM, Gadi Ben-Avi wrote:

I want something that can be done using automation.


Does using something like sed or patch count?



--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Giliad Wilf]

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 14:47:35 +, Allan Staller  wrote:

>One time setup.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: I M Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
>Gadi Ben-Avi
>Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 1:33 AM
>To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>Subject: Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks
>
>Thanks
>Is this a otetime setup, or would I have to do this twice a year?
>Gadi
>

>One time setup.
>

Yes, it flips automatically, Gadi.

Note the M3 and M10 in the expression, for March and October.

What does not flip automatically is the CLOCKxx's TIMEZONE parameter value. 
A JES2 automatic command can be manually set, up to seven days in advance,
before the date, to do the flip "unattended", as it has to occur at 2am...

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Allan Staller]

One time setup.

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Gadi Ben-Avi
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 1:33 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

Thanks
Is this a onetime setup, or would I have to do this twice a year?
Gadi

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Paul Gilmartin
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 9:28 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 07:09:19 +, Gadi Ben-Avi wrote:

>I know, bit that requires editing a file.
>I want something that can be done using automation.
>
A better approach, extracting information from Linux, which does it right:

503 $ tail -1  /usr/share/zoneinfo/Asia/Tel_Aviv
IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0

So:
TZ=IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0 export TZ

See: 
https://apc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpubs.opengroup.org%2Fonlinepubs%2F007908799%2Fxbd%2Fenvvar.htmldata=02%7C01%7Callan.staller%40HCL.COM%7C05ed9cd45e5d4796e6e308d78cfa994a%7C189de737c93a4f5a8b686f4ca9941912%7C0%7C0%7C637132880288380164sdata=syRZCr5cUu78uANGQS33rdcKaygYTrxbawsdxACvFzU%3Dreserved=0

Unfortunately, this must be set in several places.

-- gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Gadi Ben-Avi]

Thanks
Is this a onetime setup, or would I have to do this twice a year?
Gadi

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Paul Gilmartin
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 9:28 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 07:09:19 +, Gadi Ben-Avi wrote:

>I know, bit that requires editing a file.
>I want something that can be done using automation.
>
A better approach, extracting information from Linux, which does it right:

503 $ tail -1  /usr/share/zoneinfo/Asia/Tel_Aviv
IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0

So:
TZ=IST-2IDT,M3.4.4/26,M10.5.0 export TZ

See: https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/007908799/xbd/envvar.html

Unfortunately, this must be set in several places.

-- gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Gadi Ben-Avi]

I'm in Israel.

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Paul Gilmartin
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 9:03 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 06:26:57 +, Gadi Ben-Avi wrote:

>Hi,
>Twice a year, we change the time zone the system is using with the SET 
>TIMEZONE command.
>This does not affect tasks running under Unix System Services.
>
>Is there a way to make these tasks use the z/OS system Time Zone?
>
>We are using z/OS v2.2 and z/OS v2.3
>
FAQ; Dammit! Should be RFE.

No,  but where are you?

— gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Gadi Ben-Avi]

I know, bit that requires editing a file.
I want something that can be done using automation.
Gadi

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
ITschak Mugzach
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2019 8:54 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

in /etc/profile set the variable TZ to UTC+2 (setenv  TZ "UTC2EDT")

ITschak

On Mon, Dec 30, 2019 at 8:27 AM Gadi Ben-Avi  wrote:

> Hi,
> Twice a year, we change the time zone the system is using with the SET 
> TIMEZONE command.
> This does not affect tasks running under Unix System Services.
>
> Is there a way to make these tasks use the z/OS system Time Zone?
>
> We are using z/OS v2.2 and z/OS v2.3
>
> Thanks
>
> Gadi
>
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Legacy **|  *

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Mon, 30 Dec 2019 06:26:57 +, Gadi Ben-Avi wrote:

>Hi,
>Twice a year, we change the time zone the system is using with the SET 
>TIMEZONE command.
>This does not affect tasks running under Unix System Services.
>
>Is there a way to make these tasks use the z/OS system Time Zone?
>
>We are using z/OS v2.2 and z/OS v2.3
>
FAQ; Dammit! Should be RFE.

No,  but where are you?

— gil

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Re: Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[ITschak Mugzach]

in /etc/profile set the variable TZ to UTC+2 (setenv  TZ "UTC2EDT")

ITschak

On Mon, Dec 30, 2019 at 8:27 AM Gadi Ben-Avi  wrote:

> Hi,
> Twice a year, we change the time zone the system is using with the SET
> TIMEZONE command.
> This does not affect tasks running under Unix System Services.
>
> Is there a way to make these tasks use the z/OS system Time Zone?
>
> We are using z/OS v2.2 and z/OS v2.3
>
> Thanks
>
> Gadi
>
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ITschak Mugzach
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Chaning time zone for Unix based tasks

[Gadi Ben-Avi]

Hi,
Twice a year, we change the time zone the system is using with the SET TIMEZONE 
command.
This does not affect tasks running under Unix System Services.

Is there a way to make these tasks use the z/OS system Time Zone?

We are using z/OS v2.2 and z/OS v2.3

Thanks

Gadi

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