Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
Thanks for clearing it up. Sometimes I have a problem understanding IBM speak. On Mon, 12/5/16, Robert2 Gensler <rgen...@us.ibm.com> wrote: Subject: Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Received: Monday, December 5, 2016, 3:41 PM Hi Esmie, Yes, for all intents and purposes this means FlashCopy. Robert DFSMSdss Architecture and Development Tucson, AZ 1-720-349-5211 rgen...@us.ibm.com IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> wrote on 12/05/2016 10:20:10 AM: > From: esmie moo <012780d99c7b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Date: 12/05/2016 10:20 AM > Subject: Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION > Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > > Good Morning Gentle Readers, > > Thanks very much for answering my question. All your input has > afforded me additional knowledge aboug FLASHCOPY. > > Robert, I checked your suggestion about looking for ADR806I. It > does appear on the output which confirms what you said: > > ADR806I (001)-T0MI (02), VOLUME SBR000 WAS COPIED USING A FAST > REPLICATION FUNCTION. > > Thanks for the tip. Just to clear up my understanding, does FAST > REPLICATION FUNCTION mean the same as FLASHCOPY? > > Thanks again. > ---- > On Sun, 12/4/16, Robert2 Gensler <rgen...@us.ibm.com> wrote: > > Subject: Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Received: Sunday, December 4, 2016, 8:37 PM > > Hi Esmie, > > DFSMSdss will notify you if > FlashCopy was used by issuing an ADR806I in the > sysprint output. You do not see any evidence > in the sysin because, by > default, COPY > operations use what is called FastReplication(PREFERRED). > There is a FASTREPLICATION keyword on the copy > command that has three > different > sub-parameters. You can read about the details in the > manual. > FCNC is another parameter that > controls how the FlashCopy is made, but it > does not control whether or not FlashCopy is > used. That is controlled by > the > FASTREPLICATION keyword (or default). Typically FCNC is > used when you > are going to dump the target > of the FlashCopy to tape and in the course of > that DUMP command you withdraw the original > relationship with the > FCWITHDRAW keyword. > Another keyword to investigate using is DEBUG(FRMSG > (...)) because if FlashCopy was not used, the > DEBUG(FRMSG(...)) > specification will control > how detailed the returned information is. > > Thanks, > Robert > DFSMSdss Architecture > and Development > Tucson, AZ > 1-720-349-5211 > rgen...@us.ibm.com > > IBM Mainframe Discussion List > <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > wrote on > 12/03/2016 08:58:21 AM: > > > From: esmie moo <012780d99c7b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> > > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > > Date: 12/03/2016 09:01 AM > > Subject: FLASHCOPY QUESTION > > Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > > > > Gentle Readers, > > > > I have a question > about FLASHCOPY using ADRDSSU and COPY. In my > > first example I was told that the job is > using FLASHCOPY. However I > > do not see > any evidence. > > > > > COPY FULL INDYNAM (SDB000) OUTDYNAM (MDB000) > DUMPCONDITIONING > > ADR101I (R/I)-RI01 > (01), TASKID 001 HAS BEEN ASSIGNED TO COMMAND 'COPY > ' > > > > From my > understanding it is performing a full volume copy of a > > source volume. If my understanding of > the parm DUMPCONDITIONING is > > correct, > it (DUMPCONDITIONING) allows to make a copy of the source > > volume and while keeping the target volume > online. > > > > I have > done a full volume copy of a source to target without the > > DUMPCONDITIONING parm and it worked - the > volume was fully copied > > (see below). > Am I missing something? Aren't both examples doing > the > > same thing? > > > > COPY INDDNAME(DASD1) > OUTDDNAME(DASD2) - > > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP COPYVOLID > PURGE > > /* > > > > However I do not see any evidence of > FLASHCOPY being invoked because > > the > FCNC parm is not present. > > > > Here is a my second example: > > > > COPY FULL > IDY(PROM70,3390) ODY(SNAP63,
Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
Hi Esmie, Yes, for all intents and purposes this means FlashCopy. Robert DFSMSdss Architecture and Development Tucson, AZ 1-720-349-5211 rgen...@us.ibm.com IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> wrote on 12/05/2016 10:20:10 AM: > From: esmie moo <012780d99c7b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Date: 12/05/2016 10:20 AM > Subject: Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION > Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > > Good Morning Gentle Readers, > > Thanks very much for answering my question. All your input has > afforded me additional knowledge aboug FLASHCOPY. > > Robert, I checked your suggestion about looking for ADR806I. It > does appear on the output which confirms what you said: > > ADR806I (001)-T0MI (02), VOLUME SBR000 WAS COPIED USING A FAST > REPLICATION FUNCTION. > > Thanks for the tip. Just to clear up my understanding, does FAST > REPLICATION FUNCTION mean the same as FLASHCOPY? > > Thanks again. > ---- > On Sun, 12/4/16, Robert2 Gensler <rgen...@us.ibm.com> wrote: > > Subject: Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Received: Sunday, December 4, 2016, 8:37 PM > > Hi Esmie, > > DFSMSdss will notify you if > FlashCopy was used by issuing an ADR806I in the > sysprint output. You do not see any evidence > in the sysin because, by > default, COPY > operations use what is called FastReplication(PREFERRED). > There is a FASTREPLICATION keyword on the copy > command that has three > different > sub-parameters. You can read about the details in the > manual. > FCNC is another parameter that > controls how the FlashCopy is made, but it > does not control whether or not FlashCopy is > used. That is controlled by > the > FASTREPLICATION keyword (or default). Typically FCNC is > used when you > are going to dump the target > of the FlashCopy to tape and in the course of > that DUMP command you withdraw the original > relationship with the > FCWITHDRAW keyword. > Another keyword to investigate using is DEBUG(FRMSG > (...)) because if FlashCopy was not used, the > DEBUG(FRMSG(...)) > specification will control > how detailed the returned information is. > > Thanks, > Robert > DFSMSdss Architecture > and Development > Tucson, AZ > 1-720-349-5211 > rgen...@us.ibm.com > > IBM Mainframe Discussion List > <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > wrote on > 12/03/2016 08:58:21 AM: > > > From: esmie moo <012780d99c7b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> > > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > > Date: 12/03/2016 09:01 AM > > Subject: FLASHCOPY QUESTION > > Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > > > > Gentle Readers, > > > > I have a question > about FLASHCOPY using ADRDSSU and COPY. In my > > first example I was told that the job is > using FLASHCOPY. However I > > do not see > any evidence. > > > > > COPY FULL INDYNAM (SDB000) OUTDYNAM (MDB000) > DUMPCONDITIONING > > ADR101I (R/I)-RI01 > (01), TASKID 001 HAS BEEN ASSIGNED TO COMMAND 'COPY > ' > > > > From my > understanding it is performing a full volume copy of a > > source volume. If my understanding of > the parm DUMPCONDITIONING is > > correct, > it (DUMPCONDITIONING) allows to make a copy of the source > > volume and while keeping the target volume > online. > > > > I have > done a full volume copy of a source to target without the > > DUMPCONDITIONING parm and it worked - the > volume was fully copied > > (see below). > Am I missing something? Aren't both examples doing > the > > same thing? > > > > COPY INDDNAME(DASD1) > OUTDDNAME(DASD2) - > > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP COPYVOLID > PURGE > > /* > > > > However I do not see any evidence of > FLASHCOPY being invoked because > > the > FCNC parm is not present. > > > > Here is a my second example: > > > > COPY FULL > IDY(PROM70,3390) ODY(SNAP63,3390) DUMPCOND FCNC- > > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP CANCELERROR PURGE > FCTOPPRCPRIMARY - > > > FCSETGTOK(FAILRELATION) > > > > In the above example FLASCHOPY is being > performed because of the FCNC. > > > > Could you correct my understanding of all > 3 examples? > > > > > Thanks. > > > > > -- > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive > access ins
Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
I looked back at one my lightning fast Mod-27 volume copy jobs and indeed found ADR806I (001)-T0MI (02), VOLUME vv WAS COPIED USING A FAST REPLICATION FUNCTION I'm told that this indicates usage of the 'fast copy' microcode, available only when copying within the same DASD subsystem. Once the job began execution, all time stamps show 08.41.54 from start to finish. Now that's what I call fast. . . J.O.Skip Robinson Southern California Edison Company Electric Dragon Team Paddler SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager 323-715-0595 Mobile 626-302-7535 Office robin...@sce.com -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of esmie moo Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 7:20 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: (External):Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION Good Morning Gentle Readers, Thanks very much for answering my question. All your input has afforded me additional knowledge aboug FLASHCOPY. Robert, I checked your suggestion about looking for ADR806I. It does appear on the output which confirms what you said: ADR806I (001)-T0MI (02), VOLUME SBR000 WAS COPIED USING A FAST REPLICATION FUNCTION. Thanks for the tip. Just to clear up my understanding, does FAST REPLICATION FUNCTION mean the same as FLASHCOPY? Thanks again. On Sun, 12/4/16, Robert2 Gensler <rgen...@us.ibm.com> wrote: Subject: Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Received: Sunday, December 4, 2016, 8:37 PM Hi Esmie, DFSMSdss will notify you if FlashCopy was used by issuing an ADR806I in the sysprint output. You do not see any evidence in the sysin because, by default, COPY operations use what is called FastReplication(PREFERRED). There is a FASTREPLICATION keyword on the copy command that has three different sub-parameters. You can read about the details in the manual. FCNC is another parameter that controls how the FlashCopy is made, but it does not control whether or not FlashCopy is used. That is controlled by the FASTREPLICATION keyword (or default). Typically FCNC is used when you are going to dump the target of the FlashCopy to tape and in the course of that DUMP command you withdraw the original relationship with the FCWITHDRAW keyword. Another keyword to investigate using is DEBUG(FRMSG (...)) because if FlashCopy was not used, the DEBUG(FRMSG(...)) specification will control how detailed the returned information is. Thanks, Robert DFSMSdss Architecture and Development Tucson, AZ 1-720-349-5211 rgen...@us.ibm.com IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> wrote on 12/03/2016 08:58:21 AM: > From: esmie moo <012780d99c7b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Date: 12/03/2016 09:01 AM > Subject: FLASHCOPY QUESTION > Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > > > Gentle Readers, > > I have a question about FLASHCOPY using ADRDSSU and > COPY. In my > first example I was told that the job is using FLASHCOPY. > However I > do not see any evidence. > > COPY FULL INDYNAM (SDB000) OUTDYNAM (MDB000) DUMPCONDITIONING > ADR101I (R/I)-RI01 (01), TASKID 001 HAS BEEN ASSIGNED TO COMMAND 'COPY ' > > From my understanding it is performing a full volume copy of a > source volume. If my understanding of the parm DUMPCONDITIONING is > correct, it (DUMPCONDITIONING) allows to make a copy of the source > volume and while keeping the target volume online. > > I have done a full volume copy of a source to target without the > DUMPCONDITIONING parm and it worked - the volume was fully copied > (see below). Am I missing something? Aren't both examples doing the > same thing? > > COPY INDDNAME(DASD1) OUTDDNAME(DASD2) - > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP COPYVOLID PURGE > /* > > However I do not see any evidence of FLASHCOPY being invoked because > the FCNC parm is not present. > > Here is a my second example: > > COPY FULL IDY(PROM70,3390) ODY(SNAP63,3390) DUMPCOND FCNC- > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP CANCELERROR PURGE FCTOPPRCPRIMARY - > FCSETGTOK(FAILRELATION) > > In the above example FLASCHOPY is being performed because of the FCNC. > > Could you correct my understanding of all 3 examples? > > Thanks. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
Joel, Thanks for helping me understand DUMPCONDITIONING. With your help I am able to increase my understanding. On Sat, 12/3/16, Joel C. Ewing <jcew...@acm.org> wrote: Subject: Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Received: Saturday, December 3, 2016, 11:18 AM On 12/03/2016 07:58 AM, esmie moo wrote: > Gentle Readers, > > I have a question about FLASHCOPY using ADRDSSU and COPY. In my first example I was told that the job is using FLASHCOPY. However I do not see any evidence. > > COPY FULL INDYNAM (SDB000) OUTDYNAM (MDB000) DUMPCONDITIONING > ADR101I (R/I)-RI01 (01), TASKID 001 HAS BEEN ASSIGNED TO COMMAND 'COPY ' > > >From my understanding it is performing a full volume copy of a source volume. If my understanding of the parm DUMPCONDITIONING is correct, it (DUMPCONDITIONING) allows to make a copy of the source volume and while keeping the target volume online. > > I have done a full volume copy of a source to target without the DUMPCONDITIONING parm and it worked - the volume was fully copied (see below). Am I missing something? Aren't both examples doing the same thing? > > COPY INDDNAME(DASD1) OUTDDNAME(DASD2) - > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP COPYVOLID PURGE > /* > > However I do not see any evidence of FLASHCOPY being invoked because the FCNC parm is not present. > > Here is a my second example: > > COPY FULL IDY(PROM70,3390) ODY(SNAP63,3390) DUMPCOND FCNC- > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP CANCELERROR PURGE FCTOPPRCPRIMARY - > FCSETGTOK(FAILRELATION) > > In the above example FLASCHOPY is being performed because of the FCNC. > > Could you correct my understanding of all 3 examples? > > Thanks. > > If you do a full volume copy without DUMPCONDITIONING and with COPYVOLID, that means when the copy is complete the target volume will now have the same VOLSER as the source volume and dss will force it offline, as you can't have two volumes with identical VOLSER online to the same MVS system. If your goal was just to make a point-in-time copy on DASD, that may be sufficient. But if your goal was to then back up that target volume to removable tape media, you would not be able to do that with dss from the same system because the volume is offline because of the duplicate VOLSER. It also means that if you for some reason needed to IPL at that point, the system will complain about finding two volumes with the same VOLSER and there could be some confusion about which of the two volumes should be placed online and the wrong one could be chosen. With DUMPCONDITIONING the original different target volume VOLSER is preserved so both volumes can be online to the same system and there is no later confusion about which is the original and which is the point-in-time copy. DSS is smart enough when restoring from a tape dump of the volume with the DUMPCONDITIONING copy to also restore the original VOLSER (this used to require either an VTOCINDEX or VVDS dataset on the volume to supply the correct VOLSER). There are other vendor utilities that will allow one to dump an offline DASD volume with a duplicate volser to tape, but this seems to me a perversion of the meaning of "offline", which was intended to mean access by the system was impossible and that the device could safely be taken physically offline for hardware maintenance. Assuming there is still a dss FASTREPLICATION parameter, it used to default to "PREFERRED", which meant if flashcopy wasn't available for some reason, dss would default to an ordinary copy but still do the COPY command successfully (just m-u-c-h slower). If you wanted the copy to fail if flashcopy were not possible, you had to explicitly request FASTREPLICATION(REQUIRED). It should be obvious from the time required for the COPY command to complete whether flashcopy has been used: a fraction of a second for the dss COPY command to complete with fastcopy, versus minutes without fastcopy. Joel C. Ewing -- Joel C. Ewing, Bentonville, AR jcew...@acm.org -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
Good Morning Gentle Readers, Thanks very much for answering my question. All your input has afforded me additional knowledge aboug FLASHCOPY. Robert, I checked your suggestion about looking for ADR806I. It does appear on the output which confirms what you said: ADR806I (001)-T0MI (02), VOLUME SBR000 WAS COPIED USING A FAST REPLICATION FUNCTION. Thanks for the tip. Just to clear up my understanding, does FAST REPLICATION FUNCTION mean the same as FLASHCOPY? Thanks again. On Sun, 12/4/16, Robert2 Gensler <rgen...@us.ibm.com> wrote: Subject: Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Received: Sunday, December 4, 2016, 8:37 PM Hi Esmie, DFSMSdss will notify you if FlashCopy was used by issuing an ADR806I in the sysprint output. You do not see any evidence in the sysin because, by default, COPY operations use what is called FastReplication(PREFERRED). There is a FASTREPLICATION keyword on the copy command that has three different sub-parameters. You can read about the details in the manual. FCNC is another parameter that controls how the FlashCopy is made, but it does not control whether or not FlashCopy is used. That is controlled by the FASTREPLICATION keyword (or default). Typically FCNC is used when you are going to dump the target of the FlashCopy to tape and in the course of that DUMP command you withdraw the original relationship with the FCWITHDRAW keyword. Another keyword to investigate using is DEBUG(FRMSG (...)) because if FlashCopy was not used, the DEBUG(FRMSG(...)) specification will control how detailed the returned information is. Thanks, Robert DFSMSdss Architecture and Development Tucson, AZ 1-720-349-5211 rgen...@us.ibm.com IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> wrote on 12/03/2016 08:58:21 AM: > From: esmie moo <012780d99c7b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Date: 12/03/2016 09:01 AM > Subject: FLASHCOPY QUESTION > Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > > Gentle Readers, > > I have a question about FLASHCOPY using ADRDSSU and COPY. In my > first example I was told that the job is using FLASHCOPY. However I > do not see any evidence. > > COPY FULL INDYNAM (SDB000) OUTDYNAM (MDB000) DUMPCONDITIONING > ADR101I (R/I)-RI01 (01), TASKID 001 HAS BEEN ASSIGNED TO COMMAND 'COPY ' > > From my understanding it is performing a full volume copy of a > source volume. If my understanding of the parm DUMPCONDITIONING is > correct, it (DUMPCONDITIONING) allows to make a copy of the source > volume and while keeping the target volume online. > > I have done a full volume copy of a source to target without the > DUMPCONDITIONING parm and it worked - the volume was fully copied > (see below). Am I missing something? Aren't both examples doing the > same thing? > > COPY INDDNAME(DASD1) OUTDDNAME(DASD2) - > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP COPYVOLID PURGE > /* > > However I do not see any evidence of FLASHCOPY being invoked because > the FCNC parm is not present. > > Here is a my second example: > > COPY FULL IDY(PROM70,3390) ODY(SNAP63,3390) DUMPCOND FCNC- > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP CANCELERROR PURGE FCTOPPRCPRIMARY - > FCSETGTOK(FAILRELATION) > > In the above example FLASCHOPY is being performed because of the FCNC. > > Could you correct my understanding of all 3 examples? > > Thanks. > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
Hi Esmie, DFSMSdss will notify you if FlashCopy was used by issuing an ADR806I in the sysprint output. You do not see any evidence in the sysin because, by default, COPY operations use what is called FastReplication(PREFERRED). There is a FASTREPLICATION keyword on the copy command that has three different sub-parameters. You can read about the details in the manual. FCNC is another parameter that controls how the FlashCopy is made, but it does not control whether or not FlashCopy is used. That is controlled by the FASTREPLICATION keyword (or default). Typically FCNC is used when you are going to dump the target of the FlashCopy to tape and in the course of that DUMP command you withdraw the original relationship with the FCWITHDRAW keyword. Another keyword to investigate using is DEBUG(FRMSG (...)) because if FlashCopy was not used, the DEBUG(FRMSG(...)) specification will control how detailed the returned information is. Thanks, Robert DFSMSdss Architecture and Development Tucson, AZ 1-720-349-5211 rgen...@us.ibm.com IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> wrote on 12/03/2016 08:58:21 AM: > From: esmie moo <012780d99c7b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Date: 12/03/2016 09:01 AM > Subject: FLASHCOPY QUESTION > Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > > Gentle Readers, > > I have a question about FLASHCOPY using ADRDSSU and COPY. In my > first example I was told that the job is using FLASHCOPY. However I > do not see any evidence. > > COPY FULL INDYNAM (SDB000) OUTDYNAM (MDB000) DUMPCONDITIONING > ADR101I (R/I)-RI01 (01), TASKID 001 HAS BEEN ASSIGNED TO COMMAND 'COPY ' > > From my understanding it is performing a full volume copy of a > source volume. If my understanding of the parm DUMPCONDITIONING is > correct, it (DUMPCONDITIONING) allows to make a copy of the source > volume and while keeping the target volume online. > > I have done a full volume copy of a source to target without the > DUMPCONDITIONING parm and it worked - the volume was fully copied > (see below). Am I missing something? Aren't both examples doing the > same thing? > > COPY INDDNAME(DASD1) OUTDDNAME(DASD2) - > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP COPYVOLID PURGE > /* > > However I do not see any evidence of FLASHCOPY being invoked because > the FCNC parm is not present. > > Here is a my second example: > > COPY FULL IDY(PROM70,3390) ODY(SNAP63,3390) DUMPCOND FCNC- > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP CANCELERROR PURGE FCTOPPRCPRIMARY - > FCSETGTOK(FAILRELATION) > > In the above example FLASCHOPY is being performed because of the FCNC. > > Could you correct my understanding of all 3 examples? > > Thanks. > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
I don't know of any overt sign of flash copy invocation, but for me there is strong circumstantial evidence: lightning fast volume copy. We periodically migrate maintenance via full DSS volume copy. Done this for years. Then one time the copy job ran in only seconds instead of minutes. I thought for sure something had failed. Nope, all was A-OK. It happened that the source and target volumes were in the same DS8* DASD subsystem with the flash copy feature installed, so (I was told) flash copy got invoked automatically. When we copy between DASD subsystems, it still takes minutes. BTW I have a narrower view of 'online/offline' than Joel does. I take 'online' to be an MVS status involving OS control blocks. A volume is either online or offline on that basis. The trouble with bringing in 'reachable' is that it introduces a scale of 'accessibility' with many nuances. Is the device physically connected at all? If it is connected, is it genned to a chpid? If it is genned, is the chpid in the access list for that LPAR? If it is not in the list, can the IODF be updated to include it? These questions all cloud the issue. So, a volume is either online or offline to the OS at any given moment. Duplicate volsers are not allowed to be OS-online concurrently. No other restrictions. . . J.O.Skip Robinson Southern California Edison Company Electric Dragon Team Paddler SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager 323-715-0595 Mobile 626-302-7535 Office robin...@sce.com -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Joel C. Ewing Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 8:18 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: (External):Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION On 12/03/2016 07:58 AM, esmie moo wrote: > Gentle Readers, > > I have a question about FLASHCOPY using ADRDSSU and COPY. In my first > example I was told that the job is using FLASHCOPY. However I do not see any > evidence. > > COPY FULL INDYNAM (SDB000) OUTDYNAM (MDB000) DUMPCONDITIONING > ADR101I (R/I)-RI01 (01), TASKID 001 HAS BEEN ASSIGNED TO COMMAND 'COPY ' > > >From my understanding it is performing a full volume copy of a source > >volume. If my understanding of the parm DUMPCONDITIONING is correct, it > >(DUMPCONDITIONING) allows to make a copy of the source volume and while > >keeping the target volume online. > > I have done a full volume copy of a source to target without the > DUMPCONDITIONING parm and it worked - the volume was fully copied (see > below). Am I missing something? Aren't both examples doing the same thing? > > > COPY INDDNAME(DASD1) OUTDDNAME(DASD2) - > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP COPYVOLID PURGE > /* > > However I do not see any evidence of FLASHCOPY being invoked because the FCNC > parm is not present. > > Here is a my second example: > > COPY FULL IDY(PROM70,3390) ODY(SNAP63,3390) DUMPCOND FCNC- > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP CANCELERROR PURGE FCTOPPRCPRIMARY - > FCSETGTOK(FAILRELATION) > > In the above example FLASCHOPY is being performed because of the FCNC. > > Could you correct my understanding of all 3 examples? > > Thanks. > > If you do a full volume copy without DUMPCONDITIONING and with COPYVOLID, that means when the copy is complete the target volume will now have the same VOLSER as the source volume and dss will force it offline, as you can't have two volumes with identical VOLSER online to the same MVS system. If your goal was just to make a point-in-time copy on DASD, that may be sufficient. But if your goal was to then back up that target volume to removable tape media, you would not be able to do that with dss from the same system because the volume is offline because of the duplicate VOLSER. It also means that if you for some reason needed to IPL at that point, the system will complain about finding two volumes with the same VOLSER and there could be some confusion about which of the two volumes should be placed online and the wrong one could be chosen. With DUMPCONDITIONING the original different target volume VOLSER is preserved so both volumes can be online to the same system and there is no later confusion about which is the original and which is the point-in-time copy. DSS is smart enough when restoring from a tape dump of the volume with the DUMPCONDITIONING copy to also restore the original VOLSER (this used to require either an VTOCINDEX or VVDS dataset on the volume to supply the correct VOLSER). There are other vendor utilities that will allow one to dump an offline DASD volume with a duplicate volser to tape, but this seems to me a perversion of the meaning of "offline", which was i
Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
On 12/03/2016 07:58 AM, esmie moo wrote: > Gentle Readers, > > I have a question about FLASHCOPY using ADRDSSU and COPY. In my first > example I was told that the job is using FLASHCOPY. However I do not see any > evidence. > > COPY FULL INDYNAM (SDB000) OUTDYNAM (MDB000) DUMPCONDITIONING > ADR101I (R/I)-RI01 (01), TASKID 001 HAS BEEN ASSIGNED TO COMMAND 'COPY ' > > >From my understanding it is performing a full volume copy of a source > >volume. If my understanding of the parm DUMPCONDITIONING is correct, it > >(DUMPCONDITIONING) allows to make a copy of the source volume and while > >keeping the target volume online. > > I have done a full volume copy of a source to target without the > DUMPCONDITIONING parm and it worked - the volume was fully copied (see > below). Am I missing something? Aren't both examples doing the same thing? > > > COPY INDDNAME(DASD1) OUTDDNAME(DASD2) - > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP COPYVOLID PURGE > /* > > However I do not see any evidence of FLASHCOPY being invoked because the FCNC > parm is not present. > > Here is a my second example: > > COPY FULL IDY(PROM70,3390) ODY(SNAP63,3390) DUMPCOND FCNC- > ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP CANCELERROR PURGE FCTOPPRCPRIMARY - > FCSETGTOK(FAILRELATION) > > In the above example FLASCHOPY is being performed because of the FCNC. > > Could you correct my understanding of all 3 examples? > > Thanks. > > If you do a full volume copy without DUMPCONDITIONING and with COPYVOLID, that means when the copy is complete the target volume will now have the same VOLSER as the source volume and dss will force it offline, as you can't have two volumes with identical VOLSER online to the same MVS system. If your goal was just to make a point-in-time copy on DASD, that may be sufficient. But if your goal was to then back up that target volume to removable tape media, you would not be able to do that with dss from the same system because the volume is offline because of the duplicate VOLSER. It also means that if you for some reason needed to IPL at that point, the system will complain about finding two volumes with the same VOLSER and there could be some confusion about which of the two volumes should be placed online and the wrong one could be chosen. With DUMPCONDITIONING the original different target volume VOLSER is preserved so both volumes can be online to the same system and there is no later confusion about which is the original and which is the point-in-time copy. DSS is smart enough when restoring from a tape dump of the volume with the DUMPCONDITIONING copy to also restore the original VOLSER (this used to require either an VTOCINDEX or VVDS dataset on the volume to supply the correct VOLSER). There are other vendor utilities that will allow one to dump an offline DASD volume with a duplicate volser to tape, but this seems to me a perversion of the meaning of "offline", which was intended to mean access by the system was impossible and that the device could safely be taken physically offline for hardware maintenance. Assuming there is still a dss FASTREPLICATION parameter, it used to default to "PREFERRED", which meant if flashcopy wasn't available for some reason, dss would default to an ordinary copy but still do the COPY command successfully (just m-u-c-h slower). If you wanted the copy to fail if flashcopy were not possible, you had to explicitly request FASTREPLICATION(REQUIRED). It should be obvious from the time required for the COPY command to complete whether flashcopy has been used: a fraction of a second for the dss COPY command to complete with fastcopy, versus minutes without fastcopy. Joel C. Ewing -- Joel C. Ewing,Bentonville, AR jcew...@acm.org -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
FLASHCOPY QUESTION
Gentle Readers, I have a question about FLASHCOPY using ADRDSSU and COPY. In my first example I was told that the job is using FLASHCOPY. However I do not see any evidence. COPY FULL INDYNAM (SDB000) OUTDYNAM (MDB000) DUMPCONDITIONING ADR101I (R/I)-RI01 (01), TASKID 001 HAS BEEN ASSIGNED TO COMMAND 'COPY ' >From my understanding it is performing a full volume copy of a source volume. >If my understanding of the parm DUMPCONDITIONING is correct, it >(DUMPCONDITIONING) allows to make a copy of the source volume and while >keeping the target volume online. I have done a full volume copy of a source to target without the DUMPCONDITIONING parm and it worked - the volume was fully copied (see below). Am I missing something? Aren't both examples doing the same thing? COPY INDDNAME(DASD1) OUTDDNAME(DASD2) - ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP COPYVOLID PURGE /* However I do not see any evidence of FLASHCOPY being invoked because the FCNC parm is not present. Here is a my second example: COPY FULL IDY(PROM70,3390) ODY(SNAP63,3390) DUMPCOND FCNC- ALLDATA(*) ALLEXCP CANCELERROR PURGE FCTOPPRCPRIMARY - FCSETGTOK(FAILRELATION) In the above example FLASCHOPY is being performed because of the FCNC. Could you correct my understanding of all 3 examples? Thanks. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
Rex, Thanks for the explanation. So as not to clutter the board I will take this offline. On Tue, 7/19/16, Pommier, Rex <rpomm...@sfgmembers.com> wrote: Subject: Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Received: Tuesday, July 19, 2016, 9:14 AM Esmie, Let me give it a try. I think you're getting confused due to terminology and different views of the copies. From a z/OS point of view, both the examples you show are doing full volume copies of data from your IN to your OUT. Once the job is done, you have 2 full copies of the data, one on each volume. The difference is what's going on in the back-end disk array. In example 1, you have FCNC which from the back-end array, the only thing that happens is that a set of pointers (a track table) gets built but no data gets copied. The only time data gets physically copied from source to target is when either the source or target data track is changed. If the source data gets changed, a copy of the track gets put on the target before the source is updated. In case of the target getting updated, the changed data is written to the target. If, for example, in this scenario you are doing this copy with the intent of doing a DUMP of the target to tape, most of the data for the DUMP is actually coming from the SOURCE, because unless the data changed, the SOURCE is the only place the physical data resides. In example 2, FCINCREMENTAL does NOT mean do an incremental backup. FC/DFDSS does a full background copy of all the data from the source to the target. It still looks like it ran really fast to z/OS because as soon as the track table is built on the array, the array signals to z/OS the backup is done. However, the back end is still copying all the data to the target. Why use FCINCR then? Under normal FC processing, if you don't use FCNC, the background copy is initiated, and then once all the data is copied to the target, the relationship between source and target is terminated, and the 2 volumes are now stand-alone. If FCINCR is specified like in your example, the relationship remains in place with the track table now indicating which tracks have changed since the FC ran. If you then come along and run another COPY command with the same source and target, the array uses the track table and only updates the changed tracks, thus (potentially) significantly reducing the load on the array if there wasn't much change in the data. So in short, FCNC only copies changed tracks from the source to the target, but FCINCR forces a full back-end copy of all the data from source to target on initial setup. Note in the DFDSS manual is that FCNC and FCINCR are mutually exclusive. HTH, Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of esmie moo Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2016 6:59 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: FLASHCOPY QUESTION Gentle Readers, I was wondering if any of you can clear up understating about FlashCopy. In the following example COPY INDYNAM(SYS012) OUTDYNAM(DCN00) CANCELERROR - PURGE ALLEXCP ALLDATA(*) OPT(4) ADMIN FCNOCOPY - DUMPCOND FR(REQ) DEBUG(FRMSG(DETAILED)) My understanding is that an Incremental copy is being performed because FCNOCPY is specified. My understanding of Incremental is that only the updated tracks are copied over to the target volume. Please correct me if I am wrong. Also, I have this example. Is this for a FULL FlashCopy of a volume? However, I am confused that the FCINCREMENTAL parm is specified which would indicate that this is an incremental copy COPY FULL INDYNAM(ZFSZ01) OUTDYNAM(ZWATP0) ALLE ALLD(*) - FASTREPLICATION(REQUIRED) FCINCREMENTAL DUMPCONDITIONING ADMIN PURGE Could someone clear up this for me? Thanks in advance. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN The information contained in this message is confidential, protected from disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or action omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to this message and destroy the material in its entirety, whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send
Re: FLASHCOPY QUESTION
Esmie, Let me give it a try. I think you're getting confused due to terminology and different views of the copies. From a z/OS point of view, both the examples you show are doing full volume copies of data from your IN to your OUT. Once the job is done, you have 2 full copies of the data, one on each volume. The difference is what's going on in the back-end disk array. In example 1, you have FCNC which from the back-end array, the only thing that happens is that a set of pointers (a track table) gets built but no data gets copied. The only time data gets physically copied from source to target is when either the source or target data track is changed. If the source data gets changed, a copy of the track gets put on the target before the source is updated. In case of the target getting updated, the changed data is written to the target. If, for example, in this scenario you are doing this copy with the intent of doing a DUMP of the target to tape, most of the data for the DUMP is actually coming from the SOURCE, because unless the data changed, the SOURCE is the only place the physical data resides. In example 2, FCINCREMENTAL does NOT mean do an incremental backup. FC/DFDSS does a full background copy of all the data from the source to the target. It still looks like it ran really fast to z/OS because as soon as the track table is built on the array, the array signals to z/OS the backup is done. However, the back end is still copying all the data to the target. Why use FCINCR then? Under normal FC processing, if you don't use FCNC, the background copy is initiated, and then once all the data is copied to the target, the relationship between source and target is terminated, and the 2 volumes are now stand-alone. If FCINCR is specified like in your example, the relationship remains in place with the track table now indicating which tracks have changed since the FC ran. If you then come along and run another COPY command with the same source and target, the array uses the track table and only updates the changed tracks, thus (potentially) significantly reducing the load on the array if there wasn't much change in the data. So in short, FCNC only copies changed tracks from the source to the target, but FCINCR forces a full back-end copy of all the data from source to target on initial setup. Note in the DFDSS manual is that FCNC and FCINCR are mutually exclusive. HTH, Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of esmie moo Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2016 6:59 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: FLASHCOPY QUESTION Gentle Readers, I was wondering if any of you can clear up understating about FlashCopy. In the following example COPY INDYNAM(SYS012) OUTDYNAM(DCN00) CANCELERROR - PURGE ALLEXCP ALLDATA(*) OPT(4) ADMIN FCNOCOPY - DUMPCOND FR(REQ) DEBUG(FRMSG(DETAILED)) My understanding is that an Incremental copy is being performed because FCNOCPY is specified. My understanding of Incremental is that only the updated tracks are copied over to the target volume. Please correct me if I am wrong. Also, I have this example. Is this for a FULL FlashCopy of a volume? However, I am confused that the FCINCREMENTAL parm is specified which would indicate that this is an incremental copy COPY FULL INDYNAM(ZFSZ01) OUTDYNAM(ZWATP0) ALLE ALLD(*) - FASTREPLICATION(REQUIRED) FCINCREMENTAL DUMPCONDITIONING ADMIN PURGE Could someone clear up this for me? Thanks in advance. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN The information contained in this message is confidential, protected from disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or action omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to this message and destroy the material in its entirety, whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
FLASHCOPY QUESTION
Gentle Readers, I was wondering if any of you can clear up understating about FlashCopy. In the following example COPY INDYNAM(SYS012) OUTDYNAM(DCN00) CANCELERROR - PURGE ALLEXCP ALLDATA(*) OPT(4) ADMIN FCNOCOPY - DUMPCOND FR(REQ) DEBUG(FRMSG(DETAILED)) My understanding is that an Incremental copy is being performed because FCNOCPY is specified. My understanding of Incremental is that only the updated tracks are copied over to the target volume. Please correct me if I am wrong. Also, I have this example. Is this for a FULL FlashCopy of a volume? However, I am confused that the FCINCREMENTAL parm is specified which would indicate that this is an incremental copy COPY FULL INDYNAM(ZFSZ01) OUTDYNAM(ZWATP0) ALLE ALLD(*) - FASTREPLICATION(REQUIRED) FCINCREMENTAL DUMPCONDITIONING ADMIN PURGE Could someone clear up this for me? Thanks in advance. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN