Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[John McKown]

On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 11:56 PM, Edward Gould 
wrote:

> Do you really want the operators involved in this?

They have enough work to do.
> Consider cancelling the job period.
>
> Ed
>
>
​I agree. I've become curious about the reason for this request. I am
assuming that this is some sort of "production" job. In most shops, that is
set up and done by a production scheduling system such as TWS or CA-7 or
???. The last time I remember the operators doing something akin to this
was in the days of punched cards.​


-- 
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their work three times, because they're sure that something won't be right.
Optimistic people check once, trust in Solis-de to keep the ship safe, then
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"I think you're mistaking the word optimistic for inept."
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>From "Star Nomad" by Lindsay Buroker:

Maranatha! <><
John McKown

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Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Edward Gould]

Do you really want the operators involved in this?
They have enough work to do.
Consider cancelling the job period.

Ed

> On Jul 11, 2016, at 11:41 PM, Munif Sadek  wrote:
> 
> Hi 
> 
> 
> We are JES2, z/OS 2.1 and would like batch to issues a WTOR (Confirm Y/N ?)  
> if a job is submitted by surrogate Batch Id in a specific JOB class of a 
> specific LPAR.
> 
> We are plex and this job class is JES2 initiator  (not shared, non WLM)  and  
> WTOR is required only if JOB is scheduled to run in a particular LPAR - Job 
> class. 
> 
> Can some one please provided pointer in the  right direction. Can RACF  help?
> 
> regards Munif
> 
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Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Itschak Mugzach]

Just to add to Charles ideas, making your operators decision makers isn't a
good idea. Are they better than racf who allowed the aurrogation? Get an
smf exit to inform you that user a used user's b authority. Corrlog has an
agent that does that.

Best
ITschak.
בתאריך 12 ביול 2016 18:43,‏ "Charles Mills" <charl...@mcn.org> כתב:

> > The WTOR is highly problematic for many system tasks.
>
> Better a programmed "rule" (in a generic sense of the word; not lobbying
> for some particular product or technique) than a WTOR. Those pesky humans
> are slow and unreliable.
>
> Charles
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On
> Behalf Of Jesse 1 Robinson
> Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 8:27 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job
>
> My first thought for validity verification is Exit 6, which we use a lot.
> However, that runs in JES2 Main Task. I don't think you can issue WTOR
> there: all of JES2 would wait for the reply. In looking through the JES2
> exit table
>
>
> https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/SSLTBW_2.1.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r1.ieae400/jes2.htm
>
> I don't see anything promising other than 52 and 54 (statement scan),
> which run in JES2 User environment. The scan exits run only at submit time,
> so you would have no control over a job that is later moved to a different
> LPAR or job class.
>
> The WTOR is highly problematic for many system tasks.
>
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Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Leonardo Vaz]

I agree with Charles, you can simply use the SURROGATE class or reinvent the 
wheel and issue a RACROUTE on exit 52. Also, I believe a WTOR on exit 52 will 
hold the submitter's TSO session until it's replied. 

What I may also suggest is to enforce a HOLD on any job with USER= (in exit 52) 
and send an alert to release the job via a $WTO so the job can be released by 
the proper person.

Regards,
Leo


-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Charles Mills
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 11:43 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

> The WTOR is highly problematic for many system tasks.

Better a programmed "rule" (in a generic sense of the word; not lobbying for 
some particular product or technique) than a WTOR. Those pesky humans are slow 
and unreliable.

Charles

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Jesse 1 Robinson
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 8:27 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

My first thought for validity verification is Exit 6, which we use a lot. 
However, that runs in JES2 Main Task. I don't think you can issue WTOR there: 
all of JES2 would wait for the reply. In looking through the JES2 exit table

https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/SSLTBW_2.1.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r1.ieae400/jes2.htm

I don't see anything promising other than 52 and 54 (statement scan), which run 
in JES2 User environment. The scan exits run only at submit time, so you would 
have no control over a job that is later moved to a different LPAR or job 
class. 

The WTOR is highly problematic for many system tasks. 

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Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Elardus Engelbrecht]

Skip Robinson  wrote:

>My first thought for validity verification is Exit 6, which we use a lot. 
>However, that runs in JES2 Main Task. I don't think you can issue WTOR there: 
>all of JES2 would wait for the reply. In looking through the JES2 exit table 
 
>https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/SSLTBW_2.1.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r1.ieae400/jes2.htm
> 

Oh, yes, thanks for filling in it for me, I got at last a change to look at 
that table. 
 

>I don't see anything promising other than 52 and 54 (statement scan), which 
>run in JES2 User environment. The scan exits run only at submit time, so you 
>would have no control over a job that is later moved to a different LPAR or 
>job class.  

Agreed. I have missed these two initially even when the OP said exit 5x. I was 
indeed thinking about scanning/validating of statements.
 

>The WTOR is highly problematic for many system tasks.  
 
Yes, it is! If you have a lot of such WTORs your system may grind to a halt if 
your operators are not watching the console. That is if you don't have 
automation software.

Groete / Greetings 
Elardus Engelbrecht 

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Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Charles Mills]

> The WTOR is highly problematic for many system tasks.

Better a programmed "rule" (in a generic sense of the word; not lobbying for 
some particular product or technique) than a WTOR. Those pesky humans are slow 
and unreliable.

Charles

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Jesse 1 Robinson
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 8:27 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

My first thought for validity verification is Exit 6, which we use a lot. 
However, that runs in JES2 Main Task. I don't think you can issue WTOR there: 
all of JES2 would wait for the reply. In looking through the JES2 exit table

https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/SSLTBW_2.1.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r1.ieae400/jes2.htm

I don't see anything promising other than 52 and 54 (statement scan), which run 
in JES2 User environment. The scan exits run only at submit time, so you would 
have no control over a job that is later moved to a different LPAR or job 
class. 

The WTOR is highly problematic for many system tasks. 

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Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Jesse 1 Robinson]

My first thought for validity verification is Exit 6, which we use a lot. 
However, that runs in JES2 Main Task. I don't think you can issue WTOR there: 
all of JES2 would wait for the reply. In looking through the JES2 exit table

https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/SSLTBW_2.1.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r1.ieae400/jes2.htm

I don't see anything promising other than 52 and 54 (statement scan), which run 
in JES2 User environment. The scan exits run only at submit time, so you would 
have no control over a job that is later moved to a different LPAR or job 
class. 

The WTOR is highly problematic for many system tasks. 

.
.
.
J.O.Skip Robinson
Southern California Edison Company
Electric Dragon Team Paddler 
SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager
323-715-0595 Mobile
626-302-7535 Office
robin...@sce.com


-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Elardus Engelbrecht
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 3:24 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: (External):Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

Itschak Mugzach wrote:

>May be a job with a user= in the jobcard that is not the submiter id. I 
>believe jes exits 5x can do that.

Yes, a JES2 exit (nr 5 I think) which scans the JCL statements and when 
discovering a USER=??? statement, can issue a WTOR. That is *if* you may issue 
a WTOR in the environment where that exit is running.


Munif Sadek wrote:

>"We are JES2, z/OS 2.1 and would like batch to issues a WTOR (Confirm Y/N?)  
>if a job is submitted by surrogate Batch Id in a specific JOB class of a 
>specific LPAR."

Use automation to catch that job and issue a WTOR. (Control-O has this clause 
'ON-JOB-ARRIVAL'.)


>"Can RACF help?"

With SURROGAT Class yes. But still no WTOR, just a NOTIFY which may be picked 
up many minutes/hours/days later.

Groete / Greetings
Elardus Engelbrecht


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Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Elardus Engelbrecht]

Itschak Mugzach wrote:

>May be a job with a user= in the jobcard that is not the submiter id. I 
>believe jes exits 5x can do that.

Yes, a JES2 exit (nr 5 I think) which scans the JCL statements and when 
discovering a USER=??? statement, can issue a WTOR. That is *if* you may issue 
a WTOR in the environment where that exit is running.


Munif Sadek wrote:

>"We are JES2, z/OS 2.1 and would like batch to issues a WTOR (Confirm Y/N?)  
>if a job is submitted by surrogate Batch Id in a specific JOB class of a 
>specific LPAR."

Use automation to catch that job and issue a WTOR. (Control-O has this clause 
'ON-JOB-ARRIVAL'.)


>"Can RACF help?"

With SURROGAT Class yes. But still no WTOR, just a NOTIFY which may be picked 
up many minutes/hours/days later.

Groete / Greetings
Elardus Engelbrecht

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Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Itschak Mugzach]

May be a job with a user= in the jobcard that is not the submiter id. I
believe jes exits 5x can do that.

ITschak
בתאריך 12 ביול 2016 09:03,‏ "Vernooij, CP (ITOPT1) - KLM" <
kees.verno...@klm.com> כתב:

> What is "surrogate Batch Id"?
>
> Kees.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On
> Behalf Of Munif Sadek
> Sent: 12 July, 2016 6:42
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job
>
> Hi
>
>
> We are JES2, z/OS 2.1 and would like batch to issues a WTOR (Confirm Y/N
> ?)  if a job is submitted by surrogate Batch Id in a specific JOB class of
> a specific LPAR.
>
> We are plex and this job class is JES2 initiator  (not shared, non WLM)
> and  WTOR is required only if JOB is scheduled to run in a particular LPAR
> - Job class.
>
> Can some one please provided pointer in the  right direction. Can RACF
> help?
>
> regards Munif
>
> --
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Re: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Vernooij, CP (ITOPT1) - KLM]

What is "surrogate Batch Id"?

Kees.

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Munif Sadek
Sent: 12 July, 2016 6:42
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

Hi 


We are JES2, z/OS 2.1 and would like batch to issues a WTOR (Confirm Y/N ?)  if 
a job is submitted by surrogate Batch Id in a specific JOB class of a specific 
LPAR.

We are plex and this job class is JES2 initiator  (not shared, non WLM)  and  
WTOR is required only if JOB is scheduled to run in a particular LPAR - Job 
class. 

Can some one please provided pointer in the  right direction. Can RACF  help?

regards Munif

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33014286




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issue WTOR if surrogat ID submits a job

[Munif Sadek]

Hi 


We are JES2, z/OS 2.1 and would like batch to issues a WTOR (Confirm Y/N ?)  if 
a job is submitted by surrogate Batch Id in a specific JOB class of a specific 
LPAR.

We are plex and this job class is JES2 initiator  (not shared, non WLM)  and  
WTOR is required only if JOB is scheduled to run in a particular LPAR - Job 
class. 

Can some one please provided pointer in the  right direction. Can RACF  help?

regards Munif

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