[kde] MOSSCon in Louisville in May! Submit your proposal this week!
You are invited to be a speaker/presenter at MOSSCon. Preparations are in full swing for the very first Midwest Open Source Software Conference (MOSSCon), to be held in Louisville on May 18-19. Your help in spreading the word and helping us fill out our schedule of presentations and workshops would be appreciated. This is going to be a great networking event for the whole region! Louisville is in such a central location, it can draw from a very wide area. We have a great venue: the University of Louisville's Student Activities Center, with several large halls, a number of smaller meeting rooms, and plenty of exhibit space available for groups and businesses to make their presence known. We are working on a broadly based Open theme, that can include open source hardware, open data, etc., as well as the full gamut of open source software. We already have some super presentations lined up. But there are still plenty of pieces that need to come together. Right now we are concentrating on filling out our schedule with more presentations and workshops. And soliciting sponsors. If you're involved with Open Source (or open anything) you definitely want to be a part of this. I encourage you to consider speaking or doing a presentation or workshop on a subject in your area of interest and/or expertise. Check out the conference website at http://mosscon.org/. Click on Be a Speaker for details on submitting your proposal. But get to it! The deadline for submitting your preliminary proposal is this Friday, March 29! http://mosscon.org/ Spread the word and submit your proposal! Thanks, John Hicks ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
[kde] kdm multiple keyboard layouts
Hello, First, is there a kdm-users dedicated mailing list? Now my question. I'm learning Dvorak keyboard layout but I share this computer with my wife. She doesn't like the layout so I need kdm to default to latam layout and have dvorak as a option (either a keyboard shortcut or a menu option) so I don't have to remember two passwords. Is this possible? Thanks!! Norberto ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
[kde] Research Study: Open Source Developers on the fence between company and community
Dear ladies and gentlemen, my name is Thomas Zerbach, I'm a research assistant at the University of Koblenz-Landau (Germany) currently working on an empirical research study which revolves around the job situation of (professional) open source developers. The goal of the study is to gain insights on the effect of developers' double commitment to the open source community and the organization. The study already received support by several organizations including the Open Source Business Foundation (OSBF), the European Commission's Joinup project and various open source projects (e.g. Eclipse) and experts (e.g. former Open Source Director at Oracle Gilles Gravier)! I am contacting you with the hope of getting any kind of support in order to reach a bigger target audience that could contribute to the research. Here are some main facts about the study: Who is the target group? The study is aimed at employed software developers who also work with open source code and therefore are to some extent dependant on the open source community. Why should developers participate? 1. They can support social projects and a startup company at the same time! As an incentive, the University of Koblenz-Landau offers participants the opportunity to donate real money invested by the University to social projects after completing the survey. This offer is part of a collaboration with the startup company socialfunders, which specializes on corporate giving processes. More information on the socialfunders can be found here: https://www.socialfunders.org/. 2. They can make their voice heard! The research study aims at deriving managerial implications for organizations to improve their employees' job situation. Participants can also gain insights in the situation of fellow open source developers if they want to receive a rehashed version of the research results after the completion of the study. How much effort is required? Only about 10 minutes of their time. All information will of course be treated anonymously and solely be used for scientific purposes. Link to the research study: http://ww2.unipark.de/uc/kb_uni_koblenz_kilian_ls/d20b/ I hope I was able to catch your interest. If you can think of a way how to support me with my research (e.g. by forwarding this message or incorporating this information in a newsletter/ internal forum) or if you have any questions regarding the research study feel free to contact me. I am looking forward to hearing from you! Best Regards, Thomas Zerbach -- E-Mail: tzerb...@uni-koblenz.de Wissenschaftlicher Mitarbeiter Universität Koblenz-Landau Lehrstuhl für Informationsmanagement und Organisation Universitätsstr. 1 56070 Koblenz www.uni-koblenz.de ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] kdm multiple keyboard layouts
On 03/27/2013 10:18 AM, zoolook wrote: Hello, First, is there a kdm-users dedicated mailing list? Now my question. I'm learning Dvorak keyboard layout but I share this computer with my wife. She doesn't like the layout so I need kdm to default to latam layout and have dvorak as a option (either a keyboard shortcut or a menu option) so I don't have to remember two passwords. Is this possible? Thanks!! Norberto ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html. System settings Input Devices Keyboard Layouts. The settings form there allows you to add various keyboard layouts. Once these have been activated an icon in the notifications area of your panel tells you which keyboard layout is active at the time. I use this to switch between UK, UK-international and Polisk keyboard layouts. Just click the icon and you cycle through them, once you have set them up in System Settings. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?
On Sunday, 2013-03-24, Kevin Chadwick wrote: On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 16:41:35 +0100 Kevin Krammer kram...@kde.org wrote: There were a couple of newly developed programs but they were almost always components of the workspace product. I am currently not aware of any application which dropped features during the porting, but I can obviously not know all applications and all their features. Multiple monitor support certainly fell behind for a while and I have to say that now xfce is catching up in terms of core features it certainly is making me wonder if that would have saved me time spent on resetup and increasing performance or dealing with compositing crashes even on fast systems when having many many windows open. I am talking about debian stable here too. But that is a workspace feature, no? I certainly think freedesktop.org should change it's name perhaps to enterprisedesktop.org or maybe cloudesktop.org I didn't get the context of that one. Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?
On Sunday, 2013-03-24, Kevin Chadwick wrote: On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 14:16:34 + (UTC) Duncan 1i5t5.dun...@cox.net wrote: Of course they'll with a near-certainty still continue to work on xorg for a few years anyway, but once the general desktop moves to wayland, the X dependency gets moved to the might not be installed for anything else list, and suddenly the additional deps cost of running that old app go ***WAY*** up, which means fewer people run them, which means a bigger likelihood of an accumulation of serious bugs over time. That's the wayland upset of the status quo I'm a bit worried about. OpenBSD is getting KMS drivers just now (except GPL'd drm drivers) so wayland should be possible for OpenBSD atleast on a fair chunk of hardware, as it is apparently very compatible with Linux, That is most likely only necessary if one uses the reference implementation. It would be weird if a protocol on user space level could somehow depend on certain kernel features. especially as I am skeptical of it being implemented well considering freedekstop.orgs history such as disregard for other opinions and anything non linux Hmm, can you point out a freedesktop.org spec which is bound to Linux? Qt and KDE implement most of them can run quite nicely on BSDs as far as I heard. Don't get me wrong I welcome the benefits of wayland which has been in development for so long and so hope that will mean it will be good for the whole eco system but I worry about recent stories of Gnome and KDE rushing towards it due to Mir. That seems illogical. Indeed. But that illogic is easily enought explained. Somebody misinterpreted developer communication. Happens all the time, one of the drawbacks of open development. Work has been going on for a long time already, on the Qt side of things (no idea about the GTK+ side) the respective QPA backend has developed in parallel with wayland's efforts for years, inspite of that requirng a lot of work in the end (having to update to protocol and API that were in flux). However that was deemed necessary so one could early one see if things needed to be different to fullfil the requirements of the toolkit side. However, some people seem to have got the impression that no such work was being done, so the discussions around that topic were emphasised more. Which, as we have seen, led unfortunately to the misinterpretation that work had only recently started. If you find anyone who got tricked by that misinterpretation, most likely because they didn't have access to respective developer communication themselves, you can easily show them a video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLiSEmtRvGs It is from a developer on the Qt side of things, showing things that can be done with a Qt based wayland compositor. In November 2012, obviously way earlier than the recent Mir announcements and development for that compositor library did almost certainly start many months prior to the presentation. Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?
On Monday, 2013-03-25, Duncan wrote: Kevin Krammer posted on Sun, 24 Mar 2013 16:41:35 +0100 as excerpted: And in fact that was what I guess kubuntu and some others were (rightly, it turned out) predicting, the reason they didn't do an LTS at the time, because they didn't believe the upstream support would actually be there. This was mostly a result of Canonical not actually doing any LTS work on anything other than their main product. Doing another Kubuntu LTS could have meant spending actual resources on maintenance and that is not something they were comfortable with. Naturally all actual LTS level distributors (SUSE, Red Hat, Debian) continued to do what their users and customers expected them to do and as usual shared the maintenance efforts between them. I think the main problem here is lumping together different highly independent products into one term. Thanks for continuing to emphasize that, Kevin. It's certainly going to be interesting to see how the kde frameworks 5 thing plays out, especially given that qt5 is going the much more modular route at exactly the same time, with most components of each becoming optional, only installed when a specific app needs them. Qt4 was already very modular, Qt5 mostly just changed which libraries are considered essential and which are not. A lot of modularity is discarded at packaging level, e.g. if a package is just libqt4 then an application package which would only needslibQtCore4 would still depend on all the other libraries. While Qt is fortunately mostly packages in a split way, KDE's libraries have traditionally not been. The Frameworks 5 efforts are a lot about making that more obvious, hopefully leading to a situation where there are separate packages for separate libraries. But there were a few feature drops as well. The biggest two projects I can name here aren't part of kde-core, but they're headline kde apps and thus very important: kaffeine, and amarok. AFAIK kaffeine for kde4 simply took too long to mature, and in the mean time, it simply didn't have the power features that people used it for in the kde3 era, instead of the many other media player alternatives out there. Features like frame-by-frame advance and incremental playback speed. These are advanced features that simply aren't available in the default level offerings, kde3 OR kde4, that had people using kaffeine for kde3 instead of the lower featured alternatives in the first place. Ah, didn't know about the change in Kaffein, never used it myself, I am an mplayer (console) user :) Which leaves amarok. Amarok's kde3 - kde4 conversion was for me a microcosm of the larger kde3 - kde4 debacle. The devs tried switching to mysql as akonadi was at the time, but in the process, they used mysql functionality (something about a mysql library for use in other apps, I've forgotten the details) that was completely broken on amd64/x86_64 at the time, because as all libraries on amd64, the library in question needed built with -fpic, but as that library was a part of the larger mysql package and building the rest of it with -fpic would have meant unacceptable slowdowns for the executables, nobody was actually building it with -fpic. This is strange, could that be a Gentoo artifact? MySQL is officially supporting in-process for some of its backends (usually MyISAM) and as far as I can tell worked well for most people I know (but those are all Debian users). It can be hard to tell from a developer perspective if something that is officially supported by an upstream dependency does not work under some circumstances and that some of your downstreams are triggern those. Btw, isn't there a continuation of the Amarok version 1 project? I think it is called Clementine or something like that. I do sort of wish gwenview would implement audio file support, however, and thus be a full media filemanager. Media files are my biggest use case for user-side/full-GUI file management, and gwenview handles images and video well enough that I use it almost exclusively for them, but it totally hides everything else, including audio-only files, which are now one of only two things I use dolphin for. The other is as a trivial-case file browser, basically a file open dialog on steroids. Interesting idea, have you checked if there is a wish item report for that? Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] kdm multiple keyboard layouts
On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 5:11 PM, Bogus Zaba bog...@bogzab.plus.com wrote: On 03/27/2013 10:18 AM, zoolook wrote: Hello, First, is there a kdm-users dedicated mailing list? Now my question. I'm learning Dvorak keyboard layout but I share this computer with my wife. She doesn't like the layout so I need kdm to default to latam layout and have dvorak as a option (either a keyboard shortcut or a menu option) so I don't have to remember two passwords. Is this possible? Thanks!! Norberto __**_ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/**listinfo/kdehttps://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde . Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html. System settings Input Devices Keyboard Layouts. The settings form there allows you to add various keyboard layouts. Once these have been activated an icon in the notifications area of your panel tells you which keyboard layout is active at the time. I use this to switch between UK, UK-international and Polisk keyboard layouts. Just click the icon and you cycle through them, once you have set them up in System Settings. I want kd_M_ (kde's display manager) to be mutiple-keyboard-layout aware :-) I want to be able to switch between 2 keyboard layouts in kdM. Or is there something I'm missing? I see no icon to switch layouts in kdM. Thanks! ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] kdm multiple keyboard layouts
On 03/27/2013 09:16 PM, zoolook wrote: On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 5:11 PM, Bogus Zaba bog...@bogzab.plus.com mailto:bog...@bogzab.plus.com wrote: On 03/27/2013 10:18 AM, zoolook wrote: Hello, First, is there a kdm-users dedicated mailing list? Now my question. I'm learning Dvorak keyboard layout but I share this computer with my wife. She doesn't like the layout so I need kdm to default to latam layout and have dvorak as a option (either a keyboard shortcut or a menu option) so I don't have to remember two passwords. Is this possible? Thanks!! Norberto ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html. System settings Input Devices Keyboard Layouts. The settings form there allows you to add various keyboard layouts. Once these have been activated an icon in the notifications area of your panel tells you which keyboard layout is active at the time. I use this to switch between UK, UK-international and Polisk keyboard layouts. Just click the icon and you cycle through them, once you have set them up in System Settings. I want kd_M_ (kde's display manager) to be mutiple-keyboard-layout aware :-) I want to be able to switch between 2 keyboard layouts in kdM. Or is there something I'm missing? I see no icon to switch layouts in kdM. Thanks! Sorry, I misread your original post. I think you are right there is no kdm option to change keyboard layouts - the thing I was describing comes after you have logged in using kdm. There may be options to achieve what you want by logging into your system in a plain text console rather than using a display manager login. You might then be able to set locale / keyboard map in the console and afterwards start your gui with startx? ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?
On Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:21:47 +0100 Kevin Krammer kram...@kde.org wrote: I certainly think freedesktop.org should change it's name perhaps to enterprisedesktop.org or maybe cloudesktop.org I didn't get the context of that one. Various projects have shown their disregard for the user base and preference for enterprise or cloud things like: Udisks - dropping support for 6 months for features people actually use in order to cater for sessions (it may be Arch using udisks2? before it should have done was the problem there however, Arch has some good but also terrible points) systemd - perhaps not a freedesktop.org spec? but it certainly abuses the freedesktop.org domain without allowing comments and has basically come from Red Hats want for spinning up VMs quickly, disregarding other priorities of the main user base. It doesn't suit the name freedesktop because it is forcing more and more dependencies such as polkit onto users when it could allow you to choose and change to whatever you want when you want like spacefm allows you to choose polkit/udisks, sudo/whatever with udevil etc.. especially as I am skeptical of it being implemented well considering freedekstop.orgs history such as disregard for other opinions and anything non linux Hmm, can you point out a freedesktop.org spec which is bound to Linux? Qt and KDE implement most of them can run quite nicely on BSDs as far as I heard. I guess I am meaning freedesktop hosted and my above gripe may actually be with the desktop environment dependencies that have nothing to do with freedesktop.org specs but happens to be common to varying degrees to all the DEs that use the specs. Perhaps you could confirm that for me? ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?
Kevin Krammer posted on Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:54:28 +0100 as excerpted: Which leaves amarok. Amarok's kde3 - kde4 conversion was for me a microcosm of the larger kde3 - kde4 debacle. The devs tried switching to mysql as akonadi was at the time, but in the process, they used mysql functionality (something about a mysql library for use in other apps, I've forgotten the details) that was completely broken on amd64/x86_64 at the time, because as all libraries on amd64, the library in question needed built with -fpic, but as that library was a part of the larger mysql package and building the rest of it with -fpic would have meant unacceptable slowdowns for the executables, nobody was actually building it with -fpic. This is strange, could that be a Gentoo artifact? MySQL is officially supporting in-process for some of its backends (usually MyISAM) and as far as I can tell worked well for most people I know (but those are all Debian users). It wasn't a gentoo artifact, but due to gentoo being reasonably leading edge, gentoo (along with I suppose arch) was one of the first to hit it. At the time mysql was having growing pains of its own, and this was one of them. I wish I remember which library it was, but I believe it really hadn't been considered an external interface until just before this, and while amarok wasn't the first to use it, being as popular a kde app as it was, it was the first reasonably popular app to use it. And I guess previous use had all been 32-bit, so it really hadn't mattered. But the mysql build scripts weren't adding -fpic for that library's build yet, and the problem was so new people were figuring it all out in real time, so at first, the only alternative as to build the whole mysql package with -fpic on amd64. But of course that slowed down the (non-library) executables, and a big part of mysql's appeal as a database has always been performance, so all the big data customers would have immediately protested at the loss of that few percent in performance, and the distros were thus stuck for a period of a few months with a broken-for-amarok mysql. Meanwhile, amarok itself was behind kde4-core, and while kde4-core was busy telling users that kde3 was no longer supported, amarok and other kde non-core apps (at least k3b and kaffeine as well, that I was personally running at the time) had yet to release stable kde4 versions -- they had early alphas or betas out, but that was it. So users had to choose between an unsupported kde3 core but stable kde apps, or a so-called stable kde4-core (which was really still alpha with 4.2, beta with 4.3), but deal with unstable pre-release non-core apps. And I suppose the amarok devs thought it's only pre-release anyway, no big deal if amd64 users are shut out for a bit. Except that only kde4 was supported by kde-core by then, and I guess the amarok devs didn't consider the fact that they were locking out all their amd64 users that had already bitten the bullet (or in my case, were trying to bite it) and had switched to the only supported kde-core already. Meanwhile, gentoo was still sort of supporting kde3 at the time, for stable anyway, but they'd already announced it EOLed because upstream kde wasn't supporting it any longer, thus signaling users like me to get our butts in gear and move to kde4 while the moving was good. Except kde4 was still horribly broken, both core and even more the non-core apps. I expect amd64 archlinux users had a similar problem, because both gentoo and arch are rolling distros. Standard non-rolling distros in many cases were still kde3 with their current stable release, and were working thru these sorts of problems for either the immediately following release or the one after that, depending on where they were in their cycle at the time. That, or in a couple cases I guess the distros simply bit the bullet and switched to kde4 (exclusively) as well, since upstream had declared kde3 no longer supported, and what worked worked and what didn't didn't -- they were simply going with upstream. Anyway, there really should have been kde3 support until at least the popular non-core kde-based apps were stable on kde4. And as I've said, by (late) kde 4.5, pretty much everything (both kde core and non-core) was stabilized on kde4 that was going to be, so that's what /should/ have been 4.0 and would have been the minimum practical in ordered not to leave users in the gap. Tho even that's pushing it, as many users aren't ready to switch with a normal x.0 release either, and giving them a year to switch would have meant supporting kde3 thru kde 4.7 or so. But of course by then kdepim was going thru its betas, so it would have needed delayed further... until 4.9 or even the current 4.10. Either that or kdepim shouldn't have been allowed that major switch in the stable 4.x series, and should have waited until 5.x to drop kmail1, etc, tho of course the
Re: [kde] kdm multiple keyboard layouts
First, I didn't noticed gmail was sending HTML. Please excuse me. This
one _should_ be plain text.
On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 7:48 PM, Bogus Zaba bog...@bogzab.plus.com wrote:
On 03/27/2013 09:16 PM, zoolook wrote:
On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 5:11 PM, Bogus Zaba bog...@bogzab.plus.com
mailto:bog...@bogzab.plus.com wrote:
On 03/27/2013 10:18 AM, zoolook wrote:
Hello,
First, is there a kdm-users dedicated mailing list?
Now my question.
I'm learning Dvorak keyboard layout but I share this computer
with my wife. She doesn't like the layout so I need kdm to
default to latam layout and have dvorak as a option (either a
keyboard shortcut or a menu option) so I don't have to
remember two passwords.
Is this possible?
Thanks!!
Norberto
___
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Archives: http://lists.kde.org/.
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System settings Input Devices Keyboard Layouts. The settings
form there allows you to add various keyboard layouts. Once these
have been activated an icon in the notifications area of your
panel tells you which keyboard layout is active at the time. I use
this to switch between UK, UK-international and Polisk keyboard
layouts. Just click the icon and you cycle through them, once you
have set them up in System Settings.
I want kd_M_ (kde's display manager) to be mutiple-keyboard-layout aware :-)
I want to be able to switch between 2 keyboard layouts in kdM.
Or is there something I'm missing? I see no icon to switch layouts in kdM.
Thanks!
Sorry, I misread your original post.
It's ok. Don't worry.
I think you are right there is no kdm option to change keyboard layouts
[some rant, but it's meant to be funny, keep reading 'cos I fixed]
We are in the year two thousand thirteen. It is the xxi century. We
are already on the second decade of the xxi century, and I already
have a flying car!!! (...ok, I'm lying a little bit here... it doesn't
fly, but it's new and shinny! :-) ), and ...
There may be options to achieve what you want by logging into your system in
a plain text console rather than using a display manager login. You might
then be able to set locale / keyboard map in the console and afterwards start
your gui with startx?
... and you want me to start kde using startx like in the '90 :-/
I'm going to my bedroom to cry.
I remember being able to configure xfree86 to hot-switch between
keyboard layouts, but xorg has no x{whatever}.conf in /etc/X11.
In *ubuntu (and from what I've been reading, every distro) the
xorg.conf files are split into /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/
To configure multiple keyboard layouts, I copied
/usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-evdev.conf to
/etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-evdev.conf (if the directory doesn't exist,
create it).
Then I modified the section where matchiskeyboard is:
Section InputClass
Identifier evdev keyboard catchall
MatchIsKeyboard on
MatchDevicePath /dev/input/event*
Driver evdev
### added this:
Option XkbModel pc105
Option XkbLayout latam,us(dvp)
Option XKbOptions grp:alt_shift_toggle
###
EndSection
As you can see, I've configured alt+shift as the hot-key to toggle the
layouts. It works in kdm (the display manager). Latam is the default.
I can press alt+shift to swicth to dvorak (programmer layout).
It is not perfect (missing layout label for exaple) but it works for me.
Adding this feature to kdm would be nice, since no display manager
seems to have this (2013 Guys. 2013. Windows 2000 supported this in
1999)
Now I have a little funny behaviour with middle-click to paste. I
don't know if it is caused by the above modification to the config or
something else (kde 4.10.1 still has this habit of deleting the
configuration file and replacing it with the defaults so maybe it is
just klipper doing its (default) thing :-/) . It is not important.
I'll fix it a few more minutes.
Thanks for reading!
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Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?
On Sat, Mar 23, 2013 at 6:42 PM, Leon Feng rainofch...@gmail.com wrote: 2013/3/23 Kevin Krammer kram...@kde.org On Saturday, 2013-03-23, dE . wrote: Cause of this behaviour of distros, KDE gets less chance to get tested. The only solution is to elongate the release cycles, that way, each version of the DE gets tested slowly by every advanced users; so they face and report bugs before the very end user face them. I am not sure I understand this fully, isn't this what already happens? Due to the way of how distributions undergo their development cycles it effectively already increased the testing phase for software they contain. First each software is tested by the respective community's beta testers, then each software is tested even more widely by the distribution's beta phase and after that by its early upgraders. I would guess that at the point a normal user upgrades the software has been in testing for a couple of months, maybe even half a year. Lets have a look at the most recent version KDE SC 4.10 Beta 1 tag was in November 2012 at which point it is most likely tested by KDE beta testers. This continues until February 2013 (about three months). If we take openSUSE as an example distribution, its respective release is March 2013, adding another monthof testing by people who build from source. The test audience at this point has expanded to include early upgraders of openSUSE. Not sure how long each update interval for openSUSE is but if we assume one month, then enthusiastic users who are not early upgraders will probably wait for the first of those, more cautious users even for the second or third. So depending where such users are comfort zone wise, the time between start of testing and deployment will be four and six months. KDE release time is not the time it hit all users. The testing time is very different based on distros. Usually Arch and [gentoo testing] is the first. They usually start using a upstream released version within days or even hours. Then Fedora, Ubuntu, Opensuse ... They usually have 6 months or 8 months release time and alpha\beta test. If their is cirtical bugs, they usually provide theri own patch. They provide seperate repo for advance users to upgrade immediately. Then Debian. [gentoo stable]. They usually do not release when there is still bugs exits. The time between Arch release and Debian release can be as long as 1-2 years. For debian stable users, the testing time is very long here. I checked gentoo's wiki here: [http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/KDE] KDE 4.10 is still in testing, Gentoo has not releas it yet. So dE, are you using testing and complain KDE is not tested before release? 4.10 is keyworded, meaning it's lacking testing, but no major bugs have been found yet. This's different from KDE release cycles, and the bugs I've complained about (except 1) are not Gentoo specific. Besides I'm talking about general KDE stable releases. You can tell gentoo KDE maintainer not to mask KDE4.10 as stable if you think your bugs will hit normal gentoo users. As far as I see, no other distro can reproduce your bugs. Maybe it is distro specific. Or if you really really want stable and no bugs, use gentoo stable or Debian stable. You should stop using Gentoo testing. Feng Chao The sole reason why I'm using Gentoo testing is to test the new release. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Yet another failed KDE release?
On Sat, Mar 23, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Anne Wilson cannewil...@googlemail.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 23/03/13 13:08, dE . wrote: There's very less time focused on testing; that should be increased, and there's really no reason to hurry releases, no one complained KDE is empty and featureless, but a lot complain about it's bugs and stability. This should point to something. Sorry:This discussion is getting a bit heavy, I'll take some time to respond. No distro forces you to use the latest of everything. Usually any version is supported for at least a few months after the release of a new one, so you can always stick with that. You claim to be happy to help test, yet you complain constantly. Let's try for some facts. I'm complaining right now, cause I see all this in the stable release (4.10.1). This makes early testing the releases more important, cause it reflects the state of KDE. Have you any idea how many different graphics cards are in use by the KDE community - i.e. by all users? Sound cards? and that's just the obvious ones. How is any developer going to test every one of those? It's simply not possible. Early adopters choose to be guinea pigs, helping testing. If you or anyone else doesn't want to be in that situation, simply stick with the older version. Thats's exactly why there should be more time to test RCs and the RC releases should be slow. Not everyone runs the same distro, or hardware, so KDE should be tested for maximum backends and libraries, which may revile new bugs; which as of the current time hits end users, and after that bugs are reported, which often lasts for years, cause devs are busy preparing for the next release. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
