Re: [discussion] archiving and retiring the Dot
On 2023-10-02, Joseph P. De Veaugh-Geiss wrote: > In this context, a radical idea came up: perhaps we can archive and > retire the Dot altogether. I'd like to come up with an alternative proposal: Make the dot more used: - Make it easier to submit articles there - Retire all project blogs in favour of the dot - Make planet only for personal blogs Isn't most "project blogs" workarounds to having it hard to have news items about the projects posted in the right place (the dot) All project blogs are kind of statements and news from the project as opposed to statements from individuals. Some examples: "App is now eco certified" => dot "How I reduced power consumption of app" => blog/planet "Akademy 2031 is hosted on Mars" => dot "At akademy, I found this place serving authentic filled-crust italian pizza" => dot And that would also leave better room for posts I would love to see on the planet by KDE contributors: "I taught my 5-year old to control a plane" "I reordered my bookshelf by height. This is why" "I tried vegetarian cooking; this recipe is amazing" "Please remember to vote in the upcoming election in my home country" For me, dot is about project news; planet is about the life of the contributors to the community. /Sune
Re: [discussion] archiving and retiring the Dot
On Tuesday, 3 October 2023 20:30:51 CEST Albert Astals Cid wrote: > El dimarts, 3 d’octubre de 2023, a les 19:18:37 (CEST), Paul Brown va > > escriure: > > Hello, > > > > > That is not correct, Akademy makes a huge use of the dot for sharing > > > info > > > to the wider community > > > > > > You can see this by looking at the articles on https://dot.kde.org/ > > > > But that reasoning is a bit weird, no? I am reading "There are many > > Akademy > > articles on the dot because Akademy articles are posted on the dot". But > > surely the same could be said of another site, say akademy.kde.org, if we > > started posting Akademy articles there, right? > > > > I don't see how that makes using the dot over any other site better. > > > > > KDE needs somewhere for official news, having that just mixed in with > > > blog > > > posts would make them much harder to find and be drowned out in noise > > > > I would argue that it is not noise. Blog posts collected on the planet, > > by > > and large _are_ KDE news. > > > > If anything the dot brings more noise to the planet than any other source, > > as multiple largely unrelated topics are covered on the dot, while blogs > > of the different projects and developers tend to focus on narrow, specific > > topics. > > > > In any case, if noise is what you want to avoid (and it is a valid point > > to > > bring up), it makes much more sense to publish Akademy news on the site > > that hosts all the other Akademy info, that is: on akademy.kde.org and > > interested parties can go there to get their news. > > I disagree, I see akademy.kde.org as the page for people explicitly > interested in Akademy, but even people not really interested in Akademy are > potentially interested in what happened in it, As far as I know, there is no plan to stop posting news about Akademy or impede those people who are interested in Akademy news from reading them, albeit elsewhere. > e.g. because they are > interested in the decision we took to rename Plasma to Quark. What?!? > > > The same goes for KDE e.v. announcements (new sponsors, Board sprints, > > advisory board meetings, etc.), and news and blog posts covering KDE's > > mentorization programs: they should live on the sites that talk about > > those > > things so people who are only interested in those things can avoid all > > other noise. > > > > And if you want a wider array of news (i.e. something noisier), well, that > > is what the planet is for. > > I disagree, the planet is an assortment of blogs from contributors, not a > news page. ¿Porqué no los dos? Of the 10 stories on the planet's front page, 7 are literally news stories directly related to KDE. I think you will find that those kind of numbers, 70% ~ 80% KDE-related news items, are present throughout the planet. That they are written by contributors does not not make them news stories. > > By removing the dot from the equation, we are > > helping readers reduce their exposure to noise. > > > > It is also worth pointing out that the traffic to the dot is extremely low > > and does not make up for the effort of writing for it and probably > > maintaining it. While monthly visits to other sites are beyond the > > thousands, sometimes the 10s of thousands, monthly visits to the dot are > > in > > the hundreds, rarely breaking 10 visitors a day. > > > > I understand that not all projects equally popular, so there will be a a > > wide differences in traffic, but the dot is a news site. Maintaining a > > news site nobody reads makes no sense. > > Maybe nobody reads it because nothing is written into it. Last news item is > from month ago, why would anyone visit a news page with so little news? Or you can look at it from th other side: we slowed down publishing stuff on the dot because we found it an ineffective way of reaching the public. We have the general policy in the Promo team of not wasting the community's resources and money on things that have been proven to not work. This may come as a shock, but some stuff that KDE has been doing for years in the area of communication and promotion actually does. not. work. We found that publishing elsewhere reached larger audiences and produced more engagement and drove more traffic to our other sites (which is the whole point) than posting to the dot. The added benefit was that we did not have t o waste hours dealing with the dot's awfully painful and crappy interface every time we wanted to post some news. Instead, we could get on with actual productive work. The decision was clear for us. Most of the time, the dot is just in the way anyway. Or it is replicating information which is already elsewhere (and better and more complete, like in a release announcement), or not bringing anything in the way of traffic we cannot achieve better, much better, and much more of with social media. You may not realise it now, but, by removing the dot, you are doing yourselves a favour. You will get
Re: [discussion] archiving and retiring the Dot
On Tuesday, 3 October 2023 23:04:12 CEST Albert Astals Cid wrote: > El dimarts, 3 d’octubre de 2023, a les 22:01:26 (CEST), Paul Brown va > > escriure: > > On Tuesday, 3 October 2023 20:30:51 CEST Albert Astals Cid wrote: > > > El dimarts, 3 d’octubre de 2023, a les 19:18:37 (CEST), Paul Brown va > > > > > > escriure: > > > > Hello, > > > > > > > > > That is not correct, Akademy makes a huge use of the dot for sharing > > > > > info > > > > > to the wider community > > > > > > > > > > You can see this by looking at the articles on https://dot.kde.org/ > > > > > > > > But that reasoning is a bit weird, no? I am reading "There are many > > > > Akademy > > > > articles on the dot because Akademy articles are posted on the dot". > > > > But > > > > surely the same could be said of another site, say akademy.kde.org, if > > > > we > > > > started posting Akademy articles there, right? > > > > > > > > I don't see how that makes using the dot over any other site better. > > > > > > > > > KDE needs somewhere for official news, having that just mixed in > > > > > with > > > > > blog > > > > > posts would make them much harder to find and be drowned out in > > > > > noise > > > > > > > > I would argue that it is not noise. Blog posts collected on the > > > > planet, > > > > by > > > > and large _are_ KDE news. > > > > > > > > If anything the dot brings more noise to the planet than any other > > > > source, > > > > as multiple largely unrelated topics are covered on the dot, while > > > > blogs > > > > of the different projects and developers tend to focus on narrow, > > > > specific > > > > topics. > > > > > > > > In any case, if noise is what you want to avoid (and it is a valid > > > > point > > > > to > > > > bring up), it makes much more sense to publish Akademy news on the > > > > site > > > > that hosts all the other Akademy info, that is: on akademy.kde.org and > > > > interested parties can go there to get their news. > > > > > > I disagree, I see akademy.kde.org as the page for people explicitly > > > interested in Akademy, but even people not really interested in Akademy > > > are > > > potentially interested in what happened in it, > > > > As far as I know, there is no plan to stop posting news about Akademy or > > impede those people who are interested in Akademy news from reading them, > > albeit elsewhere. > > > > > e.g. because they are > > > interested in the decision we took to rename Plasma to Quark. > > > > What?!? > > That was just an hypothetical example of something that may be decided in > Akademy (and thus reported in the Akademy news) that people that are not > interested in Akademy per se would like to know about. You nearly gave me a hypothetical heart attack. Cheers Paul -- Promotion & Communication www: https://kde.org Mastodon: https://floss.social/@kde Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kde/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/kdecommunity LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/kde
Re: [discussion] archiving and retiring the Dot
El dimarts, 3 d’octubre de 2023, a les 22:01:26 (CEST), Paul Brown va escriure: > On Tuesday, 3 October 2023 20:30:51 CEST Albert Astals Cid wrote: > > El dimarts, 3 d’octubre de 2023, a les 19:18:37 (CEST), Paul Brown va > > > > escriure: > > > Hello, > > > > > > > That is not correct, Akademy makes a huge use of the dot for sharing > > > > info > > > > to the wider community > > > > > > > > You can see this by looking at the articles on https://dot.kde.org/ > > > > > > But that reasoning is a bit weird, no? I am reading "There are many > > > Akademy > > > articles on the dot because Akademy articles are posted on the dot". But > > > surely the same could be said of another site, say akademy.kde.org, if > > > we > > > started posting Akademy articles there, right? > > > > > > I don't see how that makes using the dot over any other site better. > > > > > > > KDE needs somewhere for official news, having that just mixed in with > > > > blog > > > > posts would make them much harder to find and be drowned out in noise > > > > > > I would argue that it is not noise. Blog posts collected on the planet, > > > by > > > and large _are_ KDE news. > > > > > > If anything the dot brings more noise to the planet than any other > > > source, > > > as multiple largely unrelated topics are covered on the dot, while > > > blogs > > > of the different projects and developers tend to focus on narrow, > > > specific > > > topics. > > > > > > In any case, if noise is what you want to avoid (and it is a valid point > > > to > > > bring up), it makes much more sense to publish Akademy news on the site > > > that hosts all the other Akademy info, that is: on akademy.kde.org and > > > interested parties can go there to get their news. > > > > I disagree, I see akademy.kde.org as the page for people explicitly > > interested in Akademy, but even people not really interested in Akademy > > are > > potentially interested in what happened in it, > > As far as I know, there is no plan to stop posting news about Akademy or > impede those people who are interested in Akademy news from reading them, > albeit elsewhere. > > > e.g. because they are > > interested in the decision we took to rename Plasma to Quark. > > What?!? That was just an hypothetical example of something that may be decided in Akademy (and thus reported in the Akademy news) that people that are not interested in Akademy per se would like to know about. Cheers, Albert
Re: [discussion] archiving and retiring the Dot
El dimarts, 3 d’octubre de 2023, a les 19:18:37 (CEST), Paul Brown va escriure: > Hello, > > > That is not correct, Akademy makes a huge use of the dot for sharing info > > to the wider community > > > > You can see this by looking at the articles on https://dot.kde.org/ > > But that reasoning is a bit weird, no? I am reading "There are many Akademy > articles on the dot because Akademy articles are posted on the dot". But > surely the same could be said of another site, say akademy.kde.org, if we > started posting Akademy articles there, right? > > I don't see how that makes using the dot over any other site better. > > > KDE needs somewhere for official news, having that just mixed in with blog > > posts would make them much harder to find and be drowned out in noise > > I would argue that it is not noise. Blog posts collected on the planet, by > and large _are_ KDE news. > > If anything the dot brings more noise to the planet than any other source, > as multiple largely unrelated topics are covered on the dot, while blogs > of the different projects and developers tend to focus on narrow, specific > topics. > > In any case, if noise is what you want to avoid (and it is a valid point to > bring up), it makes much more sense to publish Akademy news on the site that > hosts all the other Akademy info, that is: on akademy.kde.org and > interested parties can go there to get their news. I disagree, I see akademy.kde.org as the page for people explicitly interested in Akademy, but even people not really interested in Akademy are potentially interested in what happened in it, e.g. because they are interested in the decision we took to rename Plasma to Quark. > > The same goes for KDE e.v. announcements (new sponsors, Board sprints, > advisory board meetings, etc.), and news and blog posts covering KDE's > mentorization programs: they should live on the sites that talk about those > things so people who are only interested in those things can avoid all other > noise. > > And if you want a wider array of news (i.e. something noisier), well, that > is what the planet is for. I disagree, the planet is an assortment of blogs from contributors, not a news page. > By removing the dot from the equation, we are > helping readers reduce their exposure to noise. > > It is also worth pointing out that the traffic to the dot is extremely low > and does not make up for the effort of writing for it and probably > maintaining it. While monthly visits to other sites are beyond the > thousands, sometimes the 10s of thousands, monthly visits to the dot are in > the hundreds, rarely breaking 10 visitors a day. > > I understand that not all projects equally popular, so there will be a a > wide differences in traffic, but the dot is a news site. Maintaining a > news site nobody reads makes no sense. Maybe nobody reads it because nothing is written into it. Last news item is from month ago, why would anyone visit a news page with so little news? Cheers, Albert > > Cheers > > Paul
Re: [discussion] archiving and retiring the Dot
Hello, > That is not correct, Akademy makes a huge use of the dot for sharing info to > the wider community > > You can see this by looking at the articles on https://dot.kde.org/ But that reasoning is a bit weird, no? I am reading "There are many Akademy articles on the dot because Akademy articles are posted on the dot". But surely the same could be said of another site, say akademy.kde.org, if we started posting Akademy articles there, right? I don't see how that makes using the dot over any other site better. > KDE needs somewhere for official news, having that just mixed in with blog > posts would make them much harder to find and be drowned out in noise I would argue that it is not noise. Blog posts collected on the planet, by and large _are_ KDE news. If anything the dot brings more noise to the planet than any other source, as multiple largely unrelated topics are covered on the dot, while blogs of the different projects and developers tend to focus on narrow, specific topics. In any case, if noise is what you want to avoid (and it is a valid point to bring up), it makes much more sense to publish Akademy news on the site that hosts all the other Akademy info, that is: on akademy.kde.org and interested parties can go there to get their news. The same goes for KDE e.v. announcements (new sponsors, Board sprints, advisory board meetings, etc.), and news and blog posts covering KDE's mentorization programs: they should live on the sites that talk about those things so people who are only interested in those things can avoid all other noise. And if you want a wider array of news (i.e. something noisier), well, that is what the planet is for. By removing the dot from the equation, we are helping readers reduce their exposure to noise. It is also worth pointing out that the traffic to the dot is extremely low and does not make up for the effort of writing for it and probably maintaining it. While monthly visits to other sites are beyond the thousands, sometimes the 10s of thousands, monthly visits to the dot are in the hundreds, rarely breaking 10 visitors a day. I understand that not all projects equally popular, so there will be a a wide differences in traffic, but the dot is a news site. Maintaining a news site nobody reads makes no sense. Cheers Paul -- Promotion & Communication www: https://kde.org Mastodon: https://floss.social/@kde Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kde/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/kdecommunity LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/kde
Re: [discussion] archiving and retiring the Dot
On Dienstag, 3. Oktober 2023 08:53:24 CEST Sune Vuorela wrote: > On 2023-10-02, Joseph P. De Veaugh-Geiss wrote: > > In this context, a radical idea came up: perhaps we can archive and > > retire the Dot altogether. > > I'd like to come up with an alternative proposal: > > Make the dot more used: > - Make it easier to submit articles there > - Retire all project blogs in favour of the dot > - Make planet only for personal blogs - Make planet only for personal blogs about KDE related things. > And that would also leave better room for posts I would love to see on > the planet by KDE contributors: > "I taught my 5-year old to control a plane" > "I reordered my bookshelf by height. This is why" > "I tried vegetarian cooking; this recipe is amazing" > "Please remember to vote in the upcoming election in my home country" I wouldn't want to see any of this on Planet KDE. I'd be on Facebook, Insta, X, whatever, if I was interested in such content. Citing https://invent.kde.org/websites/planet-kde-org/-/blob/master/README.md "Blog content should be mostly KDE themed and not liable to offend. If you have a general blog you may want to set up a tag and subscribe the feed for that tag only to Planet KDE." I fully subscribe to this. Regards, Ingo signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
