Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[jp charras]

Le 23/11/2019 à 00:05, ja...@veith.net a écrit :
>> On 22.11.19 21:12, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
>> What Jeff described is the simplest case.  Where things really get
>> interesting is when you start sharing schematic files between projects.
> 
> Imho multiple use of a schematic requires separate instance data.
> Similar problem for the recently discussed variant/do not fit where
> the values are different instead reference designators. Could imagine
> both, e.g. a filter circuit used multiple times for different frequency
> whether its on the same board or not. If used outside project, the
> project file could link instance data to schematic. Penalty is not
> having complete schematics in one file.

I agree: sharing the same schematic file between projects projects is
the best way to break the projects.

For instance:
- projects can have different libraries using the same library nickname,
and having different symbols having the same lib id between projects.
- alternate references (AR lines) exist only for complex hierarchies
when the same file has more than one instance in the same project
- when the hierarchy is not complex, only the F0 field (reference)
stores the reference.
So, changing it in a project breaks the other project if this sheet is
shared between projects.
And there are more subtle cases (what about swapping 2 units in a
multi-unit component in a project?)

So sharing a sheet file between projects is just madness.

-- 
Jean-Pierre CHARRAS

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Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Mark Roszko]

It has potential to reduce clicks.

But feel free to suggest a change in the visual style that can
accommodate two buttons without degrading the website visually or
psychology reducing donations too (the "wow these guys look desperate"
effect)

On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 5:49 PM Drew Van Zandt 
wrote:

> Adding clicks reduces the chance you'll get a donation.
>
> On Fri, Nov 22, 2019, 5:31 PM Wayne Stambaugh 
> wrote:
>
>> On 11/22/19 3:23 PM, Nick Østergaard wrote:
>> > On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 18:03, Wayne Stambaugh 
>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has joined
>> the
>> >> Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
>> >> project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to donate to
>> >> KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can spend
>> donation
>> >> money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with CERN and
>> >> you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your preference.  You
>> >> should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.
>> >>
>> >> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
>> >> website main page.  If someone would please point me to the correct
>> >> place in the website source where I need to do this, I would appreciate
>> >> it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation link is
>> >> https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.
>> >>
>> >> Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook page?  I
>> >> didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so I could
>> >> post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.
>> >>
>> >
>> > I have admin access on it, but I think you got it as well from the
>> > original creator (Sujith Anandan) of it. I don't really maintain it,
>> > facebook is not really my thing.
>>
>> It's not my thing either but I thought I would add the announcement
>> there.  I don't recall ever getting admin access.  I did get the twitter
>> admin login information.  Do you have Sujith's email address so that I
>> can ping him?
>>
>> >
>> >> I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential donor
>> >> visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.  Thank you all
>> >> for your continued support.
>> >>
>> >> Cheers,
>> >>
>> >> Wayne
>> >>
>> >> ___
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-- 
Mark
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Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Sujith Anandan]

Hello Wayne,

I have already added you as page admin, please accept the request you will
get in facebook.

Thanks.
Sujith

On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 5:15 AM Wayne Stambaugh 
wrote:

> I was wondering about that myself.  We can try a donate page and see how
> it works.  We can always change it if we don't like it.
>
> On 11/22/19 3:53 PM, Mark Roszko wrote:
> > I'm not sure about adding a second button in the header.
> >
> > I am envisioning creating a "Donate" page with both CERN and Linux
> > foundation options presented clearly with one big button for each and a
> > small blurb for what each does. The header will go to this intermediate
> > page.
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 2:50 PM Wayne Stambaugh  > > wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > On 11/22/19 2:39 PM, Mark Roszko wrote:
> > >> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> > > website main page.
> > >
> > > But is it in addition to or to replace CERN?
> >
> > In addition to.
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 12:03 PM Wayne Stambaugh
> > mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>
> > > >>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has
> > joined the
> > > Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.
> The
> > > project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to
> > donate to
> > > KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can
> > spend donation
> > > money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with
> > CERN and
> > > you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your
> > preference.  You
> > > should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation
> shortly.
> > >
> > > I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the
> KiCad
> > > website main page.  If someone would please point me to the
> > correct
> > > place in the website source where I need to do this, I would
> > appreciate
> > > it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation
> > link is
> > > https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.
> > >
> > > Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook
> > page?  I
> > > didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so
> > I could
> > > post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do
> it.
> > >
> > > I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential
> > donor
> > > visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.
> > Thank you all
> > > for your continued support.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > >
> > > Wayne
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> > > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> > 
> > >  > >
> > > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> > > More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Mark
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Mark
>
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Re: [Kicad-developers] Building Kicad on Windows 10/Eclipse/Msys2

[Brian Piccioni]

Can Simon or somebody who understands such things verify that the following is correct so I can update my recipe? Thanks == In Mingw64 git clone https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-source-mirror.git This will create a local repository directory called kicad-source-mirror At any time you can update the repository by cd kicad-source-mirrorgit pull origin master  Note that this will leave files which are in kicad-source-mirror but not in the kicad source repository unaffected.*** However *** they will over write your versions of those files! So if you edit cmakelists.txt or any other Kicad source file those edits will be lost.   From: Simon RichterSent: November 22, 2019 6:46 AMTo: kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.netSubject: Re: [Kicad-developers] Building Kicad on Windows 10/Eclipse/Msys2 Hi, On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 09:30:48PM -0500, Brian Piccioni wrote: > Download the Kicad source files from https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-source-mirror> Untar or unzip into /home/kicad-source-mirror-master This probably should be "use git to get the source tree", otherwise I thinkthis might be a valuable addition to the website.    Simon ___Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developersPost to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.netUnsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developersMore help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp 

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[Kicad-developers] [PATCH] Enable full CTest framework

[Simon Richter]

This allows asking CTest for running the test suite under valgrind
---
 CMakeLists.txt | 2 +-
 1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-)

diff --git a/CMakeLists.txt b/CMakeLists.txt
index 7f6ee37a5..81e5dc8ae 100644
--- a/CMakeLists.txt
+++ b/CMakeLists.txt
@@ -980,7 +980,7 @@ if( UNIX AND NOT APPLE )
 )
 endif()
 
-#include( CTest )
+include( CTest )
 enable_testing()
 
 if( UNIX AND NOT APPLE )
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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[ja...@veith.net]

> On 22.11.19 21:12, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:

What Jeff described is the simplest case.  Where things really get
interesting is when you start sharing schematic files between projects.


Imho multiple use of a schematic requires separate instance data. 
Similar problem for the recently discussed variant/do not fit where

the values are different instead reference designators. Could imagine
both, e.g. a filter circuit used multiple times for different frequency
whether its on the same board or not. If used outside project, the 
project file could link instance data to schematic. Penalty is not 
having complete schematics in one file.




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Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Drew Van Zandt]

Adding clicks reduces the chance you'll get a donation.

On Fri, Nov 22, 2019, 5:31 PM Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:

> On 11/22/19 3:23 PM, Nick Østergaard wrote:
> > On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 18:03, Wayne Stambaugh 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has joined the
> >> Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
> >> project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to donate to
> >> KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can spend donation
> >> money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with CERN and
> >> you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your preference.  You
> >> should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.
> >>
> >> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> >> website main page.  If someone would please point me to the correct
> >> place in the website source where I need to do this, I would appreciate
> >> it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation link is
> >> https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.
> >>
> >> Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook page?  I
> >> didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so I could
> >> post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.
> >>
> >
> > I have admin access on it, but I think you got it as well from the
> > original creator (Sujith Anandan) of it. I don't really maintain it,
> > facebook is not really my thing.
>
> It's not my thing either but I thought I would add the announcement
> there.  I don't recall ever getting admin access.  I did get the twitter
> admin login information.  Do you have Sujith's email address so that I
> can ping him?
>
> >
> >> I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential donor
> >> visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.  Thank you all
> >> for your continued support.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >>
> >> Wayne
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> >> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>
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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Dino Ghilardi]

On 22/11/19 23:14, Andy Peters wrote:



On Nov 22, 2019, at 2:30 PM, Dino Ghilardi  wrote:

Just my two cents on this.

Considering that the actual "manual work-around" to do the "back annotation" 
now can be:

-Open pcbnew and eeschema at the same time
-Select the component you want to rename on pcbnew
-the right symbol gets highlighted (but not selected) automatically in eeschema
-select the highlighted component in eeschema, press "U" shortcut (edit 
reference)
-change the reference in the dialog
-press F8 to update the pcb

A possible approach is to use this sequence of operations (...future python 
script?).

Since the mechanism to find the correct symbol on eeschema seems yet 
implemented, probably the only missing parts would be to implement is

Enable from pcbnew the command "select the highlighted component and/or open the 
"edit reference" dialog.

Drawbacks:
-Requires eeschema and pcbnew open at the same time (may be this is not a  a 
problem since we also have DRC that opens eeschema when run).
-Requires to check that schematic and layout are synchronized before starting 
the back-annotation (probably needed also for all the other implementations).
-For bigger schematics the full-update via F8 can become slow, so as a future 
improvement, after a first working implementation could be a way to update only 
the modified field.


I have done manual back-annotation because automated back-annotation (what 
Brian Piccioni is doing) didn’t exist.

I’m in the habit of doing “geographical re-annotation” after a layout has 
completed. This is where the layout is scanned and, say, the resistor most near 
the upper left is numbered R1, the resistor to its right is then R2, and so on. 
This is purely an aid for the human assembler and the human debugging the 
design. It’s not really interesting for automated assembly.

You can do this manually, on a small design, using the approach you suggest, 
but for anything complex (my last board was 165 mm x 125 mm with about 150 
capacitors, a hundred resistors, and a bunch of ICs) it’s impossible.

So it really needs to be automated. The options, as I see them, are few and 
simple: origin, direction (increasing in X or increasing in Y) and an option to 
not re-annotate a part (maybe don’t change the reference designators for 
connectors). The logic of the sorting is straightforward, but it’s a task best 
left to the machines.

-a

--


I agree,
   my comment was more "low level": to automate the high level 
"origin-direction-etc... the first step would be having the lower part 
"up-and-running", then build the fully automated part on that.


P.S.: I like the term "geographical annotation" more than "back 
annotation" for this feature.


Another possible approach I can think about is adding "board 
geographical (re)annotation in eeschema "annotate schematic" tool: if 
eeschema can "ask" the position to pcbnew it also can re-annotate the 
components according to position.
Since pcbnew does not move components if only the reference changes in 
eeschema, this could be also a solution.


Drawback: probably this approach is less intuitive to the user that 
expects to be able to change references in pcbnew.


Cheers,
Dino.


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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Andy Peters]

> On Nov 22, 2019, at 2:30 PM, Dino Ghilardi  wrote:
> 
> Just my two cents on this.
> 
> Considering that the actual "manual work-around" to do the "back annotation" 
> now can be:
> 
> -Open pcbnew and eeschema at the same time
> -Select the component you want to rename on pcbnew
> -the right symbol gets highlighted (but not selected) automatically in 
> eeschema
> -select the highlighted component in eeschema, press "U" shortcut (edit 
> reference)
> -change the reference in the dialog
> -press F8 to update the pcb
> 
> A possible approach is to use this sequence of operations (...future python 
> script?).
> 
> Since the mechanism to find the correct symbol on eeschema seems yet 
> implemented, probably the only missing parts would be to implement is
> 
> Enable from pcbnew the command "select the highlighted component and/or open 
> the "edit reference" dialog.
> 
> Drawbacks:
> -Requires eeschema and pcbnew open at the same time (may be this is not a  a 
> problem since we also have DRC that opens eeschema when run).
> -Requires to check that schematic and layout are synchronized before starting 
> the back-annotation (probably needed also for all the other implementations).
> -For bigger schematics the full-update via F8 can become slow, so as a future 
> improvement, after a first working implementation could be a way to update 
> only the modified field.

I have done manual back-annotation because automated back-annotation (what 
Brian Piccioni is doing) didn’t exist.

I’m in the habit of doing “geographical re-annotation” after a layout has 
completed. This is where the layout is scanned and, say, the resistor most near 
the upper left is numbered R1, the resistor to its right is then R2, and so on. 
This is purely an aid for the human assembler and the human debugging the 
design. It’s not really interesting for automated assembly.

You can do this manually, on a small design, using the approach you suggest, 
but for anything complex (my last board was 165 mm x 125 mm with about 150 
capacitors, a hundred resistors, and a bunch of ICs) it’s impossible.

So it really needs to be automated. The options, as I see them, are few and 
simple: origin, direction (increasing in X or increasing in Y) and an option to 
not re-annotate a part (maybe don’t change the reference designators for 
connectors). The logic of the sorting is straightforward, but it’s a task best 
left to the machines.

-a
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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Brian]

An aside...

On 11/22/19 3:14 PM, Andy Peters wrote:

Now select that sub-sheet symbol by left-clicking/holding and drawing 
a rectangle around it. Right-click and choose “duplicate block.” Now 
you have a new instance of that same sub-sheet.
As a user, I would not expect "Duplicate" to mean "Create a shallow 
copy."  I would expect the duplicated block to be completely independent 
of the original block.  If that is actually the behavior (a shallow 
copy, i.e. a new reference to the same block), "Duplicate" is a 
misleading term.


How, then, would I take a sub-sheet and create a deep copy, in the case 
that my intent was to modify the copy in some way without affecting the 
original?


Thanks for engaging on my rabbit-trail!

-B

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Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Wayne Stambaugh]

I was wondering about that myself.  We can try a donate page and see how
it works.  We can always change it if we don't like it.

On 11/22/19 3:53 PM, Mark Roszko wrote:
> I'm not sure about adding a second button in the header.
> 
> I am envisioning creating a "Donate" page with both CERN and Linux
> foundation options presented clearly with one big button for each and a
> small blurb for what each does. The header will go to this intermediate
> page.
> 
> On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 2:50 PM Wayne Stambaugh  > wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> On 11/22/19 2:39 PM, Mark Roszko wrote:
> >> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> > website main page. 
> >
> > But is it in addition to or to replace CERN?
> 
> In addition to.
> 
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 12:03 PM Wayne Stambaugh
> mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>
> > >> wrote:
> >
> >     I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has
> joined the
> >     Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
> >     project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to
> donate to
> >     KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can
> spend donation
> >     money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with
> CERN and
> >     you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your
> preference.  You
> >     should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.
> >
> >     I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> >     website main page.  If someone would please point me to the
> correct
> >     place in the website source where I need to do this, I would
> appreciate
> >     it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation
> link is
> >     https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.
> >
> >     Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook
> page?  I
> >     didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so
> I could
> >     post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.
> >
> >     I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential
> donor
> >     visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project. 
> Thank you all
> >     for your continued support.
> >
> >     Cheers,
> >
> >     Wayne
> >
> >     ___
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> 
> >      >
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> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Mark
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Mark

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Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Wayne Stambaugh]

On 11/22/19 3:23 PM, Nick Østergaard wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 18:03, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>>
>> I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has joined the
>> Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
>> project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to donate to
>> KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can spend donation
>> money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with CERN and
>> you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your preference.  You
>> should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.
>>
>> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
>> website main page.  If someone would please point me to the correct
>> place in the website source where I need to do this, I would appreciate
>> it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation link is
>> https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.
>>
>> Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook page?  I
>> didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so I could
>> post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.
>>
> 
> I have admin access on it, but I think you got it as well from the
> original creator (Sujith Anandan) of it. I don't really maintain it,
> facebook is not really my thing.

It's not my thing either but I thought I would add the announcement
there.  I don't recall ever getting admin access.  I did get the twitter
admin login information.  Do you have Sujith's email address so that I
can ping him?

> 
>> I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential donor
>> visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.  Thank you all
>> for your continued support.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Wayne
>>
>> ___
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Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Mark Roszko]

I'm not sure about adding a second button in the header.

I am envisioning creating a "Donate" page with both CERN and Linux
foundation options presented clearly with one big button for each and a
small blurb for what each does. The header will go to this intermediate
page.

On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 2:50 PM Wayne Stambaugh 
wrote:

>
>
> On 11/22/19 2:39 PM, Mark Roszko wrote:
> >> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> > website main page.
> >
> > But is it in addition to or to replace CERN?
>
> In addition to.
>
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 12:03 PM Wayne Stambaugh  > > wrote:
> >
> > I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has joined
> the
> > Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
> > project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to donate
> to
> > KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can spend
> donation
> > money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with CERN
> and
> > you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your preference.  You
> > should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.
> >
> > I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> > website main page.  If someone would please point me to the correct
> > place in the website source where I need to do this, I would
> appreciate
> > it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation link
> is
> > https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.
> >
> > Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook page?  I
> > didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so I
> could
> > post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.
> >
> > I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential donor
> > visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.  Thank you
> all
> > for your continued support.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Wayne
> >
> > ___
> > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> > 
> > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> > More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Mark
>


-- 
Mark
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Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Nick Østergaard]

On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 18:03, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>
> I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has joined the
> Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
> project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to donate to
> KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can spend donation
> money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with CERN and
> you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your preference.  You
> should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.
>
> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> website main page.  If someone would please point me to the correct
> place in the website source where I need to do this, I would appreciate
> it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation link is
> https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.
>
> Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook page?  I
> didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so I could
> post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.
>

I have admin access on it, but I think you got it as well from the
original creator (Sujith Anandan) of it. I don't really maintain it,
facebook is not really my thing.

> I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential donor
> visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.  Thank you all
> for your continued support.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Wayne
>
> ___
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> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Andy Peters]

> On Nov 22, 2019, at 12:42 PM, Brian  wrote:
> 
>>> On 22 Nov 2019, at 19:29, Brian >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> From the peanut gallery:
>>> 
>>> Can someone tell me an example use-case for a single schematic symbol 
>>> corresponding to multiple board entities within a single project?
>>> 
>>> As perhaps a rather naïve PCB designer, it seems like mostly a bad idea to 
>>> me to have anything other than 1:1.
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> -Brian Henning 

>> On 11/22/19 2:37 PM, Jeff Young wrote:
>>> Hi Brian,
>>> 
>>> Imagine you’re doing an audio amplifier.  Your main schematic sheet has 4 
>>> subsheets: PSU, control logic, left channel and right channel.  Both left 
>>> channel and right channel point to the same sub-page.  So there’s a single 
>>> schematic symbol for each part in the left & right channel, which gets 
>>> annotated as two different references (ie: Q101 and Q201), and attached to 
>>> two different footprints.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> Jeff.
>>> 

> Hi Jeff,
> 
> Thanks for helping me understand this.  So how would someone looking at the 
> schematic know that this one symbol represents both Q101 and Q201?  For that 
> matter, if there's some instructions or a tutorial about creating a situation 
> like this (one schematic drawing representing multiple instances of the 
> subcircuit on the pcb), I'd be interested to learn it.  I have a couple 
> projects in the pipeline where I might find this feature useful; in the past, 
> I've manually copy/pasted sections of a schematic to repeat subcircuits.
> 
> Thanks,
> -Brian

When I first read Brian H’s message, “multiple board entities” stood out — I 
thought he was talking about having more than one physical PCB in the project! 
Now I understand his concern.

Brian — when you have a design which uses multiple instantiations of the same 
sub-sheet, when you look at that design in the schematic editor (are we still 
calling it EESChema?) you can navigate through the sub-sheets using the 
Hierarchical Navigator. In each instance of a sub-sheet, you will see that each 
component has been assigned unique reference designators.

So do a simple test. Create a project. In the project’s main sheet, choose 
Create Hierarchical sheet from the right-hand menu. Give it a reasonable file 
name (like subsheet.sch) and give it a reasonable Sheet Name. (Sheet name is 
basically a reference designator for a sub-sheet.) Enter that sheet, add some 
parts. keep it simple, like a single inverting op-amp circuit, so an op-amp 
symbol and two resistors. Add two power symbols for the op-amp power. Add 
hierarchical labels for the input and output. Don’t worry about annotation yet. 
Save the sheet. 

Navigate back to the top. Right-click on the sub-sheet symbol and choose 
“Import sheet pins.” You need to do this once for each hierarchical label you 
added. This is how you bring nets up to a higher level. Now select that 
sub-sheet symbol by left-clicking/holding and drawing a rectangle around it. 
Right-click and choose “duplicate block.” Now you have a new instance of that 
same sub-sheet. Place it. Then right-click on it, choose “Edit …” (or just hit 
E) and give it a better sheet name. Now you have two unique instances of that 
sub-sheet. Choose Tools -> Annotate Schematic. When that’s done, enter each of 
the sub-sheets — you will see that they each have unique reference designators 
for the same symbols. Also, the non-hierarchical (local) nets in each sub-sheet 
will have unique net labels! So when you export the netlist for PCB it’ll work 
as you expect.

Oh, yeah, when you print out the schematic, you will get as many sheets as you 
have instances of the sub-sheets. So the simple example here, with a top-level 
sheet and two instances of a single sub-sheet will give you three printed pages.

Try it!

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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Wayne Stambaugh]

What Jeff described is the simplest case.  Where things really get
interesting is when you start sharing schematic files between projects.
 When this happens, there will entries in a symbol definition for each
instance (sheet) of the schematic file in every project.  Here is an
sample symbol (component) section with comments of what happens in the
file itself:

$Comp
L Device:R R?
U 1 1 56C02CD5
P 4650 3250
# These four entries are from one project where this schematic file is
# referenced in four separate sheets.
AR Path="/56C02CC2/56C02CD5" Ref="R1"  Part="1"
AR Path="/56C0317D/56C02CD5" Ref="R2"  Part="1"
AR Path="/5B8E85A4/56C02CD5" Ref="R3"  Part="1"
AR Path="/5B8E866A/56C02CD5" Ref="R4"  Part="1"
# These four entries are from a different project where this schematic
# file is referenced in three separate sheets.
AR Path="/56C02CC5/56C02CD5" Ref="R1"  Part="1"
AR Path="/56C0317F/56C02CD5" Ref="R2"  Part="1"
AR Path="/5C8E85A4/56C02CD5" Ref="R3"  Part="1"
# There can be any number of these references so you cannot use the
# reference to look up changes for back annotation.  You must use the
# path but paths can deviate from the board if the schematic has been
# modified and changes have not been pushed to the board which further
# complicates things.
F 0 "R?" V 4730 3250 50   C CNN
F 1 "R" V 4650 3250 50   C CNN
F 2 "" V 4580 3250 30   C CNN
F 3 "" H 4650 3250 30   C CNN
14650 3250
100-1
$EndComp

There are a whole bunch of issues that can crop up like timestamp
clashes between projects so there are known bugs even with what I
described above.  The new file format will add some type of hashing to
prevent this.

On 11/22/19 2:47 PM, Jeff Young wrote:
> Hi Brian,
> 
> If you double-click into the left channel you’ll see Q101.  If you
> double-click into the right, you’ll see Q201.  So it looks like there
> are two.  But if you edit either one it goes back to a single file so
> both will be changed.
> 
> (To be honest I’ve never used this feature, so I’m not 100% sure the
> above is correct.  But I’m pretty sure.)
> 
> My guess is there’s a tutorial somewhere; perhaps Wayne or JP could comment?
> 
> Cheers,
> Jeff.
> 
> 
>> On 22 Nov 2019, at 19:42, Brian > > wrote:
>>
>> Hi Jeff,
>>
>> Thanks for helping me understand this.  So how would someone looking
>> at the schematic know that this one symbol represents both Q101 and
>> Q201?  For that matter, if there's some instructions or a tutorial
>> about creating a situation like this (one schematic drawing
>> representing multiple instances of the subcircuit on the pcb), I'd be
>> interested to learn it.  I have a couple projects in the pipeline
>> where I might find this feature useful; in the past, I've manually
>> copy/pasted sections of a schematic to repeat subcircuits.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> -Brian
>>
>> On 11/22/19 2:37 PM, Jeff Young wrote:
>>> Hi Brian,
>>>
>>> Imagine you’re doing an audio amplifier.  Your main schematic sheet
>>> has 4 subsheets: PSU, control logic, left channel and right channel.
>>>  Both left channel and right channel point to the same sub-page.  So
>>> there’s a single schematic symbol for each part in the left & right
>>> channel, which gets annotated as two different references (ie: Q101
>>> and Q201), and attached to two different footprints.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Jeff.
>>>
 On 22 Nov 2019, at 19:29, Brian >>> > wrote:

 From the peanut gallery:

 Can someone tell me an example use-case for a single schematic
 symbol corresponding to multiple board entities within a single project?

 As perhaps a rather naïve PCB designer, it seems like mostly a bad
 idea to me to have anything other than 1:1.

 Thanks,
 -Brian Henning 

> On Nov 22, 2019, at 1:44 PM, Brian Piccioni
> mailto:br...@documenteddesigns.com>>
> wrote:
>
> 
> Wayne 
>  
> I thought I would weigh in as I am collaborating with Alexander.
>  
> If a designer manually re-annotates a board and schematics he would
> follow a number of steps:
>  
>
>  1. Ensure the schematics, PCB, and netlist are coherent and
> without error (I.e. nothing in the schematics or PCB which is
> not in the other, netlist corresponds to schematic and PCB);
>  2. Manually edit each component on the board and keep a record of
> every change in a “change list”;
>  3. Manually edit the schematic in accordance with the “change list”;
>  4. Regenerate the netlist;
>  5. Update PCB from schematics;
>  6. Verify that the schematics and PCB are still coherent.
>
>  
> Manually editing the schematic would consist of going from
> component to component, looking up the component ref des in the
> “change list”, changing the ref des to the new value, and moving to
> the next component. The final step would only be necessary due to
> 

Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Wayne Stambaugh]

On 11/22/19 2:39 PM, Mark Roszko wrote:
>> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> website main page. 
> 
> But is it in addition to or to replace CERN?

In addition to.

> 
> 
> 
> On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 12:03 PM Wayne Stambaugh  > wrote:
> 
> I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has joined the
> Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
> project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to donate to
> KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can spend donation
> money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with CERN and
> you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your preference.  You
> should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.
> 
> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> website main page.  If someone would please point me to the correct
> place in the website source where I need to do this, I would appreciate
> it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation link is
> https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.
> 
> Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook page?  I
> didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so I could
> post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.
> 
> I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential donor
> visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.  Thank you all
> for your continued support.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Wayne
> 
> ___
> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> Post to     : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> 
> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Mark

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Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Jeff Young]

Addition.  Folks are free to continue to use CERN if they want.

> On 22 Nov 2019, at 19:39, Mark Roszko  wrote:
> 
> > I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> website main page.  
> 
> But is it in addition to or to replace CERN?
> 
> 
> 
> On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 12:03 PM Wayne Stambaugh  > wrote:
> I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has joined the
> Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
> project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to donate to
> KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can spend donation
> money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with CERN and
> you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your preference.  You
> should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.
> 
> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> website main page.  If someone would please point me to the correct
> place in the website source where I need to do this, I would appreciate
> it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation link is
> https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad 
> .
> 
> Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook page?  I
> didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so I could
> post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.
> 
> I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential donor
> visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.  Thank you all
> for your continued support.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Wayne
> 
> ___
> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers 
> 
> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net 
> 
> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers 
> 
> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Mark
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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Jeff Young]

Hi Brian,

If you double-click into the left channel you’ll see Q101.  If you double-click 
into the right, you’ll see Q201.  So it looks like there are two.  But if you 
edit either one it goes back to a single file so both will be changed.

(To be honest I’ve never used this feature, so I’m not 100% sure the above is 
correct.  But I’m pretty sure.)

My guess is there’s a tutorial somewhere; perhaps Wayne or JP could comment?

Cheers,
Jeff.


> On 22 Nov 2019, at 19:42, Brian  wrote:
> 
> Hi Jeff,
> 
> Thanks for helping me understand this.  So how would someone looking at the 
> schematic know that this one symbol represents both Q101 and Q201?  For that 
> matter, if there's some instructions or a tutorial about creating a situation 
> like this (one schematic drawing representing multiple instances of the 
> subcircuit on the pcb), I'd be interested to learn it.  I have a couple 
> projects in the pipeline where I might find this feature useful; in the past, 
> I've manually copy/pasted sections of a schematic to repeat subcircuits.
> 
> Thanks,
> -Brian
> 
> On 11/22/19 2:37 PM, Jeff Young wrote:
>> Hi Brian,
>> 
>> Imagine you’re doing an audio amplifier.  Your main schematic sheet has 4 
>> subsheets: PSU, control logic, left channel and right channel.  Both left 
>> channel and right channel point to the same sub-page.  So there’s a single 
>> schematic symbol for each part in the left & right channel, which gets 
>> annotated as two different references (ie: Q101 and Q201), and attached to 
>> two different footprints.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Jeff.
>> 
>>> On 22 Nov 2019, at 19:29, Brian >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> From the peanut gallery:
>>> 
>>> Can someone tell me an example use-case for a single schematic symbol 
>>> corresponding to multiple board entities within a single project?
>>> 
>>> As perhaps a rather naïve PCB designer, it seems like mostly a bad idea to 
>>> me to have anything other than 1:1.
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> -Brian Henning 
>>> 
 On Nov 22, 2019, at 1:44 PM, Brian Piccioni >>> > wrote:
 
 
 Wayne 
  
 I thought I would weigh in as I am collaborating with Alexander.
  
 If a designer manually re-annotates a board and schematics he would follow 
 a number of steps:
  
 Ensure the schematics, PCB, and netlist are coherent and without error 
 (I.e. nothing in the schematics or PCB which is not in the other, netlist 
 corresponds to schematic and PCB);
 Manually edit each component on the board and keep a record of every 
 change in a “change list”;
 Manually edit the schematic in accordance with the “change list”;
 Regenerate the netlist;
 Update PCB from schematics;
 Verify that the schematics and PCB are still coherent.
  
 Manually editing the schematic would consist of going from component to 
 component, looking up the component ref des in the “change list”, changing 
 the ref des to the new value, and moving to the next component. The final 
 step would only be necessary due to the near certainty that manual 
 re-annotation would have introduced errors.
  
 This is, more or less, what I do in my standalone application. 
 Unfortunately, I also run roughshod over timestamps, etc.. Nonetheless, 
 the application has been well received and appears to be used a fair bit.
  
 If we were to write a demon (probably the wrong term) which essentially 
 did the same steps, would that address your concerns?
  
 Of course, we would use Kiway to accomplish the transfers but the approach 
 would be pretty much identical to a manual re-annotation except far less 
 likely to introduce errors.
  
 If that would not work, can you please explain why? Perhaps if we 
 understand why we can suggest solutions.
  
 Brian
  
 From: Wayne Stambaugh 
 Sent: November 22, 2019 12:03 PM
 To: Alexander Shuklin 
 Cc: KiCad Developers 
 Subject: Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB
  
 I would prefer that you did ask questions rather than spending a lot of
 development time on a solution that would not be accepted because it
 breaks things.  This is not a trivial problem although it may appear
 that way.  There are plenty of ways to implement back annotation that
 will break things in unexpected ways.  There are a very few ways to not
 break things.  This is why I'm telling you this.  If you don't care
 about the schematic and the board references being synchronized, then
 back-annotation isn't really necessary.  As soon as you attempt to
 back-annotated the schematic from the board, all of the issues that I
 have previously discussed come in to play and have to be addressed.
  
 On 11/22/19 9:53 AM, 

Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Brian]

Hi Jeff,

Thanks for helping me understand this.  So how would someone looking at 
the schematic know that this one symbol represents both Q101 and Q201?  
For that matter, if there's some instructions or a tutorial about 
creating a situation like this (one schematic drawing representing 
multiple instances of the subcircuit on the pcb), I'd be interested to 
learn it.  I have a couple projects in the pipeline where I might find 
this feature useful; in the past, I've manually copy/pasted sections of 
a schematic to repeat subcircuits.


Thanks,
-Brian

On 11/22/19 2:37 PM, Jeff Young wrote:

Hi Brian,

Imagine you’re doing an audio amplifier.  Your main schematic sheet 
has 4 subsheets: PSU, control logic, left channel and right channel. 
 Both left channel and right channel point to the same sub-page.  So 
there’s a single schematic symbol for each part in the left & right 
channel, which gets annotated as two different references (ie: Q101 
and Q201), and attached to two different footprints.


Cheers,
Jeff.

On 22 Nov 2019, at 19:29, Brian > wrote:


From the peanut gallery:

Can someone tell me an example use-case for a single schematic symbol 
corresponding to multiple board entities within a single project?


As perhaps a rather naïve PCB designer, it seems like mostly a bad 
idea to me to have anything other than 1:1.


Thanks,
-Brian Henning

On Nov 22, 2019, at 1:44 PM, Brian Piccioni 
mailto:br...@documenteddesigns.com>> 
wrote:



Wayne
I thought I would weigh in as I am collaborating with Alexander.
If a designer manually re-annotates a board and schematics he would 
follow a number of steps:


 1. Ensure the schematics, PCB, and netlist are coherent and without
error (I.e. nothing in the schematics or PCB which is not in the
other, netlist corresponds to schematic and PCB);
 2. Manually edit each component on the board and keep a record of
every change in a “change list”;
 3. Manually edit the schematic in accordance with the “change list”;
 4. Regenerate the netlist;
 5. Update PCB from schematics;
 6. Verify that the schematics and PCB are still coherent.

Manually editing the schematic would consist of going from component 
to component, looking up the component ref des in the “change list”, 
changing the ref des to the new value, and moving to the next 
component. The final step would only be necessary due to the near 
certainty that manual re-annotation would have introduced errors.
This is, more or less, what I do in my standalone application. 
Unfortunately, I also run roughshod over timestamps, etc.. 
Nonetheless, the application has been well received and appears to 
be used a fair bit.
If we were to write a demon (probably the wrong term) which 
essentially did the same steps, would that address your concerns?
Of course, we would use Kiway to accomplish the transfers but the 
approach would be pretty much identical to a manual re-annotation 
except far less likely to introduce errors.
If that would not work, can you please explain why? Perhaps if we 
understand why we can suggest solutions.

Brian
*From:*Wayne Stambaugh 
*Sent:*November 22, 2019 12:03 PM
*To:*Alexander Shuklin 
*Cc:*KiCad Developers 
*Subject:*Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB
I would prefer that you did ask questions rather than spending a lot of
development time on a solution that would not be accepted because it
breaks things.  This is not a trivial problem although it may appear
that way.  There are plenty of ways to implement back annotation that
will break things in unexpected ways.  There are a very few ways to not
break things.  This is why I'm telling you this.  If you don't care
about the schematic and the board references being synchronized, then
back-annotation isn't really necessary.  As soon as you attempt to
back-annotated the schematic from the board, all of the issues that I
have previously discussed come in to play and have to be addressed.
On 11/22/19 9:53 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> Excuse me for so much questions. There's plenty of ways how it can be
> done, and I'm quite new, maybe I don't see some simple way.
> I can back up data from pcbnew which is not up to date to schematics,
> after that I call update pcb dialog. Somebody will want to update pcb
> by references and after that I will have pcbnew old data which is not
> up to date either to schematics or layout anymore. I don't think there
> will be straight forward solution how to solve it.
> May I just open update pcb dialog and ask user to care about schematic
> and layout being up to date?
>
> On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 17:16, Wayne Stambaugh 
mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>> wrote:

>>
>> There is no need to create your own dialog.  Just call the update 
board
>> from schematic function before you back annotate. You will have 
to make
>> a temporary copy of your board 

Re: [Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Mark Roszko]

> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
website main page.

But is it in addition to or to replace CERN?



On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 12:03 PM Wayne Stambaugh 
wrote:

> I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has joined the
> Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
> project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to donate to
> KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can spend donation
> money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with CERN and
> you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your preference.  You
> should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.
>
> I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
> website main page.  If someone would please point me to the correct
> place in the website source where I need to do this, I would appreciate
> it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation link is
> https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.
>
> Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook page?  I
> didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so I could
> post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.
>
> I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential donor
> visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.  Thank you all
> for your continued support.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Wayne
>
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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Jeff Young]

Hi Brian,

Imagine you’re doing an audio amplifier.  Your main schematic sheet has 4 
subsheets: PSU, control logic, left channel and right channel.  Both left 
channel and right channel point to the same sub-page.  So there’s a single 
schematic symbol for each part in the left & right channel, which gets 
annotated as two different references (ie: Q101 and Q201), and attached to two 
different footprints.

Cheers,
Jeff.

> On 22 Nov 2019, at 19:29, Brian  wrote:
> 
> From the peanut gallery:
> 
> Can someone tell me an example use-case for a single schematic symbol 
> corresponding to multiple board entities within a single project?
> 
> As perhaps a rather naïve PCB designer, it seems like mostly a bad idea to me 
> to have anything other than 1:1.
> 
> Thanks,
> -Brian Henning 
> 
>> On Nov 22, 2019, at 1:44 PM, Brian Piccioni > > wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Wayne 
>>  
>> I thought I would weigh in as I am collaborating with Alexander.
>>  
>> If a designer manually re-annotates a board and schematics he would follow a 
>> number of steps:
>>  
>> Ensure the schematics, PCB, and netlist are coherent and without error (I.e. 
>> nothing in the schematics or PCB which is not in the other, netlist 
>> corresponds to schematic and PCB);
>> Manually edit each component on the board and keep a record of every change 
>> in a “change list”;
>> Manually edit the schematic in accordance with the “change list”;
>> Regenerate the netlist;
>> Update PCB from schematics;
>> Verify that the schematics and PCB are still coherent.
>>  
>> Manually editing the schematic would consist of going from component to 
>> component, looking up the component ref des in the “change list”, changing 
>> the ref des to the new value, and moving to the next component. The final 
>> step would only be necessary due to the near certainty that manual 
>> re-annotation would have introduced errors.
>>  
>> This is, more or less, what I do in my standalone application. 
>> Unfortunately, I also run roughshod over timestamps, etc.. Nonetheless, the 
>> application has been well received and appears to be used a fair bit.
>>  
>> If we were to write a demon (probably the wrong term) which essentially did 
>> the same steps, would that address your concerns?
>>  
>> Of course, we would use Kiway to accomplish the transfers but the approach 
>> would be pretty much identical to a manual re-annotation except far less 
>> likely to introduce errors.
>>  
>> If that would not work, can you please explain why? Perhaps if we understand 
>> why we can suggest solutions.
>>  
>> Brian
>>  
>> From: Wayne Stambaugh 
>> Sent: November 22, 2019 12:03 PM
>> To: Alexander Shuklin 
>> Cc: KiCad Developers 
>> Subject: Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB
>>  
>> I would prefer that you did ask questions rather than spending a lot of
>> development time on a solution that would not be accepted because it
>> breaks things.  This is not a trivial problem although it may appear
>> that way.  There are plenty of ways to implement back annotation that
>> will break things in unexpected ways.  There are a very few ways to not
>> break things.  This is why I'm telling you this.  If you don't care
>> about the schematic and the board references being synchronized, then
>> back-annotation isn't really necessary.  As soon as you attempt to
>> back-annotated the schematic from the board, all of the issues that I
>> have previously discussed come in to play and have to be addressed.
>>  
>> On 11/22/19 9:53 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
>> > Excuse me for so much questions. There's plenty of ways how it can be
>> > done, and I'm quite new, maybe I don't see some simple way.
>> > I can back up data from pcbnew which is not up to date to schematics,
>> > after that I call update pcb dialog. Somebody will want to update pcb
>> > by references and after that I will have pcbnew old data which is not
>> > up to date either to schematics or layout anymore. I don't think there
>> > will be straight forward solution how to solve it.
>> > May I just open update pcb dialog and ask user to care about schematic
>> > and layout being up to date?
>> >
>> > On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 17:16, Wayne Stambaugh > > > wrote:
>> >> 
>> >> There is no need to create your own dialog.  Just call the update board
>> >> from schematic function before you back annotate.  You will have to make
>> >> a temporary copy of your board reference changes because updating from
>> >> the schematic will clobber any reference changes in the board.
>> >> 
>> >> On 11/22/19 9:13 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
>> >>> Hi Wayne,
>> >>> 
>> >>> I don't want to start PCB update from eeschema straight away, because
>> >>> if you run back-annotation, you already changed some references in
>> >>> layout and you gonna lose it. And probably you can 

Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Brian]

From the peanut gallery:

Can someone tell me an example use-case for a single schematic symbol 
corresponding to multiple board entities within a single project?

As perhaps a rather naïve PCB designer, it seems like mostly a bad idea to me 
to have anything other than 1:1.

Thanks,
-Brian Henning 

> On Nov 22, 2019, at 1:44 PM, Brian Piccioni  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Wayne
>  
> I thought I would weigh in as I am collaborating with Alexander.
>  
> If a designer manually re-annotates a board and schematics he would follow a 
> number of steps:
>  
> Ensure the schematics, PCB, and netlist are coherent and without error (I.e. 
> nothing in the schematics or PCB which is not in the other, netlist 
> corresponds to schematic and PCB);
> Manually edit each component on the board and keep a record of every change 
> in a “change list”;
> Manually edit the schematic in accordance with the “change list”;
> Regenerate the netlist;
> Update PCB from schematics;
> Verify that the schematics and PCB are still coherent.
>  
> Manually editing the schematic would consist of going from component to 
> component, looking up the component ref des in the “change list”, changing 
> the ref des to the new value, and moving to the next component. The final 
> step would only be necessary due to the near certainty that manual 
> re-annotation would have introduced errors.
>  
> This is, more or less, what I do in my standalone application. Unfortunately, 
> I also run roughshod over timestamps, etc.. Nonetheless, the application has 
> been well received and appears to be used a fair bit.
>  
> If we were to write a demon (probably the wrong term) which essentially did 
> the same steps, would that address your concerns?
>  
> Of course, we would use Kiway to accomplish the transfers but the approach 
> would be pretty much identical to a manual re-annotation except far less 
> likely to introduce errors.
>  
> If that would not work, can you please explain why? Perhaps if we understand 
> why we can suggest solutions.
>  
> Brian
>  
> From: Wayne Stambaugh
> Sent: November 22, 2019 12:03 PM
> To: Alexander Shuklin
> Cc: KiCad Developers
> Subject: Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB
>  
> I would prefer that you did ask questions rather than spending a lot of
> development time on a solution that would not be accepted because it
> breaks things.  This is not a trivial problem although it may appear
> that way.  There are plenty of ways to implement back annotation that
> will break things in unexpected ways.  There are a very few ways to not
> break things.  This is why I'm telling you this.  If you don't care
> about the schematic and the board references being synchronized, then
> back-annotation isn't really necessary.  As soon as you attempt to
> back-annotated the schematic from the board, all of the issues that I
> have previously discussed come in to play and have to be addressed.
>  
> On 11/22/19 9:53 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> > Excuse me for so much questions. There's plenty of ways how it can be
> > done, and I'm quite new, maybe I don't see some simple way.
> > I can back up data from pcbnew which is not up to date to schematics,
> > after that I call update pcb dialog. Somebody will want to update pcb
> > by references and after that I will have pcbnew old data which is not
> > up to date either to schematics or layout anymore. I don't think there
> > will be straight forward solution how to solve it.
> > May I just open update pcb dialog and ask user to care about schematic
> > and layout being up to date?
> >
> > On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 17:16, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
> >> 
> >> There is no need to create your own dialog.  Just call the update board
> >> from schematic function before you back annotate.  You will have to make
> >> a temporary copy of your board reference changes because updating from
> >> the schematic will clobber any reference changes in the board.
> >> 
> >> On 11/22/19 9:13 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> >>> Hi Wayne,
> >>> 
> >>> I don't want to start PCB update from eeschema straight away, because
> >>> if you run back-annotation, you already changed some references in
> >>> layout and you gonna lose it. And probably you can get some footprints
> >>> which are not connected to any of components in schematics as there's
> >>> possibility in pcbnew to create them. What I almost done is reporting
> >>> about all errors in dialog (I currently use annotation dialog in
> >>> eeschema, but I can create my own if it necessary), and if there's any
> >>> errors, it will not allow you to back-annotate. It will ask you to fix
> >>> them first.
> >>> But if you want, I can run "update pcb from schematic" dialog.
> >>> 
> >>> On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 16:30, Wayne Stambaugh  
> >>> wrote:
>  
>  Hi Alexander,
>  
>  You must ensure that all of the reference paths are up to date with the
>  schematic before you attempt to back annotate from the board.  Schematic

Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Brian Piccioni]

Wayne  I thought I would weigh in as I am collaborating with Alexander. If a designer manually re-annotates a board and schematics he would follow a number of steps: Ensure the schematics, PCB, and netlist are coherent and without error (I.e. nothing in the schematics or PCB which is not in the other, netlist corresponds to schematic and PCB);Manually edit each component on the board and keep a record of every change in a “change list”;Manually edit the schematic in accordance with the “change list”;Regenerate the netlist;Update PCB from schematics;Verify that the schematics and PCB are still coherent. Manually editing the schematic would consist of going from component to component, looking up the component ref des in the “change list”, changing the ref des to the new value, and moving to the next component. The final step would only be necessary due to the near certainty that manual re-annotation would have introduced errors. This is, more or less, what I do in my standalone application. Unfortunately, I also run roughshod over timestamps, etc.. Nonetheless, the application has been well received and appears to be used a fair bit. If we were to write a demon (probably the wrong term) which essentially did the same steps, would that address your concerns? Of course, we would use Kiway to accomplish the transfers but the approach would be pretty much identical to a manual re-annotation except far less likely to introduce errors. If that would not work, can you please explain why? Perhaps if we understand why we can suggest solutions. Brian From: Wayne StambaughSent: November 22, 2019 12:03 PMTo: Alexander ShuklinCc: KiCad DevelopersSubject: Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB I would prefer that you did ask questions rather than spending a lot ofdevelopment time on a solution that would not be accepted because itbreaks things.  This is not a trivial problem although it may appearthat way.  There are plenty of ways to implement back annotation thatwill break things in unexpected ways.  There are a very few ways to notbreak things.  This is why I'm telling you this.  If you don't careabout the schematic and the board references being synchronized, thenback-annotation isn't really necessary.  As soon as you attempt toback-annotated the schematic from the board, all of the issues that Ihave previously discussed come in to play and have to be addressed. On 11/22/19 9:53 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:> Excuse me for so much questions. There's plenty of ways how it can be> done, and I'm quite new, maybe I don't see some simple way.> I can back up data from pcbnew which is not up to date to schematics,> after that I call update pcb dialog. Somebody will want to update pcb> by references and after that I will have pcbnew old data which is not> up to date either to schematics or layout anymore. I don't think there> will be straight forward solution how to solve it.> May I just open update pcb dialog and ask user to care about schematic> and layout being up to date?> > On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 17:16, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:>> >> There is no need to create your own dialog.  Just call the update board>> from schematic function before you back annotate.  You will have to make>> a temporary copy of your board reference changes because updating from>> the schematic will clobber any reference changes in the board.>> >> On 11/22/19 9:13 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:>>> Hi Wayne,>>> >>> I don't want to start PCB update from eeschema straight away, because>>> if you run back-annotation, you already changed some references in>>> layout and you gonna lose it. And probably you can get some footprints>>> which are not connected to any of components in schematics as there's>>> possibility in pcbnew to create them. What I almost done is reporting>>> about all errors in dialog (I currently use annotation dialog in>>> eeschema, but I can create my own if it necessary), and if there's any>>> errors, it will not allow you to back-annotate. It will ask you to fix>>> them first.>>> But if you want, I can run "update pcb from schematic" dialog.>>> >>> On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 16:30, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:  Hi Alexander,  You must ensure that all of the reference paths are up to date with the schematic before you attempt to back annotate from the board.  Schematic changes can result in the footprint paths in the board being out of sync so you have to perform and update board from schematic (this code already exists) before you attempt to run the back annotation process from the board editor to ensure all of the paths are up to date.  This will ensure when you back annotate that there is a one to one correlation between board footprint sheet paths and schematic symbol sheet paths.  Cheers,  Wayne  On 11/22/19 1:18 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:> Hi Wayne,> thanks for answer.> Hopefully I will show you commit soon, so team could look, check 

Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH] Selection appearance options

[Seth Hillbrand]

On 11/21/19 8:01 AM, Jonatan Liljedahl wrote:

Hi,

Here comes two patches regarding the selection appearance.

Patch #1: Adds three new options in the settings dialog:

- Draw selected text items as box
Instead of drawing a stroked shadow behind the text, a rounded
rectangle is drawn according to the text boundary box.

- Draw selected child items
When disabled, only the main selected item is drawn with the selection
shadow, not the various fields and pin names etc. Default is enabled
(current behaviour)

- Fill selected shapes
Any selected shapes has their selection shadow filled, instead of just
drawing along the lines.

See attached screenshots for a demonstration of some various
combinations of these settings.

Patch #2: Tweaks the amount of zoom-level impact on the selection
shadow thickness, to get a more coherent look while zooming. You need
to try this in action to know if it's good (I think it is).

Cheers

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Hi Jonatan-

Thanks for this patch.  I'll give this a test run this weekend.  I know 
that the Mac display of highlight was always a bit different than Linux, 
so it would be good if one of our Mac devs also tested for issues.


Best-
Seth

--
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Seth Hillbrand
*Lead Developer*
+1-530-302-5483‬ 
Davis, CA
www.kipro-pcb.com  i...@kipro-pcb.com 

https://twitter.com/KiProEDA  
https://www.linkedin.com/company/kicad 



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Re: [Kicad-developers] 5.1.5 release tag

[Adam Wolf]

Of course, while there could be bugs in anything at any time :) the
main thing I'm concerned about is that I recently made a change to the
packager that builds release builds with a release version of
wxwidgets.   We were getting debug assertions popping up sometimes
(which are in Launchpad) on the nightlies, and Wayne and a few other
folks said let's make the releases not do that.  This is the first
release since then, so I'm just a little cautious.

Adam

On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 9:51 AM Andy Peters  wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Nov 22, 2019, at 8:02 AM, Adam Wolf  
> > wrote:
> >
> > If folks on 10.14 or 10.15 could test
> > https://kicad-downloads.s3.cern.ch/osx/stable/kicad-unified-5.1.5-rc1-10_14.dmg,
> > and anyone still on 10.13 or lower could test
> > https://kicad-downloads.s3.cern.ch/osx/stable/kicad-unified-5.1.5-rc2.dmg,
> > that would be great.
>
> I have all three. Will do so this weekend.
>
> -a
>
>
> >
> > Adam
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 20, 2019 at 7:11 PM Adam Wolf  
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> I set rc1 to build earlier today.  I can upload it when it finishes and if 
> >> folks can test it, I can easily rebuild as 5.1.5 tomorrow!
> >>
> >> On Wed, Nov 20, 2019, 4:59 PM Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I'm willing to push the release date up if the MacOS package is ready.
> >>> Just let me know.
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>>
> >>> Wayne
> >>>
> >>> On 11/20/19 5:46 PM, Nick Østergaard wrote:
>  5.1.5 is fairly well rolled out now, thanks to various good people :)
> 
>  To make the release official, I think we are only needing the macos
>  build. @Adam Wolf  if you need any help, please speak up.
> 
> 
>  Nick
> 
>  On Wed, 20 Nov 2019 at 19:33, Steven A. Falco  
>  wrote:
> >
> > Fedora Rawhide has 5.1.5 now.  Fedora 30 and 31 will have 5.1.5 in a 
> > week or so, depending on whether we get any karma.
> >
> > Also of note - as of 5.1.5 we are now using OCC on all builds.  OCE is 
> > no longer needed for current Fedora releases.
> >
> >Steve
> >
> > On 11/17/19 11:56 AM, Rene Pöschl wrote:
> >> Libraries have been tagged.
> >>
> >> On 14/11/2019 18:36, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
> >>> The 5.1 branch has been tagged for 5.1.5 and the source archive has be
> >>> uploaded to launchpad.  Please tag the library, doc, and translation
> >>> repos so we can fire up those packages builders.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>>
> >>> Wayne
> >>>
> >>> On 11/13/19 3:55 PM, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
>  It's been a couple of weeks since 5.1.5-rc1 was tagged and everything
>  seems to have stabilized nicely.  I'm going to tag 5.1.5 tomorrow 
>  around
>  noon EST unless something comes up.  I'm assuming the libraries,
>  documentation, and translations are ready to go and that it shouldn't
>  take too long to get most of the installer packages build and 
>  uploaded
>  to the KiCad website.  I would like to make the release announcement 
>  on
>  Wednesday, November 27th.  It would be something to be thankful for
>  leading into the US Thanksgiving Holiday.  If there are any issues 
>  with
>  this date, please let me know.  Thank you everyone for your continued
>  support of the KiCad project.
> 
>  Cheers,
> 
>  Wayne
> 
> >>> ___
> >>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
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> >>
> >>
> >>
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> >>>
> >>> ___
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> > 

Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Wayne Stambaugh]

I would prefer that you did ask questions rather than spending a lot of
development time on a solution that would not be accepted because it
breaks things.  This is not a trivial problem although it may appear
that way.  There are plenty of ways to implement back annotation that
will break things in unexpected ways.  There are a very few ways to not
break things.  This is why I'm telling you this.  If you don't care
about the schematic and the board references being synchronized, then
back-annotation isn't really necessary.  As soon as you attempt to
back-annotated the schematic from the board, all of the issues that I
have previously discussed come in to play and have to be addressed.

On 11/22/19 9:53 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> Excuse me for so much questions. There's plenty of ways how it can be
> done, and I'm quite new, maybe I don't see some simple way.
> I can back up data from pcbnew which is not up to date to schematics,
> after that I call update pcb dialog. Somebody will want to update pcb
> by references and after that I will have pcbnew old data which is not
> up to date either to schematics or layout anymore. I don't think there
> will be straight forward solution how to solve it.
> May I just open update pcb dialog and ask user to care about schematic
> and layout being up to date?
> 
> On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 17:16, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>>
>> There is no need to create your own dialog.  Just call the update board
>> from schematic function before you back annotate.  You will have to make
>> a temporary copy of your board reference changes because updating from
>> the schematic will clobber any reference changes in the board.
>>
>> On 11/22/19 9:13 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
>>> Hi Wayne,
>>>
>>> I don't want to start PCB update from eeschema straight away, because
>>> if you run back-annotation, you already changed some references in
>>> layout and you gonna lose it. And probably you can get some footprints
>>> which are not connected to any of components in schematics as there's
>>> possibility in pcbnew to create them. What I almost done is reporting
>>> about all errors in dialog (I currently use annotation dialog in
>>> eeschema, but I can create my own if it necessary), and if there's any
>>> errors, it will not allow you to back-annotate. It will ask you to fix
>>> them first.
>>> But if you want, I can run "update pcb from schematic" dialog.
>>>
>>> On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 16:30, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:

 Hi Alexander,

 You must ensure that all of the reference paths are up to date with the
 schematic before you attempt to back annotate from the board.  Schematic
 changes can result in the footprint paths in the board being out of sync
 so you have to perform and update board from schematic (this code
 already exists) before you attempt to run the back annotation process
 from the board editor to ensure all of the paths are up to date.  This
 will ensure when you back annotate that there is a one to one
 correlation between board footprint sheet paths and schematic symbol
 sheet paths.

 Cheers,

 Wayne

 On 11/22/19 1:18 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> Hi Wayne,
> thanks for answer.
> Hopefully I will show you commit soon, so team could look, check and
> suggest something about that. I'm aware about differences between
> PCBnew and eeschema and just now I'm writing algorithm that will check
> it.
> Do you mean that some schematic file(.sch) can be used in more than
> one projects? So, I don't plan to change the unique IDs and those
> components will still be linked to each other, but if references will
> be changed it will make a mess in another project.
> I have 3 ideas how I can deal with that:
> 1) create a dialog, which will say something like "please make sure,
> that your schematic files are not shared between different projects"
> 2) I can go by recently opened projects, parse schematics in each of
> them and look if any schematic uses sheet, which already in use in
> current project. I'm now sure, but I would presume, that it will be
> quite slow.
> 3) To hold information in what project this particular schematics was
> used. So that's should be saved in .sch file then. But I don't think
> that information will be very valuable.
>
>
> On Thu, 21 Nov 2019 at 00:07, Wayne Stambaugh  
> wrote:
>>
>> On 11/7/19 5:06 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> is it alright to answer anybody in one letter?
>>> First of all, don't take amiss if I keep silence for a day, as I have
>>> 2 little children and at the best case I have couple of hours a day on
>>> my own.
>>>
>>> On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 16:27, Wayne Stambaugh  
>>> wrote:
 Complex schematic hierarchies (using the same schematic more than once 
 in a design) always trips up new developers.
>>> 

[Kicad-developers] KiCad joins the Linux Foundation

[Wayne Stambaugh]

I just pushed a blog post to the KiCad website that KiCad has joined the
Linux Foundation so consider this the official announcement.  The
project did this to give donors a choice of how they want to donate to
KiCad and it gives us some more flexibility on how we can spend donation
money.  This does not in any way change our relationship with CERN and
you can continue to donate via CERN if that is your preference.  You
should be seeing announcements from the Linux Foundation shortly.

I need to add a "Donate via Linux Foundation" button to the KiCad
website main page.  If someone would please point me to the correct
place in the website source where I need to do this, I would appreciate
it.  If you would rather do it yourself, the KiCad LF donation link is
https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad.

Who has the account login information for the KiCad Facebook page?  I
didn't create this so it would be nice if I had edit access so I could
post announcements there instead of asking someone else to do it.

I hope joining the Linux Foundation will improve our potential donor
visibility so we can continue to grow the KiCad project.  Thank you all
for your continued support.

Cheers,

Wayne

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[Kicad-developers] What does "when in doubt do it opposite than certain other pcb tool" stand for?

[Rene Pöschl]

Hi guys,


the roadmap has the following section:

> Study ergonomics of various commercial/proprietary PCB 
 applications (when 
in doubt about any particular UI solution, check how it has been done in 
a certain proprietary app that is very popular among OSHW folks and do 
exactly opposite).



I would assume this is referencing version 6 of eagle. The current 
versions of eagle are actually something that can (in some aspects) be 
used as a good example. I would therefore assume that this sentence is 
simply out of date and could be removed or at least reworded.



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Re: [Kicad-developers] 5.1.5 release tag

[Andy Peters]

> On Nov 22, 2019, at 8:02 AM, Adam Wolf  wrote:
> 
> If folks on 10.14 or 10.15 could test
> https://kicad-downloads.s3.cern.ch/osx/stable/kicad-unified-5.1.5-rc1-10_14.dmg,
> and anyone still on 10.13 or lower could test
> https://kicad-downloads.s3.cern.ch/osx/stable/kicad-unified-5.1.5-rc2.dmg,
> that would be great.

I have all three. Will do so this weekend.

-a


> 
> Adam
> 
> On Wed, Nov 20, 2019 at 7:11 PM Adam Wolf  
> wrote:
>> 
>> I set rc1 to build earlier today.  I can upload it when it finishes and if 
>> folks can test it, I can easily rebuild as 5.1.5 tomorrow!
>> 
>> On Wed, Nov 20, 2019, 4:59 PM Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I'm willing to push the release date up if the MacOS package is ready.
>>> Just let me know.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> 
>>> Wayne
>>> 
>>> On 11/20/19 5:46 PM, Nick Østergaard wrote:
 5.1.5 is fairly well rolled out now, thanks to various good people :)
 
 To make the release official, I think we are only needing the macos
 build. @Adam Wolf  if you need any help, please speak up.
 
 
 Nick
 
 On Wed, 20 Nov 2019 at 19:33, Steven A. Falco  
 wrote:
> 
> Fedora Rawhide has 5.1.5 now.  Fedora 30 and 31 will have 5.1.5 in a week 
> or so, depending on whether we get any karma.
> 
> Also of note - as of 5.1.5 we are now using OCC on all builds.  OCE is no 
> longer needed for current Fedora releases.
> 
>Steve
> 
> On 11/17/19 11:56 AM, Rene Pöschl wrote:
>> Libraries have been tagged.
>> 
>> On 14/11/2019 18:36, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
>>> The 5.1 branch has been tagged for 5.1.5 and the source archive has be
>>> uploaded to launchpad.  Please tag the library, doc, and translation
>>> repos so we can fire up those packages builders.
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> 
>>> Wayne
>>> 
>>> On 11/13/19 3:55 PM, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
 It's been a couple of weeks since 5.1.5-rc1 was tagged and everything
 seems to have stabilized nicely.  I'm going to tag 5.1.5 tomorrow 
 around
 noon EST unless something comes up.  I'm assuming the libraries,
 documentation, and translations are ready to go and that it shouldn't
 take too long to get most of the installer packages build and uploaded
 to the KiCad website.  I would like to make the release announcement on
 Wednesday, November 27th.  It would be something to be thankful for
 leading into the US Thanksgiving Holiday.  If there are any issues with
 this date, please let me know.  Thank you everyone for your continued
 support of the KiCad project.
 
 Cheers,
 
 Wayne
 
>>> ___
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>> 
>> 
>> 
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> 
> 
> ___
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>>> 
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Andy Peters
5511 E Rosewood St
Tucson, AZ 85711
520-907-2262
de...@latke.net




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Re: [Kicad-developers] 5.1.5 release tag

[Adam Wolf]

If folks on 10.14 or 10.15 could test
https://kicad-downloads.s3.cern.ch/osx/stable/kicad-unified-5.1.5-rc1-10_14.dmg,
and anyone still on 10.13 or lower could test
https://kicad-downloads.s3.cern.ch/osx/stable/kicad-unified-5.1.5-rc2.dmg,
that would be great.

Adam

On Wed, Nov 20, 2019 at 7:11 PM Adam Wolf  wrote:
>
> I set rc1 to build earlier today.  I can upload it when it finishes and if 
> folks can test it, I can easily rebuild as 5.1.5 tomorrow!
>
> On Wed, Nov 20, 2019, 4:59 PM Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>>
>> I'm willing to push the release date up if the MacOS package is ready.
>> Just let me know.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Wayne
>>
>> On 11/20/19 5:46 PM, Nick Østergaard wrote:
>> > 5.1.5 is fairly well rolled out now, thanks to various good people :)
>> >
>> > To make the release official, I think we are only needing the macos
>> > build. @Adam Wolf  if you need any help, please speak up.
>> >
>> >
>> > Nick
>> >
>> > On Wed, 20 Nov 2019 at 19:33, Steven A. Falco  
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Fedora Rawhide has 5.1.5 now.  Fedora 30 and 31 will have 5.1.5 in a week 
>> >> or so, depending on whether we get any karma.
>> >>
>> >> Also of note - as of 5.1.5 we are now using OCC on all builds.  OCE is no 
>> >> longer needed for current Fedora releases.
>> >>
>> >> Steve
>> >>
>> >> On 11/17/19 11:56 AM, Rene Pöschl wrote:
>> >>> Libraries have been tagged.
>> >>>
>> >>> On 14/11/2019 18:36, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
>>  The 5.1 branch has been tagged for 5.1.5 and the source archive has be
>>  uploaded to launchpad.  Please tag the library, doc, and translation
>>  repos so we can fire up those packages builders.
>> 
>>  Thanks,
>> 
>>  Wayne
>> 
>>  On 11/13/19 3:55 PM, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
>> > It's been a couple of weeks since 5.1.5-rc1 was tagged and everything
>> > seems to have stabilized nicely.  I'm going to tag 5.1.5 tomorrow 
>> > around
>> > noon EST unless something comes up.  I'm assuming the libraries,
>> > documentation, and translations are ready to go and that it shouldn't
>> > take too long to get most of the installer packages build and uploaded
>> > to the KiCad website.  I would like to make the release announcement on
>> > Wednesday, November 27th.  It would be something to be thankful for
>> > leading into the US Thanksgiving Holiday.  If there are any issues with
>> > this date, please let me know.  Thank you everyone for your continued
>> > support of the KiCad project.
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> >
>> > Wayne
>> >
>>  ___
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>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> ___
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>> >>
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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Alexander Shuklin]

Excuse me for so much questions. There's plenty of ways how it can be
done, and I'm quite new, maybe I don't see some simple way.
I can back up data from pcbnew which is not up to date to schematics,
after that I call update pcb dialog. Somebody will want to update pcb
by references and after that I will have pcbnew old data which is not
up to date either to schematics or layout anymore. I don't think there
will be straight forward solution how to solve it.
May I just open update pcb dialog and ask user to care about schematic
and layout being up to date?

On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 17:16, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>
> There is no need to create your own dialog.  Just call the update board
> from schematic function before you back annotate.  You will have to make
> a temporary copy of your board reference changes because updating from
> the schematic will clobber any reference changes in the board.
>
> On 11/22/19 9:13 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> > Hi Wayne,
> >
> > I don't want to start PCB update from eeschema straight away, because
> > if you run back-annotation, you already changed some references in
> > layout and you gonna lose it. And probably you can get some footprints
> > which are not connected to any of components in schematics as there's
> > possibility in pcbnew to create them. What I almost done is reporting
> > about all errors in dialog (I currently use annotation dialog in
> > eeschema, but I can create my own if it necessary), and if there's any
> > errors, it will not allow you to back-annotate. It will ask you to fix
> > them first.
> > But if you want, I can run "update pcb from schematic" dialog.
> >
> > On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 16:30, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi Alexander,
> >>
> >> You must ensure that all of the reference paths are up to date with the
> >> schematic before you attempt to back annotate from the board.  Schematic
> >> changes can result in the footprint paths in the board being out of sync
> >> so you have to perform and update board from schematic (this code
> >> already exists) before you attempt to run the back annotation process
> >> from the board editor to ensure all of the paths are up to date.  This
> >> will ensure when you back annotate that there is a one to one
> >> correlation between board footprint sheet paths and schematic symbol
> >> sheet paths.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >>
> >> Wayne
> >>
> >> On 11/22/19 1:18 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> >>> Hi Wayne,
> >>> thanks for answer.
> >>> Hopefully I will show you commit soon, so team could look, check and
> >>> suggest something about that. I'm aware about differences between
> >>> PCBnew and eeschema and just now I'm writing algorithm that will check
> >>> it.
> >>> Do you mean that some schematic file(.sch) can be used in more than
> >>> one projects? So, I don't plan to change the unique IDs and those
> >>> components will still be linked to each other, but if references will
> >>> be changed it will make a mess in another project.
> >>> I have 3 ideas how I can deal with that:
> >>> 1) create a dialog, which will say something like "please make sure,
> >>> that your schematic files are not shared between different projects"
> >>> 2) I can go by recently opened projects, parse schematics in each of
> >>> them and look if any schematic uses sheet, which already in use in
> >>> current project. I'm now sure, but I would presume, that it will be
> >>> quite slow.
> >>> 3) To hold information in what project this particular schematics was
> >>> used. So that's should be saved in .sch file then. But I don't think
> >>> that information will be very valuable.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, 21 Nov 2019 at 00:07, Wayne Stambaugh  
> >>> wrote:
> 
>  On 11/7/19 5:06 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> > Hi,
> > is it alright to answer anybody in one letter?
> > First of all, don't take amiss if I keep silence for a day, as I have
> > 2 little children and at the best case I have couple of hours a day on
> > my own.
> >
> > On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 16:27, Wayne Stambaugh  
> > wrote:
> >> Complex schematic hierarchies (using the same schematic more than once 
> >> in a design) always trips up new developers.
> > Can you please explain a bit more? I know that you can use
> > hierarchical sheets, so there will be more than one sch files in the
> > schematic. And there's also "multi-symbols" which have few eeschema
> > symbols but one footprint. I'm not quite understand what means "using
> > the same schematic more than once in a design", as every symbol has
> > unique ID. Is it something else I'm not aware of?
> 
>  Yes, every symbol has a unique path ID but that doesn't mean that the
>  board and the schematic will always be in sync so this is where issues
>  come into play.  There also can be unique IDs from other projects
>  because schematics can be shared between projects so you have to be
>  careful not to break all of 

Re: [Kicad-developers] Building Kicad on Windows 10/Eclipse/Msys2

[Brian Piccioni]

Simon  I have never figured out how to use git to fetch sources. If you can direct me to something like a Linux command line example I would appreciate it otherwise I’ll set it as a background task. Brian From: Simon RichterSent: November 22, 2019 6:46 AMTo: kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.netSubject: Re: [Kicad-developers] Building Kicad on Windows 10/Eclipse/Msys2 Hi, On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 09:30:48PM -0500, Brian Piccioni wrote: > Download the Kicad source files from https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-source-mirror> Untar or unzip into /home/kicad-source-mirror-master This probably should be "use git to get the source tree", otherwise I thinkthis might be a valuable addition to the website.    Simon ___Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developersPost to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.netUnsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developersMore help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp 

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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Wayne Stambaugh]

There is no need to create your own dialog.  Just call the update board
from schematic function before you back annotate.  You will have to make
a temporary copy of your board reference changes because updating from
the schematic will clobber any reference changes in the board.

On 11/22/19 9:13 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> Hi Wayne,
> 
> I don't want to start PCB update from eeschema straight away, because
> if you run back-annotation, you already changed some references in
> layout and you gonna lose it. And probably you can get some footprints
> which are not connected to any of components in schematics as there's
> possibility in pcbnew to create them. What I almost done is reporting
> about all errors in dialog (I currently use annotation dialog in
> eeschema, but I can create my own if it necessary), and if there's any
> errors, it will not allow you to back-annotate. It will ask you to fix
> them first.
> But if you want, I can run "update pcb from schematic" dialog.
> 
> On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 16:30, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>>
>> Hi Alexander,
>>
>> You must ensure that all of the reference paths are up to date with the
>> schematic before you attempt to back annotate from the board.  Schematic
>> changes can result in the footprint paths in the board being out of sync
>> so you have to perform and update board from schematic (this code
>> already exists) before you attempt to run the back annotation process
>> from the board editor to ensure all of the paths are up to date.  This
>> will ensure when you back annotate that there is a one to one
>> correlation between board footprint sheet paths and schematic symbol
>> sheet paths.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Wayne
>>
>> On 11/22/19 1:18 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
>>> Hi Wayne,
>>> thanks for answer.
>>> Hopefully I will show you commit soon, so team could look, check and
>>> suggest something about that. I'm aware about differences between
>>> PCBnew and eeschema and just now I'm writing algorithm that will check
>>> it.
>>> Do you mean that some schematic file(.sch) can be used in more than
>>> one projects? So, I don't plan to change the unique IDs and those
>>> components will still be linked to each other, but if references will
>>> be changed it will make a mess in another project.
>>> I have 3 ideas how I can deal with that:
>>> 1) create a dialog, which will say something like "please make sure,
>>> that your schematic files are not shared between different projects"
>>> 2) I can go by recently opened projects, parse schematics in each of
>>> them and look if any schematic uses sheet, which already in use in
>>> current project. I'm now sure, but I would presume, that it will be
>>> quite slow.
>>> 3) To hold information in what project this particular schematics was
>>> used. So that's should be saved in .sch file then. But I don't think
>>> that information will be very valuable.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, 21 Nov 2019 at 00:07, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:

 On 11/7/19 5:06 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> Hi,
> is it alright to answer anybody in one letter?
> First of all, don't take amiss if I keep silence for a day, as I have
> 2 little children and at the best case I have couple of hours a day on
> my own.
>
> On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 16:27, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>> Complex schematic hierarchies (using the same schematic more than once 
>> in a design) always trips up new developers.
> Can you please explain a bit more? I know that you can use
> hierarchical sheets, so there will be more than one sch files in the
> schematic. And there's also "multi-symbols" which have few eeschema
> symbols but one footprint. I'm not quite understand what means "using
> the same schematic more than once in a design", as every symbol has
> unique ID. Is it something else I'm not aware of?

 Yes, every symbol has a unique path ID but that doesn't mean that the
 board and the schematic will always be in sync so this is where issues
 come into play.  There also can be unique IDs from other projects
 because schematics can be shared between projects so you have to be
 careful not to break all of these cases.

>> You'll want to take a close look at KIWAY::ExpressMail() and 
>> KIWAY_PLAYER::KiwayMailIn()
> Ok, I'll look at that. I think I've seen that in footprints back 
> annotation.
>> This is unfortunate.  Being able to work directly with on of the lead 
>> developers would have made this task a lot easier to understand.  You 
>> are always free to reach out for help on this mailing list.
> Thanks for that. Actually now i think to join FOSDEM, but I need visa
> and I'm not sure yet.
>> Asking first prevents you from working on something that someone else 
>> may already be working on and writing code that would be immediately 
>> rejected
> Actually I already made that mistake, when made board statistics
> dialog. It was 

Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Alexander Shuklin]

Hi Wayne,

I don't want to start PCB update from eeschema straight away, because
if you run back-annotation, you already changed some references in
layout and you gonna lose it. And probably you can get some footprints
which are not connected to any of components in schematics as there's
possibility in pcbnew to create them. What I almost done is reporting
about all errors in dialog (I currently use annotation dialog in
eeschema, but I can create my own if it necessary), and if there's any
errors, it will not allow you to back-annotate. It will ask you to fix
them first.
But if you want, I can run "update pcb from schematic" dialog.

On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 16:30, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>
> Hi Alexander,
>
> You must ensure that all of the reference paths are up to date with the
> schematic before you attempt to back annotate from the board.  Schematic
> changes can result in the footprint paths in the board being out of sync
> so you have to perform and update board from schematic (this code
> already exists) before you attempt to run the back annotation process
> from the board editor to ensure all of the paths are up to date.  This
> will ensure when you back annotate that there is a one to one
> correlation between board footprint sheet paths and schematic symbol
> sheet paths.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Wayne
>
> On 11/22/19 1:18 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> > Hi Wayne,
> > thanks for answer.
> > Hopefully I will show you commit soon, so team could look, check and
> > suggest something about that. I'm aware about differences between
> > PCBnew and eeschema and just now I'm writing algorithm that will check
> > it.
> > Do you mean that some schematic file(.sch) can be used in more than
> > one projects? So, I don't plan to change the unique IDs and those
> > components will still be linked to each other, but if references will
> > be changed it will make a mess in another project.
> > I have 3 ideas how I can deal with that:
> > 1) create a dialog, which will say something like "please make sure,
> > that your schematic files are not shared between different projects"
> > 2) I can go by recently opened projects, parse schematics in each of
> > them and look if any schematic uses sheet, which already in use in
> > current project. I'm now sure, but I would presume, that it will be
> > quite slow.
> > 3) To hold information in what project this particular schematics was
> > used. So that's should be saved in .sch file then. But I don't think
> > that information will be very valuable.
> >
> >
> > On Thu, 21 Nov 2019 at 00:07, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
> >>
> >> On 11/7/19 5:06 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> >>> Hi,
> >>> is it alright to answer anybody in one letter?
> >>> First of all, don't take amiss if I keep silence for a day, as I have
> >>> 2 little children and at the best case I have couple of hours a day on
> >>> my own.
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 16:27, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>  Complex schematic hierarchies (using the same schematic more than once 
>  in a design) always trips up new developers.
> >>> Can you please explain a bit more? I know that you can use
> >>> hierarchical sheets, so there will be more than one sch files in the
> >>> schematic. And there's also "multi-symbols" which have few eeschema
> >>> symbols but one footprint. I'm not quite understand what means "using
> >>> the same schematic more than once in a design", as every symbol has
> >>> unique ID. Is it something else I'm not aware of?
> >>
> >> Yes, every symbol has a unique path ID but that doesn't mean that the
> >> board and the schematic will always be in sync so this is where issues
> >> come into play.  There also can be unique IDs from other projects
> >> because schematics can be shared between projects so you have to be
> >> careful not to break all of these cases.
> >>
>  You'll want to take a close look at KIWAY::ExpressMail() and 
>  KIWAY_PLAYER::KiwayMailIn()
> >>> Ok, I'll look at that. I think I've seen that in footprints back 
> >>> annotation.
>  This is unfortunate.  Being able to work directly with on of the lead 
>  developers would have made this task a lot easier to understand.  You 
>  are always free to reach out for help on this mailing list.
> >>> Thanks for that. Actually now i think to join FOSDEM, but I need visa
> >>> and I'm not sure yet.
>  Asking first prevents you from working on something that someone else 
>  may already be working on and writing code that would be immediately 
>  rejected
> >>> Actually I already made that mistake, when made board statistics
> >>> dialog. It was accepted, but I felt myself really stupid.
>  Good luck and thank you for your interest in contributing to KiCad.
> >>> Thanks! I will try hard to match coding and git polices.
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 17:24, Jon Evans  wrote:
>  Eeschema now keeps its internal net state up to date continuously, but I 
>  didn't work on any continuous syncing to 

Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Wayne Stambaugh]

You got it!  Schematic files can be shared multiple times not only in
the current schematic but multiple times in other project schematics as
well.  You could have a symbol in a schematic file with the same
reference more than once with many different sheet paths.

On 11/22/19 6:55 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> Ooops,
> I just realized what are you own about.
> I wasn't aware that's it is possible to use schematic sheet twice and
> have different references in it according to sheet path. I never used
> it during PCB production :)
> That's not a problem I will use component "path" rather than just
> timestamp. Thanks for tip!
> 
> On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 09:18, Alexander Shuklin  wrote:
>>
>> Hi Wayne,
>> thanks for answer.
>> Hopefully I will show you commit soon, so team could look, check and
>> suggest something about that. I'm aware about differences between
>> PCBnew and eeschema and just now I'm writing algorithm that will check
>> it.
>> Do you mean that some schematic file(.sch) can be used in more than
>> one projects? So, I don't plan to change the unique IDs and those
>> components will still be linked to each other, but if references will
>> be changed it will make a mess in another project.
>> I have 3 ideas how I can deal with that:
>> 1) create a dialog, which will say something like "please make sure,
>> that your schematic files are not shared between different projects"
>> 2) I can go by recently opened projects, parse schematics in each of
>> them and look if any schematic uses sheet, which already in use in
>> current project. I'm now sure, but I would presume, that it will be
>> quite slow.
>> 3) To hold information in what project this particular schematics was
>> used. So that's should be saved in .sch file then. But I don't think
>> that information will be very valuable.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, 21 Nov 2019 at 00:07, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>>>
>>> On 11/7/19 5:06 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
 Hi,
 is it alright to answer anybody in one letter?
 First of all, don't take amiss if I keep silence for a day, as I have
 2 little children and at the best case I have couple of hours a day on
 my own.

 On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 16:27, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
> Complex schematic hierarchies (using the same schematic more than once in 
> a design) always trips up new developers.
 Can you please explain a bit more? I know that you can use
 hierarchical sheets, so there will be more than one sch files in the
 schematic. And there's also "multi-symbols" which have few eeschema
 symbols but one footprint. I'm not quite understand what means "using
 the same schematic more than once in a design", as every symbol has
 unique ID. Is it something else I'm not aware of?
>>>
>>> Yes, every symbol has a unique path ID but that doesn't mean that the
>>> board and the schematic will always be in sync so this is where issues
>>> come into play.  There also can be unique IDs from other projects
>>> because schematics can be shared between projects so you have to be
>>> careful not to break all of these cases.
>>>
> You'll want to take a close look at KIWAY::ExpressMail() and 
> KIWAY_PLAYER::KiwayMailIn()
 Ok, I'll look at that. I think I've seen that in footprints back 
 annotation.
> This is unfortunate.  Being able to work directly with on of the lead 
> developers would have made this task a lot easier to understand.  You are 
> always free to reach out for help on this mailing list.
 Thanks for that. Actually now i think to join FOSDEM, but I need visa
 and I'm not sure yet.
> Asking first prevents you from working on something that someone else may 
> already be working on and writing code that would be immediately rejected
 Actually I already made that mistake, when made board statistics
 dialog. It was accepted, but I felt myself really stupid.
> Good luck and thank you for your interest in contributing to KiCad.
 Thanks! I will try hard to match coding and git polices.

 On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 17:24, Jon Evans  wrote:
> Eeschema now keeps its internal net state up to date continuously, but I 
> didn't work on any continuous syncing to PcbNew.  The way it works in 
> Eeschema, the graphical schematic is still the driving source of truth; 
> the netlist does not drive the schematic.
 Am I right in general idea: Eeschema creates netlist which updates
 continuously. And PCB updates through eeschema by "uppdate PCB from
 schematic" tool. It isn't planned to do that automatically and
 continuously, is it?

 On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 17:56, Brian Piccioni  
 wrote:
> My utility is up on GitHub as a standalone app. I learned enough c++ and 
> wxWidgets so porting it to Kicad should be useful.
 I've seen your app, and bug report. And actually I try to jump in
 because I use geometrical renumber of components as well)))
> Replacing my 

Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH] Eeschema: simulator: use dotted traces for current and phase.

[Wayne Stambaugh]

This would be a great long term solution.  You could also store it in
the project file since it is project specific if you don't want to go
through the effort of designing a new s-expression file format.

On 11/21/19 6:45 PM, Ian McInerney wrote:
> I think it would be good to define a new S-expression config file that
> can be used to store the plot configurations of the simulator. This file
> should just contain the plot information, such as lines displayed, their
> style/color, axis configurations, colors, etc. (and maybe analysis
> parameters, I haven't thought about that part yet). This would allow us
> to add the functionality to open/save plot styles (similar to how a
> Modelsim .do file can be used to save/configure the waveform display,
> but ours won't be a script).
> 
> -Ian
> 
> On Thu, 21 Nov 2019, 22:11 Jon Evans,  > wrote:
> 
> I can add the simulator to the scope of effort to do the whole
> settings files upgrade for 6.0
> 
> On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 5:06 PM Wayne Stambaugh
> mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> 
> 
> On 11/21/19 1:15 PM, Kymatica wrote:
> > Sure, I can make it configurable. Where should this setting be
> available? In the main preferences? (Perhaps a new Simulator
> section there?)
> 
> I would think the simulator will over time have enough user (not
> simulation control) configuration settings that it would have
> it's own
> preferences dialog and that the settings would be saved in a
> separate
> configuration file.  I think at the moment the config settings
> are saved
> in the eeschema config file.
> 
> >
> > /Jonatan
> >
> >> 21 nov. 2019 kl. 18:26 skrev Wayne Stambaugh
> mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>>:
> >>
> >> Hi Jonatan,
> >>
> >> I just tested this and it seems to work as expected although I'm
> >> thinking it might be a good idea to make this a configuration
> option
> >> rather than the only behavior.  Users might not find this
> desirable.
> >> Anyone else have any thoughts on this?  For future reference,
> when you
> >> are going to make behavioral changes to KiCad, please ping
> the dev
> >> mailing list first for feedback.  I would have made the option
> >> suggestion before you began coding.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >>
> >> Wayne
> >>
> >>> On 11/19/19 11:30 AM, Jonatan Liljedahl wrote:
> >>> This patch makes it easier to visually keep apart traces for
> current
> >>> vs voltage and phase vs magnitude, by using dotted line
> style for
> >>> current and phase traces.
> >>>
> >>> To get the dotted style drawn correctly, I had to switch
> from drawing
> >>> each trace line segment individually to creating an array
> and then
> >>> using DrawLines() on it, so that the whole trace is one
> continuous
> >>> line.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >>> Post to     : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> 
> >>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >>> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
> >>>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >> Post to     : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> 
> >> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
> 
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Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH] Eeschema: simulator: use dotted traces for current and phase.

[Wayne Stambaugh]

Makes sense to me.

On 11/21/19 5:10 PM, Jon Evans wrote:
> I can add the simulator to the scope of effort to do the whole settings
> files upgrade for 6.0
> 
> On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 5:06 PM Wayne Stambaugh  > wrote:
> 
> 
> On 11/21/19 1:15 PM, Kymatica wrote:
> > Sure, I can make it configurable. Where should this setting be
> available? In the main preferences? (Perhaps a new Simulator section
> there?)
> 
> I would think the simulator will over time have enough user (not
> simulation control) configuration settings that it would have it's own
> preferences dialog and that the settings would be saved in a separate
> configuration file.  I think at the moment the config settings are saved
> in the eeschema config file.
> 
> >
> > /Jonatan
> >
> >> 21 nov. 2019 kl. 18:26 skrev Wayne Stambaugh
> mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>>:
> >>
> >> Hi Jonatan,
> >>
> >> I just tested this and it seems to work as expected although I'm
> >> thinking it might be a good idea to make this a configuration option
> >> rather than the only behavior.  Users might not find this desirable.
> >> Anyone else have any thoughts on this?  For future reference,
> when you
> >> are going to make behavioral changes to KiCad, please ping the dev
> >> mailing list first for feedback.  I would have made the option
> >> suggestion before you began coding.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >>
> >> Wayne
> >>
> >>> On 11/19/19 11:30 AM, Jonatan Liljedahl wrote:
> >>> This patch makes it easier to visually keep apart traces for current
> >>> vs voltage and phase vs magnitude, by using dotted line style for
> >>> current and phase traces.
> >>>
> >>> To get the dotted style drawn correctly, I had to switch from
> drawing
> >>> each trace line segment individually to creating an array and then
> >>> using DrawLines() on it, so that the whole trace is one continuous
> >>> line.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >>> Post to     : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> 
> >>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >>> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
> >>>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >> Post to     : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> 
> >> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
> >> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
> 
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> 
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Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Wayne Stambaugh]

Hi Alexander,

You must ensure that all of the reference paths are up to date with the
schematic before you attempt to back annotate from the board.  Schematic
changes can result in the footprint paths in the board being out of sync
so you have to perform and update board from schematic (this code
already exists) before you attempt to run the back annotation process
from the board editor to ensure all of the paths are up to date.  This
will ensure when you back annotate that there is a one to one
correlation between board footprint sheet paths and schematic symbol
sheet paths.

Cheers,

Wayne

On 11/22/19 1:18 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> Hi Wayne,
> thanks for answer.
> Hopefully I will show you commit soon, so team could look, check and
> suggest something about that. I'm aware about differences between
> PCBnew and eeschema and just now I'm writing algorithm that will check
> it.
> Do you mean that some schematic file(.sch) can be used in more than
> one projects? So, I don't plan to change the unique IDs and those
> components will still be linked to each other, but if references will
> be changed it will make a mess in another project.
> I have 3 ideas how I can deal with that:
> 1) create a dialog, which will say something like "please make sure,
> that your schematic files are not shared between different projects"
> 2) I can go by recently opened projects, parse schematics in each of
> them and look if any schematic uses sheet, which already in use in
> current project. I'm now sure, but I would presume, that it will be
> quite slow.
> 3) To hold information in what project this particular schematics was
> used. So that's should be saved in .sch file then. But I don't think
> that information will be very valuable.
> 
> 
> On Thu, 21 Nov 2019 at 00:07, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>>
>> On 11/7/19 5:06 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> is it alright to answer anybody in one letter?
>>> First of all, don't take amiss if I keep silence for a day, as I have
>>> 2 little children and at the best case I have couple of hours a day on
>>> my own.
>>>
>>> On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 16:27, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
 Complex schematic hierarchies (using the same schematic more than once in 
 a design) always trips up new developers.
>>> Can you please explain a bit more? I know that you can use
>>> hierarchical sheets, so there will be more than one sch files in the
>>> schematic. And there's also "multi-symbols" which have few eeschema
>>> symbols but one footprint. I'm not quite understand what means "using
>>> the same schematic more than once in a design", as every symbol has
>>> unique ID. Is it something else I'm not aware of?
>>
>> Yes, every symbol has a unique path ID but that doesn't mean that the
>> board and the schematic will always be in sync so this is where issues
>> come into play.  There also can be unique IDs from other projects
>> because schematics can be shared between projects so you have to be
>> careful not to break all of these cases.
>>
 You'll want to take a close look at KIWAY::ExpressMail() and 
 KIWAY_PLAYER::KiwayMailIn()
>>> Ok, I'll look at that. I think I've seen that in footprints back annotation.
 This is unfortunate.  Being able to work directly with on of the lead 
 developers would have made this task a lot easier to understand.  You are 
 always free to reach out for help on this mailing list.
>>> Thanks for that. Actually now i think to join FOSDEM, but I need visa
>>> and I'm not sure yet.
 Asking first prevents you from working on something that someone else may 
 already be working on and writing code that would be immediately rejected
>>> Actually I already made that mistake, when made board statistics
>>> dialog. It was accepted, but I felt myself really stupid.
 Good luck and thank you for your interest in contributing to KiCad.
>>> Thanks! I will try hard to match coding and git polices.
>>>
>>> On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 17:24, Jon Evans  wrote:
 Eeschema now keeps its internal net state up to date continuously, but I 
 didn't work on any continuous syncing to PcbNew.  The way it works in 
 Eeschema, the graphical schematic is still the driving source of truth; 
 the netlist does not drive the schematic.
>>> Am I right in general idea: Eeschema creates netlist which updates
>>> continuously. And PCB updates through eeschema by "uppdate PCB from
>>> schematic" tool. It isn't planned to do that automatically and
>>> continuously, is it?
>>>
>>> On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 17:56, Brian Piccioni  
>>> wrote:
 My utility is up on GitHub as a standalone app. I learned enough c++ and 
 wxWidgets so porting it to Kicad should be useful.
>>> I've seen your app, and bug report. And actually I try to jump in
>>> because I use geometrical renumber of components as well)))
 Replacing my homebrew parsing of PCB, Schematic, and netlist files to 
 calls to internal Kicad functions/methods in the respective apps;
 

Re: [Kicad-developers] Back annotate references from PCB

[Alexander Shuklin]

Ooops,
I just realized what are you own about.
I wasn't aware that's it is possible to use schematic sheet twice and
have different references in it according to sheet path. I never used
it during PCB production :)
That's not a problem I will use component "path" rather than just
timestamp. Thanks for tip!

On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 at 09:18, Alexander Shuklin  wrote:
>
> Hi Wayne,
> thanks for answer.
> Hopefully I will show you commit soon, so team could look, check and
> suggest something about that. I'm aware about differences between
> PCBnew and eeschema and just now I'm writing algorithm that will check
> it.
> Do you mean that some schematic file(.sch) can be used in more than
> one projects? So, I don't plan to change the unique IDs and those
> components will still be linked to each other, but if references will
> be changed it will make a mess in another project.
> I have 3 ideas how I can deal with that:
> 1) create a dialog, which will say something like "please make sure,
> that your schematic files are not shared between different projects"
> 2) I can go by recently opened projects, parse schematics in each of
> them and look if any schematic uses sheet, which already in use in
> current project. I'm now sure, but I would presume, that it will be
> quite slow.
> 3) To hold information in what project this particular schematics was
> used. So that's should be saved in .sch file then. But I don't think
> that information will be very valuable.
>
>
> On Thu, 21 Nov 2019 at 00:07, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
> >
> > On 11/7/19 5:06 AM, Alexander Shuklin wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > > is it alright to answer anybody in one letter?
> > > First of all, don't take amiss if I keep silence for a day, as I have
> > > 2 little children and at the best case I have couple of hours a day on
> > > my own.
> > >
> > > On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 16:27, Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
> > >> Complex schematic hierarchies (using the same schematic more than once 
> > >> in a design) always trips up new developers.
> > > Can you please explain a bit more? I know that you can use
> > > hierarchical sheets, so there will be more than one sch files in the
> > > schematic. And there's also "multi-symbols" which have few eeschema
> > > symbols but one footprint. I'm not quite understand what means "using
> > > the same schematic more than once in a design", as every symbol has
> > > unique ID. Is it something else I'm not aware of?
> >
> > Yes, every symbol has a unique path ID but that doesn't mean that the
> > board and the schematic will always be in sync so this is where issues
> > come into play.  There also can be unique IDs from other projects
> > because schematics can be shared between projects so you have to be
> > careful not to break all of these cases.
> >
> > >> You'll want to take a close look at KIWAY::ExpressMail() and 
> > >> KIWAY_PLAYER::KiwayMailIn()
> > > Ok, I'll look at that. I think I've seen that in footprints back 
> > > annotation.
> > >> This is unfortunate.  Being able to work directly with on of the lead 
> > >> developers would have made this task a lot easier to understand.  You 
> > >> are always free to reach out for help on this mailing list.
> > > Thanks for that. Actually now i think to join FOSDEM, but I need visa
> > > and I'm not sure yet.
> > >> Asking first prevents you from working on something that someone else 
> > >> may already be working on and writing code that would be immediately 
> > >> rejected
> > > Actually I already made that mistake, when made board statistics
> > > dialog. It was accepted, but I felt myself really stupid.
> > >> Good luck and thank you for your interest in contributing to KiCad.
> > > Thanks! I will try hard to match coding and git polices.
> > >
> > > On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 17:24, Jon Evans  wrote:
> > >> Eeschema now keeps its internal net state up to date continuously, but I 
> > >> didn't work on any continuous syncing to PcbNew.  The way it works in 
> > >> Eeschema, the graphical schematic is still the driving source of truth; 
> > >> the netlist does not drive the schematic.
> > > Am I right in general idea: Eeschema creates netlist which updates
> > > continuously. And PCB updates through eeschema by "uppdate PCB from
> > > schematic" tool. It isn't planned to do that automatically and
> > > continuously, is it?
> > >
> > > On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 at 17:56, Brian Piccioni  
> > > wrote:
> > >> My utility is up on GitHub as a standalone app. I learned enough c++ and 
> > >> wxWidgets so porting it to Kicad should be useful.
> > > I've seen your app, and bug report. And actually I try to jump in
> > > because I use geometrical renumber of components as well)))
> > >> Replacing my homebrew parsing of PCB, Schematic, and netlist files to 
> > >> calls to internal Kicad functions/methods in the respective apps;
> > >> Once this is done I’ll use Kiway to communicate the changes between 
> > >> eeSchema and PCBNew.
> > > Have you already start to create communication between 

Re: [Kicad-developers] Building Kicad on Windows 10/Eclipse/Msys2

[Simon Richter]

Hi,

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 09:30:48PM -0500, Brian Piccioni wrote:

> Download the Kicad source files from 
> https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-source-mirror;
> Untar or unzip into /home/kicad-source-mirror-master

This probably should be "use git to get the source tree", otherwise I think
this might be a valuable addition to the website.

   Simon

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Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH] Eeschema: simulator: use dotted traces for current and phase.

[Jonatan Liljedahl]

Also this message didn't reach the list:

On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 12:14 AM Kymatica  wrote:
>
> Hi,
> With quick and easy I wasn’t actually referring to the coding involved, but 
> to the user experience: when I fire up the simulator I (as a user) just want 
> to see the results and look at the plots, with as little confusion as 
> possible regarding which trace is which, or which trace belongs to which 
> scale. I don’t want to configure anything. But perhaps I missunderstood, and 
> that the proposal wasn’t to have style config per trace/signal but per trace 
> type? (Volt, Current, Mag, Phase) Because traces are volatile, you add and 
> remove them many times depending on what you want to see.
>
> /Jonatan
>
> > 21 nov. 2019 kl. 21:55 skrev Wayne Stambaugh :
> >
> > On 11/21/19 2:36 PM, Kymatica wrote:
> >> The idea here was to simply use a different visual style for the traces
> >> that are plotted for the secondary y axis, to make it easy to see which
> >> scale the trace belongs to without having to look it up in the signals 
> >> list.
> >>
> >> Per trace configuration could be nice, at least if preparing images for
> >> presentation. But for everyday simulation work I’d just want it quick
> >> and easy.
> >
> > I understand the temptation to do the quick and easy hack.  We have all
> > done it.  From a project maintenance perspective, allowing developers to
> > merge their personal quick hacks quickly makes a mess of the KiCad code
> > base.  This is why I would prefer that we carefully consider what trace
> > drawing options we want to support so we can design a solution that
> > works over the long term.
> >
> >>
> >> /Jonatan
> >>
>  21 nov. 2019 kl. 18:34 skrev Ian McInerney :
> >>>
> >>> 
> >>> This is probably introducing major feature creep, but it would be nice
> >>> to develop a dialog that allows setting the per-trace characteristics
> >>> (such as color, line type, line width, etc) that this could go in.
> >>> Where we put the accessors to it, I am not sure (it would be great if
> >>> we could link it with the legend fields). Then we can add in more
> >>> configuration options there as we implement them.
> >>>
> >>> -Ian
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 5:26 PM Wayne Stambaugh  >>> > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>Hi Jonatan,
> >>>
> >>>I just tested this and it seems to work as expected although I'm
> >>>thinking it might be a good idea to make this a configuration option
> >>>rather than the only behavior.  Users might not find this desirable.
> >>>Anyone else have any thoughts on this?  For future reference, when you
> >>>are going to make behavioral changes to KiCad, please ping the dev
> >>>mailing list first for feedback.  I would have made the option
> >>>suggestion before you began coding.
> >>>
> >>>Cheers,
> >>>
> >>>Wayne
> >>>
> >>>On 11/19/19 11:30 AM, Jonatan Liljedahl wrote:
>  This patch makes it easier to visually keep apart traces for current
>  vs voltage and phase vs magnitude, by using dotted line style for
>  current and phase traces.
> 
>  To get the dotted style drawn correctly, I had to switch from
> >>>drawing
>  each trace line segment individually to creating an array and then
>  using DrawLines() on it, so that the whole trace is one continuous
>  line.
> 
> 
>  ___
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>  Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net
> >>>
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> 
> >>>
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-- 
/Jonatan
http://kymatica.com

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[Kicad-developers] [PATCH] Selection appearance options

[Jonatan Liljedahl]

Oh, I just realized that when replying on my phone, it got sent from
another email address and didn't reach the list!

-- Forwarded message -
From: Kymatica 
Date: Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 7:23 PM
Subject: Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH] Selection appearance options
To: Kevin Cozens 
Cc: 


I think the screenshots show in what way this can improve visibility
and reduce clutter. The first screenshot is the current appearance,
which I find distracting.

Not sure what you mean regarding reducing color saturation, I don’t
see that happening here? Note this is eeschema, not pcbnew.

Yes, it works fine also for symbols with yellow-body-fill.

/Jonatan

> 21 nov. 2019 kl. 17:45 skrev Kevin Cozens :
>
> On 2019-11-21 11:01 a.m., Jonatan Liljedahl wrote:
>> Here comes two patches regarding the selection appearance.
>
> I'm just curious as to what is the problem that the proposed patches are 
> meant to address? (I may have missed the information in an earlier email).
>
> Is the idea to provide a much more visible indicator of what has been 
> selected than just reducing colour saturation, particularly when zoomed out?
>
> One question about the proposed patches. Have they been tested with symbols 
> containing the yellow infill?
>
> --
> Cheers!
>
> Kevin.
>
> http://www.ve3syb.ca/   | "Nerds make the shiny things that
> https://www.patreon.com/KevinCozens | distract the mouth-breathers, and
>| that's why we're powerful"
> Owner of Elecraft K2 #2172  |
> #include  | --Chris Hardwick
>
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-- 
/Jonatan
http://kymatica.com

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Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH] Eeschema: simulator plot: allow standard mac pan and pinch to zoom

[Jonatan Liljedahl]

Hi,

I found it. Here's an updated patch that makes it behave exactly as in
the schematic editor, and uses the "trackpad pan" common config
setting. This should work as expected on Linux.

Note that in mathplot.h the coding style git hook complained, but I
left it as is because it matches the current style in mathplot.h.
Better to update the coding style for the whole file in a separate
commit.

Cheers

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 7:13 PM Kymatica  wrote:
>
> It changes to ctrl-scrollwheel for zooming. Perhaps someone can point me in 
> the right direction for having the correct behavior on linux? How is it done 
> in the schematic editor?
>
> /Jonatan
>
> > 21 nov. 2019 kl. 18:02 skrev Wayne Stambaugh :
> >
> > Hi Jonatan,
> >
> > I tested this patch on my Linux laptop which has Ubuntu 19.04 with a
> > stock gnome desktop and it breaks the two finger zoom touchpad behavior.
> > With your patch zoom becomes a pan.  I'm not sure if this is just a
> > configuration issue or something else but I'm not seeing the same
> > behavior in the board and schematic editors so I suspect something else
> > is at play.  Can someone else with a linux laptop test this?  I don't
> > want to merge this if it breaks linux systems.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Wayne
> >
> >> On 11/19/19 11:22 AM, Jonatan Liljedahl wrote:
> >> This patch allows standard trackpad gestures for pan and zoom, just
> >> like in eeschema and pcbnew etc.
> >>
> >> While working on this, I noticed mathplot.cpp is a bit messy, with a
> >> lot of commented out or unused code, and some buggy behaviours. This
> >> patch does not address any of that.
> >>
> >>
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-- 
/Jonatan
http://kymatica.com


0001-Eeschema-simulator-plot-allow-standard-mac-pan-and-p.patch
Description: Binary data
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Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH] Eeschema: simulator: use dotted traces for current and phase.

[Jonatan Liljedahl]

Right, such configuration could be useful. However, note that a
selection of which lines (signals?) to show would be tied to the
actual current state of the schematic. Nets changes names, either
because user changes the names of labels, or automatically when things
get reconnected and re-annotated (Net-(R12-Pad2)) etc..

In any case, I think it makes sense to have a base setting of default
trace drawing style, and I think it makes sense if this is separated
into "left scale" (Voltage and Magnitude) and "right scale" (Current
and Phase). You can only view Voltage and Current, or Magnitude and
Phase, in the same plot, not any other combinations.

On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 12:46 AM Ian McInerney  wrote:
>
> I think it would be good to define a new S-expression config file that can be 
> used to store the plot configurations of the simulator. This file should just 
> contain the plot information, such as lines displayed, their style/color, 
> axis configurations, colors, etc. (and maybe analysis parameters, I haven't 
> thought about that part yet). This would allow us to add the functionality to 
> open/save plot styles (similar to how a Modelsim .do file can be used to 
> save/configure the waveform display, but ours won't be a script).
>
> -Ian
>
> On Thu, 21 Nov 2019, 22:11 Jon Evans,  wrote:
>>
>> I can add the simulator to the scope of effort to do the whole settings 
>> files upgrade for 6.0
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 5:06 PM Wayne Stambaugh  wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> On 11/21/19 1:15 PM, Kymatica wrote:
>>> > Sure, I can make it configurable. Where should this setting be available? 
>>> > In the main preferences? (Perhaps a new Simulator section there?)
>>>
>>> I would think the simulator will over time have enough user (not
>>> simulation control) configuration settings that it would have it's own
>>> preferences dialog and that the settings would be saved in a separate
>>> configuration file.  I think at the moment the config settings are saved
>>> in the eeschema config file.
>>>
>>> >
>>> > /Jonatan
>>> >
>>> >> 21 nov. 2019 kl. 18:26 skrev Wayne Stambaugh :
>>> >>
>>> >> Hi Jonatan,
>>> >>
>>> >> I just tested this and it seems to work as expected although I'm
>>> >> thinking it might be a good idea to make this a configuration option
>>> >> rather than the only behavior.  Users might not find this desirable.
>>> >> Anyone else have any thoughts on this?  For future reference, when you
>>> >> are going to make behavioral changes to KiCad, please ping the dev
>>> >> mailing list first for feedback.  I would have made the option
>>> >> suggestion before you began coding.
>>> >>
>>> >> Cheers,
>>> >>
>>> >> Wayne
>>> >>
>>> >>> On 11/19/19 11:30 AM, Jonatan Liljedahl wrote:
>>> >>> This patch makes it easier to visually keep apart traces for current
>>> >>> vs voltage and phase vs magnitude, by using dotted line style for
>>> >>> current and phase traces.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> To get the dotted style drawn correctly, I had to switch from drawing
>>> >>> each trace line segment individually to creating an array and then
>>> >>> using DrawLines() on it, so that the whole trace is one continuous
>>> >>> line.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
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>>> >>
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-- 
/Jonatan
http://kymatica.com

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