Re: [OSM-legal-talk] decision removing data
Hi, Simon Ward wrote: Not arguing against people having a choice, but I do think that, whether or not the license change happens, people should be able to get all of the old data, including history, under the terms of the existing CC-by-sa license. It has been officially said by the LWG (and is documented in the implementation plan on the wiki) that immediately before changeover, a last cc-by-sa planet including full history will be made available. Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09 E008°23'33 ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] decision removing data
80n 80n...@... writes: There are many things that meet the almost trivial threshold that legally constitutes creativity. Road classification, land use, abstraction, generalization, selectivity, arbitrary tagging, arrangement, smoothness, routes, desire paths, boundary approximation, building outlines, junction topology, address schema, layers, etc. All creative, all copyrightable. I have been leading a team of digitizers tracing features from aerial images. I was doing everything I could to minimize the creative or artistic part of their work. Actually, a quite heavy system of internal and external quality control was there just to make sure that every worker was producing about the same sort of bulk data. There are also other and bigger organizations than OSM doing same kind of, for my mind non-creative, work. Mapping agencies in the European countries, for example. I think that we must not claim that this kind of work is creative and copyrightable. That will be used against us and against all the citizens willing to use geospatial data produced by our administrations. We should show an example about free geodata, not the opposite. -Jukka Rahkonen- ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] decision removing data
On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 6:57 PM, Jukka Rahkonen jukka.rahko...@latuviitta.fi wrote: 80n 80n...@... writes: There are many things that meet the almost trivial threshold that legally constitutes creativity. Road classification, land use, abstraction, generalization, selectivity, arbitrary tagging, arrangement, smoothness, routes, desire paths, boundary approximation, building outlines, junction topology, address schema, layers, etc. All creative, all copyrightable. I have been leading a team of digitizers tracing features from aerial images. I was doing everything I could to minimize the creative or artistic part of their work. Actually, a quite heavy system of internal and external quality control was there just to make sure that every worker was producing about the same sort of bulk data. So, without your best endeavours, would you agree that these contributors would naturally introduce some creativeness? If you have to expend effort to remove creativity then you have made a pretty good case for the existence of creativity. Thank you for your testimony. There are also other and bigger organizations than OSM doing same kind of, for my mind non-creative, work. Please don't misunderstand the legal meaning of creativity with respect to copyright. As far as I know, creativity in this context refers to factors such as originality, arrangment and selectivity. Decisions such as whether or not to trace a particular feature because of its prominence is one of selectivity and in the eyes of the law that might constitute creativity. Mapping agencies in the European countries, for example. I think that we must not claim that this kind of work is creative and copyrightable. That will be used against us and against all the citizens willing to use geospatial data produced by our administrations. We should show an example about free geodata, not the opposite. -Jukka Rahkonen- ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] decision removing data
80n 80n...@... writes: So, without your best endeavours, would you agree that these contributors would naturally introduce some creativeness? If you have to expend effort to remove creativity then you have made a pretty good case for the existence of creativity. Thank you for your testimony. Somehow I feel that you did understand what I meant, but I may be wrong. Anyhow, I apologize, I should have written clearly that I did not really mean they were creative. They made errors. We learned them and tested them with calibrated test areas until they could do acceptable work. You can call them contributors, we called them workers. I suppose our boss would have used trained monkees instead if she had enough bananas. I have been doing rather a lot of digitising in my life. I do not consider my own digitising work as creative, just work. Others can feel in a different way, I speak for myself. Very similar work (but not as fun) as using a sewing machine, or welding steel plates, or plowing with a tractor - just try to follow the lines which you see. I think I would rather go welding now than continue this thread any longer. -Jukka- ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
