[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #49 from Buovjaga  ---
You have captured some remarkably succulent specimens there, Ralph!

(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #47)
> The problem is that we have a ton of
> legacy ODB files with embedded hsqldb 1.8 out there in userland, and no easy
> way to convert them.

Relevant tender result from Sept 2017:
https://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/board-discuss/msg04087.html
"Tender to implement HSQLDB binary format import in LibreOffice"

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #48 from Ralph Peters  ---
Thanks for the reply!  I am just a simple-minded Fortran/C++ programmer :^),
but did a bit in java and can "sorta" understand your comments.  I think that
you implied these problems do not exist with a split database and/or the later
hsqldb 2.4??  Correct?  At least, I have not seen problems, yet.

The problems with legacy embedded databases could be "fixed/mitigated" if there
was a detailed explanation/tutorial about how to switch to a split database and
some supporting software.  It would certainly be good "public relations" with
your "customers".

I had relatively good luck moving to a split database with hsqldb 2.4.  Why did
I choose hsqldb?  There were bits of documentation on the web, a wizard to help
with setup, and I thought (maybe incorrectly) that staying with hsqldb would
make the move easier.

Thanks for your help and comments,
Ralph Peters
Retired cactus & succulent guy in Albuquerque NM

For something completely different (pretty pictures that I also "index" in this
database), go to
http://www.new-mexico.cactus-society.org/Presentations/RalphPeters_ThunderRiver/PicGallery/index.html

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #47 from Alex Thurgood  ---
(In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #46)

> 
> BTW, your first line in the post is concerning ("legendary instability") -
> Is this one of the reasons for switching to Firebird?  It may be worthwhile
> to think about the "root-cause" of the embedded database problems.  Is it
> hysqldb 1,8 OR something else in the linkage between it and libreoffice.  I
> would think that the Firebird group should be
> inetersted/concerned/something...

No, the problems with hsqldb and LO, AOO, and prior to that OOo, mainly all
revolve around Java, and the way it is instantiated and the Java processes
managed within the LO process. It has always been a disaster just sitting
there, waiting to happen, even at the time that Sun first came up with idea (I
was involved with OOo at the time and voiced my concerns even then, from the
non-developer perspective that I had).

Embedded Firebird doesn't use any of that Java-instantiation stuff. That was
the whole point of moving to it in the first place, to hopefully provide a C++
based engine database that could be embedded without having to rely on Java to
jump through rings of fire. The problem is that we have a ton of legacy ODB
files with embedded hsqldb 1.8 out there in userland, and no easy way to
convert them.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #46 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #45)
> Closing this report as insufficient data.
> 
> The information about the legendary instability of the embedded hsqsl 1.8.0
> when the ODB file contains many reports, forms, macros, etc and a file size
> of several Mb is well known. It is documented in many places and certainly
> not a new phenomena.
> 
> I could have set this to WONTFIX, as it is unlikely that the instability
> issues will ever be addressed for the current embedded version of hsqldb,
> considering that the project is moving towards supporting embedded Firebird
> as the default rather than continuing with embedded hsqldb. This means that
> the code relating to embedded hsqldb is in "maintenance/curation mode"
> rather than "active development". Regressions are still being fixed for the
> time being, but tomy knowledge, no specific development with regard to
> improving embedded hsqldb 1.8 is being undertaken.
> 
> 
> As we don't have a sample db file with which to test, and as the original
> poster has moved to an external hdsqldb solution, I am setting this to
> INSUFFICIENT DATA rather than worksforme.

Closing it seems like a reasonable thing to do Alex.  I was unable to setup a
test database that illustrated the problems and didn't have sensitive info.  

I have continued using my split database and have done a lot of work adding
"location" data from friends - adding something like 4000 records, editing
them, etc.  I have also used other parts of the database adding records,
editing etc.  My total time working with it is at least 80 hours.  I have had
NO CRASHES  What a relief!!!  Yes, there are some minor inconveniences
using a split database -- for example one cannot modify tables after they are
created.  It would be nice to be able to edit the "Description" for each of the
variables at a later date.

BTW, your first line in the post is concerning ("legendary instability") - Is
this one of the reasons for switching to Firebird?  It may be worthwhile to
think about the "root-cause" of the embedded database problems.  Is it hysqldb
1,8 OR something else in the linkage between it and libreoffice.  I would think
that the Firebird group should be inetersted/concerned/something...

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

Alex Thurgood  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|UNCONFIRMED |RESOLVED
 Resolution|--- |INSUFFICIENTDATA

--- Comment #45 from Alex Thurgood  ---
Closing this report as insufficient data.

The information about the legendary instability of the embedded hsqsl 1.8.0
when the ODB file contains many reports, forms, macros, etc and a file size of
several Mb is well known. It is documented in many places and certainly not a
new phenomena.

I could have set this to WONTFIX, as it is unlikely that the instability issues
will ever be addressed for the current embedded version of hsqldb, considering
that the project is moving towards supporting embedded Firebird as the default
rather than continuing with embedded hsqldb. This means that the code relating
to embedded hsqldb is in "maintenance/curation mode" rather than "active
development". Regressions are still being fixed for the time being, but tomy
knowledge, no specific development with regard to improving embedded hsqldb 1.8
is being undertaken.


As we don't have a sample db file with which to test, and as the original
poster has moved to an external hdsqldb solution, I am setting this to
INSUFFICIENT DATA rather than worksforme.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #44 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to robert from comment #43)
> (In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #42)
> > 
> > Hi,
> > 
> > I am using hysqldb 2.4 only with my split database see:
> > https://www.mediafire.com/file/59iq0esx071zcic/Split_HSQLDB_Wizard_v3c.
> > odb?ssl=1
> > for a bit of background on my setup.
> > 
> > So, I do not think that there is any problem with having both 2.4 and 1.8,
> > as 1.8 is used only for the embedded database.
> 
> Please see bug34411
> 
> Bug hasn't been solved up to now.
> 
> With internal database I use a macro to save the database every time I open
> the file. So I have 10 copies saved in LO-backup-path. For external database
> I would use MariaDB instead.
> 
> Connecting to MariaDB, to PostgreSQL, Firebird, external HSQLDB and some
> others is all described in Base-Handbook. Little problem: Newer versions
> aren't translated yet from German to English.

Hi,

I have a bash script that I run to keep 4 backups on my local computer and a
backup on Dropbox, plus backups on Google Drive...  It is better than none, but
one can still lose your work since the last backup.  If it crashes regularly
(every 2 or 3 hours), one can become quite frustrated!

I used hysqldb because there was a wizard to do the setup!!  And instructions
too!  Also, it was relatively easy to move database tables, forms,queries, and
reports from the old embedded database to the new split one -- merely cut &
paste!

It would be really nice to have an up-to-date Base handbook that discussed this
 topic and others!  My heritage is German, but I do not read or speak it.

Thanks,
Ralph Peters

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

rob...@familiegrosskopf.de changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||rob...@familiegrosskopf.de

--- Comment #43 from rob...@familiegrosskopf.de ---
(In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #42)
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I am using hysqldb 2.4 only with my split database see:
> https://www.mediafire.com/file/59iq0esx071zcic/Split_HSQLDB_Wizard_v3c.
> odb?ssl=1
> for a bit of background on my setup.
> 
> So, I do not think that there is any problem with having both 2.4 and 1.8,
> as 1.8 is used only for the embedded database.

Please see bug34411

Bug hasn't been solved up to now.

With internal database I use a macro to save the database every time I open the
file. So I have 10 copies saved in LO-backup-path. For external database I
would use MariaDB instead.

Connecting to MariaDB, to PostgreSQL, Firebird, external HSQLDB and some others
is all described in Base-Handbook. Little problem: Newer versions aren't
translated yet from German to English.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #42 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Julien Nabet from comment #40)
> I didn't read the whole part but just some remarks:
> 1)
> About gdb traces:
> first one doesn't show bt just some running but perhaps it was on purpose
> second one shows "??" and, as Alex indicated, must correspond to Java part.
> It should indeed be fixed but for the moment, just type "c" to keep on and
> fetch the real bt.
> third one displays nothing except the real gdb trace is in gdbtrace.log
> 
> 2)
> About hsqldb version
> I hope you don't try to mix versions because it could corrupt your db.
> Indeed, LO uses hsqldb 1.8.0 so if you use 2.4 even to experiment...
> 
> 3)
> It seems we still need a step by step process to reproduce this with a small
> db. 
> 
> 4)
> as you're very experienced, I wonder if you'd be interested in building LO
> code, see https://www.libreoffice.org/community/developers/
> Indeed, most of the LO code is in C++ (I'd say at least 90%?).
> It would allow you to:
> - not search some debug packages
> - to choose your build options
> - try to add some specific debug traces
> ...
> but I'll stop here since I won't teach you anything here :-)
> Of course you need a good connection since LO code is quite big and some
> patience to build (depending on your machine obviously and your build
> options)
> but once it's done, you can really experiment.

Hi,

I am using hysqldb 2.4 only with my split database see:
https://www.mediafire.com/file/59iq0esx071zcic/Split_HSQLDB_Wizard_v3c.odb?ssl=1
for a bit of background on my setup.

So, I do not think that there is any problem with having both 2.4 and 1.8, as
1.8 is used only for the embedded database.

IMPORTANT BTW, I have been using my split database since about 12/15/2017 and
have had no hanging/crashing problems at all.  I have more than 30 hours of
using it and entering data.  I have had some "fun" making it do the right thing
(like auto-incrementing keys in tables) but I have fixed my particular
problems. I miss being able to modify database tables after they are in use. 
(Yes, I can setup a new one, copy-paste data and then delete the old one.)  But
the rock-solid stability makes these annoyances a very minor problem.  So, I am
interested in spending my limited time, particularly on the computer, working
instead of chasing bugs.

I would seriously suggest that "official" and updated documents be written for
Base concerning CONVERTING an embedded database to a split one.  Currently,
there are a number of sources (SEE ATTACHED PDF) that are from different dates.

I would also suggest that NO ONE use an embedded database because of the
numerous problems discussed in various forums and articles on the web.

Ralph Peters

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #41 from Ralph Peters  ---
Created attachment 138772
  --> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/attachment.cgi?id=138772=edit
Various web sites that helped me to move from a embedded to split database

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Julien Nabet  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||serval2...@yahoo.fr

--- Comment #40 from Julien Nabet  ---
I didn't read the whole part but just some remarks:
1)
About gdb traces:
first one doesn't show bt just some running but perhaps it was on purpose
second one shows "??" and, as Alex indicated, must correspond to Java part. It
should indeed be fixed but for the moment, just type "c" to keep on and fetch
the real bt.
third one displays nothing except the real gdb trace is in gdbtrace.log

2)
About hsqldb version
I hope you don't try to mix versions because it could corrupt your db.
Indeed, LO uses hsqldb 1.8.0 so if you use 2.4 even to experiment...

3)
It seems we still need a step by step process to reproduce this with a small
db. 

4)
as you're very experienced, I wonder if you'd be interested in building LO
code, see https://www.libreoffice.org/community/developers/
Indeed, most of the LO code is in C++ (I'd say at least 90%?).
It would allow you to:
- not search some debug packages
- to choose your build options
- try to add some specific debug traces
...
but I'll stop here since I won't teach you anything here :-)
Of course you need a good connection since LO code is quite big and some
patience to build (depending on your machine obviously and your build options)
but once it's done, you can really experiment.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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--- Comment #39 from Buovjaga  ---
(In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #38)
> I am using hysqldb 2.4 in the split database.  I think the embedded database
> uses hysqldb version 1.8. (released in 2008) 
> 
> Is it possible that some of these problems are associated with the "old"
> database?  I would imagine that there has been major work done, maybe even
> in areas that affect this set of problems..

The plan is to rather move to Firebird SQL. There are some blocker bugs still
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/showdependencytree.cgi?id=51780_resolved=1

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--- Comment #38 from Ralph Peters  ---
Alex,

I am using hysqldb 2.4 in the split database.  I think the embedded database
uses hysqldb version 1.8. (released in 2008) 

Is it possible that some of these problems are associated with the "old"
database?  I would imagine that there has been major work done, maybe even in
areas that affect this set of problems..

Just a thought,
Ralph

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--- Comment #37 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #35)
> (In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #34)
> > Well, no response so far - almost a month since my first post on this
> 
> That is a rather unfair assessment given that several people have responded
> to you over the weeks.
> 
> The fact of the matter is that you have a fairly large, complex embedded
> hsqldb database, and you  can not, for perfectly valid reasons, provide us
> with a copy of the ODB. This means we are pretty much limited in where we
> can go with this.
> 
> The fact that Base sigsegv's all over the place is nothing new and is down
> mainly to JVM instantiation and memory management (most, but not all, of the
> SIGSEGV tend to occur in the JVM).
> 
> Two suggestions :
> 
> - try increasing RAM allocated for the Java thread when you open the ODB
> file - possibly, that might help stabilize things a little - in order to do
> this, you will need to change the memory settings in the .properties or
> .scpt file within the ODB itself, which means unzipping and opening those
> files in a text editor, making your changes, then saving them and rezipping.
> Best to to do that on a copy of the ODB to see how well that goes. Off-hand,
> I don't remember exactly which file needs to be changed, but this should be
> searchable via Google, perhaps even in the hsqldb documentation itself ;
> 
> - second suggestion that might help us is if you could construct an ODB file
> with a minimum set of tables/forms/relationships not containing any
> sensitive data and that you could provide us, so that we could test
> ourselves.

I chose my words poorly Alex.  I have received a number of replies since I
first posted the problem!  I should have said that I have only received
requests for more info.

On a major piece of C++ code that I was developing, I ran both valgrind and gdb
at least every week during development to check for "unseen" problems.  Of
course, I ran them whenever I had a problem.  And that kept me out of trouble. 
So,the SIGSEVs caused me a lot of heartburn.  I had not received any response
about the SIGSEVs, until now. 

Yes, it is difficult to debug via "long distance".  I have done only a little
java software, so figuring out how to increase the size of RAM and the mutex
stuff would take me quite a while. BTW, I thought that java was not supposed to
have memory problems?  Wasn't that the point?  But I am merely an old C++
hacker (and lisp and Fortran)

The bottom line is that splitting the database SEEMS to have solved the
problem.  I am using hysqldb 2.4  This "experiment" may provide you with some
more ideas about what the problem is.  I will notify you on this thread if I
see a problem.  I have spent a number of hours adding data with 1 to 2 forms
open and NO problems.  I will be adding a lot of data to the split database and
will have multiple forms open at one time.  This should provide a good test!!

BTW, I will not go back to the embedded database as the split one posts info to
the database during the session and is reported to  be less likely to lose
information when there are problems.  Or do I mis-understand what I have read??

So, again my apologies for getting a bit rude.  The task, as I laid it out was
very difficult!!   I became irritated when I could not go "back to work".

Thanks for your help and attention!
Ralph

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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--- Comment #36 from Alex Thurgood  ---
Seeing a SIGSEGV in the AffineBridge rang a bell :

- it could be that you've been hit by the problem described and discussed in
this thread :


https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice/2015-June/068446.html


for which there is currently no solution.

See also bug 57872, which is also related to the above mail discussion
(indirectly, in that it talks about how to improve performance in the Java
bridge).

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--- Comment #35 from Alex Thurgood  ---
(In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #34)
> Well, no response so far - almost a month since my first post on this

That is a rather unfair assessment given that several people have responded to
you over the weeks.

The fact of the matter is that you have a fairly large, complex embedded hsqldb
database, and you  can not, for perfectly valid reasons, provide us with a copy
of the ODB. This means we are pretty much limited in where we can go with this.

The fact that Base sigsegv's all over the place is nothing new and is down
mainly to JVM instantiation and memory management (most, but not all, of the
SIGSEGV tend to occur in the JVM).

Two suggestions :

- try increasing RAM allocated for the Java thread when you open the ODB file -
possibly, that might help stabilize things a little - in order to do this, you
will need to change the memory settings in the .properties or .scpt file within
the ODB itself, which means unzipping and opening those files in a text editor,
making your changes, then saving them and rezipping. Best to to do that on a
copy of the ODB to see how well that goes. Off-hand, I don't remember exactly
which file needs to be changed, but this should be searchable via Google,
perhaps even in the hsqldb documentation itself ;

- second suggestion that might help us is if you could construct an ODB file
with a minimum set of tables/forms/relationships not containing any sensitive
data and that you could provide us, so that we could test ourselves.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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--- Comment #34 from Ralph Peters  ---
Well, no response so far - almost a month since my first post on this subject! 
I decided after doing some research on the web to switch from an embedded
database to a split database which uses hysqldb using the wizard found at
https://www.mediafire.com/file/59iq0esx071zcic/Split_HSQLDB_Wizard_v3c.odb?ssl=1
 I spent about a day doing the transfer, which included a fairly detailed check
of the new database to see that all data tables, views, forms, and reports were
OK.  

I have been using the split-database for several days and have had NO CRASHES. 
YES NONE! This leads me to suspect that there is nothing wrong with my data,
instead there are problems with the current (LO 5.4.3) implementation of the
embedded database in LO.  If I have any "crash" problems I will report them
here!!

SO, I would suggest that people do NOT USE the embedded database and
switch/start with the split version!  There are a number of web pages on the
subject for example
http://g0o0o0gle.com/base-wizard-portablesplit-hsql-database-template/

BTW, my database is fairly large.  The mydb.data file is 34 MB.  Compressed as
a tgz file the size is 5.5 MB, this includes everything except the driver files
(hysqldb.jar and sqltool.jar) which do not change.

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--- Comment #33 from Ralph Peters  ---
I have been using 5.4.3 to add information with only 1 form open.  I had 1 hang
and when I recovered I found that most of the info (45 minutes of work) was
gone.  I have just tried again doing something even simpler and now, as I am
shutting down to save my work, it has hung again.  The gui says "Wait?" or
"Force quit?" and after cycling through this several times over 15 minutes I
have given up and done a "Force quit"

I was able to recover and all the new data was there, but when I tried to exit
it hung again.  A fourth try recovered and successfully shutdown.

Output from a shell program "watching" soffice shows modest use during this
last "hang".

Mon Dec 11 12:33:41 MST 2017 - %CPU %MEM CMD
 5.3 12.2 /opt/libreoffice5.4/program/soffice.bin --base
file:///home/ralph/Desk
Mon Dec 11 12:33:51 MST 2017 - %CPU %MEM CMD
 5.3 12.2 /opt/libreoffice5.4/program/soffice.bin --base
file:///home/ralph/Desk
Mon Dec 11 12:34:01 MST 2017 - %CPU %MEM CMD
 5.3 12.2 /opt/libreoffice5.4/program/soffice.bin --base
file:///home/ralph/Desk
Mon Dec 11 12:34:11 MST 2017 - %CPU %MEM CMD
 5.3 12.2 /opt/libreoffice5.4/program/soffice.bin --base
file:///home/ralph/Desk
Mon Dec 11 12:34:21 MST 2017 - %CPU %MEM CMD
 5.2 12.2 /opt/libreoffice5.4/program/soffice.bin --base
file:///home/ralph/Desk

This database is almost USELESS!!!  Would someone fix all the SIGSEGV errors
and I can see if the problem goes away?

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Buovjaga  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Keywords|wantBacktrace   |haveBacktrace
 Status|NEEDINFO|UNCONFIRMED
 Ever confirmed|1   |0

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--- Comment #32 from Ralph Peters  ---
Created attachment 138220
  --> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/attachment.cgi?id=138220=edit
A second gdb trace.

I thought that I would look up stuff in "tables" instead of "forms" and paid
close attention to the gdb output.  After looking at the output, I gave up!! 
This is a mess.  SIGSEV occurs repeatedly!  Is the 6. branch this much of a
mess??

Please respond!  Look at both gdb traces!

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--- Comment #31 from Ralph Peters  ---
BTW, this was just a simple test.  I opened a single form at a time (locations
and then plants) and did a search for records that matched a specified value. 
Nothing fancy or complicated!

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--- Comment #30 from Ralph Peters  ---
After a closer look there are some SIGSEGV problems.  NOT good!

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--- Comment #29 from Ralph Peters  ---
Created attachment 138087
  --> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/attachment.cgi?id=138087=edit
Trace file for PRELIMINARY run

This is the trace file that is associated with the "GDB output" file that I
just sent.

NOTE!!  LO Base did not crash but there are LOTS of complaints...

I will try to reproduce some of my "hanging" problems tomorrow.  These 2 files
are just examples to see if I am doing the things that you need/want.

and now off to a basketball game...
Ralph

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--- Comment #28 from Ralph Peters  ---
Created attachment 138086
  --> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/attachment.cgi?id=138086=edit
GDB output from PRELIMINARY run

LOTs of complaints!  It stopped several times so I had to "continue"

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--- Comment #27 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Buovjaga from comment #26)
> (In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #25)
> > OK, I spent some time looking at Ubuntu and did not see what you are talking
> > about.  Would it be possible for you to provide a link to what you think is
> > the BEST download (.tgz file) for me to use?
> 
> I would just go with the latest master debug build, which now happens to be:
> https://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/master/Linux-rpm_deb-x86_64@70-TDF-
> dbg/2017-11-29_00.49.31/master_dbg~2017-11-29_00.49.31_LibreOfficeDev_6.1.0.
> 0.alpha0_Linux_x86-64_archive.tar.gz
> 
> After unpacking, you should just be able to run soffice from the program
> subdirectory.

THANKS!  I hope to give it a try in the next day or two.
Ralph

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--- Comment #26 from Buovjaga  ---
(In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #25)
> OK, I spent some time looking at Ubuntu and did not see what you are talking
> about.  Would it be possible for you to provide a link to what you think is
> the BEST download (.tgz file) for me to use?

I would just go with the latest master debug build, which now happens to be:
https://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/master/Linux-rpm_deb-x86_64@70-TDF-dbg/2017-11-29_00.49.31/master_dbg~2017-11-29_00.49.31_LibreOfficeDev_6.1.0.0.alpha0_Linux_x86-64_archive.tar.gz

After unpacking, you should just be able to run soffice from the program
subdirectory.

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--- Comment #25 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Buovjaga from comment #24)
> (In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #23)
> > I suppose that a set of "dbgsym" deb files are available for 5.4.2?  I
> > looked, but was unable to find them.
> 
> They are supposed to be in your distribution's package repository. Ubuntu
> has them, but I am not sure about Linux Mint.
> 
> If you are unable to find them, the 6.0 debug build should do (if the
> problem still happens).

Ubuntu should work just fine.

OK, I spent some time looking at Ubuntu and did not see what you are talking
about.  Would it be possible for you to provide a link to what you think is the
BEST download (.tgz file) for me to use?

Thanks,
Ralph Peters

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--- Comment #24 from Buovjaga  ---
(In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #23)
> I suppose that a set of "dbgsym" deb files are available for 5.4.2?  I
> looked, but was unable to find them.

They are supposed to be in your distribution's package repository. Ubuntu has
them, but I am not sure about Linux Mint.

If you are unable to find them, the 6.0 debug build should do (if the problem
still happens).

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--- Comment #23 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Buovjaga from comment #21)
> Ralph: see here
> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/QA/BugReport/Debug_Information
> 
> For Debian, Ubuntu the package names apparently follow the format
> libreoffice-*-dbgsym
> 
> Another possibility is downloading this massive 2GB (6GB unpacked) archive,
> which includes the debug symbols already:
> http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/master/Linux-rpm_deb-x86_64@70-TDF-
> dbg/current/
> It is a fresh master build.


Hi,

I suppose that a set of "dbgsym" deb files are available for 5.4.2?  I looked,
but was unable to find them.

Your link sent me to a debug set for 6.0 which MAY have its own new & exciting
problems.  I can use it if that is all that is available, but

I see that valgrind lives!  A wonderful tool, but only if you are able to stand
a slow-down of 100 fold...

Ralph

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Alex Thurgood  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Keywords||wantBacktrace

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Alex Thurgood  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|UNCONFIRMED |NEEDINFO
 Ever confirmed|0   |1

--- Comment #22 from Alex Thurgood  ---
Setting to NEEDINFO pending receipt of a backtrace. If we get one, we can
decide where to go from there.

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--- Comment #21 from Buovjaga  ---
Ralph: see here
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/QA/BugReport/Debug_Information

For Debian, Ubuntu the package names apparently follow the format
libreoffice-*-dbgsym

Another possibility is downloading this massive 2GB (6GB unpacked) archive,
which includes the debug symbols already:
http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/master/Linux-rpm_deb-x86_64@70-TDF-dbg/current/
It is a fresh master build.

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--- Comment #20 from Ralph Peters  ---
BTW, many times if I do NOT "save" my work before closing LibreOffice Base, it
will hang "permanently".

save  -> means click the "save" icon - the floppy disk icon in upper left
close -> means click the "X" in the upper-right corner

I can "kill" libreoffice base and "recover" my work and then re-remember to
save and then close.

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--- Comment #19 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #18)
> @Ralph : as you mention that you have programming experience, perhaps you
> could install either the debug code for the version of LO that comes with
> your distrib and try and obtain a backtrace using gdb when the app hangs.
> That at least might point in the right direction.
> 
> The problem with LO5162 as provided by the distro is that it is, to all
> intents and purposes, obsolete, and no longer supported by TDF. Whether or
> not Ubuntu still provides updates and fixes for that version is another
> matter altogether and not within the LibreOffice project's control.
> 
> Another avenue to explore is the version of JDK/JVM. The report-builder, as
> does embedded hsqldb, uses Java to function correctly, and perhaps a SIGSEGV
> in the JVM, for whatever reason, is subsequently causing LO to hang. You
> might want to look through your logs to see if there are any traces of hangs
> registered there when using LibreOffice and that particular ODB file.
> 
> If we don't have a copy of the database, and I understand your reticence to
> post a copy on this bug report, then it is going to be very difficult for us
> to reproduce. If your database contains confidential information then
> posting it to this bug report is not a good idea, as it will become public.
> 
> There are/were known mutex release issues that sometimes occur(red) with
> LibreOffice Base, particularly when switching between Forms and Reports. The
> behaviour you describe might be one such occurrence, which is why I
> suggested trying to obtain a backtrace with a debug build (or the associated
> debug symbol code provided with the distro version).

Hi Alex,

Where do I get the debug code?  I could wander the web but thought
that I would ask.  I am currently using version 5.4.3.2 of
LibreOffice which I downloaded from the LibreOffice site.

Ahh gdb I remember it well...with fondness based on many
hours(days, weeks...) using it inside emacs.  (Maybe not fondness, but
it was a great tool.)  I have not used it for a few years, so I may
have a few questions about what would make sense to do.  Are you
suggesting just a simple run and then look at the backtrace after I
kill it??

A set of suggestions to get me re-started might speed things up.

Is "main" LibreOffice code c++?  Or one of the
newer languages?  I know that hsqldb is java.

Which logs should I look at during and after a "hang"?  Suggestions
appreciated!

You mentioned mutex issues and that sounds right to me.  On occasion,
after I killed LibreOffice in the standard gui manner ("Wait" or
"Force Quit"), I have checked "top" and found soffice.bin was still
running and chewing up a lot of cpu (40%) after it was "killed".

Ralph



I CHECKED ON THE INSTALLED PACKAGES FOR JAVA and JDK.  Are these appropriate?

JAVA:
dpkg -l | grep java
ii  ca-certificates-java  20160321 
   all  Common CA certificates (JKS keystore)
ii  cjs   3.4.4+sonya  
   amd64Mozilla-based javascript bindings for the
Cinnamon platform
ii  gir1.2-javascriptcoregtk-3.0:amd642.4.11-0ubuntu0.1
   amd64JavaScript engine library from WebKitGTK+ -
GObject introspection data
ii  gir1.2-javascriptcoregtk-4.0:amd642.18.3-0ubuntu0.16.04.1  
   amd64JavaScript engine library from WebKitGTK+ -
GObject introspection data
ii  gjs   1.44.0-1ubuntu1  
   amd64Mozilla-based javascript bindings for the GNOME
platform
ii  java-common   0.56ubuntu2  
   all  Base package for Java runtimes
ii  libapache-pom-java10-2build1   
   all  Maven metadata for all Apache Software projects
ii  libatk-wrapper-java   0.33.3-6 
   all  ATK implementation for Java using JNI
ii  libatk-wrapper-java-jni:amd64 0.33.3-6 
   amd64ATK implementation for Java using JNI (JNI
bindings)
ii  libcjs0f  3.4.4+sonya  
   amd64Mozilla-based javascript bindings for the
Cinnamon platform
ii  libcommons-beanutils-java 1.9.2-3  
   all  Apache Commons BeanUtils - Utility for
manipulating Java beans
ii  libcommons-collections3-java  3.2.2-1  
   all  Apache Commons Collections - Extended
Collections API 

[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #18 from Alex Thurgood  ---
@Ralph : as you mention that you have programming experience, perhaps you could
install either the debug code for the version of LO that comes with your
distrib and try and obtain a backtrace using gdb when the app hangs. That at
least might point in the right direction.

The problem with LO5162 as provided by the distro is that it is, to all intents
and purposes, obsolete, and no longer supported by TDF. Whether or not Ubuntu
still provides updates and fixes for that version is another matter altogether
and not within the LibreOffice project's control.

Another avenue to explore is the version of JDK/JVM. The report-builder, as
does embedded hsqldb, uses Java to function correctly, and perhaps a SIGSEGV in
the JVM, for whatever reason, is subsequently causing LO to hang. You might
want to look through your logs to see if there are any traces of hangs
registered there when using LibreOffice and that particular ODB file.

If we don't have a copy of the database, and I understand your reticence to
post a copy on this bug report, then it is going to be very difficult for us to
reproduce. If your database contains confidential information then posting it
to this bug report is not a good idea, as it will become public.

There are/were known mutex release issues that sometimes occur(red) with
LibreOffice Base, particularly when switching between Forms and Reports. The
behaviour you describe might be one such occurrence, which is why I suggested
trying to obtain a backtrace with a debug build (or the associated debug symbol
code provided with the distro version).

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--- Comment #17 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #15)
> Thanks Ralph, let me have a read through your answers and I'll try and get
> back to you with some suggestions.

Great!

The problem seems to occur when I have several forms open making changes to the
data.

I would prefer not to ship the odb file to you.  It contains some sensitive
info.

I can do tests for you to look for bugs.  I am an engineer who wrote software
for some 40 years in Fortran, Lisp, C++, java,... on topics ranging from
simulation of solar-energy systems to simulation of simple nuclear-power
systems for space applications to water and contaminant transport modeling and
building geometry (surroundings) from various sensors like "laser
range-finders" (robotics).  I have way to much experience looking for bugs!

BTW, an up-to-date tutorial about moving from the embedded hsqldb to an
external database using something like MariaDB would be very helpful.  Yes,
there are old tutorials on the web that treat "bits and pieces" of such a move
-- although I may have missed a newer one.  I would be quite willing to read
the new tutorial, use it AND provide feedback to the author to make it better.

Talk to you later,
Ralph

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--- Comment #16 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Ralph Peters from comment #11)
> Created attachment 137947 [details]
> relationships for database  Bug 113937

BTW, the ODB file for this is 5.4 MB, so it is fairly large.

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Alex Thurgood  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|NEEDINFO|UNCONFIRMED
 Ever confirmed|1   |0

--- Comment #15 from Alex Thurgood  ---
Thanks Ralph, let me have a read through your answers and I'll try and get back
to you with some suggestions.

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--- Comment #14 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #8)
> If you are using TDF builds and mixing with Ubuntu provided report-builder
> versions, you will have no end of trouble...

Hi,

I do not think that I am doing this...  I am using the LinuxMint software and
also LibreOffice downloads - see a previous reply.

Ralph

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--- Comment #13 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #5)
> @Ralph : we need more information than what you have provided.
> 
> You mention that the problem started a few months ago: the version numbers
> you mention weren't released a few months ago, certainly not 5.3.7 or 5.4.3,
> so we would need to know when the problem first appeared and with which
> version of LibreOffice.
> 
> Additionally, you mention that you have been using the same embedded
> database for the past 4 years. It could be that your database has
> unfortunately become corrupt, this is a known drawback of using the embedded
> hsqldb 1.8 engine.
> 
> If you have a backup, then I would suggest using a copy of that to test with
> the latest production releases to see whether you can still reproduce the
> problem.
> 
> You mention that you can't reproduce the problem with 5.1.6.2, which is the
> version provided by the distribution (Mint Sarah ?)

Hi,

I have thought about using a split database with something like MariaDB.  But I
have not seen a good tutorial on making the switch.  I started a time or two
and gave up.  I would like to export data, forms, reports, queries,  I do
not mind spending a day or two to get back to my current setup if it would be
roughly the same.  I exported this database once from a DOS database
(cornerstone) and that was a lot of work!

Ralph

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--- Comment #12 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #5)
> @Ralph : we need more information than what you have provided.
> 
> You mention that the problem started a few months ago: the version numbers
> you mention weren't released a few months ago, certainly not 5.3.7 or 5.4.3,
> so we would need to know when the problem first appeared and with which
> version of LibreOffice.
> 
> Additionally, you mention that you have been using the same embedded
> database for the past 4 years. It could be that your database has
> unfortunately become corrupt, this is a known drawback of using the embedded
> hsqldb 1.8 engine.
> 
> If you have a backup, then I would suggest using a copy of that to test with
> the latest production releases to see whether you can still reproduce the
> problem.
> 
> You mention that you can't reproduce the problem with 5.1.6.2, which is the
> version provided by the distribution (Mint Sarah ?)

Hi,

I have MANY backups of the database .odb file.  I could go back a year or two
to see if the problem exists.  Some times it takes an hour or two of use before
it shows up.

I have seen the problem a time or two with 5.1.6.2.  Sometimes, even if I do a
"Force" quit I see soffice.bin running in "top" and have to kill it with "kill
-9 ###"

I was using 5.3.3 before and did not see the problem.  But, during the summer I
am busy doing other things and may not have stressed it enough then.

How does one un-corrupt a file.  Yes I could go back to a odb file that appears
OK, but the work involved may be monumental to update to "current".
It would be nice if someone would write some software to test basic stuff for
corruption, like "relataionships" - see attached jpeg.

Ralph

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

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https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #11 from Ralph Peters  ---
Created attachment 137947
  --> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/attachment.cgi?id=137947=edit
relationships for database  Bug 113937

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #10 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #7)
> @Ralph : please also report whether you are using just distro-provided
> builds or snaps, or ppas, or whether you are using TDF downloads.

(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #5)
> @Ralph : we need more information than what you have provided.
> 
> You mention that the problem started a few months ago: the version numbers
> you mention weren't released a few months ago, certainly not 5.3.7 or 5.4.3,
> so we would need to know when the problem first appeared and with which
> version of LibreOffice.
> 
> Additionally, you mention that you have been using the same embedded
> database for the past 4 years. It could be that your database has
> unfortunately become corrupt, this is a known drawback of using the embedded
> hsqldb 1.8 engine.
> 
> If you have a backup, then I would suggest using a copy of that to test with
> the latest production releases to see whether you can still reproduce the
> problem.
> 
> You mention that you can't reproduce the problem with 5.1.6.2, which is the
> version provided by the distribution (Mint Sarah ?)

Hi!

5.1.6.2 Is the "standard" deb file package provided by LinuxMint 18.2
5.3.7 and 5.4.3 were downloaded from the LibreOffice site as deb-file packages.

When I switch, I always do a complete un-install:
  sudo apt-get purge libreoffice*.*
  sudo apt-get purge libreoffice-*
  sudo apt-get purge libobasis*

Lately the first command clears out everything.  Then I install.  I either use
the LinuxMint software gui (for 5.1.6.2) OR for the latter 2

cd ../something/DEBS/
sudo dpkg -i *.deb

Does that answer your question?
Ralph

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #9 from Ralph Peters  ---
(In reply to Alex Thurgood from comment #4)
> This wouldn't have anything to do with the kernel version bug by any chance ?

Hi Alex!

I am using:
uname -a
Linux sclero 4.4.0-31-generic #50-Ubuntu SMP Wed Jul 13 00:07:12 UTC 2016
x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

cat /etc/linuxmint/info 
RELEASE=18.2
CODENAME=sonya
EDITION="Cinnamon 64-bit"
DESCRIPTION="Linux Mint 18.2 Sonya"
DESKTOP=Gnome
TOOLKIT=GTK
NEW_FEATURES_URL=http://www.linuxmint.com/rel_sonya_cinnamon_whatsnew.php
RELEASE_NOTES_URL=http://www.linuxmint.com/rel_sonya_cinnamon.php
USER_GUIDE_URL=help:linuxmint
GRUB_TITLE=Linux Mint 18.2 Cinnamon 64-bit

and I am up-to-date.  Does that provide the info that you need?

Thanks!
Ralph Peters

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #8 from Alex Thurgood  ---
If you are using TDF builds and mixing with Ubuntu provided report-builder
versions, you will have no end of trouble...

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #7 from Alex Thurgood  ---
@Ralph : please also report whether you are using just distro-provided builds
or snaps, or ppas, or whether you are using TDF downloads.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #6 from Alex Thurgood  ---
Ideally, we would need an ODB file that shows the problem in order to test.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

Alex Thurgood  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|UNCONFIRMED |NEEDINFO
 Ever confirmed|0   |1

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #5 from Alex Thurgood  ---
@Ralph : we need more information than what you have provided.

You mention that the problem started a few months ago: the version numbers you
mention weren't released a few months ago, certainly not 5.3.7 or 5.4.3, so we
would need to know when the problem first appeared and with which version of
LibreOffice.

Additionally, you mention that you have been using the same embedded database
for the past 4 years. It could be that your database has unfortunately become
corrupt, this is a known drawback of using the embedded hsqldb 1.8 engine.

If you have a backup, then I would suggest using a copy of that to test with
the latest production releases to see whether you can still reproduce the
problem.

You mention that you can't reproduce the problem with 5.1.6.2, which is the
version provided by the distribution (Mint Sarah ?)

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #4 from Alex Thurgood  ---
This wouldn't have anything to do with the kernel version bug by any chance ?

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

--- Comment #3 from Buovjaga  ---
(In reply to Buovjaga from comment #2)
> You could try getting a backtrace of the hang:
> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/QA/BugReport/Debug_Information#GNU.
> 2FLinux
> Note that you need to install the LibreOffice debug package of your Linux
> distro.

..or maybe it will not provide any additional info as we already have the
report:
http://crashreport.libreoffice.org/stats/crash_details/b246ae69-d658-41c4-a372-4dc980e9e308

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

Buovjaga  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||todven...@suomi24.fi
Crash report or||["libmergedlo.so"]
crash signature||

--- Comment #2 from Buovjaga  ---
You could try getting a backtrace of the hang:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/QA/BugReport/Debug_Information#GNU.2FLinux
Note that you need to install the LibreOffice debug package of your Linux
distro.

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[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 113937] Forms and reports hang

[bugzilla-daemon]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113937

Ralph Peters  changed:

   What|Removed |Added

Version|unspecified |5.3.7.2 release

--- Comment #1 from Ralph Peters  ---
see crash report b246ae69-d658-41c4-a372-4dc980e9e308

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