Re: Document Include mechanism
Am Montag 13 Juli 2009 04:01:01 schrieb rgheck: That said, there probably is a bug here, especially now that we have this default master setting. A child should probably inherit the document class of its master, and its modules and such, too. I'm not sure how well we do with that. Only if it is exported with the master-buffer-* lfuns. The default master is not supposed to exclude stand-alone usage. Jürgen
Re: Document Include mechanism
On 07/12/2009 12:57 PM, James Mansion wrote:
Richard Heck wrote:
On 07/12/2009 07:46 AM, James Mansion wrote:
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book
with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version
control) them in more manageable chunks.
This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest
inclusions a bit disturbing.
What do you mean by this? You can have children of children of children.
No I can't. When I got Ctrl-D I get a dialog that says:
LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.
and the Description is:
\include{0C__src_books_arch_test}
Your command was ignored.
Type I command return to replace it with another command,
or return to continue without it.
Use Input rather than Include. That should probably be the default.
What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the
document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it
inherited to new components --- I have to set the class of each one.
To some extent, this is a known issue, and there is a sense in which
it can't be solved. If you treat the file as a file unto itself, then
it needs its own document class, preamble, etc. And sometimes a file
can be both a child of another document and a file unto itself. And
for the same reason you do always have to set the document class.
I think that's a weak answer. I don't *need* the children to be valid
as self-contained documents. What I would like is to be able to set a
docu class (optionally) but to have it ignored and defer to the parent
in the case where its a child.
I understand what you want. What I was explaining is why LyX can't
*just* work the way you want. We have had lengthy discussions about this
both on this list and on the devel list, and there are a lot of people
who need the facility I described. So we provide that as an option
(which is how it originally worked, anyway), and people who don't need
that facility---like you and me---have to make do. This is always the
trade-off: Flexibility for the people who need it vs additional effort
for the people who don't.
That said, there probably is room for improvement here. Especially now
that we have this default master setting, a child should probably
inherit the document class of its master, and its modules and such, too.
I'm not sure how well we do with that, but I can't test it now, due to
quite other problems. Of course, if you'd like to look into fixing this
yourself, I'd be happy to provide some pointers.
Richard
Re: Document Include mechanism
On 07/13/2009 02:07 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: Am Montag 13 Juli 2009 04:01:01 schrieb rgheck: That said, there probably is a bug here, especially now that we have this default master setting. A child should probably inherit the document class of its master, and its modules and such, too. I'm not sure how well we do with that. Only if it is exported with the master-buffer-* lfuns. The default master is not supposed to exclude stand-alone usage. Yes, I know: I use the master buffer thing all the time, for which thank you. What I meant was: Maybe there should be another setting, which would mean something like: Inherit the document class, preamble, etc, even when this is compiled on its own. rh
Re: Document Include mechanism
Am Montag 13 Juli 2009 15:30:46 schrieben Sie: Only if it is exported with the master-buffer-* lfuns. The default master is not supposed to exclude stand-alone usage. Yes, I know: I use the master buffer thing all the time, for which thank you. What I meant was: Maybe there should be another setting, which would mean something like: Inherit the document class, preamble, etc, even when this is compiled on its own. Probably. Or just a button that lets you inherit the params from the master. Jürgen
Re: Document Include mechanism
Am Montag 13 Juli 2009 04:01:01 schrieb rgheck: That said, there probably is a bug here, especially now that we have this default master setting. A child should probably inherit the document class of its master, and its modules and such, too. I'm not sure how well we do with that. Only if it is exported with the master-buffer-* lfuns. The default master is not supposed to exclude stand-alone usage. Jürgen
Re: Document Include mechanism
On 07/12/2009 12:57 PM, James Mansion wrote:
Richard Heck wrote:
On 07/12/2009 07:46 AM, James Mansion wrote:
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book
with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version
control) them in more manageable chunks.
This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest
inclusions a bit disturbing.
What do you mean by this? You can have children of children of children.
No I can't. When I got Ctrl-D I get a dialog that says:
LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.
and the Description is:
\include{0C__src_books_arch_test}
Your command was ignored.
Type I command return to replace it with another command,
or return to continue without it.
Use Input rather than Include. That should probably be the default.
What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the
document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it
inherited to new components --- I have to set the class of each one.
To some extent, this is a known issue, and there is a sense in which
it can't be solved. If you treat the file as a file unto itself, then
it needs its own document class, preamble, etc. And sometimes a file
can be both a child of another document and a file unto itself. And
for the same reason you do always have to set the document class.
I think that's a weak answer. I don't *need* the children to be valid
as self-contained documents. What I would like is to be able to set a
docu class (optionally) but to have it ignored and defer to the parent
in the case where its a child.
I understand what you want. What I was explaining is why LyX can't
*just* work the way you want. We have had lengthy discussions about this
both on this list and on the devel list, and there are a lot of people
who need the facility I described. So we provide that as an option
(which is how it originally worked, anyway), and people who don't need
that facility---like you and me---have to make do. This is always the
trade-off: Flexibility for the people who need it vs additional effort
for the people who don't.
That said, there probably is room for improvement here. Especially now
that we have this default master setting, a child should probably
inherit the document class of its master, and its modules and such, too.
I'm not sure how well we do with that, but I can't test it now, due to
quite other problems. Of course, if you'd like to look into fixing this
yourself, I'd be happy to provide some pointers.
Richard
Re: Document Include mechanism
On 07/13/2009 02:07 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: Am Montag 13 Juli 2009 04:01:01 schrieb rgheck: That said, there probably is a bug here, especially now that we have this default master setting. A child should probably inherit the document class of its master, and its modules and such, too. I'm not sure how well we do with that. Only if it is exported with the master-buffer-* lfuns. The default master is not supposed to exclude stand-alone usage. Yes, I know: I use the master buffer thing all the time, for which thank you. What I meant was: Maybe there should be another setting, which would mean something like: Inherit the document class, preamble, etc, even when this is compiled on its own. rh
Re: Document Include mechanism
Am Montag 13 Juli 2009 15:30:46 schrieben Sie: Only if it is exported with the master-buffer-* lfuns. The default master is not supposed to exclude stand-alone usage. Yes, I know: I use the master buffer thing all the time, for which thank you. What I meant was: Maybe there should be another setting, which would mean something like: Inherit the document class, preamble, etc, even when this is compiled on its own. Probably. Or just a button that lets you inherit the params from the master. Jürgen
Re: Document Include mechanism
Am Montag 13 Juli 2009 04:01:01 schrieb rgheck: > That said, there probably is a bug here, especially now that we have > this "default master" setting. A child should probably inherit the > document class of its master, and its modules and such, too. I'm not > sure how well we do with that. Only if it is exported with the master-buffer-* lfuns. The default master is not supposed to exclude stand-alone usage. Jürgen
Re: Document Include mechanism
On 07/12/2009 12:57 PM, James Mansion wrote:
Richard Heck wrote:
On 07/12/2009 07:46 AM, James Mansion wrote:
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book
with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version
control) them in more manageable chunks.
This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest
inclusions a bit disturbing.
What do you mean by this? You can have children of children of children.
No I can't. When I got Ctrl-D I get a dialog that says:
LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.
and the Description is:
\include{0C__src_books_arch_test}
Your command was ignored.
Type I to replace it with another command,
or to continue without it.
Use Input rather than Include. That should probably be the default.
What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the
document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it
inherited to new components --- I have to set the class of each one.
To some extent, this is a known issue, and there is a sense in which
it can't be solved. If you treat the file as a file unto itself, then
it needs its own document class, preamble, etc. And sometimes a file
can be both a child of another document and a file unto itself. And
for the same reason you do always have to set the document class.
I think that's a weak answer. I don't *need* the children to be valid
as self-contained documents. What I would like is to be able to set a
docu class (optionally) but to have it ignored and defer to the parent
in the case where its a child.
I understand what you want. What I was explaining is why LyX can't
*just* work the way you want. We have had lengthy discussions about this
both on this list and on the devel list, and there are a lot of people
who need the facility I described. So we provide that as an option
(which is how it originally worked, anyway), and people who don't need
that facility---like you and me---have to make do. This is always the
trade-off: Flexibility for the people who need it vs additional effort
for the people who don't.
That said, there probably is room for improvement here. Especially now
that we have this "default master" setting, a child should probably
inherit the document class of its master, and its modules and such, too.
I'm not sure how well we do with that, but I can't test it now, due to
quite other problems. Of course, if you'd like to look into fixing this
yourself, I'd be happy to provide some pointers.
Richard
Re: Document Include mechanism
On 07/13/2009 02:07 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: Am Montag 13 Juli 2009 04:01:01 schrieb rgheck: That said, there probably is a bug here, especially now that we have this "default master" setting. A child should probably inherit the document class of its master, and its modules and such, too. I'm not sure how well we do with that. Only if it is exported with the master-buffer-* lfuns. The default master is not supposed to exclude stand-alone usage. Yes, I know: I use the master buffer thing all the time, for which thank you. What I meant was: Maybe there should be another setting, which would mean something like: Inherit the document class, preamble, etc, even when this is compiled on its own. rh
Re: Document Include mechanism
Am Montag 13 Juli 2009 15:30:46 schrieben Sie: > > Only if it is exported with the master-buffer-* lfuns. The default master > > is not supposed to exclude stand-alone usage. > > > > > > Yes, I know: I use the master buffer thing all the time, for which thank > you. What I meant was: Maybe there should be another setting, which > would mean something like: Inherit the document class, preamble, etc, > even when this is compiled on its own. Probably. Or just a button that lets you inherit the params from the master. Jürgen
Document Include mechanism
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version control) them in more manageable chunks. This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest inclusions a bit disturbing. What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it inherited to new components --- I have to set the class of each one. I'm a bit concerned that if I change the document class (its currently Koma book, but I might want to change this) it will be quite messy and some inconsistencies might sneak in. I guess I could give in and just have one big document but as a developer that just feels all wrong somehow. The help files (at least on 1.6.2) don't seem to deal with sturcturing large projects at all - are there other hints and tips I can use? James
Re: Document Include mechanism
Richard Heck wrote:
On 07/12/2009 07:46 AM, James Mansion wrote:
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book
with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version
control) them in more manageable chunks.
This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest
inclusions a bit disturbing.
What do you mean by this? You can have children of children of children.
No I can't. When I got Ctrl-D I get a dialog that says:
LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.
and the Description is:
\include{0C__src_books_arch_test}
Your command was ignored.
Type I command return to replace it with another command,
or return to continue without it.
What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the
document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it inherited
to new components --- I have to set the class of each one.
To some extent, this is a known issue, and there is a sense in which
it can't be solved. If you treat the file as a file unto itself, then
it needs its own document class, preamble, etc. And sometimes a file
can be both a child of another document and a file unto itself. And
for the same reason you do always have to set the document class.
I think that's a weak answer. I don't *need* the children to be valid
as self-contained documents, What I would like is to be able to set a
docu class (optionally) but to have it ignored and defer to the parent
in the case where its a child.
The only annoyance here is that you will get an error message when you
compile, saying that the document classes are different. Then you can
fix it.
Not if the problem is that I didn't copy across a preamble element.
James
Re: Document Include mechanism
On 07/12/2009 12:57 PM, James Mansion wrote:
Richard Heck wrote:
On 07/12/2009 07:46 AM, James Mansion wrote:
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book
with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version
control) them in more manageable chunks.
This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest
inclusions a bit disturbing.
What do you mean by this? You can have children of children of children.
No I can't. When I got Ctrl-D I get a dialog that says:
LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.
and the Description is:
\include{0C__src_books_arch_test}
Your command was ignored.
Type I command return to replace it with another command,
or return to continue without it.
Use Input rather than Include. That should probably be the default.
What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the
document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it
inherited to new components --- I have to set the class of each one.
To some extent, this is a known issue, and there is a sense in which
it can't be solved. If you treat the file as a file unto itself, then
it needs its own document class, preamble, etc. And sometimes a file
can be both a child of another document and a file unto itself. And
for the same reason you do always have to set the document class.
I think that's a weak answer. I don't *need* the children to be valid
as self-contained documents. What I would like is to be able to set a
docu class (optionally) but to have it ignored and defer to the parent
in the case where its a child.
I understand what you want. What I was explaining is why LyX can't just
work the way you want. We have had lengthy discussions about this both
on this list and on the devel list, and there are a lot of people who
need the facility I described. So we provide that, and people who don't
need that facility---like you and me--- have to make do.
That said, there probably is a bug here, especially now that we have
this default master setting. A child should probably inherit the
document class of its master, and its modules and such, too. I'm not
sure how well we do with that.
Richard
Document Include mechanism
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version control) them in more manageable chunks. This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest inclusions a bit disturbing. What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it inherited to new components --- I have to set the class of each one. I'm a bit concerned that if I change the document class (its currently Koma book, but I might want to change this) it will be quite messy and some inconsistencies might sneak in. I guess I could give in and just have one big document but as a developer that just feels all wrong somehow. The help files (at least on 1.6.2) don't seem to deal with sturcturing large projects at all - are there other hints and tips I can use? James
Re: Document Include mechanism
Richard Heck wrote:
On 07/12/2009 07:46 AM, James Mansion wrote:
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book
with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version
control) them in more manageable chunks.
This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest
inclusions a bit disturbing.
What do you mean by this? You can have children of children of children.
No I can't. When I got Ctrl-D I get a dialog that says:
LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.
and the Description is:
\include{0C__src_books_arch_test}
Your command was ignored.
Type I command return to replace it with another command,
or return to continue without it.
What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the
document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it inherited
to new components --- I have to set the class of each one.
To some extent, this is a known issue, and there is a sense in which
it can't be solved. If you treat the file as a file unto itself, then
it needs its own document class, preamble, etc. And sometimes a file
can be both a child of another document and a file unto itself. And
for the same reason you do always have to set the document class.
I think that's a weak answer. I don't *need* the children to be valid
as self-contained documents, What I would like is to be able to set a
docu class (optionally) but to have it ignored and defer to the parent
in the case where its a child.
The only annoyance here is that you will get an error message when you
compile, saying that the document classes are different. Then you can
fix it.
Not if the problem is that I didn't copy across a preamble element.
James
Re: Document Include mechanism
On 07/12/2009 12:57 PM, James Mansion wrote:
Richard Heck wrote:
On 07/12/2009 07:46 AM, James Mansion wrote:
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book
with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version
control) them in more manageable chunks.
This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest
inclusions a bit disturbing.
What do you mean by this? You can have children of children of children.
No I can't. When I got Ctrl-D I get a dialog that says:
LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.
and the Description is:
\include{0C__src_books_arch_test}
Your command was ignored.
Type I command return to replace it with another command,
or return to continue without it.
Use Input rather than Include. That should probably be the default.
What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the
document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it
inherited to new components --- I have to set the class of each one.
To some extent, this is a known issue, and there is a sense in which
it can't be solved. If you treat the file as a file unto itself, then
it needs its own document class, preamble, etc. And sometimes a file
can be both a child of another document and a file unto itself. And
for the same reason you do always have to set the document class.
I think that's a weak answer. I don't *need* the children to be valid
as self-contained documents. What I would like is to be able to set a
docu class (optionally) but to have it ignored and defer to the parent
in the case where its a child.
I understand what you want. What I was explaining is why LyX can't just
work the way you want. We have had lengthy discussions about this both
on this list and on the devel list, and there are a lot of people who
need the facility I described. So we provide that, and people who don't
need that facility---like you and me--- have to make do.
That said, there probably is a bug here, especially now that we have
this default master setting. A child should probably inherit the
document class of its master, and its modules and such, too. I'm not
sure how well we do with that.
Richard
Document Include mechanism
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version control) them in more manageable chunks. This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest inclusions a bit disturbing. What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it inherited to new components --- I have to set the class of each one. I'm a bit concerned that if I change the document class (its currently Koma book, but I might want to change this) it will be quite messy and some inconsistencies might sneak in. I guess I could give in and just have one big document but as a developer that just feels all wrong somehow. The help files (at least on 1.6.2) don't seem to deal with sturcturing large projects at all - are there other hints and tips I can use? James
Re: Document Include mechanism
Richard Heck wrote:
On 07/12/2009 07:46 AM, James Mansion wrote:
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book
with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version
control) them in more manageable chunks.
This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest
inclusions a bit disturbing.
What do you mean by this? You can have children of children of children.
No I can't. When I got Ctrl-D I get a dialog that says:
LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.
and the Description is:
\include{0C__src_books_arch_test}
Your command was ignored.
Type I to replace it with another command,
or to continue without it.
What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the
document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it inherited
to new components --- I have to set the class of each one.
To some extent, this is a known issue, and there is a sense in which
it can't be solved. If you treat the file as a file unto itself, then
it needs its own document class, preamble, etc. And sometimes a file
can be both a child of another document and a file unto itself. And
for the same reason you do always have to set the document class.
I think that's a weak answer. I don't *need* the children to be valid
as self-contained documents, What I would like is to be able to set a
docu class (optionally) but to have it ignored and defer to the parent
in the case where its a child.
The only annoyance here is that you will get an error message when you
compile, saying that the document classes are different. Then you can
fix it.
Not if the problem is that I didn't copy across a preamble element.
James
Re: Document Include mechanism
On 07/12/2009 12:57 PM, James Mansion wrote:
Richard Heck wrote:
On 07/12/2009 07:46 AM, James Mansion wrote:
I may be doing the wrong thing - but I stared trying to write a book
with each Part in a separate document so I can edit (and version
control) them in more manageable chunks.
This seems to be working though I find the inability to nest
inclusions a bit disturbing.
What do you mean by this? You can have children of children of children.
No I can't. When I got Ctrl-D I get a dialog that says:
LaTeX Error: \include cannot be nested.
and the Description is:
\include{0C__src_books_arch_test}
Your command was ignored.
Type I to replace it with another command,
or to continue without it.
Use Input rather than Include. That should probably be the default.
What is more worrying is that I don't seem to be able to set the
document class and LaTeX preamble on the master and have it
inherited to new components --- I have to set the class of each one.
To some extent, this is a known issue, and there is a sense in which
it can't be solved. If you treat the file as a file unto itself, then
it needs its own document class, preamble, etc. And sometimes a file
can be both a child of another document and a file unto itself. And
for the same reason you do always have to set the document class.
I think that's a weak answer. I don't *need* the children to be valid
as self-contained documents. What I would like is to be able to set a
docu class (optionally) but to have it ignored and defer to the parent
in the case where its a child.
I understand what you want. What I was explaining is why LyX can't just
work the way you want. We have had lengthy discussions about this both
on this list and on the devel list, and there are a lot of people who
need the facility I described. So we provide that, and people who don't
need that facility---like you and me--- have to make do.
That said, there probably is a bug here, especially now that we have
this "default master" setting. A child should probably inherit the
document class of its master, and its modules and such, too. I'm not
sure how well we do with that.
Richard
