Re: [M100] Wiring Question

[Mike Stein]

Very nice!


On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 7:54 PM Spencer  wrote:

> I'm pleased. I finished it about 15 mins ago.
>
> The USB can provide up to the voltage of the PS (17.8VDC), and that
> voltmeter uses the power from the PS terminals in the box, but the larger
> meter doesn't do it that. It was an $8.00 meter I had to build and its
> design requires an external battery source, so I just added a battery
> holder on the back. The smaller meter was $54.00 (and too high!!!) with no
> light and for that much money.
>
> It was a lot of fun, and you and Brian made it easier and educational, and
> I really appreciate you two taking the time to suggest and guide.
>
> I've attached two pics showing testing with both the banana plugs and USB
> port hooked to a handheld meter.
>
> Spencer
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, December 11, 2022 at 03:47:03 PM EST, Mike Stein <
> mhs.st...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Excellent! Nothing more satisfying than a job well done.
>
> Just curious: if you have a fixed 5V for the USB port, why do you have to
> power the meter from a battery?
>
> m
>
> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 11:52 AM Spencer  wrote:
>
> Works great!!  I'm tickled. I did it exactly the way you recommended. It
> looks great too!  I'll get the USB port today and install it.  I'll send a
> pic of the finished product. Words can't express enough gratitude for your
> help!
>
> Spencer
>
> On Saturday, December 10, 2022 at 06:11:33 AM EST, Brian K. White <
> b.kenyo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Ok the pins are probably like this:
> http://switches-connectors-custom.cwind.com/Asset/GRB293B01BR.pdf
> The top-right corner shows the wiring for oins 1,2,3, and further down
> on the right shows where 1, 2, & 3 are physically. And the pics from the
> ebay listing also show pin number 1,2,3 in order like that (They aren't
> always, I almost posted a link to an identical looking switch that had
> the center pin numbered 1, but still had the same physical arrangement.)
>
> And it looks like the light probably takes 120vac.
>
> Which means hook the incoming hot to pin 1 (silver not in the center)
> load to pin 2 (silver in the center)
> neutral to pin 3 (the brass one)
> neutral also to the other side of the load.
>
> When you open the switch, neither the load nor the light gets power.
> When you close the switch, both the load and the light gets power.
>
> Which I believe is more or less what you guessed in the first place when
> you said ground to the brass one. Except in this case there is no ground
> and not even any consistent neutral, and you don't want to treat
> anything as actually gnd or neutral.
>
> Without a polarized plug, you're just picking one of the two wires at
> random and calling it "hot" and calling the other "neutral", but in this
> case they are just labels to keep track of them, the "neutral" isn't
> really neutral. You can't tie either wire to gnd or to the chassis
> anywhere (if there is any chassis or metal case), and the chassis must
> be fully insulated. Both wires are treated as hot in that sense.
>
> Personally I just would not use a non-polarized plug. I'd get a new
> normal cord and the white wire is neutral and the black wire is hot.
>
> --
> bkw
>
> On 12/9/22 15:04, Spencer wrote:
> > Hello Brian.
> >
> > It's a SPST 3 position switch.  Link ==> 10x SPST Red Neon Light On/Off
> > Round Rocker Switch 6A/250V 10A/125V AC | eBay
> > 
>
> >
> > Been busy - darn gum surgery. Not fun ;-(
> >
> >
> > On Tuesday, December 6, 2022 at 07:16:09 PM EST, Brian K. White
> >  wrote:
> >
> >
> > If the plug is not polarized then there is no hot or neutral.
> >
> > One wire IS hot (swings from -120v to +120v relative to GND).
> > And one wire IS neutral (stays at 0v relative to GND).
> >
> > Relative to each other, it's the same 120vac either direction, or
> > rather, there is no such thing as a direction.
> >
> > But if the plug is not polarized then you have to treat both wires as
> > equally hot, since every time it's plugged in either side could be the
> > hot side that time, at random.
> >
> > Switches come in all kinds of arrangements, so the only way to know how
> > to wire this particular switch is to test it with a continuity tester
> > and observe what connections it makes in each position, or consult it's
> > datasheet. Sometimes there is a diagram of the connections drawn right
> > on the body, otherwise google it's model number or find the datasheet
> > from the website where you got it or perhaps it's packaging.
> >
> > A rocker with 3 pins and 2 positions (you didn't say how many positions
> > btw so I'm assuming) is fairly likely to be a center-common SPDT on-on,
> > hopefully non-shorting (break-before-make). Meaning the center pin is
> > connected to either one side or the other at any given time. When you're
> > turning one pin off, you're also turning the other pin on at the same
> > time. In this case since yoiu only care about turning something on/off,
> > you would just use 

Re: [M100] Wiring Question

[Mike Stein]

Excellent! Nothing more satisfying than a job well done.

Just curious: if you have a fixed 5V for the USB port, why do you have to
power the meter from a battery?

m

On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 11:52 AM Spencer  wrote:

> Works great!!  I'm tickled. I did it exactly the way you recommended. It
> looks great too!  I'll get the USB port today and install it.  I'll send a
> pic of the finished product. Words can't express enough gratitude for your
> help!
>
> Spencer
>
> On Saturday, December 10, 2022 at 06:11:33 AM EST, Brian K. White <
> b.kenyo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Ok the pins are probably like this:
> http://switches-connectors-custom.cwind.com/Asset/GRB293B01BR.pdf
> The top-right corner shows the wiring for oins 1,2,3, and further down
> on the right shows where 1, 2, & 3 are physically. And the pics from the
> ebay listing also show pin number 1,2,3 in order like that (They aren't
> always, I almost posted a link to an identical looking switch that had
> the center pin numbered 1, but still had the same physical arrangement.)
>
> And it looks like the light probably takes 120vac.
>
> Which means hook the incoming hot to pin 1 (silver not in the center)
> load to pin 2 (silver in the center)
> neutral to pin 3 (the brass one)
> neutral also to the other side of the load.
>
> When you open the switch, neither the load nor the light gets power.
> When you close the switch, both the load and the light gets power.
>
> Which I believe is more or less what you guessed in the first place when
> you said ground to the brass one. Except in this case there is no ground
> and not even any consistent neutral, and you don't want to treat
> anything as actually gnd or neutral.
>
> Without a polarized plug, you're just picking one of the two wires at
> random and calling it "hot" and calling the other "neutral", but in this
> case they are just labels to keep track of them, the "neutral" isn't
> really neutral. You can't tie either wire to gnd or to the chassis
> anywhere (if there is any chassis or metal case), and the chassis must
> be fully insulated. Both wires are treated as hot in that sense.
>
> Personally I just would not use a non-polarized plug. I'd get a new
> normal cord and the white wire is neutral and the black wire is hot.
>
> --
> bkw
>
> On 12/9/22 15:04, Spencer wrote:
> > Hello Brian.
> >
> > It's a SPST 3 position switch.  Link ==> 10x SPST Red Neon Light On/Off
> > Round Rocker Switch 6A/250V 10A/125V AC | eBay
> > 
>
> >
> > Been busy - darn gum surgery. Not fun ;-(
> >
> >
> > On Tuesday, December 6, 2022 at 07:16:09 PM EST, Brian K. White
> >  wrote:
> >
> >
> > If the plug is not polarized then there is no hot or neutral.
> >
> > One wire IS hot (swings from -120v to +120v relative to GND).
> > And one wire IS neutral (stays at 0v relative to GND).
> >
> > Relative to each other, it's the same 120vac either direction, or
> > rather, there is no such thing as a direction.
> >
> > But if the plug is not polarized then you have to treat both wires as
> > equally hot, since every time it's plugged in either side could be the
> > hot side that time, at random.
> >
> > Switches come in all kinds of arrangements, so the only way to know how
> > to wire this particular switch is to test it with a continuity tester
> > and observe what connections it makes in each position, or consult it's
> > datasheet. Sometimes there is a diagram of the connections drawn right
> > on the body, otherwise google it's model number or find the datasheet
> > from the website where you got it or perhaps it's packaging.
> >
> > A rocker with 3 pins and 2 positions (you didn't say how many positions
> > btw so I'm assuming) is fairly likely to be a center-common SPDT on-on,
> > hopefully non-shorting (break-before-make). Meaning the center pin is
> > connected to either one side or the other at any given time. When you're
> > turning one pin off, you're also turning the other pin on at the same
> > time. In this case since yoiu only care about turning something on/off,
> > you would just use the common pin and either one of the others. You just
> > run your hot wire from the wall to the center pin and connect the load
> > to either of the other pins, either one, doesn't matter, but only one,
> > and leave the other pin unconnected. (might want to cover it with
> > heat-shrink)
> >
> > Except that is just one common configuration and might not be right for
> > your switch.
> >
> > Really the switch could be totally different. It might have 3 positions
> > and be on-off-on, or the common pin might not be the center pin, or it
> > could be a lighted switch where only 2 pins are for switching and the
> > 3rd pin is to power the light, and that light may also possibly not take
> > the same voltage as what's passing through the main pins.
> >
> > Even a lighted switch where at least one of the pins is definitely
> > special and different, still doesn't necessarily have a right way to
> 

Re: [M100] Wiring Question

[Spencer]

 Works great!!  I'm tickled. I did it exactly the way you recommended. It looks 
great too!  I'll get the USB port today and install it.  I'll send a pic of the 
finished product. Words can't express enough gratitude for your help!
Spencer
On Saturday, December 10, 2022 at 06:11:33 AM EST, Brian K. White 
 wrote:  
 
 Ok the pins are probably like this:
http://switches-connectors-custom.cwind.com/Asset/GRB293B01BR.pdf
The top-right corner shows the wiring for oins 1,2,3, and further down 
on the right shows where 1, 2, & 3 are physically. And the pics from the 
ebay listing also show pin number 1,2,3 in order like that (They aren't 
always, I almost posted a link to an identical looking switch that had 
the center pin numbered 1, but still had the same physical arrangement.)

And it looks like the light probably takes 120vac.

Which means hook the incoming hot to pin 1 (silver not in the center)
load to pin 2 (silver in the center)
neutral to pin 3 (the brass one)
neutral also to the other side of the load.

When you open the switch, neither the load nor the light gets power.
When you close the switch, both the load and the light gets power.

Which I believe is more or less what you guessed in the first place when 
you said ground to the brass one. Except in this case there is no ground 
and not even any consistent neutral, and you don't want to treat 
anything as actually gnd or neutral.

Without a polarized plug, you're just picking one of the two wires at 
random and calling it "hot" and calling the other "neutral", but in this 
case they are just labels to keep track of them, the "neutral" isn't 
really neutral. You can't tie either wire to gnd or to the chassis 
anywhere (if there is any chassis or metal case), and the chassis must 
be fully insulated. Both wires are treated as hot in that sense.

Personally I just would not use a non-polarized plug. I'd get a new 
normal cord and the white wire is neutral and the black wire is hot.

-- 
bkw

On 12/9/22 15:04, Spencer wrote:
> Hello Brian.
> 
> It's a SPST 3 position switch.  Link ==> 10x SPST Red Neon Light On/Off 
> Round Rocker Switch 6A/250V 10A/125V AC | eBay 
> 
> 
> Been busy - darn gum surgery. Not fun ;-(
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, December 6, 2022 at 07:16:09 PM EST, Brian K. White 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> If the plug is not polarized then there is no hot or neutral.
> 
> One wire IS hot (swings from -120v to +120v relative to GND).
> And one wire IS neutral (stays at 0v relative to GND).
> 
> Relative to each other, it's the same 120vac either direction, or
> rather, there is no such thing as a direction.
> 
> But if the plug is not polarized then you have to treat both wires as
> equally hot, since every time it's plugged in either side could be the
> hot side that time, at random.
> 
> Switches come in all kinds of arrangements, so the only way to know how
> to wire this particular switch is to test it with a continuity tester
> and observe what connections it makes in each position, or consult it's
> datasheet. Sometimes there is a diagram of the connections drawn right
> on the body, otherwise google it's model number or find the datasheet
> from the website where you got it or perhaps it's packaging.
> 
> A rocker with 3 pins and 2 positions (you didn't say how many positions
> btw so I'm assuming) is fairly likely to be a center-common SPDT on-on,
> hopefully non-shorting (break-before-make). Meaning the center pin is
> connected to either one side or the other at any given time. When you're
> turning one pin off, you're also turning the other pin on at the same
> time. In this case since yoiu only care about turning something on/off,
> you would just use the common pin and either one of the others. You just
> run your hot wire from the wall to the center pin and connect the load
> to either of the other pins, either one, doesn't matter, but only one,
> and leave the other pin unconnected. (might want to cover it with
> heat-shrink)
> 
> Except that is just one common configuration and might not be right for
> your switch.
> 
> Really the switch could be totally different. It might have 3 positions
> and be on-off-on, or the common pin might not be the center pin, or it
> could be a lighted switch where only 2 pins are for switching and the
> 3rd pin is to power the light, and that light may also possibly not take
> the same voltage as what's passing through the main pins.
> 
> Even a lighted switch where at least one of the pins is definitely
> special and different, still doesn't necessarily have a right way to
> wire it, since it's still up to you to decide when you want the light to
> be on. Usually you want the light to reflect the power state, on when
> the device is turned on. Or maybe you want the light to be a pilot light
> that is on at all times so that you can find it in the dark, or so that
> it indicates when power is available to the device rather than
> indicating when the device is 

Re: [M100] I'm back

[Kevin Lee]

welcome back... I've recently gone off some brand of cigars with Cohiba/TTT 
being the
worst since oct 1 Chinese owned Intertabac 
bought them raised pricing 150%... :)

I have a box of T200/drives/books and parts im not using.. 

Thanks






--- Original Message ---
On Sunday, December 11th, 2022 at 11:24 AM, Daniel L  wrote:


> 
> 
> Hi folks,
> 
> Daniel here. Finally resub'd. I had major issues. First, I was
> self-hosting my email domain at home. This led to my domain going into
> spam lists because the major players out there don't want people
> managing their own email these days.
> 
> I started using my daily BBS to obtain my mails but, the sysop wasn't
> managing the BBS for a long time and issues led to a discontinuation of
> email receipts.
> 
> Laziness set in.
> 
> Okay, I'm back.
> 
> I have two model 100's and a 200. Bought the 200 from a member on this
> list a number of years back. I haven't used it in a long time becuase
> shortly after I received it, problems arose.
> 
> Now, I have a revived interest in getting it fixed.
> 
> What have I been up to? Tons of work, flying, family obligations, and
> exploring my love of cigars.
> 
> It's good to be back with yall fine individuals.
> 
> Anyone subscribe to any tandy related newsgroups? BBS's?
> 
> Daniel

[M100] I'm back

[Daniel L]

Hi folks,

Daniel here. Finally resub'd. I had major issues. First, I was 
self-hosting my email domain at home. This led to my domain going into 
spam lists because the major players out there don't want people 
managing their own email these days.


I started using my daily BBS to obtain my mails but, the sysop wasn't 
managing the BBS for a long time and issues led to a discontinuation of 
email receipts.


Laziness set in.

Okay, I'm back.

I have two model 100's and a 200. Bought the 200 from a member on this 
list a number of years back. I haven't used it in a long time becuase 
shortly after I received it, problems arose.


Now, I have a revived interest in getting it fixed.

What have I been up to? Tons of work, flying, family obligations, and 
exploring my love of cigars.


It's good to be back with yall fine individuals.

Anyone subscribe to any tandy related newsgroups? BBS's?

Daniel