Re: [Mailman-Users] post formatting and timing

[Mark Sapiro]

Ivan Van Laningham wrote:
> 
> I think something else is going on, besides just the  only line 
> ending.  I'm using two versions of T-Bird, 1.5 and 2.0 something, and 
> both display the message concerned the same way, all crammed together on 
> a single line.  I think there must be some encoding issue.  It probably 
> is some configuration issue with T-Bird, but I've not been able to find it.


I can't find any relevant configuration setting in T-Bird, and I don't
see the problem in T-Bird 2.0.0.4 with a utf-8 charset base64 encoded
message I received through a test list. The message contained the following
--
This should be a unicode encoded message.

Throw in a few “funny” chars

To get encoding
--
The lines of dashes are separate lines and in between are a line of
text, an empty line, a second line of text, a second empty line and a
third line of text. I'm sending this in utf-8 charset (I hope), and it
should come from the list encoded base64, and I expect it will display
as described in my T-Bird 2.0.0.4. What do you see?

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San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] post formatting and timing

[Michael Welch]

Hi everyone. Just as a followup, Katrina on the Eudora list I am on came up 
with a UTF-8 decoder plug-in.
http://windharp.de/software/utf8iso.htm

Stephen J. Turnbull wrote at 07:22 PM 06/26/2007:
 
>Mark Sapiro writes:
>
> > I don't know if there is a standard that says your MUA 'should'
> > recognize a single  in the decoded text as a line break,
>
>Since it's in UTF-8, Unicode does, Technical Annex #14.  Conformance
>is required by Unicode 4.0.
>
>Of course if the MUA doesn't claim conformance to Unicode there's no
>requirement, and AFAIK there's nothing in RFC 2822 or the MIME RFCs
>that requires conformance to any text standard beyond ASCII.  However,
>most Unicode requirements are considered "best current practice".


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Re: [Mailman-Users] post formatting and timing

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Mark Sapiro writes:

 > I don't know if there is a standard that says your MUA 'should'
 > recognize a single  in the decoded text as a line break,

Since it's in UTF-8, Unicode does, Technical Annex #14.  Conformance
is required by Unicode 4.0.

Of course if the MUA doesn't claim conformance to Unicode there's no
requirement, and AFAIK there's nothing in RFC 2822 or the MIME RFCs
that requires conformance to any text standard beyond ASCII.  However,
most Unicode requirements are considered "best current practice".
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Re: [Mailman-Users] post formatting and timing

[Ivan Van Laningham]

Hi All--


Mark Sapiro wrote:
> 
> I don't know if there is a standard that says your MUA 'should'
> recognize a single  in the decoded text as a line break, but of
> five MUA's I just tried, four - Ultrafunk Popcorn 1.76, Mozilla
> Thunderbird 2.0.0.4, MS Outlook Express 6 and Mutt 1.4.2.1i - all
> rendered  in the decoded text as a line break. The fifth -
> Qualcomm Eudora 5.2 (very old) - didn't decode the base64 encoded text
> at all, it just displayed the raw base64 encoded data.
> 

I think something else is going on, besides just the  only line 
ending.  I'm using two versions of T-Bird, 1.5 and 2.0 something, and 
both display the message concerned the same way, all crammed together on 
a single line.  I think there must be some encoding issue.  It probably 
is some configuration issue with T-Bird, but I've not been able to find it.

Metta,
Ivan

-- 
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Re: [Mailman-Users] post formatting and timing

[Mark Sapiro]

Mark Sapiro wrote:
>
>My guess (I haven't actually looked at the raw decoded message) is that
>the decoded plain text has *nix  only line endings as opposed to
> endings. This would not violate RFC 2821 as the data on the
>wire is the base64 encoded data, not the original text.


I have now looked, and in today's two base64 encoded posts in the
"export list subscribers list" thread, the decoded message body does
have text with only  as a line ending.

So,

>I think the issue may be that your MUA doesn't recognize a single 
>in the decoded text as a line break.


I don't know if there is a standard that says your MUA 'should'
recognize a single  in the decoded text as a line break, but of
five MUA's I just tried, four - Ultrafunk Popcorn 1.76, Mozilla
Thunderbird 2.0.0.4, MS Outlook Express 6 and Mutt 1.4.2.1i - all
rendered  in the decoded text as a line break. The fifth -
Qualcomm Eudora 5.2 (very old) - didn't decode the base64 encoded text
at all, it just displayed the raw base64 encoded data.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] post formatting and timing

[Mark Sapiro]

Michael Welch wrote:

>Hi again. The problem seemed cured, now I am getting garbled posts again.


Here's my guess about the 'missing' line returns.

The original posts in the "I lost my patch  :-(" thread were in charset
utf-8 and were base64 encoded. So were a couple of the posts in
today's "export list subscribers list" thread.

My guess (I haven't actually looked at the raw decoded message) is that
the decoded plain text has *nix  only line endings as opposed to
 endings. This would not violate RFC 2821 as the data on the
wire is the base64 encoded data, not the original text.

I think the issue may be that your MUA doesn't recognize a single 
in the decoded text as a line break.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] post formatting and timing

[Michael Welch]

Thanks Brad & Dan for straightening me out. Kinda embarrassing, since I am a 
header watcher.

Peace.

Brad Knowles wrote at 09:29 AM 06/26/2007:
 
>On 6/26/07, Michael Welch wrote:
>
>> Hi again. The problem seemed cured, now I am getting garbled posts again.
>>
>> Further, this post took a full 6 days to show up after I sent it.
>>
>> Maybe I am on moderation, and the moderator is slow at checking in. Or ??
>
>Try checking your headers again:
>
>Received: from homepower.com (rickgermany.com [72.32.57.52])
>by bag.python.org (Postfix) with ESMTP
>for ; Tue, 26 Jun 2007
>13:20:00 +0200 (CEST)
>Received: from adsl-66-126-233-22.dsl.anhm01.pacbell.net
>[66.126.233.22] by homepower.com with SMTP; Wed,
>20 Jun 2007 19:15:19 -0700
>
>Whatever machine is running homepower.com, they delayed your mail, not us.
>
>Moreover, mailman-users is one of the very few mailman-* lists where new 
>members are not moderated by default.  Once you're subscribed, you should be 
>able to post immediately.
>
>
>I can't speak to the other problems.
>
>-- 
>Brad Knowles <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Consultant & Author
>LinkedIn Profile: 
>Slides from Invited Talks: 
>
>09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0


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Re: [Mailman-Users] post formatting and timing

[Brad Knowles]

On 6/26/07, Michael Welch wrote:

>  Hi again. The problem seemed cured, now I am getting garbled posts again.
>
>  Further, this post took a full 6 days to show up after I sent it.
>
>  Maybe I am on moderation, and the moderator is slow at checking in. Or ??

Try checking your headers again:

Received: from homepower.com (rickgermany.com [72.32.57.52])
by bag.python.org (Postfix) with ESMTP
for ; Tue, 26 Jun 2007
13:20:00 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from adsl-66-126-233-22.dsl.anhm01.pacbell.net
[66.126.233.22] by homepower.com with SMTP; Wed,
20 Jun 2007 19:15:19 -0700

Whatever machine is running homepower.com, they delayed your mail, not us.

Moreover, mailman-users is one of the very few mailman-* lists where 
new members are not moderated by default.  Once you're subscribed, 
you should be able to post immediately.


I can't speak to the other problems.

-- 
Brad Knowles <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Consultant & Author
LinkedIn Profile: 
Slides from Invited Talks: 

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
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Re: [Mailman-Users] post formatting and timing

[Michael Welch]

Hi again. The problem seemed cured, now I am getting garbled posts again.

Further, this post took a full 6 days to show up after I sent it.

Maybe I am on moderation, and the moderator is slow at checking in. Or ??

Michael Welch wrote at 07:04 PM 06/20/2007:
 
>This list's posts started showing up with all the line returns ignored. None 
>of my other emails are showing up this way. Not sure when it started, I have 
>been on vacation. But I noticed it earlier today and decided to start watching 
>it.
>
>Am I the only one?


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707-822-7884
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