Re: [MlMt] caret position in replies

[Robert Brenstein]

On 21 Feb 2019, at 16:27, Robert Brenstein wrote:


On 21 Feb 2019, at 15:18, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:


On 20 Feb 2019, at 21:00, Robert Brenstein wrote:

Yes, the signature position in set to be on top for both of us. 
Neither of us has an actual signature inserted.


Also try clicking “Reset Usage History” in the Signatures 
preferences pane to make sure MailMate did not learn a different 
preference.


--
Benny


I will try that tonight. However, the caret position as such is 
correct - it is before the first character in the reply email for both 
of us. The difference is that I have two empty lines inserted before 
the quoted original email and my wife does not. The visible settings 
we have, at least those that seem relevant, appear to be the same. I 
have a number of hidden settings added, so I suspect that the 
difference is there. But may be not.


Robert


Clicking “Reset Usage History” in the Signatures preferences pane 
fixed the problem !!!

All is well now :-)

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Re: [MlMt] Gravatar-hack for MailMate

[Charlie Garrison]

Good morning,

On 22 Feb 2019, at 1:35, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:


The attached file needs to be saved in this folder:

/Users//Application 
Support/MailMate/Resources/Layouts/headersFormatting.plist


I've already got a custom headersFormatting.plist which is quite 
different from the one you supplied. Would you be willing to point out 
what the differences are for the Gravatar icon? Or, is there any docco 
to explain the structure of the headersFormatting.plist file?


Thanks,
Charlie


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PO Box 380
Tumbarumba NSW 2653  Australia
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Re: [MlMt] beta r5609

[Sherman Wilcox]

Thanks for the link, Benny. I’ll keep the beta version and try to 
figure out if there is a pattern. Another case, a single message, just 
occurred. Should I forward that message to you?


--
Sherman

On 21 Feb 2019, at 13:15, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:


On 21 Feb 2019, at 18:17, Sherman Wilcox via mailmate wrote:

I am using this version as of today and see an issue, I believe. Some 
junk messages that are routed to Junk (by SpamSieve) still appear in 
the Inbox. But they cannot be selected or deleted. When I navigate to 
the Junk folder and select the message there, it then disappears from 
the Inbox. And of course it can be deleted from the Junk folder.


That doesn't sound good. I don't seem to be able to reproduce it. Let 
me know if you see any pattern with regard to when it does and does 
not happen.


Could you also try and see if downgrading solves the issue: 
http://updates.mailmate-app.com/archives/MailMate_r5594.tbz


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Re: [MlMt] Gravatar-hack for MailMate

[Verdon Vaillancourt]

Yup

> Is the "library" folder missing in the initial path?
>
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Re: [MlMt] Gravatar-hack for MailMate

[Rick Cogley]

>   /Users//Application 
> Support/MailMate/Resources/Layouts/headersFormatting.plist

I wanted to try this, but I cannot find this path. Instead, I have:

 /Users//Library/Application Support/Mailmate…

Is the "library" folder missing in the initial path?

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Re: [MlMt] beta r5609

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 21 Feb 2019, at 18:17, Sherman Wilcox via mailmate wrote:

I am using this version as of today and see an issue, I believe. Some 
junk messages that are routed to Junk (by SpamSieve) still appear in 
the Inbox. But they cannot be selected or deleted. When I navigate to 
the Junk folder and select the message there, it then disappears from 
the Inbox. And of course it can be deleted from the Junk folder.


That doesn't sound good. I don't seem to be able to reproduce it. Let me 
know if you see any pattern with regard to when it does and does not 
happen.


Could you also try and see if downgrading solves the issue: 
http://updates.mailmate-app.com/archives/MailMate_r5594.tbz


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[MlMt] beta r5609

[Sherman Wilcox via mailmate]

I am using this version as of today and see an issue, I believe. Some 
junk messages that are routed to Junk (by SpamSieve) still appear in the 
Inbox. But they cannot be selected or deleted. When I navigate to the 
Junk folder and select the message there, it then disappears from the 
Inbox. And of course it can be deleted from the Junk folder.


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Re: [MlMt] Group Submailbox peer weeek

[Michael Nietzold]

Von meinem iDingens gesendet...

> Am 21.02.2019 um 14:12 schrieb Benny Kjær Nielsen :
> 
> On 13 Feb 2019, at 22:41, Michael Nietzold wrote:
> 
> i like to make a submailbox for each week in year
> 
> where:
> - i create a submailbox
> - i select a date
> 
> what i see:
> - i can only select some parts of the Date
> 
> You mean you don't have a “Week” option?
> 
Yes. No WeekinYear


> what i expected:
> - it should be a better "custom selector" for Submailbox unique value 
> selector (just now i can only select an message field but not the modifiers
> 
> I don't think I understand that.
> 
- In the submailbox settings
- I can for "unique value" drop down and select "other..."
- there I have a list of some values
- I can select them
- but I don't have some kind of editor where I can add some modifiers 

for example when:
- I select a date then use a custom format string - or I select the subject and 
like to have some regex over the subject to group it some crazy other ways

Example: tried sometimes to group my mails by a "[text1] Text2" subject and get 
only crazy solutions. Later I found there is a "blob"  (formatted as 
${subject.blob} in mailbox format)



> - i see an manual section for the modifiers available in the "Mailbox Name 
> Format"
> 
> Yes, that would be nice. To some extent, you can derive it from the “Headers” 
> popup. For example if “From ▸ Address” exists then so does from.address, but 
> it's not always like this. So-called virtual headers are prefixed with # or 
> ##. One (primitive) way to see this is to create a mailbox condition and then 
> look here:
> 
> ~/Library/Application Support/MailMate/Mailboxes.plist
Should be nice to have an editor for this or a manual section describing the 
possibility (strformat or regex or some JavaScript?)

> - take a format string to format the date like "-ww" to get it formatted
> 
> I guess I could somehow make it possible to provide a strftime-style format 
> string for dates. I'll give it some thought.
> 
Thx




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Re: [MlMt] What's with the skulls?

[Robert Brenstein]

I like the idea of being able to specify the character via defaults. 
Those who do not want this feature could enter the normal at-sign there, 
thus no need for on-off switch. I would probably use a gat red 
exclamation mark that I seem to recall seeing somewhere among icons when 
searching for icons for tags.



On 21 Feb 2019, at 16:06, Michael Nietzold wrote:

1) there should be an option to switch of. Or add option with text or 
regex to exclude some email from check
2) instead of replace the sign: add an red "!" In front and Mark the 
email red

3) add an ToolTip text to explain the skull

Von meinem iDingens gesendet...

Am 21.02.2019 um 16:01 schrieb Sam Hathaway 
:


Not sure if you’re interested in suggestions for alternate ways to 
call this out, but a few things occurred to me:


You could keep the at-sign but style it differently: perhaps red and 
underlined would stand out enough without being too obnoxious.


The ⛔️ or  or ☢️ emoji are round like the at-sign and 
indicate danger.


Perhaps the checks used to decide to call out an at-sign could be a 
little more stringent. For example, a leading at-sign (some of you 
may recognize @lbutlr from another list) shouldn’t need to be 
called out. Same with a trailing at-sign.


Personally I love the little skulls but making the character used 
configurable via defaults would be lovely. I think I’d probably 
choose  or .


Thanks for all your work on MailMate!
-sam

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Re: [MlMt] caret position in replies

[Robert Brenstein]

On 21 Feb 2019, at 15:18, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:


On 20 Feb 2019, at 21:00, Robert Brenstein wrote:

Yes, the signature position in set to be on top for both of us. 
Neither of us has an actual signature inserted.


Also try clicking “Reset Usage History” in the Signatures 
preferences pane to make sure MailMate did not learn a different 
preference.


--
Benny


I will try that tonight. However, the caret position as such is correct 
- it is before the first character in the reply email for both of us. 
The difference is that I have two empty lines inserted before the quoted 
original email and my wife does not. The visible settings we have, at 
least those that seem relevant, appear to be the same. I have a number 
of hidden settings added, so I suspect that the difference is there. But 
may be not.


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Re: [MlMt] Gravatar-hack for MailMate

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 21 Feb 2019, at 16:24, Robert M. Münch wrote:

> On 21 Feb 2019, at 15:35, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:
>
>> … The attached file needs to be saved in this folder:

Sorry, that might be useful to include :)

-- 
Benny
{
longFormatting =
{
children =
(
// Gravatar example with link (which becomes a bit 
messy because the md5 value is needed twice).
{
prefixString = "https://www.gravatar.com/;;
children = (
{
formatString = 
"${from.address.#md5}";
suffixString = "\">";
},
{
// Note: Could float it right 
instead
prefixString = "https://www.gravatar.com/avatar/;;
formatString = 
"${from.address.#md5}";
suffixString = "\"/>";
},
);
suffixString = "";
},
{
separator = { string = "\n"; };
placeholderString = "(No headers found)";
// There is a lot of redundancy in the 
following. Need some way to simplify/template how this works.
// For now, only Resent-From/To is displayed.
// Note that this does not work well for 
multiple Resent headers, in particular, multiple Resent-To are hard to 
interpret/display.

prefixString = "";
suffixString = "";

children =
(
{
prefix = { string = 
"Resent-From:"; };
suffixString = 
"";
children =
(
{
formatString = 
"${resent-from.name.#nospoof}";
escapeHTML = 1;
singleClick =
{

titleFormatting = { prefixString = "Resent from "; formatString = 
"“${resent-from.name}”"; };

queryFormatting = { formatString = "resent-from.name = '${resent-from.name}'"; 
separatorString = " or "; escapeSingleQuotes = 1; };
};
},
{
prefix = { 
formatString = "${resent-from.name:+ }";};
formatString = 
"${resent-from.address}";
escapeHTML = 1;
suffix = { 
formatString = "${resent-from.name:+}";};
singleClick =
{

titleFormatting = { prefixString = "Resent from "; formatString = 
"“${resent-from.address}”"; };

queryFormatting = { formatString = "resent-from.address = 
'${resent-from.address}'"; separatorString = " or "; escapeSingleQuotes = 1; };
};
},
);
copyValues =
(
{ title = ''; 
valueFormatting = { formatString = '${resent-from.name:+${resent-from.name} 
<${resent-from.address}>}'; }; },
{ title = 'Address 
Only'; valueFormatting = { formatString = '${resent-from.address}'; }; },
{ title = 'Name Only'; 

Re: [MlMt] Gravatar-hack for MailMate

[Robert M. Münch]

On 21 Feb 2019, at 15:35, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:

> … The attached file needs to be saved in this folder:

There is no attached file. Robert

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Re: [MlMt] Feature request: DnD text into app icon = new message with that text as body

[Sam Hathaway]

On 21 Feb 2019, at 9:01, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:


On 19 Feb 2019, at 15:15, Sam Hathaway wrote:

Wouldn’t it be cool if you could drag some selected text (from your 
text editor, say) into the MailMate app icon and have it create a new 
message with that text as the message body?


I'll look into it.


Thanks, Benny!
-sam
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Re: [MlMt] What's with the skulls?

[Michael Nietzold]

1) there should be an option to switch of. Or add option with text or regex to 
exclude some email from check
2) instead of replace the sign: add an red "!" In front and Mark the email red
3) add an ToolTip text to explain the skull

Von meinem iDingens gesendet...

> Am 21.02.2019 um 16:01 schrieb Sam Hathaway :
> 
> Not sure if you’re interested in suggestions for alternate ways to call this 
> out, but a few things occurred to me:
> 
> You could keep the at-sign but style it differently: perhaps red and 
> underlined would stand out enough without being too obnoxious.
> 
> The ⛔️ or  or ☢️ emoji are round like the at-sign and indicate danger.
> 
> Perhaps the checks used to decide to call out an at-sign could be a little 
> more stringent. For example, a leading at-sign (some of you may recognize 
> @lbutlr from another list) shouldn’t need to be called out. Same with a 
> trailing at-sign.
> 
> Personally I love the little skulls but making the character used 
> configurable via defaults would be lovely. I think I’d probably choose  or .
> 
> Thanks for all your work on MailMate!
> -sam
> 
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Re: [MlMt] What's with the skulls?

[Sam Hathaway]

Not sure if you’re interested in suggestions for alternate ways to 
call this out, but a few things occurred to me:


* You could keep the at-sign but style it differently: perhaps red and 
underlined would stand out enough without being too obnoxious.


* The ⛔️ or  or ☢️ emoji are round like the at-sign and 
indicate danger.


* Perhaps the checks used to decide to call out an at-sign could be a 
little more stringent. For example, a leading at-sign (some of you may 
recognize `@lbutlr` from another list) shouldn’t need to be called 
out. Same with a trailing at-sign.


* Personally I love the little skulls but making the character used 
configurable via `defaults` would be lovely. I think I’d probably 
choose  or .


Thanks for all your work on MailMate!
-sam
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[MlMt] Gravatar-hack for MailMate

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

Hi MailMate users,

sorry about the avalanche of mailing list replies.

For those of you hoping to spot a “useful” hack on the list, I do 
have something for you. Yet another user asked me about providing a way 
to display an image of each email correspondent. I still haven't 
integrated MailMate with images from Contacts, but I realized that it 
was fairly easy to use the [Gravatar](https://www.gravatar.com) service.


I've attached a quick hack for the headers view which makes it look like 
this:


![](cid:99689FC2-4523-49B8-9CE9-A71EC8B2EABA@freron.com 
"PastedImage.png")


That's the default gravatar, because I don't have one myself, but a 
surprising number of users on this list do have one.


The attached file needs to be saved in this folder:

	/Users//Application 
Support/MailMate/Resources/Layouts/headersFormatting.plist


You might need to create `Resources` and `Layouts` and you currently 
need the latest test release of MailMate 1.x for this to work: Hold down 
⌥ when clicking “Check Now” in the Software Update preferences 
pane.


Note that this does mean that there'll be quite a lot of (encrypted) 
communication with the gravatar server.


(I make no guarantees that this will work forever.)

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Re: [MlMt] What's with the skulls?

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 21 Feb 2019, at 15:40, mailm...@lists.erikmh.org wrote:

Yes, whitelisting would be very good — perhaps at both the address 
and even at the domain level.  I have several clients using MailMate 
who love it greatly — but the skull at first really creeped them 
out, and now it just annoys them because they happen to deal regularly 
with correspondents whose email names *by corporate policy* are their 
own email addresses:


rob...@example.com 


It shouldn't happen when they are exact matches, but a small difference 
would do it.


Blech, to be sure!  What an awful idea!  But apparently it’s 
relatively common.  And it’s MailMate that gets the blame, at least 
in my clients’ minds.


Noted.

Anyway, being able to suppress the warnings for all of (say) 
example.com would be very handy for folks who have to deal with such 
organizations.


Noted.

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Re: [MlMt] What's with the skulls?

[Eric Sharakan]

I forget why I see false positives (something with the way mailing lists 
are handled in our company IIRC), but having a whitelist for those 
addresses would be great.


Thanks.

-Eric

On 21 Feb 2019, at 8:44, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:


On 16 Feb 2019, at 15:14, Eric Sharakan wrote:


I found the graphic both creepy


I'm getting quite a lot of feedback on this. Also from people finding 
it more than just creepy. It's already on my list to find a different 
approach (and not just a different symbol since the real problem here 
is that there's no explanation when it happens).


For the record, to me it's just a cartoonish symbol and I never really 
considered that anyone would find it creepy or worse -- in that case I 
would not have used it.



and sometimes shown incorrectly


It is better with false positives than false negatives for spoofing 
attempts. It would be very hard to improve it to be smarter than 
simply looking for the use of `@`. But I need to add some way for the 
user to “whitelist” names.


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Re: [MlMt] Keystrokes not going to the front window

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 14 Feb 2019, at 17:47, Dr Gregory Jefferis wrote:

I regularly find that when I am editing a message, keystrokes are 
directed to a viewer window in the background rather than the message 
window that currently has focus. Clicking on the message window again 
to ensure that it has focus, has no effect. Closing the viewer window 
in question and opening a new viewer solves the problem.


Has anyone else seen this behaviour? Have some suggestions?


I believe I've seen this a couple of times myself, but I don't know how 
to reproduce it. Let me know if you spot some kind of pattern.


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Re: [MlMt] default sent mail folder

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 12 Feb 2019, at 21:34, anonnon wrote:


is it “sent” or “sent messges” or “sent items”

i’ve got all 3 and i’m trying to sync mailmate’s setting with my 
imap server setting


If the server uses one of these (for example when using webmail) then 
you should use that in MailMate as well. Select the IMAP mailbox and 
then use “Mailbox ▸ Mailbox Type ▸ Sent Messages”. You can then 
move the emails in the other IMAP folders and delete them.


(It is possible that the server tells MailMate which one to use and if 
it does then that's what happens by default. Otherwise, MailMate simply 
makes a guess or creates “Sent Messages”.)


Note that you might be using other email clients, e.g., on iOS, which 
have their own preference. These are likely also configurable.


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Re: [MlMt] Enigmail Encrypted Subject

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 18 Feb 2019, at 17:53, Jan Münnich wrote:

For a while now, Enigmail has the ability to PGP-encrypt the subject: 
https://www.enigmail.net/index.php/en/user-manual/handbook-faq#How_can_I_encrypt_the_Subject.3F


This results in having a lot of messages with the subject 'Encrypted 
Message'. While you can see the actual subject in the mail, list views 
become very hard to manage. (See attached screenshot)


Thunderbird/Enigmail replaces the actual subject 'Encrypted Message' 
with the one from the body after decrypting the message. Would this be 
hard to integrate in MailMate as well?


Hmm, maybe not. I'm certainly willing to look into it. The best way to 
make me look at this is to use “Help ▸ Send Feedback” to send me 
an encrypted example message :)


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Re: [MlMt] strange behavior when selecting multiple source accounts

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 16 Feb 2019, at 0:18, Eric Sharakan wrote:

Often, after selecting the set of sources to take offline or online, 
the two-finger click to bring up the contextual menu acts as a normal 
left-click, changing the selection to only highlight the source my 
mouse pointer happens to be hovering over.  This most often happens if 
I move the pointer after I select the set of sources but before I do 
the two-finger click.  If I'm careful not to move my pointer, I almost 
never see this behavior.


This only seems to happen when selecting multiple source accounts; I 
never see this problem anyplace else I select multiple items and 
invoke a contextual menu.


Currently, opening the context sensitive menu using the mouse also 
selects the item under the mouse. This is kind of a bug, but I think it 
has always behaved like this in MailMate. I do have it on my list to 
change it though.


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Re: [MlMt] Feature request: DnD text into app icon = new message with that text as body

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 19 Feb 2019, at 15:15, Sam Hathaway wrote:

Wouldn’t it be cool if you could drag some selected text (from your 
text editor, say) into the MailMate app icon and have it create a new 
message with that text as the message body?


I'll look into it.

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Re: [MlMt] caret position in replies

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 20 Feb 2019, at 21:00, Robert Brenstein wrote:

Yes, the signature position in set to be on top for both of us. 
Neither of us has an actual signature inserted.


Also try clicking “Reset Usage History” in the Signatures 
preferences pane to make sure MailMate did not learn a different 
preference.


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Re: [MlMt] What's with the skulls?

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 16 Feb 2019, at 15:14, Eric Sharakan wrote:


I found the graphic both creepy


I'm getting quite a lot of feedback on this. Also from people finding it 
more than just creepy. It's already on my list to find a different 
approach (and not just a different symbol since the real problem here is 
that there's no explanation when it happens).


For the record, to me it's just a cartoonish symbol and I never really 
considered that anyone would find it creepy or worse -- in that case I 
would not have used it.



and sometimes shown incorrectly


It is better with false positives than false negatives for spoofing 
attempts. It would be very hard to improve it to be smarter than simply 
looking for the use of `@`. But I need to add some way for the user to 
“whitelist” names.


--
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Re: [MlMt] smart mailbox not updated

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 20 Feb 2019, at 8:01, chairep...@mailbox.org wrote:


Sorry but that doesn’t solve the problem as well.


I've created the same mailbox and I'll keep an eye on it.

You didn't write when it fails, but I assume you mean that emails don't 
leave the mailbox when it's no longer “today”. At least, if I send 
an email to myself then it does show up in the Today mailbox.


If this is the case, have you noticed if it leaves the mailbox at a 
later time?


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Re: [MlMt] Group Submailbox peer weeek

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 13 Feb 2019, at 22:41, Michael Nietzold wrote:


i like to make a submailbox for each week in year

where:
- i create a submailbox
- i select a date

what i see:
- i can only select some parts of the Date


You mean you don't have a “Week” option?


what i expected:
- it should be a better "custom selector" for Submailbox unique value 
selector (just now i can only select an message field but not the 
modifiers


I don't think I understand that.

- i see an manual section for the modifiers available in the  "Mailbox 
Name Format"


Yes, that would be nice. To some extent, you can derive it from the 
“Headers” popup. For example if “From ▸ Address” exists then 
so does `from.address`, but it's not always like this. So-called virtual 
headers are prefixed with `#` or `##`. One (primitive) way to see this 
is to create a mailbox condition and then look here:


~/Library/Application Support/MailMate/Mailboxes.plist

- take a format string to format the date like "-ww" to get it 
formatted


I guess I could somehow make it possible to provide a `strftime`-style 
format string for dates. I'll give it some thought.


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Re: [MlMt] Flagging potentially fake email addresses

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 13 Feb 2019, at 22:46, Kee Hinckley wrote:

So if the sender's name is "Kee Hinckley" and previous mail from me 
has been coming from "k...@example.com", and this one comes from an 
email address that I haven't seen associated with that user before, 
highlight it.


There are several ways one could compare a new email with emails sent 
from the same person and I've previously considered making some kind of 
general system to make the user aware of when it happens. No promises 
though :)


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Re: [MlMt] Sent Message duplicate

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 12 Feb 2019, at 18:07, chairep...@mailbox.org wrote:

Is it possible to create a rule to delete the duplicate? What 
parameters should I use for it?


I described a workaround in ticket 
[2145](https://freron.lighthouseapp.com/projects/58672/tickets/2145). 
The idea is to use a separate mailbox for sent messages making it easier 
to create a rule which, e.g., deletes everything added to the mailbox. 
Then you just need to decide if you want the Exchange variant (what 
Exchange sent to the recipient) or the MailMate variant (what MailMate 
sent to the Exchange server). Keeping the Exchange variant involves the 
risk of Microsoft changing the behavior of the server (again) and then 
you don't have any copy of sent messages...


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Re: [MlMt] Restrict Space Key scroll to only the current Mail

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 13 Feb 2019, at 22:30, Michael Nietzold wrote:


what i see:
- if there are more than one message in MessageList then it shows the 
next message


I'm afraid there's an unfixed bug related to `scrollPageDown:`. I'm 
actually not sure when it broke, but it might be a long time ago. It's 
on my list of things to fix soon, but some times I seem to be running to 
stand still :)


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Re: [MlMt] activity viewer timestamp

[Benny Kjær Nielsen]

On 1 Feb 2019, at 15:17, Mark Allman wrote:


I have been chasing a (non-MailMate) mail issue and so digging
through the logs in the activity viewer window.  Is there some way
to make those logs use local time instead of UTC?  For my pea brain
this makes it overly difficult to dig through and correlate things
(either with other logs or stuff like "I know I sent that
mid-afternoon yesterday").  I poked at preferences and whatnot and
haven't come up with anything.


Usually I would think UTC would make it easier. At least if comparing 
with a server or other users in other time zones.


But to answer the question: No, it's not configurable.

I have a long list of things which could improve the activity viewer and 
making this optional is already on the list.


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