Re: MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!
One Comment about the advertising with the e-mail. Don't do it! That's the sort of thing that could run me off from this list faster then any thing else. Jack -- To unsubscribe from this list, send e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put "unsubscribe MAPINFO-L" in the message body, or contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One Comment about the advertising with the e-mail. Don't do it! That's the sort of thing that could run me off from this list faster then any thing else. Would you be willing to pay a subscription fee to get the list mail then? How do you suggest we afford the service? Would you prefer twice-yearly fund drives like they do for public broadcasting? It's been free because I managed to get a good deal at Colorado Supernet for the last 6 years. That made it cost so little (and was helped by some donations and the proceeds of an auction) that my business carried it these last few years. It cost $14.95/mo plus my time, which was gladly given because it has also been good for my business. But SuperNet got bought out by Qwest/US West, and because SuperNet isn't profitable enough for the big wheels, the wheels are closing down that service. The hard, cold Morlocks meet the Eloi of the Internet. In a perfect world advertising serves to connect people who have needs to products and services that answer those needs, and that's the goal we would try to attain. I am all too aware that in our real world, advertising also tries to *create* needs and wants and stick a straw into your wallet and suck hard. We all know that activity sucks, but is there any creative solution that we can come up with where we can generate enough cash to pay for the infrastructure we need to make this list a success? Lists do not live by email alone. Perhaps we can do a mix of paid subscriptions with no advertising with some freebie subscriptions that come with a helping thinly sliced spam. How about the USGS buying up a block and giving them out to employees? Maybe people with deeper pockets could fund subscriptions for students who are full of bright ideas, but no money. Maybe we could charge enough for advertising so that there wouldn't be many (but if there were none, that wouldn't help) Or maybe the ads wouldn't be so bad or common anyway. Maybe we could do a mix of donations, light advertising, auctions, and fund drives. But all that work takes volunteers or paid staff. Advertising is the easiest solution. If you don't want it at all, get creative, and not to put too fine a point on it, put your money where your mouth is. The form that these will take has not been decided yet anyway. All that's been talked about is that the service can be offered and that advertising would be a covenant way to afford it. As Henry D. Thoreau once said, "All great enterprises should be self-supporting." How about some ideas instead of complaints? -- - Bill Thoen GISnet, 1401 Walnut St., Suite C, Boulder, CO 80302 tel: 303-786-9961, fax: 303-443-4856 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.ctmap.com/gisnet -- To unsubscribe from this list, send e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put "unsubscribe MAPINFO-L" in the message body, or contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!)
One thing to keep in mind: this will not be some generic list server with advertisements for low-interest credit cards or internet gambling. The host will be a reputable GIS magazine, and who knows -- you might see an ad for something you need! Steve Wallace Vice President, Operations Florida Farm Bureau Insurance Co's - Original Message - From: "Bill Thoen" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 22, 2000 11:41 AM Subject: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One Comment about the advertising with the e-mail. Don't do it! That's the sort of thing that could run me off from this list faster then any thing else. Would you be willing to pay a subscription fee to get the list mail then? How do you suggest we afford the service? Would you prefer twice-yearly fund drives like they do for public broadcasting? It's been free because I managed to get a good deal at Colorado Supernet for the last 6 years. That made it cost so little (and was helped by some donations and the proceeds of an auction) that my business carried it these last few years. It cost $14.95/mo plus my time, which was gladly given because it has also been good for my business. But SuperNet got bought out by Qwest/US West, and because SuperNet isn't profitable enough for the big wheels, the wheels are closing down that service. The hard, cold Morlocks meet the Eloi of the Internet. In a perfect world advertising serves to connect people who have needs to products and services that answer those needs, and that's the goal we would try to attain. I am all too aware that in our real world, advertising also tries to *create* needs and wants and stick a straw into your wallet and suck hard. We all know that activity sucks, but is there any creative solution that we can come up with where we can generate enough cash to pay for the infrastructure we need to make this list a success? Lists do not live by email alone. Perhaps we can do a mix of paid subscriptions with no advertising with some freebie subscriptions that come with a helping thinly sliced spam. How about the USGS buying up a block and giving them out to employees? Maybe people with deeper pockets could fund subscriptions for students who are full of bright ideas, but no money. Maybe we could charge enough for advertising so that there wouldn't be many (but if there were none, that wouldn't help) Or maybe the ads wouldn't be so bad or common anyway. Maybe we could do a mix of donations, light advertising, auctions, and fund drives. But all that work takes volunteers or paid staff. Advertising is the easiest solution. If you don't want it at all, get creative, and not to put too fine a point on it, put your money where your mouth is. The form that these will take has not been decided yet anyway. All that's been talked about is that the service can be offered and that advertising would be a covenant way to afford it. As Henry D. Thoreau once said, "All great enterprises should be self-supporting." How about some ideas instead of complaints? -- - Bill Thoen GISnet, 1401 Walnut St., Suite C, Boulder, CO 80302 tel: 303-786-9961, fax: 303-443-4856 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.ctmap.com/gisnet -- To unsubscribe from this list, send e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put "unsubscribe MAPINFO-L" in the message body, or contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe from this list, send e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put "unsubscribe MAPINFO-L" in the message body, or contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!)
*** This is a Sample ad, Only a sample ad. The Advertiser in this add will help you keep this service free. For a few lines of space all this knowledge and access can remain free. Thank you for your attention *** Brien -Original Message- From:John Haynes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent:Fri, 22 Sep 2000 12:55:28 -0400 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!) Bill, Going back to the early days when you asked for voluntary contributions would be a start. I fully appreciate the odious response when you ask freeloaders for dough on something they believe SHOULD BE FREE. There are many companies, like mine, that have used the list to further our business and we SHOULD PAY for it. There are other companies whose employees use the list to further their business interests but who, as employees, have no authority to authorize payment and would be hard pressed to persuade those who sign the checks that it is a worthwhile investment. A simple, for a start solution would be to set out a budget and ask for help in meeting it. Companies like mine would respond; a lot of folks would not, but all their contributions to the list make it a valuable business asset for those of us who would happily pay a fee to keep the list from going away. I have no objections to viewing advertising. I mean, like where do you go for anything that hasn't got some message wrapped into it? I just throw out 50% of the Sunday paper and fast forward through the ads on the rental video. As for the chronic whiners, "Adios, MF". Best, - Original Message - From: Bill Thoen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 22, 2000 11:41 AM Subject: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One Comment about the advertising with the e-mail. Don't do it! That's the sort of thing that could run me off from this list faster then any thing else. Would you be willing to pay a subscription fee to get the list mail then? How do you suggest we afford the service? Would you prefer twice-yearly fund drives like they do for public broadcasting? It's been free because I managed to get a good deal at Colorado Supernet for the last 6 years. That made it cost so little (and was helped by some donations and the proceeds of an auction) that my business carried it these last few years. It cost $14.95/mo plus my time, which was gladly given because it has also been good for my business. But SuperNet got bought out by Qwest/US West, and because SuperNet isn't profitable enough for the big wheels, the wheels are closing down that service. The hard, cold Morlocks meet the Eloi of the Internet. In a perfect world advertising serves to connect people who have needs to products and services that answer those needs, and that's the goal we would try to attain. I am all too aware that in our real world, advertising also tries to *create* needs and wants and stick a straw into your wallet and suck hard. We all know that activity sucks, but is there any creative solution that we can come up with where we can generate enough cash to pay for the infrastructure we need to make this list a success? Lists do not live by email alone. Perhaps we can do a mix of paid subscriptions with no advertising with some freebie subscriptions that come with a helping thinly sliced spam. How about the USGS buying up a block and giving them out to employees? Maybe people with deeper pockets could fund subscriptions for students who are full of bright ideas, but no money. Maybe we could charge enough for advertising so that there wouldn't be many (but if there were none, that wouldn't help) Or maybe the ads wouldn't be so bad or common anyway. Maybe we could do a mix of donations, light advertising, auctions, and fund drives. But all that work takes volunteers or paid staff. Advertising is the easiest solution. If you don't want it at all, get creative, and not to put too fine a point on it, put your money where your mouth is. The form that these will take has not been decided yet anyway. All that's been talked about is that the service can be offered and that advertising would be a covenant way to afford it. As Henry D. Thoreau once said, "All great enterprises should be self-supporting." How about some ideas instead of complaints? -- - Bill Thoen GISnet, 1401 Walnut St., Suite C, Boulder, CO 80302 tel: 303-786-9961, fax: 303-443-4856 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED], http://
Re: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!)
Bill, Going back to the early days when you asked for voluntary contributions would be a start. I fully appreciate the odious response when you ask freeloaders for dough on something they believe SHOULD BE FREE. There are many companies, like mine, that have used the list to further our business and we SHOULD PAY for it. There are other companies whose employees use the list to further their business interests but who, as employees, have no authority to authorize payment and would be hard pressed to persuade those who sign the checks that it is a worthwhile investment. A simple, for a start solution would be to set out a budget and ask for help in meeting it. Companies like mine would respond; a lot of folks would not, but all their contributions to the list make it a valuable business asset for those of us who would happily pay a fee to keep the list from going away. I have no objections to viewing advertising. I mean, like where do you go for anything that hasn't got some message wrapped into it? I just throw out 50% of the Sunday paper and fast forward through the ads on the rental video. As for the chronic whiners, "Adios, MF". Best, - Original Message - From: Bill Thoen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 22, 2000 11:41 AM Subject: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One Comment about the advertising with the e-mail. Don't do it! That's the sort of thing that could run me off from this list faster then any thing else. Would you be willing to pay a subscription fee to get the list mail then? How do you suggest we afford the service? Would you prefer twice-yearly fund drives like they do for public broadcasting? It's been free because I managed to get a good deal at Colorado Supernet for the last 6 years. That made it cost so little (and was helped by some donations and the proceeds of an auction) that my business carried it these last few years. It cost $14.95/mo plus my time, which was gladly given because it has also been good for my business. But SuperNet got bought out by Qwest/US West, and because SuperNet isn't profitable enough for the big wheels, the wheels are closing down that service. The hard, cold Morlocks meet the Eloi of the Internet. In a perfect world advertising serves to connect people who have needs to products and services that answer those needs, and that's the goal we would try to attain. I am all too aware that in our real world, advertising also tries to *create* needs and wants and stick a straw into your wallet and suck hard. We all know that activity sucks, but is there any creative solution that we can come up with where we can generate enough cash to pay for the infrastructure we need to make this list a success? Lists do not live by email alone. Perhaps we can do a mix of paid subscriptions with no advertising with some freebie subscriptions that come with a helping thinly sliced spam. How about the USGS buying up a block and giving them out to employees? Maybe people with deeper pockets could fund subscriptions for students who are full of bright ideas, but no money. Maybe we could charge enough for advertising so that there wouldn't be many (but if there were none, that wouldn't help) Or maybe the ads wouldn't be so bad or common anyway. Maybe we could do a mix of donations, light advertising, auctions, and fund drives. But all that work takes volunteers or paid staff. Advertising is the easiest solution. If you don't want it at all, get creative, and not to put too fine a point on it, put your money where your mouth is. The form that these will take has not been decided yet anyway. All that's been talked about is that the service can be offered and that advertising would be a covenant way to afford it. As Henry D. Thoreau once said, "All great enterprises should be self-supporting." How about some ideas instead of complaints? -- - Bill Thoen GISnet, 1401 Walnut St., Suite C, Boulder, CO 80302 tel: 303-786-9961, fax: 303-443-4856 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.ctmap.com/gisnet -- To unsubscribe from this list, send e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put "unsubscribe MAPINFO-L" in the message body, or contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe from this list, send e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put "unsubscribe MAPINFO-L" in the message body, or contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!)
Brien: ah yeah you throw me I didn't even notice the box and was wondering where your message was... Still it wouldn't my first vote for MapInfo-L to join the rest of the world in having that little box in every posting.. I think a less intrusive form of sponsorship thing may be easier? Depends how much it costs...heck, several people would probably be interested in spending something to be this quarter's sponsor and have a one-time announcement and also a mention on the archive page and list description on directions mag...heck yeah depending on the cost my company might be eager to cover it indefinitely...I'm more concered about filtering out the spam, rejecting the unsubscribe requests and protecting us from malfunctioning, crazed mail servers...not sure how that would be coordinated.. I think the eGroups business model where people constantly define new groups which ebb and flow the ad banner is the appropriate revenue stream? Not my place to say but would imagine for DirectionsMag given the comparatively miniscule traffic a quarterly sponsorship is better? (on the other hand this is a very targeted audience...i have no idea what i'm talking about) Eric - Original Message - From: "Brien Green" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 22, 2000 2:32 PM Subject: Re: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!) *** This is a Sample ad, Only a sample ad. The Advertiser in this add will help you keep this service free. For a few lines of space all this knowledge and access can remain free. Thank you for your attention *** Brien -Original Message- From:John Haynes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent:Fri, 22 Sep 2000 12:55:28 -0400 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!) Bill, Going back to the early days when you asked for voluntary contributions would be a start. I fully appreciate the odious response when you ask freeloaders for dough on something they believe SHOULD BE FREE. There are many companies, like mine, that have used the list to further our business and we SHOULD PAY for it. There are other companies whose employees use the list to further their business interests but who, as employees, have no authority to authorize payment and would be hard pressed to persuade those who sign the checks that it is a worthwhile investment. A simple, for a start solution would be to set out a budget and ask for help in meeting it. Companies like mine would respond; a lot of folks would not, but all their contributions to the list make it a valuable business asset for those of us who would happily pay a fee to keep the list from going away. I have no objections to viewing advertising. I mean, like where do you go for anything that hasn't got some message wrapped into it? I just throw out 50% of the Sunday paper and fast forward through the ads on the rental video. As for the chronic whiners, "Adios, MF". Best, - Original Message - From: Bill Thoen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 22, 2000 11:41 AM Subject: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One Comment about the advertising with the e-mail. Don't do it! That's the sort of thing that could run me off from this list faster then any thing else. Would you be willing to pay a subscription fee to get the list mail then? How do you suggest we afford the service? Would you prefer twice-yearly fund drives like they do for public broadcasting? It's been free because I managed to get a good deal at Colorado Supernet for the last 6 years. That made it cost so little (and was helped by some donations and the proceeds of an auction) that my business carried it these last few years. It cost $14.95/mo plus my time, which was gladly given because it has also been good for my business. But SuperNet got bought out by Qwest/US West, and because SuperNet isn't profitable enough for the big wheels, the wheels are closing down that service. The hard, cold Morlocks meet the Eloi of the Internet. In a perfect world advertising serves to connect people who have needs to products and services that answer those needs, and that's the goal we would try to attain. I am all too aware that in our real world, advertising also tries to *create* needs and wants and stick a straw into your wallet and suck hard. We all know that activity sucks, but is there any creative solution that we can come up with where we can generate enough cash to pay for the infrastructure we need to make this list
Re: Advertising to fund MapInfo-L (was MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving! -No Advertising!!)
John's letter, as usual articulate states my point of view as well. While I have no major objective to advertising labeled as ADV: or AD: etc as is now done, I think that the cost might be doable from donations How much is needed, anyway? At 12:55 PM 09/22/2000 , you wrote: Bill, Going back to the early days when you asked for voluntary contributions would be a start. Cindy Reid ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) VOICE: (716) 271-6490 247 N. Goodman St., Rochester, NY 14618FAX: (716) 271-1132 Mapping Analytics provides geographically based analytical services for Sales, Marketing and Strategic Planning (Sales/Service Territory Optimization, Trade Area Analysis, Site Selection, etc.) and GIS services (geocoding, map production and database development) to businesses. -- To unsubscribe from this list, send e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put "unsubscribe MAPINFO-L" in the message body, or contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MI ANNOUNCEMENT: MapInfo-L is moving!
As a result of all the recent telecom mergers here in Denver recently, the service provider we have been using to host MapInfo-L is getting its plug pulled Oct 6 and we have to move the list. The domains csn.net and sni.net will be cold and dark after the 6th. The new home is going to be at Directions Magazine very shortly. We will be running a more up-to-date majordomo server so we will finally have digest capability, faster turnaround and some other goodies. The rules and guidelines aren't going to change and Scott Elliot (owner and publisher of Directions Magazine) has assured me that your email addressed will not be used for any other purpose than the MapInfo-L subscriber list. I'll still be doing the caretaker services, and my address here isn't going to change. You will still be able to receive individual emails, but now digest mail will be available. You will also be able to read mail in the Discussions area on Directions Magazine's web site. Things will work basically like they do now, only faster and there will be more features. Another change is that there will some MapInfo-oriented advertising in the new email, but the form this will take is not yet decided. We need to figure out a way to make it all worth everyone's while. Ideas or suggestions anyone? Your email addresses will be moved automatically in a few days, so all you'll have to do is change where you send messages. You'll also all be sent a new "Welcome" message that has all the details and commands for working with majordomo in it. If you don't want to have your address moved automatically, then you should unsubscribe before addresses are moved. I will let you know a few days when addresses will be moved. I'll announce the new server and list addresses real soon now after we finish testing. This note is just a "heads up" to open up the discussion and give people time to make any changes they want to make. Does anyone have any special requests or checklist items I need to add to my to-do's to herd all you cats over to the new list? Questions? Comments? Discussion? Objections? - Bill Thoen GISnet, 1401 Walnut St., Suite C, Boulder, CO 80302 tel: 303-786-9961, fax: 303-443-4856 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.ctmap.com/gisnet -- To unsubscribe from this list, send e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put "unsubscribe MAPINFO-L" in the message body, or contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
