[Marxism] US Arab Spring policy? Third party counter-revolution

[Michael Karadjis via Marxism]

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US Arab Spring policy? Third party counter-revolution
by eternispring

.

The “rebel” factions that the US has directly supported in Syria have 
always been those that do not fight Assad – in other words rebels that 
don’t rebel. The SDF position on Syria is identical to that of the US – 
a “third option” theoretically distinguishable from the regime but which 
ultimately involves indirect support to it. This “regime preservation by 
proxy” has been US policy in the conflict, helping it to avoid the 
criticisms which would otherwise arise from unmediated direct support – 
with other “proxy” US-backed allies of the regime include Iraqi army 
brigades (who currently form the biggest ground forces of the Assad 
regime) and the Egyptian al-Sisi regime.


Another example of what’s talked about here is the famed “US only found 
54 moderate rebels to fight ISIS”. Hundreds of outlets (mainstream and 
alternative) probably recirculated the original context-less source 
piece, in turn reaching millions of people. And in only a tiny minority 
will the crucial detail being missing: that there were only 54 
signatories because the US stipulated that those who signed up sign a 
declaration to use their weapons only to fight ISIS, not Assad. This in 
turn provides the source material for “alternative media” outlets to 
repeat the upside-down narrative of a US conspiracy against the Assad 
regime.The result literally from just one misleading piece failing to 
add a line is millions of people understanding the issue upside down.


This isn’t unique to Syria either; for instance you’ll often find 
Zionists say “the Palestinians rejected the 1947 UN partition plan which 
would’ve given a peaceful solution to the Arabs and Israelis”. And 
whilst this is certainly true, as ever the critical small-print is 
missing: that the Palestinians rejected a plan which a) divided a 
country which shouldn’t have been divided and b) even in this division 
gave away more than half of the territory to a minority largely foreign 
population. For decades such myths were allowed to expand before being 
adequately challenged.


The reality is that every single faction the US has directly supported 
in the Syrian conflict have been brigades that have stopped fighting 
Assad. Whether its the SDF factions, the Mua’atasim Brigade or the New 
Syrian Army, all of these groups only got US support once they made 
clear they wouldn’t be fighting Assad. Some, like the NSA which operate 
on the Syrian-Iraqi border have even collaborated with the pro-Assad 
Iraqi government.


The indirect support has also allowed the US to directly support the 
regime as well. By pursuing a “third path” the regime was eventually 
rehabilitated enough and by 2014 the US was bombing Assad’s enemies – 
“moderate” and extreme – alongside his airforce.


Full: 
https://eternispring.wordpress.com/2017/03/03/us-arab-spring-policy-third-party-counter-revolution/?fb_action_ids=1414757321930172_action_types=news.publishes 


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Re: [Marxism] NO STALINIST VIOLENCE IN OUR MOVEMENTS!

[Michael Karadjis via Marxism]

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The definition of the word "violence" has expanded, and rightly so, and 
so we could well call this shameless disruption of of an event 
supporting the amazing work of the WH, by a bunch of arrogant, 
self-aggrandising western tyrant-boot-lickers, "violence". Or perhaps 
not. One thing is for sure though: "violent" or otherwise, if the 
organisers had decided to violently eject these scum, they would have 
been fully justified. The self-restraint was amazing.



-Original Message- 
From: Mark Lause via Marxism

Sent: Saturday, March 4, 2017 2:56 PM
To: Michael Karadjis
Subject: Re: [Marxism] NO STALINIST VIOLENCE IN OUR MOVEMENTS!

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Workers World in Houston physically attacked demonstrations back in the
early 1970s, initiating it all by accepting a debate over antiwar 
strategy
and then disrupting it.  I viewed that, at the time and since, as a 
local
aberration--the result of WWP's having recruited a preexisting local 
group

with its own peculiar ideas about how to go about having an impact.

Even then, though, the responsibility falls on the organization to reign 
in

people if they're doing what the organization doesn't want done.

ml



On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 8:56 PM, Louis Proyect via Marxism <
marxism@lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote:


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On 3/3/17 8:29 PM, Andrew Pollack via Marxism wrote:



Fine. So next time you speak from the floor I'll just walk up and 
down in

front of you with a poster blocking your face. No problem, right?


Yeah, I had that done to me in effect by Vivek Chibber. He's an 
asshole

but I wouldn't consider that "violence".


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Re: [Marxism] NO STALINIST VIOLENCE IN OUR MOVEMENTS!

[Mark Lause via Marxism]

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Workers World in Houston physically attacked demonstrations back in the
early 1970s, initiating it all by accepting a debate over antiwar strategy
and then disrupting it.  I viewed that, at the time and since, as a local
aberration--the result of WWP's having recruited a preexisting local group
with its own peculiar ideas about how to go about having an impact.

Even then, though, the responsibility falls on the organization to reign in
people if they're doing what the organization doesn't want done.

ml



On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 8:56 PM, Louis Proyect via Marxism <
marxism@lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote:

>   POSTING RULES & NOTES  
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>
> On 3/3/17 8:29 PM, Andrew Pollack via Marxism wrote:
>
>>
>> Fine. So next time you speak from the floor I'll just walk up and down in
>> front of you with a poster blocking your face. No problem, right?
>>
>>
> Yeah, I had that done to me in effect by Vivek Chibber. He's an asshole
> but I wouldn't consider that "violence".
>
>
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Re: [Marxism] NO STALINIST VIOLENCE IN OUR MOVEMENTS!

[Louis Proyect via Marxism]

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On 3/3/17 8:29 PM, Andrew Pollack via Marxism wrote:


Fine. So next time you speak from the floor I'll just walk up and down in
front of you with a poster blocking your face. No problem, right?



Yeah, I had that done to me in effect by Vivek Chibber. He's an asshole 
but I wouldn't consider that "violence".


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Re: [Marxism] NO STALINIST VIOLENCE IN OUR MOVEMENTS!

[Andrew Pollack via Marxism]

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Fine. So next time you speak from the floor I'll just walk up and down in
front of you with a poster blocking your face. No problem, right?
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Re: [Marxism] NO STALINIST VIOLENCE IN OUR MOVEMENTS!

[Louis Proyect via Marxism]

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On 3/3/17 8:21 PM, Andrew Pollack via Marxism wrote:

They physically pushed their way back and forth through the crowd and the
musicians during the performance.


That is not violence.
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Re: [Marxism] NO STALINIST VIOLENCE IN OUR MOVEMENTS!

[Andrew Pollack via Marxism]

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They physically pushed their way back and forth through the crowd and the
musicians during the performance.
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Re: [Marxism] NO STALINIST VIOLENCE IN OUR MOVEMENTS!

[Louis Proyect via Marxism]

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On 3/3/17 8:11 PM, Andrew Pollack via Marxism wrote:


With this PHYSICAL disruption (the word of choice of RT) of a White
Helmets' event in Grand Central, the Stalinists of the Hands Off Syria
Coalition have put themselves beyond the pale. There is a long-standing
tradition against violence within the movements of workers' and the
oppressed. The Workers World thugs who violated this tradition have shown
they cannot be trusted to share platforms, meetings or demonstrations with
activists seeking to advance progressive causes.


WWP is awful but I saw no violence.

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[Marxism] NO STALINIST VIOLENCE IN OUR MOVEMENTS!

[Andrew Pollack via Marxism]

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With this PHYSICAL disruption (the word of choice of RT) of a White
Helmets' event in Grand Central, the Stalinists of the Hands Off Syria
Coalition have put themselves beyond the pale. There is a long-standing
tradition against violence within the movements of workers' and the
oppressed. The Workers World thugs who violated this tradition have shown
they cannot be trusted to share platforms, meetings or demonstrations with
activists seeking to advance progressive causes.
If the Grand Central event had been properly marshalled the Stalinists
could have been stopped; we must ensure this oversight is not repeated.
(And let's not forget that it's the genocidal violence of their leader
Assad that caused the flight, death and wounding of millions of Syrians,
the very ones with Workers World claims to support once they're refugees.
Please share this widely, alert comrades to the danger of thug violence.
https://www.rt.com/usa/379391-anti-syrian-war-protest-disrupts/
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[Marxism] Cement multinational: deals made with armed groups in Syria

[Ken Hiebert via Marxism]

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http://bigstory.ap.org/article/baa39a1e1a5748e98d1c875fe67d408b/lafargeholcim-deals-armed-groups-kept-syria-plant-open

I have looked at a map and I haven't figured out if they could have done this 
without the acquiescence of the Syrian government.  
Were they shipping product out of Syria?  Did it pass through government 
controlled territory?
ken h
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[Marxism] What The Left Today Can Learn from Paul Robeson | Interview with Gerald Horne | Public Books

[Kevin Lindemann and Cathy Campo via Marxism]

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http://www.publicbooks.org/what-the-left-today-can-learn-from-paul-robeson-an-interview-with-gerald-horne/





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Re: [Marxism] Fwd: Exposed: Pro-Israel Modern Day McCarthyites Going to Extremes to Slime Human Rights Activists | Alternet

[Andrew Pollack via Marxism]

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2015
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[Marxism] Russian spying?

[John Reimann via Marxism]

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If I were a conspiracy theorist, I'd be arguing right now that Trump's
entire election was organized by that shadowy, behind-the-scenes group the
ACA... otherwise known as the American Comedians' Association. No sooner
than Trump gives a "presidential" speech than the glow from this is
completely overwhelmed by a new scandal. But the issue is serious in a way.

Did the Putin regime intervene in the US elections? I think they probably
did. After all, if they're willing to bomb the Syrian people to smithereens
to keep Assad in power, why wouldn't they hack a few computers to get the
president they like elected?

Of course, there's the question: Who is the US government to complain? This
is the government that spied on its allies, such as the German government,
for decades. Nor have they stopped simply at gathering information.
Time and again,
they've tried to influence the internal politics, such as in Venezuela
today. Or all the different coups they've helped organize.

The US and Russian governments aren't alone. Every government tries to get
inside information, and affect outcomes, in the affairs of other regimes.
Why wouldn't they?

The real problem for the US capitalist class is that they have a president
who seems to be looking out more for his own personal financial interests -
which are tied in with Russian oligarchs - than for the interests of the US
capitalist class as a whole. Now THAT is a real crime!

(in their eyes)
-- 
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Asata Shakur
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[Marxism] canals and America's first great industrial boom

[Dennis Brasky via Marxism]

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http://www.delanceyplace.com/view-archives.php?p=3281
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Re: [Marxism] Donald Trump signifies he will end US support for Syrian rebels despite their pleas to him for help | The Independent

[MM via Marxism]

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> On Mar 2, 2017, at 6:12 PM, Louis Proyect via Marxism 
>  wrote:
> 
> So all those Assadist jerks that I've been slicing and dicing for the past 6 
> years better wise up now. The verdict is in. Guilty as charged.

Won’t happen. They argue instead that one of Trump’s few redeeming features is 
his rejection of U.S. imperialism — other than to fight ISIS, of course, which 
they see as an unfortunate necessity.
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[Marxism] Fwd: Yasiin Bey, aka Mos Def, barred from entering U.S. for tour: report - NY Daily News

[Louis Proyect via Marxism]

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http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/music-arts/yaslin-bey-aka-mos-def-barred-entering-u-s-tour-report-article-1.1801864
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[Marxism] Fwd: The FDR Myth

[Louis Proyect via Marxism]

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Back in the seventh grade, in the fifties, we studied geography. As we 
looked at the United States we saw here iron ore, there oil, here a vast 
corn belt, there a vast valley growing all kinds of fruits and 
vegetables. Manufacturing cities turned out cars by the thousand. 
Broadway and Hollywood were going gangbusters. Gorgeous beaches, 
pristine mountains, crystalline rivers and lakes. Everything was here in 
abundance. With the proper organization it was paradise. Alas, it didn’t 
work out that way. It didn’t work out that way because the system we had 
needed waste to continue. In truth, it’s most important product was 
garbage. It was a vast churning trash compactor that needed to make 
always more trash. And it wasted everything.


Americans who are wondering what went wrong might consider a book by 
John T. Flynn called The Roosevelt Myth written in 1948. The revelation 
of who Roosevelt actually was and what he did is eye-poping. One such 
revelation is the tale of the origin of the military-industrial complex. 
For this did not exist before Roosevelt.


full: http://www.counterpunch.org/2017/03/03/the-fdr-myth/
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[Marxism] Empire in Crisis: “I Did Not Have a Meeting With That Envoy!”

[Ron Jacobs via Marxism]

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http://stillhomeron.blogspot.com/2017/03/empire-in-crisis-i-did-not-have-meeting.html

-- 
Check out my newest books ,* Capitalism
, Daydream
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[Marxism] Fwd: The Scab Economy: the Origins of America’s Anti-Union Movement

[Louis Proyect via Marxism]

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http://www.counterpunch.org/2017/03/03/the-scab-economy-the-origins-of-americas-anti-union-movement/
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