[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Hi Jason, We too at the National Gallery have ventured into HD program delivery and have adopted the following solution. We use MVix media players (MX780HD) with built-in hard drives. We have 1 terabyte drives which gives us nearly infinite quantities of HD video playback, localized to the plasma screen. The units are small enough to be mounted behind a plasma screen. They deliver full 1080p playback when using HDMI interfaces. They can also deliver audio content as well as web radio. They can be streamed wirelessly (although it's not the best solution) or can be mounted on a network for uploading and refreshing content. We've been running for 6 months with little issue and of course the image is outstanding. If your plasmas only take component then you'll be limited to 720p HD rather than full 1080p. The units can have an assigned playlist with repeat function for continuous play. http://www.mvixusa.com/#products_main/ht/0 There are many players in this field with similar solutions, but it's certainly worth a look. Thanks, and good hunting. Mark Paradis Chief, Multimedia Services-Chef de services multim?dia National Gallery of Canada, Mus?e des beaux-arts du Canada 380 Sussex Drive,Ottawa, Ontario K1N 9N4 ph. 613-990-1788, fx. 613-991-2680 cell 613-797-0558 -Original Message- From: mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu [mailto:mcn-l-boun...@mcn.edu] On Behalf Of Jason Bondy Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 3:59 PM To: mcn-l at mcn.edu Subject: [MCN-L] HD video in the galleries? Hello all, We have recently begun moving toward High-Definition video for all of our interviews, documentaries and other footage to be used in exhibits. We are using internally produced video as well as video shot by outside producers. However, we are running into some obstacles determining the best solution for playback in the galleries. We will be playing the HD video files from Windows-based computers connected to plasma monitors. Currently we are trying it with H.264 encoded QuickTime files, but they are very jumpy on video clips with a lot of motion. We have upgraded the RAM and video cards in the computers, but with very little improvement. Also, we using Cat5 DVI/HDMI extenders as there is quite a bit of distance from the computer to the monitor. Who else out there is using HD video in your exhibits? How are you doing it? We would welcome any suggestions or input you may have. Thank you so much, Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org ___ You are currently subscribed to mcn-l, the listserv of the Museum Computer Network (http://www.mcn.edu) To post to this list, send messages to: mcn-l at mcn.edu To unsubscribe or change mcn-l delivery options visit: http://toronto.mediatrope.com/mailman/listinfo/mcn-l
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Jason, I use VLC video player for all programmed playback on computers. You can set looping and full screen on start, it plays any format that Quicktime or WMP play (and some that they do not), and it has a lot of network functionality, including setting up streams and adjusting playlists. It's also completely cross platform... including most flavors of Linux, which has been great because I've been able to take some aging PCs and re- purpose them as dumb looping players with really sparse OS installs after they've lost their charm as interactive boxes. Oh yeah, and it's free... like beer. www.videloan.org A lot will still depend on the bit rate and format used for the encode, and there will be time that no matter what your compression is, the machine might choke if it's not fast enough. A lot of PC manufacturers are starting to include discrete chips that handle this kind of codec-ing because it can be so intense. As others have mentioned, there are good, relatively cheap solid state players out there, too. I'd like to lob my vote for Akman (~$400). I recently started using their HD version for a personal project, and it's been rock solid. Be good. Daniel Jason Bondy wrote: Daniel, Thanks for your response. We have an 80GB hard drive in the computer. Many of the video clips are 5-10 minutes long, except one that is 32 minutes. We are planning more long documentary type films, so we need to be ready for the larger files. We currently own a few of the Firefly digital video players for standard-definition video, but their HD players are out of our budget at this time, as are the Adtec devices. Also, we already have the computers installed, so we were going to try to use those if we can. As far as Blu-ray, we are concerned about wear and tear on it if the film is repeating continuously for nine hours per day. A hard drive is much cheaper to replace when it wears out. We are still learning about various HD formats and playback options. We were using H.264 originally because we have a Flash program that plays the files using QuickTime. We need a playback format and application that goes straight to full screen as soon as the computer boots up. Do you know of any good reference material that explains some of the formats more in depth? Thank you. I really appreciate your time and assistance! Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org -Original Message- From: mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu [mailto:mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel M. Bartolini Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 4:02 PM To: Museum Computer Network Listserv Subject: Re: [MCN-L] HD video in the galleries? Hi Jason- How much hard drive space do you have available on these machines and how long are your videos? I ask because HD playback on computers is significantly improved when you use codecs that create discrete frames versus heavily compressed MPEG formats like H.264. For example running your video out to something like DVCPro HD or the Animation preset creates all independent frames of the movie. Your hard drive overhead is enormous (possibly 2 Gb for every 3 minutes, depending on bit rate) but the computer has to think far less about the process as there are no i-frames going on. Alternatively, if you need really small file sizes, mess with the H.264 bit rate. Start high at 1500kb/s and move down to around 900 or less until you find something that allows you to maintain your full frame rate. The lower you go of course the more you will see those motion artifacts, but perhaps not jumpiness. The dirty sort-of-secret of that format is it's really processor intensive and upgrading video cards won't matter a lot unless you specifically buy something like the latest NVidia cards that have built in hardware rendering support of H.264 and other MPEG codecs, or if you're willing to use a program like Max/Jitter (or comparable VJ system), or environment like openFrameworks to display your video in OpenGL so all work is done on the video card. Finally, have you considered standalone HD players, like those from Adtec, or going to Blu-Ray (I know, more money, may not work)? Oi. That was long. Sorry. Hope that helps. Have a good weekend. Daniel Jason Bondy wrote: Hello all, We have recently begun moving toward High-Definition video for all of our interviews, documentaries and other footage to be used in exhibits. We are using internally produced video as well as video shot by outside producers. However, we are running into some obstacles determining the best solution for playback in the galleries. We will be playing the HD video files from Windows-based computers connected to plasma monitors
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Adventure Science Center uses Core2 Mac Mini's w/ 2GB of RAM running quick time and keynote in its new Space Chase Exhibit wing for HD digital signage. Mac mini's were chosen for the following reasons: 1.) Price - even with a 3 year apple care warranty, $900. 2.) Video - 1080p output through DVI port. 3.) Size - Fits comfortably behind LCD or in reader rail. 4.) Scripting - For the quicktime applications, I wrote a simple script placed in the startup items for each unit that launches a full-screen HD quick time presentation which work in conjunction with automated system startup/shutdown. For the keynote applications, I simply placed the keynote file into the startup items. 5.) Remote management - Built in Wifi with screen sharing. No need to run network cables. Simply connect to building wifi. Recommendations: Disable everything in system preferences that you don't need. Install the latest quicktime, system, and wifi updates. Also, don't count on keynote for more than a few minutes of HD video. Stick to quicktime natively for larger presentations/videos. I'd be happy to share the script I mention or provide a picture or two. So far we have run the machines for almost six months with no problems. I've also had good luck with Dell Precision workstations with large processor cache (4 MB or better), plenty of memory, RAID-1 7200 RPM hard drives, and professional NVIDIA video cards. Stick to Windows XP! Regards, Matt - Matthew Stevens Adventure Science Center 800 Fort Negley Blvd Nashville TN 37203 Direct: 615-401-5064 Fax: 615-862-5178 http://www.adventuresci.com -Original Message- From: mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu [mailto:mcn-l-boun...@mcn.edu] On Behalf Of Jason Bondy Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 2:59 PM To: mcn-l at mcn.edu Subject: [MCN-L] HD video in the galleries? Hello all, We have recently begun moving toward High-Definition video for all of our interviews, documentaries and other footage to be used in exhibits. We are using internally produced video as well as video shot by outside producers. However, we are running into some obstacles determining the best solution for playback in the galleries. We will be playing the HD video files from Windows-based computers connected to plasma monitors. Currently we are trying it with H.264 encoded QuickTime files, but they are very jumpy on video clips with a lot of motion. We have upgraded the RAM and video cards in the computers, but with very little improvement. Also, we using Cat5 DVI/HDMI extenders as there is quite a bit of distance from the computer to the monitor. Who else out there is using HD video in your exhibits? How are you doing it? We would welcome any suggestions or input you may have. Thank you so much, Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org ___ You are currently subscribed to mcn-l, the listserv of the Museum Computer Network (http://www.mcn.edu) To post to this list, send messages to: mcn-l at mcn.edu To unsubscribe or change mcn-l delivery options visit: http://toronto.mediatrope.com/mailman/listinfo/mcn-l
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
All, First time responding to this listserv. At the MIM we are looking at implementing a typical 'digital signage' approach where we have the playback devices co-located with the monitors. The devices that we are looking at implementing are from CELabs (http://www.celabs.net) and we are testing both the HD300zx as well as the MP400A. Both are networkable and able to be administrated and updated with content through the network. Take a look at the specs as they are very flexible and price friendly products. We are also using a custom mounting solution from Chief Manufacturing that works well as a containment unit for the player, cables and even a powerstrip. It also is the mount for the video monitor itself (there are models for both large and small monitors). I would be happy to outline more of the solution including our format selection for the videos itself. Thanks. Mark McCauley | Director of Technology | MIM-Musical Instrument Museum 8550 S. Priest Drive | Tempe, AZ 85284 | 480.481.2460 main | 480.425.3215 direct | 480.481.2459 fax | www.themim.org http://www.themim.org/
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Hi Dana et. al. I used the DV-66 in a small installation at the Monash University Computer History Museum. It continuously plays a short video attract loop with playback of the main programme triggered by a touch sensor I designed to sit in a graphic panel adhered to the inside of the display case. This saves drilling through the glass for a switch or using some sort of sensor to detect visitors. The model I used only played MPEG-1 but I note that the DV-66B also plays MPEG-2 - is that the model you have Dana ? I would be interested in your experiences with the DV-66 as I had some issues with the system as a whole although I could not isolate them to the player. MPEG-1 compression at that time was more of black art than it is today with more mature software such as Final Cut Pro. I have also used the much more expensive but very robust players from Alcorn McBride. 7 players have been running for 7 years at the Royal Australian Air Force Museum at RAAF Base WIlliams in Victoria without incident. A DVD player is arguably the most cost effective option for many smaller installations without a high turnover of content, but like a number of people on this list I have steered clients towards hard drive or solid state playback devices on the grounds of reliability, ease of interfacing with external buttons and controllers and the ability to begin playback from a cold start (ie at power up). However with domestic DVD player reliability improving and costs falling to around $30 they are an increasingly compelling option. To solve the startup problem I recently designed an exhibition controller for the Nick Cave exhibition developed by the Victorian Arts Centre. This small module can learn the power on and play commands from the DVD player remote control and emit them when the gallery or temporary exhibition main power is turned on. The discussion of computer video playback in this thread has been very interesting - please keep sharing your approaches. I developed a workshop on Digital Video in Museums for MCN 2003 - if anyone on the list would like a PDF copy of the slides please email me off list. Michael Borthwick Director Michael Borthwick Consulting Pty. Ltd www.michaelborthwick.com.au On 09/11/2008, at 1:08 AM, Dana Hutchins wrote: Have you looked into the MedeaWiz DV76 HD Player? Sounds like it does what you need and it's $385. http://www.medeawiz.com/products/Dv76.htm Sold through Team Kingsley in St. Louis. http://www.teamkingsley.com/MedeaWiz.htm Please let me know if this does what you're looking for or if anyone else has experience with this product. I'm about to use their DV68 for the first time for a project now. I'm curious about the HD player. Thanks Dana Hutchins XhibitNet 541 Congress St. Portland, ME 04101 207.773.1101 ext.102 dana at xhibit.net www.xhibit.net On 11/7/08 5:51 PM, Jason Bondy jbondy at okhistory.org wrote: Daniel, Thanks for your response. We have an 80GB hard drive in the computer. Many of the video clips are 5-10 minutes long, except one that is 32 minutes. We are planning more long documentary type films, so we need to be ready for the larger files. We currently own a few of the Firefly digital video players for standard-definition video, but their HD players are out of our budget at this time, as are the Adtec devices. Also, we already have the computers installed, so we were going to try to use those if we can. As far as Blu-ray, we are concerned about wear and tear on it if the film is repeating continuously for nine hours per day. A hard drive is much cheaper to replace when it wears out. We are still learning about various HD formats and playback options. We were using H.264 originally because we have a Flash program that plays the files using QuickTime. We need a playback format and application that goes straight to full screen as soon as the computer boots up. Do you know of any good reference material that explains some of the formats more in depth? Thank you. I really appreciate your time and assistance! Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org -Original Message- From: mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu [mailto:mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel M. Bartolini Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 4:02 PM To: Museum Computer Network Listserv Subject: Re: [MCN-L] HD video in the galleries? Hi Jason- How much hard drive space do you have available on these machines and how long are your videos? I ask because HD playback on computers is significantly improved when you use codecs that create discrete frames versus heavily compressed MPEG formats like H.264. For example running your video
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org -Original Message- From: mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu [mailto:mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel M. Bartolini Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 4:02 PM To: Museum Computer Network Listserv Subject: Re: [MCN-L] HD video in the galleries? Hi Jason- How much hard drive space do you have available on these machines and how long are your videos? I ask because HD playback on computers is significantly improved when you use codecs that create discrete frames versus heavily compressed MPEG formats like H.264. For example running your video out to something like DVCPro HD or the Animation preset creates all independent frames of the movie. Your hard drive overhead is enormous (possibly 2 Gb for every 3 minutes, depending on bit rate) but the computer has to think far less about the process as there are no i-frames going on. Alternatively, if you need really small file sizes, mess with the H. 264 bit rate. Start high at 1500kb/s and move down to around 900 or less until you find something that allows you to maintain your full frame rate. The lower you go of course the more you will see those motion artifacts, but perhaps not jumpiness. The dirty sort-of-secret of that format is it's really processor intensive and upgrading video cards won't matter a lot unless you specifically buy something like the latest NVidia cards that have built in hardware rendering support of H.264 and other MPEG codecs, or if you're willing to use a program like Max/Jitter (or comparable VJ system), or environment like openFrameworks to display your video in OpenGL so all work is done on the video card. Finally, have you considered standalone HD players, like those from Adtec, or going to Blu-Ray (I know, more money, may not work)? Oi. That was long. Sorry. Hope that helps. Have a good weekend. Daniel Jason Bondy wrote: Hello all, We have recently begun moving toward High-Definition video for all of our interviews, documentaries and other footage to be used in exhibits. We are using internally produced video as well as video shot by outside producers. However, we are running into some obstacles determining the best solution for playback in the galleries. We will be playing the HD video files from Windows-based computers connected to plasma monitors. Currently we are trying it with H.264 encoded QuickTime files, but they are very jumpy on video clips with a lot of motion. We have upgraded the RAM and video cards in the computers, but with very little improvement. Also, we using Cat5 DVI/HDMI extenders as there is quite a bit of distance from the computer to the monitor. Who else out there is using HD video in your exhibits? How are you doing it? We would welcome any suggestions or input you may have. Thank you so much, Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org ___ You are currently subscribed to mcn-l, the listserv of the Museum Computer Network (http://www.mcn.edu) To post to this list, send messages to: mcn-l at mcn.edu To unsubscribe or change mcn-l delivery options visit: http://toronto.mediatrope.com/mailman/listinfo/mcn-l ___ You are currently subscribed to mcn-l, the listserv of the Museum Computer Network (http://www.mcn.edu) To post to this list, send messages to: mcn-l at mcn.edu To unsubscribe or change mcn-l delivery options visit: http://toronto.mediatrope.com/mailman/listinfo/mcn-l ___ You are currently subscribed to mcn-l, the listserv of the Museum Computer Network (http://www.mcn.edu) To post to this list, send messages to: mcn-l at mcn.edu To unsubscribe or change mcn-l delivery options visit: http://toronto.mediatrope.com/mailman/listinfo/mcn-l Michael Borthwick Consulting Pty. Ltd. Postal: GPO Box 1950, 380 Bourke Street, Melbourne 3001 Physical: Level 1, 384 Bridge Road, Richmond Mobile Ph: + 61 418 345 800 Mobile Fax + 61 418 344 875 http://www.michaelborthwick.com.au ___ You are currently subscribed to mcn-l, the listserv of the Museum Computer Network (http://www.mcn.edu) To post to this list, send messages to: mcn-l at mcn.edu To unsubscribe or change mcn-l delivery options visit: http://toronto.mediatrope.com/mailman/listinfo/mcn-l
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Have you looked into the MedeaWiz DV76 HD Player? Sounds like it does what you need and it's $385. http://www.medeawiz.com/products/Dv76.htm Sold through Team Kingsley in St. Louis. http://www.teamkingsley.com/MedeaWiz.htm Please let me know if this does what you're looking for or if anyone else has experience with this product. I'm about to use their DV68 for the first time for a project now. I'm curious about the HD player. Thanks Dana Hutchins XhibitNet 541 Congress St. Portland, ME 04101 207.773.1101 ext.102 dana at xhibit.net www.xhibit.net On 11/7/08 5:51 PM, Jason Bondy jbondy at okhistory.org wrote: Daniel, Thanks for your response. We have an 80GB hard drive in the computer. Many of the video clips are 5-10 minutes long, except one that is 32 minutes. We are planning more long documentary type films, so we need to be ready for the larger files. We currently own a few of the Firefly digital video players for standard-definition video, but their HD players are out of our budget at this time, as are the Adtec devices. Also, we already have the computers installed, so we were going to try to use those if we can. As far as Blu-ray, we are concerned about wear and tear on it if the film is repeating continuously for nine hours per day. A hard drive is much cheaper to replace when it wears out. We are still learning about various HD formats and playback options. We were using H.264 originally because we have a Flash program that plays the files using QuickTime. We need a playback format and application that goes straight to full screen as soon as the computer boots up. Do you know of any good reference material that explains some of the formats more in depth? Thank you. I really appreciate your time and assistance! Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org -Original Message- From: mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu [mailto:mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel M. Bartolini Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 4:02 PM To: Museum Computer Network Listserv Subject: Re: [MCN-L] HD video in the galleries? Hi Jason- How much hard drive space do you have available on these machines and how long are your videos? I ask because HD playback on computers is significantly improved when you use codecs that create discrete frames versus heavily compressed MPEG formats like H.264. For example running your video out to something like DVCPro HD or the Animation preset creates all independent frames of the movie. Your hard drive overhead is enormous (possibly 2 Gb for every 3 minutes, depending on bit rate) but the computer has to think far less about the process as there are no i-frames going on. Alternatively, if you need really small file sizes, mess with the H.264 bit rate. Start high at 1500kb/s and move down to around 900 or less until you find something that allows you to maintain your full frame rate. The lower you go of course the more you will see those motion artifacts, but perhaps not jumpiness. The dirty sort-of-secret of that format is it's really processor intensive and upgrading video cards won't matter a lot unless you specifically buy something like the latest NVidia cards that have built in hardware rendering support of H.264 and other MPEG codecs, or if you're willing to use a program like Max/Jitter (or comparable VJ system), or environment like openFrameworks to display your video in OpenGL so all work is done on the video card. Finally, have you considered standalone HD players, like those from Adtec, or going to Blu-Ray (I know, more money, may not work)? Oi. That was long. Sorry. Hope that helps. Have a good weekend. Daniel Jason Bondy wrote: Hello all, We have recently begun moving toward High-Definition video for all of our interviews, documentaries and other footage to be used in exhibits. We are using internally produced video as well as video shot by outside producers. However, we are running into some obstacles determining the best solution for playback in the galleries. We will be playing the HD video files from Windows-based computers connected to plasma monitors. Currently we are trying it with H.264 encoded QuickTime files, but they are very jumpy on video clips with a lot of motion. We have upgraded the RAM and video cards in the computers, but with very little improvement. Also, we using Cat5 DVI/HDMI extenders as there is quite a bit of distance from the computer to the monitor. Who else out there is using HD video in your exhibits? How are you doing it? We would welcome any suggestions or input you may have. Thank you so much, Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Dana, I hadn't seen that one before. We had originally ruled out dedicated players as the ones that we had found were more than we wanted to spend on it. This one may be worth looking into though. Thanks, Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org -Original Message- From: mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu [mailto:mcn-l-boun...@mcn.edu] On Behalf Of Dana Hutchins Sent: Saturday, November 08, 2008 8:09 AM To: Museum Computer Network Listserv Subject: Re: [MCN-L] HD video in the galleries? Have you looked into the MedeaWiz DV76 HD Player? Sounds like it does what you need and it's $385. http://www.medeawiz.com/products/Dv76.htm Sold through Team Kingsley in St. Louis. http://www.teamkingsley.com/MedeaWiz.htm Please let me know if this does what you're looking for or if anyone else has experience with this product. I'm about to use their DV68 for the first time for a project now. I'm curious about the HD player. Thanks Dana Hutchins XhibitNet 541 Congress St. Portland, ME 04101 207.773.1101 ext.102 dana at xhibit.net www.xhibit.net On 11/7/08 5:51 PM, Jason Bondy jbondy at okhistory.org wrote: Daniel, Thanks for your response. We have an 80GB hard drive in the computer. Many of the video clips are 5-10 minutes long, except one that is 32 minutes. We are planning more long documentary type films, so we need to be ready for the larger files. We currently own a few of the Firefly digital video players for standard-definition video, but their HD players are out of our budget at this time, as are the Adtec devices. Also, we already have the computers installed, so we were going to try to use those if we can. As far as Blu-ray, we are concerned about wear and tear on it if the film is repeating continuously for nine hours per day. A hard drive is much cheaper to replace when it wears out. We are still learning about various HD formats and playback options. We were using H.264 originally because we have a Flash program that plays the files using QuickTime. We need a playback format and application that goes straight to full screen as soon as the computer boots up. Do you know of any good reference material that explains some of the formats more in depth? Thank you. I really appreciate your time and assistance! Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org -Original Message- From: mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu [mailto:mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel M. Bartolini Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 4:02 PM To: Museum Computer Network Listserv Subject: Re: [MCN-L] HD video in the galleries? Hi Jason- How much hard drive space do you have available on these machines and how long are your videos? I ask because HD playback on computers is significantly improved when you use codecs that create discrete frames versus heavily compressed MPEG formats like H.264. For example running your video out to something like DVCPro HD or the Animation preset creates all independent frames of the movie. Your hard drive overhead is enormous (possibly 2 Gb for every 3 minutes, depending on bit rate) but the computer has to think far less about the process as there are no i-frames going on. Alternatively, if you need really small file sizes, mess with the H.264 bit rate. Start high at 1500kb/s and move down to around 900 or less until you find something that allows you to maintain your full frame rate. The lower you go of course the more you will see those motion artifacts, but perhaps not jumpiness. The dirty sort-of-secret of that format is it's really processor intensive and upgrading video cards won't matter a lot unless you specifically buy something like the latest NVidia cards that have built in hardware rendering support of H.264 and other MPEG codecs, or if you're willing to use a program like Max/Jitter (or comparable VJ system), or environment like openFrameworks to display your video in OpenGL so all work is done on the video card. Finally, have you considered standalone HD players, like those from Adtec, or going to Blu-Ray (I know, more money, may not work)? Oi. That was long. Sorry. Hope that helps. Have a good weekend. Daniel Jason Bondy wrote: Hello all, We have recently begun moving toward High-Definition video for all of our interviews, documentaries and other footage to be used in exhibits. We are using internally produced video as well as video shot by outside producers. However, we are running into some obstacles determining the best solution for playback in the galleries. We will be playing the HD video files
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Hello all, We have recently begun moving toward High-Definition video for all of our interviews, documentaries and other footage to be used in exhibits. We are using internally produced video as well as video shot by outside producers. However, we are running into some obstacles determining the best solution for playback in the galleries. We will be playing the HD video files from Windows-based computers connected to plasma monitors. Currently we are trying it with H.264 encoded QuickTime files, but they are very jumpy on video clips with a lot of motion. We have upgraded the RAM and video cards in the computers, but with very little improvement. Also, we using Cat5 DVI/HDMI extenders as there is quite a bit of distance from the computer to the monitor. Who else out there is using HD video in your exhibits? How are you doing it? We would welcome any suggestions or input you may have. Thank you so much, Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Hi, Use Macs! or put in a video server/switch, We bought some Sony HD replay systems based on Express Card technology and they were superb, See main Sony.biz site under EX systems, look for EX30 Bill Gardner PS discs too slow RPM may be the reason yours is jumpy, are they 7200 or 5400 On 7 Nov 2008, at 20:59, Jason Bondy wrote: Hello all, We have recently begun moving toward High-Definition video for all of our interviews, documentaries and other footage to be used in exhibits. We are using internally produced video as well as video shot by outside producers. However, we are running into some obstacles determining the best solution for playback in the galleries. We will be playing the HD video files from Windows-based computers connected to plasma monitors. Currently we are trying it with H.264 encoded QuickTime files, but they are very jumpy on video clips with a lot of motion. We have upgraded the RAM and video cards in the computers, but with very little improvement. Also, we using Cat5 DVI/HDMI extenders as there is quite a bit of distance from the computer to the monitor. Who else out there is using HD video in your exhibits? How are you doing it? We would welcome any suggestions or input you may have. Thank you so much, Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org ___ You are currently subscribed to mcn-l, the listserv of the Museum Computer Network (http://www.mcn.edu) To post to this list, send messages to: mcn-l at mcn.edu To unsubscribe or change mcn-l delivery options visit: http://toronto.mediatrope.com/mailman/listinfo/mcn-l
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Hi Jason... We have some wide screens running the 720p high definition Hubble View Space service content here at the planetarium. I'll describe what we did and hopefully it may be of some interest. I looked at various ways to deliver content and read some MCN list traffic on the subject at the time (18 months ago?). DVD players. DVD players were ruled out as the professional grade units are not cheap (e.g. Panasonic DVD V8000 at US$900+, and NOT BluRay), and mileage for consumer DVD players in an exhibit seems to be 18 months or less before failure. There are also inflexible and can't be easily centrally administered. PC-based players This seemed more attractive. Reasonably inexpensive with say white box or Dell compact desktop PCs, with the advantage that they can be networked and centrally administered. We got a tour of a system at another local venue that used racks of such low end PCs. System control was via commercial Omnivex software, which enabled centralized scheduling and control of content across all the screens in the building. Very flexible, useable and powerful ...but expensive. Like yourself, PCs were rack-mounted well away from the screens with Extron cat5 extender boxes. I reckoned cost-per-screen (excluding display device) came out something like 1) Omnivex license: $1,300 per feed 2) PC $600 (guessing here) 3) Long distance Extron vga-over-cat5 extender box pairs (transmitter and receiver) $1,000 per feed (you'll probably need the long range versions!) 3) cat5 cable run $300 per feed (seems to be the going rate here) TOTAL $3,200 per feed. We didn't have that kind of money and were looking for a small solution to drive half a dozen screens. I felt there should be an easier way. What we went for was: Display devices: MAC mini (Intel Core 2 Duo 1.6GHz) as the display devices. These were retailing at about $650 and VERY good bang for the buck as a digital Swiss Army Knife. I'd heard discussion on this list of using them as inexpensive hard disk playback units as an alternative to flaky DVD players, but with much better flexibility and durability. They are also very small ...small enough to be bolted to a bracket on the back of the screen mounting itself. We considered trying to run windows (bootcamp?) but figured the extra cost of the windows license was not particularly necessary. One gotcha ...the MAC version of Windows Media Player is useless. Performance was terrible ...quite unusable and grossly inferior to the windows version. Conclusion: Windows Media Services is NOT cross-platform, at least if you stick to Microsoft offerings. The solution (thank God) was the free VLC media player, available for Mac, Win PC and Linux. Performance is excellent and stability rock solid. MACs run VLC and pick up a Windows Media Services stream from our main newtwork server. Another neat trick... we install a free MAC version of the popular VNC remote control application for hands free remote admin. Another gotcha: automating the MACs via Applescript to open VLC and connect to the desired feed turned out to be a niggly job, but it worked eventually and is stable. Distribution: The Windows Media Services stream is delivered over our existing LAN. We were concerned that it might consume bandwidth, with impact on other network usage and display quality. I'd read of HD (1080p) feeds consuming around 35 Mbits/s. Our LAN was 100 Mbits/s at that time, so bought new switches ($1,500?) to bump the core up to 1000 Mbits/s. Haven't even installed them yet. It turns out our 720p feed typically runs at 1.5 Mbits/s! It must be pointed out that content is relatively static, an animated Power Point style feed. In any case network bandwidth was no issue. At most, we needed to add extra, relatively short cable drops to the nearest network hub. Content Management: We simply used the Windows Media Services components included by Microsoft in Win2K3 Server. We are only running two feeds, and the server side playlist management facilities are quite adequate to set this up without the lavish Omnivex interface. Effectively free, and it could do a lot more than we are currently asking it too. Cost: 1) Mac Mini $650 (guessing here) 3) cat5 cable drop $300 per feed (seems to be the going rate here) TOTAL $950 per feed. We found that a persuasive number! ...at least for our needs. Other thoughts: You could load windows on the MACs and integrate them better into your network infrastructure, using a common Anti-Virus system, backup utility etc. And of course avoiding the need for any MAC expertise. If you get charity-priced volume licensing for your windows that maybe the way to go. mini-ITX PCs and MAC Minis: You could use mini-ITX based Win PCs to do the playback. This is getting interesting. I reckon you could build a dual-core Atom-based mini PC that could do HD playback for about CAN$350. An E-series Pentium based system for about CAN$450. Both these figures exclude windows licensing. You could try Linux
[MCN-L] HD video in the galleries?
Daniel, Thanks for your response. We have an 80GB hard drive in the computer. Many of the video clips are 5-10 minutes long, except one that is 32 minutes. We are planning more long documentary type films, so we need to be ready for the larger files. We currently own a few of the Firefly digital video players for standard-definition video, but their HD players are out of our budget at this time, as are the Adtec devices. Also, we already have the computers installed, so we were going to try to use those if we can. As far as Blu-ray, we are concerned about wear and tear on it if the film is repeating continuously for nine hours per day. A hard drive is much cheaper to replace when it wears out. We are still learning about various HD formats and playback options. We were using H.264 originally because we have a Flash program that plays the files using QuickTime. We need a playback format and application that goes straight to full screen as soon as the computer boots up. Do you know of any good reference material that explains some of the formats more in depth? Thank you. I really appreciate your time and assistance! Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org -Original Message- From: mcn-l-bounces at mcn.edu [mailto:mcn-l-boun...@mcn.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel M. Bartolini Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 4:02 PM To: Museum Computer Network Listserv Subject: Re: [MCN-L] HD video in the galleries? Hi Jason- How much hard drive space do you have available on these machines and how long are your videos? I ask because HD playback on computers is significantly improved when you use codecs that create discrete frames versus heavily compressed MPEG formats like H.264. For example running your video out to something like DVCPro HD or the Animation preset creates all independent frames of the movie. Your hard drive overhead is enormous (possibly 2 Gb for every 3 minutes, depending on bit rate) but the computer has to think far less about the process as there are no i-frames going on. Alternatively, if you need really small file sizes, mess with the H.264 bit rate. Start high at 1500kb/s and move down to around 900 or less until you find something that allows you to maintain your full frame rate. The lower you go of course the more you will see those motion artifacts, but perhaps not jumpiness. The dirty sort-of-secret of that format is it's really processor intensive and upgrading video cards won't matter a lot unless you specifically buy something like the latest NVidia cards that have built in hardware rendering support of H.264 and other MPEG codecs, or if you're willing to use a program like Max/Jitter (or comparable VJ system), or environment like openFrameworks to display your video in OpenGL so all work is done on the video card. Finally, have you considered standalone HD players, like those from Adtec, or going to Blu-Ray (I know, more money, may not work)? Oi. That was long. Sorry. Hope that helps. Have a good weekend. Daniel Jason Bondy wrote: Hello all, We have recently begun moving toward High-Definition video for all of our interviews, documentaries and other footage to be used in exhibits. We are using internally produced video as well as video shot by outside producers. However, we are running into some obstacles determining the best solution for playback in the galleries. We will be playing the HD video files from Windows-based computers connected to plasma monitors. Currently we are trying it with H.264 encoded QuickTime files, but they are very jumpy on video clips with a lot of motion. We have upgraded the RAM and video cards in the computers, but with very little improvement. Also, we using Cat5 DVI/HDMI extenders as there is quite a bit of distance from the computer to the monitor. Who else out there is using HD video in your exhibits? How are you doing it? We would welcome any suggestions or input you may have. Thank you so much, Jason ___ Jason Bondy Exhibit AV/IT Systems Oklahoma History Center 2401 N. Laird Ave. Oklahoma City, OK 73105 405-522-0783 - Office 405-522-5402 - Fax www.okhistory.org ___ You are currently subscribed to mcn-l, the listserv of the Museum Computer Network (http://www.mcn.edu) To post to this list, send messages to: mcn-l at mcn.edu To unsubscribe or change mcn-l delivery options visit: http://toronto.mediatrope.com/mailman/listinfo/mcn-l
