[MBZ] tranny acting strange
Put the 560 back on the road for a trial run the other day. I drove it around town and had no problems. Today wife decides to take it to tulsa and it starts doing wierd things. She said it wouldnt kick into gear and was at about 4k rpm. Car sat for 30-45 min till I got to where she was. I checked the fluid and it was fine. I drove it home, shifted fine at first but woulnt kick into 4th. Put it in neutral then back to drive and it kicked into 4th. Cruising down the highway all the sudden it downshifts on its own to 3rd. Would not go back to 4th. Anytime I had to go up from 2nd to 3rd i had to put it in neutral then drive and it would go up to 3rd. A few miles from home had to slow down then it never would go past 2nd. Got home and tranny seemed very hot. Couldnt hardly even touch the dipstick. Got out my lazer thermometer and read the temp on the bottom of the pan at about 278 or so. WAY too hot. My first guess is the filter is plugged up. Beyond that, the tranny is probably toast. Thoughts? -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
[MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Anyone/Everyone I got this '87 300E almost by default. I bid a very low amount and NO ONE bid against me. Imagine that. Now that I have my very first Mercedes, it would be nice if someone could help me figure out WTF on several items. 1. It starts rough, but once it is started runs smooth. And if I don't give it some extra gas it will die. I have used some BK fuel injection/system cleaner but that didn't help it start smooth. 2. After it is started, I shift it into Reverse, takes about 3-4 seconds then it hits Hard, when I shift it into Drive from Reverse, it takes about 2 seconds and then it hits not so hard. [Also, Seems like it starts out in 2nd gear. If I step down all the way on the gas it downshifts - the tires chirp and we Really take off fast! Which is good by the way but seems strange it will downshift from a standing start.] 3. This one scares me a little. Starting from a stop I accelerate smartly, when it shifts from 1st to 2nd and I hear a sound like a old cold weather V belt slipping for an instant. Same screech when it shifts from 2nd to 3rd. Not all the time but once in awhile. I know the belts aren't slipping on this engine. 4. There is a small sound under the passenger dash when I start it first thing in the morning [some other times as well] like a small fan bushing is going. It stops after a little while. What's under the dash on that side that could make that sound? Finally- 5. How the heck do I get the door panels off??? Any and all help is Greatly Appreciated! My lady and I like this car, I'd like it to perform well. Sam
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
There could be a reason that nobody bid on it if it was priced too much in the first place. Sounds like your tranny is about toast. Those long times to go into gear do not sound good and usually indicate its worn out. You can try changing the fluid and filter but i doubt it will help. Also sounds like you might be in need of new injectors. At around 160, the valve guides and seals will need to be replaced on that engine. IT will use alot of oil it they have not been. The fan noise under the dash is probably the aspirator motor for the inside air sensor. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone/Everyone I got this '87 300E almost by default. I bid a very low amount and NO ONE bid against me. Imagine that. Now that I have my very first Mercedes, it would be nice if someone could help me figure out WTF on several items. 1. It starts rough, but once it is started runs smooth. And if I don't give it some extra gas it will die. I have used some BK fuel injection/system cleaner but that didn't help it start smooth. 2. After it is started, I shift it into Reverse, takes about 3-4 seconds then it hits Hard, when I shift it into Drive from Reverse, it takes about 2 seconds and then it hits not so hard. [Also, Seems like it starts out in 2nd gear. If I step down all the way on the gas it downshifts - the tires chirp and we Really take off fast! Which is good by the way but seems strange it will downshift from a standing start.] 3. This one scares me a little. Starting from a stop I accelerate smartly, when it shifts from 1st to 2nd and I hear a sound like a old cold weather V belt slipping for an instant. Same screech when it shifts from 2nd to 3rd. Not all the time but once in awhile. I know the belts aren't slipping on this engine. 4. There is a small sound under the passenger dash when I start it first thing in the morning [some other times as well] like a small fan bushing is going. It stops after a little while. What's under the dash on that side that could make that sound? Finally- 5. How the heck do I get the door panels off??? Any and all help is Greatly Appreciated! My lady and I like this car, I'd like it to perform well. Sam ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
[MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine
Hello All, A friend of mine had an unfortunate run-in with a log a few weeks ago. He ran over a log doing 80MPH in his '93 300D. Engine was totally trashed but the rest of the car is still in reasonable shape. Some frontend damage but all repairable. The insurance company totalled the vehicle and he bought it back cheap. He is considering taking the settlement and fixing the car if he can find a used engine. The car had been set up as a veggie burner and he has lots of time and money invested in her. Anyone have any leads on an engine? Kaleb perhaps? He has an offer from a salvage yard for one but would like some more options. All suggestions or leads would be appreciated. -- Ralph Wasserbaech '82 300TD '83 300CD '90 300D '01 E320 Wagon
Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine
Good luck finding one, they are hard to come by. Im needing one myself. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello All, A friend of mine had an unfortunate run-in with a log a few weeks ago. He ran over a log doing 80MPH in his '93 300D. Engine was totally trashed but the rest of the car is still in reasonable shape. Some frontend damage but all repairable. The insurance company totalled the vehicle and he bought it back cheap. He is considering taking the settlement and fixing the car if he can find a used engine. The car had been set up as a veggie burner and he has lots of time and money invested in her. Anyone have any leads on an engine? Kaleb perhaps? He has an offer from a salvage yard for one but would like some more options. All suggestions or leads would be appreciated. -- Ralph Wasserbaech '82 300TD '83 300CD '90 300D '01 E320 Wagon ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine
Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Good luck finding one, they are hard to come by. Im needing one myself. I've got an '87 but I still want to stick it in the 2.3-16v. 22mpg is getting old, and it takes quite a bit of restraint to get that mileage, that car just wants to GO.
Re: [MBZ] tranny acting strange
Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Put the 560 back on the road for a trial run the other day. I drove it around town and had no problems. Today wife decides to take it to tulsa and it starts doing wierd things. She said it wouldnt kick into gear and was at about 4k rpm. Car sat for 30-45 min till I got to where she was. I checked the fluid and it was fine. I drove it home, shifted fine at first but woulnt kick into 4th. Put it in neutral then back to drive and it kicked into 4th. Cruising down the highway all the sudden it downshifts on its own to 3rd. Would not go back to 4th. Anytime I had to go up from 2nd to 3rd i had to put it in neutral then drive and it would go up to 3rd. A few miles from home had to slow down then it never would go past 2nd. Got home and tranny seemed very hot. Couldnt hardly even touch the dipstick. Got out my lazer thermometer and read the temp on the bottom of the pan at about 278 or so. WAY too hot. My first guess is the filter is plugged up. Beyond that, the tranny is probably toast. Thoughts? Plugged filter or the thermostat isn't opening and cooling the ATF. Possible (but unlikely) that the kickdown switch is sticking ON. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] tranny acting strange
I tell you, one other thing I noticed, the top radiator hose is sucked in, as in flat. That after sitting. Not sure what it does when running, didnt appear to be though, just after sitting a while. Marshall Booth wrote: Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Put the 560 back on the road for a trial run the other day. I drove it around town and had no problems. Today wife decides to take it to tulsa and it starts doing wierd things. She said it wouldnt kick into gear and was at about 4k rpm. Car sat for 30-45 min till I got to where she was. I checked the fluid and it was fine. I drove it home, shifted fine at first but woulnt kick into 4th. Put it in neutral then back to drive and it kicked into 4th. Cruising down the highway all the sudden it downshifts on its own to 3rd. Would not go back to 4th. Anytime I had to go up from 2nd to 3rd i had to put it in neutral then drive and it would go up to 3rd. A few miles from home had to slow down then it never would go past 2nd. Got home and tranny seemed very hot. Couldnt hardly even touch the dipstick. Got out my lazer thermometer and read the temp on the bottom of the pan at about 278 or so. WAY too hot. My first guess is the filter is plugged up. Beyond that, the tranny is probably toast. Thoughts? Plugged filter or the thermostat isn't opening and cooling the ATF. Possible (but unlikely) that the kickdown switch is sticking ON. Marshall -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
[MBZ] The loudest horn ever / How to disable Alarm
You know, someone once told me that sound can actually make someone sick- well, I had posted about my alarm (it has a mind of its own recently, and makes peeps as I drive etc.) Well, we're at this quiet little New England inn this weekend, and I park the car and go to sleep. I was awakened by the loudest, constant (not beeping but like laying-on-it) horn- realized it was my car and when I popped the hood, and found that the alarm has its own horn- much louder than the actual horn horn. I pulled wires until I got it to shut up- but get this, the sound was so loud (and I was close enough to it pulling wires) that I ended up with such a headache that I ended up loosing my dinner and sitting on the toilet all night. Really, that horn is the loudest bugger I have seen. Nothing like those random beeep, bip, bip, bip, bip alarms of today. Problem solved, right? No sound no problem. So the story gets better. I get a bad night's sleep from the sound poisoning and notice while driving back to RI that people are looking me strangely in the car as they pass. I couldn't figure it out. I thought it was because the car was overloaded with 4 heavy adults, a baby, and a trunk bursting at the seams. Nope, it was the ALARM again, NO SOUND, but a great light show (headlights, turn signals and all) Along with the lights show there was a perfect tick tick tick of the alarm relay inside the car- just like a car bomb on TV. The in-law's loved it and we're looking for the bomb all the way through MA. I pulled over. IN CASE anyone has this trouble, I KNOW WHERE THE CONTROLLER IS. Look under the driver's side floor mat. Unplug it. Throw it out the window. John Peterson 1991 300D 2.5 81k Mitch Haley wrote: Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Good luck finding one, they are hard to come by. Im needing one myself. I've got an '87 but I still want to stick it in the 2.3-16v. 22mpg is getting old, and it takes quite a bit of restraint to get that mileage, that car just wants to GO. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] tranny acting strange
Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: I tell you, one other thing I noticed, the top radiator hose is sucked in, as in flat. That after sitting. Not sure what it does when running, didnt appear to be though, just after sitting a while. That suggests that the cooling system cap isn't releasing as it should! That's unrelated to the transmission doing anything strange. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] The loudest horn ever / How to disable Alarm
On 8/13/06, John Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was awakened by the loudest, constant (not beeping but like laying-on-it) horn- realized it was my car and when I popped the hood, and found that the alarm has its own horn- much louder than the actual horn horn. Removing the alarm horn also (at least on an '87) makes access to the glow plug relay and its fuse much easier! I suppose one could get really ambitious (or vengeful) and remove every last bit of wiring associated with the accursed factory alarm, but I just unplugged the controller, removed the horn, and taped off the wires leading to the latter. Alex Chamberlain '87 300D Turbo '93 Isuzu Trooper
Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello All, A friend of mine had an unfortunate run-in with a log a few weeks ago. He ran over a log doing 80MPH in his '93 300D. Engine was totally trashed but the rest of the car is still in reasonable shape. Some frontend damage but all repairable. The insurance company totalled the vehicle and he bought it back cheap. He is considering taking the settlement and fixing the car if he can find a used engine. The car had been set up as a veggie burner and he has lots of time and money invested in her. Anyone have any leads on an engine? Kaleb perhaps? He has an offer from a salvage yard for one but would like some more options. All suggestions or leads would be appreciated. 602.96 engines are in short supply. Rebuilt ones are VERY expensive as I recall. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] Maple trees are evil
Zoltan askedmaple tree drop its various droppings on their automobile and had serious stains result Hey Zoltan, I've had wet (like from dew) Maple leaves sit on my car for a day or 2 and a stain has been left. The only way I can get them off is with wax - so if you've tried it and wax didn't help - perhaps my stains aren't as aggresive as yours. One other things to try - very carefully - is some stuff called Scratch X by Meguires/ It's meant for light scratchs, swirls as well as oxidation and blemishes. But be cautious and go slowly because it'll remove the clear coat - especially if you use a power machine. Of course, there are many less aggressive rubbing compounds available. Good luck - Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: Zoltan Finks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 10:29 PM Subject: [MBZ] Maple trees are evil Has anyone had a maple tree drop its various droppings on their automobile and had serious stains result? There are rust-colored stains on my light blue paint. I've tried several cleaners and such and the stains don't want to budge much. I'm wondering if this is acutally rust somehow being caused by the droppings or if the color is coincidental. Would love to know how to get this stuff off my paint so I can say lesson learned and place a cover over the thing from now forward. Brian 83 240D 84 Saab 900 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.9/417 - Release Date: 8/11/2006
Re: [MBZ] Fw: Alert on Critical MicrosoftMessenger ServiceVulnerability
The Video Toaster you might have seen on an Amiga was properly known as a video switcher, but with about a million effects it was a pretty amazing box. If you've seen Home Improvement you've seen Toaster effects. The Toaster Flyer came out later on an NT box and was a proper non-linear editor. -Curt Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 19:50:39 -0500 From: OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fw: Alert on Critical MicrosoftMessenger ServiceVulnerability To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Amiga was one of the leaders -- with decent marketing it could have taken the graphics industry from Apple --- The first digital video eding suite I saw ran on an Amiga -- the video toaster(?). Ah well, Apple has survived, unlike some of the others. Imagine, multi-user multitasking computers in 1978..They were around, believe it or not. Probably slower than molassas in January, but alive -- Sinclair for one, don't remember the others. Peter -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK The Americans will always do the right thing... after they've exhausted all the alternatives. Sir Winston Churchill '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager - Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Aug 14 00:55:45 2006 Received: from web32808.mail.mud.yahoo.com ([68.142.206.38]) by server8.arterytc8.net with smtp (Exim 4.52) id 1GCQk5-0001Vl-GT for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 00:55:45 + Received: (qmail 97324 invoked by uid 60001); 14 Aug 2006 00:55:35 - Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Received: from [71.233.182.93] by web32808.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:55:35 PDT Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:55:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Curt Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Diesel List mercedes@okiebenz.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.7.cp2 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Rebuilt 190D X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.7.cp2 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 00:55:45 - None of the 240Ds are turbo, yes they're slow but yes they're also nice cars to drive as long as you're not in a super hurry. That said I used to wind mine up to 80mph and hold it there for 90 miles every day. -Curt Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 16:17:53 -0500 From: Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Rebuilt 190D To: Mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Larry T. wrote: Well, based on what others around '78 go for I believe I'd have a hard time getting more than $2000 for it Are you really selling it Larry? If it is a 78, does that mean it is not turbo? Seems like it would be SLOW, SLOW, SLOW. Might make a great car for traveling. Donald H. Snook 1990 300SEL 129K - Get your email and more, right on the new Yahoo.com From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Aug 14 00:58:10 2006 Received: from mail1.mx.voyager.net ([216.93.66.204]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1GCQmQ-0001nr-7e for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 00:58:10 + Received: from voyager.net (d97.as1.sfld1.mi.core.com [209.153.174.134]) by mail1.mx.voyager.net (8.13.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id k7E0w0gr025783 for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:58:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:58:01 -0400 From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.7.cp2 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL
Re: [MBZ] Rebuilt 190D
You asked:If it is a 78, does that mean it is not turbo? Seems like it would be SLOW Hi Donald, Slow?? why would you think a 3300# car with ~65hp might be slw? ;-) That works out to 50#'s per hp - most normal family type cars are in the 20#'s/hp while high perfoemance is in the 5-10#'s/hp. I may not have answered your question completely. Nope, not a turbo. None of the 240Ds were turbocharged. Once you get up to speed, it;s not bad. But, IMHO, it gets kinda loud once I get above about 65 mph or so. Maybe it;s just mine but the engine noise is pretty bad above that. As far as acceleration, between 0 and 15 it's slw. learn to be very patient. Once above 15-18 it goes pretty good - mine's much better since I fixed the AT control rod bushing. I actually had to slow down one time to avoid the car in front of me - course, it was a scared 7 year old kid in front of me in a pedal car Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 5:17 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Rebuilt 190D Larry T. wrote: Well, based on what others around '78 go for I believe I'd have a hard time getting more than $2000 for it Are you really selling it Larry? If it is a 78, does that mean it is not turbo? Seems like it would be SLOW, SLOW, SLOW. Might make a great car for traveling. Donald H. Snook 1990 300SEL 129K ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.9/417 - Release Date: 8/11/2006
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Beware a car nobody else bids on... Chuck is exactly right, spend the money to change all the fluids, new filters where appropriate. This is a gasser right? While you're at it replace the sparkplugs and airfilter. I don't know how the fuel filter(s) work on a gasser but replace those too. I might even consider draining the gas and replacing that. Hope the shifting clears up with the flush but I'd guess that trans is toast. I think the door panels are the same as on my 190D in which case pry the cover off from the handle from the armrest and theres a bolt in there you take out, then take the lock knob off, then take the electric seat buttons off (assuming electric seats) and take the trim plate off, then pull the door handle forward and off. Then lift UP to remove the door skin. Thats definately how its done on a 190D, I did 3 yesterday. Other cars (w123 cars for sure) may be different. -Curt Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 23:08:56 + From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Anyone/Everyone I got this '87 300E almost by default. I bid a very low amount and NO ONE bid against me. Imagine that. Now that I have my very first Mercedes, it would be nice if someone could help me figure out WTF on several items. 1. It starts rough, but once it is started runs smooth. And if I don't give it some extra gas it will die. I have used some BK fuel injection/system cleaner but that didn't help it start smooth. 2. After it is started, I shift it into Reverse, takes about 3-4 seconds then it hits Hard, when I shift it into Drive from Reverse, it takes about 2 seconds and then it hits not so hard. [Also, Seems like it starts out in 2nd gear. If I step down all the way on the gas it downshifts - the tires chirp and we Really take off fast! Which is good by the way but seems strange it will downshift from a standing start.] 3. This one scares me a little. Starting from a stop I accelerate smartly, when it shifts from 1st to 2nd and I hear a sound like a old cold weather V belt slipping for an instant. Same screech when it shifts from 2nd to 3rd. Not all the time but once in awhile. I know the belts aren't slipping on this engine. 4. There is a small sound under the passenger dash when I start it first thing in the morning [some other times as well] like a small fan bushing is going. It stops after a little while. What's under the dash on that side that could make that sound? Finally- 5. How the heck do I get the door panels off??? Any and all help is Greatly Appreciated! My lady and I like this car, I'd like it to perform well. Sam - Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Aug 14 01:04:04 2006 Received: from web32809.mail.mud.yahoo.com ([68.142.206.39]) by server8.arterytc8.net with smtp (Exim 4.52) id 1GCQs8-0002Ny-8T for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:04:04 + Received: (qmail 72347 invoked by uid 60001); 14 Aug 2006 01:03:54 - Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Received: from [71.233.182.93] by web32809.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:03:54 PDT Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:03:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Curt Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Diesel List mercedes@okiebenz.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.7.cp2 Subject: Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.7.cp2 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:04:04 - I wonder if thats just a 190 trait, my 190D is hard to keep down to under 70mph. -Curt Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 19:48:11 -0400 From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Good luck finding one, they are hard to come by. Im needing one myself. I've got an '87 but I still want to stick it in the 2.3-16v. 22mpg is getting old, and it takes quite a bit of restraint to get that mileage, that car just wants to GO. - Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls.
Re: [MBZ] Maple trees are evil
Use a clay bar guy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of LarryT Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 8:40 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Maple trees are evil Zoltan askedmaple tree drop its various droppings on their automobile and had serious stains result Hey Zoltan, I've had wet (like from dew) Maple leaves sit on my car for a day or 2 and a stain has been left. The only way I can get them off is with wax - so if you've tried it and wax didn't help - perhaps my stains aren't as aggresive as yours. One other things to try - very carefully - is some stuff called Scratch X by Meguires/ It's meant for light scratchs, swirls as well as oxidation and blemishes. But be cautious and go slowly because it'll remove the clear coat - especially if you use a power machine. Of course, there are many less aggressive rubbing compounds available. Good luck - Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: Zoltan Finks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 10:29 PM Subject: [MBZ] Maple trees are evil Has anyone had a maple tree drop its various droppings on their automobile and had serious stains result? There are rust-colored stains on my light blue paint. I've tried several cleaners and such and the stains don't want to budge much. I'm wondering if this is acutally rust somehow being caused by the droppings or if the color is coincidental. Would love to know how to get this stuff off my paint so I can say lesson learned and place a cover over the thing from now forward. Brian 83 240D 84 Saab 900 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.9/417 - Release Date: 8/11/2006 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Trans Wierdness--same problem as Klebbys FIXED
Kaleb: I had similar symptoms on my 300SD but not as severe. Did not like to shift into 4th, would downshift into 3rd when it was not supposed to after about 150 miles of driving and need to be coaxed into 4th with the shift-into neutral trick. Asked for a transmission drain and new filter. My indy power flushed it instead. Still had the problem, tho the shifts were noticably crisper. Took it back and asked if they'd changed the filter. They hadn't. Made them do what I'd asked in the first place no charge. Problem solved. Drove it all day today at a minimum speed of 80, and most of the time the speedo was on the peg, and I'd have to slow down quite a bit before it started to drop. (I'm in Ontario right now, where they drive like bats out of hell-Toronto, to be exact). Trans worked perfectly. Interestingly, my mileage at those speeds was no worse than usual: 25.8 mpg. And after a thousand miles of driving like that, it used only a barely perceptible amount of oil--either all those gaskets and seals I replaced were leaking more than I thought, or running M-1 for the past 28k miles has made a big difference, or both. Dan 83 300SD, 282k Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Put the 560 back on the road for a trial run the other day. I drove it around town and had no problems. Today wife decides to take it to tulsa and it starts doing wierd things. She said it wouldnt kick into gear and was at about 4k rpm. Car sat for 30-45 min till I got to where she was. I checked the fluid and it was fine. I drove it home, shifted fine at first but woulnt kick into 4th. Put it in neutral then back to drive and it kicked into 4th. Cruising down the highway all the sudden it downshifts on its own to 3rd. Would not go back to 4th. Anytime I had to go up from 2nd to 3rd i had to put it in neutral then drive and it would go up to 3rd. A few miles from home had to slow down then it never would go past 2nd. Got home and tranny seemed very hot. Couldnt hardly even touch the dipstick. Got out my lazer thermometer and read the temp on the bottom of the pan at about 278 or so. WAY too hot. My first guess is the filter is plugged up. Beyond that, the tranny is probably toast. Thoughts? Plugged filter or the thermostat isn't opening and cooling the ATF. Possible (but unlikely) that the kickdown switch is sticking ON. Marshall -- Dan Weeks Freelance Writing and Photography 515/279-4825 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine
Curt Raymond wrote: I wonder if thats just a 190 trait, my 190D is hard to keep down to under 70mph. My problem is I enjoy going 0-60 in 7.x seconds whilst listening to that twincam Cosworth/Mercedes howl. If I put the crazy Finn mods on the 2.5 turbo engine it'll probably just get worse. There are five stop signs on little traveled roads between my house and my office.
Re: [MBZ] Wobbly 124
Sounds like it needs new shocks in the rear...not much money and easy to swap out. The shifting problem is likely a cable adjustment. Jeff Zedic Toronto
Re: [MBZ] Trans Wierdness--same problem as Klebbys FIXED
Dan Weeks wrote: Kaleb: I had similar symptoms on my 300SD but not as severe. But did you drive it down the freeway in 3rd until it hit 300 degrees F?
Re: [MBZ] Maple trees are evil
I have sugar maple trees in my front yard and they will ruin paint. I don't park under them as I have never found anything to make the paint look the same again. Mike - Original Message - From: Zoltan Finks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 10:29 PM Subject: [MBZ] Maple trees are evil Has anyone had a maple tree drop its various droppings on their automobile and had serious stains result? There are rust-colored stains on my light blue paint. I've tried several cleaners and such and the stains don't want to budge much. I'm wondering if this is acutally rust somehow being caused by the droppings or if the color is coincidental. Would love to know how to get this stuff off my paint so I can say lesson learned and place a cover over the thing from now forward. Brian 83 240D 84 Saab 900 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Rebuilt 190D
On Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:00:14 -0400 LarryT [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As far as acceleration, between 0 and 15 it's slw. learn to be very patient. Shift it manually! You can actually make a 240D much zippier than normal that way ONE CAVEAT, HOWEVER: do NOT put it in L unless you're stopped. If you put it in L when it should be in second it will be fine, but if you slow down, it will slam into first, which is hard on the transmission. That happened one time too many in our 240D/auto and the transmission broke most severely. That's why it's now a 300D/stick. Craig
[MBZ] More Jim Catheying yet to come
Took a motorcycle ride with my wife today. She's got an '89 Kawasaki 454LTD with monster electrical issues. Its like a drunken 14 year old rewired the whole bike. Last week one of the front marker lights was out. Turned out it has a banana type connection that had just pulled apart. I have no idea why there would be a banana connection, but there is and its ONLY for the left front marker light... Tonight I notice that there are 2 lights that make up the taillight and one blinks on and off prettymuch randomly, probably another blasted banana connection I couldn't find yet. Anyway the big problem is that the bike just randomly shuts off sometimes. I'm okay with it because it mostly only does it when the bike is still cold and all you have to do is reach up and jiggle the key and the bike fires right back up. Thats me with 3 years of riding experience. My wife is on her 5th ride so when it dies she just gasses it, then hits a bump, the key jiggles and she's doing a wheelie! Last summer itwas doing the same thing but would get better the more you rode the bike. We've been real busy and so the bikes only been ridden a half dozen times this year... Anyway, my winter project I guess will be rewiring that stupid bike... MB content: My wife was very pleased when her car door stayed open today... A mere 39mpg last week, I'm so disappointed ;) -Curt - How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low PC-to-Phone call rates. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Aug 14 01:53:59 2006 Received: from imo-d01.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.33]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1GCReQ-0006ee-Rf for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:53:59 + Received: from [EMAIL PROTECTED] by imo-d01.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id s.4de.1153ddf (22681) for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:53:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mblkn-m11 (mblkn-m11.mblk.aol.com [64.12.170.129]) by air-in04.mx.aol.com (v111.7) with ESMTP id MAILININ42-589944dfd7a7f6; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:53:43 -0400 Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:53:43 -0400 Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Received: from 71.120.72.101 by mblkn-m11.sysops.aol.com (64.12.170.129) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:53:42 -0400 X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI X-MB-Message-Type: User In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailer: Netscape WebMail 18766 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-AOL-IP: 64.12.170.129 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.7.cp2 Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.7.cp2 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:53:59 - Yep, here's the url for the classic center. Just fill in the info and they email you back. http://www.mbusa.com/heritage/contact-classic-center.do Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 11:22:23 -0500 Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Do they have an email address? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ya know Kaleb, you might be able to send the numbers off that plate to Mercedes Classic center to see if they know what it came from. Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Banned List [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Mailing List mercedes@okiebenz.com; Dan Holden [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 19:50:36 -0500 Subject: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in http://www.okiebenz.com/pics/603engine/ Supposed to be a 3.5l, they said it was military engine. Looks like it was from a G-wagon. It has a #22 head!!! I bought it for the head but wonder if the engine is good. Do these have the rod bending problems as well. This euro or whatever version, what sort of hp will it have? I have a nice SDL that would love to have a screaming fast 603 in it. Hmm -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore,
Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in
They also have a toll free number, its out in Califonia... 1-866-MBCLASSIC (622-5277) Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 11:22:23 -0500 Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Do they have an email address? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ya know Kaleb, you might be able to send the numbers off that plate to Mercedes Classic center to see if they know what it came from. Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Banned List [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Mailing List mercedes@okiebenz.com; Dan Holden [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 19:50:36 -0500 Subject: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in http://www.okiebenz.com/pics/603engine/ Supposed to be a 3.5l, they said it was military engine. Looks like it was from a G-wagon. It has a #22 head!!! I bought it for the head but wonder if the engine is good. Do these have the rod bending problems as well. This euro or whatever version, what sort of hp will it have? I have a nice SDL that would love to have a screaming fast 603 in it. Hmm -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
I would have to agree with Kaleb, but it could just need so tranny service. As for starting out in second gear didn't those have a winter mode for the tranny where they start out in second gear to prevent tire slippage? The rough start could be clogged injectors and just need a good cleaning or maybe the cold start valve could be faulty. If the condition of the car isn't all that bad a little TLC might be worth it. Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 23:08:56 + Subject: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs Anyone/Everyone I got this '87 300E almost by default. I bid a very low amount and NO ONE bid against me. Imagine that. Now that I have my very first Mercedes, it would be nice if someone could help me figure out WTF on several items. 1. It starts rough, but once it is started runs smooth. And if I don't give it some extra gas it will die. I have used some BK fuel injection/system cleaner but that didn't help it start smooth. 2. After it is started, I shift it into Reverse, takes about 3-4 seconds then it hits Hard, when I shift it into Drive from Reverse, it takes about 2 seconds and then it hits not so hard. [Also, Seems like it starts out in 2nd gear. If I step down all the way on the gas it downshifts - the tires chirp and we Really take off fast! Which is good by the way but seems strange it will downshift from a standing start.] 3. This one scares me a little. Starting from a stop I accelerate smartly, when it shifts from 1st to 2nd and I hear a sound like a old cold weather V belt slipping for an instant. Same screech when it shifts from 2nd to 3rd. Not all the time but once in awhile. I know the belts aren't slipping on this engine. 4. There is a small sound under the passenger dash when I start it first thing in the morning [some other times as well] like a small fan bushing is going. It stops after a little while. What's under the dash on that side that could make that sound? Finally- 5. How the heck do I get the door panels off??? Any and all help is Greatly Appreciated! My lady and I like this car, I'd like it to perform well. Sam ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Remember my CD tranny was condemmed and needed a rebuild. I changed the fluid to Mobil 1 ATF and all was good after a thousand miles or so. It's worth a try for ~$70 vs. the $1800 rebuild cost. Luther On Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:15:36 -0500, Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There could be a reason that nobody bid on it if it was priced too much in the first place. Sounds like your tranny is about toast. Those long times to go into gear do not sound good and usually indicate its worn out. You can try changing the fluid and filter but i doubt it will help. Also sounds like you might be in need of new injectors. At around 160, the valve guides and seals will need to be replaced on that engine. IT will use alot of oil it they have not been. The fan noise under the dash is probably the aspirator motor for the inside air sensor. -- Luther KB5QHU Alma, Ark '83 300SD (236 kmi) '82 300CD (160 kmi) '82 300D (74 kmi) needs MAJOR work
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone/Everyone I got this '87 300E almost by default. I bid a very low amount and NO ONE bid against me. Imagine that. Now that I have my very first Mercedes, it would be nice if someone could help me figure out WTF on several items. 1. It starts rough, but once it is started runs smooth. And if I don't give it some extra gas it will die. I have used some BK fuel injection/system cleaner but that didn't help it start smooth. 2. After it is started, I shift it into Reverse, takes about 3-4 seconds then it hits Hard, when I shift it into Drive from Reverse, it takes about 2 seconds and then it hits not so hard. [Also, Seems like it starts out in 2nd gear. If I step down all the way on the gas it downshifts - the tires chirp and we Really take off fast! Which is good by the way but seems strange it will downshift from a standing start.] 3. This one scares me a little. Starting from a stop I accelerate smartly, when it shifts from 1st to 2nd and I hear a sound like a old cold weather V belt slipping for an instant. Same screech when it shifts from 2nd to 3rd. Not all the time but once in awhile. I know the belts aren't slipping on this engine. 4. There is a small sound under the passenger dash when I start it first thing in the morning [some other times as well] like a small fan bushing is going. It stops after a little while. What's under the dash on that side that could make that sound? When properly adjusted, in drive the car sits in 2nd while stopped and starts in 2nd unless the pedal is pushed down more than ~50% or the kickdown is engaged. A 3-4 sec delay from neutral to reverse signals that the Rev. clutch pack is worn and that is the best indicator for a rebuild that I know of. Once the REV pack allows slipping, the transmission is slipping ALL the time and really needs to be rebuilt before the hard parts start to wear. Get the factory manual (on CD). That's the least expensive source of the information required to properly repair and maintain the car. Marshall Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Luther Gulseth wrote: Remember my CD tranny was condemmed and needed a rebuild. I changed the fluid to Mobil 1 ATF and all was good after a thousand miles or so. It's worth a try for ~$70 vs. the $1800 rebuild cost. Luther I agree that the first thing to do when confronted with an erratic transmission is to change the fluid (all of it including the torque converter) and filter. If that doesn't work, it gets expensive FAST! Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Hehe, welcome to the W124 chassis! Your starting problem and hard shifts are due to vac leaks, most likely on that age car leaking idle control valve hoses -- there is an electrically operated valve between the fuel distributor and the intake manifold -- looks like a small coke can, one two wire connector. It's under the air filter housing, take off the two 10 mm nuts up top and the one on the fender side where you can't see it, then take off the breather hose. Check the small breather hose as well, goes between the intake and valve cover gasket. Likely bad, too. If the hoses are split, rock hard, or mushy, replace them. I'd also replace all the rubber connectors on the hard vac lines, they are likely shot. This will improve the vac, and hence shifting. Late engagement of reverse indicates worn clutches. Check the engine mounts, likely the fan is running on the shroud when it shifts. Two large gel filled mounts, one on each side. You must be able to see the trapezoidal steel part on the bottom, and the rim on the top must be at least one inch from the frame. Very likely flat with all the glycol gel leaked out. Makes it idle rought, too. Otherwise, something it wrong The noise under the dash is a bad interior temp sensor fan motor -- there is a small fan there that draws interior air across the inside temp sensor (in the overhead, next to the sunroof switch). Have to take out the outside vent or the glove box to replace it, as I would, else the temp control becomes erratic. The door panels: Pry off the knobs for the seat back adjusters. Unscrew the lock knob, and the single screw on the cover around the latch. Pry off the cover at the top of the armrest extension, both sides. Push the release lever bucket either forward or back (I can never remember, it's obvious) and remove, then pry the wire rod out to get it free of the door. Remove the screw at the top of the armrest extension, then pull the liner UP to unhook the catches from the door. DO NOT PRY OUTWARDS FROM THE DOOR -- you will have to replace the liner if you do. Straight up till it comes free. On the rear doors you must also remove the ash tray and housing behind it, they latch the liner down as well. Replace the plastic if torn, and definitely glue it back down, else you get terrible wind noise. You will have a wonderful car once you get it back in shape. Here's a short list of things to check/repair: Rear suspension links (likely dead, the rubber goes). Requires a special tool and new bolts, but not terribly expensive Rear subframe mounts. Differential mounts. Front antisway bar mounts (cures the knocking in the front suspension) Vac hoses as mentioned. New serpentine belt unless the one you have is perfect. Will probably require an expensive belt tensioner, but it will last another 200,000 miles. Lubricate the sunroof with MB sunroof paste ONLY (Rusty has it for next to nothing in 2 oz cans) Front ball joints (and have an alignment place check the bushings on the control arms -- cheaper to replace the control arm with new ball joint if they are bad). Front flex disk between tranny and driveshaft -- the rear one lasts forever, front one goes bad every 75,000 miles or so, causes banging shifts, especially closed throttle downshift as you stop Tranny mount Center driveshaft mount (if you can move the driveshaft more than 1/8 by hand, replace the rubber) The nice thing is that you can restore it to showroom new condition if you want! Peter
Re: [MBZ] Wobbly 124
Needs rear shocks, not expensive and easy to replace. Peter
Re: [MBZ] Wobbly 124
Hendrik Riessen wrote: I had a look at a 86 230E over the weekend, at an asking price of AU$3500 and with 240k on the clock it sounded like a good replacement for the 200 which recently was in an accident and is now officially on death row. Anyway the colour was a nice light blue and was in pretty good shape except for a bit of fade on the bonnet (probably because the underbonnet padding has been removed), bit of a scuff on the front bumper and a bit of rust on one of the rear doors. About what I excpected for a $3500 124. The down side was the interior, one of those dark blue ones that makes me feel like I am sitting in a coffin. I did notice that the rear of the car was very bouncy and wobbled, sort of like being in a boat at sea. Almost got seasick driving that thing around the block. My question is what causes this phenomenon? Is it the rubber mounts in the rear subframe or is it the shocks/springs which cause this or is it a combination of a lot of things? Another thing that worried me was the auto box which did not like to engage 2nd, when I pressed the pedal to the metal it kicked down but would shift up real quick again. Manually shifting the gears helped but there definatley seemed to be something not right. There where some other issues, mainly electrical but I did not bother to buy it because of the interior colour and all the issues that have to be fixed. Anyway I thought I asked how easy/hard and expensive it would be to get the car to handle like a 124 should, in case I come across this in another Benz. Ta for all replies. The original rear links tend to fail before the shocks. There are revised more robust links that should be installed even if the originals have not yet failed. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] Zerex G05/where?
In a message dated 8/12/2006 4:06:09 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Okay, another classic: Where can I find Zerex G05 or is it Zerex GO5? I know that it's acceptable in my Mercedes, and I believe that my Saab needs the red stuff. So I thought the fluid in question would suit both. Nobody seems to carry it - any tips? Brian, My local NAPA store always seems to have it. Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 262 K miles 98 ML 320, 144 K miles
Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in
Harry - When I try the link I get the following: Virtual Host or Web Application Not Found The host www.mbusa.com on port 9081 has not been defined IBM WebSphere Application Server Is it a problem with the server, or did the final letters get messed up [I am not familiar with a '.do' BillR Jacksonville 1981 300SD 278k -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 9:54 PM To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Yep, here's the url for the classic center. Just fill in the info and they email you back. http://www.mbusa.com/heritage/contact-classic-center.do Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 11:22:23 -0500 Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Do they have an email address? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ya know Kaleb, you might be able to send the numbers off that plate to Mercedes Classic center to see if they know what it came from. Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Banned List [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Mailing List mercedes@okiebenz.com; Dan Holden [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 19:50:36 -0500 Subject: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in http://www.okiebenz.com/pics/603engine/ Supposed to be a 3.5l, they said it was military engine. Looks like it was from a G-wagon. It has a #22 head!!! I bought it for the head but wonder if the engine is good. Do these have the rod bending problems as well. This euro or whatever version, what sort of hp will it have? I have a nice SDL that would love to have a screaming fast 603 in it. Hmm -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in
Try: http://www.mbusa.com/heritage/index.do Then use the Contact link at the bottom of the page - HTH's Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: BillR [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 8:14 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Harry - When I try the link I get the following: Virtual Host or Web Application Not Found The host www.mbusa.com on port 9081 has not been defined IBM WebSphere Application Server Is it a problem with the server, or did the final letters get messed up [I am not familiar with a '.do' BillR Jacksonville 1981 300SD 278k -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 9:54 PM To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Yep, here's the url for the classic center. Just fill in the info and they email you back. http://www.mbusa.com/heritage/contact-classic-center.do Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 11:22:23 -0500 Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Do they have an email address? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ya know Kaleb, you might be able to send the numbers off that plate to Mercedes Classic center to see if they know what it came from. Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Banned List [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Mailing List mercedes@okiebenz.com; Dan Holden [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 19:50:36 -0500 Subject: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in http://www.okiebenz.com/pics/603engine/ Supposed to be a 3.5l, they said it was military engine. Looks like it was from a G-wagon. It has a #22 head!!! I bought it for the head but wonder if the engine is good. Do these have the rod bending problems as well. This euro or whatever version, what sort of hp will it have? I have a nice SDL that would love to have a screaming fast 603 in it. Hmm -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.9/417 - Release Date: 8/11/2006
Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine
Thanks for all the encouragement guys. Sounds like my friend may need to buy another car. Looks like he is going to have some parts for sale. Mitch, I have been wondering if you bought that Cosworth off a guy from Haslett? Ralph W. - Original Message - From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 9:22 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine Curt Raymond wrote: I wonder if thats just a 190 trait, my 190D is hard to keep down to under 70mph. My problem is I enjoy going 0-60 in 7.x seconds whilst listening to that twincam Cosworth/Mercedes howl. If I put the crazy Finn mods on the 2.5 turbo engine it'll probably just get worse. There are five stop signs on little traveled roads between my house and my office. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
What the hoosis now? My 190D has terrible wind noise and no plastics in the front doors at all. I've been waiting to get into the new house to replace 'em. Are you suggesting that no plastics will be louder than w/plastics or just that loose plastics will be loud? -Curt Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:49:33 -0500 From: Peter Frederick [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Replace the plastic if torn, and definitely glue it back down, else you get terrible wind noise. - Do you Yahoo!? Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail Beta. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Aug 14 14:01:35 2006 Received: from 70-184-18-215.atlasok.com ([70.184.18.215] helo=[192.168.0.101]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1GCd0Z-00061H-AL for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:01:35 + Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:01:41 -0500 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804 Netscape/7.2 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.7.cp2 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:01:35 - Where is he located? Ralph W wrote: Thanks for all the encouragement guys. Sounds like my friend may need to buy another car. Looks like he is going to have some parts for sale. Mitch, I have been wondering if you bought that Cosworth off a guy from Haslett? Ralph W. -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Be sure to use Mobil-1 ATF when changing the trans fluid. That is not where you want to try to save money. Drain the torque converter and replace the ATF filter and resist the temptation to wipe off the drips from the guts of the transmission when you pull the pan. The chance of leaving even the smallest spec of lint behind is too great and will screw things up later. Just let it drip for an hour while you clean the inside of the pan. Don't tell my wife, but I put it through the dishwasher after I wipe it clean, then I don't touch it until it goes back on. I also drain the trans cooler by removing the hoses and blowing it clear, but that's probably overkill and you run the risk of getting crud inside the hose connections. HTH and Congrats on your new purchase! -Dave Walton 94S350, 99E300 On 8/13/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone/Everyone I got this '87 300E almost by default. I bid a very low amount and NO ONE bid against me. Imagine that. Now that I have my very first Mercedes, it would be nice if someone could help me figure out WTF on several items. 1. It starts rough, but once it is started runs smooth. And if I don't give it some extra gas it will die. I have used some BK fuel injection/system cleaner but that didn't help it start smooth. 2. After it is started, I shift it into Reverse, takes about 3-4 seconds then it hits Hard, when I shift it into Drive from Reverse, it takes about 2 seconds and then it hits not so hard. [Also, Seems like it starts out in 2nd gear. If I step down all the way on the gas it downshifts - the tires chirp and we Really take off fast! Which is good by the way but seems strange it will downshift from a standing start.] 3. This one scares me a little. Starting from a stop I accelerate smartly, when it shifts from 1st to 2nd and I hear a sound like a old cold weather V belt slipping for an instant. Same screech when it shifts from 2nd to 3rd. Not all the time but once in awhile. I know the belts aren't slipping on this engine. 4. There is a small sound under the passenger dash when I start it first thing in the morning [some other times as well] like a small fan bushing is going. It stops after a little while. What's under the dash on that side that could make that sound? Finally- 5. How the heck do I get the door panels off??? Any and all help is Greatly Appreciated! My lady and I like this car, I'd like it to perform well. Sam ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Marshall Your response is timely. I'll try the Mobile suggestion for a couple thousand miles and watch closely. Now that I know it's supposed to start in 2nd I feel much better. Thanks for your response and comments. Sam From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Aug 14 14:14:03 2006 Received: from sccrmhc15.comcast.net ([63.240.77.85]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1GCdCd-0007FV-Ok for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:14:03 + Received: from smailcenter49.comcast.net ([204.127.205.149]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc15) with SMTP id 2006081414135601500dtrn4e; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:13:56 + Received: from [140.226.195.132] by smailcenter49.comcast.net; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:13:55 + From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:13:55 + Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailer: ATT Message Center Version 1 (Apr 11 2006) X-Authenticated-Sender: cmFuZG9tX2FjY2Vzc0Bjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.7.cp2 Subject: Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.7.cp2 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:14:04 - Curt Thanks for the heads up on the door panel plastics. Sam From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Aug 14 14:21:22 2006 Received: from [63.240.77.82] (helo=sccrmhc12.comcast.net) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1GCdJi-0007zg-1S for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:21:22 + Received: from smailcenter74.comcast.net ([204.127.205.174]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc12) with SMTP id 2006081414202901200mpg2ge; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:20:39 + Received: from [140.226.195.132] by smailcenter74.comcast.net; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:20:46 + From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:20:46 + Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailer: ATT Message Center Version 1 (Apr 11 2006) X-Authenticated-Sender: cmFuZG9tX2FjY2Vzc0Bjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.7.cp2 Subject: Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.7.cp2 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:21:22 - Peter Your comments are insightful and extremely helpful. I appreciate your help. I will investigate each point you make. We do like this car and would like it to perform well. If a vehicle is a honest vehicle and it tries hard to perform, then I want to help it [also for my own peace of mind] and this Mercedes is a good car. If it's ok with you, I'll keep your email address on file case something else happens? Thanks for helping Sam From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Aug 14 14:22:51 2006 Received: from sccrmhc13.comcast.net ([204.127.200.83]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1GCdL9-00083J-65 for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:22:51 + Received: from smailcenter74.comcast.net ([204.127.205.174]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc13) with SMTP id 2006081414224301300quqcge; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:22:43 + Received: from [140.226.195.132] by smailcenter74.comcast.net; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:22:59 + From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:22:59 + Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailer: ATT Message Center Version 1 (Apr 11 2006) X-Authenticated-Sender: cmFuZG9tX2FjY2Vzc0Bjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel
Re: [MBZ] Wobbly 124
Marshall, I've had some unusual wear on my rear tires in the '90 300D and the car has a bit of squirrelyness to it. The outside of the rear tires wore very quickly. Could worn out links cause this? Could you be a little more specific on which links you mean. There are an awful lot of links and struts, etc in that suspension. As always thanks for your insightful information. Ralph W. '90 300D '01 E320 Wagon '83 300CD '82 300TD The original rear links tend to fail before the shocks. There are revised more robust links that should be installed even if the originals have not yet failed. Marshall
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
One word of caution when changing the ATF - the bolts holding the oil pan can be overtorqued stripped - which can cause all kinds of problems check the torque value first - my manual says the torque is 8 while I assume it's NM it may be something else and I haven;t found where it's shown. Hate to assume - perhaps someone knows the torque value? Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 10:12 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs Marshall Your response is timely. I'll try the Mobile suggestion for a couple thousand miles and watch closely. Now that I know it's supposed to start in 2nd I feel much better. Thanks for your response and comments. Sam ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.10/418 - Release Date: 8/14/2006
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
So how much did you buy this thing for? What was the auction number? Dave
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Don't forget if you're at a stop sign, and shift to 2nd, then back to drive, the transmission should then start in first, if I remember correctly. On 14-Aug-06, at 7:12 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Marshall Your response is timely. I'll try the Mobile suggestion for a couple thousand miles and watch closely. Now that I know it's supposed to start in 2nd I feel much better. Thanks for your response and comments. Sam John 1983 300TDt 368k Kilometers (mobil 1 Delvac) 1990's 300TDt 172k Kilometers (mobil 1 Delvac) 1993 500SEL 180k Kilometers (mobil 1 Delvac)
Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in
it worked for me when i clicked on it... the url was complete, but I don't know what the do is for Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: LarryT [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:27:52 -0400 Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Try: http://www.mbusa.com/heritage/index.do Then use the Contact link at the bottom of the page - HTH's Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: BillR [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 8:14 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Harry - When I try the link I get the following: Virtual Host or Web Application Not Found The host www.mbusa.com on port 9081 has not been defined IBM WebSphere Application Server Is it a problem with the server, or did the final letters get messed up [I am not familiar with a '.do' BillR Jacksonville 1981 300SD 278k -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 9:54 PM To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Yep, here's the url for the classic center. Just fill in the info and they email you back. http://www.mbusa.com/heritage/contact-classic-center.do Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 11:22:23 -0500 Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Do they have an email address? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ya know Kaleb, you might be able to send the numbers off that plate to Mercedes Classic center to see if they know what it came from. Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Banned List [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Mailing List mercedes@okiebenz.com; Dan Holden [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 19:50:36 -0500 Subject: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in http://www.okiebenz.com/pics/603engine/ Supposed to be a 3.5l, they said it was military engine. Looks like it was from a G-wagon. It has a #22 head!!! I bought it for the head but wonder if the engine is good. Do these have the rod bending problems as well. This euro or whatever version, what sort of hp will it have? I have a nice SDL that would love to have a screaming fast 603 in it. Hmm -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.9/417 - Release Date: 8/11/2006 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Wobbly 124
Ralph W wrote: Marshall, I've had some unusual wear on my rear tires in the '90 300D and the car has a bit of squirrelyness to it. The outside of the rear tires wore very quickly. Could worn out links cause this? Could you be a little more specific on which links you mean. There are an awful lot of links and struts, etc in that suspension. As always thanks for your insightful information. The steering squirrelyness and asymmetrically tire wear is usually a sign that the link bushings have aged and have collapsed. There are 4 links and a control arm (5th link). If the links are original all four should be replaced with revised ones on older 124s (the revised links were introduced in early model year 1991, but not before several months of production had occurred). If your car has revised links, then any whose bushings have decayed should be replaced. Try twisting them - if they move much, the bushings have decayed and the links need to be replaced. I don't do suspension or steering work! You really need to talk with someone that has worked on dozens of 124/201/202 rear suspensions to deal with the fine points. The suspension is tricky and requires every piece to be correctly installed and adjusted (but it's a dream to drive when everything is working as it should). In some cases it's necessary to obtain modified mounting kits or different parts as some of the old and new parts are NOT interchangeable. I don't think it's all covered in the manual either. Most of what you need to know is covered in the manual 35-110 thru 130, but they make it seem MUCH easier than it really is!! This is a time when I just take it to Rick at http://rc-imports.com/ and tell him the rear is steering the car and he replaces all the parts that require replacement and he doesn't replace the parts that don't need to be replaced. The cost has been modest and fair and when he's done, and each of the 4 cars he did links on, steered like they were on rails (and the tires wore evenly). If either of the rear springs have broken (rare but it happens) or the spring pads or subframe mount(s) has/have collapsed, then it will be more involved and expensive. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
LarryT wrote: One word of caution when changing the ATF - the bolts holding the oil pan can be overtorqued stripped - which can cause all kinds of problems check the torque value first - my manual says the torque is 8 while I assume it's NM it may be something else and I haven;t found where it's shown. Hate to assume - perhaps someone knows the torque value? Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 10:12 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs Marshall Your response is timely. I'll try the Mobile suggestion for a couple thousand miles and watch closely. Now that I know it's supposed to start in 2nd I feel much better. Thanks for your response and comments. Sam ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.10/418 - Release Date: 8/14/2006 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Proper torque for the oil pan of a 722.1, 722.3 or 722.4 transmission is 7 Nm or 5.2 lb-ft. That's not very much more than finger tight. If ATF leaks out when tightened to 7 Nm, the pan is bent and needs to be straightened or replaced. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: SNIP I'll blow out the oil cooler tubes. Overkill is just another word for being thourough. And can be very dangerous! It's VERY rare that Mercedes hasn't been sufficiently compulsive. Just follow their procedure and you will have VERY few problems. If Mercedes considered blowing out the oil cooler tubes to be desirable or beneficial, they would have provided for it (they did provide for draining the torque converter). Same with the engine oil coolers. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Sam, Along with checking the serp belt take a look at the lower pivot point of the belt tensioner. With the engine running look to see if it's cocked out of alignment. As it wears one side (the passenger side) will tend to be pulled toward the radiator. This is not only noisey but will eventually break also. When I changed mine I replaced all the components to be safe and to prevent needing to go in again. The rad shroud is removed as is the fan - both are easy to remove but small hands would make it easier. Access is a little tight. My experience in on a diesel so the gas may be a little different. There's a book avalable thru Rusty called The E Class Owners Bible which I find very helpful. It covers the gas diesel models. HTH's Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 10:57 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs Chuck Excelent advice to change all the fluids. I did a oil change but the place didn't want to mess with the trans or fuel. Now, I'll Make it happen. Never thought about the brake fluid change, I'll bet on it's being black as well. I'll have the brakes bled with new fluid. The serpentine belt is perfect. That is almost one of the first things I checked on the engine. Thanks for your comments. Sam ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.10/418 - Release Date: 8/14/2006
Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in
Today it worked - the stars must not have be aligned correctly ... Thanks - BillR -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 1:59 PM To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in it worked for me when i clicked on it... the url was complete, but I don't know what the do is for Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: LarryT [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:27:52 -0400 Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Try: http://www.mbusa.com/heritage/index.do Then use the Contact link at the bottom of the page - HTH's Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: BillR [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 8:14 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Harry - When I try the link I get the following: Virtual Host or Web Application Not Found The host www.mbusa.com on port 9081 has not been defined IBM WebSphere Application Server Is it a problem with the server, or did the final letters get messed up [I am not familiar with a '.do' BillR Jacksonville 1981 300SD 278k -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 9:54 PM To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Yep, here's the url for the classic center. Just fill in the info and they email you back. http://www.mbusa.com/heritage/contact-classic-center.do Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 11:22:23 -0500 Subject: Re: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in Do they have an email address? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ya know Kaleb, you might be able to send the numbers off that plate to Mercedes Classic center to see if they know what it came from. Harry 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Banned List [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Mailing List mercedes@okiebenz.com; Dan Holden [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 19:50:36 -0500 Subject: [MBZ] check out this strange 603 engine I just got in http://www.okiebenz.com/pics/603engine/ Supposed to be a 3.5l, they said it was military engine. Looks like it was from a G-wagon. It has a #22 head!!! I bought it for the head but wonder if the engine is good. Do these have the rod bending problems as well. This euro or whatever version, what sort of hp will it have? I have a nice SDL that would love to have a screaming fast 603 in it. Hmm -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.9/417 - Release Date: 8/11/2006 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] need 2.5 Turbo engine
Ralph W wrote: Thanks for all the encouragement guys. Sounds like my friend may need to buy another car. Looks like he is going to have some parts for sale. Mitch, I have been wondering if you bought that Cosworth off a guy from Haslett? The 2.3-16v came from an eBay auction in Illinois last October. Rustfree, great engine, nice interior, but lots of issues elsewhere, paid $2200 or so. Mitch.
[MBZ] Trans clatter,85 300TD
When shifting into 3rd (I think), There is a clatter that reminds me of running over rumble strips. Once it shifts, all is fine until until slowing down back through that gear. I've tried WOT but it really gets harsh and I back off. The PO reported a recent fluid and filter change when I bought it and it has been great until this surfaced. Any ideas on where to start? Thanks. Harry Watkins Newton, MS 86 SDL Silver 85 300D Euro 86 SDL Gold 81 240D manual trans
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
Sure -- I'm in progress on most of those items on my two W124 chassis cars (300D and 300TE). I love them both, best cars I've ever had with the possible exception on my 72 280 SE -- it's a gas hot! Peter
Re: [MBZ] Wobbly 124
At the risk of stepping on Marshal's toes, yes. Bad links show up in three ways -- excessive outer side tire wear (camber control link and spring link bushing wear), groans on turns from the rear, or squeaks (thrust links) and excessive suspension noise directly under the rear seat (torque links). Bad torque links also produce torque steer -- pull to one side under acceleration, the other under trailing throttle due to the wheels steering. All will contribute to an unstable feel to the rear end, almost as if it'd gonna swap ends as you start a turn, but then stabilizes. Again, the rear wheels are steering when they shouldn't. Other than the tight working area and some hassle getting the new bolt and sleeve into the hole in the wheel carrier, changing the links isn't bad. Just remember to jack the wheel up to normal ride height with the bolts LOOSE -- the steel sleeve inside the bushing just be free. Otherwise you have too much spring from the rubber, they will wear out too fast, and it will handle strangely until you free the bushings up and center the travel -- the rubber acts as part of the spring force. You should also examine the mounts for the rear subframe. There are four, two underneath and two on top of the subframe. When they are bad, the whole subframe will steer on cornering. Sagging springs will also cause excessive outer tire wear, too, though, so check ride height after installing any needed links. Peter
Re: [MBZ] Wobbly 124
The new links have a smaller hole and a new bolt with a twelve point socket head. You will need the driver (you can get them cheap). Replacing the torque, thrust, and camber links is fairly easy (inner end of the torque link is a pain to reach). Any signs of off center bolts or threads of rubber is also an indication they are dead. I used to see a kit that had the full set of links, including the tie rods and bolts, for sale at a reasonable price. Not a bad idea, as they all generally will be in similar condition. You MUST get a proper four-wheel alignment if you touch the tie rods. Peter
Re: [MBZ] brand new 300E owner and have several probs
The tensioner replacement is a pain on the gasser, but not too bad. Not nearly as easy as on the diesel. If you change the belt, you MUST loosen the large center bolt BEFORE attempting relieve tension with the tensioner bolt, else you break the link between bolt and tensioner. You must also watch the little red plastic pointer -- if it does not return to the start mark or at least the narrow end of the ramp cast on the tensioner, you must replace it (the rubber inside is shot, it does not use a spring). Best course is to have a new one to hand when you start since it's fairly unlikely the one in there is still good. Expensive, I think I paid $120 or so for mine, but necessary. Attempting to tension a bad one will break that link! Peter
