Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
This has all been very enlightening. I checked my tires and noticed that the pressure in the LR was quite low. I topped it off along with the others so let's see if that makes a difference. If not, then phase two will be checking the odometer for accuracy. (low hanging fruit) On 11/18/05, Marshall Booth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Marshall Booth wrote: Timing chain life is seldom LESS than 200kmi (should about be double that if you use Mobil synthetics) unless you don't change the oil when it's dirty! That the speedometer was worked on a few years ago does NOT insure it's accuracy now. You need to measure it. A road with mileage markers is good, but it's also helpful to know just how far it is to work and back (or some other usual route). Valve adjustment makes only a small difference in fuel economy until they get WAY out. The most common causes of poor fuel economy I've seen reported are poor fuel quality, leaky fuel (or return) lines, low tire pressure, slipping odometer drive, low engine operating temperature (below 85 deg. C.). All of the other engine factors (valves, injectors, timing, poor compression, etc.) will contribute, but they tend to be minor contributors and they almost all present other symptoms (rough idle, noise, poor starting, etc.). Marshall I completely forgot the biggest potential change in fuel economy. When you change from driving a few hundred miles for every cold start to driving maybe a few or at most 10 miles for every cold start, fuel consumption can increase and mileage drop by 30 or more percent. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Marshall Booth wrote: Timing chain life is seldom LESS than 200kmi (should about be double that if you use Mobil synthetics) unless you don't change the oil when it's dirty! That the speedometer was worked on a few years ago does NOT insure it's accuracy now. You need to measure it. A road with mileage markers is good, but it's also helpful to know just how far it is to work and back (or some other usual route). Valve adjustment makes only a small difference in fuel economy until they get WAY out. The most common causes of poor fuel economy I've seen reported are poor fuel quality, leaky fuel (or return) lines, low tire pressure, slipping odometer drive, low engine operating temperature (below 85 deg. C.). All of the other engine factors (valves, injectors, timing, poor compression, etc.) will contribute, but they tend to be minor contributors and they almost all present other symptoms (rough idle, noise, poor starting, etc.). Marshall I completely forgot the biggest potential change in fuel economy. When you change from driving a few hundred miles for every cold start to driving maybe a few or at most 10 miles for every cold start, fuel consumption can increase and mileage drop by 30 or more percent. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Yes - that's EXACTLY trhe way I am doing it. On 11/17/05, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: andrew strasfogel wrote: When I say the fuel economy s*cks, this means that whereas I used to drive up to 380 miles before the reserve light came on, now it's exactly 100 miles LOWER when I hit reserve (under 300 miles). This translates to 18 or 19 mpg. I am beginning to feel ashamed that my DIESEL could fare so POORLY in fuel consumption. Have you actually calculated the fuel economy? If you're going by the reserve light, it may just be that the light isn't working right. Mine sometimes comes on with the tank FULL. ;) The most accurate way to calculate fuel economy is as follows: - Fill the tank until the pump shuts off. - Drive. - Refill the tank, preferably from the same pump, since the shutoff point varies from pump to pump. - Divide the distance driven by the gallons needed to refill the tank. - Ideally, repeat this two or three times to get an average. I assume my problem is that the engine is running rich. How would this be addressed? If it's running rich enough to cause that kind of drop in fuel economy, it should be laying down quite a smoke screen... Have you checked to make sure none of your brakes are dragging? I've seen a single draggy brake drop fuel economy by a good 20% on some cars. Put your hand down by the wheel vents after a freeway run and see if one brake disc is throwing off a lot more heat than the others. ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
I like that one best of all! Wouldn't it be great to blame it on the odometer. On 11/17/05, Christopher McCann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: don't forget to test the odo with a GPS or against mile markers on the highway Chris Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David Brodbeck wrote: The most accurate way to calculate fuel economy is as follows: - Fill the tank until the pump shuts off. - Drive. - Refill the tank, preferably from the same pump, since the shutoff point varies from pump to pump. I'd run it off a small tank under the hood, even a quart mayonaise jar will do. Plug the lines from the tank, and hook both the supply and return lines to the jar. You can conduct an accurate mpg test in a few miles this way. If your mileage still stinks, you know the problem is under the hood and not with a rusty line under the car. ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net Christopher McCann, Squier Park, Kansas City, Missouri -2005 Blue Point Siamese, Rose -1987 300TD, 150K, Rotkäppchen -1985 300SD, 209K, Wulf -1976 240D, ?K, AKP-Wagen (Alternativen Kraftstoffs Prüfenlastwagen) -1972 Jacobsen 21 Turbo Vent -1971 Case 222 Hydrive, 12HP Kohler, 38 deck, Snowcaster, One Banger - Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
1) timing chain and rails were replaced at 122K. Now I'm at 267K 2) Odometer was repaired once about 100K miles ago. 3) Valves were adjusted within the past 10K miles. On 11/17/05, Peter Frederick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: First, unless you've fixed it already, it's somewhat likely the odometer is slipping and not recording the milage correctly. Second, you very likely have a worn timing chain unless it's been replaced. Fix the odometer, replace the timing chain, do a valve adjust (or valve job if the valves aren't tight in the guides, you're about due for one of those, too), and you will be back up in the correct milage range. Peter ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
No. On 11/17/05, Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is it possible something is wrong with your fuel guage and you really still have plenty of fuel left in it? andrew strasfogel wrote: My 300TD has been getting progressively, steadily worsening fuel economy over the last few years. It runs fine, there are no fuel leaks to speak of, and I haven't changed my driving habits. I had been driving it in 2 at Marshall's recommendation, but thought this might be causing the decline in fuel economy so switched back to D around town. Makes zero difference. When I say the fuel economy s*cks, this means that whereas I used to drive up to 380 miles before the reserve light came on, now it's exactly 100 miles LOWER when I hit reserve (under 300 miles). This translates to 18 or 19 mpg. I am beginning to feel ashamed that my DIESEL could fare so POORLY in fuel consumption. Best I ever got was 27 on the highway but until a couple years ago I faithfully averaged 22-24 during the non-winter seasons, mixed driving. I assume my problem is that the engine is running rich. How would this be addressed? Thanks in advance, 1983 300 TD 267 K miles ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 250 LWB, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 450SEL, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
andrew strasfogel wrote: 1) timing chain and rails were replaced at 122K. Now I'm at 267K 2) Odometer was repaired once about 100K miles ago. 3) Valves were adjusted within the past 10K miles. Timing chain life is seldom LESS than 200kmi (should about be double that if you use Mobil synthetics) unless you don't change the oil when it's dirty! That the speedometer was worked on a few years ago does NOT insure it's accuracy now. You need to measure it. A road with mileage markers is good, but it's also helpful to know just how far it is to work and back (or some other usual route). Valve adjustment makes only a small difference in fuel economy until they get WAY out. The most common causes of poor fuel economy I've seen reported are poor fuel quality, leaky fuel (or return) lines, low tire pressure, slipping odometer drive, low engine operating temperature (below 85 deg. C.). All of the other engine factors (valves, injectors, timing, poor compression, etc.) will contribute, but they tend to be minor contributors and they almost all present other symptoms (rough idle, noise, poor starting, etc.). Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Christopher McCann wrote: crappy post Katria fuel and funky odo have been my pet theories as to why my mpgs have gone down recently too (on the SD). Not cold A few days after the hurricane the EPA came out with relaxed regulations for diesel and gasoline as a temporary measure so everyone could get fuel ASAP. Gasoline volatility requirements were relaxed and diesel sulfer requirements were relaxed. Dunno how long the temporary regulations were supposed to last (IIRC a month or so) or if that can even change you're mileage I've been getting horrible fuel mileage (17), but I think that there is a slight possibility of it being the fuel leaking from the IP and an injector ;) G'luck with it! John '79 300SD
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
I assume, you're actually calculating your mileage based on filling up the tank and doing the math of miles driven to gallons of gas used and averaging your mileage over several tanks or more in a row? If you're simply going by the low fuel light, my first thought would be if your low fuel light is coming on at the same amount of gallons ever time. Not to say that you don't have a real problem, but just checking to make sure you know what sort of mileage you're really getting. If it makes you feel any better I noticed the same thing with my 97' Subaru Impreza. Someone told me it was because they were using crappier gas at the stations. I'm trying some acetone and it's helping (though I'm also driving a little easier, so I haven't yet done enough testing to say for sure which is helping more). You may want to try it on your Benz. Though it is quite possible the issue is elsewhere... Levi (: On 11/17/05, andrew strasfogel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My 300TD has been getting progressively, steadily worsening fuel economy over the last few years. It runs fine, there are no fuel leaks to speak of, and I haven't changed my driving habits. I had been driving it in 2 at Marshall's recommendation, but thought this might be causing the decline in fuel economy so switched back to D around town. Makes zero difference. When I say the fuel economy s*cks, this means that whereas I used to drive up to 380 miles before the reserve light came on, now it's exactly 100 miles LOWER when I hit reserve (under 300 miles). This translates to 18 or 19 mpg. I am beginning to feel ashamed that my DIESEL could fare so POORLY in fuel consumption. Best I ever got was 27 on the highway but until a couple years ago I faithfully averaged 22-24 during the non-winter seasons, mixed driving. I assume my problem is that the engine is running rich. How would this be addressed? Thanks in advance, 1983 300 TD 267 K miles ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- It isn't what you have, or who you are, or where you are, or what you are doing that makes you happy or unhappy. It is what you think about. -Dale Carnegie
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
andrew strasfogel wrote: When I say the fuel economy s*cks, this means that whereas I used to drive up to 380 miles before the reserve light came on, now it's exactly 100 miles LOWER when I hit reserve (under 300 miles). This translates to 18 or 19 mpg. I am beginning to feel ashamed that my DIESEL could fare so POORLY in fuel consumption. Have you actually calculated the fuel economy? If you're going by the reserve light, it may just be that the light isn't working right. Mine sometimes comes on with the tank FULL. ;) The most accurate way to calculate fuel economy is as follows: - Fill the tank until the pump shuts off. - Drive. - Refill the tank, preferably from the same pump, since the shutoff point varies from pump to pump. - Divide the distance driven by the gallons needed to refill the tank. - Ideally, repeat this two or three times to get an average. I assume my problem is that the engine is running rich. How would this be addressed? If it's running rich enough to cause that kind of drop in fuel economy, it should be laying down quite a smoke screen... Have you checked to make sure none of your brakes are dragging? I've seen a single draggy brake drop fuel economy by a good 20% on some cars. Put your hand down by the wheel vents after a freeway run and see if one brake disc is throwing off a lot more heat than the others.
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Someone told me it was because they were using crappier gas at the stations. I have been secretely suspecting this myself since Katrina... Chris Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I assume, you're actually calculating your mileage based on filling up the tank and doing the math of miles driven to gallons of gas used and averaging your mileage over several tanks or more in a row? If you're simply going by the low fuel light, my first thought would be if your low fuel light is coming on at the same amount of gallons ever time. Not to say that you don't have a real problem, but just checking to make sure you know what sort of mileage you're really getting. If it makes you feel any better I noticed the same thing with my 97' Subaru Impreza. Someone told me it was because they were using crappier gas at the stations. I'm trying some acetone and it's helping (though I'm also driving a little easier, so I haven't yet done enough testing to say for sure which is helping more). You may want to try it on your Benz. Though it is quite possible the issue is elsewhere... Levi (: On 11/17/05, andrew strasfogel wrote: My 300TD has been getting progressively, steadily worsening fuel economy over the last few years. It runs fine, there are no fuel leaks to speak of, and I haven't changed my driving habits. I had been driving it in 2 at Marshall's recommendation, but thought this might be causing the decline in fuel economy so switched back to D around town. Makes zero difference. When I say the fuel economy s*cks, this means that whereas I used to drive up to 380 miles before the reserve light came on, now it's exactly 100 miles LOWER when I hit reserve (under 300 miles). This translates to 18 or 19 mpg. I am beginning to feel ashamed that my DIESEL could fare so POORLY in fuel consumption. Best I ever got was 27 on the highway but until a couple years ago I faithfully averaged 22-24 during the non-winter seasons, mixed driving. I assume my problem is that the engine is running rich. How would this be addressed? Thanks in advance, 1983 300 TD 267 K miles ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- It isn't what you have, or who you are, or where you are, or what you are doing that makes you happy or unhappy. It is what you think about. -Dale Carnegie ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net Christopher McCann, Squier Park, Kansas City, Missouri -2005 Blue Point Siamese, Rose -1987 300TD, 150K, Rotkäppchen -1985 300SD, 209K, Wulf -1976 240D, ?K, AKP-Wagen (Alternativen Kraftstoffs Prüfenlastwagen) -1972 Jacobsen 21 Turbo Vent -1971 Case 222 Hydrive, 12HP Kohler, 38 deck, Snowcaster, One Banger - Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Nov 17 20:51:50 2005 Received: from xproxy.gmail.com ([66.249.82.199]) by server1.arterytc1.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EcqjV-0007Pu-Ke for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 20:51:50 + Received: by xproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id t12so24269wxc for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:51:47 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=m7qj9y42CSd60U5dVOjostR//bHKRqPOKarqgziaZzCpUbwliaWncCZkLdWKxIaoQ22ykPR3umHb4nYHB/ODEC3HBIUiAlvMlbAS8FCubnQ6qG10O4Ena3/zPWymC9szs9VvzGoSOGTnRx7Othv5SY+kxjKrS3tTImFcYqwTh6c= Received: by 10.65.236.14 with SMTP id n14mr2948815qbr; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:51:47 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.65.249.1 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:51:47 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 15:51:47 -0500 From: Sunil Hari [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.6 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Booz'n Benz X-BeenThere: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.6 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Id: Mercedes mailing list mercedes_striplin.net.striplin.net List-Unsubscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive:
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
David Brodbeck wrote: The most accurate way to calculate fuel economy is as follows: - Fill the tank until the pump shuts off. - Drive. - Refill the tank, preferably from the same pump, since the shutoff point varies from pump to pump. I'd run it off a small tank under the hood, even a quart mayonaise jar will do. Plug the lines from the tank, and hook both the supply and return lines to the jar. You can conduct an accurate mpg test in a few miles this way. If your mileage still stinks, you know the problem is under the hood and not with a rusty line under the car.
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
andrew strasfogel wrote: My 300TD has been getting progressively, steadily worsening fuel economy over the last few years. It runs fine, there are no fuel leaks to speak of, and I haven't changed my driving habits. I had been driving it in 2 at Marshall's recommendation, but thought this might be causing the decline in fuel economy so switched back to D around town. Makes zero difference. When I say the fuel economy s*cks, this means that whereas I used to drive up to 380 miles before the reserve light came on, now it's exactly 100 miles LOWER when I hit reserve (under 300 miles). This translates to 18 or 19 mpg. I am beginning to feel ashamed that my DIESEL could fare so POORLY in fuel consumption. Best I ever got was 27 on the highway but until a couple years ago I faithfully averaged 22-24 during the non-winter seasons, mixed driving. I assume my problem is that the engine is running rich. How would this be addressed? Thanks in advance, Your engine is NOT running rich. With diesels there really is NO such thing (except at wide open throttle under full load - and then there IS smoke). More fuel simply translates into the engine running faster - UNTIL you use up all the air and then the engine smokes. If you are using more fuel to go the same distance (and NOT smoking all the way) you are either NOT measuring something correctly, OR doing more work, OR the energy isn't being effectively transformed into motion OR the fuel is leaking/being dumped somewhere - somehow. There really aren't any more options. How does chain stretch measure? More than 6 degrees and economy will drop a little. When the thermostats in my cars stick open, fuel economy drops - sometime by 20%. Engine needs to come from a cold start up to 85+ degrees C. (185 F) within several minutes of driving or the thermostat is likely stuck open (at least a little) and fuel economy WILL suffer (maybe a little or maybe a lot). Tire pressure below the top end of the Mercedes recommendations can reduce fuel economy by 10-15%. Improperly adjusted valves can reduce it a little. Fuel leaking somewhere is the most common cause. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Marshall Booth wrote: Tire pressure below the top end of the Mercedes recommendations can reduce fuel economy by 10-15%. Improperly adjusted valves can reduce it a little. I'm thinking that if he had a brake hose acting like a one-way valve it would have killed the pads a few times in the last couple of years, but I suppose it wouldn't hurt to jack up the wheels and give them a spin to find out.
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Herr Doktor Booth schooled us as follows: Your engine is NOT running rich. With diesels there really is NO such thing (except at wide open throttle under full load - and then there IS smoke). More fuel simply translates into the engine running faster - UNTIL you use up all the air and then the engine smokes. If you are using more fuel to go the same distance (and NOT smoking all the way) you are either NOT measuring something correctly, OR doing more work, OR the energy isn't being effectively transformed into motion OR the fuel is leaking/being dumped somewhere - somehow. There really aren't any more options. This was my nugget for the day... Bob Rentfro '77 300D 142K Litchfield Park, AZ
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
OK guys, it's time to start putting more fuel INTO Andrew's tank every few nights! HAHAHAHA, I don't care who you are, that right there is funny! --R andrew strasfogel wrote: My 300TD has been getting progressively, steadily worsening fuel economy over the last few years. It runs fine, there are no fuel leaks to speak of, and I haven't changed my driving habits. I had been driving it in 2 at Marshall's recommendation, but thought this might be causing the decline in fuel economy so switched back to D around town. Makes zero difference. When I say the fuel economy s*cks, this means that whereas I used to drive up to 380 miles before the reserve light came on, now it's exactly 100 miles LOWER when I hit reserve (under 300 miles). This translates to 18 or 19 mpg. I am beginning to feel ashamed that my DIESEL could fare so POORLY in fuel consumption. Best I ever got was 27 on the highway but until a couple years ago I faithfully averaged 22-24 during the non-winter seasons, mixed driving. I assume my problem is that the engine is running rich. How would this be addressed? Thanks in advance, 1983 300 TD 267 K miles ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
andrew strasfogel wrote: My 300TD has been getting progressively, steadily worsening fuel economy over the last few years. Different fuel supplies WILL result in differences as great as 20% in fuel economy. My 190D 2.5 turbo will deliver 33-36 mpg on BP/Amoco fuel, while MOST other brands I've tried in the last two years, deliver 28-32 mpg. When fuel supplies have gotten tight, even the energy content of BP/Amoco fuel has declined. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
crappy post Katria fuel and funky odo have been my pet theories as to why my mpgs have gone down recently too (on the SD). Not cold enough in the last couple months for THAT (coldness) to have effected it. Also, the TD (haven't had it long enough to really get a feel for it), does not seem to get great mpg's...makes me think of more crappy fuel... Chris David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Christopher McCann wrote: don't forget to test the odo with a GPS or against mile markers on the highway Good point. Mine is 5% high. ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net Christopher McCann, Squier Park, Kansas City, Missouri -2005 Blue Point Siamese, Rose -1987 300TD, 150K, Rotkäppchen -1985 300SD, 209K, Wulf -1976 240D, ?K, AKP-Wagen (Alternativen Kraftstoffs Prüfenlastwagen) -1972 Jacobsen 21 Turbo Vent -1971 Case 222 Hydrive, 12HP Kohler, 38 deck, Snowcaster, One Banger - Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Nov 17 23:00:23 2005 Received: from pop-gadwall.atl.sa.earthlink.net ([207.69.195.61]) by server1.arterytc1.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1Ecsjv-0004na-Jo for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 23:00:23 + Received: from elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net ([209.86.224.45]) by pop-gadwall.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #10) id 1Ecsju-00030h-00 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 18:00:22 -0500 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 18:00:21 -0500 (EST) From: Luther Gulseth [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: EarthLink Zoo Mail 1.0 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy X-BeenThere: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.6 Precedence: list Reply-To: Luther Gulseth [EMAIL PROTECTED], Mercedes mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Id: Mercedes mailing list mercedes_striplin.net.striplin.net List-Unsubscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: http://striplin.net/pipermail/mercedes_striplin.net List-Post: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 23:00:23 - This brings up a past experience for me. 1 tank full I got over 400 to the tank, the next one I was struggling to get 300, same with the next 2. I thought I had a fuel leak. Checked and checked and...nothing. Then the next tank the odo quit right at 200 miles into the tank, viola, we have the cause to our problem. Just a thought from my experience. -Original Message- From: Christopher McCann [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Nov 17, 2005 5:10 PM To: Mercedes mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy don't forget to test the odo with a GPS or against mile markers on the highway Chris Luther KB5QHU Alma, Ark '83 300SD (happily running diesel/WVO mix) '82 300CD slate grey, black interior, 152,xxx mi
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Another thought: VDO odometers have a tendency to develop cracks in the gears that make them stick or slip at certain points in the rotation. (I had one in a VW that would stick briefly every time three tenths came around, for example.) This isn't always very noticeable if you aren't watching closely, and it can cause low and wildly variable fuel economy numbers.
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
also makes it harder to collect ALL 5 high mileage awards - one of my life goals. Chris David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Another thought: VDO odometers have a tendency to develop cracks in the gears that make them stick or slip at certain points in the rotation. (I had one in a VW that would stick briefly every time three tenths came around, for example.) This isn't always very noticeable if you aren't watching closely, and it can cause low and wildly variable fuel economy numbers. ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net Christopher McCann, Squier Park, Kansas City, Missouri -2005 Blue Point Siamese, Rose -1987 300TD, 150K, Rotkäppchen -1985 300SD, 209K, Wulf -1976 240D, ?K, AKP-Wagen (Alternativen Kraftstoffs Prüfenlastwagen) -1972 Jacobsen 21 Turbo Vent -1971 Case 222 Hydrive, 12HP Kohler, 38 deck, Snowcaster, One Banger - Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Nov 17 23:10:04 2005 Received: from usermail.com ([216.150.205.170]) by server1.arterytc1.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.52) id 1EcstI-0005dt-36 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 23:10:04 + Received: from Fred (64-251-140-169-dialup-mo.fidnet.com [64.251.140.169]) by usermail.com (8.13.2/8.13.2) with ESMTP id jAHN9q3H018308 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 16:09:53 -0700 Received: from 192.168.3.10 (ident=leather) by Fred with smtp (masqmail 0.2.20) id 1Ecrrl-50F-00; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 16:04:25 -0600 Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 16:04:43 -0600 From: Fmiser [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 2.0.0 (GTK+ 2.6.4; i486-pc-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Usermail-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-Usermail-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] How far can you drive a diesel with faiIed charging sys? X-BeenThere: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.6 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Id: Mercedes mailing list mercedes_striplin.net.striplin.net List-Unsubscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: http://striplin.net/pipermail/mercedes_striplin.net List-Post: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 23:10:04 - rumor has it that Zeitgeist wrote: Even the old-fangled diesels with distributer-type injection pumps (VW / Cummins) would eventually fall victim to a lack of sufficient electrons, due to their electro-mechanical shutoff solenoids. On 11/17/05, Kevin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, Nov 17, 2005 at 01:50:20PM -0500, wilton strickland wrote: 'Til it's out of fuel. Unless it's one of the new-fangled models with electronics, of course. That's why the 14L Cummins engines have a thumbscrew to force the solenoid to the on position - even with no electron flow. Philip, who drove a BigCam3 500 miles with a dead alternator
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Thanks Bob (and Marshall),
Very well explained. I missed it the 1st time Dokter Booth instructed us
;-)
Now, how does the fuel injection timing affect fuel economy performance -
with the kind of background provided below.
Sorry if this has been explained in the past - my memory is terrible (due to
meds). We;re changing meds so hopefullly that sideaffect will disappear.
Or, I guess it could get worse and I'd forget I have a memory loss problem.
;-\
;-)
TIA --
Sincerely,
Larry T ('74 911, '67 MGB)
A Blood Test for your oil - www.youroil.net
For Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil
Weber Carb Stuff http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs
http://members.rennlist.com/my_911/Index.htm For my Paint Job Info
- Original Message -
From: Bob Rentfro [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Mercedes mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, November 17, 2005 4:45 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Herr Doktor Booth schooled us as follows:
Your engine is NOT running rich. With diesels there really is NO such
thing (except at wide open throttle under full load - and then there
IS smoke). More fuel simply translates into the engine running faster -
UNTIL you use up all the air and then the engine smokes. If you are
using more fuel to go the same distance (and NOT smoking all the way)
you are either NOT measuring something correctly, OR doing more work, OR
the energy isn't being effectively transformed into motion OR the fuel
is leaking/being dumped somewhere - somehow. There really aren't any
more options.
This was my nugget for the day...
Bob Rentfro
'77 300D 142K
Litchfield Park, AZ
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Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
First, unless you've fixed it already, it's somewhat likely the odometer is slipping and not recording the milage correctly. Second, you very likely have a worn timing chain unless it's been replaced. Fix the odometer, replace the timing chain, do a valve adjust (or valve job if the valves aren't tight in the guides, you're about due for one of those, too), and you will be back up in the correct milage range. Peter
Re: [MBZ] Absolutely pathetic fuel economy
Is it possible something is wrong with your fuel guage and you really still have plenty of fuel left in it? andrew strasfogel wrote: My 300TD has been getting progressively, steadily worsening fuel economy over the last few years. It runs fine, there are no fuel leaks to speak of, and I haven't changed my driving habits. I had been driving it in 2 at Marshall's recommendation, but thought this might be causing the decline in fuel economy so switched back to D around town. Makes zero difference. When I say the fuel economy s*cks, this means that whereas I used to drive up to 380 miles before the reserve light came on, now it's exactly 100 miles LOWER when I hit reserve (under 300 miles). This translates to 18 or 19 mpg. I am beginning to feel ashamed that my DIESEL could fare so POORLY in fuel consumption. Best I ever got was 27 on the highway but until a couple years ago I faithfully averaged 22-24 during the non-winter seasons, mixed driving. I assume my problem is that the engine is running rich. How would this be addressed? Thanks in advance, 1983 300 TD 267 K miles ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 250 LWB, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 450SEL, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts
