Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Larry Turner via Mercedes]

Thanks Jim,

    Very well explained.

LarryT


On 10/09/2017 11:48 AM, Jim Cathey wrote:
My experience is that you can't pay _anybody_ to care as much as you 
do, hence the DIY at my house.


Current _is_ amps!  Heat derives from current through resistance.  
It's a mathematical product, so as either goes up so does the heat. 
 (Amps times amps times resistance, actually.)  Solder is used to 
_seal_ and secure a low-resistance mechanical connection between the 
copper wires, very little current is actually preferentially going 
through the more resistive lead as compared to the copper, unless the 
mechanical joint is poor.  In no way should any properly soldered 
joint get hot enough on its own to melt the solder. If it did, it'd be 
melting the insulation in the area too, maybe even starting a fire.


-- Jim




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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

My experience is that you can't pay _anybody_ to care as much as you do,
hence the DIY at my house.

Current _is_ amps!  Heat derives from current through resistance.  It's a
mathematical product, so as either goes up so does the heat.  (Amps times
amps times resistance, actually.)  Solder is used to _seal_ and secure a
low-resistance mechanical connection between the copper wires, very little
current is actually preferentially going through the more resistive lead as
compared to the copper, unless the mechanical joint is poor.  In no way
should any properly soldered joint get hot enough on its own to melt the
solder.  If it did, it'd be melting the insulation in the area too, maybe
even starting a fire.

-- Jim
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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Larry Turner via Mercedes]

Thanks Max!

Luckily I didn't need to go that route.  the double tape method looks 
like it's working quite well.

Have a nice week
Larry

On 10/08/2017 9:47 PM, Max Dillon via Mercedes wrote:

Larry, the solder would not melt from the electricity, but might melt from the 
heat of the glow plugs.  I doubt the plugs get that hot at the connection end, 
but I think those connections are crimped.



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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Waytago!

Good work.  Your wife is a keeper!

Larry Turner via Mercedes 
October 7, 2017 at 6:01 PM
Hi All,

You may remember my recent problem with what ended up being a short in 
my GP Wiring Harness.  I don't recall where the story left off, but 
the Indy who said they could work on it but ended up not being able to 
fix it even though I was telling them what to do.  Anyway, my wife & I 
went to the Indy last Thurs. and after cranking for 20 seconds, then 
waiting for 30 sec my wife got the car to start on a 80F day on the 
2nd starter cranking.


My wife drove it home and we finally started on it this AM around 
9AM.  My wife was a big help as I can't stand for very long at a time, 
so I mostly "Supervised" (my preferred mode of operation) as she 
removed the linkages, the manifold bolts and all the bits and pieces.  
After lifting the Intake Manifold off, we were able to examine the GP 
Wire Harness.  We found the wire going to GP #2 had lost its 
insulation.  I don't know if it was abraded or perhaps the heat cycles 
made it brittle, but the insulation was gone from the point where the 
#2 GP wire left the main harness and went to the GP.  Rather than 
re-wiring the harness completely as I had planned, I decided to put 
some black electrician's tape on it then covered that with the 
Universal Magic Repair of Duct Tape to make sure the Electrician's 
Tape stayed in place.  Also, before putting the Electrician's Tape in 
place, I cleaned the bare copper wire with Brake Cleaner because the 
copper wire was coated with black diesel oil which prevented the tape 
from sticking.


Then, as we finished everything up,  I found the mandatory error which 
seems to appear in all my repairs - the Accelerator Linkage that 
attaches to the aft end of the linkage near the firewall was on the 
wrong side of the GP Harness!  I had it on the inside, between the 
harness and the cyl head, and it needs to be on the outside.  As it 
was I was prevented from snapping it in place.  (This is when I said 
DAMN!)  So we decided to stop at that point, I was beat and so was my 
wife, who had stretched the tendons of her legs when leaning over the 
engine to reach the fasteners.


But we tried it, and it started instantly like it always does, 
confirming we had put the Manifold and harness on correctly and that 
we had found and repaired the problem. Smiles all around.  Tomorrow I 
plan to either  pop that linkage off at the bottom, or even easier, 
unfasten #5 and perhaps #4 GP Wire and move the linkage rod into the 
correct position.


On the road again!

LarryT

91 300 2.5T


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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Larry, the solder would not melt from the electricity, but might melt from the 
heat of the glow plugs.  I doubt the plugs get that hot at the connection end, 
but I think those connections are crimped.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300
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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Larry Turner via Mercedes]

    Yep, spending almost $200 really left a sour taste for sure, 
especially for what little they did.  I only went to them because of my 
health and once we got it home and took it apart it appeared they did 
even less than they claimed.  At the time, there was no way to know for 
sure, but it's behind us now.  My wife was a huge help to me.  On 
Saturday, the Intake Manifold was off and back on very quickly.  I made 
a dumb mistake when we put the manifold back on and pinched the vertical 
accelerator rod ( the one against the firewall) and while I had hoped we 
could remove the GP wiring on #4 and #5 and pull the rod around to 
clear, but after removing #5 we found it impossible to reach #4, so off 
came the manifold.  We then re-routed the Accel. Rod and it actually 
went together pretty quickly.  I'm afraid I under-estimated how much 
help she would be.  Not only was she a lot of help it was great to spend 
so much time together doing something so productive.  Also her small 
hands could get into places impossible for me to reach.
    I do have a question that did not come into play as I thought it 
might.  I was thinking I might have to solder the GP Harness to repair 
it, either that or 5 new wires.  Then I wondered if the solder would 
melt when the key was turned on?  Not sure if it's current or amps (no 
bother to tell me as I'll forget by the time I need the info again) 
running through the wiring when the key is turned on but is it enough to 
melt solder?
    Thanks for all the help over the past few months as I have battled 
health and car problems!  I really appreciate it!   BTW, my new knee 
stem has stabilized inside my femur and hopefully it is holding ;-)  PT 
continues and I am putting more and more weight on it.  Hopefully I'll 
be walking on it soon.  Might be with a walker but at least I won't be 
in a wheelchair!


Later guys!
LarryT
91 300D



On 10/07/2017 11:49 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:

Attaboy/attagirl.

Leaves you wondering just what you were paying the Indy for, doesn't it?

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[G Mann via Mercedes]

ATTA Girl !!!  Well done.

[Taking artistic license with Wilton's signature post]

On Sun, Oct 8, 2017 at 9:23 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Well done, I find a repair with herself's help to be quite rewarding.
> Curt
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
>
>   On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 7:01 PM, Larry Turner via Mercedes<
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:   Hi All,
>
> You may remember my recent problem with what ended up being a short in
> my GP Wiring Harness.  I don't recall where the story left off, but the
> Indy who said they could work on it but ended up not being able to fix
> it even though I was telling them what to do.  Anyway, my wife & I went
> to the Indy last Thurs. and after cranking for 20 seconds, then waiting
> for 30 sec my wife got the car to start on a 80F day on the 2nd starter
> cranking.
>
> My wife drove it home and we finally started on it this AM around 9AM.
> My wife was a big help as I can't stand for very long at a time, so I
> mostly "Supervised" (my preferred mode of operation) as she removed the
> linkages, the manifold bolts and all the bits and pieces.  After lifting
> the Intake Manifold off, we were able to examine the GP Wire Harness.
> We found the wire going to GP #2 had lost its insulation.  I don't know
> if it was abraded or perhaps the heat cycles made it brittle, but the
> insulation was gone from the point where the #2 GP wire left the main
> harness and went to the GP.  Rather than re-wiring the harness
> completely as I had planned, I decided to put some black electrician's
> tape on it then covered that with the Universal Magic Repair of Duct
> Tape to make sure the Electrician's Tape stayed in place.  Also, before
> putting the Electrician's Tape in place, I cleaned the bare copper wire
> with Brake Cleaner because the copper wire was coated with black diesel
> oil which prevented the tape from sticking.
>
> Then, as we finished everything up,  I found the mandatory error which
> seems to appear in all my repairs - the Accelerator Linkage that
> attaches to the aft end of the linkage near the firewall was on the
> wrong side of the GP Harness!  I had it on the inside, between the
> harness and the cyl head, and it needs to be on the outside.  As it was
> I was prevented from snapping it in place.  (This is when I said DAMN!)
> So we decided to stop at that point, I was beat and so was my wife, who
> had stretched the tendons of her legs when leaning over the engine to
> reach the fasteners.
>
> But we tried it, and it started instantly like it always does,
> confirming we had put the Manifold and harness on correctly and that we
> had found and repaired the problem. Smiles all around.  Tomorrow I plan
> to either  pop that linkage off at the bottom, or even easier, unfasten
> #5 and perhaps #4 GP Wire and move the linkage rod into the correct
> position.
>
> On the road again!
>
> LarryT
>
> 91 300 2.5T
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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>
>
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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Well done, I find a repair with herself's help to be quite rewarding.
Curt

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 7:01 PM, Larry Turner via 
Mercedes wrote:   Hi All,

You may remember my recent problem with what ended up being a short in 
my GP Wiring Harness.  I don't recall where the story left off, but the 
Indy who said they could work on it but ended up not being able to fix 
it even though I was telling them what to do.  Anyway, my wife & I went 
to the Indy last Thurs. and after cranking for 20 seconds, then waiting 
for 30 sec my wife got the car to start on a 80F day on the 2nd starter 
cranking.

My wife drove it home and we finally started on it this AM around 9AM.  
My wife was a big help as I can't stand for very long at a time, so I 
mostly "Supervised" (my preferred mode of operation) as she removed the 
linkages, the manifold bolts and all the bits and pieces.  After lifting 
the Intake Manifold off, we were able to examine the GP Wire Harness.  
We found the wire going to GP #2 had lost its insulation.  I don't know 
if it was abraded or perhaps the heat cycles made it brittle, but the 
insulation was gone from the point where the #2 GP wire left the main 
harness and went to the GP.  Rather than re-wiring the harness 
completely as I had planned, I decided to put some black electrician's 
tape on it then covered that with the Universal Magic Repair of Duct 
Tape to make sure the Electrician's Tape stayed in place.  Also, before 
putting the Electrician's Tape in place, I cleaned the bare copper wire 
with Brake Cleaner because the copper wire was coated with black diesel 
oil which prevented the tape from sticking.

Then, as we finished everything up,  I found the mandatory error which 
seems to appear in all my repairs - the Accelerator Linkage that 
attaches to the aft end of the linkage near the firewall was on the 
wrong side of the GP Harness!  I had it on the inside, between the 
harness and the cyl head, and it needs to be on the outside.  As it was 
I was prevented from snapping it in place.  (This is when I said DAMN!)  
So we decided to stop at that point, I was beat and so was my wife, who 
had stretched the tendons of her legs when leaning over the engine to 
reach the fasteners.

But we tried it, and it started instantly like it always does, 
confirming we had put the Manifold and harness on correctly and that we 
had found and repaired the problem. Smiles all around.  Tomorrow I plan 
to either  pop that linkage off at the bottom, or even easier, unfasten 
#5 and perhaps #4 GP Wire and move the linkage rod into the correct 
position.

On the road again!

LarryT

91 300 2.5T

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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[OK Don via Mercedes]

Ah, we love a happy ending!

On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 10:49 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

>
> Attaboy/attagirl.
>
> Leaves you wondering just what you were paying the Indy for, doesn't it?
>
> Mitch.
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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>
>


-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2017 Subaru Legacy, 30 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

Attaboy/attagirl.

Leaves you wondering just what you were paying the Indy for, doesn't it?

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Larry Turner via Mercedes]

;-)


On 10/07/2017 8:22 PM, Max Dillon via Mercedes wrote:

Bravo!  I always said that a Lovely Assistant would come in handy!

;)



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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Bravo!  I always said that a Lovely Assistant would come in handy!  

;)
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300
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Re: [MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

Kudos,Larry

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
2005 E320  4 matic.
Wickford RI

On Oct 7, 2017 7:01 PM, "Larry Turner via Mercedes" 
wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> You may remember my recent problem with what ended up being a short in my
> GP Wiring Harness.  I don't recall where the story left off, but the Indy
> who said they could work on it but ended up not being able to fix it even
> though I was telling them what to do.  Anyway, my wife & I went to the Indy
> last Thurs. and after cranking for 20 seconds, then waiting for 30 sec my
> wife got the car to start on a 80F day on the 2nd starter cranking.
>
> My wife drove it home and we finally started on it this AM around 9AM.  My
> wife was a big help as I can't stand for very long at a time, so I mostly
> "Supervised" (my preferred mode of operation) as she removed the linkages,
> the manifold bolts and all the bits and pieces.  After lifting the Intake
> Manifold off, we were able to examine the GP Wire Harness.  We found the
> wire going to GP #2 had lost its insulation.  I don't know if it was
> abraded or perhaps the heat cycles made it brittle, but the insulation was
> gone from the point where the #2 GP wire left the main harness and went to
> the GP.  Rather than re-wiring the harness completely as I had planned, I
> decided to put some black electrician's tape on it then covered that with
> the Universal Magic Repair of Duct Tape to make sure the Electrician's Tape
> stayed in place.  Also, before putting the Electrician's Tape in place, I
> cleaned the bare copper wire with Brake Cleaner because the copper wire was
> coated with black diesel oil which prevented the tape from sticking.
>
> Then, as we finished everything up,  I found the mandatory error which
> seems to appear in all my repairs - the Accelerator Linkage that attaches
> to the aft end of the linkage near the firewall was on the wrong side of
> the GP Harness!  I had it on the inside, between the harness and the cyl
> head, and it needs to be on the outside.  As it was I was prevented from
> snapping it in place.  (This is when I said DAMN!)  So we decided to stop
> at that point, I was beat and so was my wife, who had stretched the tendons
> of her legs when leaning over the engine to reach the fasteners.
>
> But we tried it, and it started instantly like it always does, confirming
> we had put the Manifold and harness on correctly and that we had found and
> repaired the problem. Smiles all around.  Tomorrow I plan to either  pop
> that linkage off at the bottom, or even easier, unfasten #5 and perhaps #4
> GP Wire and move the linkage rod into the correct position.
>
> On the road again!
>
> LarryT
>
> 91 300 2.5T
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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[MBZ] My 91 300D with the Shorted GP Harness

[Larry Turner via Mercedes]

Hi All,

You may remember my recent problem with what ended up being a short in 
my GP Wiring Harness.  I don't recall where the story left off, but the 
Indy who said they could work on it but ended up not being able to fix 
it even though I was telling them what to do.  Anyway, my wife & I went 
to the Indy last Thurs. and after cranking for 20 seconds, then waiting 
for 30 sec my wife got the car to start on a 80F day on the 2nd starter 
cranking.


My wife drove it home and we finally started on it this AM around 9AM.  
My wife was a big help as I can't stand for very long at a time, so I 
mostly "Supervised" (my preferred mode of operation) as she removed the 
linkages, the manifold bolts and all the bits and pieces.  After lifting 
the Intake Manifold off, we were able to examine the GP Wire Harness.  
We found the wire going to GP #2 had lost its insulation.  I don't know 
if it was abraded or perhaps the heat cycles made it brittle, but the 
insulation was gone from the point where the #2 GP wire left the main 
harness and went to the GP.  Rather than re-wiring the harness 
completely as I had planned, I decided to put some black electrician's 
tape on it then covered that with the Universal Magic Repair of Duct 
Tape to make sure the Electrician's Tape stayed in place.  Also, before 
putting the Electrician's Tape in place, I cleaned the bare copper wire 
with Brake Cleaner because the copper wire was coated with black diesel 
oil which prevented the tape from sticking.


Then, as we finished everything up,  I found the mandatory error which 
seems to appear in all my repairs - the Accelerator Linkage that 
attaches to the aft end of the linkage near the firewall was on the 
wrong side of the GP Harness!  I had it on the inside, between the 
harness and the cyl head, and it needs to be on the outside.  As it was 
I was prevented from snapping it in place.  (This is when I said DAMN!)  
So we decided to stop at that point, I was beat and so was my wife, who 
had stretched the tendons of her legs when leaning over the engine to 
reach the fasteners.


But we tried it, and it started instantly like it always does, 
confirming we had put the Manifold and harness on correctly and that we 
had found and repaired the problem. Smiles all around.  Tomorrow I plan 
to either  pop that linkage off at the bottom, or even easier, unfasten 
#5 and perhaps #4 GP Wire and move the linkage rod into the correct 
position.


On the road again!

LarryT

91 300 2.5T

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