Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
I agree. You could do a lot worse. On Thu, Jul 25, 2019 at 11:59 AM Max Dillon via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > Probably fine. I've bought other Behr stuff, no issues. Note the review. > -- > Max Dillon > Charleston SC > > On July 25, 2019 11:46:49 AM EDT, Allan Streib via Mercedes < > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > >Any opinion on the Behr unit that FCP says is "OEM" and will fit my > >W116 300SD? > > > >https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mercedes-a-c-compressor-0002304711 > > > >Allan > > > >Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes writes: > > > >> 86 and up > >> > >> Sent from my iPhone > >> > >>> On Jul 24, 2019, at 8:36 PM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes > > wrote: > >>> > >>> 126 compressors are Nippondenso I think, at least the diesels are. > >>> > >>> ___ > >>> http://www.okiebenz.com > >>> > >>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > >>> > >>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > >>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > >>> > >> > >> > >> ___ > >> http://www.okiebenz.com > >> > >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > >> > >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > >> > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > -- Jaime Kopchinski http://www.jaimekop.com/ ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Probably fine. I've bought other Behr stuff, no issues. Note the review. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC On July 25, 2019 11:46:49 AM EDT, Allan Streib via Mercedes wrote: >Any opinion on the Behr unit that FCP says is "OEM" and will fit my >W116 300SD? > >https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mercedes-a-c-compressor-0002304711 > >Allan > >Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes writes: > >> 86 and up >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Jul 24, 2019, at 8:36 PM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes > wrote: >>> >>> 126 compressors are Nippondenso I think, at least the diesels are. >>> >>> ___ >>> http://www.okiebenz.com >>> >>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >>> >>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >>> >> >> >> ___ >> http://www.okiebenz.com >> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >> ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Any opinion on the Behr unit that FCP says is "OEM" and will fit my W116 300SD? https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mercedes-a-c-compressor-0002304711 Allan Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes writes: > 86 and up > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Jul 24, 2019, at 8:36 PM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes >> wrote: >> >> 126 compressors are Nippondenso I think, at least the diesels are. >> >> ___ >> http://www.okiebenz.com >> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >> > > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > -- Allan Streib Indiana University School of Informatics, Computing, and Engineering Digital Science Center | Intelligent Systems Engineering | FutureSystems ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
My 79 123 (TD) and 82 126 (SD), had the same R4 compressor setup. MBZ version has metric threads in addition to the inverted oil pickup compared to the GM version. As I recall Pierre was a fan of CompressorWorks and sealing washers (vs ordinary O-rings) where the manifold bolts to the R4 compressor, especially on Diesels. > -Original Message- > From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of MG > via Mercedes > Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2019 7:34 PM > To: Mercedes Discussion List > Cc: MG > Subject: Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD > > AH. I guess the 126 has the compressor oriented different from the 123. > > Clay Monroe via Mercedes wrote: > > Exact same mountings and position based on the spare compressor I found > while digging through all the W126 goodies in my stash. Turned out I had the > whole set up already but for the O rings just sitting in a rubbermaid tub. > > > > clay > > > >> On Jul 23, 2019, at 6:43 AM, MG via Mercedes > wrote: > >> > >> Now all you have to do is find out how to spin it to get the oil pickup on > >> the > bottom when it is in it's new position on the Mercedes. > >> > >> MG > >> > >> Clay Monroe via Mercedes wrote: > >>> I rescued one from a Chebby truck at PnP. Not bad for the price and > >>> had a 12v supply in the tool box to check the clutch would engage. > >>> Think I paid $12. Made sure to cut the hoses far from the working > >>> bits and stopper them with a duct tape bandage to keep it sanitary > >>> clay > > > > ___ > > http://www.okiebenz.com > > > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > > > > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
86 and up Sent from my iPhone > On Jul 24, 2019, at 8:36 PM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes > wrote: > > 126 compressors are Nippondenso I think, at least the diesels are. > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
126 compressors are Nippondenso I think, at least the diesels are. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
AH. I guess the 126 has the compressor oriented different from the 123. Clay Monroe via Mercedes wrote: Exact same mountings and position based on the spare compressor I found while digging through all the W126 goodies in my stash. Turned out I had the whole set up already but for the O rings just sitting in a rubbermaid tub. clay On Jul 23, 2019, at 6:43 AM, MG via Mercedes wrote: Now all you have to do is find out how to spin it to get the oil pickup on the bottom when it is in it's new position on the Mercedes. MG Clay Monroe via Mercedes wrote: I rescued one from a Chebby truck at PnP. Not bad for the price and had a 12v supply in the tool box to check the clutch would engage. Think I paid $12. Made sure to cut the hoses far from the working bits and stopper them with a duct tape bandage to keep it sanitary clay ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
The oil feed is internal. I think one simply takes off the front cap, rotates it 180 degrees, and install with fresh seals. That will allow oil to flow to front seal, maybe the bearing too? Not sure of the construction. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC On July 23, 2019 4:26:15 PM EDT, Clay Monroe via Mercedes wrote: >Exact same mountings and position based on the spare compressor I found >while digging through all the W126 goodies in my stash. Turned out I >had the whole set up already but for the O rings just sitting in a >rubbermaid tub. > >clay > >> On Jul 23, 2019, at 6:43 AM, MG via Mercedes >wrote: >> >> Now all you have to do is find out how to spin it to get the oil >pickup on the bottom when it is in it's new position on the Mercedes. >> >> MG >> >> Clay Monroe via Mercedes wrote: >>> I rescued one from a Chebby truck at PnP. Not bad for the price and >had a 12v supply in the tool box to check the clutch would engage. >Think I paid $12. Made sure to cut the hoses far from the working bits >and stopper them with a duct tape bandage to keep it sanitary >>> clay > >___ >http://www.okiebenz.com > >To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > >To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Exact same mountings and position based on the spare compressor I found while digging through all the W126 goodies in my stash. Turned out I had the whole set up already but for the O rings just sitting in a rubbermaid tub. clay > On Jul 23, 2019, at 6:43 AM, MG via Mercedes wrote: > > Now all you have to do is find out how to spin it to get the oil pickup on > the bottom when it is in it's new position on the Mercedes. > > MG > > Clay Monroe via Mercedes wrote: >> I rescued one from a Chebby truck at PnP. Not bad for the price and had a >> 12v supply in the tool box to check the clutch would engage. Think I paid >> $12. Made sure to cut the hoses far from the working bits and stopper them >> with a duct tape bandage to keep it sanitary >> clay ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Now all you have to do is find out how to spin it to get the oil pickup on the bottom when it is in it's new position on the Mercedes. MG Clay Monroe via Mercedes wrote: I rescued one from a Chebby truck at PnP. Not bad for the price and had a 12v supply in the tool box to check the clutch would engage. Think I paid $12. Made sure to cut the hoses far from the working bits and stopper them with a duct tape bandage to keep it sanitary clay On Jul 22, 2019, at 10:34 AM, Allan Streib via Mercedes wrote: Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes writes: In terms of the compressor, I'll be using a genuine MB R4, which isn't cheap. But I don't plan to do this again for the next 10-20 years. But there are cheaper options. Where does one buy this genuine compressor? Dealer? Unfortunately there isn't one near here so I like to buy online. FCP Euro lists a Behr compressor as "OEM" https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mercedes-a-c-compressor-0002304711 Allan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
I rescued one from a Chebby truck at PnP. Not bad for the price and had a 12v supply in the tool box to check the clutch would engage. Think I paid $12. Made sure to cut the hoses far from the working bits and stopper them with a duct tape bandage to keep it sanitary clay > On Jul 22, 2019, at 10:34 AM, Allan Streib via Mercedes > wrote: > > Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes writes: > >> In terms of the compressor, I'll be using a genuine MB R4, which isn't >> cheap. But I don't plan to do this again for the next 10-20 years. But >> there are cheaper options. > > Where does one buy this genuine compressor? Dealer? Unfortunately there > isn't one near here so I like to buy online. > > FCP Euro lists a Behr compressor as "OEM" > > https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mercedes-a-c-compressor-0002304711 > > Allan > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes writes: > In terms of the compressor, I'll be using a genuine MB R4, which isn't > cheap. But I don't plan to do this again for the next 10-20 years. But > there are cheaper options. Where does one buy this genuine compressor? Dealer? Unfortunately there isn't one near here so I like to buy online. FCP Euro lists a Behr compressor as "OEM" https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mercedes-a-c-compressor-0002304711 Allan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
You'll want a thermometer or two. You don't want the evaporator running below freezing. The O-rings where the manifold bolts to the compressor are an issue because of the vibration of Diesels. There is a version that is a metal washer with O-ring on the inner diameter that is more robust. I think the matching compressor is special too (Covered in Pierre's vids, I think). The OE hoses are probably leaky by now but a good hose shop should be able to rebuild (reuse old metal with new hose stock) much cheaper than MBZ parts. Look hard for leaks before charging with real R12. > -Original Message- > From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of > Allan Streib via Mercedes > Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2019 1:03 PM > To: mercedes@okiebenz.com > Cc: Allan Streib > Subject: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD > > I am wanting to get my AC going in my W116 300SD. Has not worked since I got > it. From what I can tell, the compressor is totally siezed, and I have the > belt > removed. > > These are an "upside down" GM compressor is that right? Are there better > options e.g. Sanden or something else? > > What else should I think about. I have a vacuum pump and a gauge set but > beyond vacuuming/charging I have not done any other work on AC systems. > > Allan > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
The thing about reed valves is that they inherently one-way... -Curt On Thursday, July 18, 2019, 5:08:49 PM EDT, Randy Bennell via Mercedes wrote: On 18/07/2019 3:32 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes wrote: > They have a “valve plate” that has some circular discs that act as valves. > I’m not sure that they’re reed valves in that sense. > > -D > > Sounds similar. Thin metal that opens and closes. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
On 18/07/2019 3:32 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes wrote: They have a “valve plate” that has some circular discs that act as valves. I’m not sure that they’re reed valves in that sense. -D Sounds similar. Thin metal that opens and closes. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
They have a “valve plate” that has some circular discs that act as valves. I’m not sure that they’re reed valves in that sense. -D > On Jul 18, 2019, at 4:16 PM, Randy Bennell via Mercedes > wrote: > > I am no expert on these things. Do they have valves similar to the thin reed > valve type things in air compressors? I have been told that the valves in my > York are suspect as the compressor clutch kicks in and the pump runs but it > does not compress as the pressure levels on high and low are equal. > > Any idea if something like that is available? They look to be a pretty simple > pump unit. It worked when I got the car for a year or two and then got > changed over to 134 when the freon disappeared. Lots of "new" options > available. Don't know if we are allowed to us R12 at all in Canada anymore. > My mechanic son should know as he has the MOPIA licence and can buy parts etc. > > > > On 18/07/2019 3:02 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes wrote: >> Certainly! >> >> For example: >> >> https://www.shopcenturyautoair.com/store/c20/York.html >> >> -D >> >> >>> On Jul 18, 2019, at 3:59 PM, Randy Bennell via Mercedes >>> wrote: >>> >>> Is it possible to get parts for a York and rebuild it? >>> >>> > > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
I am no expert on these things. Do they have valves similar to the thin reed valve type things in air compressors? I have been told that the valves in my York are suspect as the compressor clutch kicks in and the pump runs but it does not compress as the pressure levels on high and low are equal. Any idea if something like that is available? They look to be a pretty simple pump unit. It worked when I got the car for a year or two and then got changed over to 134 when the freon disappeared. Lots of "new" options available. Don't know if we are allowed to us R12 at all in Canada anymore. My mechanic son should know as he has the MOPIA licence and can buy parts etc. On 18/07/2019 3:02 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes wrote: Certainly! For example: https://www.shopcenturyautoair.com/store/c20/York.html -D On Jul 18, 2019, at 3:59 PM, Randy Bennell via Mercedes wrote: Is it possible to get parts for a York and rebuild it? ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Certainly! For example: https://www.shopcenturyautoair.com/store/c20/York.html -D > On Jul 18, 2019, at 3:59 PM, Randy Bennell via Mercedes > wrote: > > Is it possible to get parts for a York and rebuild it? > > > On 18/07/2019 2:24 PM, Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes wrote: >> Yes, I've replaced Yorks with Sanden compressors in the past. I've also >> run cars with original Yorks. Given the choice, I usually go for the York >> as they're simple and super reliable. I'd put money on them out living any >> Sanden compressor. They are power hungry... I might go for a sanden on a >> 200D! >> >> I'm not sure sure the R4 is as robust, but I do believe those germans knew >> what they were doing when they designed the brackets, pulleys, etc. There >> is so much to consider from an engineering standpoint that isn't >> necessarily considered when changing from an R4 to a Sanden.They car >> survived 40 year with its original compressor design and will certainly >> survive another 40 with it. >> >> It is important to buy a proper compressor... the cheap rebuilds might not >> consider the upside down installation. As mentioned, Pierre has some >> videos on this topic and he recommends genuine MB. >> >> And yes, filter is a good idea! Have you determined if the compressor >> sized up, or just the clutch? >> >> Jaime >> >> >> > > > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Is it possible to get parts for a York and rebuild it? On 18/07/2019 2:24 PM, Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes wrote: Yes, I've replaced Yorks with Sanden compressors in the past. I've also run cars with original Yorks. Given the choice, I usually go for the York as they're simple and super reliable. I'd put money on them out living any Sanden compressor. They are power hungry... I might go for a sanden on a 200D! I'm not sure sure the R4 is as robust, but I do believe those germans knew what they were doing when they designed the brackets, pulleys, etc. There is so much to consider from an engineering standpoint that isn't necessarily considered when changing from an R4 to a Sanden.They car survived 40 year with its original compressor design and will certainly survive another 40 with it. It is important to buy a proper compressor... the cheap rebuilds might not consider the upside down installation. As mentioned, Pierre has some videos on this topic and he recommends genuine MB. And yes, filter is a good idea! Have you determined if the compressor sized up, or just the clutch? Jaime ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Since it’s not currently in play, take it off and disassemble it. You have nothing to lose at this point…. Most of these are pretty simple devices and easy to disassemble. In some cases you can even obtain replacement parts, too. While it’s a totally different compressor, I’ve rebuilt Nippendenso compressors without a lot of effort and it took all of maybe an hour and around $20 worth of parts. -D > On Jul 18, 2019, at 3:33 PM, Allan Streib via Mercedes > wrote: > >> And yes, filter is a good idea! Have you determined if the compressor >> sized up, or just the clutch? > > That I'm not sure. All I know right now is it does not turn by belt or > by hand. > > Allan > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes writes: > I'm not sure sure the R4 is as robust, but I do believe those germans knew > what they were doing when they designed the brackets, pulleys, etc. There > is so much to consider from an engineering standpoint that isn't > necessarily considered when changing from an R4 to a Sanden.They car > survived 40 year with its original compressor design and will certainly > survive another 40 with it. > > It is important to buy a proper compressor... the cheap rebuilds might not > consider the upside down installation. As mentioned, Pierre has some > videos on this topic and he recommends genuine MB. Good points. And, compared to the work required to remove/replace all these parts, saving $$ on the compressor is probably a false economy. > And yes, filter is a good idea! Have you determined if the compressor > sized up, or just the clutch? That I'm not sure. All I know right now is it does not turn by belt or by hand. Allan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Yes, I've replaced Yorks with Sanden compressors in the past. I've also run cars with original Yorks. Given the choice, I usually go for the York as they're simple and super reliable. I'd put money on them out living any Sanden compressor. They are power hungry... I might go for a sanden on a 200D! I'm not sure sure the R4 is as robust, but I do believe those germans knew what they were doing when they designed the brackets, pulleys, etc. There is so much to consider from an engineering standpoint that isn't necessarily considered when changing from an R4 to a Sanden.They car survived 40 year with its original compressor design and will certainly survive another 40 with it. It is important to buy a proper compressor... the cheap rebuilds might not consider the upside down installation. As mentioned, Pierre has some videos on this topic and he recommends genuine MB. And yes, filter is a good idea! Have you determined if the compressor sized up, or just the clutch? Jaime On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 3:17 PM Dan Penoff via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > I suspect Jaime will opt for the York, but in my experience there’s > nothing wrong with the Yorks as they’re pretty bulletproof. I’ve got the > original York on the 220SEb, and it pulls a wicked vacuum and doesn’t bog > the engine down, even at idle. > > -D > > > > On Jul 18, 2019, at 3:02 PM, Allan Streib via Mercedes < > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > > > > I am leaning towards keeping R12. If the system doesn't leak, I agree > > that it's not a significant cost and that's what it's designed for. > > > > My question on the Sanden vs. original was thinking that perhaps a > > modern compressor is better than 1970s technology, from the standpoints > > of longevity, performance, and efficiency. This is a driver not a show > > car so I don't care about originality too much. Would a more modern > > compressor preclude keeping R12? > > > > I have this vague memory Jaime that you replaced a York(?) with a > > Nippondenso or somthing else, may have been discussed back in the old > > mbz.org list days? > > > > Allan > > > > > > Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes writes: > > > >> I'm getting ready to do this on my W116 300SD as the AC compressor > >> went bad earlier this year. > >> > >> My plans are: > >> 1. Remove compressor, expansion valve, and receiver/dryer and flush > >> the lines, condenser, and evaporator with AC flush solvent. > >> 2. Install new compressor, expansion valve and R/D. > >> 3. Replace any other o-rings that might have been missed in step 2. > >> 4. Evacuate and charge with R12. > >> > >> I just did this on my '67 300SEL (which hasn't had AC working since > >> the 1980s), but I didn't change the compressor, only changed the oil. > >> It'll blow air below freezing. > >> > >> A few things to consider. R12, with the right license you can get > >> easily online, is about ~$35 for a 12-14oz can on ebay. Overall, very > >> affordable. You need a vacuum pump and R12 gauge set. (You can use a > >> R-410 gauge set also, which more options might be available for). > >> > >> In terms of the compressor, I'll be using a genuine MB R4, which isn't > >> cheap. But I don't plan to do this again for the next 10-20 years. > >> But there are cheaper options. > >> > >> I honestly don't see the point in going any other route. Sanden > >> compressors and alternate refrigerants are just solutions in search of > >> a problem. The original systems work well and still fully > >> serviceable. You can convert to R134a if you want, my W116 has been > >> running it for the last 10 years before the compressor died. It > >> cooled just fine, but I don't see the point in the added pressures and > >> heat when R12 is still available. > >> > >> Jaime > >> > > > > ___ > > http://www.okiebenz.com > > > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > > > > > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > -- Jaime Kopchinski http://www.jaimekop.com/ ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
I suspect Jaime will opt for the York, but in my experience there’s nothing wrong with the Yorks as they’re pretty bulletproof. I’ve got the original York on the 220SEb, and it pulls a wicked vacuum and doesn’t bog the engine down, even at idle. -D > On Jul 18, 2019, at 3:02 PM, Allan Streib via Mercedes > wrote: > > I am leaning towards keeping R12. If the system doesn't leak, I agree > that it's not a significant cost and that's what it's designed for. > > My question on the Sanden vs. original was thinking that perhaps a > modern compressor is better than 1970s technology, from the standpoints > of longevity, performance, and efficiency. This is a driver not a show > car so I don't care about originality too much. Would a more modern > compressor preclude keeping R12? > > I have this vague memory Jaime that you replaced a York(?) with a > Nippondenso or somthing else, may have been discussed back in the old > mbz.org list days? > > Allan > > > Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes writes: > >> I'm getting ready to do this on my W116 300SD as the AC compressor >> went bad earlier this year. >> >> My plans are: >> 1. Remove compressor, expansion valve, and receiver/dryer and flush >> the lines, condenser, and evaporator with AC flush solvent. >> 2. Install new compressor, expansion valve and R/D. >> 3. Replace any other o-rings that might have been missed in step 2. >> 4. Evacuate and charge with R12. >> >> I just did this on my '67 300SEL (which hasn't had AC working since >> the 1980s), but I didn't change the compressor, only changed the oil. >> It'll blow air below freezing. >> >> A few things to consider. R12, with the right license you can get >> easily online, is about ~$35 for a 12-14oz can on ebay. Overall, very >> affordable. You need a vacuum pump and R12 gauge set. (You can use a >> R-410 gauge set also, which more options might be available for). >> >> In terms of the compressor, I'll be using a genuine MB R4, which isn't >> cheap. But I don't plan to do this again for the next 10-20 years. >> But there are cheaper options. >> >> I honestly don't see the point in going any other route. Sanden >> compressors and alternate refrigerants are just solutions in search of >> a problem. The original systems work well and still fully >> serviceable. You can convert to R134a if you want, my W116 has been >> running it for the last 10 years before the compressor died. It >> cooled just fine, but I don't see the point in the added pressures and >> heat when R12 is still available. >> >> Jaime >> > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
I second this. They’re cheap and it’s excellent insurance. Whenever I replace a major component I install a filter or inlet screen in the compressor. -D > On Jul 18, 2019, at 1:59 PM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes > wrote: > > If the compressor is damaged, do yourself a favor and have a filter installed > in the suction line. That will trap any shrapnel floating around, it's > impossible to get it all out. If you don't, the debris will promptly trash > the replacement compressor. > > > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
I am leaning towards keeping R12. If the system doesn't leak, I agree that it's not a significant cost and that's what it's designed for. My question on the Sanden vs. original was thinking that perhaps a modern compressor is better than 1970s technology, from the standpoints of longevity, performance, and efficiency. This is a driver not a show car so I don't care about originality too much. Would a more modern compressor preclude keeping R12? I have this vague memory Jaime that you replaced a York(?) with a Nippondenso or somthing else, may have been discussed back in the old mbz.org list days? Allan Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes writes: > I'm getting ready to do this on my W116 300SD as the AC compressor > went bad earlier this year. > > My plans are: > 1. Remove compressor, expansion valve, and receiver/dryer and flush > the lines, condenser, and evaporator with AC flush solvent. > 2. Install new compressor, expansion valve and R/D. > 3. Replace any other o-rings that might have been missed in step 2. > 4. Evacuate and charge with R12. > > I just did this on my '67 300SEL (which hasn't had AC working since > the 1980s), but I didn't change the compressor, only changed the oil. > It'll blow air below freezing. > > A few things to consider. R12, with the right license you can get > easily online, is about ~$35 for a 12-14oz can on ebay. Overall, very > affordable. You need a vacuum pump and R12 gauge set. (You can use a > R-410 gauge set also, which more options might be available for). > > In terms of the compressor, I'll be using a genuine MB R4, which isn't > cheap. But I don't plan to do this again for the next 10-20 years. > But there are cheaper options. > > I honestly don't see the point in going any other route. Sanden > compressors and alternate refrigerants are just solutions in search of > a problem. The original systems work well and still fully > serviceable. You can convert to R134a if you want, my W116 has been > running it for the last 10 years before the compressor died. It > cooled just fine, but I don't see the point in the added pressures and > heat when R12 is still available. > > Jaime > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Craig via Mercedes writes: > On Thu, 18 Jul 2019 12:59:13 -0500 Peter Frederick via Mercedes > wrote: > >> If the compressor is damaged, do yourself a favor and have a filter >> installed in the suction line. That will trap any shrapnel floating >> around, it's impossible to get it all out. If you don't, the debris >> will promptly trash the replacement compressor. > > You beat me to it, Peter. I was going to comment he needs to put a filter > in it, too. I assume this a good idea even if I replace the compressor, condenser and soft lines? Any chance the siezed compressor would be rebuildable on a home garage workbench? I am guessing no, but not certain. Allan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
On Thu, 18 Jul 2019 12:59:13 -0500 Peter Frederick via Mercedes wrote: > If the compressor is damaged, do yourself a favor and have a filter > installed in the suction line. That will trap any shrapnel floating > around, it's impossible to get it all out. If you don't, the debris > will promptly trash the replacement compressor. You beat me to it, Peter. I was going to comment he needs to put a filter in it, too. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
If the compressor is damaged, do yourself a favor and have a filter installed in the suction line. That will trap any shrapnel floating around, it's impossible to get it all out. If you don't, the debris will promptly trash the replacement compressor. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
> The R4 is not bad, just a little noisy and power hungry. So, where does the excess energy go? Everything we're talking about is a displacement pump, using reed valves. The only thing different is the number, size, and orientation of cylinders. (Ranging from 2 in the York to 5x2=10 in the Sanden/Nippondenso.) -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
And since this is a relatively simple system, I would encourage you to replace the flexible lines. If they’re the originals they will be porous, and while the system might hold a charge for a while, it will eventually leak out over few months. New lines aren’t that expensive, you can get a local hose shop to make them up for you. They’ll use a barrier hose that will prevent refrigerant from leaking through the hose material at the molecular level. The original hoses did not have this feature. I highly recommend the “alternative” refrigerants, as I’ve found them to work well in R12 systems myself and they’re easy to handle and you don’t have to worry about killing the planet if they leak out or the system gets discharged. New hoses are even more important with this stuff, as the different gasses would leak at a different rate, meaning your system could remain charged but the ratio of gasses has changed and it no longer cools efficiently. Not sure these guy’s stuff would work on the W116, but it’s worth looking into as far as brackets and Sanden conversions: https://klimakit.com/about/ -D > On Jul 18, 2019, at 1:35 PM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes > wrote: > > Yes, correct on the compressor. Upgrade kits for installing a Sanden are > out there (check on Peach Parts forum, I think there is a guy there selling > kits). > > Is it possible to get the regular GM compressor and rotate some part (the > front cover?) so it will work "upside down"? Worth looking into. Pierre > Hedary has a you-tuber video about the compressor, maybe worth giving him a > call. The R4 is not bad, just a little noisy and power hungry. > > Keep it R-12 if you can afford it. > > Seized compressor probably means a leak gradually bled out the oil, now > compressor parts may be scattered throughout the condenser, so you probably > need to replace that as well. Might as well do whole hog, and replace or > rebuild all the refrigerant lines. Flush out the evaporator, replace the > expansion valve and the drier. > - > Max > Charleston SC > > > On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 1:04 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes < > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > >> I am wanting to get my AC going in my W116 300SD. Has not worked since I >> got it. From what I can tell, the compressor is totally siezed, and I >> have the belt removed. >> >> These are an "upside down" GM compressor is that right? Are there >> better options e.g. Sanden or something else? >> >> What else should I think about. I have a vacuum pump and a gauge set but >> beyond vacuuming/charging I have not done any other work on AC systems. >> >> Allan >> >> ___ >> http://www.okiebenz.com >> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >> >> > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
I'm getting ready to do this on my W116 300SD as the AC compressor went bad earlier this year. My plans are: 1. Remove compressor, expansion valve, and receiver/dryer and flush the lines, condenser, and evaporator with AC flush solvent. 2. Install new compressor, expansion valve and R/D. 3. Replace any other o-rings that might have been missed in step 2. 4. Evacuate and charge with R12. I just did this on my '67 300SEL (which hasn't had AC working since the 1980s), but I didn't change the compressor, only changed the oil. It'll blow air below freezing. A few things to consider. R12, with the right license you can get easily online, is about ~$35 for a 12-14oz can on ebay. Overall, very affordable. You need a vacuum pump and R12 gauge set. (You can use a R-410 gauge set also, which more options might be available for). In terms of the compressor, I'll be using a genuine MB R4, which isn't cheap. But I don't plan to do this again for the next 10-20 years. But there are cheaper options. I honestly don't see the point in going any other route. Sanden compressors and alternate refrigerants are just solutions in search of a problem. The original systems work well and still fully serviceable. You can convert to R134a if you want, my W116 has been running it for the last 10 years before the compressor died. It cooled just fine, but I don't see the point in the added pressures and heat when R12 is still available. Jaime On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 1:04 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > I am wanting to get my AC going in my W116 300SD. Has not worked since I > got it. From what I can tell, the compressor is totally siezed, and I > have the belt removed. > > These are an "upside down" GM compressor is that right? Are there > better options e.g. Sanden or something else? > > What else should I think about. I have a vacuum pump and a gauge set but > beyond vacuuming/charging I have not done any other work on AC systems. > > Allan > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > -- Jaime Kopchinski http://www.jaimekop.com/ ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Yes, correct on the compressor. Upgrade kits for installing a Sanden are out there (check on Peach Parts forum, I think there is a guy there selling kits). Is it possible to get the regular GM compressor and rotate some part (the front cover?) so it will work "upside down"? Worth looking into. Pierre Hedary has a you-tuber video about the compressor, maybe worth giving him a call. The R4 is not bad, just a little noisy and power hungry. Keep it R-12 if you can afford it. Seized compressor probably means a leak gradually bled out the oil, now compressor parts may be scattered throughout the condenser, so you probably need to replace that as well. Might as well do whole hog, and replace or rebuild all the refrigerant lines. Flush out the evaporator, replace the expansion valve and the drier. - Max Charleston SC On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 1:04 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > I am wanting to get my AC going in my W116 300SD. Has not worked since I > got it. From what I can tell, the compressor is totally siezed, and I > have the belt removed. > > These are an "upside down" GM compressor is that right? Are there > better options e.g. Sanden or something else? > > What else should I think about. I have a vacuum pump and a gauge set but > beyond vacuuming/charging I have not done any other work on AC systems. > > Allan > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
I will add that this car was never "converted" to R134 it still has the original schrader valves. Allan Rory via Mercedes writes: > Hey Allan, > > When you find a compressor I know a lot of the R12 guys are using R290 or > in other words, propane and they say it blows ice cubes. Getting ready to > charge my '88 Montero wit it. > > Rory > > On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 10:04 AM Allan Streib via Mercedes < > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > >> I am wanting to get my AC going in my W116 300SD. Has not worked since I >> got it. From what I can tell, the compressor is totally siezed, and I >> have the belt removed. >> >> These are an "upside down" GM compressor is that right? Are there >> better options e.g. Sanden or something else? >> >> What else should I think about. I have a vacuum pump and a gauge set but >> beyond vacuuming/charging I have not done any other work on AC systems. >> >> Allan >> ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] AC options for 300SD
Hey Allan, When you find a compressor I know a lot of the R12 guys are using R290 or in other words, propane and they say it blows ice cubes. Getting ready to charge my '88 Montero wit it. Rory On Thu, Jul 18, 2019 at 10:04 AM Allan Streib via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > I am wanting to get my AC going in my W116 300SD. Has not worked since I > got it. From what I can tell, the compressor is totally siezed, and I > have the belt removed. > > These are an "upside down" GM compressor is that right? Are there > better options e.g. Sanden or something else? > > What else should I think about. I have a vacuum pump and a gauge set but > beyond vacuuming/charging I have not done any other work on AC systems. > > Allan > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
