date:20070222

Hi,

In addition to the 700-odd pieces of China's
self-shot-down satellite, many of which will work
their way down to meteor like re-entries at various 
future dates, you can add 1100+ more pieces of
defunct spaceware:  http://spaceweather.com/


Australian astronomer Ray Palmer was photographing 
the Southern Cross from his observatory in Western 
Australia on Feb. 19th when a flaming plume cut across 
the Milky Way. I had no idea what it was, he says. 
It was moving very slowly and I was able to track 
it for 35 minutes.   
In mid-apparition the object exploded. Gordon 
Garradd of New South Wales photographed an 
expanding cloud filled with specks of debris. Tim 
Thorpe of South Australia saw it, too. Quite a 
surreal scene, he says. 
What was it? It was a mystery for almost 24 hours 
until satellite expert Daniel Deak matched the trajectory 
of the plume in Palmer's photo with the orbit of a 
derelict rocket booster--a Briz-M, catalog number 
28944. 
One year ago, the Briz-M sat atop a Russian Proton 
rocket that left Earth on Feb. 28, 2006, carrying an 
Arabsat-4A communications satellite. Shortly after 
launch, the rocket malfunctioned, leaving the satellite 
in the wrong orbit and the Briz-M looping around 
Earth partially-filled with fuel. On Feb. 19, 2007, 
for reasons unknown, the fuel tanks ruptured over 
Australia. 
Jon P. Boers of the USAF Space Surveillance 
System confirms the ID and notes later, on the 
other side of the world, our radar saw 500+ pieces 
in that orbit. Today the count is up to  fragments. 
[We're seeing] more fragments as the cloud expands, 
he explains.
One thousand-plus fragments makes this a major 
breakup event, says Mark Matney of NASA's Orbital 
Debris Office at the Johnson Space Center. There is 
no immediate threat to the space station, but we're 
analyzing the orbits to assess any long-term hazard. 
Unlike recent high profile breakups, Briz-M is in 
an orbit that is difficult for most radars to see, adds 
Boers. The generation of element sets on all the pieces 
will take weeks to accomplish.


Maybe the Russian junker ran into some piece of the 
Chinese junker?

Depending on the orbit, some of this stuff will stay up
for generations and some will come down (to make holes 
in New Hampshire ponds?) Since the Briz-M seems to
have exploded in all directions, we're likely to get some
pieces down before too long.

There's a very colorful photo of the explosive trail,
visible for 35 minutes, as the Astronomy Picture of the
Day for today (02-22-07):
http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/astropix.html


Sterling K. Webb


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Re: [meteorite-list] AD: Finally 1st Chladni MARS Case - get thevery first box crafted. Soon a historical collectible!

2007-02-22 Thread Martin Altmann

Hi Mark,

be ensured, that the used samples are more than specks or cutting dust.
We offer them in 4 different specimen sizes: XS, S, M, L.
Really almost all enclosed pieces aren't just fragments or crumbs,
but show cut surfaces, hence they are, if you want, true partslices.
And often, if I look at the Moons, one is able to see with unaided eye some
details like e.g. a shock veinlet.
So they aren't just unidentifiable gimmicks.

Additional we offer for those, who felt in love with the presentation, boxed
slices by weight, where the size limit is given by the diameter of the spare
hole in the inlay card.

As you see, it's the democratization of the Moon, as now also the small
collector has the possibility to choose a significant sample from a variety
of sizes to that extend, which his budget will allow.

And of course it goes without saying, that for advanced collectors like you
(although several of the veterans felt in love with our cases),
we hold ready partslices smaller and larger than 1 gram up to fullslices
reaching the largest possible diameter of the main mass stone.

So feel free to ask for such a specimen
and, if we will find a similar case in a suitable dimension, we will craft
you a giant Chladni Case with a nice fullslice!

Martin

PS: I haven't sold in ebay for years - I have no idea, why our Chladni case
does not appear among the newly listed auctions in the meteorite category,
why no result is found, if searched after any word from the title!

But if I search for a word from the title and mark additionally search
title  description - than it appears.
Also if I enter the item number.
But not, if I search for the seller - pardelmops - then no items for sale
are shown.

HELP!   

-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: mark ford [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 22. Februar 2007 09:52
An: Martin Altmann; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Betreff: RE: [meteorite-list] AD: Finally 1st Chladni MARS Case - get
thevery first box crafted. Soon a historical collectible!


I think it's a great idea, this is what is missing in a lot of meteorite
collections these days - good presentation, a good mount or display can make
a dull sometimes worthless speck into something to really inspire people!,
that is a GOOD THING.

Best,

Mark



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Re: [meteorite-list] Sikhote-Alin Picture of the Day - February 22, 2007

2007-02-22 Thread Pete Pete

Very cool!
Is this a double impact? It looks like another rim within the larger crater.

Cheers,
Pete




From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] Sikhote-Alin Picture of the Day - February 22, 
2007
Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 22:14:12 EST

http://www.spacerocksinc.com/February_22.html

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Re: [meteorite-list] AD: Finally 1st Chladni MARS Case - getthevery first box crafted. Soon a historical collectible!

2007-02-22 Thread mark ford

Hi Martin,

be ensured, that the used samples are more than specks or cutting dust.
We offer them in 4 different specimen sizes: XS, S, M, L.

Absolutley Yes! -  just to clarify I wasn't meaning your stuff 'was worthless', 
of course it is of the very best quality!. But what I mean by that is a good 
display/case (like yours) Can make a small micro into something even bigger  
better, for that they are a really good idea! I want one!!

Btw I too had problems with searching on ebay, 'the search for other items' 
doesn't seem to work properly,so I guess ebay is having server problems at the 
moment!


Best
Mark

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Martin Altmann
Sent: 22 February 2007 10:31
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD: Finally 1st Chladni MARS Case - getthevery 
first box crafted. Soon a historical collectible!

Hi Mark,

be ensured, that the used samples are more than specks or cutting dust.
We offer them in 4 different specimen sizes: XS, S, M, L.
Really almost all enclosed pieces aren't just fragments or crumbs,
but show cut surfaces, hence they are, if you want, true partslices.
And often, if I look at the Moons, one is able to see with unaided eye some
details like e.g. a shock veinlet.
So they aren't just unidentifiable gimmicks.

Additional we offer for those, who felt in love with the presentation, boxed
slices by weight, where the size limit is given by the diameter of the spare
hole in the inlay card.

As you see, it's the democratization of the Moon, as now also the small
collector has the possibility to choose a significant sample from a variety
of sizes to that extend, which his budget will allow.

And of course it goes without saying, that for advanced collectors like you
(although several of the veterans felt in love with our cases),
we hold ready partslices smaller and larger than 1 gram up to fullslices
reaching the largest possible diameter of the main mass stone.

So feel free to ask for such a specimen
and, if we will find a similar case in a suitable dimension, we will craft
you a giant Chladni Case with a nice fullslice!

Martin

PS: I haven't sold in ebay for years - I have no idea, why our Chladni case
does not appear among the newly listed auctions in the meteorite category,
why no result is found, if searched after any word from the title!

But if I search for a word from the title and mark additionally search
title  description - than it appears.
Also if I enter the item number.
But not, if I search for the seller - pardelmops - then no items for sale
are shown.

HELP!   

-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: mark ford [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 22. Februar 2007 09:52
An: Martin Altmann; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Betreff: RE: [meteorite-list] AD: Finally 1st Chladni MARS Case - get
thevery first box crafted. Soon a historical collectible!


I think it's a great idea, this is what is missing in a lot of meteorite
collections these days - good presentation, a good mount or display can make
a dull sometimes worthless speck into something to really inspire people!,
that is a GOOD THING.

Best,

Mark



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Re: [meteorite-list] Blaine Reed Tucson Notes AD

2007-02-22 Thread AL Mitterling

Greetings Tucson attendees,

Here is my two grams worth on the auctions, dealer rooms, participation 
and parties. First I know that the dealer rooms were the first 
participants at the show many years back. Robert Haag probably was the 
first real dealer to set up and offer meteorites at the show. Other 
dealers soon followed as they offered a much needed service. Back then 
few people knew what a meteorite was and didn't think you would ever be 
able to own one or offer them for re-sale. Dealers are paying about two 
thousand or more to be a part of the show (which is suppose to be a 
wholesale show) and to rent the rooms from the show organizers. Travel 
there and setting up and time are other factors and costs. Obviously 
this is a sizable investment for them and they need a fair return.

Several years back someone decided to have an auction, not sure who but 
I would think it was the upscale auction from a New York dealer or 
possibly Michael Blood. As Blaine said those tended to compliment the 
dealers and no real problems. As the auctions caught on, a number of 
people would reserve specimens in some rooms and then go to the auctions 
in order to bid on items. Apparently after bidding on a number of things 
at auction, the same people who reserved specimens in dealer rooms would 
go back toward the end of the show and change their minds on the items 
they had taken off the shelves. Worse yet some didn't bother to return 
and let the dealer know they no longer wanted their reserved items. This 
results in the dealers selling less and costing them.

As the auctions gained favor and higher attendance a lower volume of 
sales were realized by room dealers. Of course it is more complicated 
than just this. There are now more dealers than ever, it is more 
difficult for foreign collectors to travel due to past events, other 
dealers have offered their own auctions to counter the other auctions 
and get people back in their rooms to look around. The show is not 
nearly as large as it once was due to the internet and rock and gem 
attendees having a lower count these days. I am sure ebay plays a factor 
to some degree. There are also a number of party events that compete for 
attendees time.

One trend that bothers me is the number of deals I see being made by 
dealers who don't have rooms but make the rounds to other dealer 
rooms. In some cases deals are being made in the paying dealer's room 
and has nothing to do with his inventory. To me this is very rude and if 
participants can't go outside or meet in a motel room to conduct their 
business they should at least offer the room dealer a percentage of the 
profit they are making in the offended dealers room. Courtesy seems to 
have vanished these days.

There are few dealers that have the knowledge and understanding of 
meteorites these days like Blaine Reed does. I think he is a vital part 
of the show and it will be a sad day if he can no longer afford to 
attend these shows. I recommend that if you attend the show, at least 
take a little time out to visit some of the old timers like Blaine. I 
think you will be pleased by his display, his helpful manor, his 
knowledge of the subject and best his reasonable prices. There may be a 
day when all this dries up and the pilgrimage to Tucson will no longer 
be and a subject that we only talk about. As dealers close their doors 
there will be less an less reason to attend the show.

With all this said I hope no one takes offense as it is not directed at 
any particular party. Rather it is an effort to get some of the other 
attendee's thoughts on the subject and stimulate discussion. While I am 
guilty of attending some of the auctions and understand the allure of 
going to them I still make the rounds to the rooms (as many as I can in 
the time I have) and spend a fair amount with them as well. Part of 
Tucson is the socializing, seeing what all is available from years past, 
and getting an idea of what items may become available in the near 
future. I hope to see others comment and share their thoughts on all of 
this.

BTW, I do like the idea of scheduling a hotel so we can deal the 
organizers out but don't know the legalities of doing this. I might be 
willing to set up my collection if we ever went this way. Perhaps a show 
could be scheduled in some other town, although I would miss the 
restaurants in Tucson. Best!

--AL Mitterling
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Re: [meteorite-list] Sikhote-Alin Picture of the Day - February 22, 2007

2007-02-22 Thread Jeff Kuyken

Hi Pete,

It's a very interesting piece with quite a unique 'crater'. It appears that
it may have been a double impact or possibly the result of a jagged shrapnel
fragment impacting the individual. Anyone on the list a ballistic expert?
;-)

http://www.meteorites.com.au/features/funkysa.html

Cheers,

Jeff Kuyken
Meteorites Australia
www.meteorites.com.au




- Original Message -
From: Pete Pete
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 9:38 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Sikhote-Alin Picture of the Day - February
22,2007


Very cool!
Is this a double impact? It looks like another rim within the larger crater.

Cheers,
Pete




From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] Sikhote-Alin Picture of the Day - February 22,
2007
Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 22:14:12 EST

http://www.spacerocksinc.com/February_22.html

BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free
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Re: [meteorite-list] Blaine Reed Tucson Notes AD

2007-02-22 Thread jbaxter112

Hello Al et al.,

I would like to second Al's suggestion that any Tucson attendee is really
missing out if they don't spend some time at Blaine's room. He always has
interesting material and is just a great source of meteorite information
and lore. To me he is an essential part of the Tucson experience.

Regards,
Jim Baxter

 Greetings Tucson attendees,

 Here is my two grams worth on the auctions, dealer rooms, participation
 and parties. First I know that the dealer rooms were the first
 participants at the show many years back. Robert Haag probably was the
 first real dealer to set up and offer meteorites at the show. Other
 dealers soon followed as they offered a much needed service. Back then
 few people knew what a meteorite was and didn't think you would ever be
 able to own one or offer them for re-sale. Dealers are paying about two
 thousand or more to be a part of the show (which is suppose to be a
 wholesale show) and to rent the rooms from the show organizers. Travel
 there and setting up and time are other factors and costs. Obviously
 this is a sizable investment for them and they need a fair return.

 Several years back someone decided to have an auction, not sure who but
 I would think it was the upscale auction from a New York dealer or
 possibly Michael Blood. As Blaine said those tended to compliment the
 dealers and no real problems. As the auctions caught on, a number of
 people would reserve specimens in some rooms and then go to the auctions
  in order to bid on items. Apparently after bidding on a number of
 things  at auction, the same people who reserved specimens in dealer
 rooms would  go back toward the end of the show and change their minds
 on the items  they had taken off the shelves. Worse yet some didn't
 bother to return  and let the dealer know they no longer wanted their
 reserved items. This  results in the dealers selling less and costing
 them.

 As the auctions gained favor and higher attendance a lower volume of
 sales were realized by room dealers. Of course it is more complicated
 than just this. There are now more dealers than ever, it is more
 difficult for foreign collectors to travel due to past events, other
 dealers have offered their own auctions to counter the other auctions
 and get people back in their rooms to look around. The show is not
 nearly as large as it once was due to the internet and rock and gem
 attendees having a lower count these days. I am sure ebay plays a factor
  to some degree. There are also a number of party events that compete
 for  attendees time.

 One trend that bothers me is the number of deals I see being made by
 dealers who don't have rooms but make the rounds to other dealer
 rooms. In some cases deals are being made in the paying dealer's room
 and has nothing to do with his inventory. To me this is very rude and if
  participants can't go outside or meet in a motel room to conduct their
 business they should at least offer the room dealer a percentage of the
 profit they are making in the offended dealers room. Courtesy seems to
 have vanished these days.

 There are few dealers that have the knowledge and understanding of
 meteorites these days like Blaine Reed does. I think he is a vital part
 of the show and it will be a sad day if he can no longer afford to
 attend these shows. I recommend that if you attend the show, at least
 take a little time out to visit some of the old timers like Blaine. I
 think you will be pleased by his display, his helpful manor, his
 knowledge of the subject and best his reasonable prices. There may be a
 day when all this dries up and the pilgrimage to Tucson will no longer
 be and a subject that we only talk about. As dealers close their doors
 there will be less an less reason to attend the show.

 With all this said I hope no one takes offense as it is not directed at
 any particular party. Rather it is an effort to get some of the other
 attendee's thoughts on the subject and stimulate discussion. While I am
 guilty of attending some of the auctions and understand the allure of
 going to them I still make the rounds to the rooms (as many as I can in
 the time I have) and spend a fair amount with them as well. Part of
 Tucson is the socializing, seeing what all is available from years past,
  and getting an idea of what items may become available in the near
 future. I hope to see others comment and share their thoughts on all of
 this.

 BTW, I do like the idea of scheduling a hotel so we can deal the
 organizers out but don't know the legalities of doing this. I might be
 willing to set up my collection if we ever went this way. Perhaps a show
  could be scheduled in some other town, although I would miss the
 restaurants in Tucson. Best!

 --AL Mitterling
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Re: [meteorite-list] Blaine Reed Tucson Notes AD

2007-02-22 Thread tracy latimer

The one and only year I have been able to attend the Tucson show so far, I 
was fortuante enough to make Blaine's room one of my first stops, and I 
still have (and will treasure!) the small slice of Imilac I got from him.  
The auctions are nice, and I met twice as many people there as I did by just 
cruising around, but usually auction prices seem to drift out of my reach.  
Auctions are for showpieces and rarities, the dinner-plate size slice of 
Brahin that will become the focus of a collection, and as such, it becomes a 
choice between several smaller pieces or one show-stopping number from an 
auction.

The biggest hurdle I found to my buying/collecting/visiting was trying to 
track down where all the meteorite dealers were located.  Once I had done 
that, then I had to drive all over creation to visit individual seller's 
rooms scattered all over Tucson.  Many meteorite people come to Tucson 
exclusively to talk story with all the other meteorite collectors and 
dealers.  Maybe it would be beneficial for as many sellers as possible to 
congregate in one or two venues.  I know I would much rather spend time 
looking at Lunars and other rare achondrites than driving, parking, paying 
for parking... you get the idea.  Also, if most of the dealers are at one or 
two hotels, going to the management of that hotel and saying We would like 
to rent out your restaurant for a party on this evening, and 20% of the 
people who are staying here will attend gives you a lot more buying power 
suddenly.

JMHO and 2 cents.
Tracy Latimer

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Re: [meteorite-list] [SPAM] Re: Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find

2007-02-22 Thread Moni Waiblinger


Hi All,

so I am wondering, what if Larry's meteorite is one of the Venus Stones?
Guess then all the little fragments he is selling off, will have a different 
name?

Not Holbrook meteorite?
Can some one clarify this for me?
Is Bob Haag's meteorite classified as such, Venus Stone?

With best regards,
Moni



From: DNAndrews [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] [SPAM] Re:  Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find
Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 22:16:25 -0700


They say Holbrook is the product of two breakups, one
after the other, when the largest fragment then re-fragmented
again.


Hi Sterling,
Yes, according to the original Holbrook Argus newspaper articles right
after the fall, there were two detonations.  My theory is that the first
landed at the Holbrook strewnfield.  The second?  Have you seen/heard
of Bob Haag's Venus Stone?  I know exactly where and how it was found
and have been waiting permission to search the private property.  Even
Bob himself doesn't know how or exactly where it was found (well he
might now, because I told him the story a while back).  The owners of
the land and finders of the stone didn't know what they had and just
gave it to a passer-by who in turn traded it for enough cash to buy
himself a new trailer house.

Just a theory though.
Dave




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[meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag's Venus Stone

2007-02-22 Thread bernd . pauli

Hello Moni and List,

Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Dave Andrews wrote to the List:

Hi List, The Adamana or Venus Stone was found in the Adamana landfill.
Near the Petrified Forest/Painted Desert boundary. (about 15 miles NE of
Holbrook on I-40). Evidently someone just didn't want it anymore or didn't
know what they had. It was found by a rancher target practicing with his
0.22 rifle. With the selling of the piece to Bob, I heard he purchased a
new mobile home to live in. I have one of the casts, and it looks very real.
It looks so real, that I think I'll put it up on eBay with a $15,000 reserve.
(just kidding :o) Regards, Dave


I got one of these casts too many years ago and they do look real!

Best wishes,

Bernd

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Re: [meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag's Venus Stone

2007-02-22 Thread Alexander Seidel

I am also the lucky owner of one of those Venus stone casts from Bob Haag. 
Beautiful! And you know why he called this one the Venus stone..?? :-)

This is one very special nice example of a flight-oriented meteorite, where the 
rule applies: NEVER EVER cut specimen like these just for the sake of getting 
some classification data! Why? Because a cut would destroy the character of 
the piece!

And so we don´t know what´s inside this beautiful meteorite, we can only make 
some assumptions from non-destructive observation.

Alex
Berlin/Germany

  
 Original-Nachricht 
Datum: 22 Feb 2007 18:11:00 UT
Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
CC: 
Betreff: [meteorite-list] Larry\'s Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag\'s 
Venus Stone

 Hello Moni and List,
 
 Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Dave Andrews wrote to the List:
 
 Hi List, The Adamana or Venus Stone was found in the Adamana landfill.
 Near the Petrified Forest/Painted Desert boundary. (about 15 miles NE of
 Holbrook on I-40). Evidently someone just didn't want it anymore or didn't
 know what they had. It was found by a rancher target practicing with his
 0.22 rifle. With the selling of the piece to Bob, I heard he purchased a
 new mobile home to live in. I have one of the casts, and it looks very
 real.
 It looks so real, that I think I'll put it up on eBay with a $15,000
 reserve.
 (just kidding :o) Regards, Dave
 
 
 I got one of these casts too many years ago and they do look real!
 
 Best wishes,
 
 Bernd
 
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Re: [meteorite-list] [SPAM] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag's Venus Stone

Hi Bernd and Moni,
Wow!  Bernd must save everything in his database (which is worth a 
fortune in itself).  Since 1999, I found out that this story is not 
entirely true.  It wasn't found in a landfill as Bob H. mentioned in his 
catalogue.  Instead, it was found in a horse corral when the owners of 
the ranch were cleaning it out.  (So I'm told).  They set it on a fence 
post and a passer-by, (whom will remain nameless for now),  asked if he 
could have it.  The owners just gave it to him.  He then sold it Haag 
for the sum stated below.  Those owners of the ranch (whose wife works 
with my girlfriend) sold it a while ago, but they may be foreclosing on 
it and get the land back.  So this is the scenario I'm hoping for. 

Bob lists his Adamana or Venus Stone as an L6...same as Holbrook.  
Coincidence?  Maybemaybe not.  Plotting it on the map looks quite 
possible to me.

Best,
Dave

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hello Moni and List,

Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Dave Andrews wrote to the List:

Hi List, The Adamana or Venus Stone was found in the Adamana landfill.
Near the Petrified Forest/Painted Desert boundary. (about 15 miles NE of
Holbrook on I-40). Evidently someone just didn't want it anymore or didn't
know what they had. It was found by a rancher target practicing with his
0.22 rifle. With the selling of the piece to Bob, I heard he purchased a
new mobile home to live in. I have one of the casts, and it looks very real.
It looks so real, that I think I'll put it up on eBay with a $15,000 reserve.
(just kidding :o) Regards, Dave


I got one of these casts too many years ago and they do look real!

Best wishes,

Bernd

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Re: [meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and BobHaag's Venus Stone

2007-02-22 Thread R. N. Hartman

Alex wrote NEVER EVER cut specimen like these just for the sake of getting
some classification data! 

Then cut the cast instead.  :=)

(He!He!)

Ron

- Original Message - 
From: Alexander Seidel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 10:34 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and BobHaag's
Venus Stone


I am also the lucky owner of one of those Venus stone casts from Bob Haag.
Beautiful! And you know why he called this one the Venus stone..?? :-)

This is one very special nice example of a flight-oriented meteorite, where
the rule applies: NEVER EVER cut specimen like these just for the sake of
getting some classification data! Why? Because a cut would destroy the
character of the piece!

And so we don´t know what´s inside this beautiful meteorite, we can only
make some assumptions from non-destructive observation.

Alex
Berlin/Germany


 Original-Nachricht 
Datum: 22 Feb 2007 18:11:00 UT
Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
CC:
Betreff: [meteorite-list] Larry\'s Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag\'s
Venus Stone

 Hello Moni and List,

 Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Dave Andrews wrote to the List:

 Hi List, The Adamana or Venus Stone was found in the Adamana landfill.
 Near the Petrified Forest/Painted Desert boundary. (about 15 miles NE of
 Holbrook on I-40). Evidently someone just didn't want it anymore or didn't
 know what they had. It was found by a rancher target practicing with his
 0.22 rifle. With the selling of the piece to Bob, I heard he purchased a
 new mobile home to live in. I have one of the casts, and it looks very
 real.
 It looks so real, that I think I'll put it up on eBay with a $15,000
 reserve.
 (just kidding :o) Regards, Dave


 I got one of these casts too many years ago and they do look real!

 Best wishes,

 Bernd

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Re: [meteorite-list] [SPAM] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag's Venus Stone

2007-02-22 Thread Alexander Seidel

Now this is what John Blennert wrote in another forum in July 2005, I just 
found this via google:

Although Bob Haag won't cut a large enough piece off the Adamana mass to 
properly be tested it is classed as an L5 by guess I think . The piece 
originated by a rancher who dug up some dirt at the Goodman exit area to spead 
in his barn or corrals. His ranch is in Adamana and the piece was discovered 
while spreading the dirt. It sat on a fence pole as a curiosity for quite some 
time before Bob bought it . The Adamana could be the nose cone to the Holbrook 
L6 strewnfield since that was the direction of the fall. Bob bieng very clever 
knows the piece has more value as an individual then as an oriented piece of a 
known fall !! I think !! Happy Huntin John B.

Best wishes,
Alex
Berlin/Germany


 Original-Nachricht 
Datum: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:48:22 -0700
Von: DNAndrews [EMAIL PROTECTED]
An: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] [SPAM] Larry\'s Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob  
Haag\'s Venus Stone

 Hi Bernd and Moni,
 Wow!  Bernd must save everything in his database (which is worth a 
 fortune in itself).  Since 1999, I found out that this story is not 
 entirely true.  It wasn't found in a landfill as Bob H. mentioned in his 
 catalogue.  Instead, it was found in a horse corral when the owners of 
 the ranch were cleaning it out.  (So I'm told).  They set it on a fence 
 post and a passer-by, (whom will remain nameless for now),  asked if he 
 could have it.  The owners just gave it to him.  He then sold it Haag 
 for the sum stated below.  Those owners of the ranch (whose wife works 
 with my girlfriend) sold it a while ago, but they may be foreclosing on 
 it and get the land back.  So this is the scenario I'm hoping for. 
 
 Bob lists his Adamana or Venus Stone as an L6...same as Holbrook.  
 Coincidence?  Maybemaybe not.  Plotting it on the map looks quite 
 possible to me.
 
 Best,
 Dave
 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Hello Moni and List,
 
 Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Dave Andrews wrote to the List:
 
 Hi List, The Adamana or Venus Stone was found in the Adamana landfill.
 Near the Petrified Forest/Painted Desert boundary. (about 15 miles NE of
 Holbrook on I-40). Evidently someone just didn't want it anymore or
 didn't
 know what they had. It was found by a rancher target practicing with his
 0.22 rifle. With the selling of the piece to Bob, I heard he purchased a
 new mobile home to live in. I have one of the casts, and it looks very
 real.
 It looks so real, that I think I'll put it up on eBay with a $15,000
 reserve.
 (just kidding :o) Regards, Dave
 
 
 I got one of these casts too many years ago and they do look real!
 
 Best wishes,
 
 Bernd
 
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Re: [meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag's Venus Stone

HeheheJohnny B should know better than to listen to me.   ;-)   That 
story was conveyed to me by a person who lived in Adamana a few years 
ago.  He has since passed away.  Also, it's the Goodwater area instead 
of Goodman.  Anyway, this gentleman told me that they used some of the 
old railroad base as fill for their corral.  I really don't think this 
is the case now as that would be all cinders and the owners tell me 
differently.

Bob Haag told me that the Adamana stone is an L6 and much older than the 
Holbrook fall.  But if it was in a horse corral with horses, seems as if 
that would age a meteorite quite differently?
Still all just speculation for now.
Dave (who removed the SPAM from the subject line  ;-)

Alexander Seidel wrote:

Now this is what John Blennert wrote in another forum in July 2005, I just 
found this via google:

Although Bob Haag won't cut a large enough piece off the Adamana mass to 
properly be tested it is classed as an L5 by guess I think . The piece 
originated by a rancher who dug up some dirt at the Goodman exit area to spead 
in his barn or corrals. His ranch is in Adamana and the piece was discovered 
while spreading the dirt. It sat on a fence pole as a curiosity for quite some 
time before Bob bought it . The Adamana could be the nose cone to the Holbrook 
L6 strewnfield since that was the direction of the fall. Bob bieng very clever 
knows the piece has more value as an individual then as an oriented piece of a 
known fall !! I think !! Happy Huntin John B.

Best wishes,
Alex
Berlin/Germany


  


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Re: [meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag's Venus Stone

2007-02-22 Thread Moni Waiblinger


Hi All again,

I am so under the weather with another relapse of a very bad cold!
Anyway, thank you for all your input.
I still wonder if Larry's might be related to Bob Haag's meteorite, Adamana.

http://www.nuggetshooter.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=4794

Didn't he mention that it looks very different from an ordinary Holbrook 
meteorites with lots of chondrules and being exposed after many years.

Is this what the Adamana looks like?
Lots of chondrules?
But guess even if Larry has his classified, we will never know if it is 
paired with Bob's, right! ;-)


Back to the couch,
Moni




From: DNAndrews [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob 
Haag's Venus Stone

Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 12:47:33 -0700

HeheheJohnny B should know better than to listen to me.   ;-)   That
story was conveyed to me by a person who lived in Adamana a few years
ago.  He has since passed away.  Also, it's the Goodwater area instead
of Goodman.  Anyway, this gentleman told me that they used some of the
old railroad base as fill for their corral.  I really don't think this
is the case now as that would be all cinders and the owners tell me
differently.

Bob Haag told me that the Adamana stone is an L6 and much older than the
Holbrook fall.  But if it was in a horse corral with horses, seems as if
that would age a meteorite quite differently?
Still all just speculation for now.
Dave (who removed the SPAM from the subject line  ;-)



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Re: [meteorite-list] [SPAM] Re: Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag's Venus Stone

Hi Moni,
No, it isn't related to Bob Haag's piece other than it could possibly 
be from the same fall.  Larry's find was a whole individual (some 
fragmentation) and it looked exactly like a Holbrook meteorite to 
me...only BIG!  It has the same small, dark chondrules in a light matrix 
as a typical Holbrook.  The crust looked the same as a typical Holbrook 
tooonly BIG!  ;-)

Best,
Dave

Moni Waiblinger wrote:

 Hi All again,

 I am so under the weather with another relapse of a very bad cold!
 Anyway, thank you for all your input.
 I still wonder if Larry's might be related to Bob Haag's meteorite, 
 Adamana.

 http://www.nuggetshooter.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=4794

 Didn't he mention that it looks very different from an ordinary 
 Holbrook meteorites with lots of chondrules and being exposed after 
 many years.
 Is this what the Adamana looks like?
 Lots of chondrules?
 But guess even if Larry has his classified, we will never know if it 
 is paired with Bob's, right! ;-)

 Back to the couch,
 Moni

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Re: [meteorite-list] [SPAM] Re: Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob Haag's Venus Stone

2007-02-22 Thread Ruben Garcia

Hi all,
I only saw tiny fragments of Larrys find (pieces my
friend Earl dug out of the very same hole) but they
were typical Holbrook. Also it was right in the middle
of the Holbrook Strewn Field and nowhere near the
Adamana find.

Ruben

Ruben Garcia
Phoenix, Arizona
http://www.mr-meteorite.com


 

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Re: [meteorite-list] Sikhote-Alin Picture of the Day - February 22, 2007

2007-02-22 Thread Gerald Flaherty

Also known a fly now, duck later
Jerry Flaherty
- Original Message - 
From: Jeff Kuyken [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Pete Pete [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 
meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 7:02 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Sikhote-Alin Picture of the Day - February 
22,2007


 Hi Pete,

 It's a very interesting piece with quite a unique 'crater'. It appears 
 that
 it may have been a double impact or possibly the result of a jagged 
 shrapnel
 fragment impacting the individual. Anyone on the list a ballistic expert?
 ;-)

 http://www.meteorites.com.au/features/funkysa.html

 Cheers,

 Jeff Kuyken
 Meteorites Australia
 www.meteorites.com.au




 - Original Message -
 From: Pete Pete
 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
 Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 9:38 PM
 Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Sikhote-Alin Picture of the Day - February
 22,2007


 Very cool!
 Is this a double impact? It looks like another rim within the larger 
 crater.

 Cheers,
 Pete




 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
 Subject: [meteorite-list] Sikhote-Alin Picture of the Day - February 22,
 2007
 Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 22:14:12 EST

 http://www.spacerocksinc.com/February_22.html

 BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free
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Re: [meteorite-list] Nitol

2007-02-22 Thread Gerald Flaherty

or the ol is the read end of alcohol maybe because it's at the end of Nitol
Jerry Flaherty
  - Original Message - 
  From: D 
  To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com 
  Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 10:51 PM
  Subject: [meteorite-list] Nitol

  Been reading some posts regarding etching I believe the term from the 
science of metallography is Nital...NOT Nitol. The al is the first part of 
alcohol, just as the Nit is the first part of Nitric. This incorrect 
terminology has been perpetuated for some time now.

  F.

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Re: [meteorite-list] the lunar meeorite from morocco

2007-02-22 Thread Armando Afonso

Hehe...
Any doubts about meteorite classification can be easily solved contacting 
Michael Farmer...
He knows nothing about petrography, mineralogy, never heard about isotopes, 
but can identify anything by sight!
The only side effect is the resulting thousands of insults and fisical 
menaces, but it is so funny...
AA

- Original Message - 
From: M come Meteorite Meteorites [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 5:08 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] the lunar meeorite from morocco


and if this is a lunar meteorite I am Mother Teresa of
Calcutta

Matteo

--- adrar fossile [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto:

 there all members of list .

   i'm mohamed ait ouzrou , from morocco i think that
 majorite of list know me ,
   so in the link below are some wonder  pieces if
 some one like them can contact me ,
   in the adress email  [EMAIL PROTECTED]




http://www.4shared.com/file/10828031/925d185c/lunar_meteorites_for_sale.html

   good health to all list ,
   Mohamed ait ouzrou


 -
  Découvrez une nouvelle façon d'obtenir des réponses
 à toutes vos questions ! Profitez des connaissances,
 des opinions et des expériences des internautes sur
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M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato
Via Triestina 126/A - 30173 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it
Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info
MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com
EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/






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[meteorite-list] Update; Muonionalusta homepage

2007-02-22 Thread Thomas Österberg

Dear members of the Meteorite-list,

Would like to inform you about a recent update of our web-site: 
www.muonionalustameteorites.com

We have added some newly taken pictures from recent finds (summer 2006), 
including two large individuals. Inquiries are welcome! 

Have fun!

Thomas Osterberg, Daniel Svensson


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Re: [meteorite-list] Old Woman Meteorite

2007-02-22 Thread greg stanley

Hi All:
   
  A friend of mine who lives near Washington DC actualy cut the Old Woman 
meteorite.  I remember it very well; it was the late 70's and when we got 
together, he would tell me how they cut it (with a wire) and it took months.  I 
also remember him telling me that Diamonds where found in meteorites - this 
really surprized me at the time.
   
  His name is Tim Rose and he is pictured standing next to a recently (cut) Old 
Woman meteorite in the book Rocks from Outer Space.  It was pretty wild to 
see a friend pictured in a book.
   
  I have not talked to him in many years; I've lost touch through the years.  
We would go rock and mineral hunting as well as spelunking. 
   
  Last May I began hunting meteorites in California and have done a lot of 
reading - I find the entire subject very interesting.
   
  I need to look my friend up and see what he remembers regarding Old Woman.
   
  -Greg Stanley 
   
   
   
   
   
   finders were David Friburg, Mike Jendruczak and Hack Harwood.

http://www.meteoritearticles.com/znp06191977.html

And there was no reward for them??

The Smithsonian did offer them a reward, but it was far less then the $1 
million they wanted. The finders took the position it was a million or 
nothingand got nothing.

I have at least 100 Old Woman NPA's in my archive, of which only a few are 
listed here:

http://www.meteoritearticles.com/znpoldwoman.html

Clear Skies,
Mark


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Re: [meteorite-list] the lunar meeorite from morocco

2007-02-22 Thread Armando Afonso

Hehe...
Any doubts about meteorite classification can be easily solved contacting 
Michael Farmer...
He knows nothing about petrography, mineralogy, never heard about isotopes, 
but can identify anything by sight!
The only side effect is the resulting thousands of insults and fisical 
menaces, but it is so funny...
AA
- Original Message - 
From: M come Meteorite Meteorites [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 5:08 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] the lunar meeorite from morocco


and if this is a lunar meteorite I am Mother Teresa of
Calcutta

Matteo

--- adrar fossile [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto:

 there all members of list .

   i'm mohamed ait ouzrou , from morocco i think that
 majorite of list know me ,
   so in the link below are some wonder  pieces if
 some one like them can contact me ,
   in the adress email  [EMAIL PROTECTED]




http://www.4shared.com/file/10828031/925d185c/lunar_meteorites_for_sale.html

   good health to all list ,
   Mohamed ait ouzrou


 -
  Découvrez une nouvelle façon d'obtenir des réponses
 à toutes vos questions ! Profitez des connaissances,
 des opinions et des expériences des internautes sur
 Yahoo! Questions/Réponses.
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M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato
Via Triestina 126/A - 30173 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it
Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info
MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com
EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/






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[meteorite-list] Peruvian fall Feb 3, 2004 - crater pictures

List,
   
  Anyone interested in pictures of the crater can e-mail me.
   
   
  Randall

 
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Re: [meteorite-list] Nitol

2007-02-22 Thread Frank Prochaska

Actually, the ol is from the last two letters of alcohol, not the first, and 
I believe comes from the common short hand abbreviation used for alcohol in 
various scientific and medical disciplines.  I've never seen nital used, in 
college or since, though as long as everyone knows what we're talking about, I 
doubt it matters.
   
   
   
  Frank Prochaska
   
   
   
   

 
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[meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly warning to hunters that may be considering...

Information is expected to be released in April on the Earth Impact Database 
that will give the exact coordinates to the Peruvian meteorite crater. I have 
been warned that meteorite hunters will want to turn this site upside down.  If 
anyone wishes to hunt at this site please contact me and we can discuss.
   
  Should anyone think about hunting without contacting me. I want you to 
understand that
  I have paperwork filing with the Peruvian government giving me mining 
concession rights to the crater and 100 sq. hectares surrounding the crater. It 
is a routine matter and approval is expected soon. Even with paperwork pending 
I still have legal rights here in Peru. I am serious about wanting to keep this 
crater in pristine condition until scientists have had the opportunity to study 
it in detail.
   
  Peruvian law has very strict laws concerning trespassing, especially when it 
concerns mines. I will not hesitate to prosecute and trust me, American jails 
would be considered luxury resorts compared to South American jails. Your 
sustenance will consist of beans, potatoes, and rice and maybe a piece of 
chicken if you're lucky. You might get 1 piece of fruit per week. You will have 
to drink the local water. Diarrhea will be your constant companion. I guarantee 
you will have non-stop nightmares all night every night. I know the system and 
I will make every attempt to lengthen your stay. There are ways to block your 
attempts to contact the American embassy.
   
  There is currently a standing reward for reporting to the police, any 
meteorite hunter that may wander into this area. The reward is equivalent to  6 
months income for most of the poor people of this area. They are now watchful 
and vigilant.  The towns of Aplao and Castillo are small. Everybody knows 
everybody and I have many friends in each. All relevant police agencies have 
been notified by my Peruvian attorney.
   
  My advice, don't even think about it. Alternatively, if you want to hunt at 
the crater, I am open to discussion, but only after scientific studies have 
been completed.
   
  Randall

 
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[meteorite-list] Peruvian fall Feb 3, 2004 - crater pictures

List,
   
  Anyone interested in pictures of the crater can e-mail me.
   
   
  Randall

  
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Re: [meteorite-list] meteorites for sale (azrou)

2007-02-22 Thread M come Meteorite Meteorites

no we are not interested

Matteo

--- adrar fossile [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto:

 dear list's members , 
   i have some meteorites for sale if some on is i
 nterested can contact me soon , 
   these are my information , ;

   my full name is AIT OUZROU MOHAMED 
   MY EAMILS ARE :
[EMAIL PROTECTED]AND 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]  AND
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]   AND
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
   THESE ARE MY EMAILS .
   AND THE NAME OF MY SHOP LA ROSE DE SABLE .
   AND MY FONE NUMBER IS +21211417997 
 
   
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M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato
Via Triestina 126/A - 30173 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it 
Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info
MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com
EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/






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[meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly warning to hunters that may be considering...

Information is expected to be released in April on the Earth Impact Database 
that will give the exact coordinates to the Peruvian meteorite crater. I have 
been warned that meteorite hunters will want to turn this site upside down.  If 
anyone wishes to hunt at this site please contact me and we can discuss.
   
  Should anyone think about hunting without contacting me. I want you to 
understand that
  I have paperwork filing with the Peruvian government giving me mining 
concession rights to the crater and 100 sq. hectares surrounding the crater. It 
is a routine matter and approval is expected soon. Even with paperwork pending 
I still have legal rights here in Peru. I am serious about wanting to keep this 
crater in pristine condition until scientists have had the opportunity to study 
it in detail.
   
  Peruvian law has very strict laws concerning trespassing, especially when it 
concerns mines. I will not hesitate to prosecute and trust me, American jails 
would be considered luxury resorts compared to South American jails. Your 
sustenance will consist of beans, potatoes, and rice and maybe a piece of 
chicken if you're lucky. You might get 1 piece of fruit per week. You will have 
to drink the local water. Diarrhea will be your constant companion. I guarantee 
you will have non-stop nightmares all night every night. I know the system and 
I will make every attempt to lengthen your stay. There are ways to block your 
attempts to contact the American embassy.
   
  There is currently a standing reward for reporting to the police, any 
meteorite hunter that may wander into this area. The reward is equivalent to  6 
months income for most of the poor people of this area. They are now watchful 
and vigilant.  The towns of Aplao and Castillo are small. Everybody knows 
everybody and I have many friends in each. All relevant police agencies have 
been notified by my Peruvian attorney.
   
  My advice, don't even think about it. Alternatively, if you want to hunt at 
the crater, I am open to discussion, but only after scientific studies have 
been completed.
   
  Randall

 
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Re: [meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and BobHaag's Venus Stone

2007-02-22 Thread Mike Jensen


Hi
Here is an image of the cast of the Venus Stone from Bob's site.
http://www.meteoriteman.com/graphics/venus.jpg

He sells them for $100 each. My brother and I both picked up one at the
Tucson show this year. If I remember correctly he said those were the last
ones he had for sale. But you might email him to see if he has any more for
sale.
http://www.meteoriteman.com/misc.htm

Mike
--
Mike Jensen
Jensen Meteorites
16730 E Ada PL
Aurora, CO 80017-3137
303-337-4361
IMCA 4264
website: www.jensenmeteorites.com

On 2/22/07, R. N. Hartman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


Alex wrote NEVER EVER cut specimen like these just for the sake of
getting
some classification data! 

Then cut the cast instead.  :=)

(He!He!)

Ron

- Original Message -
From: Alexander Seidel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 10:34 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and
BobHaag's
Venus Stone


I am also the lucky owner of one of those Venus stone casts from Bob Haag.
Beautiful! And you know why he called this one the Venus stone..?? :-)

This is one very special nice example of a flight-oriented meteorite,
where
the rule applies: NEVER EVER cut specimen like these just for the sake of
getting some classification data! Why? Because a cut would destroy the
character of the piece!

And so we don´t know what´s inside this beautiful meteorite, we can only
make some assumptions from non-destructive observation.

Alex
Berlin/Germany


 Original-Nachricht 
Datum: 22 Feb 2007 18:11:00 UT
Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
CC:
Betreff: [meteorite-list] Larry\'s Holbrook Holy Grail Find and Bob
Haag\'s
Venus Stone

 Hello Moni and List,

 Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Dave Andrews wrote to the List:

 Hi List, The Adamana or Venus Stone was found in the Adamana landfill.
 Near the Petrified Forest/Painted Desert boundary. (about 15 miles NE of
 Holbrook on I-40). Evidently someone just didn't want it anymore or
didn't
 know what they had. It was found by a rancher target practicing with his
 0.22 rifle. With the selling of the piece to Bob, I heard he purchased a
 new mobile home to live in. I have one of the casts, and it looks very
 real.
 It looks so real, that I think I'll put it up on eBay with a $15,000
 reserve.
 (just kidding :o) Regards, Dave


 I got one of these casts too many years ago and they do look real!

 Best wishes,

 Bernd

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[meteorite-list] venus meteorite and holbrook

2007-02-22 Thread justin weippert

I heard the same story from dave andrew when we were hunting for them in 
holbrook. Is there anyway to tell if the have the same stone chrondrules and 
age? I know the meteorite is 4.5 billion years old but can you determine the 
age of the fall? I think there related in the same fall..justin weippert 
showlow, az

 
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Re: [meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly warning to hunters that may be considering...

A rather dark post Randall.

Gary

On 21 Feb 2007 at 18:44, Randall Gregory wrote:

 
 Information is expected to be released in April on the Earth Impact 
 Databasethat will 
 give the exact coordinates to the Peruvian meteorite crater. I have been 
 warned that 
 meteorite hunters will want to turn this site upside down. If anyone wishes 
 to hunt at 
 this site please contact me and we can discuss. 
 
 Should anyone think about hunting without contacting me. I want you to 
 understand that 
 I have paperwork filing with the Peruvian government giving me mining 
 concession rights 
 to the crater and 100 sq. hectares surrounding the crater. It is a routine 
 matter and 
 approval is expected soon. Even with paperwork pending I still have legal 
 rights here in 
 Peru. I am serious about wanting to keep this crater in pristine condition 
 until 
 scientists have had the opportunity to study it in detail. 
 
 Peruvian law has very strict laws concerning trespassing, especially when it 
 concerns 
 mines. I will not hesitate to prosecute and trust me, American jails would be 
 considered 
 luxury resorts compared to South American jails. Your sustenance will consist 
 of beans, 
 potatoes, and rice and maybe a piece of chicken if you're lucky.You might get 
 1 piece of 
 fruit per week. You will have to drink the local water. Diarrhea will be your 
 constant 
 companion. I guarantee you will have non-stop nightmares all night every 
 night. I know 
 the system and I will make every attempt to lengthen your stay. There are 
 ways to block 
 your attempts to contact the American embassy. 
 
 There is currently astanding rewardforreporting to the police, any meteorite 
 hunter 
 that may wander into this area.The reward is equivalent to 6 months income 
 formost of 
 thepoor people of this area. They arenow watchful and vigilant.The towns of 
 Aplao and 
 Castillo are small. Everybody knows everybody and I have many friends in 
 each. All 
 relevant police agencies have been notified by my Peruvian attorney. 
 
 My advice, don't even think about it. Alternatively, if you want to hunt at 
 the crater, I 
 am open to discussion, but only after scientific studies have been completed. 
 
 Randall 
 
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Re: [meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly warning to hunters that may be considering...

I think so too.  A warning like this is sure to gain friends and influence 
people.  lol

Gary

On 22 Feb 2007 at 18:14, Dave Freeman mjwy wrote:

 
 Dear Gary;
 I kind of thought that maybe he should live a lonely life as his scare tactic 
 would 
 warrent that all meteorite persons would stay away from such a crabby 
 appleton!
 His crater and the Peruvian government may be his ONLY FRIENDS!
 df
 Gary K. Foote wrote:
 
 A rather dark post Randall.
 
 Gary
 
 On 21 Feb 2007 at 18:44, Randall Gregory wrote:
 
   
 
 
 Information is expected to be released in April on the Earth Impact 
 Databasethat will 
 give the exact coordinates to the Peruvian meteorite crater. I have been 
 warned that 
 meteorite hunters will want to turn this site upside down. If anyone 
 wishes to hunt at 
 this site please contact me and we can discuss. 
 
 Should anyone think about hunting without contacting me. I want you to 
 understand that 
 I have paperwork filing with the Peruvian government giving me mining 
 concession rights 
 to the crater and 100 sq. hectares surrounding the crater. It is a 
 routine matter and 
 approval is expected soon. Even with paperwork pending I still have legal 
 rights here in 
 Peru. I am serious about wanting to keep this crater in pristine 
 condition until 
 scientists have had the opportunity to study it in detail. 
 
 Peruvian law has very strict laws concerning trespassing, especially when 
 it concerns 
 mines. I will not hesitate to prosecute and trust me, American jails 
 would be considered 
 luxury resorts compared to South American jails. Your sustenance will 
 consist of beans, 
 potatoes, and rice and maybe a piece of chicken if you're lucky.You might 
 get 1 piece of 
 fruit per week. You will have to drink the local water. Diarrhea will be 
 your constant 
 companion. I guarantee you will have non-stop nightmares all night every 
 night. I know 
 the system and I will make every attempt to lengthen your stay. There are 
 ways to block 
 your attempts to contact the American embassy. 
 
 There is currently astanding rewardforreporting to the police, any 
 meteorite hunter 
 that may wander into this area.The reward is equivalent to 6 months 
 income formost of 
 thepoor people of this area. They arenow watchful and vigilant.The towns 
 of Aplao and 
 Castillo are small. Everybody knows everybody and I have many friends in 
 each. All 
 relevant police agencies have been notified by my Peruvian attorney. 
 
 My advice, don't even think about it. Alternatively, if you want to hunt 
 at the crater, I 
 am open to discussion, but only after scientific studies have been 
 completed. 
 
 Randall 
 
 No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
 with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started. 
 
 
 
 
 
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[meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire

Though the tale has not yet unfolded fully, here is where we stand to date, 
along with 
some photos...

http://www.meteorite-dealers.com/nhmet.html

More to come as we continue our search.

Gary
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[meteorite-list] FW: SSA - Announcement of Opportunity: STS-118 Downlinks

2007-02-22 Thread Greg Redfern

Hello List,

  Would you be so kind as to pass this on to schools in your area? This
is a significant opportunity for our kids to partake in history.

Thank you.

Greg Redfern
NASA JPL Solar System Ambassador
http://www2.jpl.nasa.gov/ambassador/index.html
WHAT'S UP?: THE SPACE PLACE
http://www.wtopnews.com/?sid=600113nid=421


-Original Message-
From: Solar System Ambassador 
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 2:41 PM
To: Recipient list suppressed
Subject: SSA - Announcement of Opportunity: STS-118 Downlinks
Importance: High

Please share this information with anyone you know who may be 
interested in the opportunity...

NASA is seeking formal and informal education institutions and 
organizations individually or working together, to host live, 
in-flight education downlinks during STS-118, the first flight of an 
Educator Astronaut, Barbara Morgan. The launch is scheduled for no 
earlier than June 28, 2007. The deadline to submit an application for 
STS-118 downlinks is March 9, 2007.

The Announcement of Opportunity is available on the NASA Education 
website http://education.nasa.gov/


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Re: [meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly warning tohunters that may be considering...

2007-02-22 Thread Howard Steffic

Threats like this make me want to run right down there just to prove I could 
get away with it.


Howard Steffic





From: Randall Gregory [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly warning 
tohunters that may be considering...
Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 18:44:34 -0800 (PST)

Information is expected to be released in April on the Earth Impact 
Database that will give the exact coordinates to the Peruvian meteorite 
crater. I have been warned that meteorite hunters will want to turn this 
site upside down.  If anyone wishes to hunt at this site please contact me 
and we can discuss.

   Should anyone think about hunting without contacting me. I want you to 
understand that
   I have paperwork filing with the Peruvian government giving me mining 
concession rights to the crater and 100 sq. hectares surrounding the 
crater. It is a routine matter and approval is expected soon. Even with 
paperwork pending I still have legal rights here in Peru. I am serious 
about wanting to keep this crater in pristine condition until scientists 
have had the opportunity to study it in detail.

   Peruvian law has very strict laws concerning trespassing, especially 
when it concerns mines. I will not hesitate to prosecute and trust me, 
American jails would be considered luxury resorts compared to South 
American jails. Your sustenance will consist of beans, potatoes, and rice 
and maybe a piece of chicken if you're lucky. You might get 1 piece of 
fruit per week. You will have to drink the local water. Diarrhea will be 
your constant companion. I guarantee you will have non-stop nightmares all 
night every night. I know the system and I will make every attempt to 
lengthen your stay. There are ways to block your attempts to contact the 
American embassy.

   There is currently a standing reward for reporting to the police, any 
meteorite hunter that may wander into this area. The reward is equivalent 
to  6 months income for most of the poor people of this area. They are now 
watchful and vigilant.  The towns of Aplao and Castillo are small. 
Everybody knows everybody and I have many friends in each. All relevant 
police agencies have been notified by my Peruvian attorney.

   My advice, don't even think about it. Alternatively, if you want to hunt 
at the crater, I am open to discussion, but only after scientific studies 
have been completed.

   Randall


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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire

Hi, Gary, List

I don't want to throw cold water on this possibility
(plenty of that already), but every winter, there's one
or more did a meteorite land in a pond/lake stories
that pop up on the List. There was a long-lasting thread
back in Jan., 2001, about a lake in Finland (where,
incidentally, there are many meteorite in a lake/pond
stories, none of which ever panned out with a rock).

There are so many things that can make a hole
in an icy pond. The ice is obviously quite thick now.
How thick was it when the hole appeared? The fact that
the hole is in the center (more or less) is always a
suspicious piece of data. Lakes and ponds freeze from
the shallow shore to the deep center, in that order. The
center (or the deepest spot) is always the last place to
freeze and the ice is always thinnest there.

This creates a mental trap for the unwary pond
crosser, whether they be human or critter. You test the
ice near the edge, as you go out on it and again as you
move away from shore. It is obviously strong enough
to drive a car on; you lose caution and proceed on your
merry way. Pond crossers always go over the center
of the pond because it's the shortest distance and saving
distance is the purpose of the exercise.

Particularly when the temperature drop is recent and
not long-term, you will find lakes and ponds with thick
stampable ice over the shallow margins (and farm ponds
tend to have broad shallows) while in the center sits a
universal invitation to a sudden thermal excursion.

The owner's assertion of no tracks has to be weighed
against the time that may have elapsed, the wind drift factor,
the chance of snow since the incident, and the likelihood
of quick wet prancing (and very annoyed) feet leaving prints.

No hunt for a space rock is ever wasted, though. Alan
Hildebrand, of the MIAC - Prairie Meteorite Search project
in Canada, with very reasonable assumptions, estimates that
~1.4 meteorites 100 g mass occur in each km2 (or about
4.5 meteorites 10 g mass). That's about one 100+ gm
meteorite for every 175 acres, or one 10 gm every 56 acres.
Read:  http://miac.uqac.ca/MIAC/pmsearch.htm

I'm sure that your particles contain meteoritic material;
every open body of water in the world collects cosmic dust!
In fact, Jerry Flaherty posted a story about kids collecting
meteor dust on the night of major meteor showers using
a big flat pan of water. You can also find cosmic stuff
in the muck that lines the bottom of your gutters. Scrape
out your gutters, put the gunk in a plastic bucket, dilute
with water, drag a supermagnet through it, and Voila! Star
Dust.

There's a long list of natural occurances that can punch
holes in new-iced ponds. But one of them is... Meteorite!
My problem is that I can't find any rendition of a meteorite
having been found that way.


Sterling K. Webb

- Original Message - 
From: Gary K. Foote [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 7:41 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire


Though the tale has not yet unfolded fully, here is where we stand to date, 
along with
some photos...

http://www.meteorite-dealers.com/nhmet.html

More to come as we continue our search.

Gary
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[meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire

2007-02-22 Thread Thomas Webb

Hi Gary,
Let's hope your efforts will uncover a new meteorite,
but if they don't, it still makes for an interesting
story. That, plus the possibility of success makes it
well worth the chase!
Thank you very much for the information and the
pictures!
My best,
Thomas


 

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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire

2007-02-22 Thread Dave Freeman mjwy

Not to mention that practice makes perfect! If not this one, maybe the 
nextand it beats sitting around the house dreaming about doing 
something fun!
Dave F
Where meteorite hunting season has reopened for the year.

Thomas Webb wrote:

Hi Gary,
Let's hope your efforts will uncover a new meteorite,
but if they don't, it still makes for an interesting
story. That, plus the possibility of success makes it
well worth the chase!
Thank you very much for the information and the
pictures!
My best,
Thomas


 

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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire

Hi sterling,

First, I realize the odds are against this being a meteoric created hole.  That 
being 
said let me shed some light on some of your questions;

On 22 Feb 2007 at 20:48, Sterling K. Webb wrote:

 The ice is obviously quite thick now.
 How thick was it when the hole appeared? 

It was totally frozen over the and 2 feet+ of snow fell the night that the hole 
appeared. 
 I assume the ice was at least 6 to eight inches thich though we did b=neglect 
to measure 
the depth of ice in the non-modified ice.  :(  Live and learn.


 the hole is in the center (more or less) is always a
 suspicious piece of data. Lakes and ponds freeze from
 the shallow shore to the deep center, in that order. The
 center (or the deepest spot) is always the last place to
 freeze and the ice is always thinnest there.

The pond is only 7 feet deep at the point of the hole and with our regular 
below zero 
weather the center would have been just as frozen as the edges.  In fact, 
around here it 
is at the shores where the ice is thinnest as the warmth of the underlying land 
warms the 
ice and keeps it from freezing as fast as at the deeper points.  Its always 
near the edge 
where people go in thru the ice early in winter - either there or where there 
is a 
current that keeps the water from sitting still enough long enough to freeze as 
rapidly 
the more steady water does.

 Particularly when the temperature drop is recent and
 not long-term, you will find lakes and ponds with thick
 stampable ice over the shallow margins (and farm ponds
 tend to have broad shallows) while in the center sits a
 universal invitation to a sudden thermal excursion.

If there is a tendency to thermal excursion to the center of a shallow pond I'm 
not aware 
of it.  Doesn't mean its not true - just that I've not heard of this 
phenomenon.  I'd be 
interested in anyone's pointers to greater knowledge in this area.  Further, 
this is not 
only a stream fed pond, but a spring fed pond.  the landowner assurred us the 
spring was 
a good 50 feet from the hole.

 The owner's assertion of no tracks has to be weighed
 against the time that may have elapsed, the wind drift factor,
 the chance of snow since the incident, and the likelihood
 of quick wet prancing (and very annoyed) feet leaving prints.

The snow, as stated before, fell on the night of the phenomenon's appearance.   
Maybe 
this is a factor in its appearance.  I just don't know.  I do know it is a 
fairly remote 
area and the landowner has a dog who is kept inside and she and her dog were 
the first 
ones on the scene in the morning.The landowner noted no tracks the very 
next morning. 
It was also clearly noted that there were no footprints anywhere on the pond 
the day we 
arrived seven days later.  Footprints persist in snow until the next snowfall 
and there 
has been no significant snow since, so I feel there had been nobody near the 
area at all.

 No hunt for a space rock is ever wasted, though. Alan
 Hildebrand, of the MIAC - Prairie Meteorite Search project
 in Canada, with very reasonable assumptions, estimates that
 ~1.4 meteorites 100 g mass occur in each km2 (or about
 4.5 meteorites 10 g mass). That's about one 100+ gm
 meteorite for every 175 acres, or one 10 gm every 56 acres.
 Read:  http://miac.uqac.ca/MIAC/pmsearch.htm

This is one of the facts that gives me hope. I must admit to some 
disappointment, but 
like you said, the hunt itself is a worthy learning exercise.

 I'm sure that your particles contain meteoritic material;
 every open body of water in the world collects cosmic dust!
 In fact, Jerry Flaherty posted a story about kids collecting
 meteor dust on the night of major meteor showers using
 a big flat pan of water. You can also find cosmic stuff
 in the muck that lines the bottom of your gutters. Scrape
 out your gutters, put the gunk in a plastic bucket, dilute
 with water, drag a supermagnet through it, and Voila! Star
 Dust.

I remember this post by Jerry.  To avoid being foolde by cos=mic dust we will 
be looking 
for not only visual analysis, but nickel content analysis.  Does cosmic dust 
contain 
nickel in the 'right quantities?  Again I don't know.

 There's a long list of natural occurances that can punch
 holes in new-iced ponds. But one of them is... Meteorite!
 My problem is that I can't find any rendition of a meteorite
 having been found that way.

I know.  wouldn't it be lovely if CJ and I were the first to claim this 
particular find 
method?  The splash patterns of water around the hold are compelling though...

Thanks for your comments and information  Sterling.  We will continue the 
pursuit, though 
the odds seem to be against us at this point.  :)

Gary
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Re: [meteorite-list] [SPAM] Re: Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and BobHaag's Venus Stone

100 bucks now?  They used to be $25 if I remember correctlyhowever I 
have CRS now (Can't Remember S_it).   I remember I bought a slice of 
Esquel from Bob in the late 90's (and not that big of slice either) and 
he through in the cast.  Righteous dude he is.

Dave

Mike Jensen wrote:

 Hi
 Here is an image of the cast of the Venus Stone from Bob's site.
 http://www.meteoriteman.com/graphics/venus.jpg

 He sells them for $100 each. My brother and I both picked up one at 
 the Tucson show this year. If I remember correctly he said those were 
 the last ones he had for sale. But you might email him to see if he 
 has any more for sale.
 http://www.meteoriteman.com/misc.htm

 Mike
 --
 Mike Jensen
 Jensen Meteorites
 16730 E Ada PL
 Aurora, CO 80017-3137
 303-337-4361
 IMCA 4264
 website: www.jensenmeteorites.com http://www.jensenmeteorites.com

 On 2/22/07, R. N. Hartman  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Alex wrote NEVER EVER cut specimen like these just for the sake
 of getting
 some classification data! 

 Then cut the cast instead.  :=)

 (He!He!)

 Ron

 - Original Message -
 From: Alexander Seidel [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED];
 Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
 mailto:Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
 Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 10:34 AM
 Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Larry's Holbrook Holy Grail Find and
 BobHaag's
 Venus Stone


 I am also the lucky owner of one of those Venus stone casts from
 Bob Haag.
 Beautiful! And you know why he called this one the Venus
 stone..?? :-)

 This is one very special nice example of a flight-oriented
 meteorite, where
 the rule applies: NEVER EVER cut specimen like these just for the
 sake of
 getting some classification data! Why? Because a cut would destroy
 the
 character of the piece!

 And so we don´t know what´s inside this beautiful meteorite, we
 can only
 make some assumptions from non-destructive observation.

 Alex
 Berlin/Germany


  Original-Nachricht 
 Datum: 22 Feb 2007 18:11:00 UT
 Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
 mailto:Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
 CC:
 Betreff: [meteorite-list] Larry\'s Holbrook Holy Grail Find and
 Bob Haag\'s
 Venus Stone

  Hello Moni and List,
 
  Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Dave Andrews wrote to the List:
 
  Hi List, The Adamana or Venus Stone was found in the Adamana
 landfill.
  Near the Petrified Forest/Painted Desert boundary. (about 15
 miles NE of
  Holbrook on I-40). Evidently someone just didn't want it anymore
 or didn't
  know what they had. It was found by a rancher target practicing
 with his
  0.22 rifle. With the selling of the piece to Bob, I heard he
 purchased a
  new mobile home to live in. I have one of the casts, and it
 looks very
  real.
  It looks so real, that I think I'll put it up on eBay with a
 $15,000
  reserve.
  (just kidding :o) Regards, Dave
 
 
  I got one of these casts too many years ago and they do look real!
 
  Best wishes,
 
  Bernd
 
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire

2007-02-22 Thread Göran Axelsson

Interesting that you should mention Finland and that no meteorite have 
been found that way. Bjurböle is a name that pops up whenever I hear 
about mysterious holes in ice.
http://www.somerikko.net/old/geo/met/mbjurb_e.htm

But I agree, this one doesn't really sounds like a meteorite and is 
probably caused some other way. The story about the hole getting bigger 
the first day is one part of it. There should also have been chunks of 
ice from the original surface but the central hole looked like it was 
filled by clear ice.
The elongated air bubbles are also common when the ice is freezing over.

We had a number of similar appearances of holes in ice 5-10 years ago 
but none yielded any meteorites.

... but I hope I'm wrong.

Good hunt!

Göran


Sterling K. Webb wrote:
 Hi, Gary, List

 I don't want to throw cold water on this possibility
 (plenty of that already), but every winter, there's one
 or more did a meteorite land in a pond/lake stories
 that pop up on the List. There was a long-lasting thread
 back in Jan., 2001, about a lake in Finland (where,
 incidentally, there are many meteorite in a lake/pond
 stories, none of which ever panned out with a rock).
   

... snip ...

 There's a long list of natural occurances that can punch
 holes in new-iced ponds. But one of them is... Meteorite!
 My problem is that I can't find any rendition of a meteorite
 having been found that way.


 Sterling K. Webb
   
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Re: [meteorite-list] venus meteorite and holbrook

OK...my last post on the subject and then I'm back to perpetual
lurking. Promise! Sorry I couldn't make it hunting Justin, but days
off are scarce these days.

1. Holbrook fall witnesses in 1912 reported 2 detonations...or booms.

2. Adamana is about 8 more miles down the railroad tracks (as the crow
flies) from the Holbrook strewnfield

3. Did one of those detonations make the Holbrook fall and the other
the Adamana? Beats me, but is quite possible.

4. If according to the GoldShooters forum, someone was spotted
specking on the north side of the tracks at Adamana. If so, they
are on PRIVATE property. Even on the south side they are on PRIVATE
property. I for one, would hate to be caught on the Fitzgerald's land
with no permission.

5. Adamana is NOT on the Navajo Reservation (as reported by this
forum), but it is close to the Painted Desert/Petrified Forest National
Park. So is this person at Adamana or Sun Valley?

6. Sun Valley = Holbrook fall. (No Navajo Reservation involved).

7. Adamana = Adamananot Holbrook or Sun Valley.

8. Is Larry's meteorite part of the Adamana meteorite? Looking at my
cast of the Venus Stone there is only a small amount of material
missing from the sides. Not a 1+ kilo chunk of fully crusted meteorite.

9. Is Larry's meteorite related to the Adamana meteorite? Maybe and
maybe not. If so, it is related like a Campo is from the same fall as
the Campos. Good CamposBad Campos.

10. Is Larry's meteorite an Adamana meteorite or a Holbrook meteorite?
It was found in the Holbrook strewnfield and there are no missing pieces
off of the Adamana meteorite that could possibly be that big and fully
crusted.

OKI hope I answered some questions. Back to lurking now...

Dave

justin weippert wrote:

I heard the same story from dave andrew when we were hunting for them
in holbrook. Is there anyway to tell if the have the same stone
chrondrules and age? I know the meteorite is 4.5 billion years old but
can you determine the age of the fall? I think there related in the
same fall..justin weippert showlow, az

Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel
http://travel.yahoo.com/hotelsearchpage;_ylc=X3oDMTFtaTIzNXVjBF9TAzk3NDA3NTg5BF9zAzI3MTk0ODEEcG9zAzIEc2VjA21haWx0YWdsaW5lBHNsawNxMS0wNw--

to find your fit.

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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire

Hi, Gary, List,

Like a clod, I meant to say what a good
page and description of the chase it was
and forgot to. By the time I finished reading
it, my feet were cold and I felt a sudden desire
for hot cocoa.
Your weather is colder than my weather.
And my observations are probably more true
of a winter that bounces back and forth over
the freezing line. We haven't been subzero
(F) for years.
Maybe the dual ice layer is the result of two
freezes, an earlier one that never melted fully
and a later one that couldn't close the gap.
The Earth gets about 400,000 tons of Interplanetary
Dust Particles per year: The earth's surface is
constantly being rained upon by interplanetary
dust particles (IDP's), from a few to several
hundred micrometers in diameter. The mass
distribution of this dust flux peaks at around
200µm (Love and Brownlee, 1993). This dust
is thought to be derived from collisions of
asteroidal material and from comets (e.g.
Kortenkamp and Dermott, 1998). The majority
of IDPs are compositionally similar to
chondritic meteorites (Jessberger et al, 2001),
and quite distinct from crustal rocks on earth.
The exact amount of nickel in cosmic dust
bunnies is the basis of an argument. Earlier high
estimates of how much dust was incoming were
because the nickel content was thought to be
higher than it turned out to be.
But, regardless of the amount, you'll find nickel
in cosmic dust. Just think of it as ground up meteorites,
all kinds together.


Sterling K. Webb

- Original Message - 
From: Gary K. Foote [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 
Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 9:50 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire


Hi sterling,

First, I realize the odds are against this being a meteoric created hole. 
That being
said let me shed some light on some of your questions;

On 22 Feb 2007 at 20:48, Sterling K. Webb wrote:

 The ice is obviously quite thick now.
 How thick was it when the hole appeared?

It was totally frozen over the and 2 feet+ of snow fell the night that the 
hole appeared.
 I assume the ice was at least 6 to eight inches thich though we did 
b=neglect to measure
the depth of ice in the non-modified ice.  :(  Live and learn.


 the hole is in the center (more or less) is always a
 suspicious piece of data. Lakes and ponds freeze from
 the shallow shore to the deep center, in that order. The
 center (or the deepest spot) is always the last place to
 freeze and the ice is always thinnest there.

The pond is only 7 feet deep at the point of the hole and with our regular 
below zero
weather the center would have been just as frozen as the edges.  In fact, 
around here it
is at the shores where the ice is thinnest as the warmth of the underlying 
land warms the
ice and keeps it from freezing as fast as at the deeper points.  Its always 
near the edge
where people go in thru the ice early in winter - either there or where 
there is a
current that keeps the water from sitting still enough long enough to freeze 
as rapidly
the more steady water does.

 Particularly when the temperature drop is recent and
 not long-term, you will find lakes and ponds with thick
 stampable ice over the shallow margins (and farm ponds
 tend to have broad shallows) while in the center sits a
 universal invitation to a sudden thermal excursion.

If there is a tendency to thermal excursion to the center of a shallow pond 
I'm not aware
of it.  Doesn't mean its not true - just that I've not heard of this 
phenomenon.  I'd be
interested in anyone's pointers to greater knowledge in this area.  Further, 
this is not
only a stream fed pond, but a spring fed pond.  the landowner assurred us 
the spring was
a good 50 feet from the hole.

 The owner's assertion of no tracks has to be weighed
 against the time that may have elapsed, the wind drift factor,
 the chance of snow since the incident, and the likelihood
 of quick wet prancing (and very annoyed) feet leaving prints.

The snow, as stated before, fell on the night of the phenomenon's 
appearance.   Maybe
this is a factor in its appearance.  I just don't know.  I do know it is a 
fairly remote
area and the landowner has a dog who is kept inside and she and her dog were 
the first
ones on the scene in the morning.The landowner noted no tracks the very 
next morning.
It was also clearly noted that there were no footprints anywhere on the pond 
the day we
arrived seven days later.  Footprints persist in snow until the next 
snowfall and there
has been no significant snow since, so I feel there had been nobody near the 
area at all.

 No hunt for a space rock is ever wasted, though. Alan
 Hildebrand, of the MIAC - Prairie Meteorite Search project
 in Canada, with very reasonable assumptions, estimates that
 ~1.4 meteorites 100 g mass occur in each km2 (or about
 4.5 meteorites 10 g mass).

Re: [meteorite-list] meteorites for sale (azrou)

2007-02-22 Thread Norbert F. Kammel

Matteo, why do you bring this to the list?

 no we are not interested
Well, Matteo, we can speak for ourselves.

Just my two cents,

Norbert Kammel
IMCA # 3420
www.rocksonfire.com



 M come Meteorite Meteorites [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 no we are not interested
 
 Matteo
 
 --- adrar fossile [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto:
 
  dear list's members , 
i have some meteorites for sale if some on is i
  nterested can contact me soon , 
these are my information , ;
 
my full name is AIT OUZROU MOHAMED 
MY EAMILS ARE :
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]AND 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  AND
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]   AND
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
THESE ARE MY EMAILS .
AND THE NAME OF MY SHOP LA ROSE DE SABLE .
AND MY FONE NUMBER IS +21211417997 
  
  
  -
   DÃ©couvrez une nouvelle faÃ§on d'obtenir des rÃ©ponses
  Ã  toutes vos questions ! Profitez des connaissances,
  des opinions et des expÃ©riences des internautes sur
  Yahoo! Questions/RÃ©ponses.
 __
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 http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
  
 
 
 M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato
 Via Triestina 126/A - 30173 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY
 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it 
 Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info
 MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com
 EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/
 
 
   
 
   
   
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Re: [meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly warning tohunters that may be considering...

2007-02-22 Thread Notkin

Randall Gregory posted:

 I will not hesitate to prosecute and trust me, American jails would 
 be considered luxury resorts compared to South
 American jails. Your sustenance will consist of beans, potatoes, and 
 rice and maybe a piece of chicken if you're lucky. You might get 1 
 piece of fruit per week. You will have to drink the local water. 
 Diarrhea will be your constant companion. I guarantee you will have 
 non-stop nightmares all night every night. I know the system and I 
 will make every attempt to lengthen your stay.


Hey Randall:

Thanks for the travelogue! Most entertaining. You should consider doing 
some travel writing in your spare time. Your style paints a truly 
engaging portrait of the homeland.

Listees: I propose we all add another crackpot to the blocked senders 
list (I just did). What say you? Quite a few on there already, but 
always room for one more   : )

Randall, I recommend that you check out this website. You'll find some 
kindred sprits there:

http://www.bccmeteorites.com


See you in the funny papers,

Geoff N.
www.aerolite.org


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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire

Thanks for the link Goran.  It is most telling that there was no mud on the 
surface of 
the ice.  From your referred webpage;

Meteorite made 4 meter wide hole in the ice and mud was spread over 24 x 33 m 
wide area 
around the hole.

Alo,. the fact that no chunks of ice were found around the hole.  Do you think 
the heat 
or ferocity of a presumed impact might have melted or shattered them to minute 
fragments 
indestinguishable from snow?

  The story about the hole getting bigger 
 the first day is one part of it.

That too disturbs me.  But there are thermal qualities that might have caused 
this.  
Perhaps the suddenly open water, being warmer than the surrounding ice gave the 
hole time 
to enlarge before stunning cold set back in and froze it all back up?  Just 
conjecture.

 We had a number of similar appearances of holes in ice 5-10 years ago 
 but none yielded any meteorites.

I wonder why this time period of 5 to 10 years is so short?  Why not all the 
time?
 
 ... but I hope I'm wrong.

Me too:)

Thanks,

Gary
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire

Sterling,

Hot Cocoa is on me.  lol  I understand now that winters are different 
everywhere and our 
double-digit minus 0 farenheit winters may well cause different conditions than 
where you 
are.  There is no melt-freeze-melt cycle here except ant the beginning and end 
of 
winters.  The rest is all cold, cold, cold.  Odd is the day that is above 
freezing, as 
was the day of our initial hunt.

I plan to speak with some weather observers about the dual levels of ice we 
encountered 
and whether or not they are normal.  Again, my personal knowledge fails me.

As to comic dust being 'identical in nature' to incoming meteorites, that is a 
bridge we 
will have to cross when results are in.  Perhaps we will see some atmospheric 
entry 
features that preclude their being average cosmic dust.  Only the future will 
tell.

I only know that CJ and I had an exciting and wonderful day and hope to repeat 
it as 
often as possible.  Someday we will, I am sure, strike the iron while it is hot 
and find 
a meteorite soon after its fall.  We pray that it will be here in NH as it 
would be 
historic in nature.  But we do plan some trips to desert climes for some more 
traditional 
meteorite hunting.  Picking one up off the ground will certainly get our 
collective 
bloods flowing!

Very Best,

Gary

On 22 Feb 2007 at 22:37, Sterling K. Webb wrote:

 Hi, Gary, List,
 
 Like a clod, I meant to say what a good
 page and description of the chase it was
 and forgot to. By the time I finished reading
 it, my feet were cold and I felt a sudden desire
 for hot cocoa.
 Your weather is colder than my weather.
 And my observations are probably more true
 of a winter that bounces back and forth over
 the freezing line. We haven't been subzero
 (F) for years.
 Maybe the dual ice layer is the result of two
 freezes, an earlier one that never melted fully
 and a later one that couldn't close the gap.
 The Earth gets about 400,000 tons of Interplanetary
 Dust Particles per year: The earth's surface is
 constantly being rained upon by interplanetary
 dust particles (IDP's), from a few to several
 hundred micrometers in diameter. The mass
 distribution of this dust flux peaks at around
 200µm (Love and Brownlee, 1993). This dust
 is thought to be derived from collisions of
 asteroidal material and from comets (e.g.
 Kortenkamp and Dermott, 1998). The majority
 of IDPs are compositionally similar to
 chondritic meteorites (Jessberger et al, 2001),
 and quite distinct from crustal rocks on earth.
 The exact amount of nickel in cosmic dust
 bunnies is the basis of an argument. Earlier high
 estimates of how much dust was incoming were
 because the nickel content was thought to be
 higher than it turned out to be.
 But, regardless of the amount, you'll find nickel
 in cosmic dust. Just think of it as ground up meteorites,
 all kinds together.
 
 
 Sterling K. Webb
 
 - Original Message - 
 From: Gary K. Foote [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 
 Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
 Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 9:50 PM
 Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite in New Hampshire
 
 
 Hi sterling,
 
 First, I realize the odds are against this being a meteoric created hole. 
 That being
 said let me shed some light on some of your questions;
 
 On 22 Feb 2007 at 20:48, Sterling K. Webb wrote:
 
  The ice is obviously quite thick now.
  How thick was it when the hole appeared?
 
 It was totally frozen over the and 2 feet+ of snow fell the night that the 
 hole appeared.
  I assume the ice was at least 6 to eight inches thich though we did 
 b=neglect to measure
 the depth of ice in the non-modified ice.  :(  Live and learn.
 
 
  the hole is in the center (more or less) is always a
  suspicious piece of data. Lakes and ponds freeze from
  the shallow shore to the deep center, in that order. The
  center (or the deepest spot) is always the last place to
  freeze and the ice is always thinnest there.
 
 The pond is only 7 feet deep at the point of the hole and with our regular 
 below zero
 weather the center would have been just as frozen as the edges.  In fact, 
 around here it
 is at the shores where the ice is thinnest as the warmth of the underlying 
 land warms the
 ice and keeps it from freezing as fast as at the deeper points.  Its always 
 near the edge
 where people go in thru the ice early in winter - either there or where 
 there is a
 current that keeps the water from sitting still enough long enough to freeze 
 as rapidly
 the more steady water does.
 
  Particularly when the temperature drop is recent and
  not long-term, you will find lakes and ponds with thick
  stampable ice over the shallow margins (and farm ponds
  tend to have broad shallows) while in the center sits a
  universal invitation to a sudden thermal excursion.
 
 If there is a tendency to thermal excursion to the center of a shallow pond

Re: [meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly warning to hunters that may be considering...

Randall,

I would invite people to help out - not turn them away with threats of being 
arrested.  
Heck, I'll do that now.  If anyone wants to come along on the New Hampshire 
meteorite 
hunt please do.  We'll post dates and times of when we'll be there so everyone 
can come 
along!

Come one - come all!

Gary

On 22 Feb 2007 at 20:56, Randall Gregory wrote:

 
 Gary, 
 
 I was told that hunters would turn the place up-side down. You know some 
 people would, 
 without respect for anything. Do I have to remind you? 
 http://www.azstarnet.com/gemshow01/0202.html 
 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1324361.stm 
 http://www.rockhounds.com/tucsonshow/reports/tucson96/snapsh12.shtm 
 http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb3418/is_199708/ai_n8179903 
 http://www.sciencemag.org/content/vol277/issue5328/r-samples.dtl 
 http://www.sciencemag.org/content/vol277/issue5328/r-samples.dtl 
 http://www.umich.edu/~urecord/9899/Oct21_98/16.htm 
 http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=48724 
 http://www.meteorite.com/missing_stolen.html 
 
 
 Gem show briefs 
 Dealer robbed 2nd year in row 
 Five gemstones worth as much as $130,000 were reported stolen from a dealer 
 at a gem show 
 at the Best Western Executive Inn, 333 W. Drachman St. 
 Owner Alijohn Nourestani was having breakfast on Sunday within view of his 
 display of 
 tourmaline gemstones when five pieces were stolen, he said yesterday 
 The showcase for his business, Nourestan Gems  Minerals - The Miners of Fine 
 Tourmaline, 
 was draped with a sheet when the theft took place, police were told. 
 Nourestani, who has homes in Afghanistan and New Mexico, said yesterday that 
 at the same 
 show last year, he had several tourmaline gemstones stolen that were valued 
 at between 
 $8,000 and $10,000. He also had friends who had goods that were stolen, he 
 said. 
 I've been coming to the gem show in Tucson for 17 years, he said. I love 
 Tucson. But 
 we'd like the city to know we have problems. There are gangsters in Tucson. 
 Police described the suspect as a 5-foot-7-inch man, about 165 pounds and 
 wearing a 
 flannel shirt and black pants. 
 
 
 Gary K. Foote [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
 I think so too. A warning like this is sure to gain friends and influence 
 people. lol
 
 Gary
 
 On 22 Feb 2007 at 18:14, Dave Freeman mjwy wrote:
 
 
  Dear Gary;
  I kind of thought that maybe he should live a lonely life as his scare 
 tactic would
  warrent that all meteorite persons would stay away from such a crabby 
 appleton!
  His crater and the Peruvian government may be his ONLY FRIENDS!
  df
  Gary K. Foote wrote:
 
  A rather dark post Randall.
 
  Gary
 
  On 21 Feb 2007 at 18:44, Randall Gregory wrote:
 
 
 
 
  Information is expected to be released in April on the Earth Impact 
 Databasethat will
  give the exact coordinates to the Peruvian meteorite crater. I have 
 been warned that
  meteorite hunters will want to turn this site upside down. If anyone 
 wishes to hunt at
  this site please contact me and we can discuss.
 
  Should anyone think about hunting without contacting me. I want you to 
 understand that
  I have paperwork filing with the Peruvian government giving me mining 
 concession rights
  to the crater and 100 sq. hectares surrounding the crater. It is a 
 routine matter and
  approval is expected soon. Even with paperwork pending I still have 
 legal rights here in
  Peru. I am serious about wanting to keep this crater in pristine 
 condition until
  scientists have had the opportunity to study it in detail.
 
  Peruvian law has very strict laws concerning trespassing, especially 
 when it concerns
  mines. I will not hesitate to prosecute and trust me, American jails 
 would be considered
  luxury resorts compared to South American jails. Your sustenance will 
 consist of beans,
  potatoes, and rice and maybe a piece of chicken if you're lucky.You 
 might get 1 piece of
  fruit per week. You will have to drink the local water. Diarrhea will 
 be your constant
  companion. I guarantee you will have non-stop nightmares all night 
 every night. I know
  the system and I will make every attempt to lengthen your stay. There 
 are ways to block
  your attempts to contact the American embassy.
 
  There is currently astanding rewardforreporting to the police, any 
 meteorite hunter
  that may wander into this area.The reward is equivalent to 6 months 
 income formost of
  thepoor people of this area. They arenow watchful and vigilant.The 
 towns of Aplao and
  Castillo are small. Everybody knows everybody and I have many friends 
 in each. All
  relevant police agencies have been notified by my Peruvian attorney.
 
  My advice, don't even think about it. Alternatively, if you want to 
 hunt at the crater, 
 I
  am open to discussion,

Re: [meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly warningtohunters that may be considering...

Hi, Darren, List,

Nope. It's a different meteorite (??) that
looks exactly the same.
The Barringers got Meteor Crater by way
of Daniel Barringer's mining claim. He thought
(many did) that the vast mass of the impactor
was buried beneath the crater floor, millions
of tons of stainless steel awaiting exploitation.
He drilled  up to a quarter mile into the floor
of the crater trying to hit the main mass and
found nothing but shattered strata as far as he
went.
If Randall's crater is an impact crater, there
won't be any material within it, but that 100
hectares surrounding might yield something.
Randall's mistake is thinking that the pictures
of the stones incline anyone to hunt there. If he
threw it open to all comers and set up a free
Koolaide stand in the desert, he'd probably
have a long wait to use those frosty mugs for
any actual meteorite hunters.
Despite his friendly message to prospective
hunters, the fishheads and maggotty rice don't
make the stones look any more meteoric than
they did before.
The fact that no Earth geologist can say
immediately just what they are does not logically
demonstrate that they are un-Earthly. The Earth
still keeps a few little secrets of her own. How
did josephinite form and why is it on the surface
of the Earth instead of in the mantle? It's a mystery
to me, and yet, you can buy it on eBay.



Sterling K. Webb
--
- Original Message - 
From: Darren Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 11:34 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Peruvian meteorite crater - friendly 
warningtohunters that may be considering...


On Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:22:40 -0700, you wrote:

Threats like this make me want to run right down there just to prove I 
could
get away with it.


Tell me about it.

I'm not entirely clear on this-- is this big meteorite strewnfield (with the
threats of drawing, quartering, and reincarnation as a young boy trapped in 
an
elevator with Michael Jackson if you jump his claim) the same as the Venus
meteorite he is evangelizing about?
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