Re: [meteorite-list] Show me the Shock
It would have a cosmic-ray exposure age of 4.4 billion years. No iron meteorite has a CRE age anywhere near that. On Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 1:32 PM Alfredo Petrov via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > There could be pieces of iron from Earth's core floating around the solar > system, left over from the collision that created the Moon. Since we have > no direct chemical analyses of Earth core material, when an iron meteorite > falls, how would we know whether it was originally Earth material or not? > > On Tue, 25 Jul 2023 at 20:57, Robert Verish via Meteorite-list < > meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > >> https://www.space.com/boomerang-meteorite-left-earth-and-returned >> >> A dark reddish-brown stone, picked up from the Sahara desert in Morocco a >> few years ago, appears to be an Earth rock that was flung into space >> where >> it stayed for thousands of years before returning home ? surprisingly >> intact. >> >> If scientists are right about this, the rock will officially be named the >> first meteorite to boomerang from Earth. [Not for certain!] >> >> The discovery team's work was *presented* >> ( >> https://conf.goldschmidt.info/goldschmidt/2023/meetingapp.cgi/Paper/20218 >> ) >> last week at an international geochemistry conference and has not yet been >> published in a peer-reviewed journal. >> >> "I think there is no doubt that this is a meteorite," said Frank Brenker, >> a >> geologist at the Goethe University Frankfurt in Germany, who was not >> involved with the new study. "It is just a matter of debate if it is >> really >> from Earth." [But, still could be the other way around.] >> >> Early diagnostic tests show the unusual stone features the same chemical >> composition as volcanic rocks on Earth. Interestingly, however, a few of >> its elements seem to have been altered into lighter forms of themselves. >> These lighter versions are known to occur only upon interacting with >> energetic *cosmic rays* ( https://www.space.com/32644-cosmic-rays.html ) >> in space, which provided one of two key pieces of evidence >> declaring the rock's trip beyond Earth, geologists say. >> >> Other pending measurements include unambiguous data about how much shock >> from the original impact the stone absorbed. This unique signature can be >> detected >> in the permanently altered microstructures of the mineral crystals >> forming the rock. >> Estimating the meteorite's shock levels is "something that can be checked >> or done >> in one hour or so max, using naked eyes," Ferrière said, "thus, not >> costly and a >> very important observation in this case." >> >> ( https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/uh7CnCZNh4MNnFY78yR2ke.jpg ) >> __ >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com >> https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > __ > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Show me the Shock
I am really surprised that a press release was issued on work that has not even been submitted for peer-reviewed publication. There seems to be no age data, no bulk chemical data, and no shock data. The authors seem to claim it was launched off Earth just 10,000 years ago, but I don't know where this comes from. Of course, there is no large terrestrial crater of that age. If the crystallization age is 4.5 billion years, then it is not from Earth. If the rock was launched from Earth, the required energy would melt it. The rock is listed as an achondrite, so that part fits, but it would have melted during launch 10,000 years ago (if that number is valid), not billions of years ago. I remain skeptical and surprised at the precipitous press release. On Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 11:58 AM Robert Verish via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > https://www.space.com/boomerang-meteorite-left-earth-and-returned > > A dark reddish-brown stone, picked up from the Sahara desert in Morocco a > few years ago, appears to be an Earth rock that was flung into space where > it stayed for thousands of years before returning home ? surprisingly > intact. > > If scientists are right about this, the rock will officially be named the > first meteorite to boomerang from Earth. [Not for certain!] > > The discovery team's work was *presented* > ( > https://conf.goldschmidt.info/goldschmidt/2023/meetingapp.cgi/Paper/20218 > ) > last week at an international geochemistry conference and has not yet been > published in a peer-reviewed journal. > > "I think there is no doubt that this is a meteorite," said Frank Brenker, a > geologist at the Goethe University Frankfurt in Germany, who was not > involved with the new study. "It is just a matter of debate if it is > really > from Earth." [But, still could be the other way around.] > > Early diagnostic tests show the unusual stone features the same chemical > composition as volcanic rocks on Earth. Interestingly, however, a few of > its elements seem to have been altered into lighter forms of themselves. > These lighter versions are known to occur only upon interacting with > energetic *cosmic rays* ( https://www.space.com/32644-cosmic-rays.html ) > in space, which provided one of two key pieces of evidence > declaring the rock's trip beyond Earth, geologists say. > > Other pending measurements include unambiguous data about how much shock > from the original impact the stone absorbed. This unique signature can be > detected > in the permanently altered microstructures of the mineral crystals forming > the rock. > Estimating the meteorite's shock levels is "something that can be checked > or done > in one hour or so max, using naked eyes," Ferrière said, "thus, not costly > and a > very important observation in this case." > > ( https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/uh7CnCZNh4MNnFY78yR2ke.jpg ) > __ > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Terrestrial meteorite
I hadn't heard that a crystallization age has been determined, but if it turns out to be close to 4.5 Ga, then it is even less likely to be from Earth. On Thu, Jul 13, 2023 at 8:21 AM Carl Agee wrote: > > I classified something similar but not exactly the same recently. Also > plotting in the basaltic andesite field and near the TFL. > https://www.lpi.usra.edu/meteor/metbull.php?sea=NWA+15201=names=contains=50=ge==All=name=All=All0=Normal%20table=78425 > I definitely would not go out on a limb and say it is an Earth meteorite. It > is just one (remote?) possibility for the origin. There are several types of > meteorites that plot on or near the TFL, but that does not mean they are from > Earth. There is a growing number of ungrouped achondrites that indicate > significant basaltic to andesitic volcanism on early solar system bodies. A > crystallization age of NWA 13188 would be important to have to help prove it > is from Earth -- I haven't seen the 2023 Goldschmidt abstract (only the 2022 > MetSoc abstract). Has an age been determined yet? > Carl > * > Carl B. Agee > Director, Institute of Meteoritics > Professor, Earth and Planetary Sciences > University of New Mexico > > Shipping Address: > 11 Atole Way > Placitas, NM 87043 > > (505) 750-7172 > (505) 573-5131 > Email: cb.a...@gmail.com > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 5:57 PM ALAN RUBIN via Meteorite-list > wrote: >> >> [EXTERNAL] >> >> I discussed the possibility of terrestrial meteorites in Rubin (2015), >> Icarus 257, 221-229. Neglecting the effects of the Earth's atmosphere, >> it would take five times as much energy to launch a basaltic rock off >> the Earth as it would to launch the same mass rock off Mars. Except >> for Black Beauty, essentially every shergottite has been severely >> shocked during launch off Mars, transforming the crystalline >> plagioclase into maskelynite. (A few shergottites with no maskelynite >> were shocked-heated even more strongly.) A terrestrial basalt launched >> off Earth would be heavily shocked or completely impact melted. This >> does not seem to be the case for NWA 13188. I don't think it is >> terrestrial. >> >> On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 4:36 PM Mark Hammergren via Meteorite-list >> wrote: >> > >> > Thirty years ago, my thesis advisor, Don Brownlee, and I talked about >> > potential terrestrial meteorites and how their "asteroids" might be >> > identified among the population of near-Earth objects. Unfortunately for >> > me at the time, we decided that any strong identification would rely on >> > details of silicate chemistry that are tough to measure through >> > ground-based remote sensing. But we were certain that such bodies must >> > exist. >> > >> > On the same subject, the moon will be a great place to search for >> > terrestrial meteorites, and may prove to be the best place to investigate >> > the conditions of early Earth. Heck, we might even find fossils. >> > >> > On Wed, Jul 12, 2023, 12:27 PM Bob King via Meteorite-list >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> Mike, >> >> >> >> Go to >> >> https://www.researchgate.net/publication/361365963_Northwest_Africa_13188_A_meteorite_from_the_Earth >> >> At the top click on the blue bar that says download full text pdf. I just >> >> did it and no fee is required. >> >> >> >> Bob >> >> >> >> On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 9:12 AM Michael Farmer via Meteorite-list >> >> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> Unfortunately paywall >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone >> >>> >> >>> On Wednesday, July 12, 2023, 2:05 AM, Albert Jambon via Meteorite-list >> >>> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> There was a presentation at the Goldschmidt Conference in Lyon this >> >>> week. Here is a link >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> https://www.newscientist.com/article/2381928-meteorite-left-earth-then-landed-back-down-after-round-trip-to-space/ >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> Albert JAMBON >> >>> >> >>> __ >> >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >> >>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com >> >>> https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >>>
Re: [meteorite-list] Terrestrial meteorite
I discussed the possibility of terrestrial meteorites in Rubin (2015), Icarus 257, 221-229. Neglecting the effects of the Earth's atmosphere, it would take five times as much energy to launch a basaltic rock off the Earth as it would to launch the same mass rock off Mars. Except for Black Beauty, essentially every shergottite has been severely shocked during launch off Mars, transforming the crystalline plagioclase into maskelynite. (A few shergottites with no maskelynite were shocked-heated even more strongly.) A terrestrial basalt launched off Earth would be heavily shocked or completely impact melted. This does not seem to be the case for NWA 13188. I don't think it is terrestrial. On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 4:36 PM Mark Hammergren via Meteorite-list wrote: > > Thirty years ago, my thesis advisor, Don Brownlee, and I talked about > potential terrestrial meteorites and how their "asteroids" might be > identified among the population of near-Earth objects. Unfortunately for me > at the time, we decided that any strong identification would rely on details > of silicate chemistry that are tough to measure through ground-based remote > sensing. But we were certain that such bodies must exist. > > On the same subject, the moon will be a great place to search for terrestrial > meteorites, and may prove to be the best place to investigate the conditions > of early Earth. Heck, we might even find fossils. > > On Wed, Jul 12, 2023, 12:27 PM Bob King via Meteorite-list > wrote: >> >> Mike, >> >> Go to >> https://www.researchgate.net/publication/361365963_Northwest_Africa_13188_A_meteorite_from_the_Earth >> At the top click on the blue bar that says download full text pdf. I just >> did it and no fee is required. >> >> Bob >> >> On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 9:12 AM Michael Farmer via Meteorite-list >> wrote: >>> >>> Unfortunately paywall >>> >>> >>> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone >>> >>> On Wednesday, July 12, 2023, 2:05 AM, Albert Jambon via Meteorite-list >>> wrote: >>> >>> There was a presentation at the Goldschmidt Conference in Lyon this week. >>> Here is a link >>> >>> >>> >>> https://www.newscientist.com/article/2381928-meteorite-left-earth-then-landed-back-down-after-round-trip-to-space/ >>> >>> >>> >>> Albert JAMBON >>> >>> __ >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com >>> https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >>> __ >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com >>> https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> __ >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com >> https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > __ > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Regarding about the Glenn I. Huss Collection number H37.810
Of course, you could send an email to Gary Huss. On Wed, Feb 16, 2022, 7:59 AM Sean T. Murray via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > Mendy, > > Many times those gaps are specimens that were sold between editions. I > think they moved / sold some material quickly, and never bothered to > document it outside of the COA. They cataloged what they had, but there > were many gaps throughout both books. Nininger had the same issues with > his > "The Nininger Collection of Meteorites" book (1950). > > S. > > -Original Message- > From: Mendy Ouzillou via Meteorite-list > Sent: Wednesday, February 16, 2022 8:44 AM > To: 'Sanghyeok Lee' ; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Regarding about the Glenn I. Huss Collection > number H37.810 > > H37 is Canyon Diablo, however there is a gap in numbers between the first > (H37. 605 to H37.645) and second booklet (H37.860 to H37.1056) and your > number falls in that gap. > > Someone more knowledgeable can explain the gaps and if those numbers are > listed anywhere else. > > Mendy > > -Original Message- > From: Meteorite-list On > Behalf > Of Sanghyeok Lee via Meteorite-list > Sent: Wednesday, February 16, 2022 7:05 AM > To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > Subject: [meteorite-list] Regarding about the Glenn I. Huss Collection > number H37.810 > > Dear list, > > I wonder if anyone are access to the Glenn I. Huss’s collection catalog > (especially second), I will be extremely appreciated when I know > information > related to the Huss number below… > > - H37.810 > > I suspect Canyon Diablo, and the entry likely available at the “The Second > Huss Collection of Meteorites (1986)” catalogue. If someone able to > provide > me a photograph or scanned version of this page or scanned catalogue, I > will > be literally thrilled of… > > Thank you for the all helps. > > Sincerely yours, > Sang-Hyeok, Lee > __ > > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > __ > > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > __ > > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cristobalite
Free silica is at most an accessory component in known meteorites. If the whole rock has a high cristobalite peak, it is likely a terrestrial rock. Possibilities include sandstone, quartzite and various silicaceous igneous rocks. On Fri, May 21, 2021 at 4:05 PM yasmani.ceballo--- via Meteorite-list wrote: > > Hello friends > I have a surviving difractogram of a rock that was thinked to be > meteorite in the past, but now is lost. > The only information we have is the presence of these minerals: > cristobalite, quartz, olivine, enstatite, plagioclase and amorphous > materials. Probably super high peaks of cristobalite, followed by > quartz. > This is the only information we have, so I know is nothing, but with > that how we can say? > I mean, a high cristobalite peak mean anything? There is no > cristobalite in the geology of the area where the rock is believed to > have fallen. > Thanks > > > > > __ > > EXTREMELY RARE MARTIAN AND LUNAR MAIN MASS METEORITES > https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/27190/ > Coming to auction in Bonhams Meteorites Online sale. Browse 90+ lots of > superb planetary meteorite specimens & impact memorabilia, including rare > main mass Martian and Lunar meteorites. > > Bid online May 18-28 at Bonhams : Meteorites Online > https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/27190/ > __ > > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ EXTREMELY RARE MARTIAN AND LUNAR MAIN MASS METEORITES https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/27190/ Coming to auction in Bonhams Meteorites Online sale. Browse 90+ lots of superb planetary meteorite specimens & impact memorabilia, including rare main mass Martian and Lunar meteorites. Bid online May 18-28 at Bonhams : Meteorites Online https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/27190/ __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist2.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Not an answer they like
I examine the specimens (or images of them if they do not send pieces) and then give them my best guess as to what the sample could be. Some people are insistent that I am wrong or that I am running some kind of a scam. I usually continue the conversation for one or two more rounds before I give up. At that point I sometimes tell them to try New England Meteoritical Services and let them know that they can examine the specimen for a small fee. If I find out that these folks have been sending the same sample to more than one researcher, I immediately stop corresponding with them because it is not fair to overworked researchers to be bedeviled by more than one meteorwrong provider. On Fri, Mar 19, 2021, 5:06 PM Ben Fisler via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > Tracy, >I usually offer to sell the individual “meteorites just like > theirs”, from hundreds of pounds, to a few tons, very cheaply, since I have > a near endless supply of the exact, same rocks, and that here in Phoenix, > they are commonly used in landscaping. That is usually the end of it. Try > it. > > Ben Fisler > > > On Mar 19, 2021, at 11:27 AM, Anne Black via Meteorite-list < > meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > > > I like Randy's response best. And he certainly is the expert. > > Thank you Randy, I think I will keep your response and use it next time I > am asked, if you don't mind. > > Anne Black > IMPACTIKA.com > impact...@aol.com > > > -Original Message- > From: Korotev, Randy via Meteorite-list < > meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> > To: tracy latimer > Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com < > meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> > Sent: Thu, Mar 18, 2021 3:23 pm > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Not an answer they like > > I send them this link. Doesn't usually help, though. > https://sites.wustl.edu/meteoritesite/items/thud/ > > > From: Meteorite-list on > behalf of tracy latimer via Meteorite-list < > meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> > Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 14:28 > To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > Subject: [meteorite-list] Not an answer they like > > I've been fielding a lot of e-mails this week from someone who is certain > that a meteorite nearly hit their house. The picture they sent me is of > what looks like a weathered lava bomb that likely washed free of an upslope > location and rolled/fell/bounced into his yard. They found it the > following day after a "loud thump that shook the house", then picked it up > and hosed it off, so don't have any pictures of it in situ, just a shallow > hole with muddy splash marks. I've told them several times that it doesn't > look like a meteorite: vesicles, not regmaglypts; no fusion crust, nothing > that identifies it as a likely meteorite, but they don't want to hear it. > Anyone who has dealt with a persistent "meteorite" finder, how did you > eventually get them to listen to reason/experience -- or not? > > Best! > Tracy Latimer > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > __ > > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > __ > > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > __ > > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Modern Burnishing
For those who are interested, there is a similar pattern on the Haig IIIAB iron, as illustrated on page 62 of the book Meteorites and their Origins by G. J. McCall (1973). On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 12:30 PM Michael Farmer via Meteorite-list wrote: > > I hate it. Almost 100% made of glue is my guess. There’s no natural way to > make it look like a turf squeezed out of a tube. > > > Sent from Smallbiz Yahoo Mail for iPhone > > On Friday, August 14, 2020, 10:32 AM, Graham Ensor via Meteorite-list > wrote: > > I saw that too Paul. I think I saw it once before a while back, being > offered. I have never seen this shaping before either. Very unusual, but I > would guess it must be terrestrial weathering influenced by some sort of > internal structure...e.g. perhaps melt. I took the phrase "modern burnishing" > to be that it had been cleaned in some way to remove calichebut a vague > description. > > Graham > > On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 6:42 AM Paul Gessler via Meteorite-list > wrote: > > Want everyone's opinion / on this highly unusual morphology. > I don't doubt it is a real meteorite at all just that one side looks altered > or is HUGELY UNIQUE > Christies is currently selling it and gives a cryptic explanation for its > shape as "Modern burnishing" > What the hell does that mean exactly? > they also mention it could be naturally ventifacted.??? > > Either way I have never seen anything quite like it in the meteorite world. > > Anyone else have an explanation ... please chime in on this. > > https://onlineonly.christies.com/s/deep-impact-lunar-rare-meteorites/evoking-sculpture-ken-price-exotic-meteorite-morphology-nwa-13203-38/82821 > > Thanks > Paul Gessler > > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Interesting take on Tunguska
A previous example is the 1972 fireball observed over Utah, Montana and Alberta, but this body never came closer than about 57 km from the Earth and was much smaller (say 5-15 m or so) than the one hypothesized here. The 1972 object produced sonic booms but no damage. It was observed by many and actually filmed. My wife saw it. So, the new hypothesis about Tunguska should be taken seriously and not dismissed out of hand. On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 11:46 AM Frank Cressy via Meteorite-list wrote: > > Maybe someone who has access to the original paper can answer if the author's > modeling takes in account the fall directions of trees under the blast. The > summary doesn't address that. > > Cheers, > > Frank > > > > > > > On Monday, May 11, 2020, 11:00:59 AM PDT, Michael Gilmer via Meteorite-list > wrote: > > > > > > Some new research on the Tunguska event - > https://www.sciencealert.com/scientists-have-a-new-theory-about-the-colossal-tunguska-event-explosion > > > > -- > --- > Galactic Stone & Ironworks : www.galactic-stone.com > Instagram : www.instagram.com/galacticstone > Twitter : www.twitter.com/galacticstone > --- > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite reclassification questions
When I initially classified Ningqiang, there were no known CKs. We
classified it as CV3 because that was the closest group, but we noted that
its refractory lithophile element abundances didn't match CV that well.
Later, when we defined the CK group, it became obvious that Ningqiang was
more like CK than CV. Later, upon additional reflection and analyses, we
thought it most likely that Ningqiang was sufficiently different from
normal CKs, that it was probably an ungrouped carbonaceous chondrite that
was closely related to CK and CV.
If you want a meteorite to be reclassified int the Bulletin, you need to
let the folks know (i.e., through Jeff Grossman) that this is warranted and
explain the reasons. Sometimes, the rock will indeed be reclassified and
sometimes it won't. It can be frustrating. I'm not familiar with Hart or
NWA 6047. You could email Tasha Dunn and ask her.
Alan Rubin
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 9:07 PM Michael Doran via Meteorite-list <
meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote:
> As a newbie, I've come to rely pretty heavily on the Meteoritical
> Bulletin database for information about particular meteorites as well as to
> look at aggregate data for different types.
>
> I've been somewhat surprised to discover that it is not unusual for
> meteorites to get reclassified and I was wondering if anybody could tell me
> how and under what circumstances a Met Bull entry gets updated to reflect
> new classification information.
>
> Ningqiang is a good example of reclassification updates. The Meteoritical
> Bulletin database entry shows that Ningqiang was originally classified as a
> CV3, per Meteoritical Bulletin #65 (1987) [1]. Then (if I'm interpreting
> the entry correctly) it looks like it was reclassed as a CK3, per the
> Natural History Museum's Catalogue of Meteorites, 5th edition (2000). And
> a subsequent reclassification as C3-ung came per the 7th edition of MetBase
> (2006).
>
> The particular example I had questions about is the entry for Hart, a
> Texas meteorite found in 2010 and that was initially classified as a CK3
> [2]. CK3 is a pretty rare carbonaceous chondrite type and Hart was
> apparently the only meteorite in the U.S. to get that classification.
> However, I recently came across a scientific paper ("Reclassification of
> Hart and Northwest Africa 6047: Criteria for distinguishing between CV and
> CK3 chondrites" [3]) that appears to make a persuasive case for Hart being
> reclassified as a CV3. This paper was published in 2017, but there is no
> update yet in the Met Bull entry.
>
> So my questions are:
>
> 1) Will the Meteoritical Bulletin database entry for Hart eventually get
> updated to reflect a change in classification?
>
> 2) What mechanisms (if any) are in place to keep track of these types of
> reclassifications and make updates? (From what I've seen, there is a
> mechanism for Antarctic meteorites via the Antarctic Meteorite Newsletter.
> See, for example AMN item on reclassifications [4] and subsequent Met Bull
> database entry update [5].)
>
> 3) Is there some body that mediates between competing classification
> claims? E.g. what if the original classifier disagrees with a
> reclassification?
>
> -- Michael
>
> [1] https://www.lpi.usra.edu/meteor/metbull.php?code=16981
>
> [2] https://www.lpi.usra.edu/meteor/metbull.php?code=56555
>
> [3] Dunn, TL, Gross, J. 2017 Reclassification of Hart and Northwest Africa
> 6047: Criteria for distinguishing between CV and CK3 chondrites.
> Meteoritics & Planetary Science 52(11):2412–2423
>
> [4] https://curator.jsc.nasa.gov/antmet/amn/amnfeb10/reclassifications.htm
>
> [5] E.g. for EET 96010
> https://www.lpi.usra.edu/meteor/metbull.php?code=9604
>
> Michael Doran
> Fort Worth, TX
> __
>
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--
Alan Rubin
Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics
Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences
University of California
3845 Slichter Hall
603 Charles Young Dr. E
Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567
USA
office phone: 310-825-3202
fax: 310-206-3051
e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu
website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html
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Re: [meteorite-list] Favorite Nininger stories?
I have an anecdote. At the 1984 Meteoritical Society meeting in Albuquerque, there were scientific talks presented by Gary Huss, his father Glenn Hus, and his grandfather Harvey Nininger. This may be the only time that three generations of one family gave scientific talks at the meeting of a scientific society. On Wed, May 23, 2018 at 10:05 AM, Mark Hammergren via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > I'm giving a brief presentation tomorrow to museum staff members about > Harvey Nininger. Do any of you have any favorite Nininger anecdotes > you'd like to share? Thanks! > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Michigan Meteor
If anyone is interested, I'm ready and willing to classify the samples. Alan Rubin On Thu, Jan 18, 2018 at 11:24 AM, Bigjohn Shea via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > They found a few small specimens last I heard. > Did they find the main mass? > > > > Sent using the mail.com mail app > > On 1/18/18 at 1:00 PM, Michael Farmer via Meteorite-list wrote: > > > It has been found > > > > Michael Farmer > > > > > On Jan 18, 2018, at 9:43 AM, Les to Rovy via Meteorite-list < > meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Sine I'm only 3 hours away was going to go to the area and check out > and see if anyone or anything can be found. > > > > > > Cordially > > > > > > Rick > > > __ > > > > > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and > the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > > > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > __ > > > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and > the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Quartz on meteorites
If any of you want an old reference, there is an abstract by Grant from 1968: GRANT, R. W., 1968. The occurrence of silica minerals in meteorites. Program 31st Meeting Meteoritical Sot., Cambridge, Mass., 1968 (abstract). Alan Rubin On Mon, Sep 25, 2017 at 9:48 AM, André Moutinho <mouti...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hello all, > > Morro do Rocio is a Brazilian meteorite that sílica was found: > http://adsabs.harvard.edu/full/1985Metic..20..467F > > Best > > Andre > > > > De: Meteorite-list > [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] Em nome de ALAN > RUBIN via Meteorite-list > Enviada em: sábado, 23 de setembro de 2017 21:28 > Para: Abdelfattah Gharrad <agharra...@yahoo.com> > Cc: Meteoritecentral List <meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> > Assunto: Re: [meteorite-list] Quartz on meteorites > > > > A few meteorites do contain rare grains of SiO2 including tridymite, > quartz and cristobalite, but generally these grains are quite small > and intergrown with other silicate phases. Some IVA irons contain a > few blades of trydimite, but if you see a rock with several percent or > more of quartz grains that are millimeter size or larger, it will not > be a meteorite. > > > > On Sat, Sep 23, 2017 at 4:46 PM, Abdelfattah Gharrad via > Meteorite-list <meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > > Hello members, > > I really want to post my question about quartz longtimes ago, what I > learned that if one sees quartz on a stone then the stone is not > meteorite. > in my knowledge there are different types of quartz and whose chemical > formula is SiO2. > > habitually no quartz in the meteorites but if there is in a meteorite > then it is a rare stone and whose classification differs from other > meteorites and testimony of another planet it's just opinion. > > I think that the meteorites have chemical compositions like the > terrestrial stones (magmatic, volcanic ...). the probability that a > meteorite contains SiO2 is not zero. > > if there is a clarification please. > > Thanks, > Abdelfattah. > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and > the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > > -- > > Alan Rubin > > Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics > > Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences > > University of California > > 3845 Slichter Hall > > 603 Charles Young Dr. E > > Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 > > USA > > > > office phone: 310-825-3202 > > fax: 310-206-3051 > > e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu > > website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html > -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Quartz on meteorites
A few meteorites do contain rare grains of SiO2 including tridymite, quartz and cristobalite, but generally these grains are quite small and intergrown with other silicate phases. Some IVA irons contain a few blades of trydimite, but if you see a rock with several percent or more of quartz grains that are millimeter size or larger, it will not be a meteorite. On Sat, Sep 23, 2017 at 4:46 PM, Abdelfattah Gharrad via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > Hello members, > > I really want to post my question about quartz longtimes ago, what I > learned that if one sees quartz on a stone then the stone is not meteorite. > in my knowledge there are different types of quartz and whose chemical > formula is SiO2. > > habitually no quartz in the meteorites but if there is in a meteorite then > it is a rare stone and whose classification differs from other meteorites > and testimony of another planet it's just opinion. > > I think that the meteorites have chemical compositions like the > terrestrial stones (magmatic, volcanic ...). the probability that a > meteorite contains SiO2 is not zero. > > if there is a clarification please. > > Thanks, > Abdelfattah. > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Articles About Meteorites And Asteroids
Is this the first published description of a falling meteorite? It's from the Aeneid Book II: The old man had barely spoken when, with a sudden crash, it thundered on the left, and a star, through the darkness, slid from the sky, and flew, trailing fire, in a burst of light. We watched it glide over the highest rooftops, and bury its brightness, and the sign of its passage, in the forests of Mount Ida: then the furrow of its long track gave out a glow, and, all around, the place smoked with sulphur. On Fri, Jan 27, 2017 at 6:16 PM, Paul via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > Meteorite Studies Reveal Surprises About Earth's Formation > By Elizabeth Howell, SpaceCom, January 26, 2017 > http://www.space.com/35468-earth-building-blocks-different- > than-thought.html > > Nice picture of Meteorite On Mars > > Curiosity Finds An(other) Alien Visitor on Mars > Earth Isn't the Only Planet Hit by Meteorites. Mars Gets > Them, Too. by Phil Plait, Blog-Slate Magazine, January 23, 2017 > http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astronomy/2017/01/23/curiosit > y_sees_a_meteorite_on_the_surface_of_mars.html > > This image was taken by Mastcam: Right (MAST_RIGHT) > onboard NASA's Mars rover Curiosity on Sol 1577 > (2017-01-12 11:21:52 UTC). NASA/JPL-Caltech/MSSS > http://mars.nasa.gov/msl/multimedia/raw/?rawid=1577MR0080320 > 000800289E01_DXXX=1577 > > Deflecting Asteroids > > Objective: To deflect asteroids, thus preventing their collision > with Earth Space Daily, Madrid, Spain, January 27, 2017 > http://www.spacedaily.com/reports/Objective_To_deflect_aster > oids_thus_preventing_their_collision_with_Earth_999.html > > Scientists working on deflecting asteroids headed for Earth > The Indian Express, January 27, 2017 > http://indianexpress.com/article/technology/science/scientis > ts-working-on-deflecting-asteroids-headed-for-earth-4493719/ > > Yours, > > Paul H. > > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Captain's Log - Jeff Grossman(?)
It is indeed. On Thu, Sep 8, 2016 at 8:23 AM, Kevin Kichinka via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > Team Meteorite: > > An article today on CNN.com regarding a sample recovery NASA mission > designated OSIRIS-REx to asteroid 'Bennu' quotes Program Scientist Jeff > Grossman. > > Is that THE/'our' Jeff Grossman? > > Kevin Kichinka > > Seemingly swarming with scorpions and snakes near Puriscal, Costa Rica > > "The Art of Collecting Meteorites" available on Amazon or Nook > > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteor wine
Meteor vineyard is selling a 3-pack of their current release of Meteor Wine for $375.00, still steep, but a lot less than $200 a bottle. You have to join their mailing list (which is free) to enable you to purchase their products. I've never tried it, so I cannot evaluate its quality. Just FYI. On Sat, Jul 2, 2016 at 12:53 PM, Edwin Thompson via Meteorite-list < meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> wrote: > Hello list members, > > I am searching for a bottle of Meteor wine. > A friend would like to include one in his public meteorite display. I have > searched through known wine buying venues and found a bottle in California, > but they want $200.00 for one bottle, a bit steep for this project. > I have seen several different bottles with meteors on the label over the > years. If you have a spare bottle please kindly contact me. The bottle > can be empty of contents and could be returned after being displayed. > Purchase or trade could be considered. Just doing a favor for a long time > friend. > > Thanks, > > Edwin Thompson > etmeteori...@hotmail.com > > Viva Le Tour! > > __ > > Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the > Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California 3845 Slichter Hall 603 Charles Young Dr. E Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD - Magazine with first use of Meteor-wrong?
As far as I know, one of the first published uses of the term "Meteor-wrong" was by Edward Olsen in the April 1979 issue of the Field Museum of Natural History Bulletin. He wrote an article with that title discussing some of his experiences as the meteorite curator at the Field Museum in Chicago. Olsen was my M.S. thesis adviser at the time. Among other features in that magazine issue is a reprint of a 1948 article on butterflies by Vladimir Nabokov, who later went on to write Lolita. There is also an article of mine on time and relativity. I have extra copies of that issue and will part with them for $12.00 a piece. I'll pay the postage. I'll also be happy to sign the front page of my article. If you are interested, you can send a check made out to me at the address below along with your name and address. Alternatively, you can send money via PayPal using my e-mail address: aeru...@ucla.edu If you do that, please include your name and address in the note along with the payment. I'll sign my article and send the issue out to you. -- Alan Rubin Institute of Geophysics and Planetary Physics Department of Earth, Planetary, and Space Sciences University of California Los Angeles, CA 90095-1567 USA office phone: 310-825-3202 fax: 310-206-3051 e-mail: aeru...@ucla.edu website: http://cosmochemists.igpp.ucla.edu/Rubin.html __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
