Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
On 2015-01-22 07:58 AM, Steve Shockley wrote: On 1/21/2015 8:50 AM, Brent Cook wrote: I think Dell used to have servers in its 'Cloud' line that fit 2 machines in 1U, though IIRC they were a little pricey. I couldn't find them again when searching. The C6100 was a 2U 4-server "cloud-dense" device, sort of like a 2U blade chassis. I've considered getting one, but I'm not sure if I could stand the reported noise. IIRC they have two power supplies per chassis and the blades are individually removable, so that may or may not meet your definition of redundancy. It looks like the C6220-II is the current model, but I haven't looked at those since they're not cheap on ebay. I'm running a pair of redundant OpenBSD firewalls/routers on C6100 blades. I can confirm, having had to strip and repair one of mine, that the only shared components common to all 4 slots are: 1. The metal shell 2. The fan control board 3. the SATA backplane, at least physically. The backplane the blades plug into is split into (independent) top and bottom halves. The power distribution/sharing system is split into (1+1 redundant, connected) top and bottom halves. The SATA backplane, although shared, appears to be 99% passive and signal traces appear to be highly localized; power is another story for obvious reasons; a catastrophic failure in one SATA drive could propagate to other drives, but would be fused at the power distribution board(s). It's inaccurate to characterize the 4 servers in a C6100 chassis as **completely** indepedent, but I can confirm that you definitely can pull and replace individual blades without affecting the others. In my case, I have enough 6 other servers running at that site, so I can put one router in each chassis, thus ensuring complete separation all the way out to the ethernet switch and/or the shared UPS (take your pick). -- -Adam Thompson athom...@athompso.net
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
On 1/21/2015 8:50 AM, Brent Cook wrote: I think Dell used to have servers in its 'Cloud' line that fit 2 machines in 1U, though IIRC they were a little pricey. I couldn't find them again when searching. The C6100 was a 2U 4-server "cloud-dense" device, sort of like a 2U blade chassis. I've considered getting one, but I'm not sure if I could stand the reported noise. IIRC they have two power supplies per chassis and the blades are individually removable, so that may or may not meet your definition of redundancy. It looks like the C6220-II is the current model, but I haven't looked at those since they're not cheap on ebay.
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
-Original Message- From: owner-m...@openbsd.org [mailto:owner-m...@openbsd.org] On Behalf Of Predrag Punosevac Sent: jeudi 22 janvier 2015 03:32 To: misc@openbsd.org Subject: Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair Daniel Ouellet wrote: > there is 23 model that are twin model in 1U: > > http://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/1UTwin.cfm > > But they share the power supply. May be that's what you didn't like. >> On 1/21/15 7:31 AM, Alan McKay wrote: >> I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at >> 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have >> my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. I guess another >> option would be half-width 1U if anything like that exists, and >> install a rack shelf. So when the power supply fails you will have both FW down not just one. Nice :) Even if the FW were only sharing the same case the idea is dumb because you will have to take off line good FW to fix the one which failed. Now somebody posted the link to pfSense hardware where each individual FW is removable. That would seems like the solution which fits the bill perfectly and doesn't suffer the problem I just pointed out. However catch 22 is that the case has a non-standard width so you will have to adjust your rack :) Cheers, Predrag
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
>> there is 23 model that are twin model in 1U: >> >> http://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/1UTwin.cfm >> >> But they share the power supply. May be that's what you didn't like. >So when the power supply fails you will have both FW down not just one. Yes Supermicro twin power supply is shared, but it is redundant, so you need both power supply to fail to have both FW failing (one power supply can power both systems). >Nice :) Even if the FW were only sharing the same case the idea is dumb >because you will have to take off line good FW to fix the one which failed. You can remove a system "hot-swap" without affecting the other one. Only a problem if you cannot remove *only* the failing system due to cabling or other mechanical issue. The only single point of failure I can think of is the backplane connecting everything together (both systems, both power supplies and interconnection to the front panel). BR Michel
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
Christian, sure - you're so damn right :) Just for the records, I've used main auth hmac-sha1 enc aes-128 group modp1536 quick auth hmac-sha1 enc aes-128 and just a dumb # iperf -c 172.16.2.1 Client connecting to 172.16.2.1, TCP port 5001 TCP window size: 16.0 KByte (default) [ 3] local 172.16.1.1 port 8600 connected with 172.16.2.1 port 5001 [ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth [ 3] 0.0-10.0 sec 72.5 MBytes 60.7 Mbits/sec # Without any testing on UDP or different datagram payloads and so forth. All on OpenBSD flashrd 5.5 build on stable (2014-04-05). Regards, Marco Am 21.01.2015 um 18:01 schrieb Christian Weisgerber: > On 2015-01-21, Marco Prause wrote: > >> Also when using ipsec in this test-setup, iperf was able to push ~60Mbps >> through the tunnel (ase-128). > ^^^ > That's pretty useless without specifying which MAC algorithm you > used.
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
Check this out: http://www.itxdepot.com/shop/index.php?id_category=20&controller=category I have it installed in a rack with 2 ITX MBs. Jay > Daniel Ouellet wrote: > >> there is 23 model that are twin model in 1U: >> >> http://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/1UTwin.cfm >> >> But they share the power supply. May be that's what you didn't like. > >>> On 1/21/15 7:31 AM, Alan McKay wrote: >>> I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at >>> 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have >>> my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. I guess another >>> option would be half-width 1U if anything like that exists, and >>> install a rack shelf. > > So when the power supply fails you will have both FW down not just one. > Nice :) Even if the FW were only sharing the same case the idea is dumb > because you will have to take off line good FW to fix the one which > failed. > > Now somebody posted the link to pfSense hardware where each individual > FW is removable. That would seems like the solution which fits the bill > perfectly and doesn't suffer the problem I just pointed out. However > catch 22 is that the case has a non-standard width so you will have to > adjust your rack :) > > Cheers, > Predrag
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
On 01/21/15 20:31, Predrag Punosevac wrote: Daniel Ouellet wrote: there is 23 model that are twin model in 1U: http://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/1UTwin.cfm But they share the power supply. May be that's what you didn't like. On 1/21/15 7:31 AM, Alan McKay wrote: I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. I guess another option would be half-width 1U if anything like that exists, and install a rack shelf. So when the power supply fails you will have both FW down not just one. Nice :) Even if the FW were only sharing the same case the idea is dumb because you will have to take off line good FW to fix the one which failed. Now somebody posted the link to pfSense hardware where each individual FW is removable. That would seems like the solution which fits the bill perfectly and doesn't suffer the problem I just pointed out. However catch 22 is that the case has a non-standard width so you will have to adjust your rack :) Cheers, Predrag While I don't really recommend them, the older Nokia IP260 was a 1U half rack wide appliance. Nokia made a frame that held 2 of them in a 1U standard 19 inch rack space. OpenBSD will run on them, but it requires a little effort to get it to work. Or it did the last time I tried it. My efforts to get OpenBSD to work on them is either in the archives of this list or tech@. The current CheckPoint 2200 series is of similar width and not as deep as the IP260. I don't know if they offer a mounting plate to rack 2 side by side. We either sit them on top of something in the rack or install a shelf in the rack. I've yet to try OpenBSD on one though. If we have a spare 2207 at work, I'll see if OpenBSD will run on it. Stan
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
Daniel Ouellet wrote: > there is 23 model that are twin model in 1U: > > http://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/1UTwin.cfm > > But they share the power supply. May be that's what you didn't like. >> On 1/21/15 7:31 AM, Alan McKay wrote: >> I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at >> 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have >> my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. I guess another >> option would be half-width 1U if anything like that exists, and >> install a rack shelf. So when the power supply fails you will have both FW down not just one. Nice :) Even if the FW were only sharing the same case the idea is dumb because you will have to take off line good FW to fix the one which failed. Now somebody posted the link to pfSense hardware where each individual FW is removable. That would seems like the solution which fits the bill perfectly and doesn't suffer the problem I just pointed out. However catch 22 is that the case has a non-standard width so you will have to adjust your rack :) Cheers, Predrag
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
there is 23 model that are twin model in 1U: http://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/1UTwin.cfm But they share the power supply. May be that's what you didn't like. On 1/21/15 7:31 AM, Alan McKay wrote: > I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at > 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have > my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. I guess another > option would be half-width 1U if anything like that exists, and > install a rack shelf.
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
On 2015-01-21, Marco Prause wrote: > Also when using ipsec in this test-setup, iperf was able to push ~60Mbps > through the tunnel (ase-128). ^^^ That's pretty useless without specifying which MAC algorithm you used. -- Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
On 2015-01-21, Alan McKay wrote: > I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at > 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have > my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. There are various companies that produce 1U cases that can hold two Soekris, PCEngines, etc. boards, e.g. Kerberos (Europe) http://www.kerberos.si/ENG/Soekris19.htm Yawarra (Australia) http://www.yawarra.com.au/products/servers/ -- Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
I take back the HP suggestion, since it was pointed out these share a lot of components between the servers as well. This looks interesting, though it may be under-powered depending on your needs: http://www.hacom.net/catalog/mars-ii-twin-blade-d525-pfsense-1u-server With the right search terms, I found a number of other half-width 1u servers designed for this application that may also be appropriate. They seem to basically repackage mini ITX boards. On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 7:50 AM, Brent Cook wrote: > I think Dell used to have servers in its 'Cloud' line that fit 2 > machines in 1U, though IIRC they were a little pricey. I couldn't find > them again when searching. > > The HP SL2x170z server pulls off a similar feat - you can find several > on ebay, though it may be discontinued as well. > > On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 6:31 AM, Alan McKay wrote: >> I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at >> 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have >> my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. I guess another >> option would be half-width 1U if anything like that exists, and >> install a rack shelf. >> >> >> -- >> "Don't eat anything you've ever seen advertised on TV" >> - Michael Pollan, author of "In Defense of Food"
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
I think Dell used to have servers in its 'Cloud' line that fit 2 machines in 1U, though IIRC they were a little pricey. I couldn't find them again when searching. The HP SL2x170z server pulls off a similar feat - you can find several on ebay, though it may be discontinued as well. On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 6:31 AM, Alan McKay wrote: > I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at > 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have > my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. I guess another > option would be half-width 1U if anything like that exists, and > install a rack shelf. > > > -- > "Don't eat anything you've ever seen advertised on TV" > - Michael Pollan, author of "In Defense of Food"
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 8:05 AM, Ganguin Michel wrote: > in 1U (another one goes up to 8 systems in 2U, twin3): > http://www.supermicro.nl/products/nfo/1UTwin.cfm Oh they do have them ... I checked a while back and could have sworn the Twins only started at 2U > However they share some stuff: OK maybe that's why I discounted them back then. -- "Don't eat anything you've ever seen advertised on TV" - Michael Pollan, author of "In Defense of Food"
Re: 1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
Hi Alan, some time ago I've had a look at them. Supermicro still seem to have 1U Twin-Server in their List. Unfortunately I can't say anything about running them - they are still on my "wishlist". On the other hand - does anybody know alternatives ? Just in case of not ending up in some kind of vendor-lock-in issue. For "weaker" hardware I've allready tested the APU-Boards in a 1U Dual-Box. I was able to push ~750 Mbps through them with pf enabled (just the default rules) Workstation ---> APU 1 ---> APU 2 just with a simple iperf test. Also when using ipsec in this test-setup, iperf was able to push ~60Mbps through the tunnel (ase-128). Best regards, Marco Am 21.01.2015 um 13:31 schrieb Alan McKay: > I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at > 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have > my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. I guess another > option would be half-width 1U if anything like that exists, and > install a rack shelf.
1U / 2 Computers? For redundant FW pair
I know that Supermicro has some interesting side-by-sides starting at 2U, but I'm not aware of anything in 1U. Basically I'd like to have my redundant FW pairs take up less rack space. I guess another option would be half-width 1U if anything like that exists, and install a rack shelf. -- "Don't eat anything you've ever seen advertised on TV" - Michael Pollan, author of "In Defense of Food"
