[Mono-list] could linux be MORE .Net then windows ?
This article, with at least a bit of (hopefully accurate) research behind it, seems to state a shocking conclusion: article: http://www.grimes.demon.co.uk/dotnet/vistaAndDotnet.htm#conclusion My conclusion is that Microsoft has lost its confidence in .NET. They implement very little of their own code using .NET. The framework is provided as part of the operating system, but this is so that code written by third party developers can run on Vista without the large download of the framework. Supplying the .NET runtime for third party developers in this way is similar to Microsoft supplying msvbvm60.dll as part of XP. now seeing this, is it possible, by the time Vista comes out, that a linux OS distro at that time (Feb 2007?) could in fact have (epecially if gnome installed) MORE .Net to it then even MS's new OS line of Vista? Mono could end up being more relevent for linux - then .Net is to Vista. Who would have ever guessed that 3 years ago! -tl ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] could linux be MORE .Net then windows ?
On Mon, 2006-03-27 at 04:28 -0500, ted leslie wrote: This article, with at least a bit of (hopefully accurate) research behind it, seems to state a shocking conclusion: article: http://www.grimes.demon.co.uk/dotnet/vistaAndDotnet.htm#conclusion And the rebuttal: http://blogs.msdn.com/danielfe/archive/2005/12/16/504847.aspx An interesting point is that demon.co.uk says this: If anyone tells you that Visual Studio .NET is a managed application, you instantly know that they know nothing about .NET. Simply typing dumpbin devenv.exe /headers (assuming you have devenv.exe in your path) will prove this: the location in the COM Descriptor Directory is zero. While danielfe says that VS2005 has 7.5 million lines of managed code. Why such a large difference? First of all, you can have apps which embed the .NET runtime. grimes.co.uk mentions this, even mentioning that mscoree.dll! CorBindToRuntimeEx() will be bound. However, this isn't entirely correct. IIRC, the .NET runtime can be instantiated and embedded through normal COM interfaces. Result: no explicit link between an embedding app and the .NET runtime, unless you want to disassemble the whole thing and look for the .NET runtime GUID So running `dumpbin.exe devenv.exe /headers` won't give you the correct result. Furthermore, due to .NET's terrific COM interop support, .NET objects can be used as COM objects. Thus, VS.NET can use .NET objects through COM, without having any strict .NET dependency visible within the PE headers. You'd have to read the source to know, which we don't have, but those which do have access to the VS.NET source claim that it uses managed code. So you can either rely on demon.co.uk's logic -- which we've already seen can be faulty -- or rely on those who actually have access to the source. At which point we can realize that Microsoft is still using more managed code than SuSE. :-) - Jon ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] could linux be MORE .Net then windows ?
Hi, You don't have to have a look at the source code to determine whether Visual Studio 2005 uses managed code. You missed the fact that Visual Studio 2005 is much more than a single devenv.exe. It has a lot of DLLs and supporting exe files and a lot of them are entirely managed assemblies. Also note that if you interact with managed code using CorBindToRuntimeEx() for example the unamanged code that interacts with managed code won't became managed code. Managed code is IL code. Kornél - Original Message - From: Jonathan Pryor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ted leslie [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: mono-list@lists.ximian.com Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 1:08 PM Subject: Re: [Mono-list] could linux be MORE .Net then windows ? On Mon, 2006-03-27 at 04:28 -0500, ted leslie wrote: This article, with at least a bit of (hopefully accurate) research behind it, seems to state a shocking conclusion: article: http://www.grimes.demon.co.uk/dotnet/vistaAndDotnet.htm#conclusion And the rebuttal: http://blogs.msdn.com/danielfe/archive/2005/12/16/504847.aspx An interesting point is that demon.co.uk says this: If anyone tells you that Visual Studio .NET is a managed application, you instantly know that they know nothing about .NET. Simply typing dumpbin devenv.exe /headers (assuming you have devenv.exe in your path) will prove this: the location in the COM Descriptor Directory is zero. While danielfe says that VS2005 has 7.5 million lines of managed code. Why such a large difference? First of all, you can have apps which embed the .NET runtime. grimes.co.uk mentions this, even mentioning that mscoree.dll! CorBindToRuntimeEx() will be bound. However, this isn't entirely correct. IIRC, the .NET runtime can be instantiated and embedded through normal COM interfaces. Result: no explicit link between an embedding app and the .NET runtime, unless you want to disassemble the whole thing and look for the .NET runtime GUID So running `dumpbin.exe devenv.exe /headers` won't give you the correct result. Furthermore, due to .NET's terrific COM interop support, .NET objects can be used as COM objects. Thus, VS.NET can use .NET objects through COM, without having any strict .NET dependency visible within the PE headers. You'd have to read the source to know, which we don't have, but those which do have access to the VS.NET source claim that it uses managed code. So you can either rely on demon.co.uk's logic -- which we've already seen can be faulty -- or rely on those who actually have access to the source. At which point we can realize that Microsoft is still using more managed code than SuSE. :-) - Jon ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] could linux be MORE .Net then windows ?
On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 06:08:17 -0500 Jonathan Pryor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2006-03-27 at 04:28 -0500, ted leslie wrote: This article, with at least a bit of (hopefully accurate) research behind it, seems to state a shocking conclusion: At which point we can realize that Microsoft is still using more managed code than SuSE. :-) Anyone on the Mono project care to guess how many lines of managed code (re:mono) could be in a Q1 2007 Suse release? you never know, maybe it could be more then 20 Million lines ? - Jon ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
