Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
On Wed, 15 Oct 2003, Diane Wiley wrote: Why is it that so many of the white men think that Jennings was opposed because he was a white male, when they can clearly see that the process was flawed, whatever the legal requirements were? It's like harrassing the umpire. Next time around there will be a free ride for any white male whatsoever, no questions asked. That's the way they like it, white power forever. --David Shove Roseville REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
I never heard any of the critics say as Jim Boyd does that the candidate needed to be a person of color because the majority of students are of color. I heard that people were upset that David Jennings had historically taken political positions antagonistic or contrary to the views of the vast majority of residents of Minneapolis on questions related to race(i.e. divestiture in South Africa to end apartheid). These historic positions I believe rightly cause one to question whether David Jennings would be the best qualified individual to head the Minneapolis Public School System. I have been further unimpressed by his reaction to the controversy. Rather than explaining his past positions and how or whether his views have changed or expressing a willingness to discuss his past views and current views to answer community members questions and concerns he appeared to immediately become defensive and dismissive of the concerns. I also find it remarkable that people don't understand that equal opportunity does not exist when only one internal candidate is interviewed for the position. I believe that the school board needs the community's support behind a superintedent and this is even more important when the internal candidate being considered is not traditionally credentialed. I don't understand why David Jennings could not have continued to benefit the district as a lobbyist, consultant or in some other capacity if his presumed political connections or influence or experience are what the school district found so desireable. I find it sickening when someone calls rascism in a situation when it is their views that are in question and not their race. I believe it was David Jennings' views and sensitivity to questions of race that were of concern and not the color of his skin. The views of concern were expressed as a matter of public record when he was a state legislator and I believe it to be perfectly valid for community members to want answers to their questions about these past votes and positions even if they were taken 20 years ago. It's a shame he did not take the opportunity to respond in a constructive manner by respectfully offerring to meet with the questioners and attempt to address the concerns. I believe his reaction to the questions confirmed his discomfort with the questions and in my mind supports the verisimilitude of those community activists who question his sensitivity and understanding of questions of racial and cultural diversity. The reaction of the broader community (including on this list) has been very disappointing. Personally, I am gravely disappointed that the community seemed unable to engage in a conversation about this without making broad accusations of those with whom they disagreed. Whatever happened to there being no stupid questions? Since when did it become inappropriate to raise questions about a school board decision simply because they are elected? David Strand Loring Park --- Chris Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Shawn Lewis wrote: Jim Boyd: Jennings deserved a chance to try Jim Boyd Published October 12, 2003 David Jennings and the Minneapolis school district got the shaft. It was administered by perennially angry rabble-rousers who can't see beyond their own narrow agenda. They were aided by a school board that didn't lay the proper groundwork for naming Jennings, but for this crowd that probably wouldn't have made any difference. http://www.startribune.com/stories/1519/4147542.html I think Jim Boyd's Sunday editorial gave the clearest and most accurate view of the situation I've seen yet. It should be required reading for anyone wanting to comment on the topic of David Jennings as MPS superintendent for, if no other reason, it clears up just what the laws say and do not say about what requirements a school district superintendent must meet and what obligations the school board has with respect to choosing a superintendent. I happen to agree with Boyd's position as well. Chris Johnson Fulton REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls __ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe,
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
In a message dated 10/16/2003 4:33:34 AM Central Daylight Time, David Strand writes: I never heard any of the critics say as Jim Boyd does that the candidate needed to be a person of color because the majority of students are of color That argument was out there, nonetheless. Two examples: A column by Clarence Hightower in Insight News. An opinionated news item in the Pulse of the Twin Cities by Ed Felien. Passages from both pasted are below, after two short paragraphs of commentary by me. The Strib doesn't have a problem with reverse racism, when it can be utilized to support the status quo. The Strib supported Carol Johnson because she was a trusted team player, not a boat rocker or feather ruffler. Johnson was qualified and black, and could therefore help to muzzle the NAACP. No need to look further. The Strib doesn't have a problem with reverse racism when it serves to stifle dissent and paralyze opposition to the status quo. The Strib never took anyone to task for saying Isn't it wonderful that we have a black female superintendent! and How dare you criticize our black superintendent! --- In Minnesota, its one and done for our people by Clarence Hightower President/CEO Minneapolis Urban League http://www.insightnews.com/commentary.asp?mode=displayarticleID=924 Many will say that I am wrong. Some will say that I am off base. A few will say that I am barking up the wrong tree. Well, a few days ago this great state could have proved me wrong. Carol Johnson, a person of color, vacated her position as superintendent of Minneapolis Public Schools. Did the school board hire another person of color? No! Did the school board interview another person of color? No! Did the school board seek the opinion of folks of color? No! There couldnt have been a better opportunity to prove me wrong. I mean, after all, the Minneapolis Public Schools system is 70% students of color. There is a tremendous achievement gap between students of color and White students. The district has acknowledged this gap and fashioned a 12-point plan to improve the achievement of students of color. Here was a great chance to prove me wronghire a superintendent of color! What is the School Board doing now? Wednesday 01 October @ 14:04:48 by Ed Felien http://www.pulsetc.com/article.php?sid=641mode=order=0 Now, they have appointed Dave Jennings as Superintendent of Public Schools for Minneapolis. Why would they appoint a former head of the Republican Party to lead the schools in a heavily Democratic city? Why would they appoint a white male to lead a school system that that now counts a non-white majority and furthermore a person who voted against making Martin Luther King Day a State holiday and who voted against sanctions for South Africa when it was practicing apartheid? Why would they appoint someone with no education experience and no education credentials to run an education system? -Doug Mann, King Field Mann for School Board web site: http://educationright.tripod.com REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
It is unfortunate that people are so ready to throw around the terms racist and reverse racist. We all know how much baggage they carry. If you can't craft your arguments without actually using those words, it's probably not very well considered. I understand that there is mixed opinion on why Jennings was not a suitable candidate, depending on what your sources are, but can someone explain to me why it *would be* wrong for a community of color to express their preference for a leader of color? Should not the school board be making an attempt to keep their finger on the pulse of what their community wants? If you're going to reply, I again encourage you to try and justify your statements without using loaded words. Regards, Jason Stone | Hale --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 10/16/2003 4:33:34 AM Central Daylight Time, David Strand writes: I never heard any of the critics say as Jim Boyd does that the candidate needed to be a person of color because the majority of students are of color That argument was out there, nonetheless. Two examples: A column by Clarence Hightower in Insight News. An opinionated news item in the Pulse of the Twin Cities by Ed Felien. Passages from both pasted are below, after two short paragraphs of commentary by me. The Strib doesn't have a problem with reverse racism, when it can be utilized to support the status quo. The Strib supported Carol Johnson because she was a trusted team player, not a boat rocker or feather ruffler. Johnson was qualified and black, and could therefore help to muzzle the NAACP. No need to look further. The Strib doesn't have a problem with reverse racism when it serves to stifle dissent and paralyze opposition to the status quo. The Strib never took anyone to task for saying Isn't it wonderful that we have a black female superintendent! and How dare you criticize our black superintendent! --- In Minnesota, it’s one and done for our people by Clarence Hightower President/CEO Minneapolis Urban League http://www.insightnews.com/commentary.asp?mode=displayarticleID=924 Many will say that I am wrong. Some will say that I am off base. A few will say that I am barking up the wrong tree. Well, a few days ago this great state could have proved me wrong. Carol Johnson, a person of color, vacated her position as superintendent of Minneapolis Public Schools. Did the school board hire another person of color? No! Did the school board interview another person of color? No! Did the school board seek the opinion of folks of color? No! There couldn’t have been a better opportunity to prove me wrong. I mean, after all, the Minneapolis Public Schools system is 70% students of color. There is a tremendous achievement gap between students of color and White students. The district has acknowledged this gap and fashioned a 12-point plan to improve the achievement of students of color. Here was a great chance to prove me wrong…hire a superintendent of color! What is the School Board doing now? Wednesday 01 October @ 14:04:48 by Ed Felien http://www.pulsetc.com/article.php?sid=641mode=order=0 Now, they have appointed Dave Jennings as Superintendent of Public Schools for Minneapolis. Why would they appoint a former head of the Republican Party to lead the schools in a heavily Democratic city? Why would they appoint a white male to lead a school system that that now counts a non-white majority and furthermore a person who voted against making Martin Luther King Day a State holiday and who voted against sanctions for South Africa when it was practicing apartheid? Why would they appoint someone with no education experience and no education credentials to run an education system? -Doug Mann, King Field Mann for School Board web site: http://educationright.tripod.com REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls __ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
A casual look at the gap in major metro school districts suggests no advantage associated with race of the superintendent, but I don't think formal studies exist on this very provocative subject. Can anyone cite formal research here? Ann Berget Kingfield REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
St. Paul's superintendent, a woman of color, is now resident on the board of the St. Paul Area Chamber of Commerce, the same body that opposed - as she did - the last referendum passed by the city's voters. She openly defied her own board in her opposition and her membership on the Chamber board is without justification and loaded with conflict. A superintendent of color - or the color of a superintendent - is hardly indicative of the personal tastes or positions of the holder of the post. I find Pat Harvey's Chamber board membership and sticking her thumb in the eye of her employer(s) utterly inexcusable. It takes chutzpah and the kind of arrogance that throws public confidence in their elected board members in complete disarray. The Board should dismiss her forthwith, in my view. David Jennings had shown by his work in the district - not in the legislature - that the experience had a profound effect on his views of public education and the Constitutional responsibility to provide a system of quality public teaching and learning. That says nothing about the idiotic move to hire him without allowing public input and explaining and defending their choice. Andy Driscoll Saint Paul From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:18:11 -0400 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues A casual look at the gap in major metro school districts suggests no advantage associated with race of the superintendent, but I don't think formal studies exist on this very provocative subject. Can anyone cite formal research here? Ann Berget Kingfield REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Why is it that so many of the white men think that Jennings was opposed because he was a white male, when they can clearly see that the process was flawed, whatever the legal requirements were? Where is the evidence that the African American community members who spoke out were appalled simply because he was a white male? The process was flawed. I don't know if Jennings was the best person for the job or not, but I don't think this supposed reverse racism [which I don't believe in anyway -- prejudice maybe, but racism when you are not the powers that be] approach is very very harmful to sorting out what's best for the kids and the community -- White, Black, Asian, Native American, Latino. We need to bring the parents into the system to support it -- accusing them of being reverse racists doesn't help -- especially when the schools have a dismal record of reaching out to the various communities in a meaningful way. I know very well as the parent of an African American kid who was part of and tried to develop a support group for parents of African American kids at Seward -- we were actively opposed by the administration at the school and when we tried to get help from the area superintendent and Carol Johnson's office, we got none. And while I'm at it, somebody posted something a while ago about parents being totally responsible if their children aren't learning at school. This is either someone who isn't a parent or who has a kid who doesn't have any learning or other problems. This is a much more complicated issue than simply it's the parents' faults or it's the teachers' faults. It reminds me of the argument that African Americans are genetically inferior We have a school system where teachers have too many kids to focus on any one child who is having problems learning. We don't have enough tutors and we don't have enough resources. I frankly think that whoever takes over the district is not going to be able to do much, regardless of how smart they are or how good a plan they have. We as a society need to devote more resources to the schools and that is the only thing that is going to make a difference. diane wiley, recently moved to what I now know is Tangletown, thanks to Barbara Lickness REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Jim Boyd's op-ed piece was a hoot? Actually, I suspect that an awful lot of us found it be enlightening, thoughtful, accurate, and insightful. Jim Boyd wrote about what a lot of people in Minneapolis are feeling! We were all witnesses to one of the saddest episodes of political lynching in Minneapolis history! David Jennings is an honorable man who wanted simply to work hard to make Minneapolis public schools a better place for kids to learn and teachers to teach. The same cannot be said for Mr. Staten and his confederates. Jim Bernstein Fulton -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 11:21 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues Those 3 pieces in the Strib bring back memories of the 1960's when those Negro leaders were really getting out of control. Watch out Staten, Moss, and the rest of you troublemakers or the Strib will go out find some new leaders for the African American community! Boyd's editorial was a hoot. -Doug Mann REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Mr. Atherton - There is no law that prevents you from making a recommendation to the School Board or it's search committee or a private search firm if that is the process they use. They are not required however, to take your recommendation under consideration. Jim Bernstein Fulton -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Atherton Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 5:52 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues Pamela Taylor says: I admire Barb's agenda, and I totally agree that no superintendent will come armed with all the answers. That is why I stated we should not simply look at credentials. Look for the best candidate to do the job that needs to be done. I totally DISAGREE that the Board should hire a superintendent that comes without answers. The Board should hire someone who has proven that they know what works. That is, the person should come from a school district where it can be shown that they have had a truly significant impact on student achievement. That would pretty much rule out anyone from the MPS, including Mr. Jennings. I know what needs to be done. I can articulate an agenda with specific programs and backup my many of my proposals with research. If I, a lowly educational grad student, can do this we can certainly expect a candidate for district superintendent to do it as well. I believe that credentials tell you little or nothing about about how effective a candidate will be. Credentials tell you that someone is well versed in the status quo and THE STATUS QUO IS NOT WORKING! If anyone out there knows of good candidates, homegrown or otherwise, is ther a law stating you cannot make viable recommendations to the school board? They may or may not use them, but at least its being proactive, and helping to move the search and selection process along faster. I have nominated someone. I would like to see the opponents of Mr. Jennings make a nomination. If they don't think that Mr. Jennings can do the job, then let them tell us who can. At this point we might as well concede the fact that Whites need not apply. Let's go ahead and find a person of color who can actually close the achievement gap, not someone who will be just another token appointment. One of the school board members in Memphis cried when Carol Johnson was selected. Do you know why? Because she will do just as much in Memphis as she did here. The sad truth is that the person our Board will hire will do nothing of substance to change the MPS. Why? Because the power structure in this city is happy with the way things are and they are too afraid of losing what they have now to risk making any reforms. Michael Atherton Prospect Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
RE: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Jim Bernstein wrote: Mr. Atherton - There is no law that prevents you from making a recommendation to the School Board or it's search committee or a private firm if that is the process they use. They are not required however, to take your recommendation under consideration. I'm not sure what the point is. I thought my post made it clear that I did not expect the School Board to be interested in my thoughts on the matter. In fact, I probably agree with Mr. Brauer who has told me repeatedly that no one is interested in my opinion. I post so that people can have an alternative perspective, if they should so choose. That's generally why I read other people's posts, to see if they have an interesting take on something in a way that might never have occurred to me. Please don't feel obligated to read my posts; if you find them trite, redundant, or officious please press the Delete Key before reading them. Michael Atherton Prospect Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
on 10/13/03 11:20 AM, Michael Atherton at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In fact, I probably agree with Mr. Brauer who has told me repeatedly that no one is interested in my opinion. To clarify: I don't believe I've ever said this. While I believe Michael's proofs and research are frequently not as convincing as he thinks, I uphold his right to comment. I certainly lack the Oz-like power to judge how universally one's opinions are ignored. David Brauer Kingfield REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Actually, I believe one can focus too much on the longer history of an individual's politics and behavior and too easily disallow for changes in perspective. That, it seems to me, is counter to everyone's hope that people are both capable and desirous of changing outmoded views. We hope and work for rehabilitation in criminals but presume they cannot be so. We hope and work to change the hearts and minds of legislators and other policymakers and don't believe them when they have. It is cynical and sad to assume that people are incapable of reversing their world view and of reforming their behavior to comport with that reversal. This is one of the reasons alcoholics and other addicts find it necessary to remain anonymous, and one of the reasons too many people cannot either admit they've been wrong, made a mistake or that others can change their stripes with enlightenment. My reading of David Jennings' more recent past - his work and his views - is that he underwent something of an epiphany while at the Minneapolis Chamber, of all places and that his considerable assets could be put to very good use working for a new friend he made then - Carol Johnson. In doing so, he became what many believe is apostate in the eyes of his former Republican colleagues by reversing his position on public education - a system Republicans want to privatize and are doing well with by first starving it, then taking the decayed corpse and raising it over their heads to say, See, we told you it doesn't work. Now let's put education in the hands of those who can do better - the marketplace! The Minneapolis School Board was stupid in simply creating a line of succession by elevating Jennings to the superintendency without a series of hearings on why he should be so appointed. They could have predicted that in that town the disingenuous Statens, Gleasons and Mosses of the world would descend on that decision without a process justifying the selection of a white male - and make no mistake that is what this is all about. The board should have set up a process to allow community input on their selection, but Jennings' political history should not render him automatically unqualified to manage the system. And I don't believe for a minute that the lack of a PhD or an ED qualifies a person more than the innate talent and deep street experience and respect for what education is suppose to do - create the next generation of qualified citizens and leaders. Perhaps many people are more qualified to run the Minneapolis Schools, but I dare say few within shouting distance and as familiar and Jennings is with the workings of the system. As a dyed-in-the-wool progressive, I see little in this argument to throw Jennings out of contention because he's a white male and a/or has carried a Republican label...a Republican then, who has recently voted for Democrats. Labels and scarlet letters do no good to in running a society based on human values. Andy Driscoll Saint Paul on 10/12/03 9:23 PM, Joe Nathan [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tom Searles of Waconia doesn't try to defend Jennings' legislative history. Actually, I have looked at his history. Again, I ask you and others who are such strong defenders of Jennings, - what do YOU think he did in the legislature that would justify appointment, without looking around - to Mpls supt? Tom also says a similar process (i.e., not looking around) produced Carol Johnson. True. Good point. Was Minneapolis well served by not looking around then? It's not clear. The Minneapolis Public Schools had a very mixed record under Dr. Johnson. Despite the record of the fundraising arm of Minneapolis schools, in a paid advertisement today, to say it has been a time of progress, the record is quite mixed. (Yes, I have looked closely at this). REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Shawn Lewis wrote: Jim Boyd: Jennings deserved a chance to try Jim Boyd Published October 12, 2003 David Jennings and the Minneapolis school district got the shaft. It was administered by perennially angry rabble-rousers who can't see beyond their own narrow agenda. They were aided by a school board that didn't lay the proper groundwork for naming Jennings, but for this crowd that probably wouldn't have made any difference. http://www.startribune.com/stories/1519/4147542.html I think Jim Boyd's Sunday editorial gave the clearest and most accurate view of the situation I've seen yet. It should be required reading for anyone wanting to comment on the topic of David Jennings as MPS superintendent for, if no other reason, it clears up just what the laws say and do not say about what requirements a school district superintendent must meet and what obligations the school board has with respect to choosing a superintendent. I happen to agree with Boyd's position as well. Chris Johnson Fulton REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
[Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Jennings says about-face on superintendent's job rooted in pragmatism Allie Shah, Star Tribune Published October 12, 2003 It was opening night for David Jennings, and he wasn't showing any signs of jitters. Despite the scores of people who denounced his appointment as superintendent and demanded that the school board withdraw the offer, Jennings seemed determined to ride out the controversy. http://www.startribune.com/stories/462/4148535.html Doug Grow: When the going started getting tough, Jennings got out Doug Grow, Star Tribune Published October 12, 2003 Maybe the Background Noise Brigade (BNB) was right. Maybe David Jennings really wasn't qualified to be the superintendent of Minneapolis schools. The BNBers -- the Rev. Randolph Staten and a handful of others -- hadn't even really warmed up when Jennings threw in the towel. http://www.startribune.com/stories/462/4148619.html Jim Boyd: Jennings deserved a chance to try Jim Boyd Published October 12, 2003 David Jennings and the Minneapolis school district got the shaft. It was administered by perennially angry rabble-rousers who can't see beyond their own narrow agenda. They were aided by a school board that didn't lay the proper groundwork for naming Jennings, but for this crowd that probably wouldn't have made any difference. http://www.startribune.com/stories/1519/4147542.html Shawn Lewis, Field Neighbhorhood -- __ Sign-up for your own personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup CareerBuilder.com has over 400,000 jobs. Be smarter about your job search http://corp.mail.com/careers REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Hello List, Despite what Jennings says his reasons are for turning down the job, I believe if he really thought he was qualified he should have stayed. If he really believed that he had what it took to close the gap for kids and so forth, he should have toughed it out. IMHO, I think he really thought it would be an easier ride, and since it was not, he turned tail. I am not rooting for or against him, I just think it really shows what he is made of. Had it been me and I totally believed that I was the right person for the job, I would have stuck like glue. As the interim superintendent, he had to be aware of the clauses for appointing individuals without the seemingly required criteria, so that would have putan end to that particular argument. As to public input, I believe there should have been that. The school board certainly did not have to, but it would have been a nice curtesy prior to this hoopla. Maybe they still would have chosen him. And I do not believe that had Jennings stayed that parents and other interested community folks would have become disenfranchised altogether. I believe they would still participate even as they held Jennings feet to the fire to perform up to par. When the school board members are running for office, they solicit input as they try to garner support to win. Why stop asking for how they can serve thier constituents better once they get in? The same goes for the Mayor and City Council. That remark about how Jennings was given congratulatory handshakes by Mayor Rybek and others - big deal. The esteemed Mayor, City Council members and others were all given them too, and look at what's happening there. Thatis all fluff compared to the realwork that comes after the appointment. As forRev. Staten and the others whom have raised the ire of some, I say keep raising ire. Somebody has to do it. If people don't like whatthey are saying, nothing is stopping them from rising up and speaking out, too. Change is usually attributedto those who make some noise. In conclusion, this earthshattering announcement of Jennings departure has grown old. If people want input, tell us when the community input meeting is, and make sure all the school board members will be in attendance. Invite some KIDS. Invite the groups of parents who have special needs children,PTA moms and dads, talk about cultural competancy not just matters of race. Talk about what type of educational backgrounds teachers coming in to the schools where our children attend should have. What should our current crop of teachers have now. Talk about what parents can and should be doing. Talk about what CAN happen, and then set about the task of MAKING it happen. When it all boils down to it, there are a lot of highly educated socially illiterate individuals walking around with Ph D's. Ihave personally met a few and I am not impressed. Find and hire the best person for the job. Don't look to hire credentials. You may find yourself being disappointed. By the way, Doug Mann, when are you throwing your hat into the ring? I like your politics. You are very consistent and have back-upinformation when you speak out. Make sure you are at the big meeting. Let me know when your book comes out. Pamela Taylor (Whose granddaughter currently attends kindergarten in a Minneapolis school, and is the only one, according to her teacher, who can read in the class, and whom am hoping that her enthusiasim for learning will not be suffocated by the system, weighing in from Tampa, FL) Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Pam said: Had it been me and I totally believed that I was the right person for the job, I would have stuck like glue. I say: At what cost? Yes, I think it's human instinct to fight for what is yours. But, to keep the school board embroiled in a battle that wasn't going to go away any time soon could prove to be an even costlier venture for the kids in Minneapolis. Who wins in that scenario. This isn't about a personal victory for David Jennings. It sounds like he is a resilient man who will find plenty of ways to contribute. Hopefully, he will continue at the MPS to help guide whoever it is they do choose. At any rate, I am sure he will land on his feet. My personal agenda is to advocate for the children at Whittier School. For their sakes and for the future of this school I would like to see the decision regarding superintendent made quickly so that the attention to how we close the gap becomes paramount. I am not sure any one we choose for school superintendent will come armed with all the answers. I just think it will suck up a lot of attention for now and will steer away from what is important to me. That is improving the education of the kids in the school by my house. Barb Lickness Whittier = Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has. -- Margaret Mead __ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
In a previous post I said:"Had it been me and I totally believed that I was theright person for the job, I would have stuck likeglue."Barbara Lickness responded:At what cost? Yes, I think it's human instinct tofight for what is yours. But, to keep the school boardembroiled in a battle that wasn't going to go away anytime soon could prove to be an even costlier venturefor the kids in Minneapolis. Who wins in thatscenario. This isn't about a personal victory forDavid Jennings. It sounds like he is a resilient manwho will find plenty of ways to contribute. Hopefully,he will continue at the MPS to help guide whoever itis they do choose. At any rate, I am sure he will landon his feet. My response: Jennings knew, and should have understood,the cost when he took the job.The smart move would have been toprepare for the expected fallout, as it appeared to be brewing when Johnson was considering taking the new position. And, if the belief is that he is resilient, he should have been okay. I believe either way the school board was going to be embroiled in a battle, so no news there. I believe, as I stated before, the focus should be on this community input that people are wanting to see happen, so that the battledoes not have to drag on so long. Barbara Lickness said: My personal agenda is to advocate for the children atWhittier School. For their sakes and for the future ofthis school I would like to see the decision regardingsuperintendent made quickly so that the attention tohow we close the gap becomes paramount. I am not sureany one we choose for school superintendent will comearmed with all the answers. I just think it will suckup a lot of attention for now and will steer away fromwhat is important to me. That is improving theeducation of the kids in the school by my house. Pamela Taylor says: I admire Barb's agenda, and I totally agree that no superintendent will come armed with all the answers. That is why I statedwe should notsimply look at credentials. Look for the best candidate to do the job that needs to be done. And thenholdALL feet (Super/MPSB/Parents/Teachers/Community/etc.) to the fire for the sake of our kids. If anyone out there knows of good candidates, homegrown or otherwise, is ther a law stating you cannot make viable recommendations to the school board? They may or may not use them, but at least its being proactive, and helping to move the search and selection process along faster. "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has." -- Margaret Mead Barb and I seem to share an affinity for the same quote.It has always been one of my favorites. Why, because it has always rung true. Pamela Taylor (Tampa) Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Maybe we should just take Jennings at his word -- dealing with this was taking his time and attention away from the work he really wants to do -- close the achievement gap between poor minority and white students. By withdrawing he can concentrate on that work, which is why he took the job in the first place. Barbara Nelson Burnsville (formerly of Seward) REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Pamela Taylor says: I admire Barb's agenda, and I totally agree that no superintendent will come armed with all the answers. That is why I stated we should not simply look at credentials. Look for the best candidate to do the job that needs to be done. I totally DISAGREE that the Board should hire a superintendent that comes without answers. The Board should hire someone who has proven that they know what works. That is, the person should come from a school district where it can be shown that they have had a truly significant impact on student achievement. That would pretty much rule out anyone from the MPS, including Mr. Jennings. I know what needs to be done. I can articulate an agenda with specific programs and backup my many of my proposals with research. If I, a lowly educational grad student, can do this we can certainly expect a candidate for district superintendent to do it as well. I believe that credentials tell you little or nothing about about how effective a candidate will be. Credentials tell you that someone is well versed in the status quo and THE STATUS QUO IS NOT WORKING! If anyone out there knows of good candidates, homegrown or otherwise, is ther a law stating you cannot make viable recommendations to the school board? They may or may not use them, but at least its being proactive, and helping to move the search and selection process along faster. I have nominated someone. I would like to see the opponents of Mr. Jennings make a nomination. If they don't think that Mr. Jennings can do the job, then let them tell us who can. At this point we might as well concede the fact that Whites need not apply. Let's go ahead and find a person of color who can actually close the achievement gap, not someone who will be just another token appointment. One of the school board members in Memphis cried when Carol Johnson was selected. Do you know why? Because she will do just as much in Memphis as she did here. The sad truth is that the person our Board will hire will do nothing of substance to change the MPS. Why? Because the power structure in this city is happy with the way things are and they are too afraid of losing what they have now to risk making any reforms. Michael Atherton Prospect Park REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Analysis of Jennings departure continues
Those 3 pieces in the Strib bring back memories of the 1960's when those Negro leaders were really getting out of control. Watch out Staten, Moss, and the rest of you troublemakers or the Strib will go out find some new leaders for the African American community! Boyd's editorial was a hoot. -Doug Mann REMINDERS: 1. Think a member has violated the rules? Email the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. Minneapolis Issues Forum - A City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
