Re: CC'ing list people but not getting CC'd?
Am 2007-08-18 02:02:35, schrieb Kai Grossjohann: Which email client does he use? He claims that MFT is used for replies, but the name suggests that it should be used for followups, not replies. And whats the difference? Greetings Michelle Konzack Systemadministrator Tamay Dogan Network Debian GNU/Linux Consultant -- Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/ # Debian GNU/Linux Consultant # Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886 50, rue de Soultz MSN LinuxMichi 0033/6/6192519367100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com) signature.pgp Description: Digital signature
Re: CC'ing list people but not getting CC'd?
On Sun, Aug 19, 2007 at 12:00:24AM +0200, Michelle Konzack wrote: Am 2007-08-18 02:02:35, schrieb Kai Grossjohann: Which email client does he use? He claims that MFT is used for replies, but the name suggests that it should be used for followups, not replies. And whats the difference? Replies go to the author of a message only, followups additionally go to the recipients. Kai
Re: CC'ing list people but not getting CC'd?
On Mon, Aug 20, 2007 at 08:56:19AM +0200, martin f krafft wrote: also sprach Kai Grossjohann [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2007.08.18.0202 +0200]: Which email client does he use? He claims that MFT is used for replies, but the name suggests that it should be used for followups, not replies. User-Agent: Gnus/5.110006 (No Gnus v0.6) Emacs/21.4 (gnu/linux) Sure, MFT implies followup, but isn't that pretty much the same as list-reply? Well, we have three things: followups, list-replies, and replies. Followups and list-replies are quite similar in most practical situations, but replies are quite different. I think his issue is with: - you like CCs to the list, so you set MFT on all your mails to the list address as well as yours. - I see your mail and reply to it, mutt sees the MFT and preserves it. It needs not add the list address, and I don't want it to add mine, so it copies the MFT header with the list address as well as yours to my mail. If you reply, then it gets sent to me only. If you followup, then the list address will be added since it is in MFT (as you say). - Someone else replies to *my* mail in the same way, and his mailer honours MFT, so no *you* also get CC'd on the reply, even though the subject may have diverged and you're not interested anymore. I asked for Ccs, so I got what I deserved. If I subscribe to a list, then I get all postings, even though I might only be interested in part of the topics. That's the same thing, isn't it? I generally don't mind following threads to which I have posted, even if they diverge (I have a good thread/subject blacklisting in place). However, Junio doesn't, and at least wrt git, he's way more active, so I ought to really respect his preferences. It's not clear to me what Junio wants. If we wants no Cc's, then he can just put in an MFT header that excludes himself. Shouldn't he then be a great fan of MFT since it allows him to express what he wants? Sorry, perhaps some of this is bogus, I am quite confused by now. Also, my Gnus terminology might not map well to a Mutt audience. Apologies for this. For example, I don't really know what is a list-reply, so the above could be wrong. In Gnus speak, there is only reply (to author) and followup (to author and all recipiencts, unless modified by MFT). (And then there are wide replies and very wide replies that I never understood.) Perhaps Mutt users mean something different when they talk about replies or followups. Kai
Re: CC'ing list people but not getting CC'd?
also sprach Kai Grossjohann [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2007.08.21.2215 +0200]: - Someone else replies to *my* mail in the same way, and his mailer honours MFT, so no *you* also get CC'd on the reply, even though the subject may have diverged and you're not interested anymore. I asked for Ccs, so I got what I deserved. If I subscribe to a list, then I get all postings, even though I might only be interested in part of the topics. That's the same thing, isn't it? No; from what I understand, M-F-T keeps growing, so when I reply to your mail (which had your M-F-T on it), my M-F-T also includes your address. That's a legitimate criticism, to be honest, or don't you hate those ever growing CC lists, which are basically the same? It's not clear to me what Junio wants. If we wants no Cc's, then he can just put in an MFT header that excludes himself. Shouldn't he then be a great fan of MFT since it allows him to express what he wants? He wants CCs. Also, my Gnus terminology might not map well to a Mutt audience. Apologies for this. For example, I don't really know what is a list-reply, so the above could be wrong. The manual describes it as: Reply to the current or tagged message(s) by extracting any addresses which match the addresses given by the lists or subscribe commands, but also honor any Mail-Followup-To header(s) if the $honor_followup_to configuration variable is set. Using this when replying to messages posted to mailing lists helps avoid duplicate copies being sent to the author of the message you are replying to. -- martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^.*|tr * mailto:; [EMAIL PROTECTED] solange man nicht die moral des christentums als kapitalverbrechen am leben empfindet, haben dessen verteidiger gutes spiel. - friedrich nietzsche spamtraps: [EMAIL PROTECTED] digital_signature_gpg.asc Description: Digital signature (see http://martin-krafft.net/gpg/)
Re: CC'ing list people but not getting CC'd?
also sprach Kai Grossjohann [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2007.08.18.0202 +0200]: Which email client does he use? He claims that MFT is used for replies, but the name suggests that it should be used for followups, not replies. User-Agent: Gnus/5.110006 (No Gnus v0.6) Emacs/21.4 (gnu/linux) Sure, MFT implies followup, but isn't that pretty much the same as list-reply? I think his issue is with: - you like CCs to the list, so you set MFT on all your mails to the list address as well as yours. - I see your mail and reply to it, mutt sees the MFT and preserves it. It needs not add the list address, and I don't want it to add mine, so it copies the MFT header with the list address as well as yours to my mail. - Someone else replies to *my* mail in the same way, and his mailer honours MFT, so no *you* also get CC'd on the reply, even though the subject may have diverged and you're not interested anymore. I generally don't mind following threads to which I have posted, even if they diverge (I have a good thread/subject blacklisting in place). However, Junio doesn't, and at least wrt git, he's way more active, so I ought to really respect his preferences. -- martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^.*|tr * mailto:; [EMAIL PROTECTED] click the start menu and select 'shut down.' spamtraps: [EMAIL PROTECTED] digital_signature_gpg.asc Description: Digital signature (see http://martin-krafft.net/gpg/)
Re: CC'ing list people but not getting CC'd?
also sprach Nicolas Rachinsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2007.08.17.1303 +0200]: If you do this bind in a message-hook, it should solve the problem, if you reply to a message from the pager. And you can bind L in the index to a macro that opens the message and does an L again. I haven't tried this, but I think it should work. Okay, this does work as you say. In the mean time, however, I found that Junio, the git maintainer, really just dislikes M-F-T: http://marc.info/?l=gitm=113882569532399w=2 Thus, I better comply and *stop* setting the header altogether. send-hook . 'set followup_to' send-hook '~C [EMAIL PROTECTED]' 'unset followup_to' I am also experimenting with another solution: if I use my procmail filters to *add* the Mail-Followup-To header, including all From/To/Cc addresses, but have followup_to unset as per the above, I *should* get the desired effect: list-reply would honour M-F-T and put everyone including the mailing list on To/Cc, but since mutt does not add the header by itself, it is not on the outgoing message. I have yet to verify this and publish the solution to the git mailing list. But if you have comments right now, I'd love to hear them! Cheers, -- martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^.*|tr * mailto:; [EMAIL PROTECTED] cs class at 8:30am. ugly. if you can wake up early enough to get good grades here, you need to develop hacker habits... -- jeff bailey on #debian-devel spamtraps: [EMAIL PROTECTED] digital_signature_gpg.asc Description: Digital signature (see http://martin-krafft.net/gpg/)
Re: CC'ing list people but not getting CC'd?
* martin f krafft [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2007-08-17 12:48 +0200]: One solution would be to bind L to group-reply for the git mailing list, but a reply-hook is too late for that, and I don't have a special folder for git mail. If you do this bind in a message-hook, it should solve the problem, if you reply to a message from the pager. And you can bind L in the index to a macro that opens the message and does an L again. I haven't tried this, but I think it should work. HTH, Nicolas -- http://www.rachinsky.de/nicolas
Re: CC'ing list people but not getting CC'd?
On Fri, Aug 17, 2007 at 04:38:30PM +0200, martin f krafft wrote: In the mean time, however, I found that Junio, the git maintainer, really just dislikes M-F-T: http://marc.info/?l=gitm=113882569532399w=2 Which email client does he use? He claims that MFT is used for replies, but the name suggests that it should be used for followups, not replies. Kai
