[NSP] Influence of the Cloughs on Northumbrian Piping
For those of you with an interest in the history and development of nsp playing, next Monday, the 10th of May, Chris Ormston, the leading exponent of the Clough style, will be appearing at the Chantry in Morpeth, Northumberland, for one night only, don't miss it. Chris will be telling us about the legacy of the Clough family of Newsham, playing some music to demonstrate their style, and you will all get a chance to play some tunes too. cheers Tim -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Smallpipes Simulator
It seems then that this Simulator is very much of the moment, since all the planes can do at the moment is taxi, (due to the antics of what the Mirror has called the VILE-CANO, hyphenated in case their readers didn't get it!) Maybe we could go for the more snappy title of Smallpipes Chanteranddronessimulator Tim - Original Message - From: Anthony Robb anth...@robbpipes.com To: Dartmouth NPS nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 8:56 AM Subject: [NSP] Smallpipes Simulator Hellos apiece This is an intriguing idea but I can't help wondering whether simulator might be too strong a claim? In 35 years of piping tuition, not only in the UK but also Germany, NZ and USA, I've clocked up over 5000 tutee-hrs of experience and the first (also main and universal) stumbling block with our instrument is keeping the bag well-filled and maintaining a steady pressure. A smallpipes simulator that does not have this as part of its make up is a bit like having a flight simulator that only does the taxiing bit. There may be plans to provide under-arm pressure sensitive pads to simulate this main difficulty but until they are available perhaps a more accurate description would be in order? Cheers Anthony -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Fame
Money saving tip. Rather than spending hundreds, or even thousands, on a personalised number plate for your car, simply change your name by deed poll to the registration you already have. N713PNL - Original Message - From: Francis Wood oatenp...@googlemail.com To: Dartmouth NPS nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:12 PM Subject: [NSP] Fame Fame . . . . An article by Tina Clough. Wonder if she's a relation . . . . http://www.thelegaldeedpollservice.org.uk/page53.htm Francis To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: NSP duet with other instruments
This is interesting to me as I have an unreconstructed baroque violin from about 1820 which is currently strung with Larsen strings and playing in G, wheras we also have a c.1900 czech violin strung with I know not what which is tuned down to F'n'abit for playing with nsp. Seems it might be better to have them the other way round. Am I right in thinking that before 1920ish and the current standardised concert pitch at G that many instruments' G was lower anyway, which would have led to lower tension anyway. Also is pitch purely dependent on tension, does the same tension in gut and metal and composite automatically produce the same pitch? and if not, were non gut strings made to emulate the pitch/tension combination of gut strings so as not to upset the structural tensions of a strung fiddle? Trouble is, if I tune down the baroque, which i prefer to play, I'll play the pipes less. Please don't let that affect the response of anyone who has heard me play, fiddle or pipes! Tim - Original Message - From: christopher.bi...@ec.europa.eu To: phi...@gruar.clara.net; nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 9:14 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: NSP duet with other instruments Stringing of baroque violins is another can of worms since tension varied widely according to local conventions and personal preferences. There is also the question of equal tension versus progressive tension and whether wound strings should be used for the G and/or D. It is, or at least used to be, widely believed that baroque string tension was lower than modern. As Philip points out, this is not true - even though playing was generally less high-tension than modern violin playing. A good starting point for anyone interested is here: http://www.nrinstruments.demon.co.uk/hstvnst.html (I have no vested interests). It is interesting that modern baroque is an approximation of common 19th century practise. I have personally found that very slightly progressive tension using rows CDEF (all gut) for the ascending strings of a violin at A = 415 gives good results (strictly equal tension gives a very thick G string and a very thin E, which may be historically correct (cf. Leopold Mozart's treatise), but feels uncomfortable to my modern fingers). Some argue that equal tension really means equal feel anyway. DEFG would give similar results a semitone lower. I have also tried tuning a modern violin fitted with Dominant Heavy strings down to concert F and the results were good. I think the heavy versions of a lot of strings on the market today could give satisfactory tensions at lower pitch (especially the steel one, if you like that sort of thing). c -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Philip Gruar Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2010 1:37 PM To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [NSP] NSP duet with other instruments Margaret's comment: When I'm playing duets with Andy's nsp, I always tune down. For me, I've spent a long time trying to find the right fiddle and strings so it doesn't sound like a kipper-box (or I hope it doesn't) when tuned lower. made me think, what about baroque violinists? Specialist baroque orchestras and soloists play at A=415 or a semitone lower than modern standard pitch and very occasionally even lower. This is getting on for low enough to play with standard-pitch Northumbrian pipes. Proper baroque violins have the neck set at a flatter angle than ordinary modern violins/fiddles (neck angle was increased in the 19th cent. among other things to enable higher string tension - louder tone). 18th century classical technique had a lot more in common with the playing styles of traditional music than modern classical technique does e.g. bow-hold, sometimes playing with fiddle held lower, using first position and open strings more etc. - and generally it was less high-tension than modern violin playing. This doesn't mean it lacks life, and good baroque violinists certainly don't sound as if they're playing on a kipper-box strung with knicker elastic. Would using specialist baroque-violin gut strings on a standard fiddle make for better results at the lower pitch? Just some thoughts from a non-string player, so excuse any ignorance shown! Philip To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: kipper box
struggling to find a kipper box, but plenty of cigar boxes here http://www.cigarboxnation.com/page/free-plans Tim - Original Message - From: Francis Wood oatenp...@googlemail.com To: Dru Brooke-Taylor d...@brooke-taylor.freeserve.co.uk Cc: nsp nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 2:16 PM Subject: [NSP] Re: kipper box On 10 Feb 2010, at 13:26, Dru Brooke-Taylor wrote: I've a clear mental image of seeing somewhere, a photograph of an old street musician playing what looked very like a strung kipper box. He was holding it like a fiddle. Hello Dru and others, This does sound extremely likely. People have always improvised string instruments using boxes that were immediately available. Even Fritz Kreisler is said to have begun on a cigar box fiddle. Though I wonder why a well-to-do cigar smoking Viennese family didn't just give him a real fiddle. I recently did some workshops in French primary schools, making instant instruments. One of these was a harp-like thing for which I requested substantial numbers of expanded-polystyrene boxes. I was sure these would be difficult to procure, and certainly didn't realise that the nearest town, La Rochelle, is a major fishing port. Perfect boxes were obtained in generous quantities, none of them smelling fishy, because they were all new. Whether or not there is a recollection or photo of a kipper box fiddle, it's a good bet that a few people will have tried this in the past, and may even have been pretty fair performers. Francis To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: kipper box
I'm confused, how did we get to knickers from kippers? No, on second thoughts don't answer that. What I'd like to know is, what is the correspondence about, the lowering of the tension in the elastic of the knickers, or the tension in the elastic of the lowered knickers? Tim - Original Message - From: Julia Say julia@nspipes.co.uk To: tim rolls BT tim.ro...@btconnect.com; Francis Wood oatenp...@googlemail.com Cc: marga...@watchorn7.plus.com; NSP group nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2010 1:26 PM Subject: Re: [NSP] Re: kipper box On 9 Feb 2010, Francis Wood wrote: I'm following this correspondance about baroque violinists and their lowered knicker elastic tension with some puzzlement. Maybe further resarch is needed. Would someone care to admit to a close enough acquaintance with a female baroque violinist to safely enquire about her knicker elastic? Over to you, gentlemen. Facetiously, Julia To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Key Matters. Not pipes, but of musical interest
I'm not sure how many people outside the UK will be able to access this, as it''s a BBC thing and I know there can be problems, but there's an interesting series of 1/4 hr programmes on the radio this week called Key Matters. As links are a problem too I'll type it, go to bbc.co.uk/programmes/b009yzy3. Or just look for Key Matters on the Radio 4 section. Tim -- References Visible links Hidden links: 1. http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b009yzy3 To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: bag shape
.and isn't the language fascinating in its own right. To blether on in my experience is to talk at length/nonsense, such as you might expect from a wind-bag I'd presumed it came from the same root as bladder, but Chambers just goes back to Old Norse blathra - talk foolishly, which is where I come in Oxter is also given as a verb, to take under the arm. I had only heard the noun usage before. Tim - Original Message - From: Anthony Robb anth...@robbpipes.com To: cal...@aol.com; Francis Wood oatenp...@googlemail.com Cc: Nsplist NPS nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2010 8:46 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: bag shape What a fascinating thread! The problem I see with an inverted bag is getting the chanter stock airtight in what amounts to a ridgy hole. It's bad enough with a nice soft bag with the seam on the outside and the usual leather wedges. I hate to admit it but the slightly deeper, shorter Northumbrian style bag is far less comfortable the GHB style. The narrower profile and sloped front of the latter makes hardly any left arm contact with seam (which is what used to cause me discomfort). Barry's comment that the majority of his forearm is not in bag contact at all makes me puzzled. I suppose if the bag neck was long enough the forearm could be well below the bag and not in contact but adopting such a position would surely make the wrists bend in two planes at once. Is this not tiring after a while? Barry's other comment about getting the bag well up towards the armpit is good advice but not a new idea. There is even a dialect saying for this process, oxter yor blether (oxter being armpit and blether being bag)! All perhaps another example of Bill Hedworth's gem , Each has to find their own salvation with this instrument! --- On Wed, 27/1/10, Francis Wood oatenp...@googlemail.com wrote: From: Francis Wood oatenp...@googlemail.com Hello Alex and all, You seem to suggest that turning the bag inside out is unlikely. I have two reasons for disagreeing, firstly because I have done so myself and secondly because I have seen many early bags constructed in this way. You will find that this was the usual method if you look at the available iconography or examine old examples. There has to be a good reason why this was adopted for many different kinds of pipes in different centuries and different countries. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] blowpipe
I think bellows blowpipe length is an are well worth looking at. In three years playing I haven't actually owned a set of pipes (although I am now close to a purchase) but have relied on the kindness of others who have lent me sets. Because they were borrowed I felt unable to adjust the pipes to suit my shape. As a result I have played regularly on five different sets, and on three of these I have had problems with the blow pipe separating, sometimes at the designed point, sometimes at another joint. I put this down to having learned a particular comfortable position with my first set, and then failing to adjust to each new set. When I did make such changes to the position of the bag as were necessary for me to play without loss of bellows, I found the new position quite awkward, and as has been said, more effort to play as I could no longer just use the weight of my arm. Unfortunately I didn't take measurements of any of the sets. Although I have observed the necessary shape for a gentleman piper, and I am working towards it, I would still not yet say that I require a massively long blowpipe. What work has been done on blowpipe length, is it purely maker's preference? How many makers measure up a customer before making the pipes? Tim - Original Message - From: Richard York rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk To: Francis Wood oatenp...@googlemail.com; NSP group nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2010 10:19 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: bag shape Thanks greatly to one and all for these - great food for thought here. I'm interested that everyone's addressed the matter of how to make the existing bag shape comfortable, but no-one has offered experience of the tear-drop shape - are they very rare, or just deeply heretical? Meanwhile I shall try every position from armpit downwards for my existing bag, and seriously examine the matter of neck length. Its neck, not mine. (Thanks too, Mike S, for the off-list advice on position photo's - I'll try that.) I imagine, Barry, that bellows blowpipe length also came into your shifts of bag position? Interesting too the matter of which way the seam goes. I was convinced at first that it was the seam which was getting to me, but now think it's the bulge of the square bag shape - as suggested earlier in this string. Thanks Francis too for pointing up the pics on my own website... in fairness in have to say that while the Jon Swayne huge Flemish set and renaissance-type smaller set (both all brown) are comfortable, Jon does make the seam the modern way round. In the case of the massive Flemish set I've had to mend the protective strip on the outside of the seam more than once, as it's stuck rather than stitched in place. The Jim Parr medieval gaita-type ones (black bag, light boxwood) and the little hummelschen both have the seams on the inside and are very comfortable indeed. I've never had problems with the seasoning in them. Best wishes, Richard. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: NSP oil for pipes and key pads
I'd guess it's been around since Tudor times, there is the urban myth that Henry VIII wrote Greensleeves.. Tim - Original Message - From: Francis Wood oatenp...@googlemail.com To: Richard York rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk Cc: julia@nspipes.co.uk; NSP group nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 2010 11:05 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: NSP oil for pipes and key pads On 13 Jan 2010, at 11:01, Richard York wrote: Julia, I love this word snotomer but confess I haven't met it before, You haven't played the nose-flute, then? Francis To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: NSP
Hi All, Surely the Tyne and Weary pipes appelation should only apply to developments since 1973. Before that back to a point where Newcastle was a county in it's own right (someone fill in the dates here )it's Northumberland all the way. Perhaps to avoid contention we should adopt a new designation, as Scottish is to Scotland, and English is to England (Angleland) what about Northumberlish? Tim - Original Message - From: Anthony Robb anth...@robbpipes.com To: j...@millgreens.f2s.com; gibbonssoi...@aol.com Cc: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, January 06, 2010 8:15 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: NSP Thin ice here,I think, John. Leaving aside the century in which the unique sound of the pipes was created and whether the addition of keys improved this sound, there are real problems, these days, with the appellation Northumberland. You rightly point out that the Kingdom of Northumbria belonged to a different era to the modern version of the instrument but then so does Northumberland as now designated by the boundary changes of the 1970s. Jim is far closer to the truth when he refers to Northumbria as the home of our pipes as this region does imply the inclusion of what is now Tyne Wear, and Durham. The locals of course usually just referred to them as pipes and used appellations Scottish or Irish to denote otherwise. When geographical information was added for the benefit of a wider audience, Northumberland was used. This now, however, has a greater lack of accuracy than Northumbrian as it means that the very place where the piping developments you mention is excluded from the named location. Perhaps some would like us now to refer to Northumberland pipes for the older version and Tyne Wear pipes for the modern version? As aye Anthony --- On Tue, 5/1/10, gibbonssoi...@aol.com gibbonssoi...@aol.com wrote: From: gibbonssoi...@aol.com gibbonssoi...@aol.com Subject: [NSP] Re: NSP To: j...@millgreens.f2s.com Cc: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Tuesday, 5 January, 2010, 23:03 The pipes and the kingdom belong to different eras - the Northumbrian pipes reached something like their modern form in a similar time and place to the steam locomotive. But they were called 'Northumberland pipes' then, as were their simpler 'unimproved' pre-Peacock version. 'Northumbrian' is now used, confusingly, to refer to any of -the Anglo-Saxon kingdom -the modern county -the modern NE region, from the Tees to the border, never ever specifying which is meant. It is apparently a gross error to do so, though I never understood why John -- To get on or off this list see list information at [1]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: NSP
I guess we may have to consider allowing Durham, CHAPELRY OF WHITWORTH. The Chapelry of Whitworth is bounded by the Wear, dividing it from Brancepath on the North; by Tudhoe, in the Parish of Brancepath, on the East; by Merrington on the South-east and South; and by St. Andrew's Auckland on the South-west and West. John Robinson, of Coundon, found drowned the 23d day of August 1637. He was a piper. From: 'Chapelry of Whitworth', The History and Antiquities of the County Palatine of Durham: volume 3: Stockton and Darlington wards (1823), pp. 291-302. URL: [1]http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=76361amp;strque ry=northumberland piper Date accessed: 06 January 2010. Tim - Original Message - From: [2]Anthony Robb To: [3]...@millgreens.f2s.com ; [4]gibbonssoi...@aol.com ; [5]tim rolls BT Cc: [6]...@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, January 06, 2010 1:39 PM Subject: Re: [NSP] Re: NSP Hello Tim Guess you're thinking about developments such as concert G chanters and high C keys. It would be accurate but silly as we both know. Clearly the pipes have growing international interest but newcomers Googling Northumberland (pipes) would get a very half-baked picture of the instrument and its history. Even if Northumberland had gained widespread acceptance during the appropriate period a good case could now be made for Northumbrian. Surely we should stick with the accepted and now geographically accurate Northumbrian. It is, after all, what most of us call them. As aye Anthony --- On Wed, 6/1/10, tim rolls BT tim.ro...@btconnect.com wrote: From: tim rolls BT tim.ro...@btconnect.com Subject: [NSP] Re: NSP To: j...@millgreens.f2s.com, gibbonssoi...@aol.com, Anthony Robb anth...@robbpipes.com Cc: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Wednesday, 6 January, 2010, 12:09 Hi All, Surely the Tyne and Weary pipes appelation should only apply to developments since 1973. Before that back to a point where Newcastle was a county in it's own right (someone fill in the dates here )it's Northumberland all the way. Perhaps to avoid contention we should adopt a new designation, as Scottish is to Scotland, and English is to England (Angleland) what about Northumberlish? Tim - Original Message - From: Anthony Robb [7]anth...@robbpipes.com To: [8]...@millgreens.f2s.com; [9]gibbonssoi...@aol.com Cc: [10]...@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, January 06, 2010 8:15 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: NSP Thin ice here,I think, John. Leaving aside the century in which the unique sound of the pipes was created and whether the addition of keys improved this sound, there are real problems, these days, with the appellation Northumberland. You rightly point out that the Kingdom of Northumbria belonged to a different era to the modern version of the instrument but then so does Northumberland as now designated by the boundary changes of the 1970s. Jim is far closer to the truth when he refers to Northumbria as the home of our pipes as this region does imply the inclusion of what is now Tyne Wear, and Durham. The locals of course usually just referred to them as pipes and used appellations Scottish or Irish to denote otherwise. When geographical information was added for the benefit of a wider audience, Northumberland was used. This now, however, has a greater lack of accuracy than Northumbrian as it means that the very place where the piping developments you mention is excluded from the named location. Perhaps some would like us now to refer to Northumberland pipes for the older version and Tyne Wear pipes for the modern version? As aye Anthony --- On Tue, 5/1/10, [11]gibbonssoi...@aol.com [12]gibbonssoi...@aol.com wrote: From: [13]gibbonssoi...@aol.com [14]gibbonssoi...@aol.com Subject: [NSP] Re: NSP To: [15]...@millgreens.f2s.com Cc: [16]...@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Tuesday, 5 January, 2010, 23:03 The pipes and the kingdom belong to different eras - the Northumbrian pipes reached something like their modern form in a similar time and place to the steam locomotive. But they were called 'Northumberland pipes' then, as were their simpler 'unimproved' pre-Peacock version. 'Northumbrian' is now used, confusingly, to refer to any of -the Anglo-Saxon kingdom -the modern county -the modern NE region, from the Tees to the border, never ever specifying which is meant. It is apparently a gross error to do so, though I never understood why John -- To get on or off this list see list
[NSP] Re: NSP
Sorry Matt and all, Hadn't thought to look off the bottom of the page, just hit the reply all button. Will try to do better. Tim Etiquette Only couple of gross offenders, but please don't include EVERY message in a thread when you reply to it, just the relevant bits Happy New Year To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Radio Mics and channel 69
Perhaps this link will help answer a few of the questions implied below. The consultation period may be over, but it was unlikely to have made any difference anyway, may be more joy if 100,000 people contacted their MPs. http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consult/condocs/pmse_funding/summary/ Tim - Original Message - From: Richard York rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk To: NSP group nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, November 18, 2009 9:17 PM Subject: [NSP] Radio Mics and channel 69 Not instantly an obvious smallpipes issue, I realise, but enough pipers here are in bands or other organisations using radio mics to make this worth passing on, I hope. Monday's Radio 4 PM programme reported that the Gov't, in their Ofcom hat, are selling off the radio frequencies used in the UK by all radio mics, including loop systems, known as channel 69. They're going to re-assign different frequencies for this use, but existing equipment won't work on them, so will need replacing. To be really helpful they aren't telling which frequencies they'll be making available instead, or when they'll be doing it. They are apparently generously offering to pay for the equipment thus rendered useless, but only the value of the stuff at the time, not its replacement value. .. anyone want to guess the market value of a dead radio mic? I know the mics aren't re-tunable, I don't know about the receivers - we haven't got one yet. There's an article I found earlier today online at [1]web.http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2009/nov/17/ofcom-channel-69-rad io-frequencies So bands, churches, concert halls, theatres, amateur dramatic groups, schools, and anyone else using this equipment is going to be out of pocket, and inconvenienced too. Please complain! Best wishes, Richard. -- References 1. web.http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2009/nov/17/ofcom-channel-69-radio-frequencies To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.72/2511 - Release Date: 11/18/09 07:50:00
[NSP] Re: Barrington Hornpipe
Hi Francis, I expect you know this already, but for what it's worth BARRINGTON HORNPIPE. English, Hornpipe. England, Northumberland. G Major. Standard tuning. AABB. From A Tutor for the Northumbrian Small-pipes by J.W. Fenwick, published in the late 1800's; composed by Thomas Todd. Raven (English Country Dance Tunes), 1984; pg. 98 from http://www.ibiblio.org/fiddlers/BARN_BB.htm Also, no info, but a second generation recording of George Atkinson playing it, amongst others http://sounds.bl.uk/View.aspx?item=025M-C1009X0004XX-2600V0.xml# Tim - Original Message - From: Francis Wood oatenp...@googlemail.com To: Dartmouth NPS nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 12:27 PM Subject: [NSP] Barrington Hornpipe A query about the Barrington Hornpipe, appearing in Northumbrian Pipers's Tune Book (1). Can anyone provide any information about the background to this tune? I've heard it was composed as a competition piece, requiring all on a 7 key chanter. Are there sources for this information? Does Todd's manuscript copy survive? And are there significant variants on this as it is played today? Francis To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.423 / Virus Database: 270.14.39/2470 - Release Date: 10/30/09 15:18:00
[NSP] Scottish Music project
No not piping, but for those of you interested in what music can do, this link was sent to me. [1]http://bbc.co.uk/i/n9mlt/ It's available until 9:54pm Monday 19th October 2009 BST to watch or download. Its a 40 minute TV programme, Tim -- References 1. http://bbc.co.uk/i/n9mlt/ To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: curious pipes on ebay
Is there no end to Colin's talents :-) http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ross-Electronic-Bagpipes_ These are in Ontario, Canada Tim - Original Message - From: Dally, John john.da...@hmhpub.com To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 5:27 PM Subject: [NSP] curious Burleigh pipes on ebay There is a curious set of Burleigh pipes on ebay. It's not so curious to see Burleigh pipes on ebay, but it's very curious to see a set of Burleigh pipes anywhere that have been fettled by Colin Ross. Or, at least, that's the impression I've gotten watching the scene from afar. I'd gotten the impression that Colin wouldn't go near a set of Burleigh pipes. Of course, if Colin did fettle these pipes they would be more valuable than if he hadn't. Anyone know anything about them? They're in Fife. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.104/2379 - Release Date: 09/17/09 15:55:00
[NSP] Re: Tune title spelling
Of course, even if we get the name spelt/spelled correctly, we're still left with the discussion about how the actual tune goes. Tim - Original Message - From: colin cwh...@santa-fe.freeserve.co.uk To: Nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 2009 11:35 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune title spelling Good point but I do understand what Barry is saying. I well remember sending a friend an email in Elvish for a bit of fun (Lord of the Rings style) which resulted in total gibberish as they didn't have the font installed to display it! In fact, the pound sign (which was fine in the Barry's original message) showed up as a capital L in your reply. :-) Colin Hill - Original Message - From: Anthony Robb anth...@robbpipes.com To: Nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu; Barry Say barr...@nspipes.co.uk Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 2009 11:05 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune title spelling Surely worth a go if it means more chance of the name being right in the publication? A --- On Wed, 19/8/09, Barry Say barr...@nspipes.co.uk wrote: From: Barry Say barr...@nspipes.co.uk Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune title spelling To: Nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Wednesday, 19 August, 2009, 10:25 AM Hi All Personally I wouldn't bother trying to put exotic characters in e-mail. They only work if the recipient is using the same system to read the messages as the sender is using to compose them. Look at the trouble we with get with -L- signs. Barry On 19 Aug 2009 at 10:02, The Red Goblin wrote: I have not found a way to access them for e-mail.? Tip: In WinXP (MacOS/Linux may have a similar applet) I simply copy paste exotic characters from the Character Map* accessory. Steve Collins * Buried in Start Programs Accessories System Tools (points to %SystemRoot%\System32\charmap.exe if missing) but I keep a shortcut handy on my Office Toolbar To get on or off this list see list information at [1]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.61/2312 - Release Date: 08/18/09 18:05:00
[NSP] Re: Northumbria Pipe Course 11-16 October - Places available
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[NSP] Re: Northumbria Pipe Course 11-16 October - Places available
I'll try again Hi Philip, re Can we also drop the (failed?) experiment of the NPS discussion list. Some of us ordinary members really don't care any more about the Society's internal battles. When we set up the NPS discussion list it was explicitly to allow people to wash their dirty linen in private, and to give dartmouth a break. We said so at the time. I would say on the whole it has been a success, although of late there has been a fair amount of soapy water sloshing over here too. If you find, as many do, that the NPS list is not to your taste, then it is easy to unsubscribe, or you can simply block the e-mails from those people whose postings you find offensive. I fear if we closed down the NPS list, dartmouth would again become the only outlet for people to air their views and I'm sure none of us would want that. Meanwhile, can I put in a plea to people to keep the NPS stuff over there, and leave over here for NSP matters, try not to post to both lists simultaneously as it gets confusing for recipients of both lists. Thanks Tim. - Original Message - From: Philip Gruar phi...@gruar.clara.net To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 4:13 PM Subject: [NSP] Re: Northumbria Pipe Course 11-16 October - Places available Well said colin (Hill, of course) I have been reading this list (both lists) over the past month with a growing sense of detatchment and loss of interest. I wonder if I can really be bothered to open any new message, and very likely read yet more griping and point-scoring, or whether just to hit the delete button, and send NPS and NSP alike to join all the other spam. We have had the endless what is proper piping? debate yet again (have the Taliban got an internet discussion list about true Islam, I wonder? If so it must be very similar), continuing point-scoring about the presidency, about the society rules or lack of them, pipe-makers and pipe-making books and what the society has/hasn't/should/shouldn't have done about them, and now this latest extraordinary outburst. The suggested distinction between NPS discussion and NSP (Dartmouth) list isn't really being observed, often because the subject matter applies to both. Personally, I don't bother to look closely at the acronym to see what list a posting is meant for, I still read them all - and I'm sure most of us who have subscribed to both do the same. I used to follow the discussions with interest, and often contribute to them, but the level of debate recently (with a few honourable exceptions) has sunk so low I'm tempted to unsubscribe from both lists. Letting my Society subsciption lapse sometimes seems like a good idea too. Please can we have a Summer recess, or a moratorium or something, and all come back refreshed and nicer people, ready to discuss piping and its music tolerantly and positively? Can we also drop the (failed?) experiment of the NPS discussion list. Some of us ordinary members really don't care any more about the Society's internal battles. Just fight it out among yourselves and let us know the result by old-fashioned snail-mail newsletter when all the blood has been cleaned up. Philip - Original Message - From: colin cwh...@santa-fe.freeserve.co.uk To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 2:38 PM Subject: [NSP] Re: Northumbria Pipe Course 11-16 October - Places available I'm, glad someone else aid it first. I wasn't aware that this particular list was only for NPS events and news. I thought it was a general list for anyone interested in any aspect of the pipes. So, if a course is being run and ISN'T held by the NPS we can't read it/post it etc? This puerile twaddle has got to stop before we all leave the list and, the way it's going, the Society too. Please put personal feeling aside and talk pipes and piping. If non-society events can't be discussed, what's the point of us non-Northeasteners bothering to belong to the list. I certainly can't get to Newcastle for an event (too far, too expensive, too ill to travel that distance). OK, if them's the rules How about starting a NEW list where we can discuss ANYTHING to do with piping then? I would agree, however, that this topic would not be permitted in the discussion list (which is for members only). I fail to see how a general, public list (not linked to the NPS as such) can disallow private courses, tutoring, pipe sales etc. I know that certain society members consider themselves a bit of a clique. Most of us don't. We love the pipes (whether we play or not) and enjoy talking about them. I would be most interested to read about, say, KT doing a concert here. Apoplectic fits from many members I suppose. Very sad. This list used to be very open (and I've been here for a long time as well) and honest. Now it's a point-scoring forum. I no longer look forward to reading the mails as I know what's coming. Sorry but I'm really getting
[NSP] How the brain reads
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[NSP] How the brain reads
..don't know if there's any relevance to the way we read music, currently I find I have to read each dot when I see a new tune, but this gives me hope that maybe when I've had more practice I'll be able to read whole bars at a time. Don't delete this just because it looks weird. Believe it or not, you can read it. I cdnuolt blveiee taht I cluod aulaclty uesdnatnrd waht I was rdanieg. The phaonmneal pweor of the hmuan mnid Aoccdrnig to rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoatnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be in the rghit pclae. The rset can be a taotl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit a porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe. Amzanig huh? Tim To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: piping style
Rick, No insult intended, must be the way I phrase things. Some of my best friends are extremely good musicians. I didn't mean to imply that those who seek technical perfection don't also enjoy the music. Tim - Original Message - From: Rick Damon rick.da...@dartmouth.edu To: tim rolls BT tim.ro...@btconnect.com Cc: David Baker davidthba...@googlemail.com; nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2009 7:49 PM Subject: Re: [NSP] piping style Tim, I think the suggestion that someone who wants to master the instrument and play well is doing it as a technical exercise instead of enjoying playing music is insulting. I believe that if you're going to play music you first need to get a level of competency on the instrument you play. I certainly agree that there are many styles of playing, and a wide range of musical tastes. --Rick On Apr 14, 2009, at 4:31 AM, tim rolls BT wrote: I too have little experience of piping, but I agree that the area of the correct way to play is a subject of some debate. I am keen to ensure that the NSP community is receptive to the efforts of young pipers, (and older ones, no prejudice here) so as I reckon you have a good thirty years yet of being a young piper you will have plenty of opportunity to develop your style, jazz on the pipes eh? Rick, if you are in the group treating pipes playing as a technical exercise, and trying to achieve a certain traditional technique is your aim, then certainly there is a right answer, and luckily there are pipers who will gladly help you work towards that aim, but if your aim is more philosophical, like trying to enjoy playing the music you can make for your own pleasure, then it would seem there are as many right answers as there are players. In general, the latter group don't try to tell the former not to try and achieve the perfection they are looking for! Each to his own. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.287 / Virus Database: 270.11.57/2059 - Release Date: 04/14/09 14:52:00 To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Keep on Ranting!
Thanks Chris, Looks fascinating, but as I'm not familiar with abc, I tried pasting it on the site, on the abc converter, but got an error message, tried ticking a few boxes, but no improvement. Anyone more computer savvy who can tell me what I'm doing wrong? Tim - Original Message - From: Chris Ormston ch...@chrisormston.com To: 'NSP List' nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 9:24 PM Subject: [NSP] Keep on Ranting! Here's a new one - enjoy! X:1 T:Keelman Brown of Newburn C:Chris Ormston M:4/4 K:D de|fdfa d2dc|BGBd A2de|fdfa gfed|f2e2e2 de|fdfad2dc|BGBd A2 AG|FAGB Aage|f2d2d2:|| ef|gBgf eAde|fAfe d2de|fdfa gfed|f2e2e2 ef|gBgf eAde|fAfe d2AG|FAGB Aage|f2d2d2:|| For those who prefer dots, copy and paste the above here: [1]http://www.folkinfo.org/songs/abcconvert.php Chris Ormston chrisormston.com borderdirectors.com -- References 1. http://www.folkinfo.org/songs/abcconvert.php To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/1999 - Release Date: 03/13/09 05:59:00
[NSP] Moving away from the First 30 tunes
Hi Anthony, Obviously I don't have your knowledge and background of Northumbrian music, so I don't have the same depth of feeling for these matters that you do. My purpose in following the threads on this group is to get an understanding of piping as it is, and was, from experienced people like you, and this is an incredibly rich source of knowledge. Because there is such a diverse range of opinions, often based on historical or geographical connections, often deeply held, the picture is rich and colourful. Long may that continue. You are perhaps correct that the direct relevance of masonry to the first 30 tunes is had to see, and maybe a new title was appropriate, but as a thread of thought I felt it was pertinent, and indeed the mason's decision was perhaps food for thought. I don't think there is any wish to gloss over the heritage, just a lack of knowledge, which is why your contribution is so valued. Re many of these pieces were still being played by a strong cohort of traditional musicians in north Northumberland in a style which pleased them and fitted their needs extremely well. Do you feel, as you have used the past tense, that this is no longer so? Is the (North?) Northumbrian style of playing lost apart from recordings? Has it been subsumed by Tyneside influences? Which current players do you feel best demonstrate that style? Is that style better/truer then other styles currently in evidence? Should any style be preserved in aspic or should we accept evolution, whilst treasuring, and being influenced by styles of the past be they on vinyl or in mp3? Discuss. Tim - Original Message - From: Anthony Robb anth...@robbpipes.com To: NSP group nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu; Richard York rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2009 6:20 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes Sorry to butt in folks, especially since I'm not sure what the exact context is! As the subject matter is the First 30 tunes the relevance of Victorian / Medieval masonry escapes me. I do get the impression, Richard, that you might be regarding these tunes as treasures from an earlier age. Let me reassure you that many of these pieces were still being played by a strong cohort of traditional musicians in north Northumberland in a style which pleased them and fitted their needs extremely well. It is the lack of appreciation of this and the fact that they played their reels with a phrasing that was neither march, polka or reel. This pulse fitted the dance step of choice, the Rant, so perfectly that they referred to the tunes themselves as rants. This was far more than a social pastime for the likes of Will Atkinson whose payment from The Tanner Hops made his, Bella's and their 10 bairns lives, much more bearable. It is the glossing over of this unique heritage that drives me to bring it to a wider audience. If you haven't already done so buy Will Atkinson's wonderful CD and you'll see what I mean. Regards Anthony --- On Wed, 11/3/09, Richard York rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk wrote: From: Richard York rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk Subject: [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes To: NSP group nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Wednesday, 11 March, 2009, 8:48 PM In a way, that's the least important part of the story :) It struck me at the time what a parallel it was with our treatment of music which comes to us from before our time, or at least before deadly accurate sound recording, whether it's medieval or anything else. But to answer your question, Tim, if I remember aright, he treated them each variously according to how much was evident from the original form, how much damage the dear Victorians had done, and in what condition and how stable each was. Perhaps that's relevant too. Best wishes, Richard. tim rolls BT wrote: Hi Richard, Don't leave us hanging what did he choose to do? Tim - Original Message - From: Richard York [1]rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk To: NSP group [2]...@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 6:10 PM Subject: [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes Some years ago I met a man who was responsible for some work on the musicians carvings in Beverley Minster, most famous of course being the pipers. His quandary was whether to simply clean them up as they were, or to restore them to what the Victorians had imposed on them, mistakes and all, or to try to restore them to what he thought the medieval carvers had intended, though that last was now very impossible to do with any certainty, given changes in their condition over time, so he'd be imposing on them. And whatever he did would be right for some people, wrong for others, and whatever he did they'd never be as they once used to be. Or he could simply leave them to fall to bits by themselves. Richard. Anthony Robb
[NSP] Monkey hunting
Hi John and all, I like the monkey hunting analogy. If you're hunting monkeys (ies?) by yourself, then hunt them in whatever way catches most monkeys for you. Naturally if you are hunting monkeys with a group of other monkey hunters, you need some agreement as to how you are all going to hunt, otherwise the result will be unsatisfactory (you just scatter the monkeys and they all laugh at you from the treetops) In which case a written set of instructions on how to hunt monkeys would be useful. Having all got copies of the How to hunt Monkeys, the New Guinea way you will of course find that many of the hunters then say, but we dont hunt them thay way and you end up agreeing to amend the instructions, leaving the person who spent time copying ten sets of instructions out muttering darkly in the corner. Tim - Original Message - From: john_da...@hmco.com To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2009 7:26 PM Subject: [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes Perhaps, you could make the recordings yourself, Colin. That way the bench would be quite clearly marked. It would seem likely that there could be all sorts of interpretations of a tune, or bad playing technique, if the sound source were another instrument. Last night I played tunes with a friend, an ear player who grew up in Morpeth, was active in the folk scene in Northumberland for many years before moving here. He plays stringed instruments, so the popping pipe sound goes nicely with the slurry string sound. He doesn't play any of the tunes note for note the way they appear in the books, because he picked them up by ear, having heard many from the time he was a lad. If I said, look, you're not playing that tune correctly, it would be like the anthropologist telling the tribesman in New Guinea he's hunting monkey incorrectly. One tune in particular, The Hesleyside Reel, is very difficult for me to play at his tempo without cutting out some of the notes. Was it written for the pipes? It's a lovely tune, but my right hand's ligature doesn't like it very much unless I play it at a rambling pace. Now, I realize, if I had Chris Ormston's technique I could do it properly, but I never will (I'm not alone, am I?). If the choice is mucking up the tune or adapting it to fit my technical abilities, what's a guy to do? John rosspi...@aol.com 03/10/2009 10:40 AM To j.gibb...@imperial.ac.uk cc nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes Dear John, When I was saying that I thought the tunes in the 'First 30 Tunes' might be better played on some other instrument than the small pipes to give an idea of how the tune went it was to avoid the copying of pehaps bad playing technique from pipers who had contributed tracks for the CD. I had no experience of using ABC copies of the tunes to generate audio copies but it seems to be a relatively straightforward way of getting the printed tunes out there to be heard. At the moment the NPS is only interested in producing a CD to accompany the '30 tunes' book but as we have most of the other tunes that are in our publications in ABC form it could be applied to all those tunes that beginners have difficulty in lifting off the page. As you say the main problem is in finding someone to do the job. Colin R -Original Message- From: Gibbons, John j.gibb...@imperial.ac.uk To: 'colin' cwh...@santa-fe.freeserve.co.uk; nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 16:41 Subject: [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes An abc pipers' tunebook should ideally - * Not be a copy of a printed source. It might affect its sales. Let alone copyright questions. * So should be mostly traditional unpublished material. * It could contain new tunes too, if submitted by the composer - copyright again. * It should be communally authored - wait for a single author and it will take a long time, and will mirror his taste; be it excellent or otherwise, someone will disagree! It is a view of the tradition that we are after, not just Joe Bloggs' bit of it. * Abc's could be submitted to the nsp mailing list, and someone web-literate could put it online. * So we need a willing able volunteer. * Here the plan falls to the ground. John -Original Message- From: nsp-request+j.gibbons=ic.ac...@cs.dartmouth.edu [[1]mailto:nsp-request+j.gibbons=ic.ac...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of colin Sent: 10 March 2009 16:23 To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [NSP] Re: [NSP]Re: irst 30 tunes I'm glad you wrote this. I suggested something similar but my post never appeared
[NSP] Re: First 30 tunes
Hi Richard, Don't leave us hanging what did he choose to do? Tim - Original Message - From: Richard York rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk To: NSP group nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 6:10 PM Subject: [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes Some years ago I met a man who was responsible for some work on the musicians carvings in Beverley Minster, most famous of course being the pipers. His quandary was whether to simply clean them up as they were, or to restore them to what the Victorians had imposed on them, mistakes and all, or to try to restore them to what he thought the medieval carvers had intended, though that last was now very impossible to do with any certainty, given changes in their condition over time, so he'd be imposing on them. And whatever he did would be right for some people, wrong for others, and whatever he did they'd never be as they once used to be. Or he could simply leave them to fall to bits by themselves. Richard. Anthony Robb wrote: ... There is much room for personal interpretation on top of this basic style difference. Letting people hear these differences is important. As for so-called bad habits these must surely be/have been pleasing to the players themselves at some point and are therefore valid in their own right even if others may find them displeasing. Copying these personal idiosyncracies is one thing, and each player can decide this for themselves, ignoring the regional accent completely is another thing altogether! I would say go for it Colin, a person with your background can not help but make a valuable contribution to the body of piping knowledge. As aye Anthony To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.10/1995 - Release Date: 03/11/09 08:28:00
[NSP] the foremost Northumbrian Pipes player
some of you may have missed this on the BBC website A globally acclaimed folk artist from Northumberland is to be given a prestigious music award. Kathryn Tickell, who plays the Northumbrian pipes and violin, is to be awarded the Queen's Medal for Music. The annual award, approved by the Queen, is presented to musicians judged to have had a major influence on the musical life of the nation. The 41-year-old will be presented with the Medal in a private audience with the Queen later this year. Sir Peter Maxwell Davies, appointed as the Master of The Queen's Music in 2004, said: I am delighted to have the opportunity to present the Queen's Medal to Kathryn Tickell as she is not only the foremost Northumbrian Pipes player, a great composer and a wonderful all-round musician, but for her work in music education. She has put the pipes and the music of her own part of England back among the public where it belongs, and is also spreading a love of this music throughout the whole world. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: further JA research
or perhaps Rory Bremner, doing an impression... Tim - Original Message - From: david...@pt.lu To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 6:18 PM Subject: [NSP] further JA research Tullochgorum shows up as 'the corn bunting' and 'the blue green hill' as well as 'the dark blue hill ' we are now back to robert Bremner -- Scot Skinner also has it with variations -- still digging Dave Singleton To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.7/1895 - Release Date: 1/15/2009 7:46 AM
[NSP] Re: Piper print
Hi Richard, I haven't got my physics head on this morning, but would this be anything to do with the fact that many painters used a sort of camera obscura device to project the model onto a canvas, then did a quick sketch round the projected image, I can never get my head round whether the image just inverts vertically or swaps L-R as well. Tim - Original Message - From: richard.hea...@tiscali.co.uk To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:37 AM Subject: [NSP] Piper print Hi Honor, I'm no expert, but I think quite a lot of bagpipe iconography depicts the bag under the right arm. I have no idea whether or not that is due to the artist (obviously it is in the case of original paintings) or the printmaker reversing things. You'll see another example in David Allan's painting A Highland Dance at http://www.nationalgalleries.org/collection/online_az/4: 322/result/0/21917?initial=AartistId=4483artistName=David% 20Allansubmit=1 Here is shown two Scottish bagpipers playing for dancing, both having the bag under their right arm. It was painted c.1780. There are also examples in Hugh Cheape's recent book about bagpipes. Richard 50% off Norton Security 2009 - http://www.tiscali.co.uk/security To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.6/1889 - Release Date: 1/12/2009 8:18 PM
[NSP] Re: exmouth.edu (society magazine)
Hi Peter, Page 41 et seq. NPS magazine, Vol 29, 2008. Struck several chords with me. Tim - Original Message - From: Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: tim rolls BT [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [NSP] exmouth.edu (society magazine) Hi Tim, Have to say, you've stumped me with this comment. I must have missed something somewhere! Peter tim rolls BT wrote: respect! Tim -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.9.15/1833 - Release Date: 12/5/2008 7:08 PM
[NSP] olympic games bagpipes
In case anyone's interested, on ebay now, the Highland pipes that were played at the olymic games opening ceremony, allegedly! As some of you may remember, these pipes can only play about 4 different tunes, including, we seem to remember Scotland the Brave, The Rowan Tree, and possibly Highland Cathedral. [1]http://shop.ebay.co.uk/?_from=R40_trksid=m38_nkw=bagpipes+olympic; _sacat=See-All-Categories -- References 1. http://shop.ebay.co.uk/?_from=R40_trksid=m38_nkw=bagpipes+olympic_sacat=See-All-Categories To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] exmouth.edu (society magazine)
respect! Tim -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Music for funeral
And don't play effin' Highland Cathedral either Should that be Highland Cathedral ineff and a ' , Tim - Original Message - From: Paul Gretton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2008 6:40 PM Subject: [NSP] Music for funeral My gut reaction is: play anything appropriate - there are lots of options - but please, please, please don't play Amazing Grace! I don't think one should do anything that might contribute to that awful piece of slop becoming a part of the Northumberland repertoire too. It would be dreadful if it ever became a standard feature of funerals on this side of the Atlantic the way it has in the States. And in the States the problem is not just with funerals: over there, there are only two tunes associated with bagpipes (of any type), namely Amazing Grace and that other one. There was no Amazing Grace at the Cenotaph this morning and I think you may agree that the somber ceremony of commemoration was still pretty effective. And don't play effin' Highland Cathedral either Paul Gretton -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.1/1781 - Release Date: 11/11/2008 8:59 AM
[NSP] Re: Maa Bonny Lad
well here's one version Sir Richard Runciman Terry, member of a Northumbrian shipping family and a good collector of sailing-ship shanties dredged up this song from childhood memory and gave it to W.G. Whittaker who published it in North Countrie Ballads, Songs and Pipe-Tunes in 1922. In the song, keel means a sea-going boat, not the flat-bottomed coal-barges usually associated with the Tyne. Lyrics Have you seen ought of my bonny lad? Are you sure he's well-o? He's gone o'er long with a stick in his hand, He's gone to row the keel-o. Yes I have seen your bonny lad, 'Twas on the sea I spied him. His grave is green but not wi' grass And you'll never lie beside him. Have you seen ought of my bonny lad? And are you sure he's well-o? He's gone o'er long with a stick in his hand, He's gone to row the keel-o. and this link goes to a version too but you may need sibelius http://www.rossleighmusic.co.uk/MaaBonnyLadSCH.htm good luck Tim - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 12:55 AM Subject: [NSP] Maa Bonny Lad I urgently need the words of Maa Bonny Lad Can anyone come to my rescue? Please e-mail to[EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanking whomsoever in advance. Sheila __ Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel. [2]Check out Today's Hot 5 Travel Deals! -- References 1. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 2. http://travel.aol.com/discount-travel?ncid=emlcntustrav0001 To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.4/1754 - Release Date: 10/29/2008 7:45 AM
[NSP] Re: Over the hill?
I shouldn't worry too much Richard, a brief extract from the summary says males tap faster than females, the dominant hand is faster than the non-dominant hand the slow down is apparantly only about 10-15% for the over 50s compared to the 16-24s, and if you want all the stats. and have trouble sleeping go to http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3848/is_200407/ai_n9439965/pg_1?tag=artBody;col1. Just make sure you play with a group of older females and you should be able to keep your end up! A fellow over 50 Tim - Original Message - From: Richard York [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: NSP group nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Friday, October 24, 2008 7:06 PM Subject: [NSP] Over the hill? The BBC radio news Quiz has just referred to a test of men's declining powers, correlated with age. It seems we start to seriously go downhill after 39. (Not much hope for me then.) The test was to see how rapidly they could keep tapping their index fingers over a period of 10 seconds, a vital skill for any man of the world. One wonders how the test would vary if they took a sample of NSpipers? And does it mean that starting to play in my mid-50's I don't stand a chance with repeated notes? Yours in senility, Richard. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.2/1743 - Release Date: 10/24/2008 8:33 AM
[NSP] Re: Heads and Tails
As the tail seems to be wagging, and quite happy about it, maybe we can deduce the beast is canine? That makes you the dog's left b Paul. Maybe somebody at the head can check for a cold damp nose (Off the head of your beer perhaps, bitter not stout of course!) bright eyes (Stimulant of your choice) and pricked ears (listening for choyting?) Tim - Original Message - From: Paul Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Dartmouth NSP nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 4:57 PM Subject: [NSP] Heads and Tails Is anybody else out there trying to work out where they are on this amazing beast? I've decided that I'm the left testicle. Paul __ Get Hotmail on your mobile from Vodafone [1]Try it Now! -- References 1. http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/111354028/direct/01/ To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.7.6/1711 - Release Date: 10/6/2008 5:37 PM
[NSP] Tharsei
or as the translation from the greek goes, Be of good cheer John 16:33 et al (wonderful combination, the internet and the bible.) I think Chris is far too pessimistic and lacking in self confidence. I may be well off the mark here, but I'd guess in the first half of the 1900s there were only a few dozen people carrying on the traditions and tunes of NSP. Now there are hundreds. possibly thousands of people playing the pipes all around the world, and a good many of them are aiming for the Gold Standard, so there are quite possibly more people playing, or trying to play, the pipes the traditional way than ever before. Regarding the traditional Northumbrian tunes, it's known that many of these were lifted, or have migrated from Scotland and Ireland, and Keep your feet still Geordie Hinny and the Rowan Tree at least, were known under different names by my father-in-law playing the melodeon in Norfolk over 50 years ago. We should accept this cross fertilization as an invigoration, I've no doubt many Northumbrian tunes are played on Uillean pipes, and the playing of other forms of music on the pipes widens their audience and brings more devotees into the fold,( if that's not a mixed metaphor.) I thoroughly enjoy Chris's playing, but I enjoy trying to play the fiddle too, and back beat and syncopation does it for me. I am not ashamed to say that KT first brought my attention to the pipes, although she was a young lass playing the fiddle when I first saw her. Without her more broadly accessible/commercial/populist (call it what you will) style and repertoire, many people would never have come to the pipes. That may have been a good thing or not, who's to say. Whatever, I don't think traditional playing is threatened, but is becoming available to a wider and wider audience with the advent of the internet. Discuss. Tim - Original Message - From: Matt Seattle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Robert Greef [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 10:01 AM Subject: [NSP] Re: More code? I'll spell it out A pint of Guinness (or similar stout) is the image, symbolising or alluding to . Ireland, and by extension, in the context, Irish music. Chris's post was an amusing (to me and presumably others) comment on the perceived dilution of the Northumbrian piping tradition. It contained references which would be picked up by many on this list, whether or not they agreed with the underlying opinions, but you can't please, or amuse, everybody. Cheers Matt On 10/7/08, Robert Greef [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This posting makes my point more emphatically, because even with this extra commentary the passage is still meaningless dribble. Say what you mean! Or is this whole farrago totally content -free? Cheers, Robert - Original Message - From: Matt Seattle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Monday, October 06, 2008 12:52 PM Subject: [NSP] Re: Threat replies are in I suspect there has been some misunderstanding of Chris Ormston's post - The new threat is from another species imported from Ireland and Scotland. This beast has a stout black body with a creamy white head, and has taken root in newcastlegateshead. A pint of Guinness (or similar stout) is the image, symbolising or alluding to . To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.7.6/1711 - Release Date: 10/6/2008 5:37 PM
[NSP] Re: Threat replies are in
That's two alludes in consecutive post's. Who moderates this site, we can't have allude posts willy-nilly Tim PS I think Kathryn Tickell is a mighty fine musician and I'd like to be nearly as good on the pipes as she is. Who says she shan't be named and why? Anyone brave enough? - Original Message - From: Matt Seattle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Monday, October 06, 2008 12:52 PM Subject: [NSP] Re: Threat replies are in I suspect there has been some misunderstanding of Chris Ormston's post - The new threat is from another species imported from Ireland and Scotland. This beast has a stout black body with a creamy white head, and has taken root in newcastlegateshead. A pint of Guinness (or similar stout) is the image, symbolising or alluding to . To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.7.6/1709 - Release Date: 10/5/2008 9:20 AM
[NSP] Re: Piping under threat!
Perhaps syncopated jiggery is a virus like the squirrel pox that grays carry but kills reds? Tim This made me wonder what 'Pan-Celtic syncopated jiggery' is, and what the nature of the threat. Sounds more like fun than a threat in the admittedly unlikely event of you asking me g To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.7.5/1702 - Release Date: 10/1/2008 9:05 AM
[NSP] Re: Piping under threat!
Seems to me that as the pipes have been around for about 500 years in their present form, but much of the repetoire is from the last 200-250 years and is probably a sample of popular tunes of the day that you could argue that the traditional tunes at least of the pipes have already been lost. As to the way of playing, who knows, each player is likely to have learnt at the knee of another, and added his own foibles. The traditional way now, and probably then, is what is in the living memory, although there is a degree of calcification due to recordings of early 20th century players, much as spelling became more fixed with the advent of the printing press. This site has recently shown that there is no certainty as to the meaning of notation, so how can we know how things were played. I'm sure that Chris Ormston, widely regarded as one of the finest players around today, will have a great influence on how the pipes are learnt and played for many years, and because there are recordings of his style, that will now go on into perpetuity, I don't think you need fear Chris, that your style will die out in the near future. Now for my pebble in the pond, As some wise chap said a while back, In my father's house there are many rooms, or words to that effect. I think there should be not just tolerance, but acceptance of a wide range of not only playing styles, but music types as well. If it was OK in the 1850's to play hit songs of the day, then why not now accept tunes from the last 40-50-60 years, which I'm sure most of us will agree has been an incredibly rich and diverse period of music writing. So, preparing to be shot down, how about In the Mood, Moon River ,Popcorn(by Hot butter if my memory serves)I am sailing (Rod Stewart) Money, money,money by ABBA. You can see wher I'm coming from. But before you do shoot, think how much poorer we would be musically if the Sax had only ever been used to play orchestral music, it's original purpose as a crossover between brass and woodwind. Tim RollsOriginal Message - From: Robert Greef [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 9:22 AM Subject: [NSP] Piping under threat! I saw the post from Chris Ormston: I'm seriously concerned that the traditional way of playing our instrument will be swept away in a wave of Pan-Celtic syncopated jiggery This made me wonder what 'Pan-Celtic syncopated jiggery' is, and what the nature of the threat. Cheers, Robert Greef To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.7.5/1702 - Release Date: 10/1/2008 9:05 AM
