Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

Hey everyone,

I spoke with Friends of Animals today.  They are pushing for legislation to ban 
contest "hunts" (I use the word hunt very lightly, more like massacres) in NYS. 
 A press release will be going out tomorrow from NYS Senator Avella's office 
regarding the legislation and I was asked to give a quote for it.  I am still 
not sure of the actual circumstances regarding this bill, an am waiting to hear 
more details about it, as well as a copy of the actual bill.

In the meantime, I happen to be attending the NYS Audubon Council meeting this 
weekend and will be asking the chapters in attendance to sign on in support of 
the legislation.  Huntington-Oyster Bay Audubon signed on today, obviously!

If your organization would like to sign on, please let me know.  We hope to 
have all the names in place by Tuesday at the very latest.

While at the meeting we will be brainstorming various other avenues to explore 
regarding this issue including discussions with the DEC as well as the Rod and 
Gun Club itself (Larry, got your car back yet? HA!). 

These "hunts" are despicable displays of butchery which demonstrate an 
appalling lack of value for the wildlife we share our world with.   

Stella Miller





  
 



"Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy



 From: "stella.mille...@yahoo.com" 
To: Arie Gilbert ; NYSBIRDS-L 
 
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2014 12:15 PM
Subject: RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 

Hi all. I have a call this afternoon with Friends of the Animals to discuss how 
we, including NYS Audubon chapters can join them in their efforts to ban these 
contest killings. I will also be attending the NY Audubon council meeting in 
Saratoga Springs this weekend and will try to gather support from the various 
chapters then. 

Once I have had my discussion with Friends I will let you all know how it went. 
I don't think we can stop this years event but lets hope that in the future 
wildlife will be safe from slaughter for fun and prizes!

Stella Miller


< -- The message is truncated. -- >


Sent with Verizon Mobile Email



---Original Message---
From: "Arie Gilbert" 
Sent: 3/19/2014 8:26 am
To: "NYSBIRDS-L" 
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

  
got a gun,
fact I've got two,
that's okay man cause I love god,
glorified version of a pellet gun,
fell so manly,
when armed...  (Pearl Jam)

Arie Gilbert
North Babylon, NY

WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com 
 WWW.qcbirdclub.org 



On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:

  
According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  

Best,  
Pat














On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM,  wrote:


  
I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable.  
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...

 

John Turner

- Original Message -----
From: Richard 
Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: Stella Miller 
Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 

> My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
> Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing 
> now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
> their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
> plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
> flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
> subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
> 
> Rich
> 
> Sent from my wireless tin can
> 
> > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
>  wrote:
> > 
> > Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
> Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
> eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
> of Crow Pot Pie.
> > 
> > Stella
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
> cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
> It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
> is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
> impoverished existence for Man.&quo

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Linda Orkin]

Go to this link to see the successful result of comments against another
shoot scheduled by Ducks Unltd.  I took the relevant part out of it, the
letter response and put it as a message on the Rod and gun club facebook
page.

http://exposingthebiggame.wordpress.com/2014/03/19/victory-ducks-unlimited-2000-bird-pigeon-shoot-cancelled/

It can be done.

Linda Orkin
Ithaca, NY




On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 12:24 PM, Larry Trachtenberg <
trachtenb...@amsllp.com> wrote:

>  As a hunter, I'm surprised you'd quote "Glorified G" which is an
> anti-gun song, really poking fun at gun enthusiasts, don't you think.
>
> As an aside, and not to turn it into a song writing thread, I certainly
> prefer seeing Pearl Jam lyrics to Nas lyrics on this site anytime.
>
> I don't think I can add to the crow shoot comments anything that has not
> already been said.
>
>
>
>
>
> Larry Trachtenberg
>
> Ossining
>
>
>
> *From:* bounce-113372021-10490...@list.cornell.edu [mailto:
> bounce-113372021-10490...@list.cornell.edu] *On Behalf Of *John Cancalosi
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 19, 2014 12:12 PM
> *To:* Arie Gilbert
> *Cc:* NYSBIRDS-L
>
> *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>
>
>
> I don't have time to read through all these comments so as not to repeat,
> but I don't think that anyone has used the obvious description of these
> events as a "MURDER OF CROWS"!
>
>
>
> I am a hunter and have defended hunting to a number of birdwatchers
> recently. Im my opinion what we have here is no more hunting than
> bull-fighting is sport. Let them eat crow!
>
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 8:25 AM, Arie Gilbert 
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *got a gun, fact I've got two, that's okay man cause I love god, glorified
> version of a pellet gun, fell so manly, when armed...  *(Pearl Jam)
>
> Arie Gilbert
> North Babylon, NY
>
> WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com
>  WWW.qcbirdclub.org
>
>
>
>  On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:
>
>  According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to
> see who could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts
> would have to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part
> of their club's culture.
>
> Best,
>
> Pat
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM,  wrote:
>
>  I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the
> unjustifyable.
>
> To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to
> shoot crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal
> law...
>
>
>
> John Turner
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Richard
> Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> To: Stella Miller
> Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne
> Hertzog , Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund
>
> > My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish
> > Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing
> > now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was
> > their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
> > plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or
> > flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not
> > subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing.
> >
> > Rich
> >
> > Sent from my wireless tin can
> >
> > > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?
> > Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be
> > eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast
> > of Crow Pot Pie.
> > >
> > > Stella
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything
> > cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people.
> > It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice
> > is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an
> > impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
> > > From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg
> > > To: Larry Federman
> > > Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard
> > ; Lynne Hertzog
> > ; Cesar Castillo ;
> > NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund
> >
> > > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> > >
> > > Dear Larry and others,
> > >

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[stella.mille...@yahoo.com]

Hi all. I have a call this afternoon with Friends of the Animals to discuss how 
we, including NYS Audubon chapters can join them in their efforts to ban these 
contest killings. I will also be attending the NY Audubon council meeting in 
Saratoga Springs this weekend and will try to gather support from the various 
chapters then. 

Once I have had my discussion with Friends I will let you all know how it went. 
I don't think we can stop this years event but lets hope that in the future 
wildlife will be safe from slaughter for fun and prizes!

Stella Miller
 

< -- The message is truncated. -- >


Sent with Verizon Mobile Email


---Original Message---
From: "Arie Gilbert" 
Sent: 3/19/2014 8:26 am
To: "NYSBIRDS-L" 
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

   
 got a gun,
 fact I've got two,
 that's okay man cause I love god,
 glorified version of a pellet gun,
 fell so manly,
 when armed...  (Pearl Jam)
 
 Arie Gilbert
 North Babylon, NY
 
 WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com 
  WWW.qcbirdclub.org 
 
 
 
 On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:
 
   
According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  
 
 Best,  
Pat
 

 
 

 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM,  wrote:
 
 
  
I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable.  
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
 
 
 
John Turner
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Richard 
 Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 To: Stella Miller 
 Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 
 
 > My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
 > Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing 
 > now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
 > their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
 > plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
 > flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
 > subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
 > 
 > Rich
 > 
 > Sent from my wireless tin can
 > 
 > > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
 >  wrote:
 > > 
 > > Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
 > Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
 > eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
 > of Crow Pot Pie.
 > > 
 > > Stella
 > > 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
 > cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
 > It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
 > is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
 > impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
 > > From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg 
 > > To: Larry Federman  
 > > Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
 > ; Lynne Hertzog 
 > ; Cesar Castillo ; 
 > NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
 >  
 > > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
 > > Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 > > 
 > > Dear Larry and others,
 > > I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
 > answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
 > think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
 > they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
 > > 
 > > Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
 > but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
 > twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
 > up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
 > > 
 > > Best Rick
 > > 
 > > From: r...@hvc.rr.com
 > > Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
 > > Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
 > > To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
 > > Rick,
 > > Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is 
 > expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The 
 > crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all 
 > its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and 
 > has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
 > you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie". 
 > > You may gather and eat different things, however that does not 
 > negatively define us as sportsme

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Larry Trachtenberg]

As a hunter, I'm surprised you'd quote "Glorified G" which is an anti-gun song, 
really poking fun at gun enthusiasts, don't you think.
As an aside, and not to turn it into a song writing thread, I certainly prefer 
seeing Pearl Jam lyrics to Nas lyrics on this site anytime.
I don't think I can add to the crow shoot comments anything that has not 
already been said.


Larry Trachtenberg
Ossining

From: bounce-113372021-10490...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-113372021-10490...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of John Cancalosi
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2014 12:12 PM
To: Arie Gilbert
Cc: NYSBIRDS-L
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

I don't have time to read through all these comments so as not to repeat, but I 
don't think that anyone has used the obvious description of these events as a 
"MURDER OF CROWS"!

I am a hunter and have defended hunting to a number of birdwatchers recently. 
Im my opinion what we have here is no more hunting than bull-fighting is sport. 
Let them eat crow!

On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 8:25 AM, Arie Gilbert 
mailto:ariegilb...@optonline.net>> wrote:

got a gun,
fact I've got two,
that's okay man cause I love god,
glorified version of a pellet gun,
fell so manly,
when armed...  (Pearl Jam)

Arie Gilbert
North Babylon, NY

WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com<http://WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com>
 WWW.qcbirdclub.org<http://WWW.qcbirdclub.org>


On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:
According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.

Best,
Pat




On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, 
mailto:redk...@optonline.net>> wrote:
I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable.
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...

John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard
Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: Stella Miller
Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund

> My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish
> Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing
> now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was
> their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
> plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or
> flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not
> subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing.
>
> Rich
>
> Sent from my wireless tin can
>
> > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller
> wrote:
> >
> > Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?
> Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be
> eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast
> of Crow Pot Pie.
> >
> > Stella
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything
> cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people.
> It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice
> is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an
> impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
> > From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg
> > To: Larry Federman
> > Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard
> ; Lynne Hertzog
> ; Cesar Castillo ;
> NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund
>
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
> > Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> >
> > Dear Larry and others,
> > I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following
> answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't
> think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that
> they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
> >
> > Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go
> but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think
> twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take
> up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
> >
> > Best Rick
> >
> > From: r...@hvc.rr.com<mailto:r...@hvc.rr.com>
> > Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
> > Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
> > To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net<mailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net>
> > Rick,
> > Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is
> expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The
> crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all
> 

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[John Cancalosi]

I don't have time to read through all these comments so as not to repeat,
but I don't think that anyone has used the obvious description of these
events as a "MURDER OF CROWS"!

I am a hunter and have defended hunting to a number of birdwatchers
recently. Im my opinion what we have here is no more hunting than
bull-fighting is sport. Let them eat crow!


On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 8:25 AM, Arie Gilbert wrote:

>
> *got a gun**,*
> *fact I've got two,*
> *that's okay man cause I love god**,*
> *glorified version of a pellet gun,*
> *fell so manly,*
> *when armed...  *(Pearl Jam)
>
> Arie Gilbert
> North Babylon, NY
>
> WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com
>  WWW.qcbirdclub.org
>
>
>
> On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:
>
> According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to
> see who could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts
> would have to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part
> of their club's culture.
>
> Best,
> Pat
>
>
>
>
> On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM,  wrote:
>
>  I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the
> unjustifyable.
> To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to
> shoot crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal
> law...
>
> John Turner
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Richard
> Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> To: Stella Miller
> Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne
> Hertzog , Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund
>
> > My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish
> > Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing
> > now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was
> > their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
> > plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or
> > flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not
> > subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing.
> >
> > Rich
> >
> > Sent from my wireless tin can
> >
> > > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?
> > Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be
> > eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast
> > of Crow Pot Pie.
> > >
> > > Stella
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything
> > cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people.
> > It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice
> > is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an
> > impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
> > > From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg
> > > To: Larry Federman
> > > Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard
> > ; Lynne Hertzog
> > ; Cesar Castillo ;
> > NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund
> >
> > > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> > >
> > > Dear Larry and others,
> > > I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following
> > answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't
> > think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that
> > they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
> > >
> > > Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go
> > but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think
> > twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take
> > up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
> > >
> > > Best Rick
> > >
> > > From: r...@hvc.rr.com
> > > Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
> > > Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
> > > To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
> > > Rick,
> > > Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is
> > expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The
> > crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all
> > its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and
> > has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence
> > you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie".
> > > You may gather and eat different things, however that does not
> > negatively define us as sportsmen.
> > > RVW Gun C

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Arie Gilbert]

  
  

got a gun,
fact I've got two,
that's okay man cause I love god,
glorified version of a pellet gun,
fell so manly,
when armed...  (Pearl Jam)

Arie Gilbert
North Babylon, NY

WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com 
 WWW.qcbirdclub.org 



On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken
  wrote:


  
  According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel
Skramble, to see who could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems
like stopping these hunts would have to be done by changing the
law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's culture.  

Best, 
Pat





  
  

  
  
On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, <redk...@optonline.net>
wrote:

  
  
I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to
  justify the unjustifyable. 
  To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if
the ability to shoot crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if
it stems from federal law...
   
  John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
  Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
  Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene
  County
  To: Stella Miller 
Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg ,
  Larry Federman , Jonathan
Perez , Lynne Hertzog ,
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L
  , Jim Osterlund 
  
  > My guess is that nobody will consume
  any American Crow, Fish 
  > Crow, or Raven unless one or two do
  so to "justify" the killing 
  > now that it's been put out there.
  Nobody should believe that was 
  > their original intention. It was just
  to shoot to wound or kill -
  > plain and simple. I've seen crippled
  crows impaired on trees or 
  > flopping on ice to lure more into
  range. This is not 
  > subsistence hunting - it's wonton
  killing. 
  > 
  > Rich
  > 
  > Sent from my wireless tin can
  > 
  > > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21,
  Stella Miller 
  >  wrote:
> > 
> > Is he really confirming that
they will be eating these birds? 
> Sounds as though he is putting it
out there that they CAN be 
> eaten, not necessarily that they
will be sitting down to a feast 
> of Crow Pot Pie.
> > 
> > Stella
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > "Conservation is sometimes
perceived as stopping everything 
> cold, as holding whooping cranes in
higher esteem than people. 
> It is up to science to spread the
understanding that the choice 
> is not between wild places or
people, it is between a rich or an 
> impoverished existence for Man."
Thomas Lovejoy
> > From: Rick & Linda
Kedenburg 
  > > To: Larry Federman 

> > Cc: Jonathan Perez ;
  Richard 
  > ;
Lynne Hertzog 
> ;
  Ce

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[gochfeldlaw]

Maybe they could be convinced to switch their targets to rats and feral cats.
 

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Patricia Aitken 
To:  
Cc: Richard ; Stella Miller 
; Rick & Linda Kedenburg ; 
Larry Federman ; Jonathan Perez 
; Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar 
Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim 
Osterlund 
Sent: Wed, Mar 19, 2014 6:50 am
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County



According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  

Best, 
Pat









On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM,  wrote:



I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable. 
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
 
John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: Stella Miller 
Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 

> My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
> Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing 
> now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
> their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
> plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
> flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not  
> subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing.  
> 
> Rich
> 
> Sent from my wireless tin can
> 
> > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
>  wrote:
> > 
> > Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?  
> Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
> eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
> of Crow Pot Pie.
> > 
> > Stella
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
> cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
> It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
> is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
> impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
> > From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg 
> > To: Larry Federman  
> > Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
> ; Lynne Hertzog 
> ; Cesar Castillo ; 
> NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
>  
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
> > Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> > 
> > Dear Larry and others,
> > I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
> answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
> think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
> they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
> > 
> > Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
> but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
> twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
> up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
> > 
> > Best Rick
> > 
> > From:   r...@hvc.rr.com
> > Subject:Re: Crow Shoot
> > Date:   March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
> > To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
> > Rick,
> >   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is 
> expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The 
> crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all 
> its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and 
> has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
> you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie". 
> > You may gather and eat different things, however that does not 
> negatively define us as sportsmen. 
> > RVW Gun Club
> > Sent from my iPhone
> > 
> > On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
>  wrote:
> > 
> > Dear RVW Club. 
> > As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know 
> you have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly 
> legal for this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
> > 
> > However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most 
> intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been 
> documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and 
> live in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love 
> and appreciate nature long ago.
> > 
> > I hope you can understand that this will no

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

There is also a "Squirrel Slam" that takes place each year in Holley, NY, 
hosted by the local fire department.  Controversy has been swirling around that 
event as children ages 12 and up are welcome and prizes are awarded.  There 
were intense protests and efforts  to put an end to the event, but it went on 
anyway.   Competitive hunting, unfortunately, is not just part of this 
particular club's culture, but a mindset and tradition among certain areas of 
the county (NY is certainly not unique to this as we all know).  Friends of the 
Animals of NYC organized the protest and has been heavily involved with the 
issue, and have been in discussions (or at least let their opinions be heard) 
with elected officials about the Slam.   They are hoping to get a bill passed 
that will ban these sort of activities.

I am reaching out to them to bring this event to their attention as well.  It 
may well help to have a larger, well organized force behind us.

Stella Miller
 



"Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Patricia Aitken 
To: ""  
Cc: Richard ; Stella Miller 
; Rick & Linda Kedenburg ; 
Larry Federman ; Jonathan Perez 
; Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar 
Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim 
Osterlund  
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2014 6:50 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  

Best, 
Pat




On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM,  wrote:


I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable. 
>To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
>crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
> 
>John Turner
>
>- Original Message -
>From: Richard 
>Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
>Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>To: Stella Miller 
>Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
>Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 
>
>> My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
>> Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing 
>> now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
>> their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
>> plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
>> flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
>> subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
>> 
>> Rich
>> 
>> Sent from my wireless tin can
>> 
>> > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
>>  wrote:
>> > 
>> > Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
>> Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
>> eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
>> of Crow Pot Pie.
>> > 
>> > Stella
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
>> cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
>> It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
>> is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
>> impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
>> > From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg 
>> > To: Larry Federman 
>> > Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
>> ; Lynne Hertzog 
>> ; Cesar Castillo ; 
>> NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
>> 
>> > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
>> > Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>> > 
>> > Dear Larry and others,
>> > I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
>> answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
>> think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
>> they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
>> > 
>> > Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
>> but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
>> twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
>> up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
>> > 
>> > Best Rick
>> > 
>>

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Patricia Aitken]

According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  

Best, 
Pat




> On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM,  wrote:
> 
> I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
> unjustifyable. 
> To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to 
> shoot crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
>  
> John Turner
> 
> - Original Message -
> From: Richard 
> Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> To: Stella Miller 
> Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog 
> , Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 
> 
> > My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
> > Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing 
> > now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
> > their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
> > plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
> > flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
> > subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
> > 
> > Rich
> > 
> > Sent from my wireless tin can
> > 
> > > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
> > wrote:
> > > 
> > > Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
> > Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
> > eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
> > of Crow Pot Pie.
> > > 
> > > Stella
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
> > cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
> > It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
> > is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
> > impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
> > > From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg 
> > > To: Larry Federman 
> > > Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
> > ; Lynne Hertzog 
> > ; Cesar Castillo ; 
> > NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
> > 
> > > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> > > 
> > > Dear Larry and others,
> > > I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
> > answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
> > think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
> > they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
> > > 
> > > Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
> > but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
> > twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
> > up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
> > > 
> > > Best Rick
> > > 
> > > From: r...@hvc.rr.com
> > > Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
> > > Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
> > > To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
> > > Rick,
> > > Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is 
> > expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The 
> > crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all 
> > its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and 
> > has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
> > you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie". 
> > > You may gather and eat different things, however that does not 
> > negatively define us as sportsmen. 
> > > RVW Gun Club
> > > Sent from my iPhone
> > > 
> > > On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
> > wrote:
> > > 
> > > Dear RVW Club. 
> > > As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI. I know 
> > you have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly 
> > legal for this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
> > > 
> > > However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most 
> > intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been 
> > documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and 
> > live in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love 
> > and appreciate nature long ago.
> > > 
> > &

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Patricia Aitken]

According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  

Best, 
Pat




 On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, redk...@optonline.net wrote:
 
 I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
 unjustifyable. 
 To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to 
 shoot crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
  
 John Turner
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Richard 
 Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 To: Stella Miller 
 Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog 
 , Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 
 
  My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
  Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to justify the killing 
  now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
  their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
  plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
  flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
  subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
  
  Rich
  
  Sent from my wireless tin can
  
   On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
  wrote:
   
   Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
  Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
  eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
  of Crow Pot Pie.
   
   Stella
   
   
   
   
   Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
  cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
  It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
  is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
  impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
   From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg 
   To: Larry Federman 
   Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
  ; Lynne Hertzog 
  ; Cesar Castillo ; 
  NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
  
   Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
   Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
   
   Dear Larry and others,
   I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
  answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
  think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
  they are gathering the crows to eat.
   
   Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
  but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
  twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
  up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
   
   Best Rick
   
   From: r...@hvc.rr.com
   Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
   Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
   To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
   Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is 
  expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The 
  crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all 
  its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and 
  has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
  you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie. 
   You may gather and eat different things, however that does not 
  negatively define us as sportsmen. 
   RVW Gun Club
   Sent from my iPhone
   
   On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
  wrote:
   
   Dear RVW Club. 
   As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI. I know 
  you have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly 
  legal for this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
   
   However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most 
  intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been 
  documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and 
  live in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love 
  and appreciate nature long ago.
   
   I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the 
  reputation of your club or for any responsible hunters.
   
   Rick Kedenburg
   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
   
   On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
   
   Yes, this is a State issue. Our State Senator is Cecilia 
  Tkaczyk and our Assembly member is Pete Lopez. Our US 
  congressman is Chris Gibson. I will be reaching out to all of 
  their offices.
   
   But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
   
   And their Facebook page is still up - 
  https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/ 
   Larry Federman
   President, Northern Catskills Audubon
   
   
   --
   NYSbirds-L List Info:
   Welcome and Basics
   Rules and Information
   Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
   Archives:
   The Mail Archive
   Surfbirds
   BirdingOnThe.Net
   Please submit your observations to eBird!
   --
   
   
  
  --
  
  NYSbirds-L List Info

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

There is also a Squirrel Slam that takes place each year in Holley, NY, 
hosted by the local fire department.  Controversy has been swirling around that 
event as children ages 12 and up are welcome and prizes are awarded.  There 
were intense protests and efforts  to put an end to the event, but it went on 
anyway.   Competitive hunting, unfortunately, is not just part of this 
particular club's culture, but a mindset and tradition among certain areas of 
the county (NY is certainly not unique to this as we all know).  Friends of the 
Animals of NYC organized the protest and has been heavily involved with the 
issue, and have been in discussions (or at least let their opinions be heard) 
with elected officials about the Slam.   They are hoping to get a bill passed 
that will ban these sort of activities.

I am reaching out to them to bring this event to their attention as well.  It 
may well help to have a larger, well organized force behind us.

Stella Miller
 



Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Patricia Aitken aitkenpatri...@gmail.com
To: redk...@optonline.net redk...@optonline.net 
Cc: Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com; Stella Miller 
stella.mille...@yahoo.com; Rick  Linda Kedenburg kedenb...@optonline.net; 
Larry Federman birderla...@verizon.net; Jonathan Perez 
jonathan.ape...@gmail.com; Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar 
Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim 
Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2014 6:50 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  

Best, 
Pat




On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, redk...@optonline.net wrote:


I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable. 
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
 
John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: Stella Miller 
Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 

 My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
 Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to justify the killing 
 now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
 their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
 plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
 flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
 subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
 
 Rich
 
 Sent from my wireless tin can
 
  On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
  wrote:
  
  Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
 Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
 eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
 of Crow Pot Pie.
  
  Stella
  
  
  
  
  Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
 cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
 It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
 is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
 impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
  From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg 
  To: Larry Federman 
  Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
 ; Lynne Hertzog 
 ; Cesar Castillo ; 
 NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
 
  Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
  Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
  
  Dear Larry and others,
  I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
 answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
 think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
 they are gathering the crows to eat.
  
  Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
 but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
 twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
 up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
  
  Best Rick
  
 From: r...@hvc.rr.com
 Subject:Re: Crow Shoot
 Date:   March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
 To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
  Rick,
Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is 
 expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The 
 crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all 
 its worth. It sounds as if you

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[gochfeldlaw]

Maybe they could be convinced to switch their targets to rats and feral cats.
 

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Patricia Aitken aitkenpatri...@gmail.com
To: redk...@optonline.net redk...@optonline.net
Cc: Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com; Stella Miller 
stella.mille...@yahoo.com; Rick  Linda Kedenburg kedenb...@optonline.net; 
Larry Federman birderla...@verizon.net; Jonathan Perez 
jonathan.ape...@gmail.com; Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar 
Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim 
Osterlund james...@optonline.net
Sent: Wed, Mar 19, 2014 6:50 am
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County



According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  

Best, 
Pat









On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, redk...@optonline.net wrote:



I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable. 
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
 
John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: Stella Miller 
Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 

 My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
 Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to justify the killing 
 now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
 their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
 plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
 flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not  
 subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing.  
 
 Rich
 
 Sent from my wireless tin can
 
  On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
  wrote:
  
  Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?  
 Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
 eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
 of Crow Pot Pie.
  
  Stella
   
  
  
  
  Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
 cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
 It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
 is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
 impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
  From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg 
  To: Larry Federman  
  Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
 ; Lynne Hertzog 
 ; Cesar Castillo ; 
 NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
  Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
  
  Dear Larry and others,
  I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
 answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
 think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
 they are gathering the crows to eat.
  
  Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
 but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
 twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
 up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
  
  Best Rick
  
  From:   r...@hvc.rr.com
  Subject:Re: Crow Shoot
  Date:   March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
  To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
  Rick,
Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is 
 expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The 
 crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all 
 its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and 
 has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
 you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie. 
  You may gather and eat different things, however that does not 
 negatively define us as sportsmen. 
  RVW Gun Club
  Sent from my iPhone
  
  On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
  wrote:
  
  Dear RVW Club. 
  As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know 
 you have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly 
 legal for this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
  
  However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most 
 intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been 
 documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and 
 live in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love 
 and appreciate nature long ago.
  
  I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the 
 reputation of your club or for any responsible hunters.
  
  Rick Kedenburg
  rickkedenb...@optonline.net
  
  On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
  
  Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia 
 Tkaczyk and our Assembly

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Arie Gilbert]

  
  

got a gun,
fact I've got two,
that's okay man cause I love god,
glorified version of a pellet gun,
fell so manly,
when armed...  (Pearl Jam)

Arie Gilbert
North Babylon, NY

WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com 
 WWW.qcbirdclub.org 



On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken
  wrote:


  
  According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel
Skramble, to see who could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems
like stopping these hunts would have to be done by changing the
law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's culture.  

Best, 
Pat





  
  

  
  
On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, redk...@optonline.net
wrote:

  
  
I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to
  justify the unjustifyable. 
  To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if
the ability to shoot crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if
it stems from federal law...
   
  John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard <richardpguth...@gmail.com>
  Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
  Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene
  County
  To: Stella Miller <stella.mille...@yahoo.com>
Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg <kedenb...@optonline.net>,
  Larry Federman <birderla...@verizon.net>, Jonathan
Perez <jonathan.ape...@gmail.com>, Lynne Hertzog <lynnehert...@gmail.com>,
Cesar Castillo <czar3...@yahoo.com>, NYSBIRDS-L
  <nysbirds-l@cornell.edu>, Jim Osterlund <james...@optonline.net>
  
   My guess is that nobody will consume
  any American Crow, Fish 
   Crow, or Raven unless one or two do
  so to "justify" the killing 
   now that it's been put out there.
  Nobody should believe that was 
   their original intention. It was just
  to shoot to wound or kill -
   plain and simple. I've seen crippled
  crows impaired on trees or 
   flopping on ice to lure more into
  range. This is not 
   subsistence hunting - it's wonton
  killing. 
   
   Rich
   
   Sent from my wireless tin can
   
On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21,
  Stella Miller 
   <stella.mille...@yahoo.com> wrote:
  
  Is he really confirming that
they will be eating these birds? 
 Sounds as though he is putting it
out there that they CAN be 
 eaten, not necessarily that they
will be sitting down to a feast 
 of Crow Pot Pie.
  
  Stella
  
  
  
  
  "Conservation is sometimes
perceived as stopping everything 
 cold, as holding whooping cranes in
higher esteem than people. 
 It is up to science to spread the
understanding that the choice 
 is not between wild places or
people, it is between a rich or an 
 impoverished existence for Man."
Thomas Lovejoy
  From: Rick  Linda
Kedenburg <kedenb...@optonline.net>
To: Larry Federman <birderla...@verizon.net>

  Cc: Jonathan Perez <jonathan.ape...@gmail.com>;
  Richard 
   

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[John Cancalosi]

I don't have time to read through all these comments so as not to repeat,
but I don't think that anyone has used the obvious description of these
events as a MURDER OF CROWS!

I am a hunter and have defended hunting to a number of birdwatchers
recently. Im my opinion what we have here is no more hunting than
bull-fighting is sport. Let them eat crow!


On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 8:25 AM, Arie Gilbert ariegilb...@optonline.netwrote:


 *got a gun**,*
 *fact I've got two,*
 *that's okay man cause I love god**,*
 *glorified version of a pellet gun,*
 *fell so manly,*
 *when armed...  *(Pearl Jam)

 Arie Gilbert
 North Babylon, NY

 WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com
  WWW.qcbirdclub.org



 On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:

 According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to
 see who could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts
 would have to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part
 of their club's culture.

 Best,
 Pat




 On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, redk...@optonline.net wrote:

  I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the
 unjustifyable.
 To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to
 shoot crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal
 law...

 John Turner

 - Original Message -
 From: Richard
 Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 To: Stella Miller
 Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne
 Hertzog , Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund

  My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish
  Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to justify the killing
  now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was
  their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
  plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or
  flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not
  subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing.
 
  Rich
 
  Sent from my wireless tin can
 
   On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller
   wrote:
  
   Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?
  Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be
  eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast
  of Crow Pot Pie.
  
   Stella
  
  
  
  
   Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything
  cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people.
  It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice
  is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an
  impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
   From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg
   To: Larry Federman
   Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard
  ; Lynne Hertzog
  ; Cesar Castillo ;
  NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund
 
   Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
   Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
  
   Dear Larry and others,
   I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following
  answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't
  think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that
  they are gathering the crows to eat.
  
   Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go
  but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think
  twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take
  up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
  
   Best Rick
  
   From: r...@hvc.rr.com
   Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
   Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
   To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
   Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is
  expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The
  crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all
  its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and
  has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence
  you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie.
   You may gather and eat different things, however that does not
  negatively define us as sportsmen.
   RVW Gun Club
   Sent from my iPhone
  
   On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg
   wrote:
  
   Dear RVW Club.
   As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI. I know
  you have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly
  legal for this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
  
   However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most
  intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been
  documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and
  live in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love
  and appreciate nature long ago.
  
   I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the
  reputation of your club or for any responsible hunters.
  
   Rick Kedenburg
   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
  
   On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
  
   Yes, this is a State issue. Our State Senator

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Larry Trachtenberg]

As a hunter, I'm surprised you'd quote Glorified G which is an anti-gun song, 
really poking fun at gun enthusiasts, don't you think.
As an aside, and not to turn it into a song writing thread, I certainly prefer 
seeing Pearl Jam lyrics to Nas lyrics on this site anytime.
I don't think I can add to the crow shoot comments anything that has not 
already been said.


Larry Trachtenberg
Ossining

From: bounce-113372021-10490...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-113372021-10490...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of John Cancalosi
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2014 12:12 PM
To: Arie Gilbert
Cc: NYSBIRDS-L
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

I don't have time to read through all these comments so as not to repeat, but I 
don't think that anyone has used the obvious description of these events as a 
MURDER OF CROWS!

I am a hunter and have defended hunting to a number of birdwatchers recently. 
Im my opinion what we have here is no more hunting than bull-fighting is sport. 
Let them eat crow!

On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 8:25 AM, Arie Gilbert 
ariegilb...@optonline.netmailto:ariegilb...@optonline.net wrote:

got a gun,
fact I've got two,
that's okay man cause I love god,
glorified version of a pellet gun,
fell so manly,
when armed...  (Pearl Jam)

Arie Gilbert
North Babylon, NY

WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.comhttp://WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com
 WWW.qcbirdclub.orghttp://WWW.qcbirdclub.org


On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:
According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.

Best,
Pat




On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, 
redk...@optonline.netmailto:redk...@optonline.net wrote:
I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable.
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...

John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard
Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: Stella Miller
Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund

 My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish
 Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to justify the killing
 now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was
 their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
 plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or
 flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not
 subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing.

 Rich

 Sent from my wireless tin can

  On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller
 wrote:
 
  Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?
 Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be
 eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast
 of Crow Pot Pie.
 
  Stella
 
 
 
 
  Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything
 cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people.
 It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice
 is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an
 impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
  From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg
  To: Larry Federman
  Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard
 ; Lynne Hertzog
 ; Cesar Castillo ;
 NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund

  Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
  Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 
  Dear Larry and others,
  I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following
 answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't
 think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that
 they are gathering the crows to eat.
 
  Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go
 but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think
 twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take
 up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
 
  Best Rick
 
  From: r...@hvc.rr.commailto:r...@hvc.rr.com
  Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
  Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
  To: rickkedenb...@optonline.netmailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net
  Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is
 expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The
 crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all
 its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and
 has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence
 you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie.
  You may gather and eat different things, however that does not
 negatively define us as sportsmen.
  RVW Gun Club
  Sent from my iPhone
 
  On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg
 wrote:
 
  Dear RVW Club.
  As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[stella.mille...@yahoo.com]

Hi all. I have a call this afternoon with Friends of the Animals to discuss how 
we, including NYS Audubon chapters can join them in their efforts to ban these 
contest killings. I will also be attending the NY Audubon council meeting in 
Saratoga Springs this weekend and will try to gather support from the various 
chapters then. 

Once I have had my discussion with Friends I will let you all know how it went. 
I don't think we can stop this years event but lets hope that in the future 
wildlife will be safe from slaughter for fun and prizes!

Stella Miller
 

 -- The message is truncated. -- 


Sent with Verizon Mobile Email


---Original Message---
From: Arie Gilbert ariegilb...@optonline.net
Sent: 3/19/2014 8:26 am
To: NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

   
 got a gun,
 fact I've got two,
 that's okay man cause I love god,
 glorified version of a pellet gun,
 fell so manly,
 when armed...  (Pearl Jam)
 
 Arie Gilbert
 North Babylon, NY
 
 WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com 
  WWW.qcbirdclub.org 
 
 
 
 On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:
 
   
According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  
 
 Best,  
Pat
 

 
 

 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, redk...@optonline.net wrote:
 
 
  
I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable.  
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
 
 
 
John Turner
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Richard 
 Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 To: Stella Miller 
 Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 
 
  My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
  Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to justify the killing 
  now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
  their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
  plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
  flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
  subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
  
  Rich
  
  Sent from my wireless tin can
  
   On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
   wrote:
   
   Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
  Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
  eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
  of Crow Pot Pie.
   
   Stella
   
   
   
   
   Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
  cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
  It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
  is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
  impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
   From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg 
   To: Larry Federman  
   Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
  ; Lynne Hertzog 
  ; Cesar Castillo ; 
  NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
   
   Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
   Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
   
   Dear Larry and others,
   I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
  answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
  think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
  they are gathering the crows to eat.
   
   Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
  but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
  twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
  up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
   
   Best Rick
   
   From: r...@hvc.rr.com
   Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
   Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
   To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
   Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is 
  expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The 
  crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all 
  its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and 
  has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
  you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie. 
   You may gather and eat different things, however that does not 
  negatively define us as sportsmen. 
   RVW Gun Club
   Sent from my iPhone
   
   On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
   wrote:
   
   Dear RVW Club. 
   As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI. I know 
  you have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly 
  legal for this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
   
   However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most 
  intelligent creatures

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Linda Orkin]

Go to this link to see the successful result of comments against another
shoot scheduled by Ducks Unltd.  I took the relevant part out of it, the
letter response and put it as a message on the Rod and gun club facebook
page.

http://exposingthebiggame.wordpress.com/2014/03/19/victory-ducks-unlimited-2000-bird-pigeon-shoot-cancelled/

It can be done.

Linda Orkin
Ithaca, NY




On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 12:24 PM, Larry Trachtenberg 
trachtenb...@amsllp.com wrote:

  As a hunter, I'm surprised you'd quote Glorified G which is an
 anti-gun song, really poking fun at gun enthusiasts, don't you think.

 As an aside, and not to turn it into a song writing thread, I certainly
 prefer seeing Pearl Jam lyrics to Nas lyrics on this site anytime.

 I don't think I can add to the crow shoot comments anything that has not
 already been said.





 Larry Trachtenberg

 Ossining



 *From:* bounce-113372021-10490...@list.cornell.edu [mailto:
 bounce-113372021-10490...@list.cornell.edu] *On Behalf Of *John Cancalosi
 *Sent:* Wednesday, March 19, 2014 12:12 PM
 *To:* Arie Gilbert
 *Cc:* NYSBIRDS-L

 *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County



 I don't have time to read through all these comments so as not to repeat,
 but I don't think that anyone has used the obvious description of these
 events as a MURDER OF CROWS!



 I am a hunter and have defended hunting to a number of birdwatchers
 recently. Im my opinion what we have here is no more hunting than
 bull-fighting is sport. Let them eat crow!



 On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 8:25 AM, Arie Gilbert ariegilb...@optonline.net
 wrote:







 *got a gun, fact I've got two, that's okay man cause I love god, glorified
 version of a pellet gun, fell so manly, when armed...  *(Pearl Jam)

 Arie Gilbert
 North Babylon, NY

 WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com
  WWW.qcbirdclub.org



  On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:

  According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to
 see who could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts
 would have to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part
 of their club's culture.

 Best,

 Pat








 On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, redk...@optonline.net wrote:

  I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the
 unjustifyable.

 To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to
 shoot crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal
 law...



 John Turner

 - Original Message -
 From: Richard
 Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 To: Stella Miller
 Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne
 Hertzog , Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund

  My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish
  Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to justify the killing
  now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was
  their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
  plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or
  flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not
  subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing.
 
  Rich
 
  Sent from my wireless tin can
 
   On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller
  wrote:
  
   Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?
  Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be
  eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast
  of Crow Pot Pie.
  
   Stella
  
  
  
  
   Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything
  cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people.
  It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice
  is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an
  impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
   From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg
   To: Larry Federman
   Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard
  ; Lynne Hertzog
  ; Cesar Castillo ;
  NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund
 
   Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
   Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
  
   Dear Larry and others,
   I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following
  answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't
  think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that
  they are gathering the crows to eat.
  
   Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go
  but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think
  twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take
  up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
  
   Best Rick
  
   From: r...@hvc.rr.com
   Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
   Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
   To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
   Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is
  expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The
  crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

Hey everyone,

I spoke with Friends of Animals today.  They are pushing for legislation to ban 
contest hunts (I use the word hunt very lightly, more like massacres) in NYS. 
 A press release will be going out tomorrow from NYS Senator Avella's office 
regarding the legislation and I was asked to give a quote for it.  I am still 
not sure of the actual circumstances regarding this bill, an am waiting to hear 
more details about it, as well as a copy of the actual bill.

In the meantime, I happen to be attending the NYS Audubon Council meeting this 
weekend and will be asking the chapters in attendance to sign on in support of 
the legislation.  Huntington-Oyster Bay Audubon signed on today, obviously!

If your organization would like to sign on, please let me know.  We hope to 
have all the names in place by Tuesday at the very latest.

While at the meeting we will be brainstorming various other avenues to explore 
regarding this issue including discussions with the DEC as well as the Rod and 
Gun Club itself (Larry, got your car back yet? HA!). 

These hunts are despicable displays of butchery which demonstrate an 
appalling lack of value for the wildlife we share our world with.   

Stella Miller





  
 



Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy



 From: stella.mille...@yahoo.com stella.mille...@yahoo.com
To: Arie Gilbert ariegilb...@optonline.net; NYSBIRDS-L 
nysbirds-l@cornell.edu 
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2014 12:15 PM
Subject: RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 

Hi all. I have a call this afternoon with Friends of the Animals to discuss how 
we, including NYS Audubon chapters can join them in their efforts to ban these 
contest killings. I will also be attending the NY Audubon council meeting in 
Saratoga Springs this weekend and will try to gather support from the various 
chapters then. 

Once I have had my discussion with Friends I will let you all know how it went. 
I don't think we can stop this years event but lets hope that in the future 
wildlife will be safe from slaughter for fun and prizes!

Stella Miller


 -- The message is truncated. -- 


Sent with Verizon Mobile Email



---Original Message---
From: Arie Gilbert ariegilb...@optonline.net
Sent: 3/19/2014 8:26 am
To: NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

  
got a gun,
fact I've got two,
that's okay man cause I love god,
glorified version of a pellet gun,
fell so manly,
when armed...  (Pearl Jam)

Arie Gilbert
North Babylon, NY

WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com 
 WWW.qcbirdclub.org 



On 3/19/2014 6:50 AM, Patricia Aitken wrote:

  
According to their facebook page, they also had a Squirrel Skramble, to see who 
could shoot the most squirrels.  It seems like stopping these hunts would have 
to be done by changing the law, as competitive hunting is part of their club's 
culture.  

Best,  
Pat














On Mar 19, 2014, at 1:55 AM, redk...@optonline.net wrote:


  
I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable.  
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...

 

John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: Stella Miller 
Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 

 My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
 Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to justify the killing 
 now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
 their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
 plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
 flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
 subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
 
 Rich
 
 Sent from my wireless tin can
 
  On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
  wrote:
  
  Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
 Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
 eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
 of Crow Pot Pie.
  
  Stella
  
  
  
  
  Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
 cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
 It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
 is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
 impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
  From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg 
  To: Larry Federman  
  Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
 ; Lynne Hertzog 
 ; Cesar

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[redknot]

I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable. 
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
 
John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: Stella Miller 
Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 

> My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
> Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing 
> now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
> their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
> plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
> flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
> subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
> 
> Rich
> 
> Sent from my wireless tin can
> 
> > On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
> wrote:
> > 
> > Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
> Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
> eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
> of Crow Pot Pie.
> > 
> > Stella
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
> cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
> It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
> is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
> impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
> > From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg 
> > To: Larry Federman 
> > Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
> ; Lynne Hertzog 
> ; Cesar Castillo ; 
> NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
> 
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
> > Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> > 
> > Dear Larry and others,
> > I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
> answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
> think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
> they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
> > 
> > Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
> but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
> twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
> up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
> > 
> > Best Rick
> > 
> > From: r...@hvc.rr.com
> > Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
> > Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
> > To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
> > Rick,
> > Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is 
> expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The 
> crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all 
> its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and 
> has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
> you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie". 
> > You may gather and eat different things, however that does not 
> negatively define us as sportsmen. 
> > RVW Gun Club
> > Sent from my iPhone
> > 
> > On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
> wrote:
> > 
> > Dear RVW Club. 
> > As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI. I know 
> you have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly 
> legal for this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
> > 
> > However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most 
> intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been 
> documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and 
> live in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love 
> and appreciate nature long ago.
> > 
> > I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the 
> reputation of your club or for any responsible hunters.
> > 
> > Rick Kedenburg
> > rickkedenb...@optonline.net
> > 
> >> On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
> >> 
> >> Yes, this is a State issue. Our State Senator is Cecilia 
> Tkaczyk and our Assembly member is Pete Lopez. Our US 
> congressman is Chris Gibson. I will be reaching out to all of 
> their offices.
> >> 
> >> But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
> >> 
> >> And their Facebook page is still up - 
> https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/>> 
> >> Larry Federman
> >> President, Northern Catskills 

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[John J. Collins]

While Rooks may have been eaten in the past, the rhyme in question wasn’t about 
Rooks.  It was about LIVE birds (specifically named “Blackbirds” which are 
indeed the European or Common Blackbird, Turdus merula) which were placed in 
the pie ALIVE so that “when the pie was open the birds began to sing” 
(something you would be hard-pressed to hear a Rook do!!!) and fly away 
(something nestling Rooks would not be able to do either) to the amazement of 
the King.  See the very nice Wikipedia entry on this subject at 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sing_a_Song_of_Sixpence.

John J. Collins
Raritan, NJ
jjcb...@verizon.net
"God desires that all the world be pure in his sight.
The earth should not be injured.
The earth should not be destroyed."  (St. Hildegard of Bingen)
"I will sing to the Lord all my life;
I will sing praise to my God while I live." (Ps. 104:33)  

From: bounce-113352161-3714...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-113352161-3714...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Paul R Sweet
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 1:52 PM
To: Anthony Collerton
Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg; Larry Federman; Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne 
Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim Osterlund
Subject: RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

Thanks Anthony, I stand corrected. 

From: Anthony Collerton [mailto:icoller...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:50 PM
To: Paul R Sweet
Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg; Larry Federman; Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne 
Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

The "Blackbirds" mentioned would almost certainly have been Rooks (Corvus 
frugilegus) which were regularly eaten historically in Europe.  Usually young 
birds taken from nests before they fledged.  Adult crows probably aren't the 
tastiest of game birds, although I suppose technically edible.  I doubt many 
will make it to the table in this case though.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Paul R Sweet  wrote:
Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not crows. 
 
From: bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Rick & Linda 
Kedenburg
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
To: Larry Federman
Cc: Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim 
Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 
Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us think. 
It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
 
Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps some 
press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
contacts along these lines.
 
Best Rick
 
  From:   r...@hvc.rr.com
  Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
  Date:  March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
  To:  rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that 
crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie". 
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
define us as sportsmen. 
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone
 
On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg  wrote:
 
Dear RVW Club. 
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under the 
rules of the NYS-DEC.
 
However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and use 
tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination with 
them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.
 
I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of your 
club or for any responsible hunters.
 
Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net
 
On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:


Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.
 
But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
 
And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
 
Larry Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon
 
 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration a

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Tom Kerr]

No I do not.  Lets just say I didn't see them make an effort to pick them
up.  I didn't really want to hang around.
On Mar 18, 2014 12:56 PM, "Lynne Hertzog"  wrote:

> Hi Tom.
> Do you have any video of that event?
> Lynne
> On Mar 18, 2014 12:54 PM, "Tom Kerr"  wrote:
>
>> I witnessed a crow hunt in Monroe County. They didn't even pick them up,
>> it was just target practice.
>> On Mar 18, 2014 12:51 PM, "Anthony Collerton" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> The "Blackbirds" mentioned would almost certainly have been Rooks
>>> (Corvus frugilegus) which were regularly eaten historically in Europe.
>>>  Usually young birds taken from nests before they fledged.  Adult crows
>>> probably aren't the tastiest of game birds, although I suppose technically
>>> edible.  I doubt many will make it to the table in this case though.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Paul R Sweet  wrote:
>>>
>>>  Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula
>>> not crows.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu [
>>> mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu]
>>> *On Behalf Of *Rick & Linda Kedenburg
>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
>>> *To:* Larry Federman
>>> *Cc:* Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo;
>>> NYSBIRDS-L; Jim Osterlund
>>> *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dear Larry and others,
>>>
>>> I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See
>>> Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of
>>> us think. It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but
>>> perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't
>>> know any journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else
>>> have any contacts along these lines.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Best Rick
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>   *From: *  r...@hvc.rr.com
>>>
>>>   *Subject: **Re: Crow Shoot*
>>>
>>>   *Date: * March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
>>>
>>>   *To: * rickkedenb...@optonline.net
>>>
>>> Rick,
>>>
>>>   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We
>>> applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We
>>> believe in utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do
>>> not realize that crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as
>>> anecdotal evidence you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie".
>>>
>>> You may gather and eat different things, however that does not
>>> negatively define us as sportsmen.
>>>
>>> RVW Gun Club
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dear RVW Club.
>>>
>>> As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have
>>> every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen
>>> under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most
>>> intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to
>>> fashion and use tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My
>>> fascination with them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation
>>> of your club or for any responsible hunters.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Rick Kedenburg
>>>
>>> rickkedenb...@optonline.net
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>   Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and
>>> our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I
>>> will be reaching out to all of their offices.
>>>
>>>
>

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Paul R Sweet]

Thanks Anthony, I stand corrected.

From: Anthony Collerton [mailto:icoller...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:50 PM
To: Paul R Sweet
Cc: Rick & Linda Kedenburg; Larry Federman; Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne 
Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

The "Blackbirds" mentioned would almost certainly have been Rooks (Corvus 
frugilegus) which were regularly eaten historically in Europe.  Usually young 
birds taken from nests before they fledged.  Adult crows probably aren't the 
tastiest of game birds, although I suppose technically edible.  I doubt many 
will make it to the table in this case though.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Paul R Sweet 
mailto:sw...@amnh.org>> wrote:
Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not crows.

From: 
bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu<mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu>
 [mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Rick & Linda 
Kedenburg
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
To: Larry Federman
Cc: Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim 
Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us think. 
It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps some 
press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

  From:   r...@hvc.rr.com<mailto:r...@hvc.rr.com>
  Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
  Date:  March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
  To:  
rickkedenb...@optonline.net<mailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net>
Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that 
crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie".
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
define us as sportsmen.
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
mailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net>> wrote:

Dear RVW Club.
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under the 
rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and use 
tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination with 
them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of your 
club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net<mailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net>

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:



Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.

But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.

And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/

Larry Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
Rules and Information<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
Subscribe, Configuration and 
Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
Archives:
The Mail 
Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
Surfbirds<http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
BirdingOnThe.Net<http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>
Please submit your observations to eBird<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
Rules and Information<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
Subscribe, Configuration and 
Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
Archives:
The Mail 
Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
Surfbirds<http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
BirdingOnThe.Net<http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Richard]

My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish Crow, or Raven 
unless one or two do so to "justify" the killing now that it's been put out 
there. Nobody should believe that was their original intention. It was just to 
shoot to wound or kill - plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on 
trees or flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not  subsistence 
hunting - it's wonton killing.  

Rich

Sent from my wireless tin can

> On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller  wrote:
> 
> Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?  Sounds as 
> though he is putting it out there that they CAN be eaten, not necessarily 
> that they will be sitting down to a feast of Crow Pot Pie.
> 
> Stella
>  
> 
> 
> 
> "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
> whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread 
> the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
> between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
> From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg 
> To: Larry Federman  
> Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
> ; Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar 
> Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim 
> Osterlund  
> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
> 
> Dear Larry and others,
> I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
> Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us 
> think. It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
> 
> Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps 
> some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
> journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
> contacts along these lines.
> 
> Best Rick
> 
>   From: r...@hvc.rr.com
>   Subject:Re: Crow Shoot
>   Date:   March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
>   To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
> Rick,
>   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
> your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
> utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize 
> that crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal 
> evidence you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie". 
> You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
> define us as sportsmen. 
> RVW Gun Club
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg  
> wrote:
> 
> Dear RVW Club. 
> As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
> right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under 
> the rules of the NYS-DEC.
> 
> However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
> creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and 
> use tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination 
> with them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.
> 
> I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of 
> your club or for any responsible hunters.
> 
> Rick Kedenburg
> rickkedenb...@optonline.net
> 
>> On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
>> 
>> Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
>> Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will 
>> be reaching out to all of their offices.
>>  
>> But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
>>  
>> And  their Facebook page is still up - 
>> https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
>>  
>> Larry Federman
>> President, Northern Catskills Audubon
> 
> 
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --
> 
> 

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Tom Kerr]

I witnessed a crow hunt in Monroe County. They didn't even pick them up, it
was just target practice.
On Mar 18, 2014 12:51 PM, "Anthony Collerton"  wrote:

> The "Blackbirds" mentioned would almost certainly have been Rooks (Corvus
> frugilegus) which were regularly eaten historically in Europe.  Usually
> young birds taken from nests before they fledged.  Adult crows probably
> aren't the tastiest of game birds, although I suppose technically edible.
>  I doubt many will make it to the table in this case though.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Paul R Sweet  wrote:
>
>  Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not
> crows.
>
>
>
> *From:* bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu [
> mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu]
> *On Behalf Of *Rick & Linda Kedenburg
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
> *To:* Larry Federman
> *Cc:* Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L;
> Jim Osterlund
> *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>
>
>
> Dear Larry and others,
>
> I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See
> Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of
> us think. It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
>
>
>
> Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps
> some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know
> any journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have
> any contacts along these lines.
>
>
>
> Best Rick
>
>
>
>   *From: *  r...@hvc.rr.com
>
>   *Subject: **Re: Crow Shoot*
>
>   *Date: * March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
>
>   *To: * rickkedenb...@optonline.net
>
> Rick,
>
>   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We
> applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We
> believe in utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do
> not realize that crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as
> anecdotal evidence you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie".
>
> You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively
> define us as sportsmen.
>
> RVW Gun Club
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
> wrote:
>
>
>
> Dear RVW Club.
>
> As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have
> every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen
> under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
>
>
>
> However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent
> creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and
> use tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination
> with them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.
>
>
>
> I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of
> your club or for any responsible hunters.
>
>
>
> Rick Kedenburg
>
> rickkedenb...@optonline.net
>
>
>
> On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
>
>
>
>   Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and
> our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I
> will be reaching out to all of their offices.
>
>
>
> But, as we all know, 'legally' the club has a right to do this.
>
>
>
> And  their Facebook page is still up -
> https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
>
>
>
> Larry Federman
> President, Northern Catskills Audubon
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
>
> Welcome and Basics <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
>
> Rules and Information <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
>
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
>
> *Archives:*
>
> The Mail 
> Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
>
> Surfbirds <http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
>
> BirdingOnThe.Net <http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>
>
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>
> *!*
>
> --
>  --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
> Rules and Information <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
> S

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Anthony Collerton]

The "Blackbirds" mentioned would almost certainly have been Rooks (Corvus 
frugilegus) which were regularly eaten historically in Europe.  Usually young 
birds taken from nests before they fledged.  Adult crows probably aren't the 
tastiest of game birds, although I suppose technically edible.  I doubt many 
will make it to the table in this case though.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Paul R Sweet  wrote:
> 
> Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not 
> crows.
>  
> From: bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu 
> [mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Rick & Linda 
> Kedenburg
> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
> To: Larry Federman
> Cc: Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim 
> Osterlund
> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>  
> Dear Larry and others,
> I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
> Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us 
> think. It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the crows to eat.
>  
> Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps 
> some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
> journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
> contacts along these lines.
>  
> Best Rick
>  
>   From:   r...@hvc.rr.com
>   Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
>   Date:  March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
>   To:  rickkedenb...@optonline.net
> Rick,
>   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
> your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
> utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize 
> that crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal 
> evidence you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie". 
> You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
> define us as sportsmen. 
> RVW Gun Club
> Sent from my iPhone
>  
> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg  
> wrote:
>  
> Dear RVW Club. 
> As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
> right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under 
> the rules of the NYS-DEC.
>  
> However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
> creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and 
> use tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination 
> with them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.
>  
> I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of 
> your club or for any responsible hunters.
>  
> Rick Kedenburg
> rickkedenb...@optonline.net
>  
> On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
> 
> 
> Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
> Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will 
> be reaching out to all of their offices.
>  
> But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
>  
> And  their Facebook page is still up - 
> https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
>  
> Larry Federman
> President, Northern Catskills Audubon
>  
>  
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?  Sounds as though 
he is putting it out there that they CAN be eaten, not necessarily that they 
will be sitting down to a feast of Crow Pot Pie.

Stella
 



"Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Rick & Linda Kedenburg 
To: Larry Federman  
Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
; Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar 
Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim 
Osterlund  
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us think. 
It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps some 
press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

From:   r...@hvc.rr.com
Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that 
crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie". 
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
define us as sportsmen. 
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg  wrote:

Dear RVW Club. 
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under the 
rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and use 
tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination with 
them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of your 
club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:

Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.
> 
>But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
> 
>And  their Facebook page is still up - 
>https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
> 
>Larry Federman
>President, Northern Catskills Audubon
> 


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Rick & Linda Kedenburg]

Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See  
Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what  
any of us think. It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the  
crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but  
perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I  
don't know any journalists in that area that would take up the story.  
Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

From: r...@hvc.rr.com
Subject:Re: Crow Shoot
Date:   March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected.  
We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is  
meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all its worth. It  
sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and has been consumed  
for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence you would recall "4 and  
20 blackbirds baked in a pie".
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not  
negatively define us as sportsmen.
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg  
 wrote:

Dear RVW Club.
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you  
have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for  
this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most  
intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been  
documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and live  
in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love and  
appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the  
reputation of your club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:

> Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk  
> and our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris  
> Gibson.  I will be reaching out to all of their offices.
>
> But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
>
> And  their Facebook page is still up - https://www.facebook.com/ 
> events/258725434301388/
>
> Larry Federman
> President, Northern Catskills Audubon
>


--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Paul R Sweet]

Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not crows.

From: bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Rick & Linda 
Kedenburg
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
To: Larry Federman
Cc: Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim 
Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us think. 
It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps some 
press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

  From:   r...@hvc.rr.com<mailto:r...@hvc.rr.com>
  Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
  Date:  March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
  To:  
rickkedenb...@optonline.net<mailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net>
Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that 
crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
you would recall "4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie".
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
define us as sportsmen.
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
mailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net>> wrote:

Dear RVW Club.
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under the 
rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and use 
tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination with 
them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of your 
club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net<mailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net>

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:


Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.

But, as we all know, 'legally' the club has a right to do this.

And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/

Larry Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
Rules and Information<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
Subscribe, Configuration and 
Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
Archives:
The Mail 
Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
Surfbirds<http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
BirdingOnThe.Net<http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>
Please submit your observations to eBird<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>!
--

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Rick & Linda Kedenburg]

Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See  
Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what  
any of us think. It's preposterous that they are "gathering" the  
crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but  
perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I  
don't know any journalists in that area that would take up the story.  
Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

From: r...@hvc.rr.com
Subject:Re: Crow Shoot
Date:   March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected.  
We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is  
meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all its worth. It  
sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and has been consumed  
for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence you would recall "4 and  
20 blackbirds baked in a pie".
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not  
negatively define us as sportsmen.
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg  
 wrote:

Dear RVW Club.
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you  
have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for  
this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most  
intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been  
documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and live  
in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love and  
appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the  
reputation of your club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:

> Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk  
> and our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris  
> Gibson.  I will be reaching out to all of their offices.
>
> But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
>
> And  their Facebook page is still up - https://www.facebook.com/ 
> events/258725434301388/
>
> Larry Federman
> President, Northern Catskills Audubon
>


--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Richard]

One more step by hunting advocates to alienate any otherwise tolerant 
supporters. Way to go, sports, keep up the good work. As if hunting can use any 
more opponents. 

Rich Guthrie 

Sent from my wireless tin can

> On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:05, John Cancalosi  wrote:
> 
> This isn't hunting. These "hunters" should be made to "eat crow".
> 
> 
>> On Tue, Mar 18, 2014 at 9:58 AM, Stella Miller  
>> wrote:
>> They took down the announcement on the timeline
>>  where several of us had commented.  Glad to see there is an official event 
>> to post on.  Thanks Larry!
>> 
>> Stella
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
>> whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread 
>> the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it 
>> is between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
>> From: Larry Federman 
>> To: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
>>  
>> Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo 
>> ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
>>  
>> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:26 AM
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>> 
>> Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
>> Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will 
>> be reaching out to all of their offices.
>>  
>> But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
>>  
>> And  their Facebook page is still up - 
>> https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
>>  
>> Larry Federman
>> President, Northern Catskills Audubon
>>  
>> From: Jonathan Perez
>> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:28 AM
>> To: Richard
>> Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund
>> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>>  
>> Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional aide 
>> we had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district I 
>> would start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.
>>  
>> Good luck.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard  wrote:
>>> 
>>> The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule 
>>> generated or regulated at the state level. 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my wireless tin can
>>> 
>>>> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am 
>>>> in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
>>>> Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 
>>>> 
>>>> Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
>>>> http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
>>>> 
>>>> Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
>>>> 
>>>> -Jonathan
>>>>  
>>>> Jonathan A. Perez
>>>> 
>>>> J.D. Candidate
>>>> American University Washington College of Law, 2015
>>>> M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
>>>> B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  
>>>> wrote:
>>>> Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
>>>> Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
>>>> http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
>>>> Lynne Hertzog
>>>> On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
>>>> Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this? 
>>>> This reminds me of
>>>> The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
>>>> wrote:
>>>> There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in 
>>>> Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  
>>>> They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of 
>>>> Corvus corax  only adds targets.
>>>> --
>>>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>>> Welcome and Basics
>>>> Rules and Information
>>>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>>> Archives:
>>>> The Mail Archive
>>&g

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

They took down the announcement on the timeline
 where several of us had commented.  Glad to see there is an official event to 
post on.  Thanks Larry!

Stella

 



"Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Larry Federman 
To: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
 
Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo 
; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
 
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:26 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and 
our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris 
Gibson.  I will be reaching out to all of their offices.
 
But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
 
And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
 
Larry 
Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon
 
From: Jonathan Perez 
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:28 AM
To: Richard 
Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim 
Osterlund 
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene 
County
 
Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional aide 
we had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district I would 
start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.
 
Good luck.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard  
wrote:


The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule  generated 
or regulated at the state level. 
>
>Sent from my wireless tin 
  can
>
>On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez   wrote:
>
>
>I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.   As I am in 
>DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
>>Paul 
Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 
>>
>>Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
>>http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
>>
>>Hope  that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
>>
>>-Jonathan
>>
>> 
>>Jonathan A. Perez
>>
>>J.D. Candidate
>>American University 
Washington College of Law, 2015
>>M.A., University of Virginia, 
2008
>>B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  
>>wrote:
>>
>>Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
>>>Doesn't 
  seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
>>>http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
>>>Lynne Hertzog
>>>On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"   wrote:
>>>
>>>Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for  this?  
>>>>This  reminds me of 
>>>>The Birds of Killingworth  by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim  Osterlund  
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids  in 
>>>>Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through  March.  
>>>>They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our  feeble return of 
>>>>Corvus corax  only adds targets. 
>>>>--
>>>>NYSbirds-L List  Info:
>>>>Welcome and  Basics
>>>>Rules and  Information
>>>>Subscribe,  Configuration and Leave
>>>>Archives:
>>>>The Mail  Archive
>>>>Surfbirds
>>>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>>>Please  submit your observations to eBird!
>>>>--
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>NYSbirds-L List  Info:
>>>>Welcome and  Basics
>>>>Rules and  Information
>>>>Subscribe, Configuration and  Leave
>>>>Archives:
>>>>The Mail Archive
>>>>Surfbirds
>>>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>>>Please  submit your observations to eBird!
>>>>--
>>>--
>>>NYSbirds-L  List Info:
>>>Welcome and Basics
>>>Rules and  Information
>>>Subscribe, Configuration and  Leave
>>>Archives:
>>>The Mail Archive
>>>Surfbirds
>>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>>Please  submit your observations to eBird!
>>>--
>> 
>>--
>>NYSbirds-L  List Info:
>>Welcome and Basics
>>Rules and  Information
>>Subscribe,  Configuration and Leave
>>Archives:
>>The  Mail Archive
>>Surfbirds
>>BirdingO

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[John Cancalosi]

This isn't hunting. These "hunters" should be made to "eat crow".


On Tue, Mar 18, 2014 at 9:58 AM, Stella Miller wrote:

> They took down the announcement on the timeline
>  where several of us had commented.  Glad to see there is an official
> event to post on.  Thanks Larry!
>
> Stella
>
>
>
>
>
> "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as
> holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science
> to spread the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or
> people, it is between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas
> Lovejoy
>   --
>  *From:* Larry Federman 
> *To:* Jonathan Perez ; Richard <
> richardpguth...@gmail.com>
> *Cc:* Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo <
> czar3...@yahoo.com>; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund <
> james...@optonline.net>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:26 AM
>
> *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>
>  Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and
> our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I
> will be reaching out to all of their offices.
>
> But, as we all know, 'legally' the club has a right to do this.
>
> And  their Facebook page is still up -
> https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
>
> Larry Federman
> President, Northern Catskills Audubon
>
>  *From:* Jonathan Perez 
> *Sent:* Monday, March 17, 2014 8:28 AM
> *To:* Richard 
> *Cc:* Lynne Hertzog  ; Cesar 
> Castillo;
> NYSBIRDS-L  ; Jim Osterlund
> *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>
>  Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional
> aide we had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district
> I would start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.
>
> Good luck.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard  wrote:
>
>  The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule
> generated or regulated at the state level.
>
> Sent from my wireless tin can
>
> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez 
> wrote:
>
>I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As
> I am in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.
> Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville.
>
> Here is his contact from a general Google search.
> http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
>
> Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
>
> -Jonathan
>
>  Jonathan A. Perez
>
> J.D. Candidate
> American University Washington College of Law, 2015
> M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
> B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
>
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog wrote:
>
> Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
> Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
> http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
> Lynne Hertzog
>  On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
>
>  Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
> This reminds me of
> The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>
>
>  On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund 
> wrote:
>  There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in
> Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year -- September through March.
> They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of
> *Corvus* *corax*  only adds targets.
> --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
> Rules and Information <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
> *Archives:*
> The Mail 
> Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
> Surfbirds <http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
> BirdingOnThe.Net <http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>
> *!*
> --
>
>
> --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
> Rules and Information <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
> *Archives:*
> The Mail 
> Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
> Surfbirds <http://www.surfbird

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Larry Federman]

Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.

But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.

And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/

Larry Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon

From: Jonathan Perez 
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:28 AM
To: Richard 
Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional aide we 
had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district I would 
start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.

Good luck.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard  wrote:


  The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
or regulated at the state level. 

  Sent from my wireless tin can

  On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez  wrote:


I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am 
in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 


Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/


Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.


-Jonathan


Jonathan A. Perez

J.D. Candidate
American University Washington College of Law, 2015
M.A., University of Virginia, 2008

B.A., Bowdoin College 2005






On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  
wrote:

  Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
  Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.

  http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html

  Lynne Hertzog

  On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:

Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
This reminds me of 
The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund 
 wrote:

There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in 
Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They 
make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
only adds targets. 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--



--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
  --
  NYSbirds-L List Info:
  Welcome and Basics 
  Rules and Information 
  Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
  Archives:
  The Mail Archive
  Surfbirds
  BirdingOnThe.Net
  Please submit your observations to eBird!
  --

--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Larry Federman]

Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.

But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.

And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/

Larry Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon

From: Jonathan Perez 
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:28 AM
To: Richard 
Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional aide we 
had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district I would 
start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.

Good luck.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com wrote:


  The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
or regulated at the state level. 

  Sent from my wireless tin can

  On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com wrote:


I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am 
in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 


Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/


Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.


-Jonathan


Jonathan A. Perez

J.D. Candidate
American University Washington College of Law, 2015
M.A., University of Virginia, 2008

B.A., Bowdoin College 2005






On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com 
wrote:

  Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
  Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.

  http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html

  Lynne Hertzog

  On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:

Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
This reminds me of 
The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund 
james...@optonline.net wrote:

There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in 
Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They 
make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
only adds targets. 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--



--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
  --
  NYSbirds-L List Info:
  Welcome and Basics 
  Rules and Information 
  Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
  Archives:
  The Mail Archive
  Surfbirds
  BirdingOnThe.Net
  Please submit your observations to eBird!
  --

--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[John Cancalosi]

This isn't hunting. These hunters should be made to eat crow.


On Tue, Mar 18, 2014 at 9:58 AM, Stella Miller stella.mille...@yahoo.comwrote:

 They took down the announcement on the timeline
  where several of us had commented.  Glad to see there is an official
 event to post on.  Thanks Larry!

 Stella





 Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as
 holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science
 to spread the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or
 people, it is between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas
 Lovejoy
   --
  *From:* Larry Federman birderla...@verizon.net
 *To:* Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com; Richard 
 richardpguth...@gmail.com
 *Cc:* Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar Castillo 
 czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim Osterlund 
 james...@optonline.net
 *Sent:* Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:26 AM

 *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

  Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and
 our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I
 will be reaching out to all of their offices.

 But, as we all know, 'legally' the club has a right to do this.

 And  their Facebook page is still up -
 https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/

 Larry Federman
 President, Northern Catskills Audubon

  *From:* Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com
 *Sent:* Monday, March 17, 2014 8:28 AM
 *To:* Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com
 *Cc:* Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com ; Cesar 
 Castilloczar3...@yahoo.com;
 NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu ; Jim Osterlundjames...@optonline.net
 *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

  Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional
 aide we had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district
 I would start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.

 Good luck.

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com wrote:

  The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule
 generated or regulated at the state level.

 Sent from my wireless tin can

 On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com
 wrote:

I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As
 I am in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.
 Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville.

 Here is his contact from a general Google search.
 http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/

 Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.

 -Jonathan

  Jonathan A. Perez

 J.D. Candidate
 American University Washington College of Law, 2015
 M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
 B.A., Bowdoin College 2005



 On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.comwrote:

 Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
 Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
 http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
 Lynne Hertzog
  On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:

  Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
 This reminds me of
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow


  On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net
 wrote:
  There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in
 Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year -- September through March.
 They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of
 *Corvus* *corax*  only adds targets.
 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --


 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --

 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

They took down the announcement on the timeline
 where several of us had commented.  Glad to see there is an official event to 
post on.  Thanks Larry!

Stella

 



Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Larry Federman birderla...@verizon.net
To: Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com; Richard 
richardpguth...@gmail.com 
Cc: Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar Castillo 
czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim Osterlund 
james...@optonline.net 
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:26 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and 
our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris 
Gibson.  I will be reaching out to all of their offices.
 
But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
 
And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
 
Larry 
Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon
 
From: Jonathan Perez 
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:28 AM
To: Richard 
Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim 
Osterlund 
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene 
County
 
Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional aide 
we had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district I would 
start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.
 
Good luck.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com 
wrote:


The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule  generated 
or regulated at the state level. 

Sent from my wireless tin 
  can

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com  wrote:


I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.   As I am in 
DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
Paul 
Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 

Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/

Hope  that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.

-Jonathan

 
Jonathan A. Perez

J.D. Candidate
American University 
Washington College of Law, 2015
M.A., University of Virginia, 
2008
B.A., Bowdoin College 2005





On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com 
wrote:

Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
Doesn't 
  seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
Lynne Hertzog
On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com  wrote:

Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for  this?  
This  reminds me of 
The Birds of Killingworth  by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim  Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
wrote:

There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids  in 
Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through  March.  
They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our  feeble return of 
Corvus corax  only adds targets. 
--
NYSbirds-L List  Info:
Welcome and  Basics
Rules and  Information
Subscribe,  Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail  Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please  submit your observations to eBird!
--


--
NYSbirds-L List  Info:
Welcome and  Basics
Rules and  Information
Subscribe, Configuration and  Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please  submit your observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L  List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and  Information
Subscribe, Configuration and  Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please  submit your observations to eBird!
--
 
--
NYSbirds-L  List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and  Information
Subscribe,  Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The  Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit  your observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List 
Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and 
Information
Subscribe, 
Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail 
Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your 
observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Richard]

One more step by hunting advocates to alienate any otherwise tolerant 
supporters. Way to go, sports, keep up the good work. As if hunting can use any 
more opponents. 

Rich Guthrie 

Sent from my wireless tin can

 On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:05, John Cancalosi jjcpurav...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 This isn't hunting. These hunters should be made to eat crow.
 
 
 On Tue, Mar 18, 2014 at 9:58 AM, Stella Miller stella.mille...@yahoo.com 
 wrote:
 They took down the announcement on the timeline
  where several of us had commented.  Glad to see there is an official event 
 to post on.  Thanks Larry!
 
 Stella
 
  
 
 
 
 Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
 whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread 
 the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it 
 is between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
 From: Larry Federman birderla...@verizon.net
 To: Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com; Richard 
 richardpguth...@gmail.com 
 Cc: Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar Castillo 
 czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim Osterlund 
 james...@optonline.net 
 Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:26 AM
 
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 
 Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
 Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will 
 be reaching out to all of their offices.
  
 But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
  
 And  their Facebook page is still up - 
 https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
  
 Larry Federman
 President, Northern Catskills Audubon
  
 From: Jonathan Perez
 Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:28 AM
 To: Richard
 Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
  
 Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional aide 
 we had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district I 
 would start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.
  
 Good luck.
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule 
 generated or regulated at the state level. 
 
 Sent from my wireless tin can
 
 On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am 
 in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
 Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 
 
 Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
 http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
 
 Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
 
 -Jonathan
  
 Jonathan A. Perez
 
 J.D. Candidate
 American University Washington College of Law, 2015
 M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
 B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
 
 
 
 On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com 
 wrote:
 Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
 Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
 http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
 Lynne Hertzog
 On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:
 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this? 
 This reminds me of
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
 
 
 
 On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
 wrote:
 There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in 
 Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  
 They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of 
 Corvus corax  only adds targets.
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and  Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics 
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
  
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Rick Linda Kedenburg]

Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See  
Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what  
any of us think. It's preposterous that they are gathering the  
crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but  
perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I  
don't know any journalists in that area that would take up the story.  
Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

From: r...@hvc.rr.com
Subject:Re: Crow Shoot
Date:   March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected.  
We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is  
meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all its worth. It  
sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and has been consumed  
for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence you would recall 4 and  
20 blackbirds baked in a pie.
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not  
negatively define us as sportsmen.
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg  
rickkedenb...@optonline.net wrote:

Dear RVW Club.
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you  
have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for  
this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most  
intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been  
documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and live  
in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love and  
appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the  
reputation of your club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:

 Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk  
 and our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris  
 Gibson.  I will be reaching out to all of their offices.

 But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.

 And  their Facebook page is still up - https://www.facebook.com/ 
 events/258725434301388/

 Larry Federman
 President, Northern Catskills Audubon



--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Paul R Sweet]

Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not crows.

From: bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Rick  Linda 
Kedenburg
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
To: Larry Federman
Cc: Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim 
Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us think. 
It's preposterous that they are gathering the crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps some 
press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

  From:   r...@hvc.rr.commailto:r...@hvc.rr.com
  Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
  Date:  March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
  To:  
rickkedenb...@optonline.netmailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that 
crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie.
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
define us as sportsmen.
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
rickkedenb...@optonline.netmailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net wrote:

Dear RVW Club.
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under the 
rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and use 
tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination with 
them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of your 
club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.netmailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:


Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.

But, as we all know, 'legally' the club has a right to do this.

And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/

Larry Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basicshttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
Rules and Informationhttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
Subscribe, Configuration and 
Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
Archives:
The Mail 
Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
Surfbirdshttp://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
BirdingOnThe.Nethttp://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
Please submit your observations to eBirdhttp://ebird.org/content/ebird/!
--

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Rick Linda Kedenburg]

Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See  
Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what  
any of us think. It's preposterous that they are gathering the  
crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but  
perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I  
don't know any journalists in that area that would take up the story.  
Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

From: r...@hvc.rr.com
Subject:Re: Crow Shoot
Date:   March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected.  
We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is  
meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all its worth. It  
sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and has been consumed  
for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence you would recall 4 and  
20 blackbirds baked in a pie.
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not  
negatively define us as sportsmen.
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg  
rickkedenb...@optonline.net wrote:

Dear RVW Club.
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you  
have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for  
this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most  
intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been  
documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and live  
in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love and  
appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the  
reputation of your club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:

 Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk  
 and our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris  
 Gibson.  I will be reaching out to all of their offices.

 But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.

 And  their Facebook page is still up - https://www.facebook.com/ 
 events/258725434301388/

 Larry Federman
 President, Northern Catskills Audubon



--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?  Sounds as though 
he is putting it out there that they CAN be eaten, not necessarily that they 
will be sitting down to a feast of Crow Pot Pie.

Stella
 



Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg kedenb...@optonline.net
To: Larry Federman birderla...@verizon.net 
Cc: Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com; Richard 
richardpguth...@gmail.com; Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar 
Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim 
Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us think. 
It's preposterous that they are gathering the crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps some 
press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

From:   r...@hvc.rr.com
Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that 
crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie. 
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
define us as sportsmen. 
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg rickkedenb...@optonline.net wrote:

Dear RVW Club. 
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under the 
rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and use 
tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination with 
them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of your 
club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:

Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.
 
But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
 
And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
 
Larry Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon
 


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Anthony Collerton]

The Blackbirds mentioned would almost certainly have been Rooks (Corvus 
frugilegus) which were regularly eaten historically in Europe.  Usually young 
birds taken from nests before they fledged.  Adult crows probably aren't the 
tastiest of game birds, although I suppose technically edible.  I doubt many 
will make it to the table in this case though.

Sent from my iPhone

 On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Paul R Sweet sw...@amnh.org wrote:
 
 Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not 
 crows.
  
 From: bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu 
 [mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Rick  Linda 
 Kedenburg
 Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
 To: Larry Federman
 Cc: Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim 
 Osterlund
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
  
 Dear Larry and others,
 I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
 Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us 
 think. It's preposterous that they are gathering the crows to eat.
  
 Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps 
 some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
 journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
 contacts along these lines.
  
 Best Rick
  
   From:   r...@hvc.rr.com
   Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
   Date:  March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
   To:  rickkedenb...@optonline.net
 Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
 your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
 utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize 
 that crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal 
 evidence you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie. 
 You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
 define us as sportsmen. 
 RVW Gun Club
 Sent from my iPhone
  
 On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg rickkedenb...@optonline.net 
 wrote:
  
 Dear RVW Club. 
 As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
 right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under 
 the rules of the NYS-DEC.
  
 However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
 creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and 
 use tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination 
 with them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.
  
 I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of 
 your club or for any responsible hunters.
  
 Rick Kedenburg
 rickkedenb...@optonline.net
  
 On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
 
 
 Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
 Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will 
 be reaching out to all of their offices.
  
 But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
  
 And  their Facebook page is still up - 
 https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
  
 Larry Federman
 President, Northern Catskills Audubon
  
  
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Tom Kerr]

I witnessed a crow hunt in Monroe County. They didn't even pick them up, it
was just target practice.
On Mar 18, 2014 12:51 PM, Anthony Collerton icoller...@gmail.com wrote:

 The Blackbirds mentioned would almost certainly have been Rooks (Corvus
 frugilegus) which were regularly eaten historically in Europe.  Usually
 young birds taken from nests before they fledged.  Adult crows probably
 aren't the tastiest of game birds, although I suppose technically edible.
  I doubt many will make it to the table in this case though.

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Paul R Sweet sw...@amnh.org wrote:

  Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not
 crows.



 *From:* bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu [
 mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edubounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu]
 *On Behalf Of *Rick  Linda Kedenburg
 *Sent:* Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
 *To:* Larry Federman
 *Cc:* Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L;
 Jim Osterlund
 *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County



 Dear Larry and others,

 I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See
 Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of
 us think. It's preposterous that they are gathering the crows to eat.



 Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps
 some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know
 any journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have
 any contacts along these lines.



 Best Rick



   *From: *  r...@hvc.rr.com

   *Subject: **Re: Crow Shoot*

   *Date: * March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT

   *To: * rickkedenb...@optonline.net

 Rick,

   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We
 applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We
 believe in utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do
 not realize that crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as
 anecdotal evidence you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie.

 You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively
 define us as sportsmen.

 RVW Gun Club

 Sent from my iPhone



 On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg rickkedenb...@optonline.net
 wrote:



 Dear RVW Club.

 As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have
 every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen
 under the rules of the NYS-DEC.



 However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent
 creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and
 use tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination
 with them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.



 I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of
 your club or for any responsible hunters.



 Rick Kedenburg

 rickkedenb...@optonline.net



 On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:



   Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and
 our Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I
 will be reaching out to all of their offices.



 But, as we all know, 'legally' the club has a right to do this.



 And  their Facebook page is still up -
 https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/



 Larry Federman
 President, Northern Catskills Audubon





 --

 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*

 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME

 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES

 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

 *Archives:*

 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html

 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L

 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*

 --
  --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --

 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Richard]

My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish Crow, or Raven 
unless one or two do so to justify the killing now that it's been put out 
there. Nobody should believe that was their original intention. It was just to 
shoot to wound or kill - plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on 
trees or flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not  subsistence 
hunting - it's wonton killing.  

Rich

Sent from my wireless tin can

 On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller stella.mille...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
 Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds?  Sounds as 
 though he is putting it out there that they CAN be eaten, not necessarily 
 that they will be sitting down to a feast of Crow Pot Pie.
 
 Stella
  
 
 
 
 Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
 whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread 
 the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
 between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
 From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg kedenb...@optonline.net
 To: Larry Federman birderla...@verizon.net 
 Cc: Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com; Richard 
 richardpguth...@gmail.com; Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar 
 Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim 
 Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
 Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 
 Dear Larry and others,
 I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
 Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us 
 think. It's preposterous that they are gathering the crows to eat.
 
 Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps 
 some press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
 journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
 contacts along these lines.
 
 Best Rick
 
   From: r...@hvc.rr.com
   Subject:Re: Crow Shoot
   Date:   March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
   To:   rickkedenb...@optonline.net
 Rick,
   Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
 your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
 utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize 
 that crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal 
 evidence you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie. 
 You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
 define us as sportsmen. 
 RVW Gun Club
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg rickkedenb...@optonline.net 
 wrote:
 
 Dear RVW Club. 
 As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
 right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under 
 the rules of the NYS-DEC.
 
 However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
 creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and 
 use tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination 
 with them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.
 
 I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of 
 your club or for any responsible hunters.
 
 Rick Kedenburg
 rickkedenb...@optonline.net
 
 On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
 
 Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
 Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will 
 be reaching out to all of their offices.
  
 But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
  
 And  their Facebook page is still up - 
 https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
  
 Larry Federman
 President, Northern Catskills Audubon
 
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Paul R Sweet]

Thanks Anthony, I stand corrected.

From: Anthony Collerton [mailto:icoller...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:50 PM
To: Paul R Sweet
Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg; Larry Federman; Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne 
Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

The Blackbirds mentioned would almost certainly have been Rooks (Corvus 
frugilegus) which were regularly eaten historically in Europe.  Usually young 
birds taken from nests before they fledged.  Adult crows probably aren't the 
tastiest of game birds, although I suppose technically edible.  I doubt many 
will make it to the table in this case though.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Paul R Sweet 
sw...@amnh.orgmailto:sw...@amnh.org wrote:
Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not crows.

From: 
bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edumailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu
 [mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Rick  Linda 
Kedenburg
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
To: Larry Federman
Cc: Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim 
Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us think. 
It's preposterous that they are gathering the crows to eat.

Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps some 
press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
contacts along these lines.

Best Rick

  From:   r...@hvc.rr.commailto:r...@hvc.rr.com
  Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
  Date:  March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
  To:  
rickkedenb...@optonline.netmailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that 
crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie.
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
define us as sportsmen.
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
rickkedenb...@optonline.netmailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net wrote:

Dear RVW Club.
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under the 
rules of the NYS-DEC.

However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and use 
tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination with 
them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.

I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of your 
club or for any responsible hunters.

Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.netmailto:rickkedenb...@optonline.net

On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:



Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.

But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.

And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/

Larry Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basicshttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
Rules and Informationhttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
Subscribe, Configuration and 
Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
Archives:
The Mail 
Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
Surfbirdshttp://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
BirdingOnThe.Nethttp://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
Please submit your observations to eBirdhttp://ebird.org/content/ebird/!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basicshttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
Rules and Informationhttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
Subscribe, Configuration and 
Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
Archives:
The Mail 
Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
Surfbirdshttp://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
BirdingOnThe.Nethttp://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
Please submit your observations to eBirdhttp://ebird.org/content/ebird/!
--

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http

RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[John J. Collins]

While Rooks may have been eaten in the past, the rhyme in question wasn’t about 
Rooks.  It was about LIVE birds (specifically named “Blackbirds” which are 
indeed the European or Common Blackbird, Turdus merula) which were placed in 
the pie ALIVE so that “when the pie was open the birds began to sing” 
(something you would be hard-pressed to hear a Rook do!!!) and fly away 
(something nestling Rooks would not be able to do either) to the amazement of 
the King.  See the very nice Wikipedia entry on this subject at 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sing_a_Song_of_Sixpence.

John J. Collins
Raritan, NJ
jjcb...@verizon.net
God desires that all the world be pure in his sight.
The earth should not be injured.
The earth should not be destroyed.  (St. Hildegard of Bingen)
I will sing to the Lord all my life;
I will sing praise to my God while I live. (Ps. 104:33)  

From: bounce-113352161-3714...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-113352161-3714...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Paul R Sweet
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 1:52 PM
To: Anthony Collerton
Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg; Larry Federman; Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne 
Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim Osterlund
Subject: RE: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

Thanks Anthony, I stand corrected. 

From: Anthony Collerton [mailto:icoller...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:50 PM
To: Paul R Sweet
Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg; Larry Federman; Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne 
Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

The Blackbirds mentioned would almost certainly have been Rooks (Corvus 
frugilegus) which were regularly eaten historically in Europe.  Usually young 
birds taken from nests before they fledged.  Adult crows probably aren't the 
tastiest of game birds, although I suppose technically edible.  I doubt many 
will make it to the table in this case though.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 18, 2014, at 10:34 AM, Paul R Sweet sw...@amnh.org wrote:
Point of information, the 4 and 20 blackbirds would be Turdus merula not crows. 
 
From: bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-113350129-11471...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Rick  Linda 
Kedenburg
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
To: Larry Federman
Cc: Jonathan Perez; Richard; Lynne Hertzog; Cesar Castillo; NYSBIRDS-L; Jim 
Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 
Dear Larry and others,
I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following answer. (See Below) 
Judging from the way it's worded I don't think they care what any of us think. 
It's preposterous that they are gathering the crows to eat.
 
Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go but perhaps some 
press coverage of this event my make them think twice. I don't know any 
journalists in that area that would take up the story. Anyone else have any 
contacts along these lines.
 
Best Rick
 
  From:   r...@hvc.rr.com
  Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
  Date:  March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
  To:  rickkedenb...@optonline.net
Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is expected. We applaud 
your respect for nature and the crow. The crow is meaningful. We believe in 
utilizing the animal for all its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that 
crow can and has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie. 
You may gather and eat different things, however that does not negatively 
define us as sportsmen. 
RVW Gun Club
Sent from my iPhone
 
On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg rickkedenb...@optonline.net wrote:
 
Dear RVW Club. 
As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI.  I know you have every 
right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly legal for this to happen under the 
rules of the NYS-DEC.
 
However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent 
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to fashion and use 
tools. They are highly social and live in family groups. My fascination with 
them led me to love and appreciate nature long ago.
 
I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the reputation of your 
club or for any responsible hunters.
 
Rick Kedenburg
rickkedenb...@optonline.net
 
On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:


Yes, this is a State issue.  Our State Senator is Cecilia Tkaczyk and our 
Assembly member is Pete Lopez.  Our US congressman is Chris Gibson.  I will be 
reaching out to all of their offices.
 
But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
 
And  their Facebook page is still up - 
https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/
 
Larry Federman
President, Northern Catskills Audubon
 
 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics 
Rules and Information 
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[redknot]

I totally agree with Rich. It was a posthaste attempt to justify the 
unjustifyable. 
To proceed in trying to stop this we need to determine if the ability to shoot 
crows is rooted in NY En Con Law or if it stems from federal law...
 
John Turner

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: Stella Miller 
Cc: Rick  Linda Kedenburg , Larry Federman , Jonathan Perez , Lynne Hertzog , 
Cesar Castillo , NYSBIRDS-L , Jim Osterlund 

 My guess is that nobody will consume any American Crow, Fish 
 Crow, or Raven unless one or two do so to justify the killing 
 now that it's been put out there. Nobody should believe that was 
 their original intention. It was just to shoot to wound or kill -
 plain and simple. I've seen crippled crows impaired on trees or 
 flopping on ice to lure more into range. This is not 
 subsistence hunting - it's wonton killing. 
 
 Rich
 
 Sent from my wireless tin can
 
  On Mar 18, 2014, at 11:21, Stella Miller 
 wrote:
  
  Is he really confirming that they will be eating these birds? 
 Sounds as though he is putting it out there that they CAN be 
 eaten, not necessarily that they will be sitting down to a feast 
 of Crow Pot Pie.
  
  Stella
  
  
  
  
  Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything 
 cold, as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. 
 It is up to science to spread the understanding that the choice 
 is not between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an 
 impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
  From: Rick  Linda Kedenburg 
  To: Larry Federman 
  Cc: Jonathan Perez ; Richard 
 ; Lynne Hertzog 
 ; Cesar Castillo ; 
 NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
 
  Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:07 AM
  Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
  
  Dear Larry and others,
  I wrote to the club yesterday and received the following 
 answer. (See Below) Judging from the way it's worded I don't 
 think they care what any of us think. It's preposterous that 
 they are gathering the crows to eat.
  
  Approaching our government representatives is a good way to go 
 but perhaps some press coverage of this event my make them think 
 twice. I don't know any journalists in that area that would take 
 up the story. Anyone else have any contacts along these lines.
  
  Best Rick
  
  From: r...@hvc.rr.com
  Subject: Re: Crow Shoot
  Date: March 17, 2014 10:56:54 PM EDT
  To: rickkedenb...@optonline.net
  Rick,
  Thank you for your input. Your opinion of our event is 
 expected. We applaud your respect for nature and the crow. The 
 crow is meaningful. We believe in utilizing the animal for all 
 its worth. It sounds as if you do not realize that crow can and 
 has been consumed for centuries. I'm sure as anecdotal evidence 
 you would recall 4 and 20 blackbirds baked in a pie. 
  You may gather and eat different things, however that does not 
 negatively define us as sportsmen. 
  RVW Gun Club
  Sent from my iPhone
  
  On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:40 PM, Rick Kedenburg 
 wrote:
  
  Dear RVW Club. 
  As a youth I was a duck and deer hunter on eastern LI. I know 
 you have every right to conduct this shoot. It is perfectly 
 legal for this to happen under the rules of the NYS-DEC.
  
  However I am still outraged by this. Crows are one of the most 
 intelligent creatures we share the Earth with. They have been 
 documented to fashion and use tools. They are highly social and 
 live in family groups. My fascination with them led me to love 
 and appreciate nature long ago.
  
  I hope you can understand that this will not be good for the 
 reputation of your club or for any responsible hunters.
  
  Rick Kedenburg
  rickkedenb...@optonline.net
  
  On Mar 18, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Larry Federman wrote:
  
  Yes, this is a State issue. Our State Senator is Cecilia 
 Tkaczyk and our Assembly member is Pete Lopez. Our US 
 congressman is Chris Gibson. I will be reaching out to all of 
 their offices.
  
  But, as we all know, ‘legally’ the club has a right to do this.
  
  And their Facebook page is still up - 
 https://www.facebook.com/events/258725434301388/ 
  Larry Federman
  President, Northern Catskills Audubon
  
  
  --
  NYSbirds-L List Info:
  Welcome and Basics
  Rules and Information
  Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
  Archives:
  The Mail Archive
  Surfbirds
  BirdingOnThe.Net
  Please submit your observations to eBird!
  --
  
  
 
 --
 
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 
 ARCHIVES:
 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 
 Please submit your observations to eBird:
 http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 
 --

--

NYSbirds-L

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Rick & Linda Kedenburg]

I am outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent  
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to  
fashion and use tools. They are highly social and live in family  
groups. My fascination with them led me into birding long ago.

Thank you to those in this group for letting us know how best to  
address this issue.
Stella, let us know Audubon New York's position on this and if they  
will advocate to stop this.

Rick & Linda

Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can  
change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.

Margaret Mead





On Mar 17, 2014, at 12:53 PM, Stella Miller wrote:

> By the way, the Club took down the Crow Down announcements on their  
> FB page.  A few of us had already made comments.
>
> Attached is the announcement for those of you that have not seen it.
>
> Stella
>
>
>
>
> "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold,  
> as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up  
> to science to spread the understanding that the choice is not  
> between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an  
> impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
> From: Richard 
> To: Jonathan Perez 
> Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo  
> ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim  
> Osterlund 
> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>
> The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule  
> generated or regulated at the state level.
>
> Sent from my wireless tin can
>
> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez  
>  wrote:
>
>> I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.   
>> As I am in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.
>> Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents  
>> Palenville.
>>
>> Here is his contact from a general Google search. http:// 
>> tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
>>
>> Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
>>
>> -Jonathan
>>
>> Jonathan A. Perez
>>
>> J.D. Candidate
>> American University Washington College of Law, 2015
>> M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
>> B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  
>>  wrote:
>> Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
>> Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
>> http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
>> Lynne Hertzog
>> On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"   
>> wrote:
>> Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
>> This reminds me of
>> The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
>>  wrote:
>> There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids  
>> in Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September  
>> through March.  They make no distinction of species, so I suppose  
>> our feeble return of Corvus corax  only adds targets.
>> --
>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>> Welcome and Basics
>> Rules and Information
>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>> Archives:
>> The Mail Archive
>> Surfbirds
>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>> --
>>
>>
>> --
>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>> Welcome and Basics
>> Rules and Information
>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>> Archives:
>> The Mail Archive
>> Surfbirds
>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>> --
>> --
>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>> Welcome and Basics
>> Rules and Information
>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>> Archives:
>> The Mail Archive
>> Surfbirds
>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>> --
>>
>> --
>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>> Welcome and Basics
>> Rules and Information
>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>> Archives:
>> The Mail Archive
>> Surfbirds
>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>> --
>
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --
>
>
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --


--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

They changed their settings.  Last night you could post on it.  Which is how I 
shared their photo to the HOBAS page as well as my own.  For extra measure, I 
downloaded it in case they pulled it.

Stella


 



"Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Linda Orkin 
To: Stella Miller  
Cc: Richard ; Jonathan Perez 
; Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar 
Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim 
Osterlund  
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 1:02 PM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


That is really  quite an appalling notice, hopefully the crows are smart enough 
to stay away.  I messaged the rod and gun club on their FB page since there is 
no other way to post or comment.  

Linda Orkin
Ithaca, NY




On Mon, Mar 17, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Stella Miller  
wrote:

By the way, the Club took down the Crow Down announcements on their FB page.  A 
few of us had already made comments.  
>
>
>
>Attached is the announcement for those of you that have not seen it.
>
>
>Stella
>
> 
>
>
>
>"Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
>whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread 
>the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
>between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy
>
>
>
> 
>From: Richard 
>To: Jonathan Perez  
>Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo 
>; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
> 
>Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:34 AM
>
>Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>
>
>
>The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
>or regulated at the state level. 
>
>Sent from my wireless tin can
>
>On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez  wrote:
>
>
>I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am in 
>DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
>>Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 
>>
>>Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
>>http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
>>
>>Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
>>
>>-Jonathan
>>
>>
>>
>>Jonathan A. Perez
>>
>>J.D. Candidate
>>American University Washington College of Law, 2015
>>M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
>>B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  
>>wrote:
>>
>>Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
>>>Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
>>>http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
>>>Lynne Hertzog
>>>On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
>>>
>>>Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
>>>>This reminds me of 
>>>>The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
>>>>wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in 
>>>>Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  
>>>>They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of 
>>>>Corvus corax  only adds targets. 
>>>>--
>>>>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>>>Welcome and Basics
>>>>Rules and Information
>>>>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>>>Archives:
>>>>The Mail Archive
>>>>Surfbirds
>>>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>>>Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>>>--
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>>>Welcome and Basics
>>>>Rules and Information
>>>>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>>>Archives:
>>>>The Mail Archive
>>>>Surfbirds
>>>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>>>Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>>>--
>>>--
>>>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>>Welcome and Basics
>>>Rules and Information
>>>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>>Archives:
>>>The Mail Archive
>>>Surfbirds
>>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>>Pl

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Linda Orkin]

That is really  quite an appalling notice, hopefully the crows are smart
enough to stay away.  I messaged the rod and gun club on their FB page
since there is no other way to post or comment.

Linda Orkin
Ithaca, NY


On Mon, Mar 17, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Stella Miller
wrote:

> By the way, the Club took down the Crow Down announcements on their FB
> page.  A few of us had already made comments.
>
> Attached is the announcement for those of you that have not seen it.
>
> Stella
>
>
>
>
> "Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as
> holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science
> to spread the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or
> people, it is between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas
> Lovejoy
>   --
>  *From:* Richard 
> *To:* Jonathan Perez 
> *Cc:* Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo <
> czar3...@yahoo.com>; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund <
> james...@optonline.net>
> *Sent:* Monday, March 17, 2014 7:34 AM
>
> *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
>
> The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule
> generated or regulated at the state level.
>
> Sent from my wireless tin can
>
> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez 
> wrote:
>
> I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am
> in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.
> Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville.
>
> Here is his contact from a general Google search.
> http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
>
> Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
>
> -Jonathan
>
> Jonathan A. Perez
>
> J.D. Candidate
> American University Washington College of Law, 2015
> M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
> B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
>
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog wrote:
>
> Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
> Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
> http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
> Lynne Hertzog
> On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
>
> Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
> This reminds me of
> The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>
>
>   On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund <
> james...@optonline.net> wrote:
>  There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in
> Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year -- September through March.
>  They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of
> *Corvus* *corax*  only adds targets.
> --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
> Rules and Information <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
> *Archives:*
> The Mail 
> Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
> Surfbirds <http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
> BirdingOnThe.Net <http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>
> *!*
> --
>
>
>   --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
> Rules and Information <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
> *Archives:*
> The Mail 
> Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
> Surfbirds <http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
> BirdingOnThe.Net <http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>
> *!*
> --
>
> --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME>
> Rules and Information <http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES>
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
> *Archives:*
> The Mail 
> Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html>
> Surfbirds <http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L>
> BirdingOnThe.Net <http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html>
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>
> *!*

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

By the way, the Club took down the Crow Down announcements on their FB page.  A 
few of us had already made comments.  


Attached is the announcement for those of you that have not seen it.

Stella

 



"Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Richard 
To: Jonathan Perez  
Cc: Lynne Hertzog ; Cesar Castillo 
; NYSBIRDS-L ; Jim Osterlund 
 
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:34 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
or regulated at the state level. 

Sent from my wireless tin can

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez  wrote:


I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am in 
DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
>Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 
>
>Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
>http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
>
>Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
>
>-Jonathan
>
>
>
>Jonathan A. Perez
>
>J.D. Candidate
>American University Washington College of Law, 2015
>M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
>B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
>
>
>
>
>
>On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  wrote:
>
>Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
>>Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
>>http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
>>Lynne Hertzog
>>On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
>>
>>Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
>>>This reminds me of 
>>>The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
>>>wrote:
>>> 
>>>There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in Suffolk 
>>>County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make 
>>>no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
>>>only adds targets. 
>>>--
>>>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>>Welcome and Basics
>>>Rules and Information
>>>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>>Archives:
>>>The Mail Archive
>>>Surfbirds
>>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>>Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>>--
>>>
>>>
>>>--
>>>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>>Welcome and Basics
>>>Rules and Information
>>>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>>Archives:
>>>The Mail Archive
>>>Surfbirds
>>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>>Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>>--
>>--
>>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>Welcome and Basics
>>Rules and Information
>>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>Archives:
>>The Mail Archive
>>Surfbirds
>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>--
>
>--
>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>Welcome and Basics
>Rules and Information
>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>Archives:
>The Mail Archive
>Surfbirds
>BirdingOnThe.Net
>Please submit your observations to eBird!
>--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--<>

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

I have reached out to Audubon NY to see if they are willing to take any action 
on this.  In addition, if you wish to reach out to the DEC, my contact let me 
know that it is the Region 4 office518-357-2355 or 607-652-7367.  Feel free 
to leave a reasonable, non inflammatory comment on the Rod and Gun Club's FB 
page also.  Not that it will matter to them, but at least they will hear 
dissenting voices to this barbaric practice.

Stella Miller
 



"Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy



 From: MB Warburton 
To: Lynne Hertzog  
Cc: Cesar Castillo ; NYSBIRDS-L ; 
Jim Osterlund  
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:49 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


Richard is correct, it is time for a change and it will not happen without 
action from many fronts. The senseless shooting(competition type events ) of 
snowshoe hares needs to stop as well.
Thanks Richard for the alert.
MaryBethWarburton 

On Mar 16, 2014, at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog wrote:

Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
>Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
>http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
>Lynne Hertzog
>On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
>
>Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
>>This reminds me of 
>>The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>>
>>
>>
>>On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
>>wrote:
>> 
>>There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in Suffolk 
>>County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make 
>>no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
>>only adds targets. 
>>--
>>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>Welcome and Basics
>>Rules and Information
>>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>Archives:
>>The Mail Archive
>>Surfbirds
>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>--
>>
>>
>>--
>>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>Welcome and Basics
>>Rules and Information
>>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>Archives:
>>The Mail Archive
>>Surfbirds
>>BirdingOnThe.Net
>>Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>--
>--
>NYSbirds-L List Info:
>Welcome and Basics
>Rules and Information
>Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>Archives:
>The Mail Archive
>Surfbirds
>BirdingOnThe.Net
>Please submit your observations to eBird!
>--

--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[MB Warburton]

Richard is correct, it is time for a change and it will not happen without 
action from many fronts. The senseless shooting(competition type events ) of 
snowshoe hares needs to stop as well.
Thanks Richard for the alert.
MaryBethWarburton 
On Mar 16, 2014, at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog wrote:

> Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
> Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
> 
> http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
> 
> Lynne Hertzog
> 
> On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
> Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
> This reminds me of 
> The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
> 
> 
> 
> On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
> wrote:
> There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in Suffolk 
> County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make 
> no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
> only adds targets.
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --
> 
> 
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --


--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Jonathan Perez]

Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional aide we 
had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district I would 
start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.

Good luck.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard  wrote:
> 
> The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
> or regulated at the state level. 
> 
> Sent from my wireless tin can
> 
>> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez  wrote:
>> 
>> I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am 
>> in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
>> Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 
>> 
>> Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
>> http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
>> 
>> Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
>> 
>> -Jonathan
>> 
>> Jonathan A. Perez
>> 
>> J.D. Candidate
>> American University Washington College of Law, 2015
>> M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
>> B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  
>>> wrote:
>>> Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
>>> Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
>>> 
>>> http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
>>> 
>>> Lynne Hertzog
>>> 
 On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
 This reminds me of 
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
 
 
 
 On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
 wrote:
 There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in 
 Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  
 They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of 
 Corvus corax  only adds targets.
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
>>> 
>>> --
>>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>> Welcome and Basics
>>> Rules and Information
>>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>> Archives:
>>> The Mail Archive
>>> Surfbirds
>>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>> --
>> 
>> --
>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>> Welcome and Basics
>> Rules and Information
>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>> Archives:
>> The Mail Archive
>> Surfbirds
>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>> --

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Richard]

The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
or regulated at the state level. 

Sent from my wireless tin can

> On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez  wrote:
> 
> I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am in 
> DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
> Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 
> 
> Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
> http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
> 
> Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
> 
> -Jonathan
> 
> Jonathan A. Perez
> 
> J.D. Candidate
> American University Washington College of Law, 2015
> M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
> B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
> 
> 
> 
>> On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  
>> wrote:
>> Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
>> Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
>> 
>> http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
>> 
>> Lynne Hertzog
>> 
>>> On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
>>> Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
>>> This reminds me of 
>>> The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
>>> wrote:
>>> There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in 
>>> Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  
>>> They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of 
>>> Corvus corax  only adds targets.
>>> --
>>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>> Welcome and Basics
>>> Rules and Information
>>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>> Archives:
>>> The Mail Archive
>>> Surfbirds
>>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>> --
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>>> Welcome and Basics
>>> Rules and Information
>>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>>> Archives:
>>> The Mail Archive
>>> Surfbirds
>>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>>> --
>> 
>> --
>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>> Welcome and Basics
>> Rules and Information
>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>> Archives:
>> The Mail Archive
>> Surfbirds
>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>> --
> 
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Jonathan Perez]

I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am
in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.
Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville.

Here is his contact from a general Google search.
http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/

Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.

-Jonathan

Jonathan A. Perez

J.D. Candidate
American University Washington College of Law, 2015
M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
B.A., Bowdoin College 2005



On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog wrote:

> Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
> Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
>
> http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
>
> Lynne Hertzog
> On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
>
>> Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
>> This reminds me of
>> The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>>
>>
>>   On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund <
>> james...@optonline.net> wrote:
>>  There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in
>> Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.
>>  They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of
>> *Corvus* *corax*  only adds targets.
>> --
>> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
>> Welcome and Basics 
>> Rules and Information 
>> Subscribe, Configuration and 
>> Leave
>> *Archives:*
>> The Mail 
>> Archive
>> Surfbirds 
>> BirdingOnThe.Net 
>> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*
>> *!*
>> --
>>
>>
>>   --
>> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
>> Welcome and Basics 
>> Rules and Information 
>> Subscribe, Configuration and 
>> Leave
>> *Archives:*
>> The Mail 
>> Archive
>> Surfbirds 
>> BirdingOnThe.Net 
>> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*
>> *!*
>> --
>>
> --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics 
> Rules and Information 
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave
> *Archives:*
> The Mail 
> Archive
> Surfbirds 
> BirdingOnThe.Net 
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*
> *!*
> --
>

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Glenn Wilson]

Who makes the rules? The hunters. 

Glenn Wilson
Endicott, NY
www.WilsonsWarbler.com

On Mar 16, 2014, at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  wrote:

Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.

http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html

Lynne Hertzog

> On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:
> Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
> This reminds me of 
> The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
> 
> 
> 
> On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
> wrote:
> There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in Suffolk 
> County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make 
> no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
> only adds targets.
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --
> 
> 
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --

--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Glenn Wilson]

Who makes the rules? The hunters. 

Glenn Wilson
Endicott, NY
www.WilsonsWarbler.com

On Mar 16, 2014, at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com wrote:

Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.

http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html

Lynne Hertzog

 On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:
 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
 This reminds me of 
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
 
 
 
 On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
 wrote:
 There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in Suffolk 
 County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make 
 no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
 only adds targets.
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --

--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Jonathan Perez]

I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am
in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.
Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville.

Here is his contact from a general Google search.
http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/

Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.

-Jonathan

Jonathan A. Perez

J.D. Candidate
American University Washington College of Law, 2015
M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
B.A., Bowdoin College 2005



On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.comwrote:

 Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
 Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.

 http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html

 Lynne Hertzog
 On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
 This reminds me of
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow


   On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund 
 james...@optonline.net wrote:
  There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in
 Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.
  They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of
 *Corvus* *corax*  only adds targets.
 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --


   --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --

 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --


--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Richard]

The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
or regulated at the state level. 

Sent from my wireless tin can

 On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am in 
 DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
 Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 
 
 Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
 http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
 
 Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
 
 -Jonathan
 
 Jonathan A. Perez
 
 J.D. Candidate
 American University Washington College of Law, 2015
 M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
 B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
 
 
 
 On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com 
 wrote:
 Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
 Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
 
 http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
 
 Lynne Hertzog
 
 On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:
 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
 This reminds me of 
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
 
 
 
 On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
 wrote:
 There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in 
 Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  
 They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of 
 Corvus corax  only adds targets.
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Jonathan Perez]

Lopez is the assemblyman. Tonko is the congressman. As a congressional aide we 
had calls all the time from state level complaints. For a district I would 
start with the congressman and petition for a local contact.

Good luck.

Sent from my iPhone

 On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
 or regulated at the state level. 
 
 Sent from my wireless tin can
 
 On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am 
 in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
 Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 
 
 Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
 http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/
 
 Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.
 
 -Jonathan
 
 Jonathan A. Perez
 
 J.D. Candidate
 American University Washington College of Law, 2015
 M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
 B.A., Bowdoin College 2005
 
 
 
 On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com 
 wrote:
 Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
 Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
 
 http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
 
 Lynne Hertzog
 
 On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:
 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
 This reminds me of 
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
 
 
 
 On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
 wrote:
 There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in 
 Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  
 They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of 
 Corvus corax  only adds targets.
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[MB Warburton]

Richard is correct, it is time for a change and it will not happen without 
action from many fronts. The senseless shooting(competition type events ) of 
snowshoe hares needs to stop as well.
Thanks Richard for the alert.
MaryBethWarburton 
On Mar 16, 2014, at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog wrote:

 Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
 Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
 
 http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
 
 Lynne Hertzog
 
 On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:
 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
 This reminds me of 
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
 
 
 
 On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
 wrote:
 There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in Suffolk 
 County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make 
 no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
 only adds targets.
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 
 
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --


--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

I have reached out to Audubon NY to see if they are willing to take any action 
on this.  In addition, if you wish to reach out to the DEC, my contact let me 
know that it is the Region 4 office518-357-2355 or 607-652-7367.  Feel free 
to leave a reasonable, non inflammatory comment on the Rod and Gun Club's FB 
page also.  Not that it will matter to them, but at least they will hear 
dissenting voices to this barbaric practice.

Stella Miller
 



Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy



 From: MB Warburton msmarybeth.warbur...@gmail.com
To: Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com 
Cc: Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; 
Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:49 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


Richard is correct, it is time for a change and it will not happen without 
action from many fronts. The senseless shooting(competition type events ) of 
snowshoe hares needs to stop as well.
Thanks Richard for the alert.
MaryBethWarburton 

On Mar 16, 2014, at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog wrote:

Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
Lynne Hertzog
On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:

Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
This reminds me of 
The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
wrote:
 
There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in Suffolk 
County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make 
no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
only adds targets. 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--

--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

By the way, the Club took down the Crow Down announcements on their FB page.  A 
few of us had already made comments.  


Attached is the announcement for those of you that have not seen it.

Stella

 



Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com
To: Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com 
Cc: Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar Castillo 
czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim Osterlund 
james...@optonline.net 
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:34 AM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
or regulated at the state level. 

Sent from my wireless tin can

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com wrote:


I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am in 
DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 

Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/

Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.

-Jonathan



Jonathan A. Perez

J.D. Candidate
American University Washington College of Law, 2015
M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
B.A., Bowdoin College 2005





On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com wrote:

Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
Lynne Hertzog
On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:

Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
This reminds me of 
The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
wrote:
 
There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in Suffolk 
County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make 
no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  
only adds targets. 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--

--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--attachment: crow hunt.JPG

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Linda Orkin]

That is really  quite an appalling notice, hopefully the crows are smart
enough to stay away.  I messaged the rod and gun club on their FB page
since there is no other way to post or comment.

Linda Orkin
Ithaca, NY


On Mon, Mar 17, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Stella Miller
stella.mille...@yahoo.comwrote:

 By the way, the Club took down the Crow Down announcements on their FB
 page.  A few of us had already made comments.

 Attached is the announcement for those of you that have not seen it.

 Stella




 Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as
 holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science
 to spread the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or
 people, it is between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas
 Lovejoy
   --
  *From:* Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com
 *To:* Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com
 *Cc:* Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar Castillo 
 czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim Osterlund 
 james...@optonline.net
 *Sent:* Monday, March 17, 2014 7:34 AM

 *Subject:* Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

 The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule
 generated or regulated at the state level.

 Sent from my wireless tin can

 On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am
 in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.
 Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville.

 Here is his contact from a general Google search.
 http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/

 Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.

 -Jonathan

 Jonathan A. Perez

 J.D. Candidate
 American University Washington College of Law, 2015
 M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
 B.A., Bowdoin College 2005



 On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.comwrote:

 Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
 Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
 http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
 Lynne Hertzog
 On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
 This reminds me of
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow


   On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund 
 james...@optonline.net wrote:
  There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in
 Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year -- September through March.
  They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of
 *Corvus* *corax*  only adds targets.
 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --


   --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --

 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --


 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

They changed their settings.  Last night you could post on it.  Which is how I 
shared their photo to the HOBAS page as well as my own.  For extra measure, I 
downloaded it in case they pulled it.

Stella


 



Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Linda Orkin wingmagi...@gmail.com
To: Stella Miller stella.mille...@yahoo.com 
Cc: Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com; Jonathan Perez 
jonathan.ape...@gmail.com; Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar 
Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim 
Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 1:02 PM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


That is really  quite an appalling notice, hopefully the crows are smart enough 
to stay away.  I messaged the rod and gun club on their FB page since there is 
no other way to post or comment.  

Linda Orkin
Ithaca, NY




On Mon, Mar 17, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Stella Miller stella.mille...@yahoo.com 
wrote:

By the way, the Club took down the Crow Down announcements on their FB page.  A 
few of us had already made comments.  



Attached is the announcement for those of you that have not seen it.


Stella

 



Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread 
the understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy



 
From: Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com
To: Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com 
Cc: Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar Castillo 
czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim Osterlund 
james...@optonline.net 
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:34 AM

Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County



The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule generated 
or regulated at the state level. 

Sent from my wireless tin can

On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com wrote:


I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.  As I am in 
DC, I usually think of who is the representative.  
Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents Palenville. 

Here is his contact from a general Google search. 
http://tonko.house.gov/contact-me/

Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.

-Jonathan



Jonathan A. Perez

J.D. Candidate
American University Washington College of Law, 2015
M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
B.A., Bowdoin College 2005





On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com 
wrote:

Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting. 
Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
Lynne Hertzog
On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:

Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
This reminds me of 
The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
wrote:
 
There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in 
Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  
They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of 
Corvus corax  only adds targets. 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--

--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--


-- 

If you permit 
this evil, what is the good
of the good of your life?

-Stanley Kunitz...


--
NYSbirds-L List Info

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Rick Linda Kedenburg]

I am outraged by this. Crows are one of the most intelligent  
creatures we share the Earth with. They have been documented to  
fashion and use tools. They are highly social and live in family  
groups. My fascination with them led me into birding long ago.

Thank you to those in this group for letting us know how best to  
address this issue.
Stella, let us know Audubon New York's position on this and if they  
will advocate to stop this.

Rick  Linda

Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can  
change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.

Margaret Mead





On Mar 17, 2014, at 12:53 PM, Stella Miller wrote:

 By the way, the Club took down the Crow Down announcements on their  
 FB page.  A few of us had already made comments.

 Attached is the announcement for those of you that have not seen it.

 Stella




 Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold,  
 as holding whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up  
 to science to spread the understanding that the choice is not  
 between wild places or people, it is between a rich or an  
 impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy
 From: Richard richardpguth...@gmail.com
 To: Jonathan Perez jonathan.ape...@gmail.com
 Cc: Lynne Hertzog lynnehert...@gmail.com; Cesar Castillo  
 czar3...@yahoo.com; NYSBIRDS-L nysbirds-l@cornell.edu; Jim  
 Osterlund james...@optonline.net
 Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:34 AM
 Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

 The congressman is actually Peter Lopez. But I think this is a rule  
 generated or regulated at the state level.

 Sent from my wireless tin can

 On Mar 17, 2014, at 6:56, Jonathan Perez  
 jonathan.ape...@gmail.com wrote:

 I am no longer in the metro area, but still a member of the list.   
 As I am in DC, I usually think of who is the representative.
 Paul Tonko, a Congressional Democrat in the House represents  
 Palenville.

 Here is his contact from a general Google search. http:// 
 tonko.house.gov/contact-me/

 Hope that helps! This is inhumane, indeed.

 -Jonathan

 Jonathan A. Perez

 J.D. Candidate
 American University Washington College of Law, 2015
 M.A., University of Virginia, 2008
 B.A., Bowdoin College 2005



 On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:49 PM, Lynne Hertzog  
 lynnehert...@gmail.com wrote:
 Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
 Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.
 http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html
 Lynne Hertzog
 On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com  
 wrote:
 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
 This reminds me of
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow



 On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
 james...@optonline.net wrote:
 There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids  
 in Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year — September  
 through March.  They make no distinction of species, so I suppose  
 our feeble return of Corvus corax  only adds targets.
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --


 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --
 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --

 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --

 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --


 --
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 Welcome and Basics
 Rules and Information
 Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
 Archives:
 The Mail Archive
 Surfbirds
 BirdingOnThe.Net
 Please submit your observations to eBird!
 --crow hunt.JPG


--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Lynne Hertzog]

Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.

http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html

Lynne Hertzog
On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, "Cesar Castillo"  wrote:

> Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
> This reminds me of
> The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
>
>
>   On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund <
> james...@optonline.net> wrote:
>  There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in
> Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year -- September through March.
>  They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of
> *Corvus* *corax*  only adds targets.
> --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics 
> Rules and Information 
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave
> *Archives:*
> The Mail 
> Archive
> Surfbirds 
> BirdingOnThe.Net 
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*
> *!*
> --
>
>
>   --
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
> Welcome and Basics 
> Rules and Information 
> Subscribe, Configuration and 
> Leave
> *Archives:*
> The Mail 
> Archive
> Surfbirds 
> BirdingOnThe.Net 
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*
> *!*
> --
>

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Cesar Castillo]

Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
This reminds me of 
The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund  
wrote:
 
There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in Suffolk 
County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make no 
distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  only 
adds targets. 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Jim Osterlund]

There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can "hunt" Corvids in Suffolk 
County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make no 
distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  only 
adds targets.
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

I have reached out to the DEC to try and get the ball rolling.  This is 
outrageous.   

Stella Miller




"Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man." Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Susan Krause 
To: "redk...@optonline.net" ; Richard 
 
Cc: NYSBIRDS-L  
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:34 PM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


so let's try to stop it.
Sue



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:32 PM, "redk...@optonline.net" 
 wrote:
 
Richard- I couldn't agree more. This is sickening and should not be something 
that the NYS DEC should allow to occurmaybe Rip Van Winkle can just go back 
to sleep.

John Turner 

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:53 pm
Subject: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: NYSBIRDS-L 

> The Rip Van Winkle Rod and Gun Club, Palenville, NY, has 
> scheduled a "Crow Down" for March 30 - 31. Their  object is as 
> they  say: "Wanted Dead or Alive - Crows". 
> 
> Their poster can be seen by checking their Facebook page. 
> 
> Unfortunately this "sport" is allowed by NYS Department of 
> Environmental Conservation. 
> 
> I think it's time for change. 
> 
> Rich Guthrie 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my wireless tin can
> --
> 
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
> 
> ARCHIVES:
> 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
> 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
> 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
> 
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
>
 http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
> 
> --
> 
> 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Susan Krause]

so let's try to stop it.
Sue



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:32 PM, "redk...@optonline.net" 
 wrote:
 
Richard- I couldn't agree more. This is sickening and should not be something 
that the NYS DEC should allow to occurmaybe Rip Van Winkle can just go back 
to sleep.

John Turner 

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:53 pm
Subject: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: NYSBIRDS-L 

> The Rip Van Winkle Rod and Gun Club, Palenville, NY, has 
> scheduled a "Crow Down" for March 30 - 31. Their  object is as 
> they  say: "Wanted Dead or Alive - Crows". 
> 
> Their poster can be seen by checking their Facebook page. 
> 
> Unfortunately this "sport" is allowed by NYS Department of 
> Environmental Conservation. 
> 
> I think it's time for change. 
> 
> Rich Guthrie 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my wireless tin can
> --
> 
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
> 
> ARCHIVES:
> 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
> 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
> 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
> 
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
> http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
> 
> --
> 
> 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[redknot]

Richard- I couldn't agree more. This is sickening and should not be something 
that the NYS DEC should allow to occurmaybe Rip Van Winkle can just go back 
to sleep.

John Turner 

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:53 pm
Subject: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: NYSBIRDS-L 

> The Rip Van Winkle Rod and Gun Club, Palenville, NY, has 
> scheduled a "Crow Down" for March 30 - 31. Their object is as 
> they say: "Wanted Dead or Alive - Crows". 
> 
> Their poster can be seen by checking their Facebook page. 
> 
> Unfortunately this "sport" is allowed by NYS Department of 
> Environmental Conservation. 
> 
> I think it's time for change. 
> 
> Rich Guthrie 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my wireless tin can
> --
> 
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
> 
> ARCHIVES:
> 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
> 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
> 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
> 
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
> http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
> 
> --
> 
>

--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[redknot]

Richard- I couldn't agree more. This is sickening and should not be something 
that the NYS DEC should allow to occurmaybe Rip Van Winkle can just go back 
to sleep.

John Turner 

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:53 pm
Subject: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: NYSBIRDS-L 

 The Rip Van Winkle Rod and Gun Club, Palenville, NY, has 
 scheduled a Crow Down for March 30 - 31. Their object is as 
 they say: Wanted Dead or Alive - Crows. 
 
 Their poster can be seen by checking their Facebook page. 
 
 Unfortunately this sport is allowed by NYS Department of 
 Environmental Conservation. 
 
 I think it's time for change. 
 
 Rich Guthrie 
 
 
 
 Sent from my wireless tin can
 --
 
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 
 ARCHIVES:
 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 
 Please submit your observations to eBird:
 http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 
 --
 


--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Susan Krause]

so let's try to stop it.
Sue



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:32 PM, redk...@optonline.net 
redk...@optonline.net wrote:
 
Richard- I couldn't agree more. This is sickening and should not be something 
that the NYS DEC should allow to occurmaybe Rip Van Winkle can just go back 
to sleep.

John Turner 

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:53 pm
Subject: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: NYSBIRDS-L 

 The Rip Van Winkle Rod and Gun Club, Palenville, NY, has 
 scheduled a Crow Down for March 30 - 31. Their  object is as 
 they  say: Wanted Dead or Alive - Crows. 
 
 Their poster can be seen by checking their Facebook page. 
 
 Unfortunately this sport is allowed by NYS Department of 
 Environmental Conservation. 
 
 I think it's time for change. 
 
 Rich Guthrie 
 
 
 
 Sent from my wireless tin can
 --
 
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 
 ARCHIVES:
 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 
 Please submit your observations to eBird:
 http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 
 --
 
 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Stella Miller]

I have reached out to the DEC to try and get the ball rolling.  This is 
outrageous.   

Stella Miller




Conservation is sometimes perceived as stopping everything cold, as holding 
whooping cranes in higher esteem than people. It is up to science to spread the 
understanding that the choice is not between wild places or people, it is 
between a rich or an impoverished existence for Man. Thomas Lovejoy



 From: Susan Krause skrause...@yahoo.com
To: redk...@optonline.net redk...@optonline.net; Richard 
richardpguth...@gmail.com 
Cc: NYSBIRDS-L NYSBIRDS-L@cornell.edu 
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:34 PM
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
 


so let's try to stop it.
Sue



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:32 PM, redk...@optonline.net 
redk...@optonline.net wrote:
 
Richard- I couldn't agree more. This is sickening and should not be something 
that the NYS DEC should allow to occurmaybe Rip Van Winkle can just go back 
to sleep.

John Turner 

- Original Message -
From: Richard 
Date: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:53 pm
Subject: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County
To: NYSBIRDS-L 

 The Rip Van Winkle Rod and Gun Club, Palenville, NY, has 
 scheduled a Crow Down for March 30 - 31. Their  object is as 
 they  say: Wanted Dead or Alive - Crows. 
 
 Their poster can be seen by checking their Facebook page. 
 
 Unfortunately this sport is allowed by NYS Department of 
 Environmental Conservation. 
 
 I think it's time for change. 
 
 Rich Guthrie 
 
 
 
 Sent from my wireless tin can
 --
 
 NYSbirds-L List Info:
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 
 ARCHIVES:
 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 
 Please submit your observations to eBird:

 http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 
 --
 
 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--


--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Jim Osterlund]

There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in Suffolk 
County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make no 
distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  only 
adds targets.
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Cesar Castillo]

Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?  
This reminds me of 
The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow



On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net 
wrote:
 
There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in Suffolk 
County 4 days a week for half the year — September through March.  They make no 
distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of Corvus corax  only 
adds targets. 
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
Welcome and Basics
Rules and Information
Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
Archives:
The Mail Archive
Surfbirds
BirdingOnThe.Net
Please submit your observations to eBird!
--
--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

Re: [nysbirds-l] Crow Shoot scheduled in Greene County

[Lynne Hertzog]

Here is the page from the DEC on crow shooting.
Doesn't seem right, shooting crows, at any time of year.

http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/65847.html

Lynne Hertzog
On Mar 16, 2014 11:22 PM, Cesar Castillo czar3...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Is this just for sport, or is there a valid reason for this?
 This reminds me of
 The Birds of Killingworth by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow


   On Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:46 PM, Jim Osterlund 
 james...@optonline.net wrote:
  There aren't usually organized shoots, but you can hunt Corvids in
 Suffolk County 4 days a week for half the year -- September through March.
  They make no distinction of species, so I suppose our feeble return of
 *Corvus* *corax*  only adds targets.
 --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --


   --
 *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
 Welcome and Basics http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
 Rules and Information http://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
 Subscribe, Configuration and 
 Leavehttp://www.northeastbirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm
 *Archives:*
 The Mail 
 Archivehttp://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
 Surfbirds http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
 BirdingOnThe.Net http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
 *Please submit your observations to **eBird*http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
 *!*
 --


--

NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm

ARCHIVES:
1) http://www.mail-archive.com/nysbirds-l@cornell.edu/maillist.html
2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html

Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--