Re[2]: [PHP-DEV] short_open_tag
Hello All, AG I don't see why it's such a big deal for people who are creating xml to AG turn-off short tags? YES! This is the main question/answer of this thread! So, please, people, calm down. Zmievski has got the present for all of you...=)) Antony Dovgal aka tony2001 mailto:tony2001;ua.fm http://phpclub.net -- PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/ To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re[2]: [PHP-DEV] short_open_tag
Hello Dan, Tuesday, October 15, 2002, 7:41:16 PM, you wrote: DH The web is a rapidly changing market and standards are being activley DH evolved. ?php is more compatable with standards on the web than ? ... DH and its not about XML document headers. Yes, the web is rapidly changing, but PHP shouldn't and couldn't change so fast. DH I have written semi static XML document from php before (for speed reasons DH over using an output parser). EG: DH ?xml ... ? DH root DH data DH age?php echo $age; ?/age DH /data DH /root You can disable short_tags on 99% of hostings yourself. By disabling short_tags we can solve one small problem and obtain one really BIG. DH The other advantage is to force people one way or the other. In the case DH of 50% of servers allowing short tags, and the other not... a script using DH short tags will only work on 50% of PHP installations (just as a script DH that relies on register_globals will only work on servers with it switched DH on). Hmmm.. I don't see any advantage in forcing people at all. People MUST have choice(and possibility to learn on their own mistakes). I think we can finish this discussion. The answer is NO. Antony Dovgal aka tony2001 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://phpclub.net -- PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/ To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re[2]: [PHP-DEV] short_open_tag
Hello Dan and all. DH Due to the frequency of this coming up on the list, would it be possible DH to disable them as of PHP v5? I suppose, it's not a kind of problem that should be solved in such way. DH People will be expecting major changes come v5, and it might be the DH easiest way to move over (if thats what the developers conclude). I don't think that this is the reason to break backward compatibilty. Thousands of programmers use short tags in their scripts, but only hundreds can't change this setting in php.ini manually. Antony Dovgal aka tony2001 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://phpclub.net -- PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/ To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: Re[2]: [PHP-DEV] short_open_tag
Thousands of programmers use short tags in their scripts, but only hundreds can't change this setting in php.ini manually. Wrong... Many webhosting companies won't allow customers to change php.ini, and my experiences with php_set_ini() aren't too good. Regards, Manuzhai -- PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/ To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re[2]: [PHP-DEV] short_open_tag
Hello Dan, DH Your missing the point of my suggestion. Im not suggesting we switch it DH off by default, Im suggesting we *remove* the feature. Very good. Why not to change to script language=php.../script then? DH As the XML community expands and more and more scripting languages (server DH and client side) are being designed to interoperate, cross-language DH compatability (or at least handling) is required. XML|PHP community imho much less than PHP-community, that uses ? ? syntax. As I already said, there is hundreds to thank you and thousands to hate you for this *harmful* modification. DH The short tag ? is bad form, and shows lazyness. ?php fits the standard, DH and its my recommendation that (in version 5 of the product) the sort tag DH option is removed. No, you just missing something important. When you want to remove or change something by default - this shows: a. you're lazy to change it locally OR b. you're lazy to find good hosting where you can change php.ini. (nothing personal) DH Yes - this will break *alot* of sloppy scripts (including scripts taking DH the short cut ?= instead of ?php echo). However, a very simple DH sh/sed/awk script could be written that scans a directory tree and DH converts all .php files to .php5 files. Yep, it's rather easy to write such script. But it's not easy to change millions of already working php-scripts. DH Note: this script could also check for other cross version problems that DH may arrise. We can *aviod* such kind of problems by leaving this option in present state. DH My *key* point is that come the upgrade jump from v4 to v5 people will DH *expect* major differences - otherwise it would just be another step in DH the v4 tree. Yes, I agree, v5 gives *possibility* to provide major differences. BUT: 1. Removing (and even disabling by default) short tags is not necessary for all PHP-community. 2. Possibilty to provide chages is not necessity to provide them. There are a lot of more important things. Thank you for your attention =) Antony Dovgal aka tony2001 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://phpclub.net -- PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/ To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re[2]: [PHP-DEV] short_open_tag
Hello all. ZS changing a number in the version doesn't give us a carte blanche to break ZS compatibility. Compatibility breakage is cumulative - the more you break, ZS the harder it is to adapt. That's in fact what I'm talking about. Antony Dovgal aka tony2001 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://phpclub.net -- PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/ To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re[2]: [PHP-DEV] short_open_tag
At 12:17 10/15/2002 +0300, Antony Dovgal wrote: Hello Dan, DH Your missing the point of my suggestion. Im not suggesting we switch it DH off by default, Im suggesting we *remove* the feature. Very good. Why not to change to script language=php.../script then? As long as you're aiming for XHTML compliance, you might as well do it right. The language attribute for script, doesn't exist. http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/dtds.html#dtdentry_xhtml1-strict.dtd_script FWIW: -1 on the change. For somebody who never uses/has used XML, it's incomprehensible, why he/she has to type 3 extra chars every time. IF (major if) anything, make a config-option --enable-xml-compliance which checks/corrects a number of things (like, check apache symbols/disable short tags/enable related modules/add ?xml tag at start of doc output). Another -1, because it's a security risk, as your (legacy) sources will be sent to the client, if you're not aware of this. This may expose passwords, internal networks and what not. Met vriendelijke groeten / With kind regards, Webmaster IDG.nl Melvyn Sopacua Logan I spent a minute looking at my own code by accident. Logan I was thinking What the hell is this guy doing? -- PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/ To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
