Re: Numbering Scheme

[Gene Wirchenko]

At 07:48 2018-10-12, Alan Bourke  wrote:
Easy for the staff to count, or difficult for the opposition to 
count. Pick one.


 In situations like this, aren't there supposed to be three 
things with a choice of two?  Especially on a Friday.


Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko


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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

It doesn't have to be either or. I have put forward the various 
suggestions to the client and will let them decide how they want it done.


Thanks to everyone for their contribution.

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 12/10/2018 10:48 AM, Alan Bourke wrote:

Easy for the staff to count, or difficult for the opposition to count. Pick one.




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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Alan Bourke]

Easy for the staff to count, or difficult for the opposition to count. Pick one.

-- 
  Alan Bourke
  alanpbourke (at) fastmail (dot) fm

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

Thanks for the suggestion

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 11/10/2018 02:56 PM, Joe Yoder wrote:

How about converting to base 26 and printing alpha characters (A-Z)?  This
would allow easy sequencing and a simple program could convert an alpha
string to  a base 10 number when needed.- Joe

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 2:39 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:


They have that already. This is a physical count process to avoid theft.
They deal in lending money for gold and have to be paranoid.

On 11 October 2018 14:10:36 GMT-04:00, Stephen Russell <
srussell...@gmail.com> wrote:

Why not make a dashboard that has a Count for the Day on it. If you
have
really simple people this might work?

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 9:54 AM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:


Thanks, Obscuring the number is not a problem, but I think they want

to

be able to read the number off the ticket at the end of the day in
sequential order and I don't see how I can come up with a simple way

to

do this.

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 10/10/2018 03:48 PM, Richard Kaye wrote:

One way is to come up with a 10 letter "word" with each letter

representing a digit. You then convert the numeric sequence to alpha
characters. And to avoid the pattern being too easily spotted, add

one or

more random characters to the final string. It's not the most robust
encryption scheme in the world but it should obscure it enough.

Here's a

bit of VFP code to do this using the non-dictionary phrase MONKEYSHIP

as

the rebus. Pass it the number to encode and optionally .t. as the

second

parameter to append a single random character at the end.

**
*  Program: MONKEYSHIP.PRG
* Date: 05/07/2007 03:26 PM
*  VFP Version: Visual FoxPro 09.00..7423 for Windows
*Notes:
**

FUNCTION MonkeyShip(m.tnStringToEncode AS Number, m.tlRandom AS

Boolean)

LOCAL m.lcRetval AS Character


m.lcStringToEncode=ALLTRIM(TRANSFORM(m.tnStringToEncode,[999]))

LOCAL ARRAY laRebus[10,2]
m.laRebus[1,1]=1
m.laRebus[1,2]=[M]
m.laRebus[2,1]=2
m.laRebus[2,2]=[O]
m.laRebus[3,1]=3
m.laRebus[3,2]=[N]
m.laRebus[4,1]=4
m.laRebus[4,2]=[K]
m.laRebus[5,1]=5
m.laRebus[5,2]=[E]
m.laRebus[6,1]=6
m.laRebus[6,2]=[Y]
m.laRebus[7,1]=7
m.laRebus[7,2]=[S]
m.laRebus[8,1]=8
m.laRebus[8,2]=[H]
m.laRebus[9,1]=9
m.laRebus[9,2]=[I]
m.laRebus[10,1]=0
m.laRebus[10,2]=[P]
m.lcRetval=[]
m.lcChar=[]
FOR m.x=1 TO LEN(ALLTRIM(m.lcStringToEncode))


m.lcChar=m.laRebus[ASCAN(m.laRebus,VAL(SUBSTR(m.lcStringToEncode,x,1)),1,-1,1,8),2]

   m.lcRetval=m.lcRetval+m.lcChar
NEXT
IF m.tlRandom
   LOCAL m.liCounter AS Integer
   PRIVATE m.pcRandomChar
   m.pcRandomChar=[ ]
   m.liCounter=1
*!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at

least one alpha not in monkeyship

   DO WHILE NOT ReturnRandom()
   m.liCounter=m.liCounter+1
   IF m.liCounter=10
   EXIT
   ENDIF
   ENDDO
   IF m.liCounter=10   && we went through loop 10 times and

could

not get a char back

   m.lcRetval=[Q]+m.lcRetval
   ELSE
   m.lcRetval=m.pcRandomChar+m.lcRetval
   ENDIF
ENDIF
RETURN m.lcRetval
ENDFUNC

FUNCTION ReturnRandom
LOCAL m.lcRandomSeed AS Character, m.lIsGood AS Boolean
*!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at

least one alpha not in monkeyship

m.lcRandomSeed=SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)
m.lIsGood=.f.
FOR m.y=LEN(m.lcRandomSeed) TO 2 STEP -1  && don't need to

check

first char in sys(2015)

   IF ISALPHA(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)) AND NOT

UPPER(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1))$[MONKEYSHIP]

   m.pcRandomChar=SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)
   m.lIsGood=.t.
   EXIT
   ELSE
   m.lIsGood=.f.
   ENDIF
NEXT
RETURN m.lIsGood
ENDFUNC

--

rk

-Original Message-
From: ProfoxTech  On Behalf Of Frank

Cazabon

Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2018 3:25 PM
To: profoxt...@leafe.com
Subject: Numbering Scheme

I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a

pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of

the

day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various

parcels

received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket

issued to

their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and

read

the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They

are now

not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their competitors may

be

able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how much business

they are

doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning and then one ate in

the

afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit

that

I am coming up blank.

Any ideas?




[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Joe Yoder]

How about converting to base 26 and printing alpha characters (A-Z)?  This
would allow easy sequencing and a simple program could convert an alpha
string to  a base 10 number when needed.- Joe

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 2:39 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:

> They have that already. This is a physical count process to avoid theft.
> They deal in lending money for gold and have to be paranoid.
>
> On 11 October 2018 14:10:36 GMT-04:00, Stephen Russell <
> srussell...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Why not make a dashboard that has a Count for the Day on it. If you
> >have
> >really simple people this might work?
> >
> >On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 9:54 AM Frank Cazabon 
> >wrote:
> >
> >> Thanks, Obscuring the number is not a problem, but I think they want
> >to
> >> be able to read the number off the ticket at the end of the day in
> >> sequential order and I don't see how I can come up with a simple way
> >to
> >> do this.
> >>
> >> Frank.
> >>
> >> Frank Cazabon
> >>
> >> On 10/10/2018 03:48 PM, Richard Kaye wrote:
> >> > One way is to come up with a 10 letter "word" with each letter
> >> representing a digit. You then convert the numeric sequence to alpha
> >> characters. And to avoid the pattern being too easily spotted, add
> >one or
> >> more random characters to the final string. It's not the most robust
> >> encryption scheme in the world but it should obscure it enough.
> >Here's a
> >> bit of VFP code to do this using the non-dictionary phrase MONKEYSHIP
> >as
> >> the rebus. Pass it the number to encode and optionally .t. as the
> >second
> >> parameter to append a single random character at the end.
> >> >
> >> > **
> >> > *  Program: MONKEYSHIP.PRG
> >> > * Date: 05/07/2007 03:26 PM
> >> > *  VFP Version: Visual FoxPro 09.00..7423 for Windows
> >> > *Notes:
> >> > **
> >> >
> >> > FUNCTION MonkeyShip(m.tnStringToEncode AS Number, m.tlRandom AS
> >Boolean)
> >> > LOCAL m.lcRetval AS Character
> >> >
> >>
>
> >m.lcStringToEncode=ALLTRIM(TRANSFORM(m.tnStringToEncode,[999]))
> >> > LOCAL ARRAY laRebus[10,2]
> >> > m.laRebus[1,1]=1
> >> > m.laRebus[1,2]=[M]
> >> > m.laRebus[2,1]=2
> >> > m.laRebus[2,2]=[O]
> >> > m.laRebus[3,1]=3
> >> > m.laRebus[3,2]=[N]
> >> > m.laRebus[4,1]=4
> >> > m.laRebus[4,2]=[K]
> >> > m.laRebus[5,1]=5
> >> > m.laRebus[5,2]=[E]
> >> > m.laRebus[6,1]=6
> >> > m.laRebus[6,2]=[Y]
> >> > m.laRebus[7,1]=7
> >> > m.laRebus[7,2]=[S]
> >> > m.laRebus[8,1]=8
> >> > m.laRebus[8,2]=[H]
> >> > m.laRebus[9,1]=9
> >> > m.laRebus[9,2]=[I]
> >> > m.laRebus[10,1]=0
> >> > m.laRebus[10,2]=[P]
> >> > m.lcRetval=[]
> >> > m.lcChar=[]
> >> > FOR m.x=1 TO LEN(ALLTRIM(m.lcStringToEncode))
> >> >
> >>
>
> >m.lcChar=m.laRebus[ASCAN(m.laRebus,VAL(SUBSTR(m.lcStringToEncode,x,1)),1,-1,1,8),2]
> >> >   m.lcRetval=m.lcRetval+m.lcChar
> >> > NEXT
> >> > IF m.tlRandom
> >> >   LOCAL m.liCounter AS Integer
> >> >   PRIVATE m.pcRandomChar
> >> >   m.pcRandomChar=[ ]
> >> >   m.liCounter=1
> >> > *!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at
> >> least one alpha not in monkeyship
> >> >   DO WHILE NOT ReturnRandom()
> >> >   m.liCounter=m.liCounter+1
> >> >   IF m.liCounter=10
> >> >   EXIT
> >> >   ENDIF
> >> >   ENDDO
> >> >   IF m.liCounter=10   && we went through loop 10 times and
> >could
> >> not get a char back
> >> >   m.lcRetval=[Q]+m.lcRetval
> >> >   ELSE
> >> >   m.lcRetval=m.pcRandomChar+m.lcRetval
> >> >   ENDIF
> >> > ENDIF
> >> > RETURN m.lcRetval
> >> > ENDFUNC
> >> >
> >> > FUNCTION ReturnRandom
> >> > LOCAL m.lcRandomSeed AS Character, m.lIsGood AS Boolean
> >> > *!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at
> >> least one alpha not in monkeyship
> >>

Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

They have that already. This is a physical count process to avoid theft. They 
deal in lending money for gold and have to be paranoid.

On 11 October 2018 14:10:36 GMT-04:00, Stephen Russell  
wrote:
>Why not make a dashboard that has a Count for the Day on it. If you
>have
>really simple people this might work?
>
>On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 9:54 AM Frank Cazabon 
>wrote:
>
>> Thanks, Obscuring the number is not a problem, but I think they want
>to
>> be able to read the number off the ticket at the end of the day in
>> sequential order and I don't see how I can come up with a simple way
>to
>> do this.
>>
>> Frank.
>>
>> Frank Cazabon
>>
>> On 10/10/2018 03:48 PM, Richard Kaye wrote:
>> > One way is to come up with a 10 letter "word" with each letter
>> representing a digit. You then convert the numeric sequence to alpha
>> characters. And to avoid the pattern being too easily spotted, add
>one or
>> more random characters to the final string. It's not the most robust
>> encryption scheme in the world but it should obscure it enough.
>Here's a
>> bit of VFP code to do this using the non-dictionary phrase MONKEYSHIP
>as
>> the rebus. Pass it the number to encode and optionally .t. as the
>second
>> parameter to append a single random character at the end.
>> >
>> > **
>> > *  Program: MONKEYSHIP.PRG
>> > * Date: 05/07/2007 03:26 PM
>> > *  VFP Version: Visual FoxPro 09.00..7423 for Windows
>> > *Notes:
>> > **
>> >
>> > FUNCTION MonkeyShip(m.tnStringToEncode AS Number, m.tlRandom AS
>Boolean)
>> > LOCAL m.lcRetval AS Character
>> >
>>
>m.lcStringToEncode=ALLTRIM(TRANSFORM(m.tnStringToEncode,[999]))
>> > LOCAL ARRAY laRebus[10,2]
>> > m.laRebus[1,1]=1
>> > m.laRebus[1,2]=[M]
>> > m.laRebus[2,1]=2
>> > m.laRebus[2,2]=[O]
>> > m.laRebus[3,1]=3
>> > m.laRebus[3,2]=[N]
>> > m.laRebus[4,1]=4
>> > m.laRebus[4,2]=[K]
>> > m.laRebus[5,1]=5
>> > m.laRebus[5,2]=[E]
>> > m.laRebus[6,1]=6
>> > m.laRebus[6,2]=[Y]
>> > m.laRebus[7,1]=7
>> > m.laRebus[7,2]=[S]
>> > m.laRebus[8,1]=8
>> > m.laRebus[8,2]=[H]
>> > m.laRebus[9,1]=9
>> > m.laRebus[9,2]=[I]
>> > m.laRebus[10,1]=0
>> > m.laRebus[10,2]=[P]
>> > m.lcRetval=[]
>> > m.lcChar=[]
>> > FOR m.x=1 TO LEN(ALLTRIM(m.lcStringToEncode))
>> >
>> 
>m.lcChar=m.laRebus[ASCAN(m.laRebus,VAL(SUBSTR(m.lcStringToEncode,x,1)),1,-1,1,8),2]
>> >   m.lcRetval=m.lcRetval+m.lcChar
>> > NEXT
>> > IF m.tlRandom
>> >   LOCAL m.liCounter AS Integer
>> >   PRIVATE m.pcRandomChar
>> >   m.pcRandomChar=[ ]
>> >   m.liCounter=1
>> > *!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at
>> least one alpha not in monkeyship
>> >   DO WHILE NOT ReturnRandom()
>> >   m.liCounter=m.liCounter+1
>> >   IF m.liCounter=10
>> >   EXIT
>> >   ENDIF
>> >   ENDDO
>> >   IF m.liCounter=10   && we went through loop 10 times and
>could
>> not get a char back
>> >   m.lcRetval=[Q]+m.lcRetval
>> >   ELSE
>> >   m.lcRetval=m.pcRandomChar+m.lcRetval
>> >   ENDIF
>> > ENDIF
>> > RETURN m.lcRetval
>> > ENDFUNC
>> >
>> > FUNCTION ReturnRandom
>> > LOCAL m.lcRandomSeed AS Character, m.lIsGood AS Boolean
>> > *!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at
>> least one alpha not in monkeyship
>> > m.lcRandomSeed=SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)
>> > m.lIsGood=.f.
>> > FOR m.y=LEN(m.lcRandomSeed) TO 2 STEP -1  && don't need to
>check
>> first char in sys(2015)
>> >   IF ISALPHA(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)) AND NOT
>> UPPER(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1))$[MONKEYSHIP]
>> >   m.pcRandomChar=SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)
>> >   m.lIsGood=.t.
>> >   EXIT
>> >   ELSE
>> >   m.lIsGood=.f.
>> >   ENDIF
>> > NEXT
>> > RETURN m.lIsGood
>> > ENDFUNC
>> >
>> > --
>> >
>> > rk
>> >
>> > -Original Message-
>> > From: ProfoxTech  On Behalf Of Frank
>>

Re: Numbering Scheme

[Stephen Russell]

Why not make a dashboard that has a Count for the Day on it. If you have
really simple people this might work?

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 9:54 AM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:

> Thanks, Obscuring the number is not a problem, but I think they want to
> be able to read the number off the ticket at the end of the day in
> sequential order and I don't see how I can come up with a simple way to
> do this.
>
> Frank.
>
> Frank Cazabon
>
> On 10/10/2018 03:48 PM, Richard Kaye wrote:
> > One way is to come up with a 10 letter "word" with each letter
> representing a digit. You then convert the numeric sequence to alpha
> characters. And to avoid the pattern being too easily spotted, add one or
> more random characters to the final string. It's not the most robust
> encryption scheme in the world but it should obscure it enough. Here's a
> bit of VFP code to do this using the non-dictionary phrase MONKEYSHIP as
> the rebus. Pass it the number to encode and optionally .t. as the second
> parameter to append a single random character at the end.
> >
> > **
> > *  Program: MONKEYSHIP.PRG
> > * Date: 05/07/2007 03:26 PM
> > *  VFP Version: Visual FoxPro 09.00..7423 for Windows
> > *Notes:
> > **
> >
> > FUNCTION MonkeyShip(m.tnStringToEncode AS Number, m.tlRandom AS Boolean)
> > LOCAL m.lcRetval AS Character
> >
> m.lcStringToEncode=ALLTRIM(TRANSFORM(m.tnStringToEncode,[999]))
> > LOCAL ARRAY laRebus[10,2]
> > m.laRebus[1,1]=1
> > m.laRebus[1,2]=[M]
> > m.laRebus[2,1]=2
> > m.laRebus[2,2]=[O]
> > m.laRebus[3,1]=3
> > m.laRebus[3,2]=[N]
> > m.laRebus[4,1]=4
> > m.laRebus[4,2]=[K]
> > m.laRebus[5,1]=5
> > m.laRebus[5,2]=[E]
> > m.laRebus[6,1]=6
> > m.laRebus[6,2]=[Y]
> > m.laRebus[7,1]=7
> > m.laRebus[7,2]=[S]
> > m.laRebus[8,1]=8
> > m.laRebus[8,2]=[H]
> > m.laRebus[9,1]=9
> > m.laRebus[9,2]=[I]
> > m.laRebus[10,1]=0
> > m.laRebus[10,2]=[P]
> > m.lcRetval=[]
> > m.lcChar=[]
> > FOR m.x=1 TO LEN(ALLTRIM(m.lcStringToEncode))
> >
>  
> m.lcChar=m.laRebus[ASCAN(m.laRebus,VAL(SUBSTR(m.lcStringToEncode,x,1)),1,-1,1,8),2]
> >   m.lcRetval=m.lcRetval+m.lcChar
> > NEXT
> > IF m.tlRandom
> >   LOCAL m.liCounter AS Integer
> >   PRIVATE m.pcRandomChar
> >   m.pcRandomChar=[ ]
> >   m.liCounter=1
> > *!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at
> least one alpha not in monkeyship
> >   DO WHILE NOT ReturnRandom()
> >   m.liCounter=m.liCounter+1
> >   IF m.liCounter=10
> >   EXIT
> >   ENDIF
> >   ENDDO
> >   IF m.liCounter=10   && we went through loop 10 times and could
> not get a char back
> >   m.lcRetval=[Q]+m.lcRetval
> >   ELSE
> >   m.lcRetval=m.pcRandomChar+m.lcRetval
> >   ENDIF
> > ENDIF
> > RETURN m.lcRetval
> > ENDFUNC
> >
> > FUNCTION ReturnRandom
> > LOCAL m.lcRandomSeed AS Character, m.lIsGood AS Boolean
> > *!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at
> least one alpha not in monkeyship
> > m.lcRandomSeed=SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)
> > m.lIsGood=.f.
> > FOR m.y=LEN(m.lcRandomSeed) TO 2 STEP -1  && don't need to check
> first char in sys(2015)
> >   IF ISALPHA(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)) AND NOT
> UPPER(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1))$[MONKEYSHIP]
> >   m.pcRandomChar=SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)
> >   m.lIsGood=.t.
> >   EXIT
> >   ELSE
> >   m.lIsGood=.f.
> >   ENDIF
> > NEXT
> > RETURN m.lIsGood
> > ENDFUNC
> >
> > --
> >
> > rk
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: ProfoxTech  On Behalf Of Frank
> Cazabon
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2018 3:25 PM
> > To: profoxt...@leafe.com
> > Subject: Numbering Scheme
> >
> > I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
> pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
> day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
> received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued to
> their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and read
> the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They are now
> not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their competitors may be

Re: Numbering Scheme

[Jean MAURICE]

so to improve this solution : print the time and then add the sequential number 
as milliseconds such as :

172543.124 : the ticket has been printed at 17h25m43s and is the 124th ...

The Foxil

Le 11/10/2018 à 17:12, Frank Cazabon a écrit :

That may work!

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 11/10/2018 10:59 AM, Vassilis Aggelakos wrote:

Try to put the real number between two 1 single digit other numbers. For
example 3452 --> 3=dummy 45 = real sequence 2--> dummy.

No math needed, just this little trick!

Hope this helps.

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 5:55 PM Alan Bourke  wrote:


Do you care more about competitors overestimating or underestimating the
amount of business being done?

--
   Alan Bourke
   alanpbourke (at) fastmail (dot) fm


[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Koen Piller]

What I would do: at a 3digt random prefix and a 2 digit random suffix to
your seq number of fixed lengte.
So you will end up with something like 45600198
67000261
45800377
Aso
If you print the list like this you will see at one glance the seq number
but your competetiors are not Abel to see that
68118555
Means you have 185 as seq number.
I have worked succesfully for years with this system
Koen

Op wo 10 okt. 2018 om 21:25 schreef Frank Cazabon 

> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
> pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
> day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
> received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
> to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
> read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
> are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
> competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
> much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
> and then one ate in the afternoon).
>
> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
> I am coming up blank.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> --
>
> Frank.
>
> Frank Cazabon
>
>
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

LOL!

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 11/10/2018 11:06 AM, Ted Roche wrote:

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 10:54 AM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:


Thanks, Obscuring the number is not a problem, but I think they want to
be able to read the number off the ticket at the end of the day in
sequential order and I don't see how I can come up with a simple way to
do this.


Invisible Ink 




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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

That may work!

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 11/10/2018 10:59 AM, Vassilis Aggelakos wrote:

Try to put the real number between two 1 single digit other numbers. For
example 3452 --> 3=dummy 45 = real sequence 2--> dummy.

No math needed, just this little trick!

Hope this helps.

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 5:55 PM Alan Bourke  wrote:


Do you care more about competitors overestimating or underestimating the
amount of business being done?

--
   Alan Bourke
   alanpbourke (at) fastmail (dot) fm


[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

Thanks

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 10/10/2018 06:45 PM, Charles Hart Enzer, M.D. wrote:

How about table with two columns in an Array:

- Column One is sequential by one
- Column Two is generated by Random Number Generator with IF THEN
   - If Random Number Exists, reGenerate
- Assign numbers to items from Column Two

Instead of an Array, create a Table to be used -- estimating length for
next five to ten years



*Shai / שי **Charles Hart Enzer, MD(Ohio, USA), FAACAP*
*Aliyah : Cincinnati to Jerusalem
's German Colony
 May, 2017*



*Volunteer Associate Professor of PsychiatryUniversity of Cincinnati
Medical CenterWebSite: **EnzerMD.com *
*Publications* 

*If a problem has no solution, *
*it may not be a problem, *
*but a fact -- not to be solved, *
*but to be coped with over time*

-- Shimon Peres, Ninth President of Israel



On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 12:25 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:


I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
and then one ate in the afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
I am coming up blank.

Any ideas?

--

Frank.

Frank Cazabon



[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Vassilis Aggelakos]

If you want it a bit more sophisticated, the last digit it could denote how
many digits are dummy in the begining.

E.g: 45672 --> 45=dummy --> 67 real number and 2 dummy indicator.

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 6:03 PM Ed Leafe  wrote:

> On Oct 11, 2018, at 9:59 AM, Vassilis Aggelakos 
> wrote:
> >
> > Try to put the real number between two 1 single digit other numbers. For
> > example 3452 --> 3=dummy 45 = real sequence 2--> dummy.
> >
> > No math needed, just this little trick!
>
> This is the best solution so far! You could use multiple extra digits on
> the left and right of the true number, and randomize them.
>
>
> -- Ed Leafe
>
>
>
>
>
>
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

They actually have barcodes on the ticket but never use the scanners to 
actually read them, they just read the number (printed below the bar code).


Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 10/10/2018 06:19 PM, Mike wrote:
Print the sequential number using a barcode font. If a customer has a 
barcode scanner, they can "see" the number, but they'd have to be 
looking pretty hard. Meanwhile, an $80 barcode scanner (USB 
connection) on the office computer would let them read the sequential 
number.


Mike Copeland


Frank Cazabon wrote:
I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a 
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of 
the day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various 
parcels received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the 
ticket issued to their customer and at the end of the day sort them 
sequentially and read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they 
match the parcels). They are now not wanting the number printed on 
the ticket as their competitors may be able to get an idea from the 
sequential numbers how much business they are doing (by getting a 
ticket early in the morning and then one ate in the afternoon).


So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit 
that I am coming up blank.


Any ideas?





[excessive quoting removed by server]

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RE: Numbering Scheme

[Richard Kaye]

The people in the know memorize the rebus. But you mentioned nobody wants to 
think so... 

--

rk

-Original Message-
From: ProfoxTech  On Behalf Of Frank Cazabon
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 10:54 AM
To: profoxt...@leafe.com
Subject: Re: Numbering Scheme

Thanks, Obscuring the number is not a problem, but I think they want to be able 
to read the number off the ticket at the end of the day in sequential order and 
I don't see how I can come up with a simple way to do this.

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 10/10/2018 03:48 PM, Richard Kaye wrote:
> One way is to come up with a 10 letter "word" with each letter representing a 
> digit. You then convert the numeric sequence to alpha characters. And to 
> avoid the pattern being too easily spotted, add one or  more random 
> characters to the final string. It's not the most robust encryption scheme in 
> the world but it should obscure it enough. Here's a bit of VFP code to do 
> this using the non-dictionary phrase MONKEYSHIP as the rebus. Pass it the 
> number to encode and optionally .t. as the second parameter to append a 
> single random character at the end.
>
> **
> *  Program: MONKEYSHIP.PRG
> * Date: 05/07/2007 03:26 PM
> *  VFP Version: Visual FoxPro 09.00..7423 for Windows
> *Notes:
> **
>   
> FUNCTION MonkeyShip(m.tnStringToEncode AS Number, m.tlRandom AS 
> Boolean) LOCAL m.lcRetval AS Character
> m.lcStringToEncode=ALLTRIM(TRANSFORM(m.tnStringToEncode,[9
> 99]))
> LOCAL ARRAY laRebus[10,2]
> m.laRebus[1,1]=1
> m.laRebus[1,2]=[M]
> m.laRebus[2,1]=2
> m.laRebus[2,2]=[O]
> m.laRebus[3,1]=3
> m.laRebus[3,2]=[N]
> m.laRebus[4,1]=4
> m.laRebus[4,2]=[K]
> m.laRebus[5,1]=5
> m.laRebus[5,2]=[E]
> m.laRebus[6,1]=6
> m.laRebus[6,2]=[Y]
> m.laRebus[7,1]=7
> m.laRebus[7,2]=[S]
> m.laRebus[8,1]=8
> m.laRebus[8,2]=[H]
> m.laRebus[9,1]=9
> m.laRebus[9,2]=[I]
> m.laRebus[10,1]=0
> m.laRebus[10,2]=[P]
> m.lcRetval=[]
> m.lcChar=[]
> FOR m.x=1 TO LEN(ALLTRIM(m.lcStringToEncode))
>   
> m.lcChar=m.laRebus[ASCAN(m.laRebus,VAL(SUBSTR(m.lcStringToEncode,x,1)),1,-1,1,8),2]
>   m.lcRetval=m.lcRetval+m.lcChar
> NEXT
> IF m.tlRandom
>   LOCAL m.liCounter AS Integer
>   PRIVATE m.pcRandomChar
>   m.pcRandomChar=[ ]
>   m.liCounter=1
> *!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at least one 
> alpha not in monkeyship
>   DO WHILE NOT ReturnRandom()
>   m.liCounter=m.liCounter+1
>   IF m.liCounter=10
>   EXIT
>   ENDIF
>   ENDDO
>   IF m.liCounter=10   && we went through loop 10 times and could not 
> get a char back
>   m.lcRetval=[Q]+m.lcRetval
>   ELSE
>   m.lcRetval=m.pcRandomChar+m.lcRetval
>   ENDIF
> ENDIF
> RETURN m.lcRetval
> ENDFUNC
>
> FUNCTION ReturnRandom
> LOCAL m.lcRandomSeed AS Character, m.lIsGood AS Boolean
> *!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at 
> least one alpha not in monkeyship
> m.lcRandomSeed=SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)
> m.lIsGood=.f.
> FOR m.y=LEN(m.lcRandomSeed) TO 2 STEP -1  && don't need to check first 
> char in sys(2015)
>   IF ISALPHA(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)) AND NOT 
> UPPER(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1))$[MONKEYSHIP]
>   m.pcRandomChar=SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)
>   m.lIsGood=.t.
>   EXIT
>   ELSE
>   m.lIsGood=.f.
>   ENDIF
> NEXT
> RETURN m.lIsGood
> ENDFUNC
>
> --
>
> rk
>
> -Original Message-
> From: ProfoxTech  On Behalf Of Frank 
> Cazabon
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2018 3:25 PM
> To: profoxt...@leafe.com
> Subject: Numbering Scheme
>
> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a pawnshop). 
> The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the day (read that 
> as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels received for the 
> tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued to their customer and 
> at the end of the day sort them sequentially and read the numbers off the 
> tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They are now not wanting the 
> number printed on the ticket as their competitors may be able to get an idea 
> from the sequential numbers how much business they are doing (by getting a 
> ticket early in the morning and then one ate in the afternoon).
>
> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that I am 
> coming up blank.
>
> Any ideas?
>


[excessive quoting removed by server]

___

Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

That's along the lines of what I think needs to be done but not sure if 
my client will be happy with it. Only way to find out is to ask.


Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 10/10/2018 06:18 PM, Paul H. Tarver wrote:

How about a simple character substitution routine like this:

Original # String: '0123456789'
Substitution String : '2546890313'

Create a simple routine to take a number as a string, do a character by
character substitution and return the "encoded" Ticket #

Ticket #: 12345 would be printed on the ticket as 54689
Ticket #: 12346 would be printed on the ticket as 54680

If the displayed digit string is randomly ordered none of the ticket numbers
would make any sense if a morning ticket was compared to an afternoon
ticket.

Then you could "decode" the ticket # when the user entered the ticket number
to regenerate the original ticket number. This would also help prevent
counterfeit tickets a bit as well, I would think.

This could even be expanded to include some alpha characters in the Ticket #
if you wanted to add a prefix or suffix to the Ticket #.

Paul H. Tarver
Email: p...@tpcqpc.com


-Original Message-
From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-boun...@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Frank
Cazabon
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2018 2:25 PM
To: profoxt...@leafe.com
Subject: Numbering Scheme

I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
and then one ate in the afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
I am coming up blank.

Any ideas?




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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Ted Roche]

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 10:54 AM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:

> Thanks, Obscuring the number is not a problem, but I think they want to
> be able to read the number off the ticket at the end of the day in
> sequential order and I don't see how I can come up with a simple way to
> do this.
>

Invisible Ink 

-- 
Ted Roche
Ted Roche & Associates, LLC
http://www.tedroche.com


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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

I would guess they are more concerned about overestimating, but that's 
just a WAG.


Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 11/10/2018 10:55 AM, Alan Bourke wrote:

Do you care more about competitors overestimating or underestimating the amount 
of business being done?




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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Ed Leafe]

On Oct 11, 2018, at 9:59 AM, Vassilis Aggelakos  wrote:
> 
> Try to put the real number between two 1 single digit other numbers. For
> example 3452 --> 3=dummy 45 = real sequence 2--> dummy.
> 
> No math needed, just this little trick!

This is the best solution so far! You could use multiple extra digits on the 
left and right of the true number, and randomize them.


-- Ed Leafe






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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

On 10/10/2018 03:41 PM, Eric Selje wrote:

What difference does it make if the competition knows how much business
you're doing?


I really couldn't say. They seem to "spy" on their competitors this way 
and think their competitors also do it to them. I really don't 
understand their reasoning, but then again these are clients who 
wouldn't let me remotely connect to their systems until just a couple 
years ago.


Frank.

Frank Cazabon



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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

This is for their end of day process and they want to be able to count 
the number of tickets and match the number of parcels and then be able 
to match them in sequential order. They also store the parcels in a 
vault in sequential order so that when the customer comes back for their 
parcel it's easy to find.


The tickets are printed on dot matrix printers using carbon copy paper.

The only way I can see this working is to have an internal sequential 
number and an external random one. At the end of the day they'll have to 
print out a report with the internal and external numbers so they can do 
their matching/double check. The parcel will have just the internal 
number on it. When the customer comes back they'll have to look up the 
parcel on the PC using the external number and then get the internal 
number to get the package from the vault.


Maybe they'll be happy with this.

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 10/10/2018 05:20 PM, Tracy Pearson wrote:

Do you have
   1) a specific report for the customer ticket
   2) can you can add a sequential number on to the above for the internal
copy?
   3) a parcel label that can have a ticket number and the sequential number
on it?

It would mean the two people would need to come back and get the parcel, and
see the label to try to figure out the numbers.


-Original Message-
From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-boun...@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Frank
Cazabon
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2018 3:25 PM
To: profoxt...@leafe.com
Subject: Numbering Scheme

I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
and then one ate in the afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
I am coming up blank.

Any ideas?




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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Vassilis Aggelakos]

Try to put the real number between two 1 single digit other numbers. For
example 3452 --> 3=dummy 45 = real sequence 2--> dummy.

No math needed, just this little trick!

Hope this helps.

On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 5:55 PM Alan Bourke  wrote:

> Do you care more about competitors overestimating or underestimating the
> amount of business being done?
>
> --
>   Alan Bourke
>   alanpbourke (at) fastmail (dot) fm
>
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Alan Bourke]

Do you care more about competitors overestimating or underestimating the amount 
of business being done?

-- 
  Alan Bourke
  alanpbourke (at) fastmail (dot) fm

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

Thanks, Obscuring the number is not a problem, but I think they want to 
be able to read the number off the ticket at the end of the day in 
sequential order and I don't see how I can come up with a simple way to 
do this.


Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 10/10/2018 03:48 PM, Richard Kaye wrote:

One way is to come up with a 10 letter "word" with each letter representing a 
digit. You then convert the numeric sequence to alpha characters. And to avoid the 
pattern being too easily spotted, add one or  more random characters to the final string. 
It's not the most robust encryption scheme in the world but it should obscure it enough. 
Here's a bit of VFP code to do this using the non-dictionary phrase MONKEYSHIP as the 
rebus. Pass it the number to encode and optionally .t. as the second parameter to append 
a single random character at the end.

**
*  Program: MONKEYSHIP.PRG
* Date: 05/07/2007 03:26 PM
*  VFP Version: Visual FoxPro 09.00..7423 for Windows
*Notes:
**
  
FUNCTION MonkeyShip(m.tnStringToEncode AS Number, m.tlRandom AS Boolean)

LOCAL m.lcRetval AS Character
m.lcStringToEncode=ALLTRIM(TRANSFORM(m.tnStringToEncode,[999]))
LOCAL ARRAY laRebus[10,2]
m.laRebus[1,1]=1
m.laRebus[1,2]=[M]
m.laRebus[2,1]=2
m.laRebus[2,2]=[O]
m.laRebus[3,1]=3
m.laRebus[3,2]=[N]
m.laRebus[4,1]=4
m.laRebus[4,2]=[K]
m.laRebus[5,1]=5
m.laRebus[5,2]=[E]
m.laRebus[6,1]=6
m.laRebus[6,2]=[Y]
m.laRebus[7,1]=7
m.laRebus[7,2]=[S]
m.laRebus[8,1]=8
m.laRebus[8,2]=[H]
m.laRebus[9,1]=9
m.laRebus[9,2]=[I]
m.laRebus[10,1]=0
m.laRebus[10,2]=[P]
m.lcRetval=[]
m.lcChar=[]
FOR m.x=1 TO LEN(ALLTRIM(m.lcStringToEncode))

m.lcChar=m.laRebus[ASCAN(m.laRebus,VAL(SUBSTR(m.lcStringToEncode,x,1)),1,-1,1,8),2]
m.lcRetval=m.lcRetval+m.lcChar
NEXT
IF m.tlRandom
LOCAL m.liCounter AS Integer
PRIVATE m.pcRandomChar
m.pcRandomChar=[ ]
m.liCounter=1
*!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at least one 
alpha not in monkeyship
DO WHILE NOT ReturnRandom()
m.liCounter=m.liCounter+1
IF m.liCounter=10
EXIT
ENDIF
ENDDO
IF m.liCounter=10   && we went through loop 10 times and could not 
get a char back
m.lcRetval=[Q]+m.lcRetval
ELSE
m.lcRetval=m.pcRandomChar+m.lcRetval
ENDIF
ENDIF
RETURN m.lcRetval
ENDFUNC

FUNCTION ReturnRandom
LOCAL m.lcRandomSeed AS Character, m.lIsGood AS Boolean
*!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at least one 
alpha not in monkeyship
m.lcRandomSeed=SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)
m.lIsGood=.f.
FOR m.y=LEN(m.lcRandomSeed) TO 2 STEP -1&& don't need to check first 
char in sys(2015)
IF ISALPHA(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)) AND NOT 
UPPER(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1))$[MONKEYSHIP]
m.pcRandomChar=SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)
m.lIsGood=.t.
EXIT
ELSE
m.lIsGood=.f.
ENDIF
NEXT
RETURN m.lIsGood
ENDFUNC

--

rk

-Original Message-
From: ProfoxTech  On Behalf Of Frank Cazabon
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2018 3:25 PM
To: profoxt...@leafe.com
Subject: Numbering Scheme

I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a pawnshop). The 
sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the day (read that as 
check for stealing) when checking the various parcels received for the tickets 
issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued to their customer and at the end 
of the day sort them sequentially and read the numbers off the tickets to 
ensure they match the parcels). They are now not wanting the number printed on 
the ticket as their competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential 
numbers how much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the 
morning and then one ate in the afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that I am 
coming up blank.

Any ideas?




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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

That would still involve some thought on the users part (and they don't 
think at all).


Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 10/10/2018 03:46 PM, Vassilis Aggelakos wrote:

Multiply the number by 3.

Vassilis


On 10 Oct 2018, at 22:42, Ted Roche  wrote:

Keep a table with the primary key (a non-data-bearing auto-incremented
integer) as the sequential number, to ensure things don't go missing out of
sequence.

For each ticket, create a unique number that's not already in the table.
Use the random functions to generate a mix of numbers and letters, and
check to ensure that's not already in use. (You could use GUIDs, but they
are too long for practical use, I suspect.)

At the end of the day, you can match a list of the random "ticket numbers"
against your list in primary key order to ensure no tickets were
"misplaced."



On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 3:25 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:


I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
and then one ate in the afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
I am coming up blank.

Any ideas?

--

Frank.

Frank Cazabon



[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

They have a barcode on the ticket, but we also print the number. They 
(for whatever reason) found that using the barcode was too hard.


A QR code won't make it any easier. :(

Frank.

Frank Cazabon

On 10/10/2018 05:35 PM, Stephen Russell wrote:

01 =1  10=2

Why not print a QR Barcode and stick the number in there instead?

On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 4:24 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:


But how will the staff be able to read the binary numbers off the ticket
and know it's in sequence?

On 10 October 2018 15:33:10 GMT-04:00, Stephen Russell <
srussell...@gmail.com> wrote:

Go binary!  10010110101 They are kicking ass today!


On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 2:26 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:


I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of

the

day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various

parcels

received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket

issued

to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially

and

read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels).

They

are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers

how

much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the

morning

and then one ate in the afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit

that

I am coming up blank.

Any ideas?

--

Frank.

Frank Cazabon



[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Mike]

True, but they would need several invoices to compare...which means 
they're "looking" for a sequence and not just "noticing".


Mike


Paul Hill wrote:

On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 at 23:19, Mike  wrote:

Print the sequential number using a barcode font. If a customer has a
barcode scanner, they can "see" the number, but they'd have to be
looking pretty hard.

Or they could just use their phone.




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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Paul Hill]

On Wed, 10 Oct 2018 at 23:19, Mike  wrote:
>
> Print the sequential number using a barcode font. If a customer has a
> barcode scanner, they can "see" the number, but they'd have to be
> looking pretty hard.

Or they could just use their phone.

-- 
Paul

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Charles Hart Enzer, M.D.]

How about table with two columns in an Array:

   - Column One is sequential by one
   - Column Two is generated by Random Number Generator with IF THEN
  - If Random Number Exists, reGenerate
   - Assign numbers to items from Column Two

Instead of an Array, create a Table to be used -- estimating length for
next five to ten years



*Shai / שי **Charles Hart Enzer, MD(Ohio, USA), FAACAP*
*Aliyah : Cincinnati to Jerusalem
's German Colony
 May, 2017*



*Volunteer Associate Professor of PsychiatryUniversity of Cincinnati
Medical CenterWebSite: **EnzerMD.com *
*Publications* 

*If a problem has no solution, *
*it may not be a problem, *
*but a fact -- not to be solved, *
*but to be coped with over time*

-- Shimon Peres, Ninth President of Israel



On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 12:25 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:

> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
> pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
> day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
> received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
> to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
> read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
> are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
> competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
> much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
> and then one ate in the afternoon).
>
> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
> I am coming up blank.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> --
>
> Frank.
>
> Frank Cazabon
>
>
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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RE: Numbering Scheme

[Paul H. Tarver]

How about a simple character substitution routine like this:

Original # String: '0123456789'
Substitution String : '2546890313'

Create a simple routine to take a number as a string, do a character by
character substitution and return the "encoded" Ticket #

Ticket #: 12345 would be printed on the ticket as 54689 
Ticket #: 12346 would be printed on the ticket as 54680

If the displayed digit string is randomly ordered none of the ticket numbers
would make any sense if a morning ticket was compared to an afternoon
ticket. 

Then you could "decode" the ticket # when the user entered the ticket number
to regenerate the original ticket number. This would also help prevent
counterfeit tickets a bit as well, I would think. 

This could even be expanded to include some alpha characters in the Ticket #
if you wanted to add a prefix or suffix to the Ticket #. 

Paul H. Tarver
Email: p...@tpcqpc.com 


-Original Message-
From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-boun...@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Frank
Cazabon
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2018 2:25 PM
To: profoxt...@leafe.com
Subject: Numbering Scheme

I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a 
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the 
day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels 
received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued 
to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and 
read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They 
are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their 
competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how 
much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning 
and then one ate in the afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that 
I am coming up blank.

Any ideas?

-- 

Frank.

Frank Cazabon


[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Mike]

Print the sequential number using a barcode font. If a customer has a 
barcode scanner, they can "see" the number, but they'd have to be 
looking pretty hard. Meanwhile, an $80 barcode scanner (USB connection) 
on the office computer would let them read the sequential number.


Mike Copeland


Frank Cazabon wrote:
I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a 
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of 
the day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various 
parcels received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the 
ticket issued to their customer and at the end of the day sort them 
sequentially and read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match 
the parcels). They are now not wanting the number printed on the 
ticket as their competitors may be able to get an idea from the 
sequential numbers how much business they are doing (by getting a 
ticket early in the morning and then one ate in the afternoon).


So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit 
that I am coming up blank.


Any ideas?




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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Stephen Russell]

01 =1  10=2

Why not print a QR Barcode and stick the number in there instead?

On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 4:24 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:

> But how will the staff be able to read the binary numbers off the ticket
> and know it's in sequence?
>
> On 10 October 2018 15:33:10 GMT-04:00, Stephen Russell <
> srussell...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Go binary!  10010110101 They are kicking ass today!
> >
> >
> >On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 2:26 PM Frank Cazabon 
> >wrote:
> >
> >> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
> >> pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of
> >the
> >> day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various
> >parcels
> >> received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket
> >issued
> >> to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially
> >and
> >> read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels).
> >They
> >> are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
> >> competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers
> >how
> >> much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the
> >morning
> >> and then one ate in the afternoon).
> >>
> >> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit
> >that
> >> I am coming up blank.
> >>
> >> Any ideas?
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Frank.
> >>
> >> Frank Cazabon
> >>
> >>
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

So effectively display one number on the ticket but when it comes to checking, 
run a report displaying the sequential numbers and the random/nonsense number?

On 10 October 2018 15:42:30 GMT-04:00, Ted Roche  wrote:
>Keep a table with the primary key (a non-data-bearing auto-incremented
>integer) as the sequential number, to ensure things don't go missing
>out of
>sequence.
>
>For each ticket, create a unique number that's not already in the
>table.
>Use the random functions to generate a mix of numbers and letters, and
>check to ensure that's not already in use. (You could use GUIDs, but
>they
>are too long for practical use, I suspect.)
>
>At the end of the day, you can match a list of the random "ticket
>numbers"
>against your list in primary key order to ensure no tickets were
>"misplaced."
>
>
>
>On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 3:25 PM Frank Cazabon 
>wrote:
>
>> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
>> pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of
>the
>> day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various
>parcels
>> received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket
>issued
>> to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially
>and
>> read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels).
>They
>> are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
>> competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers
>how
>> much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the
>morning
>> and then one ate in the afternoon).
>>
>> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit
>that
>> I am coming up blank.
>>
>> Any ideas?
>>
>> --
>>
>> Frank.
>>
>> Frank Cazabon
>>
>>
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

But how will the staff be able to read the binary numbers off the ticket and 
know it's in sequence?

On 10 October 2018 15:33:10 GMT-04:00, Stephen Russell  
wrote:
>Go binary!  10010110101 They are kicking ass today!
>
>
>On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 2:26 PM Frank Cazabon 
>wrote:
>
>> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
>> pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of
>the
>> day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various
>parcels
>> received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket
>issued
>> to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially
>and
>> read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels).
>They
>> are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
>> competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers
>how
>> much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the
>morning
>> and then one ate in the afternoon).
>>
>> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit
>that
>> I am coming up blank.
>>
>> Any ideas?
>>
>> --
>>
>> Frank.
>>
>> Frank Cazabon
>>
>>
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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RE: Numbering Scheme

[Tracy Pearson]

Do you have 
  1) a specific report for the customer ticket
  2) can you can add a sequential number on to the above for the internal
copy?
  3) a parcel label that can have a ticket number and the sequential number
on it?

It would mean the two people would need to come back and get the parcel, and
see the label to try to figure out the numbers.


-Original Message-
From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-boun...@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Frank
Cazabon
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2018 3:25 PM
To: profoxt...@leafe.com
Subject: Numbering Scheme

I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a 
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the 
day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels 
received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued 
to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and 
read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They 
are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their 
competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how 
much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning 
and then one ate in the afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that 
I am coming up blank.

Any ideas?

-- 

Frank.

Frank Cazabon


[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Vassilis Aggelakos]

Multiply the number by 3.

Vassilis

> On 10 Oct 2018, at 22:25, Frank Cazabon  wrote:
> 
> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a pawnshop). 
> The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the day (read that 
> as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels received for the 
> tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued to their customer and 
> at the end of the day sort them sequentially and read the numbers off the 
> tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They are now not wanting the 
> number printed on the ticket as their competitors may be able to get an idea 
> from the sequential numbers how much business they are doing (by getting a 
> ticket early in the morning and then one ate in the afternoon).
> 
> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that I am 
> coming up blank.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> -- 
> 
> Frank.
> 
> Frank Cazabon
> 
> 
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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RE: Numbering Scheme

[Richard Kaye]

One way is to come up with a 10 letter "word" with each letter representing a 
digit. You then convert the numeric sequence to alpha characters. And to avoid 
the pattern being too easily spotted, add one or  more random characters to the 
final string. It's not the most robust encryption scheme in the world but it 
should obscure it enough. Here's a bit of VFP code to do this using the 
non-dictionary phrase MONKEYSHIP as the rebus. Pass it the number to encode and 
optionally .t. as the second parameter to append a single random character at 
the end. 

**
*  Program: MONKEYSHIP.PRG
* Date: 05/07/2007 03:26 PM
*  VFP Version: Visual FoxPro 09.00..7423 for Windows
*Notes: 
**
 
FUNCTION MonkeyShip(m.tnStringToEncode AS Number, m.tlRandom AS Boolean)
LOCAL m.lcRetval AS Character
m.lcStringToEncode=ALLTRIM(TRANSFORM(m.tnStringToEncode,[999]))
LOCAL ARRAY laRebus[10,2]
m.laRebus[1,1]=1
m.laRebus[1,2]=[M]
m.laRebus[2,1]=2
m.laRebus[2,2]=[O]
m.laRebus[3,1]=3
m.laRebus[3,2]=[N]
m.laRebus[4,1]=4
m.laRebus[4,2]=[K]
m.laRebus[5,1]=5
m.laRebus[5,2]=[E]
m.laRebus[6,1]=6
m.laRebus[6,2]=[Y]
m.laRebus[7,1]=7
m.laRebus[7,2]=[S]
m.laRebus[8,1]=8
m.laRebus[8,2]=[H]
m.laRebus[9,1]=9
m.laRebus[9,2]=[I]
m.laRebus[10,1]=0
m.laRebus[10,2]=[P]
m.lcRetval=[]
m.lcChar=[]
FOR m.x=1 TO LEN(ALLTRIM(m.lcStringToEncode))

m.lcChar=m.laRebus[ASCAN(m.laRebus,VAL(SUBSTR(m.lcStringToEncode,x,1)),1,-1,1,8),2]
m.lcRetval=m.lcRetval+m.lcChar 
NEXT 
IF m.tlRandom
LOCAL m.liCounter AS Integer
PRIVATE m.pcRandomChar
m.pcRandomChar=[ ]
m.liCounter=1
*!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at least one 
alpha not in monkeyship
DO WHILE NOT ReturnRandom() 
m.liCounter=m.liCounter+1 
IF m.liCounter=10
EXIT 
ENDIF 
ENDDO 
IF m.liCounter=10   && we went through loop 10 times and could not 
get a char back
m.lcRetval=[Q]+m.lcRetval
ELSE 
m.lcRetval=m.pcRandomChar+m.lcRetval
ENDIF 
ENDIF 
RETURN m.lcRetval
ENDFUNC 

FUNCTION ReturnRandom
LOCAL m.lcRandomSeed AS Character, m.lIsGood AS Boolean 
*!* get a bunch of values to work with which will hopefully give at least one 
alpha not in monkeyship
m.lcRandomSeed=SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)+SYS(2015)
m.lIsGood=.f.
FOR m.y=LEN(m.lcRandomSeed) TO 2 STEP -1&& don't need to check first 
char in sys(2015)
IF ISALPHA(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)) AND NOT 
UPPER(SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1))$[MONKEYSHIP]
m.pcRandomChar=SUBSTR(m.lcRandomSeed,y,1)
m.lIsGood=.t.
EXIT 
ELSE 
m.lIsGood=.f.
ENDIF 
NEXT 
RETURN m.lIsGood
ENDFUNC

--

rk

-Original Message-
From: ProfoxTech  On Behalf Of Frank Cazabon
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2018 3:25 PM
To: profoxt...@leafe.com
Subject: Numbering Scheme

I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a pawnshop). The 
sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the day (read that as 
check for stealing) when checking the various parcels received for the tickets 
issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued to their customer and at the end 
of the day sort them sequentially and read the numbers off the tickets to 
ensure they match the parcels). They are now not wanting the number printed on 
the ticket as their competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential 
numbers how much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the 
morning and then one ate in the afternoon).

So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that I am 
coming up blank.

Any ideas?

-- 

Frank.

Frank Cazabon


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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Vassilis Aggelakos]

Multiply the number by 3. 

Vassilis

> On 10 Oct 2018, at 22:42, Ted Roche  wrote:
> 
> Keep a table with the primary key (a non-data-bearing auto-incremented
> integer) as the sequential number, to ensure things don't go missing out of
> sequence.
> 
> For each ticket, create a unique number that's not already in the table.
> Use the random functions to generate a mix of numbers and letters, and
> check to ensure that's not already in use. (You could use GUIDs, but they
> are too long for practical use, I suspect.)
> 
> At the end of the day, you can match a list of the random "ticket numbers"
> against your list in primary key order to ensure no tickets were
> "misplaced."
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 3:25 PM Frank Cazabon 
> wrote:
> 
>> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
>> pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
>> day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
>> received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
>> to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
>> read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
>> are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
>> competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
>> much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
>> and then one ate in the afternoon).
>> 
>> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
>> I am coming up blank.
>> 
>> Any ideas?
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> Frank.
>> 
>> Frank Cazabon
>> 
>> 
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Ted Roche]

Keep a table with the primary key (a non-data-bearing auto-incremented
integer) as the sequential number, to ensure things don't go missing out of
sequence.

For each ticket, create a unique number that's not already in the table.
Use the random functions to generate a mix of numbers and letters, and
check to ensure that's not already in use. (You could use GUIDs, but they
are too long for practical use, I suspect.)

At the end of the day, you can match a list of the random "ticket numbers"
against your list in primary key order to ensure no tickets were
"misplaced."



On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 3:25 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:

> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
> pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
> day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
> received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
> to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
> read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
> are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
> competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
> much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
> and then one ate in the afternoon).
>
> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
> I am coming up blank.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> --
>
> Frank.
>
> Frank Cazabon
>
>
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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RE: Numbering Scheme

[John Weller]

ROFL.  

John Weller
01380 723235
07976 393631


Go binary!  10010110101 They are kicking ass today!



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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Eric Selje]

Or Hex?

What difference does it make if the competition knows how much business
you're doing?

E

On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 2:33 PM Stephen Russell 
wrote:

> Go binary!  10010110101 They are kicking ass today!
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 2:26 PM Frank Cazabon 
> wrote:
>
> > I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
> > pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
> > day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
> > received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
> > to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
> > read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
> > are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
> > competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
> > much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
> > and then one ate in the afternoon).
> >
> > So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
> > I am coming up blank.
> >
> > Any ideas?
> >
> > --
> >
> > Frank.
> >
> > Frank Cazabon
> >
> >
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Re: Numbering Scheme

[Stephen Russell]

Go binary!  10010110101 They are kicking ass today!


On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 2:26 PM Frank Cazabon 
wrote:

> I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a
> pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the
> day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels
> received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued
> to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and
> read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They
> are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their
> competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how
> much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning
> and then one ate in the afternoon).
>
> So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that
> I am coming up blank.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> --
>
> Frank.
>
> Frank Cazabon
>
>
[excessive quoting removed by server]

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Numbering Scheme

[Frank Cazabon]

I have a client who issues tickets in numerical sequence (it's a 
pawnshop). The sequence helps them balance things back at the end of the 
day (read that as check for stealing) when checking the various parcels 
received for the tickets issued (they keep a copy of the ticket issued 
to their customer and at the end of the day sort them sequentially and 
read the numbers off the tickets to ensure they match the parcels). They 
are now not wanting the number printed on the ticket as their 
competitors may be able to get an idea from the sequential numbers how 
much business they are doing (by getting a ticket early in the morning 
and then one ate in the afternoon).


So, they have asked me to come up with a solution and I must admit that 
I am coming up blank.


Any ideas?

--

Frank.

Frank Cazabon


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