Re: should i move on to python3
On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 09:15 +1100, Python Nutter wrote: > Maybe if everyone shares their own thinking for their own situations > it may help. Well, at work I do a mixture of things, some of which require python 2.3 (I know...), and some of which I can write to whatever version I want. I generally use 2.5 for the second group. This is all work that runs live all the time and has money running through it, so I'd rather not risk moving to 3 for *any* of it until: a) any security holes in python 3 have been fixed b) it costs me more to stick with 2.x than to go through all of my code line by line. At home I normally write code for 2.5, as that's what comes with Ubuntu Hardy (on my main, stable, machine), and most users will have 2.5 or 2.6 for quite a long time. For projects that are released, I'm planning to stick to the advice Guido gave at Europython and keep working on 2.5/2.6 in trunk, but automatically generate a 3.x branch using 2to3. I think it's going to be a bit like Java's JVMs (I can barely write Java, but I use some Java projects) - I've got Java 5 and 6 running different applications side by side here. In fact, I've got Sun's JVM for 6 and 5, and IBM's JDK for Java 5 all running. Similarly, on various machines I use CPython 2.3, 2.4, 2.5, 2.6 and Jython 2.2 for various reasons - and I'm certainly planning on using PyPy a large amount once it's stable. I used the Beta of 3.0, but to be honest I haven't used it for anything "proper" yet. Tim Wintle -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: should i move on to python3
On Mar 7, 5:09�pm, Terry Reedy wrote: > Python Nutter wrote: > > silently troll python submitters and got the feeling 3.1 was what 3.0 > > was supposed to be ;-) > > I would say that it will be what the developers wish 3.0 had been. �Part > of the problem was that not enough people downloaded and tested the 3.0 > betas to discover certain problems before the release. That's the old chicken/egg question. People who depend on third party libraries can't test beta versions of 3.0, can they? Nothing anybody can do anything about, just a comment. > > �> so I been silently waking for 3.1 to go final > > > before spending time with the 3 branch to learn the changes. > > You will, of course, then have to take what you get ;-). �If you have > any unusual uses, please consider trying them out on a beta release. > > tjr -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: should i move on to python3
Python Nutter wrote: silently troll python submitters and got the feeling 3.1 was what 3.0 was supposed to be ;-) I would say that it will be what the developers wish 3.0 had been. Part of the problem was that not enough people downloaded and tested the 3.0 betas to discover certain problems before the release. > so I been silently waking for 3.1 to go final before spending time with the 3 branch to learn the changes. You will, of course, then have to take what you get ;-). If you have any unusual uses, please consider trying them out on a beta release. tjr -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: should i move on to python3
Maybe if everyone shares their own thinking for their own situations it may help. I know the 2.x branch rather well, and cut my teeth on it. My work involves x509 cryptographic materials and I cut my own binaries and then wrap them in python to extend and enhance or build a lot of automation around the binaries. I am the primary consumer of the final programs so I don't wrap them in any sort of GUI. As such my python touchpoints are rather slim on libraries. It took me all my life up to a month ago to move off of os.popen and onto subprocess. With this I could move between Python branches without much issue. I do have an Ubuntu system at work as well as Windows so I'm a lazy sod who didn't feel like building a custom Python build so I jus use what comes with Ubuntu. Because of this I am stuck with a tenuous small reliance on the 2.x branch, very small but add in lazy or not wanting to use up xyz hours preparing new environments and learning a new idioms and you might get the typical python user who encorporates it at a job function where programming is not their job function but they use python to help make the job eaier in a few areas. I use more 3rd party modules at home and use the OS X platform exclusively there. I wish I had time with the family but a lot of my projects have been left by the wayside (web page scraping, games and opengl programming, etc). Unlike Windows, tkinter GUI programs on OS X could look native-ish. I always have aversions to making GUI programs for distribution that require users install large dependencies so I have shied away from doing them. With 3.1 it looks like themed tk support is now added so that could be an incentive. That and I silently troll python submitters and got the feeling 3.1 was what 3.0 was supposed to be ;-) so I been silently waking for 3.1 to go final before spending time with the 3 branch to learn the changes. In short if it's just you using your programs you have a lot of flexibility in your choice of branch to use. If you distribute then you are restricted by your end user branch sets even more. If you heavily use 3rd party modules you are tied down further. So work backwards and decide what is it you at writting, what features internal and external are you using or desire to use and who will consume your program. Then you'll have your answer or pretty close to it. Cheers, PN On 08/03/2009, Martin P. Hellwig wrote: > R. David Murray wrote: > >> Comparing Python releases to Windows releases is...disturbing :) > That was why I was very carefully in this example for choosing 2000 :-) > > -- > mph > -- > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list > -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: should i move on to python3
R. David Murray wrote: Comparing Python releases to Windows releases is...disturbing :) That was why I was very carefully in this example for choosing 2000 :-) -- mph -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: should i move on to python3
"Martin P. Hellwig" wrote: > Wensui Liu wrote: > > i started learning python with earlier version and am happy with it > > and all related packages, such as scipy, pywin, and so on. > > right now, i am wondering if i should move to python3. if i do, will > > all packages working on earlier version still work in python3? this is > > my major concern. > > I wouldn't bet on it > > > my another question is how many python users will move to python3. > > Eventually all of them. > > > any insight? > > Well I don't have insight in the mind of the core developers, but I > think you could compare it with any other major software upgrade. > Think of it like people upgrading from windows NT4 to 2000, some > software works some not, some people are happy with NT4 others prefer to > keep up with current technology. Look at it like py3 is 2000 before the > first service pack, internally it works, could need some polishing but > that's about it. The things that don't work are more often caused by > third parties then the core development. Comparing Python releases to Windows releases is...disturbing :) > > thanks a lot. > > If you want to be more on the safe side, I would say wait for 3.2 or > even 3.3 . More specific, wait till the external module developers (the > ones you use) say it is stable on Py3 As of 3.1 (which fixes the speed problems of the new io package), I think the only reason not to move to python3 will be any dependency one might have on 3rd party packages that haven't themselves made the switch yet. Of course, that will be a big issue for some time to come for many people. -- R. David Murray http://www.bitdance.com -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: should i move on to python3
Wensui Liu wrote: i started learning python with earlier version and am happy with it and all related packages, such as scipy, pywin, and so on. right now, i am wondering if i should move to python3. if i do, will all packages working on earlier version still work in python3? this is my major concern. I wouldn't bet on it my another question is how many python users will move to python3. Eventually all of them. any insight? Well I don't have insight in the mind of the core developers, but I think you could compare it with any other major software upgrade. Think of it like people upgrading from windows NT4 to 2000, some software works some not, some people are happy with NT4 others prefer to keep up with current technology. Look at it like py3 is 2000 before the first service pack, internally it works, could need some polishing but that's about it. The things that don't work are more often caused by third parties then the core development. thanks a lot. If you want to be more on the safe side, I would say wait for 3.2 or even 3.3 . More specific, wait till the external module developers (the ones you use) say it is stable on Py3 -- mph -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
should i move on to python3
i started learning python with earlier version and am happy with it and all related packages, such as scipy, pywin, and so on. right now, i am wondering if i should move to python3. if i do, will all packages working on earlier version still work in python3? this is my major concern. my another question is how many python users will move to python3. any insight? thanks a lot. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
