date:20141217

Please allow me to dissent.  I resisted DT shifters like the plague, but 
three things brought me around to friction DT.  You may or may not agree 
with my rationale:

1.  Simplicity.  Other than having no shifters at all, DT friction is the 
simplest approach.
2.  Relatedly, reliability in all respects.  You go from a system with 
moving cable housing to one in which the geometric relationship of the 
shifters and the derailers is fixed, a function of the bike frame.  
Consequently, there is no way in which movement of the handlebars can have 
any effect on shifting, ever.
3.  Finally, aesthetics.  For me, and perhaps only me, there is something 
about DT shifters.  I think it started with this photograph many years 
ago:  http://sheldonbrown.com/org//brown/pages/20browndampierreclose.htm.  
It just seemed somehow *perfect*.

I've used barcons, and just about everything else, but I like DT shifters. 
So there.

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 5:10:16 AM UTC-5, ascpgh wrote:

 I'm with you Glen. When DT shifters were it, I was enjoying mountain 
 biking and my shifters right there on the bar, by the brake levers. I have 
 longer legs than my torso would dictate to production frame  and my 60 cm 
 road bike always had me feeling a little unsteady; those shifters were so 
 far down there and the old school 42/52 rings with not much range of the 
 five cogs didn't really reward those shifts either. Brifters drew me back 
 and facilitated longer trips not limited by the mental fatigue, until 
 things broke. That was more maddening than the wobbliness of reaching to 
 what felt like my ankles to get another gear. 

 Bar ends came to me via my Bridgestone RB-1 and an XO-2. That RB paved the 
 way to my Rambouillet and its bar ends, switched into friction mode ever 
 since. Aesthetes abhor the housing paths if a bar bag is intended. Me, I'll 
 figure it out. I can't imagine greater happiness of the form and function. 

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 1:38:43 AM UTC-5, Glen wrote:

 As a tall guy I never liked shifters on the down tube, way too far to 
 reach. It took brifters to introduce me to bar ends, now i'm sold


 On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 10:09:21 PM UTC-7, lungimsam wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable? 

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more 
 difficult and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into 
 forearms while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?



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[RBW] What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread ascpgh

Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
the extra bandwidth.

My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a lively 
tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull brakes, 
generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value of 
experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade wheels 
versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including many 
posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not reach 
reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

Andy Cheatham
Pittsburgh

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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread Michael Hechmer

I think it depends on the kind of riding you will be doing.  I used bar 
ends for the 13 years I commuted into work surrounded by rush hour traffic. 
 I liked the security of not leaving the handle bars or being far from the 
brake levers.  For a similar reason I use BEs on the tandem because the 
stoker doesn't like me to let go of the bars.   But since retiring, I have 
gradually moved all three of my singles back to DT.  Why?  Now most of my 
riding is just for joy, and the terrain here in VT is very rolling, which 
rewards fast double shifts.  Unless I'm on the drops I can't do that with 
BEs but with DT I can reach down and move the levers in quick succession. 
 DT also seems to be more aggressive and suffers less from cable stretch. 
 OTOH BEs feel more relaxed and is the most intuitive, (move the lever up, 
move the chain up) so my wife prefers it.  DT requires teaching your hand 
where the lever is, but with a little practice it becomes pretty automatic.

Michael

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:09:21 AM UTC-5, lungimsam wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable? 

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult 
 and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms 
 while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?

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Re: [RBW] What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Eric Daume

I'm doing a 650B conversion of my '83 Trek 620, too much reading BQ, I
guess. Parts are already on the way.

I'm also thinking about ordering a custom Chinese titanium 29+ frame.

Eric

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 5:37 AM, ascpgh asc@gmail.com wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh

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Re: [RBW] Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...


On 12/17/2014 12:09 AM, lungimsam wrote:

If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting just as 
easy and enjoyable?


Maybe, maybe not.  For me, not.



Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult


Exactly.  For some people, when they drop their hand it falls on the DT 
lever.  With my setup, my hand is quite far away from the lever, and I 
have to bend down about as much as to reach a water bottle on the downtube.




and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms while 
pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time.


No, I haven't had that at all.   Easy to simulate: you know where the 
lever is going to be.  Practice putting your hand there while riding.




What's your experience been with DT shifting?



There are some things that are great: simple cable run, out of the way; 
looks good.  I have indexed DT levers on my porteur, which I shift 
infrequently and the location frees up the bar and lets me use inverse 
brake levers.  Think of it as similar to a Simple-One only no stick is 
required to shift, there's a handy DT lever for the purpose.


I hated it back in the day.  Not only was there the awkward reach, you 
also had to fiddle around with friction shifting.  I almost crashed one 
time when I hit a pothole while reaching over to shift -- made worse by 
the presence of my then 1 year old daughter on a baby seat at the time.


YMMV.  Plenty of people love them.


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Re: [RBW] In San Diego this week

2014-12-17 Thread Curtis McKenzie

Thursday is out for me. Next time it is.

Safe travels

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014, Tony DeFilippo vpi...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hey Curtis, dual bad news... I haven't found a bike and I'm not convinced
 I'll be wrapped from work by 530pm.  Thurs would be better for me but I'm
 still probably bike-less.  What do you think - next time?

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[RBW] Albas to noodles

2014-12-17 Thread Edwin W


'm going to swap out Albas for noodles. Thanks for the help so far and for 
these questions. 
I've never been a racer, always a rider and have loved my Albas for the last 
two years on my sam， but wanted a new bike and thought this was a cheaper way 
to go.  Intrigued by more positions, I'm going to try it out. 
After 20 miles I'm thinking I'll be back on Albas in a year, so I won't throw 
them away!

This cockpit change thing is fiddly. Some things:
Where do you put the rear derailer cable in relation to marks rack and Wald 
basket? Under? Behind?

Where do you run the brake cables in relation to the bars? If you took a cross 
section looking from the stem, would the cable be at 9, 730, or 6 o'clock for 
the right side? (Got that image?)

How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I cut it 
too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a little 
section of housing? Or will it buckle?

I am going to ride a hundred miles or at least fifty before I wrap them!
Learning by experimenting,

Edwin

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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

Agree on the grew up with DT shifting.  Of course have both and both are 
natural for me.  Current DT is on my go-fast - it's natural for me on that 
ride, though I do shift less often.  Never had a problem with my long 
spindly limbs.  I have bar ends on my utility bike with moustache cockpit, 
ride it in tougher hills, shift a lot and enjoy it.  

On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 11:09:21 PM UTC-6, lungimsam wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable? 

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult 
 and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms 
 while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?

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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

I use DT shifters in traffic (90% of my riding is commuting) so I don't think 
that's a factor for me.  Of course I do have arms like a gorilla, so reaching 
the shifters had never been a problem for me.

I probably shift less than I did with BE, Ergo, etc.  I do miss my old Command 
Shifters, but the installation of both varieties was inelegant.

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[RBW] Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread shawn m.

My Hunqapillar has barend shifters, and I really like them, except when I knock 
them against the doorframe getting the bike in and out of the garage. When I 
built up my Atlantis this fall, I went with downtube shifters mostly because of 
cost-containment. I like the clean lines, and I like how it mitigates my 
natural tendency to shift too often. But, that's ALL I like. The reach is just 
too much for me to feel comfortable with, and bar ends are going on in the 
spring. I like the look of downtube shifters, and the simplicity. The 
experience? Not so much.

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Re: [RBW] Re: I saw this article and thought of the PB Bikes debate

ebay bike parts scalper, who has Riv water bottles listed for $100.  
Teach your kids to suck it up?  Merry Christmas.  They'll have plenty of 
chances to learn that on their own.  

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:09:30 AM UTC-6, Joe Bernard wrote:

 What is PB Bikes?

 On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 8:39:33 PM UTC-8, Jim M. wrote:

 Maybe it's just winter grumpies, but this thread seems to be filled with 
 self-congratulatory self-righteousness, which, IMHO, is not particularly 
 Riv-ish.

 jim m
 wc ca



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Re: [RBW] Albas to noodles


On 12/17/2014 07:41 AM, Edwin W wrote:

How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I cut it 
too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a little 
section of housing? Or will it buckle?


In-line adjuster?

Best way to lengthen a cut-too-short cable is a new cable and learn from 
your mistake.


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Re: [RBW] Albas to noodles

2014-12-17 Thread Edwin W

Yes, Steve, I am learning, one job at a time.

Edwin

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 7:52:31 AM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:

 On 12/17/2014 07:41 AM, Edwin W wrote: 
  How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I 
 cut it too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a 
 little section of housing? Or will it buckle? 

 In-line adjuster? 

 Best way to lengthen a cut-too-short cable is a new cable and learn from 
 your mistake. 


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Re: [RBW] Albas to noodles

2014-12-17 Thread Minh

this is one of those things that's easier to see then to describe.  i'd 
suggest you troll the flickr groups and look at how others have done this, 
there are a few different options that work.

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 8:57:01 AM UTC-5, Edwin W wrote:

 Yes, Steve, I am learning, one job at a time.

 Edwin

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 7:52:31 AM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:

 On 12/17/2014 07:41 AM, Edwin W wrote: 
  How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I 
 cut it too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a 
 little section of housing? Or will it buckle? 

 In-line adjuster? 

 Best way to lengthen a cut-too-short cable is a new cable and learn from 
 your mistake. 



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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread Minh

for me a huge factor is how much you actually shift, i found DT shifters 
much more livable after i got my single-speed. i find the reach a little 
far, but in many cases i just don't shift :)  

but i'm one of the people that love the look versus bar-end 
shifters--especially bar-ends where you exit the tape at the drops, just 
looks cleaner!

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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult 
and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms 
while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

What's your experience been with DT shifting?

I suppose height and dexterity are an issue but in all my years of DT 
shifting, I've never had any problem knocking my knees into my arms while 
shifting.

On the other hand, bar end shifters on my Hilsen did get in the way and 
also marred the top tube when the fork flipped over while parked at a stand.

The DT shifters on my custom Kellogg 
https://www.flickr.com/photos/57976152@N07/5462707215/ are a perfect 
reach for me.  The shorter distance between the shifters and ders make it 
easier to set up and maintain - and arguably a bit more efficient shifting, 
although I never experienced any deficiencies with the bar end function - 
just location. 

Another advantage to DT shifters is with practice you can execute front and 
rear chain shifts near simultaneously with one hand.  I suppose you could 
do that with bar ends, but you better not need a strong grip on the bar 
while doing so.

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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread Leslie

I think the 10-speed I had as a kid, had the shifters on the stem.   But 
after I switched to a mountain-bike in college, I had grip shifts, and 
wasn't on another bike for over 15 years.

When I built up my Ram, I went w/ the bar-ends on Noodles, was fine.  With 
my Bomba, went with bar-ends on my moustaches, was fine.   

But then when I got the canti-Rom

My Ram, I have a front rack and a rando box bag on the front, w/ a leading 
Edelux, fenders;  the Bomba also has fenders, a front basket, lights, both 
of those bikes are 'kitted out'.   The canti-Rom, I wanted to go for 
something more simple.

Since it has cantis on it, I went w/ larger tires on it, and as I was 
reusing my wider Noodles, I left the interrupters on it.   But it's a much 
more simple bike, just a tool-roll and a bell as the only 'extras' on 
it.In keeping it simple, I thought I'd try DT's on it. 

Ya know, I'm now riding it more than the other two.   Still love the other 
two:  if I was going for a LONG ride, I'd grab the Ram, and if I was going 
to run errands, or camping, the Bomba is the bike...  But for just a 
quick jaunt on the greenbelt, it's the Rom that I grab.   

I will say, I don't shift a lot, w/ DT...I get into gear, and stay in 
it longer   but, the gearing's there when needed.



FWIW


-L


On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:09:21 AM UTC-5, lungimsam wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable? 

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult 
 and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms 
 while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?

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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

Finally going to try out a kick back hub for an urban porteur.  Should be 
on the streets around February.  

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:37:11 AM UTC-6, ascpgh wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a 
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull 
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value 
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade 
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including 
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not 
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh


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[RBW] Albas to noodles

2014-12-17 Thread true

 Edwin W  wrote:
How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I cut it 
too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a little 
section of housing? Or will it buckle?




I have used these Jagwire Aluminum Housing Connectors a few times with success.


http://bikeline.com/product/jagwire-aluminum-housing-connectors-188236-1.htm

Paul in Dallas

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Re: [RBW] Albas to noodles

2014-12-17 Thread cyclotourist

Definitely cheaper than a new bike... I think I spend more time
fiddling with bike setups than riding!!!

I run cables behind racks/baskets.

For brake cables, I tend to run them more at around a 10 or 11 o'clock
position under the tape. That makes a nice little shelf for hands, and
puts them in line with interruptor levers (you absolutely have to try
those IMHO).

I've butted an extra cm or so of cable onto a too-short cable and it
worked find. YMMV of course, and Steve's in-line adjuster barrel was a
real good idea as well.

Have fun!

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 6:13 AM, Minh mgiangs...@gmail.com wrote:
 this is one of those things that's easier to see then to describe.  i'd
 suggest you troll the flickr groups and look at how others have done this,
 there are a few different options that work.


 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 8:57:01 AM UTC-5, Edwin W wrote:

 Yes, Steve, I am learning, one job at a time.

 Edwin

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 7:52:31 AM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:

 On 12/17/2014 07:41 AM, Edwin W wrote:
  How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I
  cut it too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a
  little section of housing? Or will it buckle?

 In-line adjuster?

 Best way to lengthen a cut-too-short cable is a new cable and learn from
 your mistake.

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Re: [RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Tim Gavin

A friend will braze on some rack and fender mounts (I will supervise and
hold his beer) to my Schwinn KOM.  Then I'm going to get the frame
powder-coated; I'm thinking clear coat to show off the lugs, maybe with a
light metal flake.

I'm also going to spread the rear to 135 mm from 130, and replace the
vintage 6-speed Uniglide wheels with some newer 8-speed ones.

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Matthew J matthewj...@gmail.com wrote:

 Finally going to try out a kick back hub for an urban porteur.  Should be
 on the streets around February.


 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:37:11 AM UTC-6, ascpgh wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh

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Re: [RBW] Re: I saw this article and thought of the PB Bikes debate

Deac, doesn't your father lavish you with $3000 bicycles?  

On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 8:18:37 AM UTC-6, Deacon Patrick wrote:

 Thank you, Peter! Now I'm even more thankful we have no TV and don't buy 
 plastic or electronic toys toys. 

 With abandon,
 Patrick


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Re: [RBW] It isn't winter yet

2014-12-17 Thread Jim Bronson

Because your public meta complaint has so much more value to the group?  I
started the PB Bikes thread which devolved into the anti-television thread
but I enjoyed it.  Sorry you didn't, but self-righteous is in the eye of
the beholder.  I rode my Rivendell custom 605 kilometers, or 376 miles last
weekend.  If you want to buy me lift tickets and gas to go ski I'll be
happy to stop posting and go do it.

Otherwise, please direct your complaints privately to the moderator.  That
is the appropriate way to handle it when the tenor of the group is not in
keeping with your expectations.

/snark off

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 12:36 AM, Glen glam...@gmail.com wrote:

 Normally around February Jim will chime in make a notice that the tone
 isn't in keeping with the topic of this list.

 Well it isn't even the Solstice and we have two threads that are beyond
 the norm for this group.

 The outright attack on the seller of the AHH is not in the spirit of this
 group and the self righteous I don't own a television thread has nothing
 to do with Rivendell bikes and those who ride them.

 Please stop.

 Go ride your bike or go skiing.

 Thank you,

 Glen

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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Will

General maintenance is my project. I finished refitting my son's 1983 Trek 
613. It now has bar-ends, better fenders, an Altus rear der. (very nice), 
Riv's bolt-on brakes (also very nice), a new Top-Line rear light to replace 
an older BM model, and a BM eyc (from Riv) for the front. It's an 
old-style sport-touring setup and he commutes with it. The dyno is a 
Shimano pre-built (from Harris) that's been running well for 3 years. He 
rides with lights on all the time. Also got him one of the Riv safety 
triangles. My son has been reticent with safety issues, like using helmets, 
but the Riv triangle changed all of that. He reports that cars now give him 
a lot of extra space when passing and he will no longer ride without the 
triangle. So this became a must-have for the family. We all ride with Riv 
triangles now. 

I added Tubus Logo Evo racks to our two mixtes (the TouringSore.com), put 
Top-Line (battery) rear lights on them, and roll-top hi-viz panniers. The 
set-up is great. I don't think many realize that Tubus, BM, and Ortlieb 
are co-designed. It's a profoundly impressive system. The lights are 
seriously good, the racks are seriously good, and the panniers 
attach/detach in seconds. I purchased Cygo Streaks for the mixtes from Riv. 
If you are looking for a great light that is simple to install and rather 
bright, and don't want to invest in a dynamo, these are definitely the 
ticket. They are cheap for the light they provide. Also added Riv's IRD 
thumbies to one of the mixtes, the other has the legendary Command units. 
The IRD thumbies are great. Like them more than bar-ends. 

Current project on the stand is #2 son's bike. I bought Riv's tektro cantis 
to replace some older cantis that are shot. Will also rework the drive 
train with an Altus, and a front der. to be determined. 

General thoughts: Riv's recommended parts never disappoint. The brakes and 
Cygos are great. The Altus is great. I do prefer the Tubus system to the 
Nitto rack-and-seat-bag system. But then... we park the bikes at public 
racks and easy on-off baggage is necessary for theft prevention. 

If the Tooth-Fairy dropped a pile of moolah on us. I think we'd all ride 
Riv-spec'd dynamo Cheviots with Tubus racks and Ortleib or Arkel panniers. 
That would be the supreme do-all bike. 

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:37:11 AM UTC-6, ascpgh wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a 
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull 
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value 
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade 
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including 
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not 
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh


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Re: [RBW] Re: I saw this article and thought of the PB Bikes debate

2014-12-17 Thread Deacon Patrick

I'm not sure how to respond to this question, Ron. Is it a serious 
question? How did you arrive at it based on anything I've written? The 
simple answer is No.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 7:46:48 AM UTC-7, Ron Mc wrote:

 Deac, doesn't your father lavish you with $3000 bicycles?  

 On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 8:18:37 AM UTC-6, Deacon Patrick wrote:

 Thank you, Peter! Now I'm even more thankful we have no TV and don't buy 
 plastic or electronic toys toys. 

 With abandon,
 Patrick



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Re: [RBW] What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Toby Whitfield

I am doing the same conversion! The 1983 Trek 620 is the last sport touring 
model year with side pull calipers, as far as I can tell. It is a nice frame, 
with decent clearance, though it looks like only 38mm tires with fenders will 
fit. I am still thinking about the wheels. I have some Mafac Raids and the rest 
of the parts. 

My other winter project is building up a Betty Foy for my wife. It just arrived 
yesterday. That might happen before the Trek. It is a really nice frame, though 
there are a couple of paint imperfections that I was disappointed with. One is 
on the heart cutout detail at the top of the seat tube, so very noticeable. Oh 
well - it was one of the sale frames and really very nice overall. 

I have figured out everything for the Betty Foy build except for the cranks. I 
have a sugino AT that would work well, but I was trying to work out chainring 
selection. I like the wide low double with chain guard that Riv sells, but 
can't find a chain guard for the 45 big ring size. 

Toby
Toronto

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[RBW] Re: Albas to noodles

2014-12-17 Thread David Hays

My Uncle Gust-who my Father referred to as 'a plumber's carpenter'- used to 
say 'I cut it three times and it was still too short'.
No one was hurt. 
We smile and learn. 
David


On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 7:41:47 AM UTC-5, Edwin W wrote:


 'm going to swap out Albas for noodles. Thanks for the help so far and for 
 these questions. 
 I've never been a racer, always a rider and have loved my Albas for the 
 last two years on my sam， but wanted a new bike and thought this was a 
 cheaper way to go.  Intrigued by more positions, I'm going to try it out. 
 After 20 miles I'm thinking I'll be back on Albas in a year, so I won't 
 throw them away! 

 This cockpit change thing is fiddly. Some things: 
 Where do you put the rear derailer cable in relation to marks rack and 
 Wald basket? Under? Behind? 

 Where do you run the brake cables in relation to the bars? If you took a 
 cross section looking from the stem, would the cable be at 9, 730, or 6 
 o'clock for the right side? (Got that image?) 

 How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I 
 cut it too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a 
 little section of housing? Or will it buckle? 

 I am going to ride a hundred miles or at least fifty before I wrap them! 
 Learning by experimenting, 

 Edwin

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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread George Schick

One major project this Winter is to jump into the ring with a @#$% 
crankset/BB overhaul, or changeout, or maybe a combination of the two.  If 
anything in the world could use a bit of standardization it would be this 
business of trying to match up BB spindle tapers and length with said 
requirements for them published by those who pedal (no pun intended) 
various cranksets.  On top of all that, I'm done with these so-called self 
extracting fixing bolts and going back to a good old crank puller that 
actually works.

Enough of that rant - the next project will be to boil a piece of leather 
and let it dry on a cylindrical surface in order to shape it into a nicely 
curved mud flap.  In order to keep in that way, I'm thinking of shellacking 
the tire side of the flap.  Anyone know how well shellac works with leather?


On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:37:11 AM UTC-6, ascpgh wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a 
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull 
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value 
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade 
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including 
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not 
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh


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[RBW] Re: The new cycling revolution starts NOW! With one custom bike part! (Modified Silver Shifter)

2014-12-17 Thread Johan Larsson

Nice work. I wasn't aware of that lever angle detail before, and have 
learned something new! Thanks!

Johan Larsson,
Sweden

On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 7:04:52 AM UTC+1, Bill Lindsay wrote:

 OK, that's a little hyperbolic, but I'm pretty excited.  I like downtube 
 shifters, and Silver downtube shifters are great.  I use Silvers and I use 
 the Suntour Sprints that Silvers copied.  They are *almost* perfect.  One 
 thing I like a teeny bit better is that the very last Shimano downtube 
 shifters had a neat little feature.  The left side shifter would not lay 
 flat, parallel with the downtube.  It had a built-in internal stop that 
 made it stop a bit early.  That way, when you reach through to grab that 
 left shifter with your right hand, it was sitting up high and was easier to 
 grab.  I always thought that was pretty slick.  

 The piece that causes Silvers, and Suntour, and Campy, and Gipiemme 
 shifters to stop parallel to the downtube was the same little piece.  It's 
 a flat piece of aluminum with a square hole in it, and a bent tooth in just 
 the right place.  I went ahead and worked out a design for a different base 
 plate piece that has the tooth repositioned to give my Silver shifters that 
 Shimano feature of grab-ability.  I had my brother-in-law work up a solid 
 model and I ordered a prototype from a machine shop.  I test installed it 
 tonight, and it works just like I planned it.  

 Photos prove I can overthink almost anything:   Silver 2.0 
 https://www.flickr.com/photos/45758191@N04/sets/72157649775913121/

 Now I'm looking into more cost effective manufacturing methods to see if 
 it's feasible to make a run of these for other downtube zealots to geek out 
 on.   


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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread Clayton.sf

One (to me) huge advantage is the fact that DT are fairly well protected 
whereas bar end shifters live in a fairly exposed place when it comes to 
crashing, leaning, falling over. With a little practice both work just fine.

Clayton, SF

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Re: [RBW] Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

It requires a slightly different technique, given that your hands don't
grasp the shifters in the same way. With BES I use my fist and palm to
shift, which gives very good control. With DTS it's my forefinger and
thumb, or rather the forefinger and the palm directly underneath this
finger, and the thumb; and this requires (until you get the habit) a more
conscious effort to shift decisively (as opposed to tentatively). But once
you get it, it works fine. BES remain easier, in the sense of being easier
to shift precisely.

As for reach (I ride frames from 57 to 60) that has never really been a
problem for me.

On Tue, Dec 16, 2014 at 10:09 PM, lungimsam john11.2...@gmail.com wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting
 just as easy and enjoyable?

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult
 and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms
 while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time.

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?

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*[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore
himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to
destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his
needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely
having the power to avoid work and live one’s life from birth to death in
electric light and to the tune of tinned music is not a reason for doing
so.”*
*
  -- George Orwell, Pleasure Spots*

*Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not money,
I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have
the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and
though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not
money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and
though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me
nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money
vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh
not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in
iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all
things, endureth all things. . . . And now abideth faith, hope, money,
these three; but the greatest of these is money. *
*
 -- George Orwell, Keep The Apidistra Flying*

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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

Yeah, the one bike (Fargo) with BES has a big wad of bar tape padding on
the top tube where the Silver shifters would otherwise contact the paint --
this tape is scarred from many contacts. Such contacts also annoyingly
shift the levers which is something I have to anticipate when I first get
on and go -- don't want to stand on the pedal and have the chain slam into
the wrong gear.

AND I broke a Silver shifter when the bike fell over ...

All that said, the BES are easier to shift precisely, which is good on
rough terrain.

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 9:10 AM, Clayton.sf clayton...@gmail.com wrote:

 One (to me) huge advantage is the fact that DT are fairly well protected
 whereas bar end shifters live in a fairly exposed place when it comes to
 crashing, leaning, falling over. With a little practice both work just fine.

 Clayton, SF

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By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
Other professional writing services.
http://www.resumespecialties.com/
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*
*[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore
himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to
destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his
needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely
having the power to avoid work and live one’s life from birth to death in
electric light and to the tune of tinned music is not a reason for doing
so.”*
*
  -- George Orwell, Pleasure Spots*

*Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not money,
I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have
the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and
though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not
money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and
though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me
nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money
vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh
not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in
iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all
things, endureth all things. . . . And now abideth faith, hope, money,
these three; but the greatest of these is money. *
*
 -- George Orwell, Keep The Apidistra Flying*

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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Kieran J

I hate threads like this. They get me scheming about projects I shouldn't 
even to begin to consider taking on.

KJ


On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 5:37:11 AM UTC-5, ascpgh wrote:

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[RBW] Re: I saw this article and thought of the PB Bikes debate

2014-12-17 Thread Phil Bickford

Thank You Joe

I'M THINKING I MISSED SOMETHING, oops,   caps off

My time fortunately is not that valuable it seems.  I need to get hep to 
read this group. PB Bikes. Mmmm, 

Re: [RBW] Re: I saw this article and thought of the PB Bikes debate
 What is PB Bikes?
  

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RE: [RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Allingham II, Thomas J

If you do try a kickback, I’d urge you to use one without a coaster brake – on 
my MB-2 Resurrectio, I used a 2-speed Sturmey Archer kickback with a coaster 
brake, and the braking results in shifting when I don’t want it to.  Otherwise 
I like the kickback hub a lot.

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Matthew J
Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:28 AM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

Finally going to try out a kick back hub for an urban porteur.  Should be on 
the streets around February.

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:37:11 AM UTC-6, ascpgh wrote:
Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through winter. 
The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the conditions, 
plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize that at this time 
every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to go with the 
anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for the extra 
bandwidth.

My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a lively 
tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull brakes, 
generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value of 
experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade wheels 
versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including many posting 
subjects and items in this project and admit that may not reach reality, but 
it's fun to have on the drawing board.

Andy Cheatham
Pittsburgh
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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

It occurs to me that the kind of handlebar you're using is also a factor.  
If you're using drops, DT is probably much more appealing than if you're 
using a sit-up handlebar of some sort.  I'm a drop-bar user, and so find DT 
shifters natural.  I expect if I ever shift to uprights, I'll want 
something closer to my hands--likely a 3-speed trigger arrangement.

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:17:27 AM UTC-5, Minh wrote:

 for me a huge factor is how much you actually shift, i found DT shifters 
 much more livable after i got my single-speed. i find the reach a little 
 far, but in many cases i just don't shift :)  

 but i'm one of the people that love the look versus bar-end 
 shifters--especially bar-ends where you exit the tape at the drops, just 
 looks cleaner!



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[RBW] The new cycling revolution starts NOW! With one custom bike part! (Modified Silver Shifter)

2014-12-17 Thread Bill

Well I still have one bike in the fleet with 'tubers and this looks like just 
the ticket.  At first glance I wondered why someone hadn't done these maybe 50 
years ago.  It's never too late. Great idea!

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Re: [RBW] It isn't winter yet

Hey I am one of the people who loves TV and my kid does too. I didn't take
any of the anti-tv stuff as preachy or self-righteousness. People live
their lives different ways and its interesting to hear about different
styles of parenting and living. And yes it does relate back to bikes
because I know for a lot of us riding is a family activity.

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 9:52 AM, Jim Bronson jim.bron...@gmail.com wrote:

 Because your public meta complaint has so much more value to the group?  I
 started the PB Bikes thread which devolved into the anti-television thread
 but I enjoyed it.  Sorry you didn't, but self-righteous is in the eye of
 the beholder.  I rode my Rivendell custom 605 kilometers, or 376 miles last
 weekend.  If you want to buy me lift tickets and gas to go ski I'll be
 happy to stop posting and go do it.

 Otherwise, please direct your complaints privately to the moderator.  That
 is the appropriate way to handle it when the tenor of the group is not in
 keeping with your expectations.

 /snark off

 On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 12:36 AM, Glen glam...@gmail.com wrote:

 Normally around February Jim will chime in make a notice that the tone
 isn't in keeping with the topic of this list.

 Well it isn't even the Solstice and we have two threads that are beyond
 the norm for this group.

 The outright attack on the seller of the AHH is not in the spirit of this
 group and the self righteous I don't own a television thread has nothing
 to do with Rivendell bikes and those who ride them.

 Please stop.

 Go ride your bike or go skiing.

 Thank you,

 Glen

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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

 I'm a drop-bar user, and so find DT shifters natural.  I expect if I ever 
shift to uprights, I'll want something closer to my hands--likely a 3-speed 
trigger arrangement.

Good points.  I had drops on the Hilsen referenced above.  My flat bar 
multi speed is a 1x6 matched to Paul Thumbies holding a Shimano bar end.

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 10:23:12 AM UTC-6, Andrew Marchant-Shapiro 
wrote:

 It occurs to me that the kind of handlebar you're using is also a factor.  
 If you're using drops, DT is probably much more appealing than if you're 
 using a sit-up handlebar of some sort.  I'm a drop-bar user, and so find DT 
 shifters natural.  I expect if I ever shift to uprights, I'll want 
 something closer to my hands--likely a 3-speed trigger arrangement.

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:17:27 AM UTC-5, Minh wrote:

 for me a huge factor is how much you actually shift, i found DT shifters 
 much more livable after i got my single-speed. i find the reach a little 
 far, but in many cases i just don't shift :)  

 but i'm one of the people that love the look versus bar-end 
 shifters--especially bar-ends where you exit the tape at the drops, just 
 looks cleaner!



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Re: [RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

 If you do try a kickback, I’d urge you to use one without a coaster brake 
– on my MB-2 Resurrectio, I used a 2-speed Sturmey Archer kickback with a 
coaster brake, and the braking results in  shifting when I don’t want it 
to.  Otherwise I like the kickback hub a lot.

Definitely a concern.  I sourced a Czech hub which is supposedly better 
than the other options out there.  Definitely better looking.  Will see how 
it works. 

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 10:21:02 AM UTC-6, Pudge wrote:

  If you do try a kickback, I’d urge you to use one without a coaster 
 brake – on my MB-2 Resurrectio, I used a 2-speed Sturmey Archer kickback 
 with a coaster brake, and the braking results in shifting when I don’t want 
 it to.  Otherwise I like the kickback hub a lot.

  

 *From:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com javascript: [mailto:
 rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com javascript:] *On Behalf Of *Matthew J
 *Sent:* Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:28 AM
 *To:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com javascript:
 *Subject:* [RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

  
  
 Finally going to try out a kick back hub for an urban porteur.  Should be 
 on the streets around February.  

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:37:11 AM UTC-6, ascpgh wrote:
  
 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
 the extra bandwidth.
  
  
  
 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a 
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull 
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value 
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade 
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including 
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not 
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.
  
  
  
 Andy Cheatham
  
 Pittsburgh
   
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 email) and any printout thereof.

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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread 'Mojo' via RBW Owners Bunch

I will join Andrew here, I love downtube friction shifting. Its simple with 
very fast derailer response to input. There is very little to go wrong. 
Even the entire cable is visible in case it starts to fail. Bar ends are 
great too just not Great. Its not as easy or as convenient as bar ends, by 
a gnat's ass. Just as bar ends aren't as convenient as brifters. Just how 
much convenience do we need? Are we men or are we Devo?! What's wrong with 
having to use a little more finesse?! ...Oh sorry... I feel better now.

All that said, I only have one bike of eight with downtube shifters. Its my 
LHT tank and sometimes I pull it down just because I feel like playing 
fretless. 

On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 10:09:21 PM UTC-7, lungimsam wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable? 

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult 
 and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms 
 while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?

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Re: [RBW] Re: I saw this article and thought of the PB Bikes debate

2014-12-17 Thread cyclotour...@gmail.com

Everyone in my family knows that PB stands for Princess Bubblegum!


On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 10:09:30 PM UTC-8, Joe Bernard wrote:

 What is PB Bikes?

 On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 8:39:33 PM UTC-8, Jim M. wrote:

 Maybe it's just winter grumpies, but this thread seems to be filled with 
 self-congratulatory self-righteousness, which, IMHO, is not particularly 
 Riv-ish.

 jim m
 wc ca



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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread RoadieRyan

Finishing a rebuild project - 1970s Torpado Alpha that has been dissembled 
for going on two months.  Need to clean and wax frame, rebuild the main 
bearings, clean up the components and then reassemble with new parts.   I 
find once I get going on the bearings the project starts to gather 
momentum.  http://ryansrebuilds.blogspot.com/ 

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 2:37:11 AM UTC-8, ascpgh wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a 
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull 
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value 
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade 
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including 
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not 
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh


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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread cyclotour...@gmail.com

Like many of the above replies, I have both set ups. I would say bar ends 
are better due to always being near at and (and I ride with my hands 
resting on them when I have Moustache bars). But, downtube shifters are 
fine on a bike you don't shift a whole bunch, and don't ride aggressively 
off road. Looks much cleaner which is why I have them on that bike.

On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 9:09:21 PM UTC-8, lungimsam wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable? 

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult 
 and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms 
 while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?

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RE: [RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Allingham II, Thomas J

1.  Another mixte rebuild for a charity auction.  This one is a Fuji Royale 
mixte (from, I think, 1981); quite a nice frame, repainted by Bruce at the 
Color Factory a tasteful Taxicab Yellow.  It will get the same build as in past 
years – 3-speed Sturmey drum brake rear and Sturmey drum brake front, laced to 
Ghisallo wooden rims in 650B, upright bars, and some kind of fancy chainguard 
and basket.  These builds have enough whiz-bang to them that they fetch good 
bids, and sometimes bidding wars.  And I have the problems worked out with 
these builds, so other than lacing the wheels, they don’t take me too long.

2.  Finish the build on my SS coupled Saluki, and get comfortable packing and 
unpacking it.

3.  I have two bikes that have been off the road for minor repairs or updates 
for nearly a year – time to get to them this winter.  My Bombadil gets a new 
Luxos set-up, and some new grips.  The Mystery Bike took a fall, and needs a 
new cork grip; while I’m at it I’ll change the brake levers and install a 
basket on the Mark’s rack.

4.  The downtube shifter thread has me curious – I’ve never ridden a downtube 
shifter-equipped bike.  So an old and somewhat beat-up but perfectly sound 
Gitane Tour de France with downtubers will move up in the queue – good to have 
a beater road bike, and it’s a snazzy purple color with foil decals, so, hey!

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Matthew J
Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:28 AM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

Finally going to try out a kick back hub for an urban porteur.  Should be on 
the streets around February.

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:37:11 AM UTC-6, ascpgh wrote:
Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through winter. 
The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the conditions, 
plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize that at this time 
every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to go with the 
anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for the extra 
bandwidth.

My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a lively 
tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull brakes, 
generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value of 
experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade wheels 
versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including many posting 
subjects and items in this project and admit that may not reach reality, but 
it's fun to have on the drawing board.

Andy Cheatham
Pittsburgh
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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

Those rubber shift lever covers were made for DT levers, but always seemed 
pretty pointless.  

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v728/bulldog1935/Raleigh/700c/aaaPA180005.jpg

However, they're absolutely necessary on bar end shifters to protect the 
top tube paint.  


On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 10:16:52 AM UTC-6, Patrick Moore wrote:

 Yeah, the one bike (Fargo) with BES has a big wad of bar tape padding on 
 the top tube where the Silver shifters would otherwise contact the paint -- 
 this tape is scarred from many contacts. Such contacts also annoyingly 
 shift the levers which is something I have to anticipate when I first get 
 on and go -- don't want to stand on the pedal and have the chain slam into 
 the wrong gear.

 AND I broke a Silver shifter when the bike fell over ...

 All that said, the BES are easier to shift precisely, which is good on 
 rough terrain.

 On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 9:10 AM, Clayton.sf clayt...@gmail.com 
 javascript: wrote:

 One (to me) huge advantage is the fact that DT are fairly well protected 
 whereas bar end shifters live in a fairly exposed place when it comes to 
 crashing, leaning, falling over. With a little practice both work just fine.

 Clayton, SF

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 By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
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 *[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore 
 himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to 
 destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his 
 needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely 
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 *Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not money, 
 I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have 
 the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and 
 though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not 
 money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and 
 though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me 
 nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money 
 vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh 
 not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in 
 iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all 
 things, endureth all things. . . . And now abideth faith, hope, money, 
 these three; but the greatest of these is money. *
 *  
  -- George Orwell, Keep The Apidistra Flying*
  

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Re: [RBW] Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread Michael Hechmer

Although I prefer DTs, I will say that BEs are clearly the most 
ergonomically designed.  Way more than SIS.  Truth is both system work fine 
and no one should sweat about it too much one way or the other.

Michael 

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 11:11:58 AM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:

 It requires a slightly different technique, given that your hands don't 
 grasp the shifters in the same way. With BES I use my fist and palm to 
 shift, which gives very good control. With DTS it's my forefinger and 
 thumb, or rather the forefinger and the palm directly underneath this 
 finger, and the thumb; and this requires (until you get the habit) a more 
 conscious effort to shift decisively (as opposed to tentatively). But once 
 you get it, it works fine. BES remain easier, in the sense of being easier 
 to shift precisely.

 As for reach (I ride frames from 57 to 60) that has never really been a 
 problem for me.

 On Tue, Dec 16, 2014 at 10:09 PM, lungimsam john1...@gmail.com 
 javascript: wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable?

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult 
 and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms 
 while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time.

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?

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 Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
 By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
 Other professional writing services.
 http://www.resumespecialties.com/
 www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
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 *
 *[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore 
 himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to 
 destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his 
 needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely 
 having the power to avoid work and live one’s life from birth to death in 
 electric light and to the tune of tinned music is not a reason for doing 
 so.”*
 *  
   -- George Orwell, Pleasure Spots*

 *Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not money, 
 I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have 
 the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and 
 though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not 
 money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and 
 though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me 
 nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money 
 vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh 
 not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in 
 iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all 
 things, endureth all things. . . . And now abideth faith, hope, money, 
 these three; but the greatest of these is money. *
 *  
  -- George Orwell, Keep The Apidistra Flying*
  

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[RBW] Re: Albas to noodles

2014-12-17 Thread dougP

Edwin:

See the photo linked on Bill's first post on Phase 2 Atlantis build.  
He's got a head on shot of the cables exiting the bar tape.  He also posted 
a photo of the bike with big front rack and a big front basket, so he had 
plenty of hardware to consider in his cable routing decision.  

On the question of cable housing, I fiddled a lot with bars last winter  
went thru lots of housing.  Just trying to fit a piece of housing between 
point A  point B often didn't work out when I ran the cables thru  
connected everything.  My solution was to start with a generous amount of 
extra housing and accept that I may have to dis-assemble the run a couple 
of times to trim the housing.  I run an Acorn Rando bag in front that 
influences where the cable can go.  Also, when you get 4 cables competing 
for space  their ideal run, some interference can happen.  Trial  error.  
Bring patience  a good housing cutter.

dougP

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:41:47 AM UTC-8, Edwin W wrote:


 'm going to swap out Albas for noodles. Thanks for the help so far and for 
 these questions. 
 I've never been a racer, always a rider and have loved my Albas for the 
 last two years on my sam， but wanted a new bike and thought this was a 
 cheaper way to go.  Intrigued by more positions, I'm going to try it out. 
 After 20 miles I'm thinking I'll be back on Albas in a year, so I won't 
 throw them away! 

 This cockpit change thing is fiddly. Some things: 
 Where do you put the rear derailer cable in relation to marks rack and 
 Wald basket? Under? Behind? 

 Where do you run the brake cables in relation to the bars? If you took a 
 cross section looking from the stem, would the cable be at 9, 730, or 6 
 o'clock for the right side? (Got that image?) 

 How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I 
 cut it too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a 
 little section of housing? Or will it buckle? 

 I am going to ride a hundred miles or at least fifty before I wrap them! 
 Learning by experimenting, 

 Edwin

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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread Michael Hechmer

I would disagree that brifters are more convenient than BEs.  I find 
pushing with my finger tips quite unnatural.
Michael

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 11:41:04 AM UTC-5, Mojo wrote:

 I will join Andrew here, I love downtube friction shifting. Its simple 
 with very fast derailer response to input. There is very little to go 
 wrong. Even the entire cable is visible in case it starts to fail. Bar ends 
 are great too just not Great. Its not as easy or as convenient as bar ends, 
 by a gnat's ass. Just as bar ends aren't as convenient as brifters. Just 
 how much convenience do we need? Are we men or are we Devo?! What's wrong 
 with having to use a little more finesse?! ...Oh sorry... I feel better now.

 All that said, I only have one bike of eight with downtube shifters. Its 
 my LHT tank and sometimes I pull it down just because I feel like playing 
 fretless. 

 On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 10:09:21 PM UTC-7, lungimsam wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable? 

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more difficult 
 and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into forearms 
 while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?



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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread Jim Bronson

I see lots of drop bar users with bar ends... Just saying.
On Dec 17, 2014 10:23 AM, Andrew Marchant-Shapiro 
marchantshap...@gmail.com wrote:

 It occurs to me that the kind of handlebar you're using is also a factor.
 If you're using drops, DT is probably much more appealing than if you're
 using a sit-up handlebar of some sort.  I'm a drop-bar user, and so find DT
 shifters natural.  I expect if I ever shift to uprights, I'll want
 something closer to my hands--likely a 3-speed trigger arrangement.

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:17:27 AM UTC-5, Minh wrote:

 for me a huge factor is how much you actually shift, i found DT shifters
 much more livable after i got my single-speed. i find the reach a little
 far, but in many cases i just don't shift :)

 but i'm one of the people that love the look versus bar-end
 shifters--especially bar-ends where you exit the tape at the drops, just
 looks cleaner!

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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

I also love the subtle feel of pushing the bar end down with palm and 
everything shifting just like silk

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:04:48 PM UTC-6, Michael Hechmer wrote:

 I would disagree that brifters are more convenient than BEs.  I find 
 pushing with my finger tips quite unnatural.
 Michael

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 11:41:04 AM UTC-5, Mojo wrote:

 I will join Andrew here, I love downtube friction shifting. Its simple 
 with very fast derailer response to input. There is very little to go 
 wrong. Even the entire cable is visible in case it starts to fail. Bar ends 
 are great too just not Great. Its not as easy or as convenient as bar ends, 
 by a gnat's ass. Just as bar ends aren't as convenient as brifters. Just 
 how much convenience do we need? Are we men or are we Devo?! What's wrong 
 with having to use a little more finesse?! ...Oh sorry... I feel better now.

 All that said, I only have one bike of eight with downtube shifters. Its 
 my LHT tank and sometimes I pull it down just because I feel like playing 
 fretless. 

 On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 10:09:21 PM UTC-7, lungimsam wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable? 

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more 
 difficult and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into 
 forearms while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?



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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

Jim, have to agree with you about the obvious - no offense.  Bar ends and a 
moustache cockpit are just perfect.  I can see how stem shifters would be 
best with Albas and absolute sit-straight-up cycling.   I did, however, 
hunt down Microshift 9-speed barcons for my daughter's first drop-bar bike, 
because I didn't want her reaching into the wheel to shift, and she's very 
happy with them.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v728/bulldog1935/Raleigh/Fuji/aaP6240002.jpg


On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:12:20 PM UTC-6, Jim Bronson wrote:

 I see lots of drop bar users with bar ends... Just saying.
 On Dec 17, 2014 10:23 AM, Andrew Marchant-Shapiro marchan...@gmail.com 
 javascript: wrote:

 It occurs to me that the kind of handlebar you're using is also a 
 factor.  If you're using drops, DT is probably much more appealing than if 
 you're using a sit-up handlebar of some sort.  I'm a drop-bar user, and so 
 find DT shifters natural.  I expect if I ever shift to uprights, I'll want 
 something closer to my hands--likely a 3-speed trigger arrangement.

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:17:27 AM UTC-5, Minh wrote:

 for me a huge factor is how much you actually shift, i found DT shifters 
 much more livable after i got my single-speed. i find the reach a little 
 far, but in many cases i just don't shift :)  

 but i'm one of the people that love the look versus bar-end 
 shifters--especially bar-ends where you exit the tape at the drops, just 
 looks cleaner!

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[RBW] Re: Albas to noodles

2014-12-17 Thread Bill Lindsay

How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I 
cut it too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a 
little section of housing? Or will it buckle? 

Edwin

I assume you are talking about proper shift cable housing, the stuff with 
parallel wires running longitudinally.  You can NOT but two pieces of that 
housing end to end.  It absolutely will buckle.  However, there is a 
double-ended ferrule that is made specifically to splice two bits of shift 
housing together, end-to-end.  

Double-Ended Ferrule 
http://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=44950category=7

On my Atlantis Build I was using RED housing, in a prepackaged set.  I 
wanted to run the shift housing all the way under the tape, and sure enough 
the pre-cut length of RED shift housing wasn't long enough.  I searched 
through my small-parts bin and couldn't find a double ended ferrule, so I 
switched out to the BLACK shift housing that I have in bulk.  I briefly 
considered making my own double sided ferrule:  Put a normal ferrule on 
both ends and then cut a length of metal tubing that has just the right 
I.D. to hold those two ferrules in-line with one another.  I was going to 
hide that splice under the bar tape.  I decided that would be a little too 
janky of a mechanical downgrade in exchange for a small additional run of 
RED housing, and decided against it.

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:41:47 AM UTC-8, Edwin W wrote:


 'm going to swap out Albas for noodles. Thanks for the help so far and for 
 these questions. 
 I've never been a racer, always a rider and have loved my Albas for the 
 last two years on my sam， but wanted a new bike and thought this was a 
 cheaper way to go.  Intrigued by more positions, I'm going to try it out. 
 After 20 miles I'm thinking I'll be back on Albas in a year, so I won't 
 throw them away! 

 This cockpit change thing is fiddly. Some things: 
 Where do you put the rear derailer cable in relation to marks rack and 
 Wald basket? Under? Behind? 

 Where do you run the brake cables in relation to the bars? If you took a 
 cross section looking from the stem, would the cable be at 9, 730, or 6 
 o'clock for the right side? (Got that image?) 

 How do you lengthen cable and housing. That's kind of a joke, because I 
 cut it too short, but if you have a little extra cable CAN you throw in a 
 little section of housing? Or will it buckle? 

 I am going to ride a hundred miles or at least fifty before I wrap them! 
 Learning by experimenting, 

 Edwin

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Re: [RBW] What's your winter project?

Eric: please report on the Chinese made 29er frame.

Matthew: Ditto on the kickback.

I keep mulling the alternatives of a S3X, a kickback, or a serendipitous TF
find for extra wheels for my Rivendell fixies.

With a kickback, incidentally, I'd want the coaster model, since I don't
want to have to install a rear caliper on the fixies. I think.

My own winter project is to finally get around to installing the new
Berthouds on the Riv commuter. Maybe even this afternoon!

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Re: [RBW] PSA: Are you missing a large yellow Albatrossed A. Homer Hilsen ?

2014-12-17 Thread Chris Chen

Skate Or Die says you're full of it

On Tue, Dec 16, 2014 at 10:18 PM, Aaron Young 1ce...@gmail.com wrote:

 Welp, looks like I'm going to have to start rockin more stuff. Ah,
 forget it. I'll be honest - deep down I'm just an Un-Rocker.

 -Aaron Un-Rockin' 4 Life Young
 The Dalles, OR

 On Tuesday, December 16, 2014, Bill Lindsay tapebu...@gmail.com wrote:

 Turns out this really is Emil, former Riv Employee, actually selling his
 personal bike, legitimately.  It's a good deal, snap it up if you want a
 56cm 650B hilsen that happens to be running 700c wheels and short reach
 brakes.

 On Monday, December 15, 2014 2:20:03 PM UTC-8, Bill Lindsay wrote:

 A bunch of circumstantial evidence and my Spidey Sense tells me this
 Large Albatrossed Custom Painted A Homer Hilsen is not being sold by the
 original owner:

 http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/4802051500.html


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[RBW] Parts Purge Continues

More stuff for sale, Nitto lugged seatpost, usual insertion marks, looks
great. A true piece of bike jewelry. $110 shipped. I will be parting out my
too big for me 61cm Soma Grand Randonneur tonight, Riv wheels, typical Riv
build. Its a lovely bike but the extension above the seattube is just a
hair too high and even with the seat slammed the saddle height is more
than what I like. Paypal, lower 48. Thanks all

Peter

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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

 because I didn't want her reaching into the wheel to shift

What set up would lead to this?

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:27:01 PM UTC-6, Ron Mc wrote:

 Jim, have to agree with you about the obvious - no offense.  Bar ends and 
 a moustache cockpit are just perfect.  I can see how stem shifters would be 
 best with Albas and absolute sit-straight-up cycling.   I did, however, 
 hunt down Microshift 9-speed barcons for my daughter's first drop-bar bike, 
 because I didn't want her reaching into the wheel to shift, and she's very 
 happy with them.


 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v728/bulldog1935/Raleigh/Fuji/aaP6240002.jpg


 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:12:20 PM UTC-6, Jim Bronson wrote:

 I see lots of drop bar users with bar ends... Just saying.
 On Dec 17, 2014 10:23 AM, Andrew Marchant-Shapiro marchan...@gmail.com 
 wrote:

 It occurs to me that the kind of handlebar you're using is also a 
 factor.  If you're using drops, DT is probably much more appealing than if 
 you're using a sit-up handlebar of some sort.  I'm a drop-bar user, and so 
 find DT shifters natural.  I expect if I ever shift to uprights, I'll want 
 something closer to my hands--likely a 3-speed trigger arrangement.

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:17:27 AM UTC-5, Minh wrote:

 for me a huge factor is how much you actually shift, i found DT 
 shifters much more livable after i got my single-speed. i find the reach a 
 little far, but in many cases i just don't shift :)  

 but i'm one of the people that love the look versus bar-end 
 shifters--especially bar-ends where you exit the tape at the drops, just 
 looks cleaner!

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[RBW] Re: Parts Purge Continues

2014-12-17 Thread Shoji Takahashi

Hi Peter,
Just a thought on the Soma GR-- perhaps you used a saddle that's relatively 
tall? I think Brooks saddles sit higher (i.e., you need to put the seat 
post lower) than some other saddles. 

For example, look at this comparison on Ocean Air Cycles (4th photo down):
http://oceanaircycles.com/2011/06/23/saddle-comparison-brooks-b17-swift-and-berthoud-touring/

If the Soma GR is otherwise nice, maybe try a different saddle with lower 
height?

shoji



On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 1:51:18 PM UTC-5, Peter M wrote:

 More stuff for sale, Nitto lugged seatpost, usual insertion marks, looks 
 great. A true piece of bike jewelry. $110 shipped. I will be parting out my 
 too big for me 61cm Soma Grand Randonneur tonight, Riv wheels, typical Riv 
 build. Its a lovely bike but the extension above the seattube is just a 
 hair too high and even with the seat slammed the saddle height is more 
 than what I like. Paypal, lower 48. Thanks all

 Peter


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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

hi Matthew, you calling me out?  I didn't want my 12-year old daughter to 
deal with downtube shifters.  If you think different I'm happy for you.  

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:52:37 PM UTC-6, Matthew J wrote:

  because I didn't want her reaching into the wheel to shift

 What set up would lead to this?

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:27:01 PM UTC-6, Ron Mc wrote:

 Jim, have to agree with you about the obvious - no offense.  Bar ends and 
 a moustache cockpit are just perfect.  I can see how stem shifters would be 
 best with Albas and absolute sit-straight-up cycling.   I did, however, 
 hunt down Microshift 9-speed barcons for my daughter's first drop-bar bike, 
 because I didn't want her reaching into the wheel to shift, and she's very 
 happy with them.


 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v728/bulldog1935/Raleigh/Fuji/aaP6240002.jpg


 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:12:20 PM UTC-6, Jim Bronson wrote:

 I see lots of drop bar users with bar ends... Just saying.
 On Dec 17, 2014 10:23 AM, Andrew Marchant-Shapiro 
 marchan...@gmail.com wrote:

 It occurs to me that the kind of handlebar you're using is also a 
 factor.  If you're using drops, DT is probably much more appealing than if 
 you're using a sit-up handlebar of some sort.  I'm a drop-bar user, and so 
 find DT shifters natural.  I expect if I ever shift to uprights, I'll want 
 something closer to my hands--likely a 3-speed trigger arrangement.

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:17:27 AM UTC-5, Minh wrote:

 for me a huge factor is how much you actually shift, i found DT 
 shifters much more livable after i got my single-speed. i find the reach 
 a 
 little far, but in many cases i just don't shift :)  

 but i'm one of the people that love the look versus bar-end 
 shifters--especially bar-ends where you exit the tape at the drops, just 
 looks cleaner!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Parts Purge Continues

That is a good idea but I really like my saddle and setup and rather not
suit my needs around the bike, if you know what I mean. Plus the GR has a
nice lightweight tubeset which doesn't exactly mesh well with my largish
body. It was a nice side project but alas I yam what I yam, a big dude with
short legs

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 1:58 PM, Shoji Takahashi shoji.takaha...@gmail.com
wrote:

Hi Peter,
Just a thought on the Soma GR-- perhaps you used a saddle that's
relatively tall? I think Brooks saddles sit higher (i.e., you need to put
the seat post lower) than some other saddles.

For example, look at this comparison on Ocean Air Cycles (4th photo down):

http://oceanaircycles.com/2011/06/23/saddle-comparison-brooks-b17-swift-and-berthoud-touring/

If the Soma GR is otherwise nice, maybe try a different saddle with lower
height?

shoji

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 1:51:18 PM UTC-5, Peter M wrote:

More stuff for sale, Nitto lugged seatpost, usual insertion marks, looks
great. A true piece of bike jewelry. $110 shipped. I will be parting out my
too big for me 61cm Soma Grand Randonneur tonight, Riv wheels, typical Riv
build. Its a lovely bike but the extension above the seattube is just a
hair too high and even with the seat slammed the saddle height is more
than what I like. Paypal, lower 48. Thanks all

Peter

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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Kyle Brooks

I also have been planning a Trek 620 project -- though mine is a 1984 
model, with canti brakes. I was just starting to pick up some parts for it 
(I got it as a frame and fork alone) when my water heater ruptured. That 
plus a fairly large car repair bill may have put the project on hold, 
unfortunately.

Kyle Brooks
Akron, OH

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 5:37:11 AM UTC-5, ascpgh wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a 
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull 
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value 
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade 
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including 
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not 
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh


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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

Not calling you out, sincerely did not follow.  

Shifting is personal.  I have no say - nor want any - as to what others do. 
 

However on most bikes the rider's hand is as close to the wheel at the 
bottom of drop bars as at a down tube shifter.

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 1:10:36 PM UTC-6, Ron Mc wrote:

 hi Matthew, you calling me out?  I didn't want my 12-year old daughter to 
 deal with downtube shifters.  If you think different I'm happy for you.  

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:52:37 PM UTC-6, Matthew J wrote:

  because I didn't want her reaching into the wheel to shift

 What set up would lead to this?

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:27:01 PM UTC-6, Ron Mc wrote:

 Jim, have to agree with you about the obvious - no offense.  Bar ends 
 and a moustache cockpit are just perfect.  I can see how stem shifters 
 would be best with Albas and absolute sit-straight-up cycling.   I did, 
 however, hunt down Microshift 9-speed barcons for my daughter's first 
 drop-bar bike, because I didn't want her reaching into the wheel to shift, 
 and she's very happy with them.


 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v728/bulldog1935/Raleigh/Fuji/aaP6240002.jpg


 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:12:20 PM UTC-6, Jim Bronson wrote:

 I see lots of drop bar users with bar ends... Just saying.
 On Dec 17, 2014 10:23 AM, Andrew Marchant-Shapiro 
 marchan...@gmail.com wrote:

 It occurs to me that the kind of handlebar you're using is also a 
 factor.  If you're using drops, DT is probably much more appealing than 
 if 
 you're using a sit-up handlebar of some sort.  I'm a drop-bar user, and 
 so 
 find DT shifters natural.  I expect if I ever shift to uprights, I'll 
 want 
 something closer to my hands--likely a 3-speed trigger arrangement.

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 9:17:27 AM UTC-5, Minh wrote:

 for me a huge factor is how much you actually shift, i found DT 
 shifters much more livable after i got my single-speed. i find the reach 
 a 
 little far, but in many cases i just don't shift :)  

 but i'm one of the people that love the look versus bar-end 
 shifters--especially bar-ends where you exit the tape at the drops, just 
 looks cleaner!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...


On 12/17/2014 01:52 PM, Matthew J wrote:

 because I didn't want her reaching into the wheel to shift

What set up would lead to this?


The point is, there is no downtube shifter setup that would require 
anyone to reach into the wheel.  In fact, you aren't anywhere even close 
to the wheel.   Now perhaps it might seem that way.  Does it seem that 
you are in danger of reaching into the wheel to retrieve a water bottle?


And I say this as a person who doesn't like, and even back in the day 
didn't like downtube shifters.


Fair's fair.  It's perfectly fine to say you don't like 'em without 
having to point to exaggerated, fancied dangers as a reason for not 
liking them.(Same's true WRT people who don't like bar end shifters: 
it's OK to not like them just because.)


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[RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread George Schick

I prefer DT shifters, too, and agree with Andrew's 1-2-3 items along with 
other positive replies on the list.  Like others have experienced, I grew 
up with DT's and just got used to them.  Bar-con's were the next 
evolutionary step, but I never cared much for them for some of the reasons 
listed in this thread along with another reason that I don't think I've 
seen mentioned yet:  you have to shift the front and rear by using two 
separate hands.  Plus, if you're used to riding with hands on the brake 
lever hoods, as I assume most of us are, you still have to reach down to 
the end of the drops with one hand or the other. With the DT's only one 
hand is required to do all the shifting - and you only reach down once.  My 
current road bike setup has an indexed DT on the right side and a friction 
DT on the left (since the front is only a double plateau).

I have had no experience with brifters, but it seems like the people I've 
ridden with who have them are always shifting back and forth all the time, 
which seems superfluous.  As others have said, I more or less learned to 
stay in one or two gears, appropriate for the wind and terrain, and just 
stand up when starting from a stop or climbing.  Now, I will say that when 
doing heavy duty off-road riding on a MTB it is nice to have shifters on 
the bar, but the one I own does not have bar-cons, but instead a pair of 
triggers mounted right next to the brake lever that you push to move the 
gear up or down.  And those do work well.


On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:32:28 AM UTC-6, Andrew Marchant-Shapiro 
wrote:

 Please allow me to dissent.  I resisted DT shifters like the plague, but 
 three things brought me around to friction DT.  You may or may not agree 
 with my rationale:

 1.  Simplicity.  Other than having no shifters at all, DT friction is the 
 simplest approach.
 2.  Relatedly, reliability in all respects.  You go from a system with 
 moving cable housing to one in which the geometric relationship of the 
 shifters and the derailers is fixed, a function of the bike frame.  
 Consequently, there is no way in which movement of the handlebars can have 
 any effect on shifting, ever.
 3.  Finally, aesthetics.  For me, and perhaps only me, there is something 
 about DT shifters.  I think it started with this photograph many years 
 ago:  http://sheldonbrown.com/org//brown/pages/20browndampierreclose.htm.  
 It just seemed somehow *perfect*.

 I've used barcons, and just about everything else, but I like DT shifters. 
 So there.

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 5:10:16 AM UTC-5, ascpgh wrote:

 I'm with you Glen. When DT shifters were it, I was enjoying mountain 
 biking and my shifters right there on the bar, by the brake levers. I have 
 longer legs than my torso would dictate to production frame  and my 60 cm 
 road bike always had me feeling a little unsteady; those shifters were so 
 far down there and the old school 42/52 rings with not much range of the 
 five cogs didn't really reward those shifts either. Brifters drew me back 
 and facilitated longer trips not limited by the mental fatigue, until 
 things broke. That was more maddening than the wobbliness of reaching to 
 what felt like my ankles to get another gear. 

 Bar ends came to me via my Bridgestone RB-1 and an XO-2. That RB paved 
 the way to my Rambouillet and its bar ends, switched into friction mode 
 ever since. Aesthetes abhor the housing paths if a bar bag is intended. Me, 
 I'll figure it out. I can't imagine greater happiness of the form and 
 function. 

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 1:38:43 AM UTC-5, Glen wrote:

 As a tall guy I never liked shifters on the down tube, way too far to 
 reach. It took brifters to introduce me to bar ends, now i'm sold


 On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 10:09:21 PM UTC-7, lungimsam wrote:

 If I love friction  bar end shifting, will I find friction DT shifting 
 just as easy and enjoyable? 

 Never done it before, and seems like the reach may make it more 
 difficult and looks like there's a big potential for knees banging into 
 forearms while pedalling and reaching down to shift  at same time. 

 What's your experience been with DT shifting?



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[RBW] Re: New Cheviot

2014-12-17 Thread Cecily Walker

Your photos really do that colour justice. Best ones I've seen yet. Happy 
riding!

On Friday, December 12, 2014 5:29:08 PM UTC-8, Kellie Stapleton wrote:

 My new luscious green Cheviot I built up about 2 weeks ago!


 https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-k4qd53iE85s/VIuVx3NKPlI/AOE/nDEePkttHKk/s1600/November%2B27%2C%2B2014_untitled_1608.jpg


 https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-mVMkj2JjiM8/VIuV1HJQyvI/AOM/YXRaWUPX03c/s1600/November%2B27%2C%2B2014_untitled_1614.jpg


 https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-FNVHczYl7WU/VIuV5P_80eI/AOU/EGBb89BJ3-A/s1600/November%2B27%2C%2B2014_untitled_1619.jpg


 https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ezmaQIkeaKI/VIuV8zC9IQI/AOc/iuVU0kfIrRE/s1600/November%2B27%2C%2B2014_untitled_1620.jpg


 https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-WXvW45uwk18/VIuWADyVV3I/AOk/wqpmMZsJmew/s1600/November%2B27%2C%2B2014_untitled_1621.jpg


 https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-m5pSv2neeCY/VIuWDkhe7aI/AOs/4dNZOA8MGFc/s1600/November%2B27%2C%2B2014_untitled_1623.jpg


 https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-mj3yPTGctPw/VIuVsO_YSQI/AN8/YWH8KbwWCpQ/s1600/November%2B27%2C%2B2014_untitled_1602.jpg


 https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-F8gUXYXlIqk/VIuVnVcZQ-I/AN0/8zD0Zn1B0PA/s1600/November%2B27%2C%2B2014_untitled_1597.jpg



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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...


On 12/17/2014 02:44 PM, George Schick wrote:
Plus, if you're used to riding with hands on the brake lever hoods, as 
I assume most of us are, you still have to reach down to the end of 
the drops with one hand or the other. With the DT's only one hand is 
required to do all the shifting - and you only reach down once. 


Let me take issue with this.  When I say reach down to get at a 
downtube shifter, I mean not only extend the arm and the hand, but also 
bend at the waist, tipping the head down towards the ground. It's a 
*reach.*  (This varies by frame size, arm length, etc: some people 
simply drop their hand and it lands right on the shift lever, no body 
movement involved.  I have a big frame and relatively short arms; for me 
it is a big reach.)


Unless they have a grotesquely incorrectly sized handlebar and stem, 
nobody needs to *reach* that way to get their hand on the end of the 
handle bar.  Yes you do have to move your hand.  No you do not have to 
extend your arm or bend at the waist.  Or, if you do, you'd really 
better change your stem and your handlebars.



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[RBW] Re: Parts Purge Continues

Ok, seatpost is spoken for. I have a set of paul brakes brand new with
upgraded kool stop mountain pads, front neo retro, rear touring.
$125 for a bikes worth. Will post more as I find more. Thanks all

Peter

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 1:51 PM, Goshen Peter uscpeter11...@gmail.com
wrote:

 More stuff for sale, Nitto lugged seatpost, usual insertion marks, looks
 great. A true piece of bike jewelry. $110 shipped. I will be parting out my
 too big for me 61cm Soma Grand Randonneur tonight, Riv wheels, typical Riv
 build. Its a lovely bike but the extension above the seattube is just a
 hair too high and even with the seat slammed the saddle height is more
 than what I like. Paypal, lower 48. Thanks all

 Peter


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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread cyclotour...@gmail.com

Right now I'm most of the way through converting our Trek T200 Tandem from 
drop bars to uprights. It's an eight speed w/ Sachs brifters, and I'm 
moving to Albatross with thumbshifters and MTB brake levers up front, and a 
Dove bar in the back. Building it with used parts from the parts bin, this 
list (thanks!), and ebay. I've already rode around the block a bit and it's 
a GREAT improvement in an already good tandem. Working on getting some 
Boscos which would give me a bit more bar height, but pretty happy with the 
Albas from the short bit I tried.

The other winter project is to actually ride the thing with my stoker!!!


On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 11:22:17 AM UTC-8, Kyle Brooks wrote:

 I also have been planning a Trek 620 project -- though mine is a 1984 
 model, with canti brakes. I was just starting to pick up some parts for it 
 (I got it as a frame and fork alone) when my water heater ruptured. That 
 plus a fairly large car repair bill may have put the project on hold, 
 unfortunately.

 Kyle Brooks
 Akron, OH

 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 5:37:11 AM UTC-5, ascpgh wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a 
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull 
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value 
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade 
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including 
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not 
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh



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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Philip Williamson

I'm putting my Gravel Roadster https://flic.kr/p/duQUJZ back together. It 
has a taller Brooks saddle, and I may put longer cranks and VP-001s on it, 
to get the seatpost min insertion line back inside the frame. 

Or give it to the child. 

Philip
www.biketinker.com

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 2:37:11 AM UTC-8, ascpgh wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a 
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull 
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value 
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade 
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including 
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not 
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh


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[RBW] Re: Parts Purge Continues

Brushed silver, sorry.
On Dec 17, 2014 3:03 PM, Goshen Peter uscpeter11...@gmail.com wrote:

 Ok, seatpost is spoken for. I have a set of paul brakes brand new with
 upgraded kool stop mountain pads, front neo retro, rear touring.
 $125 for a bikes worth. Will post more as I find more. Thanks all

 Peter

 On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 1:51 PM, Goshen Peter uscpeter11...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 More stuff for sale, Nitto lugged seatpost, usual insertion marks, looks
 great. A true piece of bike jewelry. $110 shipped. I will be parting out my
 too big for me 61cm Soma Grand Randonneur tonight, Riv wheels, typical Riv
 build. Its a lovely bike but the extension above the seattube is just a
 hair too high and even with the seat slammed the saddle height is more
 than what I like. Paypal, lower 48. Thanks all

 Peter



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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread George Schick

OK, I'll say uncle on this one.  I stand 5' 9 and have slightly 
disproportionately shorter legs vs. slightly longer torso ratio.  And I 
ride a 54cm frame.  So for me to reach down is no big deal, but I realize 
that it might be a big issue for those of taller heights and more 
proportionate builds who ride larger frames.  In which case the DT vs. 
bar-con issue may be more a physiological necessity than one of person 
preference. 

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 2:01:18 PM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:

  On 12/17/2014 02:44 PM, George Schick wrote:
  
 Plus, if you're used to riding with hands on the brake lever hoods, as I 
 assume most of us are, you still have to reach down to the end of the drops 
 with one hand or the other. With the DT's only one hand is required to do 
 all the shifting - and you only reach down once. 


 Let me take issue with this.  When I say reach down to get at a downtube 
 shifter, I mean not only extend the arm and the hand, but also bend at the 
 waist, tipping the head down towards the ground.  It's a *reach.*  (This 
 varies by frame size, arm length, etc: some people simply drop their hand 
 and it lands right on the shift lever, no body movement involved.  I have a 
 big frame and relatively short arms; for me it is a big reach.)

 Unless they have a grotesquely incorrectly sized handlebar and stem, 
 nobody needs to *reach* that way to get their hand on the end of the 
 handle bar.  Yes you do have to move your hand.  No you do not have to 
 extend your arm or bend at the waist.  Or, if you do, you'd really better 
 change your stem and your handlebars.


  

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[RBW] Bending back a bent fork

2014-12-17 Thread Anne Paulson

My adult son has a Rambouillet. He commutes on it. This guy doesn't
ride lightly; he has more of a bulldozer approach to riding, it seems.
One time he broke a frame by riding into a parked car. Yeah, his steel
Trek frame broke at the head tube; I was so pleased that the frame
broke to protect that valuable Trek fork.

Anyway, when he took his bike to the shop for some very overdue
maintenance, they noticed that his fork was slightly bent back,
undoubtedly because he hit something. The bike is still ridable, but
the handling would be better if the fork were as designed.

The shop says they can get a frame builder to bend the fork back. Is
this a reasonable thing to do?

-- 
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It isn't a contest. Enjoy the ride.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

2014-12-17 Thread Scott Henry

I think a lot of it comes from what you were riding when you came of age
in cycling.
Something about teaching an old dog and new tricks.

Scott

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 3:51 PM, George Schick bhim...@gmail.com wrote:

 OK, I'll say uncle on this one.  I stand 5' 9 and have slightly
 disproportionately shorter legs vs. slightly longer torso ratio.  And I
 ride a 54cm frame.  So for me to reach down is no big deal, but I realize
 that it might be a big issue for those of taller heights and more
 proportionate builds who ride larger frames.  In which case the DT vs.
 bar-con issue may be more a physiological necessity than one of person
 preference.


 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 2:01:18 PM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:

  On 12/17/2014 02:44 PM, George Schick wrote:

 Plus, if you're used to riding with hands on the brake lever hoods, as I
 assume most of us are, you still have to reach down to the end of the drops
 with one hand or the other. With the DT's only one hand is required to do
 all the shifting - and you only reach down once.


 Let me take issue with this.  When I say reach down to get at a
 downtube shifter, I mean not only extend the arm and the hand, but also
 bend at the waist, tipping the head down towards the ground.  It's a
 *reach.*  (This varies by frame size, arm length, etc: some people
 simply drop their hand and it lands right on the shift lever, no body
 movement involved.  I have a big frame and relatively short arms; for me it
 is a big reach.)

 Unless they have a grotesquely incorrectly sized handlebar and stem,
 nobody needs to *reach* that way to get their hand on the end of the
 handle bar.  Yes you do have to move your hand.  No you do not have to
 extend your arm or bend at the waist.  Or, if you do, you'd really better
 change your stem and your handlebars.


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[RBW] Re: Bending back a bent fork

2014-12-17 Thread Bill Lindsay

Within reason, sure.  There was/is a shop tool that clamps to the fork tips 
like a hub would, and braces itself on the BB shell and you turn a 
leadscrew to push it back out.  If the forkblades are wrinkled at all, then 
you get a little more queasy about it.  Feel under the top tube and down 
tube right behind the lugs to check there for wrinkling as well.  But yes a 
competent framebuilder can advise when he/she sees it.  

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:56:00 PM UTC-8, Anne Paulson wrote:

 My adult son has a Rambouillet. He commutes on it. This guy doesn't 
 ride lightly; he has more of a bulldozer approach to riding, it seems. 
 One time he broke a frame by riding into a parked car. Yeah, his steel 
 Trek frame broke at the head tube; I was so pleased that the frame 
 broke to protect that valuable Trek fork. 

 Anyway, when he took his bike to the shop for some very overdue 
 maintenance, they noticed that his fork was slightly bent back, 
 undoubtedly because he hit something. The bike is still ridable, but 
 the handling would be better if the fork were as designed. 

 The shop says they can get a frame builder to bend the fork back. Is 
 this a reasonable thing to do? 

 -- 
 -- Anne Paulson 

 It isn't a contest. Enjoy the ride. 


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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

 Those rubber shift lever covers were made for DT levers, but always 
seemed pretty pointless.

Speaking of fair's fair, this is a very clever idea.  

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Re: [RBW] Re: Bending back a bent fork

I had a bikeshop do this for me years ago, they had a jig they put the fork
in and just mainupulated it until it was true to the jig. Now my fork was
squashed in shipping so not sure about the front to back bending.

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 4:14 PM, Bill Lindsay tapebu...@gmail.com wrote:

 Within reason, sure.  There was/is a shop tool that clamps to the fork
 tips like a hub would, and braces itself on the BB shell and you turn a
 leadscrew to push it back out.  If the forkblades are wrinkled at all, then
 you get a little more queasy about it.  Feel under the top tube and down
 tube right behind the lugs to check there for wrinkling as well.  But yes a
 competent framebuilder can advise when he/she sees it.


 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:56:00 PM UTC-8, Anne Paulson wrote:

 My adult son has a Rambouillet. He commutes on it. This guy doesn't
 ride lightly; he has more of a bulldozer approach to riding, it seems.
 One time he broke a frame by riding into a parked car. Yeah, his steel
 Trek frame broke at the head tube; I was so pleased that the frame
 broke to protect that valuable Trek fork.

 Anyway, when he took his bike to the shop for some very overdue
 maintenance, they noticed that his fork was slightly bent back,
 undoubtedly because he hit something. The bike is still ridable, but
 the handling would be better if the fork were as designed.

 The shop says they can get a frame builder to bend the fork back. Is
 this a reasonable thing to do?

 --
 -- Anne Paulson

 It isn't a contest. Enjoy the ride.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Bending back a bent fork

2014-12-17 Thread David

Yellow Jersey did it on my XO-5. Extremely fast turnaround and perfect job. 
Can't tell visually or functionally that it was ever bent. 
David

Sent from my iPhone

 On Dec 17, 2014, at 4:19 PM, Goshen Peter uscpeter11...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 I had a bikeshop do this for me years ago, they had a jig they put the fork 
 in and just mainupulated it until it was true to the jig. Now my fork was 
 squashed in shipping so not sure about the front to back bending.
 
 On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 4:14 PM, Bill Lindsay tapebu...@gmail.com wrote:
 Within reason, sure.  There was/is a shop tool that clamps to the fork tips 
 like a hub would, and braces itself on the BB shell and you turn a leadscrew 
 to push it back out.  If the forkblades are wrinkled at all, then you get a 
 little more queasy about it.  Feel under the top tube and down tube right 
 behind the lugs to check there for wrinkling as well.  But yes a competent 
 framebuilder can advise when he/she sees it.  
 
 
 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:56:00 PM UTC-8, Anne Paulson wrote:
 My adult son has a Rambouillet. He commutes on it. This guy doesn't 
 ride lightly; he has more of a bulldozer approach to riding, it seems. 
 One time he broke a frame by riding into a parked car. Yeah, his steel 
 Trek frame broke at the head tube; I was so pleased that the frame 
 broke to protect that valuable Trek fork. 
 
 Anyway, when he took his bike to the shop for some very overdue 
 maintenance, they noticed that his fork was slightly bent back, 
 undoubtedly because he hit something. The bike is still ridable, but 
 the handling would be better if the fork were as designed. 
 
 The shop says they can get a frame builder to bend the fork back. Is 
 this a reasonable thing to do? 
 
 -- 
 -- Anne Paulson 
 
 It isn't a contest. Enjoy the ride.
 
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[RBW] Re: Bending back a bent fork

2014-12-17 Thread Deacon Patrick

A! Part of the beauty of steel!

With abandon,
Patrick

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[RBW] calendars

2014-12-17 Thread Eunice Chang

Hi all,

Thought Riv folks might be interested:

I've made a calendar full of my bike photos (including a hilsen) and am
offering it for sale. I don't make a profit - I'm donating the calendar
sales to a local bike advocacy organization, Bike Durham.

If you're interested, take a look here:

https://squareup.com/market/justshiny/bike-calendar

(there are other things for sale too, like prints- but sales of these go to
a local animal shelter).

Thanks,
Eunice

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[RBW] 61cm Soma Grand Randonneur FFHS

So while is sort out who wants what parts FS is a great condition FFHS.
headset is tange,BB is 113, can include if needed/wanted. Frame has less
than 500 miles and only has wear from buildups, no chips nicks or dents
that I could see when I built it up.

Link to soma page and info

http://www.somafab.com/archives/product/grand-randonneur-frame-set

Looking for $375 shipped but can work something out.

Thanks all

Peter

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Re: [RBW] 61cm Soma Grand Randonneur FFHS

2014-12-17 Thread Jim Bronson

What's the C-C on the seat tube?  I had a 65 but it had a really big
extension above the center, so it was sort of misnomer that it was a 65.
It was more like a 58 or a 60 from C-C.   I sold it.  So what is this one
like?

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 4:04 PM, Goshen Peter uscpeter11...@gmail.com
wrote:

 So while is sort out who wants what parts FS is a great condition FFHS.
 headset is tange,BB is 113, can include if needed/wanted. Frame has less
 than 500 miles and only has wear from buildups, no chips nicks or dents
 that I could see when I built it up.

 Link to soma page and info

 http://www.somafab.com/archives/product/grand-randonneur-frame-set

 Looking for $375 shipped but can work something out.

 Thanks all

 Peter

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-- 
Keep the metal side up and the rubber side down!

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Re: [RBW] 61cm Soma Grand Randonneur FFHS

this one is similar, the ctc on the seatube is about 56cm, with 5 and
change above the seattube.

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 5:09 PM, Jim Bronson jim.bron...@gmail.com wrote:

 What's the C-C on the seat tube?  I had a 65 but it had a really big
 extension above the center, so it was sort of misnomer that it was a 65.
 It was more like a 58 or a 60 from C-C.   I sold it.  So what is this one
 like?

 On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 4:04 PM, Goshen Peter uscpeter11...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 So while is sort out who wants what parts FS is a great condition FFHS.
 headset is tange,BB is 113, can include if needed/wanted. Frame has less
 than 500 miles and only has wear from buildups, no chips nicks or dents
 that I could see when I built it up.

 Link to soma page and info

 http://www.somafab.com/archives/product/grand-randonneur-frame-set

 Looking for $375 shipped but can work something out.

 Thanks all

 Peter

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 --
 Keep the metal side up and the rubber side down!

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[RBW] Does anyone have a rack mount, battery powered tail light to sell or trade?

I don't want to hassle with rear wiring. I can use either a 2-bolt or a
single-bolt light; want one that uses standard AA or AAA batteries. Not
interested in Planet Bike or other standard seatpost mount US blinkies:
want a rack mount light, either steady or flashing.

Will be happy to trade in full or part for my current, older model Toplight
Line Plus which works fine but has a few minor scuffs.

Thanks.


-- 
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By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
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*
*[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore
himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to
destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his
needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely
having the power to avoid work and live one’s life from birth to death in
electric light and to the tune of tinned music is not a reason for doing
so.”*
*
  -- George Orwell, Pleasure Spots*

*Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not money,
I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have
the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and
though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not
money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and
though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me
nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money
vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh
not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in
iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all
things, endureth all things. . . . And now abideth faith, hope, money,
these three; but the greatest of these is money. *
*
 -- George Orwell, Keep The Apidistra Flying*

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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread RJM

This winter I am going to rebuild my 1996 Specialized Stumpjumper so that 
means I am going to buy a new suspension fork, some tires, maybe some 
shifters for it...I think I have the rest.

I'm going to be selling my Sam Hillborne since I bought a sweet dual 
suspension mountain bike and kinda need the space. So that means taking 
that apart or at least taking some of the racks, bags, lights ect. off it. 
 I'm also going to be selling many of my other frames and parts I have 
laying around collecting dust. Time to clean out the house and have this 
stuff go to someone who will use it. I'm not really doing anymore touring 
or commuting anymore, and that was really what I set the Hillborne up as 
after getting the Roadeo built to be my go fast bike.

With the money from all that selling I am going to be buying a Hunqapillar 
or get a custom mountain mixte made by Riv. Probably will go the Hunq 
route.although I could be talked into a Bombadil. Either way, it's 
going to be a fine trail bike without suspension. 



On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 4:37:11 AM UTC-6, ascpgh wrote:

 Riding, besides my commutes, get a bit scant from here on out through 
 winter. The season, the holidays, more deliberate prep for a trip in the 
 conditions, plenty of things distract from just a nice ride but I realize 
 that at this time every year I always seem to contemplate a bike project to 
 go with the anticipated springtime, fruition or not. It's biking fun for 
 the extra bandwidth.

 My project is a low trail, 650b wheeled, all-around bike made with a 
 lively tube set (versus sturdy for touring) with drop bars, center pull 
 brakes, generator hub, LED lighting. All on a budget recognizing the value 
 of experience, unlike the box bike/mass market interpretation, handmade 
 wheels versus machine made ones as an example. I am reading and including 
 many posting subjects and items in this project and admit that may not 
 reach reality, but it's fun to have on the drawing board.

 Andy Cheatham
 Pittsburgh


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[RBW] Re: Does anyone have a rack mount, battery powered tail light to sell or trade?

PB makes a nice rack mount adapter for its blinkies...I used to use one, 
but decided it was worth the trouble to hook up dynamo wiring.  Trust me, 
it's *really worth the trouble!!!*

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 5:19:06 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:

 I don't want to hassle with rear wiring. I can use either a 2-bolt or a 
 single-bolt light; want one that uses standard AA or AAA batteries. Not 
 interested in Planet Bike or other standard seatpost mount US blinkies: 
 want a rack mount light, either steady or flashing.

 Will be happy to trade in full or part for my current, older model 
 Toplight Line Plus which works fine but has a few minor scuffs.

 Thanks.


 -- 
 Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
 By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
 Other professional writing services.
 http://www.resumespecialties.com/
 www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
 Patrick Moore
 Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten

 *
 *[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore 
 himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to 
 destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his 
 needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely 
 having the power to avoid work and live one’s life from birth to death in 
 electric light and to the tune of tinned music is not a reason for doing 
 so.”*
 *  
   -- George Orwell, Pleasure Spots*

 *Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not money, 
 I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have 
 the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and 
 though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not 
 money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and 
 though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me 
 nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money 
 vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh 
 not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in 
 iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all 
 things, endureth all things. . . . And now abideth faith, hope, money, 
 these three; but the greatest of these is money. *
 *  
  -- George Orwell, Keep The Apidistra Flying*
  

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Re: [RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

Damned household expenses get in the way of bike expenditure, don't they?

Me, my problem is insufficient income. (Well, and my promise to my daughter
that I will redecorate her bedroom -- new (modest) furniture -- before she
goes off to college -- she's 13.)

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 12:22 PM, Kyle Brooks bicycle1...@gmail.com wrote:

 I also have been planning a Trek 620 project -- though mine is a 1984
 model, with canti brakes. I was just starting to pick up some parts for it
 (I got it as a frame and fork alone) when my water heater ruptured. That
 plus a fairly large car repair bill may have put the project on hold,
 unfortunately.



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[RBW] Re: Does anyone have a rack mount, battery powered tail light to sell or trade?

2014-12-17 Thread John Hawrylak

I bought a Planet Bike Superflash and the Plant Bike plastic rack mount 
which bolts to the 2 holes in the Nitto rear rack and has a slider holder 
in the middle to allow the light to slide in and lock.  The plastic rack 
mount was app $5 and it came up on Amazon when I searched for the 
superflash.  I bolted on the mount and slid the light.  Very. very pleased

John Hawrylak
Woodstown NJ

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Re: [RBW] Re: Does anyone have a rack mount, battery powered tail light to sell or trade?

Good men can disagree. I do like the always on quality of a dynamo rear
light, But!!

1. The Toplight seems to me to be rather dim.

2. More bad, I don't like wire zip tied or taped to, *seriatim,* top tube,
top of right seat stay, and then spanning the length of the rear rack,
unsupported -- dangling in the wind, so to speak.

Had I more money, I'd have a builder find a way to route the rear wire
through top tube, seat tube, and rack tubes.

Patrick Good men always agree that you are wrong and I am right Moore

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 4:31 PM, Andrew Marchant-Shapiro 
marchantshap...@gmail.com wrote:

 PB makes a nice rack mount adapter for its blinkies...I used to use one,
 but decided it was worth the trouble to hook up dynamo wiring.  Trust me,
 it's *really worth the trouble!!!*


 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 5:19:06 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:

 I don't want to hassle with rear wiring. I can use either a 2-bolt or a
 single-bolt light; want one that uses standard AA or AAA batteries. Not
 interested in Planet Bike or other standard seatpost mount US blinkies:
 want a rack mount light, either steady or flashing.

 Will be happy to trade in full or part for my current, older model
 Toplight Line Plus which works fine but has a few minor scuffs.

 Thanks.


 --
 Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
 By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
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 *
 *[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore
 himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to
 destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his
 needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely
 having the power to avoid work and live one’s life from birth to death in
 electric light and to the tune of tinned music is not a reason for doing
 so.”*
 *
 -- George Orwell, Pleasure Spots*

 *Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not
 money, I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I
 have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge;
 and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not
 money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and
 though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me
 nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money
 vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh
 not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in
 iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all
 things, endureth all things. . . . And now abideth faith, hope, money,
 these three; but the greatest of these is money. *
 *
-- George Orwell, Keep The Apidistra Flying*

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*
*[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore
himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to
destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his
needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely
having the power to avoid work and live one’s life from birth to death in
electric light and to the tune of tinned music is not a reason for doing
so.”*
*
  -- George Orwell, Pleasure Spots*

*Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not money,
I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have
the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and
though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not
money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and
though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me
nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money
vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh
not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in
iniquity, but

Re: [RBW] Re: Does anyone have a rack mount, battery powered tail light to sell or trade?

Do you mean this?

[image: Inline image 1]

I used one to mount two chronologically distinct PB Superflashes on the
rear of said rack and had both bounce off the mount after breaking the
clip, hit the pavement, and explode into pieces when I hit one of our many
5 pavement expansion cracks. (Same route if not the same crack: the road
behind Don Chalmer's Ford at the southeast end of Rio Rancho connecting 528
to the bottom of the Big Hill.)

The mount is perfectly sound, it's the stupid plastic clip at the back of
the light that failed. I have 2 PB SFs in my lights box with no clips.

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 4:37 PM, John Hawrylak john.hawry...@verizon.net
wrote:

 I bought a Planet Bike Superflash and the Plant Bike plastic rack mount
 which bolts to the 2 holes in the Nitto rear rack and has a slider holder
 in the middle to allow the light to slide in and lock.  The plastic rack
 mount was app $5 and it came up on Amazon when I searched for the
 superflash.  I bolted on the mount and slid the light.  Very. very pleased

 John Hawrylak
 Woodstown NJ

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*
*[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore
himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to
destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his
needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely
having the power to avoid work and live one’s life from birth to death in
electric light and to the tune of tinned music is not a reason for doing
so.”*
*
  -- George Orwell, Pleasure Spots*

*Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not money,
I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have
the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and
though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not
money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and
though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me
nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money
vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh
not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in
iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all
things, endureth all things. . . . And now abideth faith, hope, money,
these three; but the greatest of these is money. *
*
 -- George Orwell, Keep The Apidistra Flying*

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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

But I have your back. On my 58 cm Ram, I -- 5'10, mostly torso, short arms
(damn! I can't reach my change!!) and simply drop my arm loosely from my
shoulder and find the dt shifter.

There *is* one more variable; how inclined your body is in your typical
riding positions. My road bars are ~1 below saddle, and I'm at the usual
45* on the hoods, so ...

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 1:51 PM, George Schick bhim...@gmail.com wrote:

 OK, I'll say uncle on this one.  I stand 5' 9 and have slightly
 disproportionately shorter legs vs. slightly longer torso ratio.  And I
 ride a 54cm frame.  So for me to reach down is no big deal, but I realize
 that it might be a big issue for those of taller heights and more
 proportionate builds who ride larger frames.  In which case the DT vs.
 bar-con issue may be more a physiological necessity than one of person
 preference.


 On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 2:01:18 PM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:

  On 12/17/2014 02:44 PM, George Schick wrote:

 Plus, if you're used to riding with hands on the brake lever hoods, as I
 assume most of us are, you still have to reach down to the end of the drops
 with one hand or the other. With the DT's only one hand is required to do
 all the shifting - and you only reach down once.


 Let me take issue with this.  When I say reach down to get at a
 downtube shifter, I mean not only extend the arm and the hand, but also
 bend at the waist, tipping the head down towards the ground.  It's a
 *reach.*  (This varies by frame size, arm length, etc: some people
 simply drop their hand and it lands right on the shift lever, no body
 movement involved.  I have a big frame and relatively short arms; for me it
 is a big reach.)

 Unless they have a grotesquely incorrectly sized handlebar and stem,
 nobody needs to *reach* that way to get their hand on the end of the
 handle bar.  Yes you do have to move your hand.  No you do not have to
 extend your arm or bend at the waist.  Or, if you do, you'd really better
 change your stem and your handlebars.


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*
*[I]n exploring the physical universe man has made no attempt to explore
himself. Much of what goes by the name of pleasure is simply an effort to
destroy consciousness. If one started by asking, what is man? what are his
needs? how can he best express himself? one would discover that merely
having the power to avoid work and live one’s life from birth to death in
electric light and to the tune of tinned music is not a reason for doing
so.”*
*
  -- George Orwell, Pleasure Spots*

*Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not money,
I am become as a sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have
the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and
though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not
money, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and
though I give my body to be burned, and have not money, it profiteth me
nothing. Money suffereth long, and it is kind; money envieth not; money
vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave unseemly, seeketh
not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in
iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all
things, endureth all things. . . . And now abideth faith, hope, money,
these three; but the greatest of these is money. *
*
 -- George Orwell, Keep The Apidistra Flying*

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[RBW] Re: What's your winter project?

2014-12-17 Thread Deacon Patrick

Riding, running, and snowshoeing as much as I can, and new brakes for the 
Quickbeam from Saint Nicholas to aid my Quickbeam single track tomfoolery. 
Grin. 

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Re: [RBW] 61cm Soma Grand Randonneur FFHS

Sorry, still coming up with prices. VP Gripsters, the grey off the site as
seen on bike. $50 shipped.

Damn, forgot pic. Parting out, buying a complete bike so cranks, pedals,
bars etc all FS.
On Dec 17, 2014 5:13 PM, Goshen Peter uscpeter11...@gmail.com wrote:

 this one is similar, the ctc on the seatube is about 56cm, with 5 and
 change above the seattube.

 On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 5:09 PM, Jim Bronson jim.bron...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 What's the C-C on the seat tube?  I had a 65 but it had a really big
 extension above the center, so it was sort of misnomer that it was a 65.
 It was more like a 58 or a 60 from C-C.   I sold it.  So what is this one
 like?

 On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 4:04 PM, Goshen Peter uscpeter11...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 So while is sort out who wants what parts FS is a great condition FFHS.
 headset is tange,BB is 113, can include if needed/wanted. Frame has less
 than 500 miles and only has wear from buildups, no chips nicks or dents
 that I could see when I built it up.

 Link to soma page and info

 http://www.somafab.com/archives/product/grand-randonneur-frame-set

 Looking for $375 shipped but can work something out.

 Thanks all

 Peter

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 Keep the metal side up and the rubber side down!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...

after the lecture, that's condescension.. 
here's my daughter's frame, her first drop bar and fast steering bike - she 
had problems steering it for the first 100 miles.  In everything, she is an 
aggressive charger.  

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v728/bulldog1935/Raleigh/Fuji/aP6220007.jpg

DT shifters would be a half-inch from the tire, and she didn't need the 
distraction, while she could develop the skill, she shifts the indexed bar 
ends without thinking

on my go-fast bike, DT shifters a good 3 inches from the tire

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v728/bulldog1935/Raleigh/F%20Moser/aaaP6140003.jpg

there are other variables than reach from the saddle




On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 3:18:03 PM UTC-6, Matthew J wrote:

  Those rubber shift lever covers were made for DT levers, but always 
 seemed pretty pointless.

 Speaking of fair's fair, this is a very clever idea.  


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Re: [RBW] Re: Bar end vs. down tube shifting... What's your experience...