[RBW] Re: Roadini at RBW

[Geeter]

This is great.  It's exactly what I want in a road bike at this stage of the 
game.

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[RBW] Re: Breaking in a leather Brooks

[Joe Bernard]

BC, if you're anything like me you won't need padded shorts after the saddle is 
broken in. I rode many years with padded shorts on many saddles, and even after 
I got a B17 - which was better - I was still getting saddle sores. One day I 
said screw it and bought wool underwear and unpadded shorts from Riv..problem 
solved. All that padded squishiness between me and the saddle just got in the 
way and caused problems. It was the shock of my life when I discovered that 
going with no buffer was the right plan. 

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[RBW] Re: Roadini at RBW

[Joe Bernard]

The new newsletter has some pics of the Roadini and inquires about the 
provenance of the decals. I'm calling it: Heron!

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[RBW] Re: Aging and Exercise

[ascpgh]

I noted the same about the study when I first saw that article. Moderation 
beneficial in most things. 

Andy Cheatham
Pittsburgh

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 2:19:13 PM UTC-4, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
> I haven't looked at this study in particular but something I've noticed is 
> common with many exercise studies is they test sedentary subjects over a 
> fairly short time period. Interval training emerges at the top every time 
> and seems attractive because it is short/intense. But the few studies that 
> I've seen that examine aerobic exercise (aka, what everyone did before 
> mechanical engines) show it is foundational to good health. Combined with 
> interval training, it most closely matches how humans have lived for 
> hundreds of thousands of years. What isn't good for us is chronic cardio 
> (racing everywhere).
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
> On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 7:38:57 AM UTC-6, islaysteve wrote:
>>
>> This is very interesting to me as I fall into the age category studied, 
>> and my exercise level of right now could be classified as "sedentary."  For 
>> those of you who have not read the article, one conclusion is that the 
>> "interval" training described seemed to be the most beneficial for our age 
>> group.  Since I have a bike set up on the trainer in the basement, I can 
>> implement that plan immediately.  That type of training could of course 
>> also be done during an actual bike ride, even if it does go against "just 
>> ride" ; ).  Something to think about.
>> Cheers, Steve
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 10:08:18 AM UTC-4, Addison wrote:
>>>
>>> Given the interest in cycling and aging amongst this group I thought 
>>> this story/study might be of interest:
>>>
>>>
>>> https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/03/23/well/move/the-best-exercise-for-aging-muscles.html?mc=aud_dev=keywee=dommob_0=367955_4=1372898_1=605799=http://m.facebook.com
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Addison Wilhite, M.A. 
>>>
>>> Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology 
>>>  
>>>
>>> *“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*
>>>
>>> Educator: Professional Portfolio 
>>>
>>> Blogger: Reno Rambler  
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: I finally made it out to Riv

['Tim' via RBW Owners Bunch]

One of the reasons it took me three weeks to write my report is that there was 
just so much good to talk about that I couldn't get started. And I still feel 
like I barely scratched the surface in telling how great everyone there is and 
how welcome they make you feel. The visit was part of a 5+ week adventure that 
I embarked upon that included some bike touring, then some national park visits 
and ended with some Dead and Company concerts (which is how I ended up in the 
Bay Area). It also included a ride the previous Sunday with the infamous 
Patrick Moore in ABQ. He posted about the ride the same day, I believe. It, too 
was a great experience. We met for a beer and dinner on Saturday night and then 
rode the wonderful bike path on Sunday. Patrick is a great host, and told me 
the story of how he had to convince Grant to build the custom that he wanted in 
1994 (hope I got the year right, Patrick). And he has some nice bikes!

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Re: [RBW] Re: I finally made it out to Riv

['Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Thanks for sharing this, Tim. How nice after five Rivendells to meet the 
people behind them in person, and then go for a ride with the designer. 
Speaking of photos of Grant, the one in the current email  evokes some kind 
of bicycle shaman, perhaps coming down into town for supplies. Too cool!

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 9:27:04 PM UTC-4, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Yes, good story, and good photos. I'm glad Grant is getting as old as I am.
>
> Following miscellaneous links related to an iBob thread on trail, I came 
> across several articles about Grant and Rivendell, notably Gary B's 
> interview with Grant published in a 2007 Bike Radar edition. A good article 
> to archive. The one on trail and the important frame design variables is 
> also worth re reading.
>
> Meandering on within the "Just Ride" idea: today's Bike Snob post talks 
> about a performance enhancement system that should fit right in: fecal 
> transplants.
>
> Who needs satire?
>
> Patrick "I don't give a shit" Moore
>
> On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 7:11 PM, Broccoli Cog  > wrote:
>
>> That's a great story!  Reinforces how happy I am to do business with such 
>> great people. I hope to visit there someday. 
>>
>> On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 6:03:02 PM UTC-4, Tim wrote:
>>>
>>> I visited Riv 3 weeks ago. I was on my way to Mountain View and was able 
>>> to spend a little under 24 hours in Walnut Creek. I got there at noon on 
>>> Friday, June 1 after leaving Sequoia National Park that morning. What a 
>>> great experience! I met Vince first and we visited. I told him about my 
>>> Rivendells. Then I met Dave, whom I've exchanged a few emails with. Great 
>>> guy. I was starving so went next door to the noodle place for some 
>>> delicious pho. I came back and hung out some more. I saw Jenny's double tt 
>>> Hilsen. Sweet bike. I rode a 52 Appaloosa with Bosco bars. Then a Clem and 
>>> a Clem L. Grant came in and we talked for quite a while. I was planning on 
>>> coming in the next morning (Saturday) and testing a bike at the Shell Ridge 
>>> open space (where many of those great photos on the site are shot. They 
>>> have maps printed at Riv and Grant gave me one and marked the directions in 
>>> highlighter. Dave recommended a sushi place for dinner and I left. 
>>>
>>> I got there Saturday with the intention of riding an Appaloosa but the 
>>> one from the day before was smaller than I wanted. I was going to take a 
>>> Clem but then Grant came by and told me to take his. Then he decided to 
>>> come along (to make sure I didn't hurt his bike, he said, tongue-in-cheek), 
>>> and off we went. The trails are just as great as they look in the pictures 
>>> and the hills are even more beautiful. There were a couple of hills we had 
>>> to walk up. Grant took my phone and went ahead on the trail a few times to 
>>> shoot me coming down. It was a great ride and he is a very engaging guy. 
>>>
>>> While I was there I ended up meeting Vince, Dave, Mark, Spencer, Will, 
>>> Jenny and Harry Hugel IV. Everyone was super nice and several of them 
>>> thanked me, from a genuine place, for buying Rivendells. They have always 
>>> been just as nice in the many, many encounters I've had with them via email 
>>> or on the phone. I've got 5 Riv's and have always loved them. It makes me 
>>> feel really good to support such a great business. 
>>>
>>> -- 
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: I finally made it out to Riv

[Patrick Moore]

Yes, good story, and good photos. I'm glad Grant is getting as old as I am.

Following miscellaneous links related to an iBob thread on trail, I came
across several articles about Grant and Rivendell, notably Gary B's
interview with Grant published in a 2007 Bike Radar edition. A good article
to archive. The one on trail and the important frame design variables is
also worth re reading.

Meandering on within the "Just Ride" idea: today's Bike Snob post talks
about a performance enhancement system that should fit right in: fecal
transplants.

Who needs satire?

Patrick "I don't give a shit" Moore

On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 7:11 PM, Broccoli Cog  wrote:

> That's a great story!  Reinforces how happy I am to do business with such
> great people. I hope to visit there someday.
>
> On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 6:03:02 PM UTC-4, Tim wrote:
>>
>> I visited Riv 3 weeks ago. I was on my way to Mountain View and was able
>> to spend a little under 24 hours in Walnut Creek. I got there at noon on
>> Friday, June 1 after leaving Sequoia National Park that morning. What a
>> great experience! I met Vince first and we visited. I told him about my
>> Rivendells. Then I met Dave, whom I've exchanged a few emails with. Great
>> guy. I was starving so went next door to the noodle place for some
>> delicious pho. I came back and hung out some more. I saw Jenny's double tt
>> Hilsen. Sweet bike. I rode a 52 Appaloosa with Bosco bars. Then a Clem and
>> a Clem L. Grant came in and we talked for quite a while. I was planning on
>> coming in the next morning (Saturday) and testing a bike at the Shell Ridge
>> open space (where many of those great photos on the site are shot. They
>> have maps printed at Riv and Grant gave me one and marked the directions in
>> highlighter. Dave recommended a sushi place for dinner and I left.
>>
>> I got there Saturday with the intention of riding an Appaloosa but the
>> one from the day before was smaller than I wanted. I was going to take a
>> Clem but then Grant came by and told me to take his. Then he decided to
>> come along (to make sure I didn't hurt his bike, he said, tongue-in-cheek),
>> and off we went. The trails are just as great as they look in the pictures
>> and the hills are even more beautiful. There were a couple of hills we had
>> to walk up. Grant took my phone and went ahead on the trail a few times to
>> shoot me coming down. It was a great ride and he is a very engaging guy.
>>
>> While I was there I ended up meeting Vince, Dave, Mark, Spencer, Will,
>> Jenny and Harry Hugel IV. Everyone was super nice and several of them
>> thanked me, from a genuine place, for buying Rivendells. They have always
>> been just as nice in the many, many encounters I've had with them via email
>> or on the phone. I've got 5 Riv's and have always loved them. It makes me
>> feel really good to support such a great business.
>>
>> --

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[RBW] Re: Breaking in a leather Brooks

[Broccoli Cog]

As the OP I am happy to report I received my new Brooks B17 Standard in the 
mail today. Put the saddle on and went for a ride. I can't say it was 
instantly comfortable but I feel like the shape of the saddle is correct. I 
just need to have a little give where my sits bones meet the saddle. I rode 
12 miles in just regular shorts no chamois. Still many miles to go before 
break in but I am optimistic that it is going to be right for me. 

On Monday, June 19, 2017 at 11:12:14 AM UTC-4, Broccoli Cog wrote:
>
> I have decided to take the plunge into the world of leather saddles with 
> the purchase of a Brooks B17. I am in search of one now and decided to buy 
> used. There is a variety of information regarding proper break in. I have 
> read using mink oil, baseball glove oil and various other methods some of 
> which seem like gimmicks. I am more into the keep it simple approach of 
> applying a good reputable oil and simply going out and riding. The only way 
> to break it in is time. Can anyone share their real world experience with 
> breaking in a leather saddle?

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[RBW] Re: I finally made it out to Riv

[Broccoli Cog]

That's a great story!  Reinforces how happy I am to do business with such 
great people. I hope to visit there someday. 

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 6:03:02 PM UTC-4, Tim wrote:
>
> I visited Riv 3 weeks ago. I was on my way to Mountain View and was able 
> to spend a little under 24 hours in Walnut Creek. I got there at noon on 
> Friday, June 1 after leaving Sequoia National Park that morning. What a 
> great experience! I met Vince first and we visited. I told him about my 
> Rivendells. Then I met Dave, whom I've exchanged a few emails with. Great 
> guy. I was starving so went next door to the noodle place for some 
> delicious pho. I came back and hung out some more. I saw Jenny's double tt 
> Hilsen. Sweet bike. I rode a 52 Appaloosa with Bosco bars. Then a Clem and 
> a Clem L. Grant came in and we talked for quite a while. I was planning on 
> coming in the next morning (Saturday) and testing a bike at the Shell Ridge 
> open space (where many of those great photos on the site are shot. They 
> have maps printed at Riv and Grant gave me one and marked the directions in 
> highlighter. Dave recommended a sushi place for dinner and I left. 
>
> I got there Saturday with the intention of riding an Appaloosa but the one 
> from the day before was smaller than I wanted. I was going to take a Clem 
> but then Grant came by and told me to take his. Then he decided to come 
> along (to make sure I didn't hurt his bike, he said, tongue-in-cheek), and 
> off we went. The trails are just as great as they look in the pictures and 
> the hills are even more beautiful. There were a couple of hills we had to 
> walk up. Grant took my phone and went ahead on the trail a few times to 
> shoot me coming down. It was a great ride and he is a very engaging guy. 
>
> While I was there I ended up meeting Vince, Dave, Mark, Spencer, Will, 
> Jenny and Harry Hugel IV. Everyone was super nice and several of them 
> thanked me, from a genuine place, for buying Rivendells. They have always 
> been just as nice in the many, many encounters I've had with them via email 
> or on the phone. I've got 5 Riv's and have always loved them. It makes me 
> feel really good to support such a great business. 
>
>

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[RBW] Re: I finally made it out to Riv

['Tim' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Links to a few pics. 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/93129181@N06/35088189920/in/dateposted-public/

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[RBW] Re: I finally made it out to Riv

[Tim O. (Portland, OR)]

Sweet! I want to see the pictures from your ride!

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 4:00:54 PM UTC-7, Ryan Fleming wrote:
>
> AGREED :)
>
> On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 5:12:35 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>> APPROVE
>>
>> On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 3:03:02 PM UTC-7, Tim wrote:
>>>
>>> I visited Riv 3 weeks ago. I was on my way to Mountain View and was able 
>>> to spend a little under 24 hours in Walnut Creek. I got there at noon on 
>>> Friday, June 1 after leaving Sequoia National Park that morning. What a 
>>> great experience! I met Vince first and we visited. I told him about my 
>>> Rivendells. Then I met Dave, whom I've exchanged a few emails with. Great 
>>> guy. I was starving so went next door to the noodle place for some 
>>> delicious pho. I came back and hung out some more. I saw Jenny's double tt 
>>> Hilsen. Sweet bike. I rode a 52 Appaloosa with Bosco bars. Then a Clem and 
>>> a Clem L. Grant came in and we talked for quite a while. I was planning on 
>>> coming in the next morning (Saturday) and testing a bike at the Shell Ridge 
>>> open space (where many of those great photos on the site are shot. They 
>>> have maps printed at Riv and Grant gave me one and marked the directions in 
>>> highlighter. Dave recommended a sushi place for dinner and I left. 
>>>
>>> I got there Saturday with the intention of riding an Appaloosa but the 
>>> one from the day before was smaller than I wanted. I was going to take a 
>>> Clem but then Grant came by and told me to take his. Then he decided to 
>>> come along (to make sure I didn't hurt his bike, he said, tongue-in-cheek), 
>>> and off we went. The trails are just as great as they look in the pictures 
>>> and the hills are even more beautiful. There were a couple of hills we had 
>>> to walk up. Grant took my phone and went ahead on the trail a few times to 
>>> shoot me coming down. It was a great ride and he is a very engaging guy. 
>>>
>>> While I was there I ended up meeting Vince, Dave, Mark, Spencer, Will, 
>>> Jenny and Harry Hugel IV. Everyone was super nice and several of them 
>>> thanked me, from a genuine place, for buying Rivendells. They have always 
>>> been just as nice in the many, many encounters I've had with them via email 
>>> or on the phone. I've got 5 Riv's and have always loved them. It makes me 
>>> feel really good to support such a great business. 
>>>
>>>

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Re: [Ext] [RBW] Re: FS: 68 cm Quickbeam $1275

[Minh]

as someone who spends way too much time on the list looking at for sale 
listings, FYI to anyone contemplating, bikes in this size rarely come up 
for sale, and quickbeams are even rarer.  just fyi!

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[RBW] Re: I finally made it out to Riv

[Ryan Fleming]

AGREED :)

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 5:12:35 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> APPROVE
>
> On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 3:03:02 PM UTC-7, Tim wrote:
>>
>> I visited Riv 3 weeks ago. I was on my way to Mountain View and was able 
>> to spend a little under 24 hours in Walnut Creek. I got there at noon on 
>> Friday, June 1 after leaving Sequoia National Park that morning. What a 
>> great experience! I met Vince first and we visited. I told him about my 
>> Rivendells. Then I met Dave, whom I've exchanged a few emails with. Great 
>> guy. I was starving so went next door to the noodle place for some 
>> delicious pho. I came back and hung out some more. I saw Jenny's double tt 
>> Hilsen. Sweet bike. I rode a 52 Appaloosa with Bosco bars. Then a Clem and 
>> a Clem L. Grant came in and we talked for quite a while. I was planning on 
>> coming in the next morning (Saturday) and testing a bike at the Shell Ridge 
>> open space (where many of those great photos on the site are shot. They 
>> have maps printed at Riv and Grant gave me one and marked the directions in 
>> highlighter. Dave recommended a sushi place for dinner and I left. 
>>
>> I got there Saturday with the intention of riding an Appaloosa but the 
>> one from the day before was smaller than I wanted. I was going to take a 
>> Clem but then Grant came by and told me to take his. Then he decided to 
>> come along (to make sure I didn't hurt his bike, he said, tongue-in-cheek), 
>> and off we went. The trails are just as great as they look in the pictures 
>> and the hills are even more beautiful. There were a couple of hills we had 
>> to walk up. Grant took my phone and went ahead on the trail a few times to 
>> shoot me coming down. It was a great ride and he is a very engaging guy. 
>>
>> While I was there I ended up meeting Vince, Dave, Mark, Spencer, Will, 
>> Jenny and Harry Hugel IV. Everyone was super nice and several of them 
>> thanked me, from a genuine place, for buying Rivendells. They have always 
>> been just as nice in the many, many encounters I've had with them via email 
>> or on the phone. I've got 5 Riv's and have always loved them. It makes me 
>> feel really good to support such a great business. 
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Breaking in a leather Brooks

[Chris Birkenmaier]

I also agree with not resorting to all sorts of saddle torture to break in the 
Brooks.  I cringe when I see the water or put it in an oven advice. Just ride 
the dang thing.  The Pro is much thicker leather. I have a number of the 
Selects and like them knowing that they should last a good long time.  They 
look fabulous too

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Re: [RBW] Re: Breaking in a leather Brooks

[Steve Palincsar]

On 06/22/2017 05:37 PM, 'Tim' via RBW Owners Bunch wrote:

Mink Oil and the Ball Peen Hammers would be a killer name for a rock band!



Image result for thumbs up

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[RBW] Re: I finally made it out to Riv

[Bill Lindsay]

APPROVE

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 3:03:02 PM UTC-7, Tim wrote:
>
> I visited Riv 3 weeks ago. I was on my way to Mountain View and was able 
> to spend a little under 24 hours in Walnut Creek. I got there at noon on 
> Friday, June 1 after leaving Sequoia National Park that morning. What a 
> great experience! I met Vince first and we visited. I told him about my 
> Rivendells. Then I met Dave, whom I've exchanged a few emails with. Great 
> guy. I was starving so went next door to the noodle place for some 
> delicious pho. I came back and hung out some more. I saw Jenny's double tt 
> Hilsen. Sweet bike. I rode a 52 Appaloosa with Bosco bars. Then a Clem and 
> a Clem L. Grant came in and we talked for quite a while. I was planning on 
> coming in the next morning (Saturday) and testing a bike at the Shell Ridge 
> open space (where many of those great photos on the site are shot. They 
> have maps printed at Riv and Grant gave me one and marked the directions in 
> highlighter. Dave recommended a sushi place for dinner and I left. 
>
> I got there Saturday with the intention of riding an Appaloosa but the one 
> from the day before was smaller than I wanted. I was going to take a Clem 
> but then Grant came by and told me to take his. Then he decided to come 
> along (to make sure I didn't hurt his bike, he said, tongue-in-cheek), and 
> off we went. The trails are just as great as they look in the pictures and 
> the hills are even more beautiful. There were a couple of hills we had to 
> walk up. Grant took my phone and went ahead on the trail a few times to 
> shoot me coming down. It was a great ride and he is a very engaging guy. 
>
> While I was there I ended up meeting Vince, Dave, Mark, Spencer, Will, 
> Jenny and Harry Hugel IV. Everyone was super nice and several of them 
> thanked me, from a genuine place, for buying Rivendells. They have always 
> been just as nice in the many, many encounters I've had with them via email 
> or on the phone. I've got 5 Riv's and have always loved them. It makes me 
> feel really good to support such a great business. 
>
>

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[RBW] I finally made it out to Riv

['Tim' via RBW Owners Bunch]

I visited Riv 3 weeks ago. I was on my way to Mountain View and was able to 
spend a little under 24 hours in Walnut Creek. I got there at noon on Friday, 
June 1 after leaving Sequoia National Park that morning. What a great 
experience! I met Vince first and we visited. I told him about my Rivendells. 
Then I met Dave, whom I've exchanged a few emails with. Great guy. I was 
starving so went next door to the noodle place for some delicious pho. I came 
back and hung out some more. I saw Jenny's double tt Hilsen. Sweet bike. I rode 
a 52 Appaloosa with Bosco bars. Then a Clem and a Clem L. Grant came in and we 
talked for quite a while. I was planning on coming in the next morning 
(Saturday) and testing a bike at the Shell Ridge open space (where many of 
those great photos on the site are shot. They have maps printed at Riv and 
Grant gave me one and marked the directions in highlighter. Dave recommended a 
sushi place for dinner and I left. 

I got there Saturday with the intention of riding an Appaloosa but the one from 
the day before was smaller than I wanted. I was going to take a Clem but then 
Grant came by and told me to take his. Then he decided to come along (to make 
sure I didn't hurt his bike, he said, tongue-in-cheek), and off we went. The 
trails are just as great as they look in the pictures and the hills are even 
more beautiful. There were a couple of hills we had to walk up. Grant took my 
phone and went ahead on the trail a few times to shoot me coming down. It was a 
great ride and he is a very engaging guy. 

While I was there I ended up meeting Vince, Dave, Mark, Spencer, Will, Jenny 
and Harry Hugel IV. Everyone was super nice and several of them thanked me, 
from a genuine place, for buying Rivendells. They have always been just as nice 
in the many, many encounters I've had with them via email or on the phone. I've 
got 5 Riv's and have always loved them. It makes me feel really good to support 
such a great business. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Breaking in a leather Brooks

['Tim' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Mink Oil and the Ball Peen Hammers would be a killer name for a rock band!

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[RBW] WTB: Brooks c17

[Michael Williams]

Hey there group,   Does anyone have a Brooks c17 that theyre not enamored with? 
  I'll take it if so!Thanks.   -Mike

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Re: [RBW] Re: Breaking in a leather Brooks

[Steve Palincsar]

B.17s -

They have one - aged- that is pre-worn & already broken in when you get 
it.  It comes pre-drilled for lacing, and you'll need to lace it after 
but a very short time.


The standard / champion special in my experience is good for shorter 
rides right out of the box, and good for centuries after maybe 50 miles.


The Select, which as far as I can tell appears to be discontinued now, 
takes longer to break in as it's leather is much thicker. I've no 
personal experience with them.


There's also a model with a cutout, the Imperial.  It's pre-drilled for 
lacing, which strongly suggests that lacing will in fact be required.


-- http://www.brooksengland.com/en_us/saddles.html

I can't imagine anyone needing to resort to hot water baths or any other 
weird techniques to break in a B.17.  Now some Team Pros are very, very 
hard to break in and can be very challenging to ride long enough to 
break them in.  But we're not talking about Team Pros here.


There's a lot of weird, bizarre and downright wrong advice on breaking 
in saddles on the internet.  Some of it might come from famous people.  
You'd be well advised to stay away from such advice.  If you see 
anything mentioning Mink Oil or ball peen hammers, run the other way as 
fast as you can, fingers in your ears saying "La la la la" all the while.


And by the way, if a saddle really hurts chances are good that the shape 
of it is wrong for you, and no amount of breaking in is going to fix 
that.  There are many brands of saddles, and within each brand many 
models of different widths and often different shapes.



On 06/22/2017 04:05 PM, alan lavine wrote:
While we're on the topic, don't some B17's break in easier than 
others?  Of all the various leathers available, which is the best and 
which is the worst?


Thanks,
Alan
NYC

On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 11:20:00 AM UTC-4, Tim wrote:

Lon Haldeman (ultra cycling legend, who, quite likely, has ridden
more miles on leather saddles than possibly any other human), in
his blog in 2011, wrote about how to break in a Brooks using the
hot water method. He claims to have broken in over 300 Brooks
saddles this way for riders on his PACTOUR rides.

http://pactour.blogspot.com

When I first began using Brooks, in 2011, I a lot of pain and
difficulty in getting them broken in. I used this method twice.
The first time it worked great and I experienced a lot of relief
from the, for me, extreme discomfort of the new saddle. In fact, I
wouldn't have continued to ride it had I not done this. Afterward,
the saddle "disappeared" beneath me. The second time I was too
impatient, and after the initial 10 minute ride while wet, rode
the saddle later in the day, before it had fully dried, and ruined
it (at least for me), because it was visibly sagging. I was
berated in this group by someone when I related my experience.

I've had 2, maybe 3, new Brooks since then, and didn't use
anything but Proofide or Obenaufs, and didn't have the issues I
had when I first started riding them. I guess maybe I was used to
them enough by then. So, to sum it all up, I think those
directions work if followed closely (or perfectly).

Oh, one other interesting aside, I've had two B17 Standards, and
on both, the rivet that is furthest left on the rear of the
saddle, rubbed a blister on my butt. I had to use a Dremel to file
it down on the outside edge. Weird. The B17 Special, with the
hammered copper rivets, does not do this to me (and they look
nicer too) so that is my saddle now.


Peace,
Tim "whose butt probably isn't smooth as a baby's butt but at
least it doesn't have a blister" Kirch


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[RBW] Re: Discs versus calipers

[Bill Lindsay]

Jeremy

None of the hydraulic brakes I've ever worked on have any way to change the 
pad to rotor spacing.  I've only worked on like 20 bikes worth.  For 
somebody like Patrick Moore who carefully and fastidiously sets up his 
mechanical disc brakes for maximum pad clearance, I would call that a major 
difference.  From my perspective, hydraulic disc brakes are self-adjusting, 
and you better like how they self-adjust, because you can't meaningfully 
change them at the caliper, from any adjustment perspective.  There are 
reach adjusters at the levers, but that just sizes the levers to your hand. 

Am I missing out on some class of hydraulic calipers that allow you to 
adjust pad clearance?

Bill

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 8:04:46 AM UTC-7, Jeremy Till wrote:
>
> Pad/rotor clearance isn't really different between hydraulic and 
> mechanical disc brakes in my experience.  Just like with rim brakes, it 
> depends more on the brake itself and the leverage ratio.  SRAM/Avid brakes, 
> for instance, tend to be fairly high leverage for a light lever feel and 
> "modulation," and in my experience their pads run pretty close to the 
> rotor, just like high leverage rim brakes (V's, for instance) need to run 
> fairly close to the rim.  At the opposite end of the spectrum would be some 
> of the Tektro hydraulics which are becoming commonplace on hybrids and city 
> bikes, and tend to have less leverage and a firmer lever feel, something 
> more like a high-profile cantilever (you have to squeeze harder to get the 
> same stopping power).  Like the cantilevers, their pads have plenty of 
> clearance, which also makes setup easier, especially with looser caliper 
> mount alignment  and rotor trueness tolerances.  
>
> Basically, no matter the type of brake, their ain't no free lunch: high 
> leverage and more stopping power per unit of lever squeezing force comes at 
> the cost of tighter clearances.  The only thing that changes are the 
> location and scale of those tolerances.  
>
> It's been my experience that I've blown through pads faster on a disc 
> brake bike but that's not really fair since the disc brake bike was being 
> used for the most braking-intensive type of riding (mountain biking on 
> steep terrain).  I've never had a disc brake bike that replicated a rim 
> brake bike in terms of use patterns so I can't really compare.
>
> On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 8:09:11 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>> I'm putting this in a new thread, because I have some questions. Note: 
>> I'm not disagreeing, I'm asking because I want to know more. 
>>
>> Clayton said, in the Rivs On Block thread:
>>
>> *- More margin betw. rim and brake to adjust for rub. Disc brakes usually 
>> have much tighter clearances and make it a much more fiddly affair to get 
>> rid of rub (applies mostly to hydros)*
>> *- Typically lighter weight*
>> *[...]*
>> *- Pads tend to last longer*
>>
>> #1: I agree that this is very true for mechanical discs, but for 
>> hydraulics? I thought that pads for hydraulics allowed more gap than those 
>> for mechanicals, at least once-sided-pull mechanicals. For me, this isn't 
>> merely academic; it may influence my choice of mechanicals over hydraulics 
>> one day.
>>
>> #2: Yes, calipers are lighter, but then disc-specific rims can be much 
>> lighter than rim brake rims, at least in the wider sizes.
>>
>> #3: I've read that this is true; I've also read the opposite (recently, 
>> in a review of some disc setup -- Bike Radar? Which one is true?
>>
>> I do know that my Kool Stop salmons seem to last years if not decades.
>>
>> -- 
>> *30% Supply and Demand discount, listmembers only, on all resume, 
>> LinkedIn, and writing services, until Demand equals Supply! And there's 
>> more! 10% kickback for any referral resulting in fully paid, list-price 
>> contract. And still more!  I am offering services in trade for a road bike, 
>> or frame and parts, that are period compatible with my AM hub, circa 1937 
>> to 1961. See my website for what I do and what I charge; email for details.*
>>
>> Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
>> By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
>> Other professional writing services.
>> http://www.resumespecialties.com/
>> www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
>> *
>> ***
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Breaking in a leather Brooks

[alan lavine]

While we're on the topic, don't some B17's break in easier than others?  Of 
all the various leathers available, which is the best and which is the 
worst?

Thanks,
Alan
NYC

On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 11:20:00 AM UTC-4, Tim wrote:
>
> Lon Haldeman (ultra cycling legend, who, quite likely, has ridden more 
> miles on leather saddles than possibly any other human), in his blog in 
> 2011, wrote about how to break in a Brooks using the hot water method. He 
> claims to have broken in over 300 Brooks saddles this way for riders on his 
> PACTOUR rides. 
>
> http://pactour.blogspot.com
>
> When I first began using Brooks, in 2011, I a lot of pain and difficulty 
> in getting them broken in. I used this method twice. The first time it 
> worked great and I experienced a lot of relief from the, for me, extreme 
> discomfort of the new saddle. In fact, I wouldn't have continued to ride it 
> had I not done this. Afterward, the saddle "disappeared" beneath me. The 
> second time I was too impatient, and after the initial 10 minute ride while 
> wet, rode the saddle later in the day, before it had fully dried, and 
> ruined it (at least for me), because it was visibly sagging. I was berated 
> in this group by someone when I related my experience. 
>
> I've had 2, maybe 3, new Brooks since then, and didn't use anything but 
> Proofide or Obenaufs, and didn't have the issues I had when I first started 
> riding them. I guess maybe I was used to them enough by then. So, to sum it 
> all up, I think those directions work if followed closely (or perfectly). 
>
> Oh, one other interesting aside, I've had two B17 Standards, and on both, 
> the rivet that is furthest left on the rear of the saddle, rubbed a blister 
> on my butt. I had to use a Dremel to file it down on the outside edge. 
> Weird. The B17 Special, with the hammered copper rivets, does not do this 
> to me (and they look nicer too) so that is my saddle now.
>
>
> Peace,
> Tim "whose butt probably isn't smooth as a baby's butt but at least it 
> doesn't have a blister" Kirch
>
>
>

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Re: [Ext] [RBW] Re: FS: 68 cm Quickbeam $1275

[a spens]

Thanks for the comments Pudge and Matt.

Actually, I was being a bit lazy.  In addition to the physical naggings, we 
are relocating, so I've got to downsize the fleet (wife: "do you really 
NEED this many bikes?"  
me: "hmmm...lemme think about that.yes."  

I do ride recumbents and they definitely have their place in my stable such 
as for touring. But on my daily rides of <50 miles I really enjoy my Rivs 
and fat bikes.  The QB is probably my favorite road ride, but we are moving 
to the mountains of Appalachia where my grunting up the hills aggravates 
things so it only makes sense to find it a home where it will be loved, 
ridden, and well cared for, rather than sit and watch whilst the other 
geared bikes get ridden.

Too bad as it is such a joy to ride.

al

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Re: [RBW] Re: Discs versus calipers

[Patrick Moore]

*Basically, no matter the type of brake, their ain't no free lunch: high
leverage and more stopping power per unit of lever squeezing force comes at
the cost of tighter clearances.  The only thing that changes are the
location and scale of those tolerances.  *

Well said. I guess that, by attaching my cables to the Avid BB7 Roads' arms
only after the arm has moved through part of its arc, I've basically
changed the leverage ratio. It works for me! And I don't notice any
diminution of braking power.

As for modulation, I don't find that these are any more abrupt than the
other mechanical discs I've used.

On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 9:04 AM, Jeremy Till  wrote:

> Pad/rotor clearance isn't really different between hydraulic and
> mechanical disc brakes in my experience.  Just like with rim brakes, it
> depends more on the brake itself and the leverage ratio.  SRAM/Avid brakes,
> for instance, tend to be fairly high leverage for a light lever feel and
> "modulation," and in my experience their pads run pretty close to the
> rotor, just like high leverage rim brakes (V's, for instance) need to run
> fairly close to the rim.  At the opposite end of the spectrum would be some
> of the Tektro hydraulics which are becoming commonplace on hybrids and city
> bikes, and tend to have less leverage and a firmer lever feel, something
> more like a high-profile cantilever (you have to squeeze harder to get the
> same stopping power).  Like the cantilevers, their pads have plenty of
> clearance, which also makes setup easier, especially with looser caliper
> mount alignment  and rotor trueness tolerances.
>
> Basically, no matter the type of brake, their ain't no free lunch: high
> leverage and more stopping power per unit of lever squeezing force comes at
> the cost of tighter clearances.  The only thing that changes are the
> location and scale of those tolerances.
>
> It's been my experience that I've blown through pads faster on a disc
> brake bike but that's not really fair since the disc brake bike was being
> used for the most braking-intensive type of riding (mountain biking on
> steep terrain).  I've never had a disc brake bike that replicated a rim
> brake bike in terms of use patterns so I can't really compare.
>
> On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 8:09:11 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>> I'm putting this in a new thread, because I have some questions. Note:
>> I'm not disagreeing, I'm asking because I want to know more.
>>
>> Clayton said, in the Rivs On Block thread:
>>
>> *- More margin betw. rim and brake to adjust for rub. Disc brakes usually
>> have much tighter clearances and make it a much more fiddly affair to get
>> rid of rub (applies mostly to hydros)*
>> *- Typically lighter weight*
>> *[...]*
>> *- Pads tend to last longer*
>>
>> #1: I agree that this is very true for mechanical discs, but for
>> hydraulics? I thought that pads for hydraulics allowed more gap than those
>> for mechanicals, at least once-sided-pull mechanicals. For me, this isn't
>> merely academic; it may influence my choice of mechanicals over hydraulics
>> one day.
>>
>> #2: Yes, calipers are lighter, but then disc-specific rims can be much
>> lighter than rim brake rims, at least in the wider sizes.
>>
>> #3: I've read that this is true; I've also read the opposite (recently,
>> in a review of some disc setup -- Bike Radar? Which one is true?
>>
>> I do know that my Kool Stop salmons seem to last years if not decades.
>>
>> --
>> *30% Supply and Demand discount, listmembers only, on all resume,
>> LinkedIn, and writing services, until Demand equals Supply! And there's
>> more! 10% kickback for any referral resulting in fully paid, list-price
>> contract. And still more!  I am offering services in trade for a road bike,
>> or frame and parts, that are period compatible with my AM hub, circa 1937
>> to 1961. See my website for what I do and what I charge; email for details.*
>>
>> Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
>> By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
>> Other professional writing services.
>> http://www.resumespecialties.com/
>> www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
>> 
>> 
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Discs versus calipers

[Patrick Moore]

(I don't know you name): I've used enough of Avid's different BB7 models to
know that even one-sided (only one pad is moved) mechanical discs can be
set up to provide outstanding and consistent power with little problem from
rotor rub (I do find that, when the pads are contaminated, as when they are
wet, or after riding through 1/4 mile of 3" sand, I might hear a few
"whiff-whiff-whiffs" until the environment returns to more normal).

I have been very pleasantly surprised at the performance of Avid's current
Road BB7. Using stock Shimano aero levers, I can set the pads comfortably
far from the rotors, get solid braking, yet preserve that "solid" lever
feel that I never got with the Mountain version of the BB7 and both Tektro
and Cane Creek V brake levers. In fact, I could easily release my pads even
more, for more lever travel, and still have all the qualities described.

Secrets to setup: most important, learning that while lever travel is
linear, actuation arm travel increases with pull, so that you must clamp
your arm to your cable until the arm has moved 25-30% through its arc.
Also: I switched from generic housing to Jagwire; perhaps this helped too,
though I've not isolated the arm attachment from the different housing.

At any rate, while I'd probably buy -- Spyres? -- the model that actuates
both pads, if I were to do this again, the current BB7 Roads are impeccable.

Patrick Moore

On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 8:17 AM, RJM  wrote:

> I'm a disc brake lover for mountain biking, but not a mechanical disk
> brake lover. Every mechanical one I've had has performed subpar and given
> me setup issues...especially compared to hydraulic discs.
>
> It has been my experience that with a good set of hydraulic brakes (one
> that squeezes both pads onto the rotor and not the kind that have only one
> piston that squeeze one pad and then the rotor onto the other pad. I hope
> that makes sense) and a quality initial setup, brake rub isn't an issue
> unless you bend a rotor. At that point, the fix is using care to bend the
> rotor back without adjusting the caliper.
>
> On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 10:09:11 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> I'm putting this in a new thread, because I have some questions. Note:
>> I'm not disagreeing, I'm asking because I want to know more.
>>
>> Clayton said, in the Rivs On Block thread:
>>
>> *- More margin betw. rim and brake to adjust for rub. Disc brakes usually
>> have much tighter clearances and make it a much more fiddly affair to get
>> rid of rub (applies mostly to hydros)*
>> *- Typically lighter weight*
>> *[...]*
>> *- Pads tend to last longer*
>>
>> #1: I agree that this is very true for mechanical discs, but for
>> hydraulics? I thought that pads for hydraulics allowed more gap than those
>> for mechanicals, at least once-sided-pull mechanicals. For me, this isn't
>> merely academic; it may influence my choice of mechanicals over hydraulics
>> one day.
>>
>> #2: Yes, calipers are lighter, but then disc-specific rims can be much
>> lighter than rim brake rims, at least in the wider sizes.
>>
>> #3: I've read that this is true; I've also read the opposite (recently,
>> in a review of some disc setup -- Bike Radar? Which one is true?
>>
>> I do know that my Kool Stop salmons seem to last years if not decades.
>>
>> --
>> *30% Supply and Demand discount, listmembers only, on all resume,
>> LinkedIn, and writing services, until Demand equals Supply! And there's
>> more! 10% kickback for any referral resulting in fully paid, list-price
>> contract. And still more!  I am offering services in trade for a road bike,
>> or frame and parts, that are period compatible with my AM hub, circa 1937
>> to 1961. See my website for what I do and what I charge; email for details.*
>>
>> Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
>> By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
>> Other professional writing services.
>> http://www.resumespecialties.com/
>> www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
>> 
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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still more!  I am offering services in trade for a road bike, or frame and
parts, that are period 

[RBW] Re: Roadini at RBW

[LBleriot]

That looks like Bleriot blue to me.

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[RBW] Re: Aging and Exercise

[Deacon Patrick]

I haven't looked at this study in particular but something I've noticed is 
common with many exercise studies is they test sedentary subjects over a 
fairly short time period. Interval training emerges at the top every time 
and seems attractive because it is short/intense. But the few studies that 
I've seen that examine aerobic exercise (aka, what everyone did before 
mechanical engines) show it is foundational to good health. Combined with 
interval training, it most closely matches how humans have lived for 
hundreds of thousands of years. What isn't good for us is chronic cardio 
(racing everywhere).

With abandon,
Patrick

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 7:38:57 AM UTC-6, islaysteve wrote:
>
> This is very interesting to me as I fall into the age category studied, 
> and my exercise level of right now could be classified as "sedentary."  For 
> those of you who have not read the article, one conclusion is that the 
> "interval" training described seemed to be the most beneficial for our age 
> group.  Since I have a bike set up on the trainer in the basement, I can 
> implement that plan immediately.  That type of training could of course 
> also be done during an actual bike ride, even if it does go against "just 
> ride" ; ).  Something to think about.
> Cheers, Steve
>
>
> On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 10:08:18 AM UTC-4, Addison wrote:
>>
>> Given the interest in cycling and aging amongst this group I thought this 
>> story/study might be of interest:
>>
>>
>> https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/03/23/well/move/the-best-exercise-for-aging-muscles.html?mc=aud_dev=keywee=dommob_0=367955_4=1372898_1=605799=http://m.facebook.com
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Addison Wilhite, M.A. 
>>
>> Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology 
>>  
>>
>> *“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*
>>
>> Educator: Professional Portfolio 
>>
>> Blogger: Reno Rambler  
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Roadini at RBW

[Chris Birkenmaier]

So are these the final color choices or just on the prototype?  I'm on the 
mailing list too for updates but haven't heard anything in a while.

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 2:12:08 PM UTC-4, Daniel D. wrote:
>
> Last word was august...

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[RBW] Re: Roadini at RBW

[Daniel D.]

Last word was august...

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[RBW] Re: Nitto campee 26vs650bvs700c

[Bill Lindsay]

Yes, those measurements were both for front racks.  The 27F is by 
definition a front rack.  

Bill

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 8:52:32 AM UTC-7, drew wrote:
>
> Thanks for the data points bill. This is for the front version?

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[RBW] FS:cockpit- nitto,vo,riv,dura-ace,tektro

[drew]

Sold 

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[RBW] Re: eCLEM

[Mike Horgan]

Thanks Joe.   Great to hear from the person who seems to be the primary 
ebike proponent in this group. For me, riding an assisted bike for the 
first time was a lightning bolt moment. I can't see going back as far as 
for daily transportation.  I read some posts here about ebikes on group 
rides and that doesn't seem like a good cultural fit (at least for a 
mostly-able rider).  But for basic shopping, getting to work, riding into 
town for an evening event I can't think of a more enjoyable way to travel. 
 If you're riding specifically to work up a sweat then more power to you, 
but for getting around with as little stress, fuss and cost as possible 
ebikes rock.

Although the higher-end Rivs are very (very!) attractive to me, I think I 
agree with you that the stout frame and limousine proportions of a clem is 
probably the best option.  My current bike will probably make it through 
this season with a little TLC (this weekend I replaced the broken saddle 
and tightened up a few loose bolts) so maybe a new build over the winter 
will be just the thing.

I'd say 'Enjoy!' to you too, but I think you already do ;)

On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 8:33:34 PM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Hi Mike, that's my CLEM that I put a rather primitive and heavy e-kit on 
> last year. It looks like you're using a Bafang mid-drive which is much 
> better and lighter (I have a BBS02 on a folding bike). I highly recommend 
> swapping to a CLEM: it's a stout frame and the long wheelbase (with fat 
> tires) makes for a very stable ride at the speeds you're doing. Enjoy!

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[RBW] Nitto campee 26vs650bvs700c

[drew]

Thanks for the data points bill. This is for the front version?

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[RBW] Re: Discs versus calipers

[Jeremy Till]

Pad/rotor clearance isn't really different between hydraulic and mechanical 
disc brakes in my experience.  Just like with rim brakes, it depends more 
on the brake itself and the leverage ratio.  SRAM/Avid brakes, for 
instance, tend to be fairly high leverage for a light lever feel and 
"modulation," and in my experience their pads run pretty close to the 
rotor, just like high leverage rim brakes (V's, for instance) need to run 
fairly close to the rim.  At the opposite end of the spectrum would be some 
of the Tektro hydraulics which are becoming commonplace on hybrids and city 
bikes, and tend to have less leverage and a firmer lever feel, something 
more like a high-profile cantilever (you have to squeeze harder to get the 
same stopping power).  Like the cantilevers, their pads have plenty of 
clearance, which also makes setup easier, especially with looser caliper 
mount alignment  and rotor trueness tolerances.  

Basically, no matter the type of brake, their ain't no free lunch: high 
leverage and more stopping power per unit of lever squeezing force comes at 
the cost of tighter clearances.  The only thing that changes are the 
location and scale of those tolerances.  

It's been my experience that I've blown through pads faster on a disc brake 
bike but that's not really fair since the disc brake bike was being used 
for the most braking-intensive type of riding (mountain biking on steep 
terrain).  I've never had a disc brake bike that replicated a rim brake 
bike in terms of use patterns so I can't really compare.

On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 8:09:11 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> I'm putting this in a new thread, because I have some questions. Note: I'm 
> not disagreeing, I'm asking because I want to know more. 
>
> Clayton said, in the Rivs On Block thread:
>
> *- More margin betw. rim and brake to adjust for rub. Disc brakes usually 
> have much tighter clearances and make it a much more fiddly affair to get 
> rid of rub (applies mostly to hydros)*
> *- Typically lighter weight*
> *[...]*
> *- Pads tend to last longer*
>
> #1: I agree that this is very true for mechanical discs, but for 
> hydraulics? I thought that pads for hydraulics allowed more gap than those 
> for mechanicals, at least once-sided-pull mechanicals. For me, this isn't 
> merely academic; it may influence my choice of mechanicals over hydraulics 
> one day.
>
> #2: Yes, calipers are lighter, but then disc-specific rims can be much 
> lighter than rim brake rims, at least in the wider sizes.
>
> #3: I've read that this is true; I've also read the opposite (recently, in 
> a review of some disc setup -- Bike Radar? Which one is true?
>
> I do know that my Kool Stop salmons seem to last years if not decades.
>
> -- 
> *30% Supply and Demand discount, listmembers only, on all resume, 
> LinkedIn, and writing services, until Demand equals Supply! And there's 
> more! 10% kickback for any referral resulting in fully paid, list-price 
> contract. And still more!  I am offering services in trade for a road bike, 
> or frame and parts, that are period compatible with my AM hub, circa 1937 
> to 1961. See my website for what I do and what I charge; email for details.*
>
> Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
> By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
> Other professional writing services.
> http://www.resumespecialties.com/
> www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
> **
> **
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Roadini at RBW

[Belopsky]

When are these expected btw? I think I'm on the mailing list..

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[RBW] Re: Discs versus calipers

[RJM]

I'm a disc brake lover for mountain biking, but not a mechanical disk brake 
lover. Every mechanical one I've had has performed subpar and given me 
setup issues...especially compared to hydraulic discs. 

It has been my experience that with a good set of hydraulic brakes (one 
that squeezes both pads onto the rotor and not the kind that have only one 
piston that squeeze one pad and then the rotor onto the other pad. I hope 
that makes sense) and a quality initial setup, brake rub isn't an issue 
unless you bend a rotor. At that point, the fix is using care to bend the 
rotor back without adjusting the caliper. 

On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 10:09:11 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:

> I'm putting this in a new thread, because I have some questions. Note: I'm 
> not disagreeing, I'm asking because I want to know more. 
>
> Clayton said, in the Rivs On Block thread:
>
> *- More margin betw. rim and brake to adjust for rub. Disc brakes usually 
> have much tighter clearances and make it a much more fiddly affair to get 
> rid of rub (applies mostly to hydros)*
> *- Typically lighter weight*
> *[...]*
> *- Pads tend to last longer*
>
> #1: I agree that this is very true for mechanical discs, but for 
> hydraulics? I thought that pads for hydraulics allowed more gap than those 
> for mechanicals, at least once-sided-pull mechanicals. For me, this isn't 
> merely academic; it may influence my choice of mechanicals over hydraulics 
> one day.
>
> #2: Yes, calipers are lighter, but then disc-specific rims can be much 
> lighter than rim brake rims, at least in the wider sizes.
>
> #3: I've read that this is true; I've also read the opposite (recently, in 
> a review of some disc setup -- Bike Radar? Which one is true?
>
> I do know that my Kool Stop salmons seem to last years if not decades.
>
> -- 
> *30% Supply and Demand discount, listmembers only, on all resume, 
> LinkedIn, and writing services, until Demand equals Supply! And there's 
> more! 10% kickback for any referral resulting in fully paid, list-price 
> contract. And still more!  I am offering services in trade for a road bike, 
> or frame and parts, that are period compatible with my AM hub, circa 1937 
> to 1961. See my website for what I do and what I charge; email for details.*
>
> Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
> By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
> Other professional writing services.
> http://www.resumespecialties.com/
> www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
> **
> **
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: So many Rivs on the chopping block

[Doug Bloch]

Here's one that popped up locally on Craigslist.  Practically my dream bike, 
but so far out of my reach cost-wise.

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/bik/6179737154.html

Doug

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[RBW] Nitto campee 26vs650bvs700c

[Bill Lindsay]

Apologies in advance for confusing this question.  Drew asked if anyone knew 
the difference in heights between three size distinctions of Nitto Campee front 
racks with removable lowriders

I have purchased two of them and have them both here in the stable. One I 
ordered through my LBS from Merry Sales. It is the 26" version, the Mt Campee. 
The other I purchased from Alex's Cycles in Japan, and it is the 27F model 
which I think of as the 700c version. 

The heights of these two racks are quite similar. By my reckoning the 27F 
measures 372mm from the center of the lowest attachment hole to the underside 
of the platform. The 26" Mt Campee is only slightly shorter at 360mm. 

Both of these racks have the dogleg bent lower legs intended to reach to the 
fork tip eyelet below the fork tip. In the photos I've seen of the 650b sized 
one, the lower legs are straight , which appears to mean they should be 
attached to eyelets above the fork tip. 

My Mt Campee is made of 10mm tubing. My 27F is made of 8mm tubing.  The 
lowriders are identical and interchangeable, the outer hoop being 10mm tubing.  
Left and right are not interchangeable. 

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito Ca

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[RBW] Re: Aging and Exercise

[islaysteve]

This is very interesting to me as I fall into the age category studied, and 
my exercise level of right now could be classified as "sedentary."  For 
those of you who have not read the article, one conclusion is that the 
"interval" training described seemed to be the most beneficial for our age 
group.  Since I have a bike set up on the trainer in the basement, I can 
implement that plan immediately.  That type of training could of course 
also be done during an actual bike ride, even if it does go against "just 
ride" ; ).  Something to think about.
Cheers, Steve


On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 10:08:18 AM UTC-4, Addison wrote:
>
> Given the interest in cycling and aging amongst this group I thought this 
> story/study might be of interest:
>
>
> https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/03/23/well/move/the-best-exercise-for-aging-muscles.html?mc=aud_dev=keywee=dommob_0=367955_4=1372898_1=605799=http://m.facebook.com
>
> Best,
>
> Addison Wilhite, M.A. 
>
> Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology 
>  
>
> *“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*
>
> Educator: Professional Portfolio 
>
> Blogger: Reno Rambler  
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Discs versus calipers

[Garth]

I'll just add this in addition to something you mentioned Patrick in the "Riv 
sale reason" topic, and that is basically never say never. Many of us would 
have scoffed at the idea of tig'd frames years ago, that's for sure. Disc 
brakes have not been around very long compared to other brakes, so who knows 
what future designs or implementations may make disc brakes more appealing 
compared to today. Maybe another brake altogether, who knows. 

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